Vox: Police Support Armed Citizens As Long As They’re Not Black or Brown

kyle rittenhouse rifle kenosha

(Adam Rogan/The Journal Times via AP)

A recent paper by University of Arizona sociologist Jennifer Carlson offers some insight into the police’s behavior. She conducted dozens of hours of interviews about guns with 79 police chiefs in three states — Michigan, California, and Arizona — to try to better understand the way police see armed civilians.

Carlson found that police leaders tended to see armed civilians as allies, maybe even informal deputies — provided they fit a set of racially coded descriptors.

“Police chiefs articulated a position of gun populism based on a presumption of racial respectability,” Carlson writes. “‘Good guys with guns’ were marked off as responsible in ways that reflected white, middle-class respectability.”

This helps us understand what happened in Wisconsin as not a bug in the code of American policing, but a feature. There’s a reason anti-police violence protesters have been met with crackdowns, while armed anti-lockdown protesters could menace the Michigan Capitol without incident.

Police — who are heavily white, heavily male, and overwhelmingly conservative politically — see guns as a scourge when they’re in the wrong hands. But the “wrong hands” tend to be Black and brown ones. When respectable-seeming white people arm themselves, police welcome their intervention — even, or perhaps especially, in a tense situation where the potential for escalation to violence is really high.

– Zach Beauchamp in Why police encouraged a teenager with a gun to patrol Kenosha’s streets

comments

  1. avatar Free Kyle! says:

    If you do not support Kyle, you do not support 2A.

    Kyle did more to keep our families safe than anyone I know.

    See Kyle!’
    Free Kyle!

    1. avatar You zoomers have a sense of humor. says:

      See Kyle indeed 🙂

      Maybe that’s too edgy. Lol.

      Where can I donate to support Kyle?

        1. avatar Roger J says:

          The previous article says Wood recommends https://fightback.law/ as the law firms crowd funding for his defense.

        2. avatar Geoff "Ammo. LOTS of ammo..." PR says:

          https://www.givesendgo.com/GUCZ

          It’s over $100,000 as of 11:45 AM EST.

          And God bless each and every one who donated… 🙂

        3. avatar JoeMoma says:

          meanwhile that Jacob guy has a gofundme at 1 million dollars already. what BS

        4. avatar neiowa says:

          Good to see his is outraising Huber’s concubine.

          https://www.gofundme.com/f/249ip7bjxc

          I’m just shocked there is no gofund me for KyleRittenhouse.

      1. avatar Casey says:

        Which Kyle? The one who is about this tall?

        1. avatar Thixotropic says:

          The really young looking kid in Kenosha charged with murdering shitbag BLM and Antifa punks.

          You know, the one that’s a better MAN than you are hands down.

          Trolling turdbox.

          BTW this ‘Study’ looks like a very limited and deeply flawed study. More of an opinion piece by a Leftist Twit published by a Leftist News Org.

        2. avatar neiowa says:

          He didn’t “murder” ANYONE.

    2. avatar Ron says:

      Kyle Rittenhouse is actually Kyle Reese, before the war and time travel.

      His age actually pairs up perfectly with Reese’s in the series.

      1. avatar Innocent Bystander says:

        These protesters must be stopped by any means neccessary.

        1. avatar Miner49er says:

          Yes, kill those who may cause property damage or inconvenience to the travel of others.

          It’s all right there in the US Constitution, right after the part about the United States of America being a Christian nation.

          I’m sure it’s somewhere in the bill of rights, the articles granting the power of summary execution to any citizen who feels offended or annoyed by the conduct of others.

          Trump/Putin 2020

        2. avatar MADDMAXX says:

          I’m sure it’s somewhere in the bill of rights, the articles granting the power of summary execution to any citizen who feels offended or annoyed by the conduct of others.

          It’s the paragraph immediately following the one about pissed off mobs having the right to destroy public AND private property, physically assault anyone that disagrees with them, loot and steal (I’m sorry, they call that “procurement” without payment aka REPARATIONS), burn occupied buildings, interfere with interstate commerce, impede the daily flow of the lives of ordinary citizens who had absolutely nothing to do with their grievances, shoot and kill anyone that disrupts their “shopping”, intimidate, harass, call for the deaths of THOUSANDS of Americans simply because they share a common profession and to function as a paid hoard financed by some of the wealthiest men and largest corporations in the world to deny citizens their RIGHTS to “Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness” . … Go back and check again.. when you find this, you’ll find that.. It all replaces that pesky little “right of the people PEACEABLY to assemble, and to PETITION the Government for a redress of grievances” you know that afterthought called the 1st Amendment…..

        3. avatar Patience Wearing Thin... says:

          Do you work this hard to be an uninformed, fact denying moron, or is this something that comes naturally to you?

        4. avatar WingedHussar says:

          @miner

          You mean like the minor inconvenience for getting your head bashed in like the guy in Portland?

          Or the guy who was using a fire extinguisher to try and save his place of work getting sucker punched and knocked out in Kenosha?

          You sound like the type of regard that would tell a rape victim that it’s only a minor inconvenience.

          Also, FYI, Rosenbaum is a pedo.
          https://inmatedatasearch.azcorrections.gov/PrintInmate.aspx?ID=172556

        5. avatar MinerFuhrer says:

          Arson is just a petty crime, a Molotov really isn’t that dangerous, a skateboard in the skull has never hurt anyone, and it’s perfectly legal to hunt people in the streets to beat them up. Oh yeah, and miner is a retard but ya’ll seem to know that already.

        6. avatar Ron says:

          Miner you continue to lie. Arson is a felony and possession of a Molotov is a federal offense.

          You’ve been thoroughly debunked on this blog anyway, by multiple readers here.

        7. avatar LarryinTX says:

          Rosenbaum *WAS* a pedo, Kyle cured him.

      2. avatar Chris T in KY says:

        to Ron
        (smile)

    3. avatar Debbie W. says:

      Another election time race baiter trying to whitewash the horrific democRat Party History of Race Based Gun Control all at the expense of others…What a sleazy lowlife pos.

      1. avatar Geoff "Ammo. LOTS of ammo..." PR says:

        Is this the real Deborah?

        There was no lint-licker in there… 🙂

        1. avatar PMinFl says:

          I miss the dirty diaper insult.

