Unless you’ve been in a sensory-deprivation tank for the last 72 hours, you’ve probably heard of G2 Research’s new G2 RIP 9mm bullet. Thanks to a dramatic video and some compelling performance claims, word of G2 Research’s new “wonder bullet” has spread through the blogosphere like gonorrhea at an 18th-century naval port. We at TTAG have been inundated with requests about it. On my ShootingTheBull410 YouTube channel and blog, I’ve been flooded with requests. People are obviously impressed by what the video is showing them, and they want to know — is it for real? Is this really and truly the last bullet you’ll ever need? . . .
Well, that’s what their marketing says anyway. Those are big words, certainly. And there’s plenty of skepticism out there too. After all, in the ammo world it seems like a new “wonder bullet” comes along every year or two. Was it really that long ago that LeMas, RBCD, ExtremeShock, DRT, and Liberty first burst on the scene? How many “wonder bullets” are there, and — will wonders never cease? Probably not. Not as long as the gun community has such a rabid appetite for them.
We’ve tried to get G2 Research to send us some to review. So far, no response. I’ve tried to buy some myself and haven’t gotten through to them. Their authorized retailer, Dixie Ammo Dump has no mention of it and their phone recording says something on the order of, “If you’re calling about G2RIP ammo, hang up, go to armthepopulace.com and look for it there. If you don’t see it, we’re out of stock. When we get some, you’ll see it there.” I called their regional distributor and was told that it will be sold nationally through firequest.com, sgammo.com, ammunitiondepot.com, and ammotogo.com. None of them have it in stock yet.
So no, we can’t test it for you… yet. But we will.
Until then, are there any observations we can make? Sure — a couple. First, I am quite optimistic about one aspect of it — it’s a fully CNC-machined bullet, and that means that it’s using an advanced technology over the traditional “melt some lead and pour it in a mold” technique of bullet manufacturing. I believe that newer technology can lead to new performance and, possibly, to better performance.
I also believe that machining bullets can potentially result in new types of performance that we never could have gotten from pouring lead. As an example, let’s look at TTAG’s 2013 Ammo Of The Year, Lehigh Defense’s Maximum Expansion in .45 Colt. This is a bullet that expands to nearly 2″ in diameter, and the petals fold flat. It’s a terrifying round, and it exists because it’s 100% CNC-machined. It’s computer-designed and manufactured to strict tolerances by being machined completely out of copper. The designers can engineer it to do things that would simply be impossible from poured lead. They changed what we can expect from bullet performance, through design and technology.
So — is it possible that G2 Research has done the same thing? Have they created a bullet that can outperform traditional ammo, by using technology and machining? Possibly.
I’m not one of the naysayers or skeptics who instantly dismiss new offerings. Instead, I’m an analyst who likes to put claims to the test. Someone who likes to actually discover what the true performance is, and publish those results. I am very interested in putting this stuff to the test using standard testing protocols as developed by the International Wound Ballistic Association, using standardized flesh simulants. And I’d really like to see what happens when one of these bullets impacts an organic flesh simulant. It’s that — and only that — which will tell us whether we’re looking at something really “new” here.
In the meantime, is there anything else we can determine from what the G2 Research team has shared with us? Sure — at least one of their claims is 100% balderdash. They say in their video that their ammo acts like “a hole saw” when ripping through barriers. That’s utterly absurd.
It looks like a hole saw, yes, but act like one? Consider this — a normal 9mm handgun barrel’s rifling delivers one rotation in about 10″ of travel. G2 says that their ammo travels at 1,265 feet per second. That means that when it hits a barrier, it’s not going to sit there spinning and sawing through that barrier — it’s going to have traveled about a foot past the barrier before it’s even completed one rotation! That ain’t a hole saw.
They say it’s great at “effectively ripping through obstacles.” Nonsense — it will smash through obstacles, just like every other bullet does. Note: I’m not saying it won’t go through obstacles and still perform; it may very well do that. What I’m saying is that the claim or representation that it’s “like a hole saw” and that it will “rip through obstacles” is over-hyped marketingspeak, and it’s unfortunate that they’re stretching to make such claims.
I have to say, it’s this type of over-the-top promotion that makes me cautious or, yes, even skeptical about the product. I’m not even getting into the claims about the “acoustic wave” and other such questionable statements. And why do they show their bullets being fired from full-auto pistols? Is it to have the viewer somehow believe that this ammo makes their gun full-auto? That’s some dramatic imagery, yes, but it makes no sense. None of us are using full-auto pistols, so why show it with no explanation?