    4. avatar Debbie W. says:

      That’s right race baiter Jennifer Carlson. In fact rumor has it that if you are a black or brown cop you don’t get a gun 🔫 until a white police chief says so. Stuff like that only goes to show any two bit sleazebag like you can stoop to get the results they want…Now gfy.

      TRUMP/PENCE 2020.

      1. avatar LarryinTX says:

        I was kinda wondering why anybody would believe this “journalist”. Sounds like made up BS to me.

        AND 2024!

  2. avatar Jim Bob says:

    Maybe the police prefer peaceful (peaceful doesn’t mean not willing to defend themselves), non-criminal armed citizens. Maybe they prefer the people spray painting ACAB and shouting “Kill the pigs” not be armed.

    1. avatar Ginder12 says:

      And last night with no cops and no militia present the protests were peaceful. I know, I know. I’m a lowlife, low information, 2nd amendment hating, piece of shit, commie troll.

      1. avatar Ing says:

        Self-awareness is the first step in the process of change.

      2. avatar That Jason says:

        Last night the police, national guard, and federal marshals were protecting the same civic buildings as previous nights.

        The sole difference is that the people out after curfew didn’t attack the police cordon as though they were spoiling for a fight.

        1. avatar Ing says:

          I wonder what ever could have occurred to take the fight out of them? It’s all such a mystery.

      3. avatar EndDangerEd says:

        Again with the LIES…. cops were out there… National Guard too… and the violent idiots that WOULD have caused fires, looting, beatings, throughout Kenosha were SCARED. THEY encountered a REAL response to THEIR violence… and several of their “bad-a$$es” found out that THEY WERE NOT. And then they were…. NOT.

    2. avatar Someone says:

      Maybe. But it’s not only their message.
      “There’s a reason anti-police violence protesters have been met with crackdowns, while armed anti-lockdown protesters could menace the Michigan Capitol without incident.” Definitely! But it’s not color of their skin, it’s their behavior. When the “menacing” anti-lockdown protest ended, the place was cleaner than before, not one store got looted and zero people got hurt. After the “mostly peaceful” anti-police ones, you may think you are in war zone.

      1. avatar Ing says:

        Not just after them, *during* them.

      2. avatar Optimistic Engineer says:

        An armed society is a polite society.

  3. avatar F around and find out says:

    Free Kyle!

    Free James Fields!

    They can’t throw us all in prison. Water the tree!

    Nationaljusticeparty.com

    1. avatar Green Mtn. Boy says:

      It is parched and sadly in need of watering.

    2. avatar Andrew lias says:

      That party seems like an ethnonationalist party. blech.

      Otherwise we are in dangerous times indeed.

    3. avatar Hush says:

      From Fool Around and find out, “They can’t throw us all in prison.”
      Now we know why they turned felons onto the streets and the chinese flu was just part of the reasoning!

  4. avatar Jeffy56 says:

    Just another lib bias peephole into society. To defend our cities and states, Cops have a job to do. Who is the problem and who is not. The foundations of our country are eroded by people who steal, kill, and game the system of safety nets, encouraged by pandering leftist politicians. Reality. Gun owners are not the problem. Being of a particular race or ethnicity is not a prerequisite to being a positive in society.

    1. avatar Optimistic Engineer says:

      Agreed. I personally know cops supporting black and brown gun owners defending the community and their property.

      Those carrying guns to cause mayhem, kill cops, and uproot society? Of course not!

  5. avatar Chadwick says:

    I wonder how this research would like up with a graph of violent crime by skin color. If this “study” isn’t complete bullshit, that extra data might add some interesting perspective. – every time I park under a tree a bird $hits on my car… I wonder if I am less likely to see a tree as a friendly source of shade.

    1. avatar Miner49er says:

      I wonder even more how it would line up with a graph of income and economic security?

      No money, no justice.

      No justice, no peace.

      1. avatar John E> says:

        Get out of the basement and get a job then.

      2. avatar Someone says:

        We do agree on something after all, Miner. It is true that some demographic groups tend to study harder, get jobs and open businesses oftener, work harder, commit less crime and spen much less time in prisons – and therefore make much more money than other groups.

        “Powerty” (so called poor Americans still live better than vast majority of people in the world) does not cause the culture of sloth and violence through. Its other way around.

      3. avatar Hannibal says:

        You sure about that “no peace” thing? How did that work out in this incident?

        Seems to me that a bunch of anarchist agitators, one armed with a gun, couldn’t take out one juvenile who actually knew how to use his. You think that’s gonna play out better for you in the streets next time? Better find a 15 year old to try and beat up, maybe you’ll have better luck.

        1. avatar jwm says:

          miner isn’t going to be in the streets. His thing is to spin up the low iq’d followers of fascism and send them on rampages.

          At his trial he will try to tell the jury that he has clean hands. He did nothing wrong. Conspiracy is a hell of a charge.

          ‘I was just following orders’ will be his defense.

      4. avatar PMinFl says:

        miner, at least you can read the signs carried by others smart enough to make up slogans.

    2. avatar Mister Fleas says:

      “I wonder how this research would like up with a graph of violent crime by skin color.”

      This is from BLM’s own Instagram page(remember, blacks make up 13.4% of the American population):

      https://www.instagram.com/p/CDAObUKpWJK/?igshid=uolqdkfb2icc

  6. avatar FREE KYLE NOW! says:

    It’s time we all put aside our differences- about masks, open carry, the GOP, the NRA, Wayne’s suits, etc…

    And support Kyle!

    Because of Kyle, my sister in law is no longer going to these protests/riots. “I didn’t realize the white people would start shooting. And when they shoot, they don’t miss.” I know, it’s complicated with family.

    He is a hero. Free Kyle! Free James Fields!

    1. avatar hawkeye says:

      I agree that it can be complicated with family. However, ‘“I didn’t realize the white people would start shooting…”‘ needs to be discussed with her because it appears she may have some “racist” issues of her own. From the images and reports I’ve seen, all kinds of people on both sides have been armed at these riots and protests. No one should play the race card unless they have the chips to back it up.

    2. avatar Hannibal says:

      Just because he’s not guilty doesn’t make him a hero.

  7. avatar Green Mtn. Boy says:

    Free Kyle and charge the prosecutor !