Their claims about energy don’t make sense either. They list a weight of 96 grains, and a velocity of 1265 feet per second with “muzzle energy” at “490”. They don’t say 490 what. We’re left to assume that they’re talking about foot-pounds. of energy, like every other ammo manufacturer quotes. However, using the standard formula for kinetic energy, 96 grains at 1265 fps yields just 341 ft/lbs, nowhere near the 490 they claim. So — is it a mistake? Or are they perhaps trying to quote their energy figures in, say, joules? I don’t know.
[ed: G2 has since updated their site, claiming muzzle energy of 370]
They say “it is a projectile like no other in history.” Forgive me, but poppycock. I will say that it certainly doesn’t look like any other projectile, that’s for sure. But to say it’s like no other? Er, might want to fact-check that one… The G2 RIP cartridge is a CNC machined projectile that has a solid base with machined petals that break off, causing multiple wound paths in the temporary cavity. The solid base continues forward to cause deep penetration. Sounds just like the Lehigh Defense Controlled Fracturing bullet. Or the Cutting Edge Personal Home Defense. In fact, except for the detaching base, it’s not even really all that different from the Winchester PDX1 12-gauge segmenting slug, is it?
So why aren’t we all using Lehigh or Cutting Edge ammo as “the last round we ever needed?” Perhaps it’s because neither of those companies launched their ammo with such an over-the-top campaign. And there’s no denying that video has been very effective in ginning up interest in the G2 Research product. As of the time of writing this, it’s gotten nearly a million views on YouTube.
So, yeah…their marketing turns me off. But it’s also what’s (apparently) selling every round they can make, so I don’t know that I can fault them for that. But what I can say is this — we here at The Truth About Guns like to get down to the truth about guns. And ammo. And we plan on doing so.
We will get ahold of some of this G2RIP ammo and we will test it professionally. Then we’ll report back truthfully and honestly about what it really, truly does. It may turn out that we end up verifying each and every one of the claims in their video. Or we may end up disproving their claims. Or somewhere in between. In the end, the only thing that matters is how the ammo actually performs. Is it better than what we’ve had? Is it an advancement in personal defense or law enforcement ammo? Or is it, yet again, another “wonder bullet” in a long line of wonder bullets?
We’ll find out. And we’ll let you know. Just as soon as we can get some.
I would ask you first what is your background and knowledge of firearms as I would ask an attorney about his or her experience in law and where he received his education.Then he or she would talk with authority.Secondly I would ask what is NRA’s knowledge base of firearms and their use versus yours if we were looking for ,let’s say professional witnesses in a gun crime court case.And lastly, I would question why you are not actively persueing repeat offenders who are repeatedly being let out of jail,obtaining STOLEN firearms and committing MURDER in the most restrictive firearms states such as Chicago Illinois ,Los Angeles Calif. Wash DC ,where 10 and 12 time offenders repeatedly get guns off the street,STOLEN, NOT at gun shows.Or as in our town , a bank robber killed a WW2 veteran while robbing the bank.He was from California and had been arrested sixty two [62] times prior.Or the man in New York who was unarmed as assailants raped and murdered his wife and daughter while he was tied up helplessly watching. But of course I am wasting my breath as you will ignore and erase this.
My question for the Moms, and for everyone else on the other side from us, is:
Where will you stop?
If you would publish a full model gun law code, as detailed as the Washington State Code RCW 9.41 (http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9.41), and promise never to go beyond that, then perhaps we could find common ground somewhere. As it is, everything you propose is resisted because everything you propose is only a first step to an undefined, but therefore scary, endpoint.
I think by now it is obvious that we can fight you forever and mostly win. If you really want “gun sense”, whatever that is, you have to say where you will stop. You have to offer us a compromise, and that means that each side only gets part of what it wants. So what part of what we want (and mostly already have) are you willing to concede to us forever?
The way I always heard the joke was “You’re in luck, looks like I can save you $10,000…” Requires a little more thought, but I like the effect better.
Agreed with the bullshit comment.
I bet they meant 490 jigowatts
LMAO!
The guy in the NRA vid is a fool, and the replies on this topic demonstrate just how EASY complete disarmament will be.
It’s already been done in many countries in Europe. THE TRICK IS YOU DON’T OUTLAW GUN OWNERSHIP. You just make it an IMPOSSIBLE HASSLE to own a gun.