  8. avatar Celebrate victory? says:

    Is it ok to make “See Kyle” jokes? I know you zoomers have less connection to WWII, and think it’s funny- but I think it might alienate the older generation.

    1. avatar They hate us anyway says:

      I’m 16. It’s funny. We’re called basically Nazis in school by our teachers, so kids just don’t care any more.

      This next generation of white conservatives is going to be more racist than you can possibly imagine.

      But in support of Kyle, I will clean up my optics and stop making “See Kyle” jokes until he is freed.

      FREE KYLE
      FREE JAMES FIELDS

      1. avatar Ron says:

        The extreme left is in fact making its own coffin with all the antics they’re putting on, and in fact, this is happening in Europe too…

        Europe, long seen as the new heartland of progress and leftist thought, is facing a fierce backlash from the young and European right, as the right and nationalism grow by the year. Even in Germany. The AfD now has significant political power, and is possibly the most right wing party on the planet today. Much of Eastern Europe and even France are following a similar path.

        It is entirely the fault of the left, what happens in to them when the right re takes Europe. And judging by all of European history, it won’t be pretty.

        In America we may be looking at something similar, but luckily in America, the American right is actually pretty level headed and tempered due to its constitutional foundation and free market ideals.

        The left here will be defeated, but in Europe, they’ll be… well… ha…

        1. avatar Prndll says:

          People should not underestimate the potential of all out shooting war as a result of this….another world war possibly

        2. avatar Mark N. says:

          Like NO WAY JOSE! All conservatives are white privileged racist killers with guns!!! (I know for sure–I was it on CNN.)

      2. avatar Miner49er says:

        “This next generation of white conservatives is going to be more racist than you can possibly imagine.”

        Even more racist than the current generation of white conservatives?

        Well, that’s quite the admission, but I take you at your word.

        And I can tell you, there are many of us older white folks who are tired of the racist BS, and we won’t stand for it.

        Having lived all my life in the south, racism exist today, it is no joke. The routine Racism and prejudice that occurs in the south is coming to a close as COVID-19 removes the small minded bigots.

        1. avatar SouthernShooter says:

          “And I can tell you, there are many of us older white folks who are tired of the racist BS, and we won’t stand for it.
          Having lived all my life in the south, racism exist today, it is no joke. The routine Racism and prejudice that occurs in the south is coming to a close as COVID-19 removes the small minded bigots.”

          My, what an prejudiced idiot you are.
          My dad, a WW2 vet, was from Toledo Ohio area and would talk about the prejudice and racism he saw against the Polish steel workers there. His uncle once declared that he would rather his 2 daughters “marry a N***** than a Polock”–and both of them married Polish-Americans.

          For you to make that statement just shows how judgmental and pitiful you are. I have lived in the South most of my life, part of it in the Delta area, and yes there is prejudice, but less with our younger generations. Unfortunately I see more of it in the OLDER generation despite your self-righteous posturing of the older generation being “tired of the racist BS”.
          You expose your own racist and prejudice leanings with your own words.

        2. avatar Patience Wearing Thin... says:

          “Even more racist than the current generation of white conservatives?” Seriously? I’m white, old, and conservative, and sick of being whitewashed with the term “racist” by morons like you who generalize, stereotype under the guise of being sensitive and standing up for equality and justice. You have no clue and I encourage you to shut the hell up.

          Your mantra should be ‘It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one’s mouth and remove all doubt’, and try to abide by it.

        3. avatar Miner49er says:

          “I’m sick of being whitewashed with the term “racist”

          Hilarious, this is what the neurolinguistic programming professionals call ‘hidden speech‘.

          Go back and read the 16-year-old’s self admission that the younger generation are conservative racists, it’s his language, not mine.

        4. avatar uncommon_sense says:

          Miner49er,

          Let me get this straight: I am a white Christian conservative who hasn’t died from exhaustion for advancing the “stop black racism” narrative so that makes me a racist, right?

          I am having a hard time understanding how I am racist when my spouse and I adopted a neglected child of another race at enormous expense, sacrifice, and difficulty to ourselves. Of course the rest of our white relatives (some conservative, some Progressive) must be racists as well for accepting our adopted child of another race with love, compassion, and tenderness.

          And I am having a hard time understanding how the white conservative Christian people at my church are racists when no less than 4% of the families have adopted children of other races, also at great expense, sacrifice, and difficulty — including one family who adopted a crack-cocaine baby who required extremely difficult ongoing medical intervention for well over 12 months.

          Interesting point of fact: additional families at my church adopted “white” children as well and something approaching 10% of our families have adopted children that desperately needed families and homes. Somehow, though, that makes us evil and racists. Got it.

          Who needs facts when you can just hate someone for whatever willy-nilly reason and go about spewing lies and vitriol at them?

        5. avatar MADDMAXX says:

          how the white conservative Christian people at my church are racists

          I’m having a hard time understanding how it is that ONLY white conservatives can be racist AND how it is (to Miner) that Covid 19 knows the difference and is only killing off those dastardly white conservative racists in the South (I’m sure there is NO racism on the OTHER side of the Mason-Dixon, you know, where most of the violent protests and riots are occurring?) …. Hard to complain about 180,000 dead and then applaud the deaths of white conservatives (racist or not)….

      3. avatar Miner49er says:

        “I’m 16. It’s funny. We’re called basically Nazis in school by our teachers, so kids just don’t care any more.

        This next generation of white conservatives is going to be more racist than you can possibly imagine.”

        Those are not my words, those are the words of a 16-year-old who posted as “they hate us anyway“

        I’m sorry y’all missed the quotation marks, but there it is, it is what it is.

        1. avatar LarryinTX says:

          Your enjoyment makes them your words. My words? You’re a lying POS. A 16 year old can be forgiven his ignorance, what is your excuse?

  9. avatar Brodirt says:

    I think the roof-top Koreans would have something different to say.
    I think that a bunch of business owners in Minneapolis would have something different to say.

  10. avatar MDH says:

    Because police are shackled by Communist shill politicians and media counterparts, the time has arrived where armed civilians must stand with and protect law enforcement professionals, our law abiding citizenry, our own families, institutions, and businesses, and ourselves.

    Our founders foresaw and provided for this time with the recognition of the natural law of self defense in the form of the Second Amendment.

    I will stand with, and defend my fellow Americans in Law Enforcement against all enemies, foreign and domestic.