Laws have been slowly put into place in other countries:
– Limit the amount of ammo purchases you can make (usually 50 rounds/year)
– Limit the number of guns you can own
– Require mountains of paperwork to own a gun
– Require difficult methods of storing or transporting a gun.
– Require statement of need for gun ownership – and no one’s statement of need is ever enough need.
– Require multiple regulations regarding magazines, barrels, triggers, safetys, serial numbers, etc. that make most firearms impossible to own.
You just make it very difficult to the point of nearly impossible to own a gun. It WILL happen here.
I dare you to post a link to the youtube vcideo on MDA’s website and/or FB page. I wanna get Shannon’s panties in a bunch . . . 🙂
But is it CNC machined from billet? Unless it is, then, hey, no sale.
Any chance you will be able to test the Multi Impact Bullet from Advanced Ballistic Concepts?
My Rights > Your Feelings
Now go raise your children.
Their website now says 370 muzzle energy.
Check out Cpt. 8 of Mark Twain’s “A Tramp Abroad” for his hilarious satire of a French pistol duel.
I’ll take mine in 10mm. It’s 1mm more than 9mm.
I’m very curious also. I believe that the ammo could work similarly to advertised. Copper ammunition (like the Lehigh Defense) can do some amazing things.
I have two predictions:
1. The ammo will be $2 / round or more – so you’re still gonna *need* practice ammo or reloads. This will never be the last bullet you’ll ever need unless you have an ammunition budget bigger than your mortgage.
2. The ammo will perform, but not nearly as pretty as advertised.
Then again, it might get clogged with denim. We’ll see.
I look forward to your review. Until I see that I remain skeptical as this is the one place that will actually review it professionally and report on it honestly. Can’t wait, if I could score some I’d send it to you…..Did not see any at Cabela’s today.
Even if we voluntarily disarmed, it woul take a few generations to locate all of our guns.:)
Quote from an MDA press release:
Instead, moms will continue to use our voices and our votes to call for sensible gun reform.”
A member of Moms Demand Action who is a Maryland-area pediatrician and was in the mall at the time of the shooting said, “You can only imagine the terror of holding your 2-year-old in a cold back hallway for 2 hours with terrified children, babies and parents, with no idea if you are going to be ok. I am more committed than ever to this important critical movement. This cannot be acceptable as the new normal. The kids are traumatized and I am, too. We have to do something real and change this terrifying reality.”
End quote.
What sensible gun reform do you think would have prevented the MD mall shooting?
What is “this terrifying reality”? That parents in the mall in Maryland lack the most effective means of self defense because of stringent “may issue” laws? That far too many people in our nation have surrendered the right and ability to protect their own lives and the lives of their children to the state, which needs to come save them in any crisis? That you think its okay and totally understandable for adults to cower in fear for hours at the sound of gunfire? That your wishful thinking has led to most public places where large groups gather adopting laws banning handguns because you feel that same wishful thinking will protect you in the unlikely event of a violent crime?
Maybe the “terrifying reality” is that deep down you understand regulating inanimate objects will never achieve the ends you desire.
MDA, please go read peer reviewed research, FBI statistics and the DOJ reports on firearms before you spew your anti gun message. What you will find in a nutshell is that all of your ideas for “gun sense” have either been tried and are failures, or will not attack the root of the plummeting levels of violence in the United States. What they will do is place punitive and onerous restrictions on good people. Of course if you are averse to reading science articles, understanding statistics and using critical thinking I can’t help you.
I’ve said it elsewhere – if they have designed a reliable breakaway fletchette system that can feed reliably, well that’s just awesome, but that detaching slug looks to have some over-penetration issues that would preclude using it as a defense round, particularly for a public carry weapon.
G2 RIP ammo is so deadly, you don’t even need a gun.
You shove it up their ass and rotate, and when it comes out … eventually… it drags the intestines out with itself?
I’d like to see dueling come back, but for a select and narrow set of circumstances.
Members of Congress get into a pissy match? Take it out on the capitol steps and draw. Hell, give them Glock 18’s and let them hose down uninvolved members of Congress as well.
Talking heads of either political party going off on some screaming face TV show? Televised duel, right there on Fox or CNN. It’ll make ratings go through the roof.
When the first round of dolts are killed off, it means that we citizens will have fewer people we need to kill to achieve a polite society again.