    1. avatar anarchyst says:

      Your statement: “I will stand with, and defend my fellow Americans in Law Enforcement against all enemies, foreign and domestic.” is disingenuous and misleading to say the least.
      “Law enforcement” WILL NOT (and is not required to) protect you, and if you are a white conservative ” will quite often be used against you.
      If you legally defend yourself, you will still be put through the legal wringer while those who should be prosecuted for wrongdoing will go scot-free.
      The “powers that be” are behind all of this destruction as there is a greater agenda at play here.
      I am not saying that there are not individual police officers who will be fair, but when their jobs and pensions are on the line, they will do their “master’s” (not the taxpayers) bidding.

      1. avatar MDH says:

        “I will stand with, and defend my fellow Americans in Law Enforcement against all enemies, foreign and domestic.” is disingenuous and misleading to say the least”.

        You should hope, in spite of evidence to the contrary vis a vis your moronic rhetoric, that you are never stupid enough to actually test that theory.

        1. avatar tdiinva says:

          Anarchists associate the Mob with “we the people” but cannot define who “we the people is. ” Is it Antifa/BLM or is it “all or blue lives matter? How do we determine who the real “we the people is? Trial by combat? If push comes to shove Anarchyst will stand with Antifa because that is where the anti-police narrative leads you.

      2. avatar tdiinva says:

        It is time to put this cops don’t have to defend myth to rest. The Court ruled in a civil case that police don’t protect specific individuals because they can’t be everywhere. Their role is to protect the civil order by removing bad actors from the streets and general deterrence. If police did not reduce crime than there would be no Ferguson effect when they are constrained from acting. Arguing that the police are useless because crime still exists is the same thing as saying laws murder are ineffective because people still get mudered.

        It’s strange that someone who goes by the name of anarchyst is unhappy with anarchy. Perhaps he should reconsider his position.

        1. avatar Chris T in KY says:

          “Anarchy in the UK” is a great song. “Cop killer” is a great song. “Peace in Mississippi” is a great “violent” instrumental song. See the album “Crash Landing” for the original version.
          But people who call themselves “anarchists” or who say anarchy is a good thing for a society, I question if they really support Liberty.

      3. avatar jwm says:

        anarchyst is a holocaust denier. To him the evil jew is the source of all wrong. If you give his words any credibility, shame on you.

        1. avatar tdiinva says:

          Who says I do give him any credit? He is an archetype. We have a lot of anarcho-capitalist/Faux Libertarians posting the same anti-police screeds.

        2. avatar G-muny nilka says:

          Actually, he may be on to something 😉
          Just something to chew on…..

  11. avatar KK says:

    I guess it never occurred to Carlson that the police base their actions and policies on decades of experience with peoples of all types. She refers to it as “menacing” the Michigan capitol. So just the appearance of guns is menacing.
    It wasn’t long ago a group of blacks, I forget their name, was marching down a street in a large city, all of them carrying AR style rifles. It didn’t look like the police treated that any differently as if they were white.

    1. avatar Chris T in KY says:

      They call themselves “NFAC” in Louisville KY. And yes the cops supported their 1st and 2nd amendment civil rights.

  12. avatar tdiinva says:

    Back in the day when aircraft hijacking was in vogue wealthy Arabs would put up with the extra scrutiny to fly El Al because they didn’t get hijacked. People feel more comfortable around people who take measured to protect people instead if hreatening them. Just saying.

  13. avatar Shire-man says:

    were marked off as responsible in ways that reflected white, middle-class respectability.
    Reminds me of this gem from the Smithsonian: https://www.newsweek.com/smithsonian-race-guidelines-rational-thinking-hard-work-are-white-values-1518333

    Fighting racism 50 years ago was: “we’re all created equal” and “character over color.”
    Fighting racism today is: “they can’t help the way they behave” and “color over character.”

  14. avatar The Crimson Pirate says:

    From the article
    “Good guys with guns’ were marked off as responsible in ways that reflected white, middle-class respectability.”

    From the paper the article cites
    “gun militarism for criminal gun activity associated with black and brown communities and drug- and gang-related crime and gun populism with respect to lawfully gun-owning Americans, often marked as white and middle class.”

    The actual LEO position towards guns is against criminals with guns and in favor of law abiding citizens with guns. The connection to race is not endemic to that position, it is an artifact of the increased criminality of the black population.

    The left, in their race/power dialectic model of the world, assumes that cops don’t want black people to have guns and that they use criminality as a proxy for race. The assumption that the “study” wants to prove is that cops don’t like black people and use anti criminal positions to target them.

    The right, in their competence hierarchy model model of the world, do not posit race as a pre existing focus of the police or society. The right’s model assumes that black people have free will and are not inherently criminals. Thus encouraging gun ownership, carry, and use among the law abiding while opposing it for criminals is not inherently racist and favors those who behave civilly and not criminally regardless of and wholly independent of race.

    The study put a lot of effort into spinning the anti guns for criminals position into one based on race. This is a typical example of leftist junk science in which results that do not say what they want are molded into something that appears to say what they want.

    1. avatar Dude says:

      That’s exactly what a racist science denier would say. /s

      It’s funny how they just won’t give up trying to smear the real peaceful protesters. When those armed protesters showed up, how much property did they destroy? How many buildings were burned down and looted? How many people were attacked? These people literally create their own reality. Talk about fake news…

  15. avatar CentralVirginian says:

    Most police are all for citizen(non-felon) carry by people of all races. The distinction now is the current breed of “progressives” who often cite their reason for firearm ownership as police violence, this implies they plan on using those firearms against or on police.
    The paper notes the early licensing and permitting schemes that democrats implemented in Jim Crow days. Many of those polices are still intact but only in democrat controlled districts so tell me who is really afraid of minorities with guns? Republicans who dismantled and continue to dismantle jim crow licensing and permitting schemes or democrats who want to implement more of them?

  16. avatar Specialist38 says:

    Seems to be there are two different scenarios.

    One – armed people try to prevent destruction of property and assault of innocent people.

    Two – armed malcontents try to re-shape society by destroying property and threatening innocents who would speak or stand against said destruction.

    Not about race, it’s about actions. If your actions infringe on others, you should expect to be confronted .