Now, on a wholly serious end of this topic:
Recently, I found myself in the Buffalo Bill Center of the West in Cody, WY. Therein they now have the largest collection of firearms in the world, having recently topped the NRA collection in Virginia. The collection is vast, and I’m thinking of approaching the curators to volunteer to teach a full-day history/development timeline tour in the museum. It would require a lot of work on my part, plus a pretty full day of driving there and back, but it might bring an appreciation of firearms to more people in a more structured manner – and also teach people that there’s no way to ban guns.
Anyway, in their collection were several dueling pairs, almost all of them are some of the very best work a gunsmith has ever made. A couple of the dueling pairs had clearly been the epoch of the gunmaker’s art at the time they were made, and all of them still had wood tight to their metal, beautiful finishing on both the wood and the metal, etc. Just lovely pieces, ensconced in beautiful wood boxes with everything needed to load, clean and maintain the dueling pairs. In short, they were possessed of the highest levels of workmanship.
Knowing something about making guns with hand tools, seeing these dueling pairs brought another aspect of the dueling period to mind: the economic disparity and advantage the richer man in the contest enjoyed. If a man of modest means got into a duel with a moneyed man, the richer man probably supplied the dueling pair. This meant that the richer man had an opportunity to practice and achieve skill in the martial art of pistol marksmanship, which wasn’t a common skill in that day by anyone, and even if the pistol(s) were not rigged, the man who was picking up one of the pistols for the very first time was at a huge disadvantage in the duel.
One of the reasons why dueling probably was outlawed was that the coming age of mass-produced handguns meant that the rich aristocracy would no longer enjoy this advantage. Their opponents might well be highly versed in the use of handguns… and rich people never like a fair fight.
MDA is not interested in Dialogue or discourse about 2A constitutional rights – they look to nothing less than civilian disarmament and bans and start with the dialogue on their Page as being “National non-partisan grassroots movement working to establish common-sense gun reforms at the state & federal level.”
They are about as Non-partisan as Hitlers brownshirts … disagree with their absolute moral outrage authority – BANNED FROM COMMENT and deleted… Stay Classy you hectoring mewling stooges and “Moms Who cant No Satisfaction or some Action… “
Where’s the graph?
“Here’s how it looks in graph form. Notice anything interesting?”
Hang tight, I emailed Dan with the graphs.
I took a look at the .45 colt max expansion and rather than buy a box to satisfy my curiosity I went down to my shop and chucked up a chunk of 1/2″ copper bar and going by the pictures on their website I made 3 that looked rather close and loaded them up and single loaded them in my 1873 Winchester clone. I loaded them to 1600 fps from a 20″ barrel and they were tumbling by the time they passed the chrono screens..
Now I may have the design all wrong going from website photos so it may be all my hack version but I only got three widely spaced keyholes on a 4’x4′ sheet of paper at 25 feet… Given that this is designed to be belly gun ammo intended for arms reach / contact to perhaps 6 ft combat distance I don’t think it is a wonder bullet
When it comes to wackie ammo designs there are lots and lots of them
The Springfield armory (the real one in Springfield Mass.)did extensive research into fletchet rounds in the 60s and 70s and nothing but a 12 gage round came of it if memory serves then there were the Remington 30-06 /.22 sabot rounds they put the .22 pill out at over 4000 fps……. The list is endless I doubt there will ever be a wonder bullit until someone makes a real version of the autopilot bullit from the almost human tv show.
Here’s what I just posted to their Facebook page….
I will never understand why gun control advocates and/or liberals always ignore facts and entirely rely on pure emotion to support their feelings. How can the organization “Moms Demand Action for Gun Sense in America” make a “sensible” argument to support their position when ignoring hard facts? The answer is that because if they acknowledged the facts, they would be forced to admit that the evidence fails to support what they seek.
18 Facts about Guns Your Local Politician Needs to Know
The following are 18 little-known gun facts that prove that guns make us safer…
(This list was complied by Michael Snyder of The American Dream)
#1 Over the past 20 years, gun sales have absolutely exploded, but homicides with firearms are down 39 percent during that time and “other crimes with firearms” are down 69 percent.
#2 A study published in the Harvard Journal of Law & Public Policy discovered that nations that have more guns tend to have less crime.
#3 The nine European nations with the lowest rate of gun ownership rate have a combined murder rate that is three times greater than the nine European nation with the highest rate of gun ownership.
#4 Almost every mass shooting that has occurred in the United States since 1950 has taken place in a state with strict gun control laws…
With just one exception, every public mass shooting in the USA since at least 1950 has taken place where citizens are banned from carrying guns. Despite strict gun regulations, Europe has had three of the worst six school shootings.