  17. avatar former water walker says:

    I have to say the Republican party put on quite an inspiring show last night. ESPECIALLY the widow of the retired black cop murdered by grinning brown scum(I tuned out Trump but not because I won’t vote for him-droning on & on). Oh and most cop’s I’ve known in Cook County HATE ANYONE carrying a gat. Red and yellow black or white. I’ve known quite a few…shout out to ex-Bear Brian Erlacher for disagreeing with the mob about deifying black felons!

    1. avatar Umm . . . says:

      I had the converse reaction. The President’s speech was much more focused than usual (in COVID briefings, etc.). I didn’t see too many of the preliminaries, but pretty much all I saw from Ivanka was trying to out-demagogue the Democrats with a litany of how many handouts the Administration had provided, plus every single “woke” buzzword.

      1. avatar Dude says:

        That’s probably because Ivanka and Jared were both democrats. She couldn’t even vote for dad in the 2016 primary because she didn’t change her registration in time.

        1. avatar former water walker says:

          LOL…to those unaware there’s a whole conspiracy theory about the Kushner’s. I agree with it. Jared is a leftard and dragged his beautiful wife along for the ride. To be fair to Trump so was he. He sure isn’t anything more than lukewarm on 2A!

        2. avatar Umm . . . says:

          Dude, FWW,
          All true. Our team deserves and requires constructive criticism for fallibly, lukewarmly defending core American principles and rights. Those who see core American principles and rights as hated obstacles in their way deserve “destructive criticism”.

    2. avatar Miner49er says:

      What I find amazing about trumps campaign is how easy it is for him to use taxpayers money to fund his political goals:

      “The billboards began popping up along a desert stretch of highway in Arizona and California in early August — plastered with “Make America Great Again!” in large capital letters or an image of President Donald Trump looking up to the sky and giving a big thumbs up.

      The small company that funded the large billboards had just months earlier received a large cash infusion backed by the same administration now being celebrated, public records show.
      Jones 1 Inc. was approved for a loan of between $150,000 and $350,000 at the end of April through the federal government’s Paycheck Protection Program (PPP), which was set up to help struggling small businesses save jobs during the pandemic.
      The company, which owns a small Shell gas station and travel center in Needles, California, went on to lease “six beautiful Trump billboards” near the border of California and Arizona, which a local group of Lake Havasu Republicans heralded — thanking “a generous Trump supporter.”

      Trump/Putin 2020:

      “It’s 180,000 dead Americans? It is what it is… “

      1. avatar Ing says:

        So the COVID relief funds that *everyone* got have magically transformed into Trump using public money to fund his campaign because one small company owns some roadside billboards in the middle of nowhere?

        The pointless gyrations of those afflicted with Trump Aggravated Resistance Disorder are baffling, but nonetheless entertaining.

        1. avatar Miner49er says:

          The PPP program was designed to rescue small businesses in serious financial trouble, not to subsidize political speech by the wealthy.

          Or is socialism OK when the money goes to your political party campaign advertising?

          “Whether or not the money Jones 1 Inc. received through the Small Business Administration loan program was directly used to pay for the Trump billboards, business ethics professors and legal experts said non-essential spending like this violates the spirit of the program, which was meant for small businesses that desperately needed the assistance to keep paying workers. More importantly, they said, this spending highlights failures in how the program was implemented and the confusion surrounding which businesses should have been entitled to the money. It also underscores the need for increased oversight — especially when the government decides which loans to forgive outright.

          “If you have enough capital to spend it on billboards, maybe you shouldn’t have been one of the companies to receive this loan,” said Liz Hempowicz, director of public policy at the Project On Government Oversight (POGO), a nonprofit watchdog group. “The responsibility really rested with the SBA and the administration to make sure they were spending these taxpayer dollars in a way that Congress intended.”

        2. avatar MADDMAXX says:

          The pointless gyrations of those afflicted with Trump Aggravated Resistance Disorder are baffling,

          Maybe that should be, afflicted with (R)abidly (E)nigmatic (T)rump (A)ggravated (R)esistance (D)iorder (S)ymptoms, OR… wait for IT… R.E.T.A.R.D.S…..

      2. avatar LarryinTX says:

        You are *SO* full of shit. Would you care to provide any evidence about your wet dream?

      3. avatar MADDMAXX says:

        It’s 180,000 dead Americans? It is what it is…

        AND under Biden this number would have been a multiple of three or four times.. Biden would NOT have banned travel from China OR Europe and while this Covid 19 thing was ramping up the Senate was shut down in a senseless beyond stupid attempt to discredit the POTUS with a sham Impeachment trial which effectively shut down BOTH Chambers thanks to a handful of Progressive Liberal Trump hating Zealots… OBTW 11 of the 15 highest mortality rates per state are ALL Liberal (hardcore RED) states most of whom called it a minor problem, Pelosi herself AND DiBlasio told people to get out and party, nothing to worry about til there WAS… But, “it is what it is”… Cuomo stated ‘Vulnerable People Are Going To Die’ from COVID, No Matter What We Do” AFTER Trump gave him thousands of ventilators AND a Navy Hospital ship AND an emergency “hospital” (staffed by Trump) that went virtually unused while Cuomo sent sick people into nursing homes to spread the disease and die because… Trump.
        You realize that this is a provisional count that WILL eventually be examined and sorted into either “died FROM” OR “died WITH” Covid 19 categories ( like the motorcyclist recently killed in an accident but tested positive and was reported as “died FROM Covid 19)… On the other hand the following numbers are FACTUAL and NEARLY 100% endorsed by Liberal Democrats and include LIVE BIRTH abortions and even post partum infanticide.. Cheers resounded in the NY. state assembly when they passed their version of the “right up to the moment of birth” bill.. Covid 19 WILL go away but abortions WILL NOT….
        Abortion Was the Leading Cause of Death Worldwide in 2019, Killing 42 Million People…
        In America, just under 1 million babies are aborted every year. But then “it IS what it is”..
        259,366 black Americans are killed by abortion each year… 36% of all abortions But hey, “It is what it IS”.. (Liberal racist Margaret Sanger would be proud)…. YOU really make this TOO easy…

        1. avatar PMinFl says:

          very good, Max.

  18. avatar Dude says:

    Skateboard guy girlfriend is getting some serious donations on gofundme by people that saw him as a hero.

    There are some interesting comments. Some people are even donating so they can leave negative comments.