#5 The United States is #1 in the world in gun ownership, and yet it is only 28th in the world in gun murders per 100,000 people.
#6 The violent crime rate in the United States actually fell from [video=youtube;FWNOiw_XIV8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=FWNOiw_XIV8″]757.7[/URL] per 100,000 in 1992 to 386.3 per 100,000 in 2011. During that same time period, the murder rate fell from 9.3 per 100,000 to 200,000 women in the United States use guns to protect themselves against sexual crime every single year.
#8 Overall, guns in the United States are used 80 times more often to prevent crime than they are to take lives.
#9 The number of unintentional fatalities due to firearms declined by 58 percent between 1991 and 2011.
#10 Despite the very strict ban on guns in the UK, the overall rate of violent crime in the UK is about 4 times higher than it is in the United States. In one recent year, there were 2,034 violent crimes per 100,000 people in the UK. In the United States, there were only 466 violent crimes per 100,000 people during that same year. Do we really want to be more like the UK?
#11 The UK has approximately 125 percent more rape victims per 100,000 people each year than the United States does.
#12 The UK has approximately 133 percent more assault victims per 100,000 people each year than the United States does.
#13 The UK has the fourth highest burglary rate in the EU.
#14 The UK has the second highest overall crime rate in the EU.
#15 Down in Australia, gun murders increased by about 19 percent and armed robberies increased by about 69 percent after a gun ban was instituted.
#16 The city of Chicago has some of the strictest gun laws in the United States. So has this reduced crime? Of course not. As I wrote about recently, the murder rate in Chicago was about 17 percent higher in 2012 than it was in 2011, and Chicago is now considered to be “the deadliest global city“. If you can believe it, there were about as many murders in Chicago during 2012 as there was in the entire nation of Japan.
#17 After the city of Kennesaw, Georgia passed a law requiring every home to have a gun, the crime rate dropped by more than 50 percent over the course of the next 23 years and there was an 89% decline in burglaries.
#18 According to Gun Owners of America, the governments of the world slaughtered more than 170 million of their own people during the 20th century. The vast majority of those people had been disarmed by their own governments prior to being slaughtered.
These facts are well documented with links to the research that proves each fact. Take some time to follow the links and become educated on the truth.
This was a great read — very informative.
And wouldn’t you know it, I inadvertently bought a great rifle for the distances I shoot and the purposes I’m likely to actually need it for. So…following your advice, I should stick with my trusty Marlin 30-30. (And get a scope if I want to be accurate beyond about 75 yards, cause even with the help of peep sights my eyes aren’t up to the task.) Although a modern semiauto would be fun and undoubtedly faster with follow-up shots and reloads, I figure I can be pretty darn effective within my limits with my chosen rifle…if I need to be.
I’m okay with that. 🙂
Well this is a worthless article seen as all the author has done is confuse rifle precision with accuracy. Yes Precision is not determined by barrel length which is a no brainier, Accuracy is in part about the repeatability of applying that precision. simply put the shorter the barrel the more the round is going to vary based off of weather and as such be less accurate. A longer barrels had less change in bullet drop over temp ranges than the shorter barrels this is being glossed over with the excuse “because you wont notice it at the ranges you are shooting.” which although for most people might be a fair statement but it is not the same as there is no difference in accuracy.
An excellent article. I’ve believed this for years, the longest barrel I own is 20″ and the rest are minimum legal length. That being said, while faster is not always better, flatter is always better. I don’t know how to get flatter without faster, and that’s got me looking in the 26″ range for my next build in 260 rem. I’ve been looking into maximum point blank range calculations for hunting rifles, and it is harder to get a projectile to stay within the +-3″ of bore line range without slinging it pretty fast as far as I can tell.
MDA – why do you believe that the government should use force to tell people what they can and cannot own?
I wouldn’t buy that thing – but if you see any ads that list an A-15 with the shoulder thing that goes up, I’ll be all over it!
I had similar thoughts when purchasing my 20″ barrel .308 LTR. I practiced out to 600 yards with my pet hunting ammo, and subsequently shot my deer at 41 yards (Bushnell laser rangefinder from stand to blood spatter). My buddy got his deer with his 16″ POF .308 at about 50 yards. Expansion and penetration where excellent, and both deer were anchored quickly. My load was a .308 Hornady SuperPerformace 165 grain GMX and his was a 180 grain .308 Trophy bonded tip. Neither round was recovered, and both heart shots did considerable internal damage.