    “This hero was murdered trying to stop a crazed white supremacist lunatic on a shooting spree from killing more people in Kenosha, WI. He joins the ranks of other anti-fascist heroes like Heather Heyer who gave their lives fighting for humanity. His sacrifice will never be forgotten. I am donating on behalf of a fascist community on Facebook that is celebrating the mass murderer as a hero. I pledged to donate one dollar for every hateful comment they post, and I am doing just that.”

    https://www.gofundme.com/f/249ip7bjxc

    1. avatar Debbie W. says:

      The young man showed restraint until he had no other choice but to defend himself. From what’s known it is no murder case so the only thing left is to slander and libel the victim of a violent mob attack.
      This marxist mentality that the guilty are innocent and the innocent are guilty may fly in the heads of useful idiots but it crashes and burns everywhere else.
      If you want to stand against bullies, looters and arsonists then get off your behind and come hell and high water vote…

      TRUMP/PENCE 2020

  19. avatar Ragnar says:

    From the article: “Police — who are heavily white, heavily male, and overwhelmingly conservative politically — “

    Is the race, gender and political leanings of the Police proportional to the demographics of the country, state or city they serve?

    1. avatar former water walker says:

      It sure is in Chiraq! Run by black folks(Beetlenuice as mayor,Cook co has a black “leader”many brown Aldercritters,po-leece heavily black and the chief of po-leece is black. Most of the state & federal pols are black or brown. Yet they still blame whitey!

    2. avatar Dude says:

      Atlanta minority population: 63%
      Atlanta minority police share: 63%

      https://www.governing.com/gov-data/safety-justice/police-department-officer-demographics-minority-representation.html

      Blaming everything on whitey is just the go to position for these people that never learned the skill of critical thinking.

    3. avatar Hannibal says:

      Often it’s not. But police are not chosen randomly from the population, which is the only way one would expect it to be the same.

      Anecdotally, the black cops I know get the most shit from dirtbag criminals and ‘protestors.’ Wait till you see some white upper-middle class trust fund kid dressed up like a homeless person yell ‘uncle tom motherf**ker’ at a black cop who grew up in the hood.

  20. avatar Ghost Who Walks says:

    A photo of 17-year-old Kyle Rittenhouse defending himself by shooting dead that Antifa thug from the communist insurgency is equal to the famous photo of our Flag going up at Iwo Jima.

    1. avatar Miner49er says:

      The flag Photo you speak of was a staged event, the real flag raising happened hours before.

      I‘d like to see a photo of Kyle using lethal force to defend another persons property, that would be interesting.

      1. avatar jwm says:

        Just like Germany during it’s fascist days criminals were let out of prisons and insane asylums to do the dirty work for the fascists. All 3 of the fascist storm troopers shot by Kyle had criminal records. It’s an old tactic.

        Kyle defended his life against fascist storm troopers. Period.

      2. avatar Joseph Quixote says:

        Miner you are such a troll.
        You know nothing about Iwo Jima. They raised the second flag because the first was tiny and barely visible from the ships at sea.
        2 of the men that raised the “staged” flag never left the island. They were not actors. Many of the others had shattered lives from the brutal battle.
        They were and are American hero’s, something you obviously hate.

        1. avatar MADDMAXX says:

          Another Miners Hero bites the dust.. Is Pedophilia a prerequisite for joining BLM..
          A man who led a protest from a skateboard through North Conway last month and called for defunding the police was charged with child pornography. On Father’s Day (June 21), Chris DeVries, 37, of Jackson led a protest he called “Skate Away the Hate,” which involved people riding bikes and skateboards down Route 16 from Schouler Park to Depot Road and back.
          At the protest, DeVries spoke through a bullhorn and listed off a number of demands that he said came from local chapters of Black Lives Matter. “If we divest funds from police and prison systems we all benefit,” said DeVries. “Those funds can go to local communities and social services.”’
          However: ‘Jackson Police Chief Chris Perley said Sunday Aug 23rd that DeVries was charged with six counts of possessing child sexual abuse images, one count of possession of psilocybin mushrooms and one of falsifying physical evidence. ’The falsifying physical evidence complaint says DeVries threw his cellphone from the porch when law enforcement arrived. The child abuse images show underage girls either in “lewd exhibition” of private parts or engaging in sexual activity.” ‘According to Perley’s probable cause statement, a forensic examiner with Internet Crimes Against Children found more than 60 images of child sexual abuse on DeVries’ phone. DeVries admitted to viewing and sharing child pornography and also that the mushrooms were used as drugs, Perley said. Jackson Police and several other police agencies executed a search warrant at the DeVries home on Wilson Road at 11:45 a.m. Friday after tips were received by the New Hampshire Internet Crimes Against Children Task Force.
          A warrant was issued by a Cheshire County Superior Court judge. Each child pornography charge is punishable by up to 15 years in prison and a $4,000 fine. The drug and evidence charges are punishable by up to seven years in prison.’

  21. avatar MADDMAXX says:

    “Police chiefs articulated a position of gun populism based on a presumption of racial respectability,” Carlson writes. “‘Good guys with guns’ were marked off as responsible in ways that reflected white, middle-class respectability.”

    I gotta call bullshit on that one, first of all NO cop is going to openly make that kind of racist statement to any outsider much less to a Liberal College Sociology professor and expect to have a job in the near future, never mind that many police chiefs are political animals and with sights set on higher office there is no way in hell they would want something that stupid laying around waiting to bite them on the ass when they poke their head out looking for that next government revenue stream… I want names, all 79 of them, I want them all to publicly proclaim their racial bias to the world… Did she only interview white cops or was it balanced according to the racial makeup of police departments across the U.S. at approximately 65% white, 13% black and a good mix of American Indian, Latino, Asian and Middle Eastern in the remaining 22%.. Were the interviews with males only or did she also talk to female chiefs? Need more input…. This is just too weak… (I’m guessing “funded by EVERYTOWN appeared somewhere near the end of her paper)….

    1. avatar Ing says:

      What the “researchers” are doing is measuring the responses against a stereotypical set of “whiteness” indicators. This leads them to conclude that when the police approve of armed citizens, they’re treating said citizens like privileged white people.

      I guess the research could be right about that. But as usual, the leftist progtards get the meaning of it exactly backwards.

      It’s not only armed white people that get a wink and a nod. These protests and marches are teeming with armed people of all shades of black and brown, and as long as they’re not pointing rifles at people, they all get treated the same. The real point here is that if “white privilege” exists, the police are VERY good at extending it to people who aren’t white.

    2. avatar Duke says:

      The author makes a racist assumption…

      “‘Good guys with guns’ were marked off as responsible…”
      He equates “RESPONSIBLE” with White and irresponsible with Black.

    3. avatar LarryinTX says:

      Spot on, MM, such blatant BS and so many bit on it. Clearly all lies.

    4. avatar PMinFl says:

      I thought that most” police chiefs” were appointed by their mayor or even sought out from other cities. I guess that the chiefs were playing the party line to protect their own jobs.
      Remember that police have to deal with criminals, loonies and the scum of the earth, who does anyone think they are going to support? They sure aren’t about to support those who they are sworn to arrest……. But their chiefs might.

  22. avatar cgray says:

    Hitler Youth Kyle still rotting his jail cell or nah?

    1. avatar LarryinTX says:

      Neverhappen, Dindunuffin’.

  23. avatar FLNarcissist says:

    Weird, I could have sworn I saw several hundred armed black militia members marching through the capitol city of KENTUCKY a few weeks ago, and then stand in formation in front of Louisville city hall and give a speech. All with the blessing, cooperation, and even assistance of the police. As much as I don’t agree with the NFAC or their leader on pretty much anything, I’m glad they exist if just to prove what bullshit articles like this one from Vox are.

  24. avatar WI Patriot says:

    vox, yeah, they’re a “credible” news outlet…not so much though…

  25. avatar Kingoliver says:

    The TTAG echo chamber.

    1. avatar FLNarcissist says:

      If I’m being honest, I’m glad Miner posts here. Just to alleviate some of that

      1. avatar Miner49er says:

        Thanks, just trying to bring an alternative viewpoint to broaden everyone’s perspective.

        1. avatar LarryinTX says:

          Wonderful. How much are you being paid?

    2. avatar Ralph says:

      It’s not an echo chamber. It’s just sound bouncing around in your head, which is otherwise empty.

      1. avatar Chris T in KY says:

        (smile)

      2. avatar Hannibal says:

        I mean… aside from some obvious trolls it is pretty echo-chambery. It’s only natural. Most people are not going to post here unless they care a lot about guns or self-defense.

        But unlike a lot of other places it seems like contrary comments rarely get removed.

  26. avatar Ralph says:

    “Police Support Armed Citizens As Long As They’re Not Criminals”

    FIFY

  27. avatar Manse Jolly says:

    I’m not sure about all the States, but I know some will not grant bail if it’s a 1st degree murder charge, or whatever the particular State calls it.

    The old saying may be the future. ‘Kyle might beat the rap but he’s going to take the ride for sure.’

    Imagine 9-12 months or more in jail, probably protective custody or solitary, before your trial even comes up.

    1. avatar Miner49er says:

      “Imagine 9-12 months or more in jail, probably protective custody or solitary, before your trial even comes up.”

      That does seem harsh, but it is reality for most minorities when arrested in the United States.

      Or does this juvenile delinquent deserve special accommodations?

      1. avatar LarryinTX says:

        Is that a guess, an opinion, or can you give us their names?

  28. avatar Debbie W. says:

    Little jake tapper is a Gun Control Zealot in his own right and was a mouthpiece for his fellow Gun Control Zealots. Now little jake thinks he has grounds to label the POTUS as racist when little jake’s gun control agenda is clearly rooted in racism and genocide. That clearly makes little jake a racist and a nazi. What Filth.

    1. avatar Miner49er says:

      Interesting viewpoint.

      So Debbie, you as a committed Republican activist must share in their misdeeds as well.

      “Mr. Hastert, 75, the longest-serving Republican House speaker in history and once one of the country’s most powerful politicians, pleaded guilty in 2015 to withdrawing $952,000 from his accounts at four banks in at least 106 separate transactions that were small enough to allow him to evade reporting requirements.

      In the 2015 plea agreement, Mr. Hastert said he gave the money to a person identified only as “Individual A” as part of a $3.5 million deal between them “to compensate for and keep confidential his prior misconduct against Individual A.”

      The plea deal does not explicitly say that Mr. Hastert sexually abused Individual A, but at his sentencing last year, the former House speaker admitted for the first time that he sexually abused the teenage wrestlers he coached at Yorkville High School in Yorkville, Ill., where he worked from 1965 to 1981. Federal prosecutors have said that Individual A is one of at least four boys, as young as 14, molested by Mr. Hastert decades ago.

      “I want to apologize to the boys I mistreated when I was their coach,” Mr. Hastert said at his sentencing in 2016. “What I did was wrong and I regret it.”

      But Judge Thomas M. Durkin of Federal District Court rebuked him at his sentencing as “a serial child molester” and asked him about at least three other specific victims: Scott Cross, who spoke at the sentencing, a man identified only as “Victim B,” and Stephen Reinboldt, a repeated victim of Mr. Hastert’s who died of AIDS in 1995.”

      By your logic, Dennis Hastert, the longest serving republican speaker of the house of representatives of the United States of America, defines every Republican as a serial child molester.

      You should be ashamed of yourself, what filth!

      1. avatar LarryinTX says:

        Dafook does that have to do with anything? I guess you just feel the need to point out that when Republicans are caught with their hands in the cookie jar, they are seriously penalized for it, unlike liberals/Democrats/Hillary/Biden/Osama.

    2. avatar MADDMAXX says:

      That clearly makes little jake a racist and a nazi. What Filth.

      Now that’s the REAL Debbie W.

  29. avatar Chris T in KY says:

    The scariest thing in America is an articulate black person with a gun. White Liberals (their sexual orientation or religion doesn’t matter) can’t bring themselves to say how an armed black person terrifies them. So they Project their own racism on to the armed white population. Modern racist gun control laws are written and signed into law by white Liberals.

    The Mulford Act that banned the open carry of loaded guns in California was co-written by the white jewish State Senator Alan Sieroty, a Democrat.

    “I want to present myself as an adult black man, fully armed and not a danger,” said Stephen Alexander, 46, of Lansing, who carried a pistol outside the Capitol building during the event. “If you are not a danger to me, I am not dangerous.