I would add this as a flip side, and this is one of the ways that velocity does matter. Expanding bullets have a practical operating range. Send a 150 grain .30 Cal slug at 3300 FPS from a .300 Whoopty-do (300 RUM, etc.) and it may very well explode if it his heavy bone. Take a long range shot where velocity drops below 1800-2000 FPS, and your bullet may fail to expand or will not expand as much. Punching paper is very forgiving.
In handguns, this problem can be much more pronounced. JHPs which work just fine from a 4″ barrel may fail to expand from 1 7/8″ snub nose revolver whether it be a .38 +P or a .357. The .380 JHP can also fail to expand from micro pistols like the LCP.
While shorter barrels usually don’t make a difference, it can and does happen. I recognize and respect your shooting experience. I have a inclination that you have considerable experience judging wind, spin drift, drop, coriolis effect, etc. Shooters with less experience want more velocity to less the effect of such factors, even though the effects can be negligible at short – medium range. Although you use the .308 as an example, 6.5 and 7mm pills have much greater velocity and higher BCs, and therefore make long range hits much simpler.
As you have pointed out, the .300 AAC has been taken out to 750 yards and 1000 yards with some shooters. That’s a lot of drop. Back in the day, the .45-70 was a long range gun. I’ve got barrels long and short barrels, and don’t mind schlepping long, heavy guns through the woods all day (so long as I’ve got some game sighting). Of course I’ll also take a handgun or 16″ AR. To each their own.
There are 20 guys a week that come into the gun store and say “clip.”
That said – WHY ARE WE STILL GIVING LIP SERVICE TO THESE MEDIA C*NTS?
I used to be on 7-8 FB gun trading pages. Down to 2 now since most of the people on them are idiots. So no amount of BS on an ad would trigger me as fake.
I think the use of the word “clips” is the biggest read flag. While some people use the two interchangeably during conversation, I really don’t see any using “clips” in an advertisement. (Now that I think about it it’s been quite a while since I heard some one refer to a magazine as a “clip” that was not anti 2A)
MDA can kiss off. If they really wanted to help children, then they would volunteer their time. There are many organisations that need members who actually do something for the community, CASA, women homes, run away homes, soup kitchens, etc, etc, and etc. Please do the community a favor, stop being armchair captains of America and stop harrassing businesses who actually make profits and actually benefit the society they are in.
I think it’s just a bit of pandering to the MDA crowd and hollywood. Talking tough. I can’t see anything he can do to really effect the issue without some congressional buy-in. Screwing with NICs is the only thing I can imagine but it would be of dubious use.
Great article. In the past few years every attorney had jumped on the band Wagon and suddenly they are experts in the nfa field. I don’t try to scare people into hiring me to prepare a trust for them.
MDA – You are not interested in a conversation, you are interested in delivering a lecture. When you wish to converse, let us know. When you wish to make progress on these serious issues, we’ll be here. When you are strong enough to have a communication that goes two ways, we’ll have that conversation.
Until such time, you’re not helping our nation.
Post of the month.
Cop A shoots Cop B by “accident” during raid. Cop A is exonerated by investigation that finds it was an “accidental discharge.” Cop A is transferred to another dept. Cop A’s wife disposes of the phone that contained sexting messages from Cop B to her. All is well in Copland.
You don’t draw your weapon unless you are facing a lethal force threat. Pretty poor judgement of the CCW holder to draw. I support CCW, but get some training and know the laws in your jurisdiction. The rights you save could be your own.
According to James Yeager, 40 s&w was made for men with small reproductive organs. Personally, I don’t see a reasonable way to connect penis size with caliber preference.
Truth About Guns? Love ya’ll! Keep up the great work! Can’t wait to hear your rendition on this ammo.
someone’s mad they are poor and a liberal. the truth asbout guns is that the 5 strictest areas of the us for gun control, ny, nj, illinois, and california, and Washington DC, also have the 5 highest gun violence rates….so kick facts, not some obama’s not a monkey propaganda….
America knows Obama’s a monkey, get with the times.
If you guys want to test them instead of talking crap about them first, then here is a place that says they have them in stock for sale.
http://www.ammunitiondepot.com/RIP-9MM-Ammo-p/g2rip9.htm
I am interested in the semi-auto feed question but don’t want to spend 44.00 for 20 rounds.