    “It’s as simple as that.”

    https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/politics/2020/05/28/we-have-arm-ourselves-michigan-demonstrators-protest-brutality/5275209002/

    1. avatar Miner49er says:

      “Modern racist gun control laws are written and signed into law by white Liberals.

      The Mulford Act that banned the open carry of loaded guns in California was co-written by the white jewish State Senator Alan Sieroty, a Democrat.”

      Sorry to say, your first statement here is completely wrong. And you even mention the Mulford Act without noting that it was famous Republican saint Ronald Reagan who signed it into law.

      And furthermore, it was Republican President Ronald Reagan who banned the carrying of firearms in national Forests and bureau of land management properties.

      Republican Ronald Reagan has been responsible for far more firearms restrictions then President Barack Hussein Obama ever thought about.

      But of course, Obama is black so he’s the villain.

      As a black American gun owner, you do see that President Barack Hussein Obama was a better steward of your gun rights then Republican Ronald Reagan, right?

      1. avatar LarryinTX says:

        Aren’t you even a little ashamed of your obvious racism?

        1. avatar Cowboy T says:

          Unfortunately, it’s true; then-Gov. Reagan did sign the Mulford Act into law, passed nearly unanimously by both Republicans and Democrats in the CA General Assembly, because Black people got tired of daily Rodney King-style beat-downs from the police for stuff like 10 miles over the speed limit. These Black people decided to exercise their 2A rights, legally, to back up the Miranda Ruling. Scared White people there to death, hence the Mulford Act got passed in near-record time for legislation. I’m originally from the Bay Area (San Francisco) and am thus familiar with this.

          That’s just one example of what that study is about.

          Here’s another one. Jemel Roberson, a hero security guard who did his job and stopped a gunman, shot by a cop. Here’s the link.

          https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2019/01/19/jemel-roberson-police-name-officer-who-shot-hero-security-guard/2622150002/
          https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/19/us/jemel-roberson-officer-ian-covey.html

  30. avatar strych9 says:

    This lady’s fingertips must be positively destroyed after working so hard to bait all those hooks with slippery language and friable Lefty concepts.

  31. avatar Hannibal says:

    Police support citizens lawfully defending themselves against violent predators

    If Vox thinks that means that means the former category cannot include black and brown people then I guess they’re super racist.

    (this may be a repost, didn’t show up when I posted it earlier)

    1. avatar Truckman says:

      that is for sure I have known many black and brown people that I would rather live around than some whites then there is some like these scumbags rioting both white and black I don,t even in the same county I am in

      1. avatar Hannibal says:

        everyone involved in this stupid incident was white (or ‘white hispanic’) anyway. Trying to turn this into a race issue because one side is looting under the cover of ‘black lives matter’ is absurd.

        There are black people looting too, don’t get me wrong. But strangely, most of them are smart enough not to attack someone armed with a rifle. It takes a special kind of stupid to do that.

  32. avatar NORDNEG says:

    I think Kyle should have used a shotgun, he could have got more dirtbags…
    Free Kyle…

    1. avatar Hannibal says:

      His target choice was excellent though. Each person he shot was posing a dangerous threat to him at the very moment he fired. Even that “medic” idiot didn’t get shot when he stopped charging- but then the moment he pulled out his handgun he lost half an arm.

      Based on the circumstances I know of, it was super dumb to be out there alone like he was for whatever purpose he had. Extremely poor tactics. But when the rubber met the road, he did as good as could possibly be expected in such a situation. And by doing so, he placed himself in a much better legal position than if he had shot other people.

      But… if he’d used a Biden Special it might not have looked as ‘militia’ in front of a jury.

      1. avatar LarryinTX says:

        I think there was one not uncovered so far. When he fell in the street, just before he whacked skateboard boy, a guy came from screen left, jumped up and kicked him in the head, then had a better idea and hobbled away screen left again. I think he caught one in there somewhere and doesn’t want his parole officer to find out about his nocturnal activities.

  33. avatar Pa John says:

    I question the study thusly: While most SHERIFFS are directly elected by the people in the communities they serve, and therefore tend to strongly support the rights of their voters, the office of POLICE CHIEF is a politically appointed one (do a search for “Mayor fires police chief” and you will get many results, then try a search on “mayor fires sheriff and you will get some very different results!).

    Since sheriffs tend to be directly elected by the people they serve (with some exceptions as there are always some exceptions), they generally tend to properly see themselves as public servants, as well they should. But since police chiefs can be appointed or fired on the local mayor’s whim, they instead must look entirely to pleasing the so called “elite ruling class” for their survival, and thus have precious little cause to concern themselves with the constitutional rights of We The People. This is where law enforcement “mission creep” begins and the breaking of those oaths to uphold the U.S. and State constitutions come in.

    In short, public servants serve / represent / protect the rights of We The People. “Ruling class elites” and those who are at their mercy tend to see We The People as merely “ignorant masses” to be manipulated and controlled however they see fit, and not necessarily for our own good. Public servants respect ALL of your constitutional rights, while “ruling class elites” see only “ignorant masses” who simply cannot be trusted with guns or the right to vote when we might decide to elect people like Trump – outsiders who rudely promise to drain their financially seductive swamp.

    The solution would be for Police Chiefs to be directly elected by We The People in much the same manner that most sheriffs are. Only by providing some protective insulation between law enforcement and a political class that increasingly sees itself as a _ruling class_ instead of the public servants that they are supposed to be, can We The People rest more assured that law enforcement will then be free to REFUSE TO ENFORCE unconstitutional laws whenever domestic enemies of the U.S. Constitution try to stuff them down our throats. We will happily reelect those in law enforcement who truly protect us indefinitely. Returning all law enforcement officials to direct election by We The People would be a win for everyone but those who would rule with an iron fist, since their primary use of force would be denied them when it comes to unconstitutional law.

    1. avatar PMinFl says:

      Pa John, thank you ,very good post.

    2. avatar DinWA says:

      Better yet, eliminate all police and have only sheriffs for law enforcement.

  34. avatar Why are all democrat cities shitholes? And why do they want America to be the same? says:

    Dems, in the dick shun ary show a picture of lemmings going over a cliff!

  35. avatar Ronald west says:

    I would have to agree with the officer’s, because 75 to 80% of dark skin have criminal records and are not licensed to carry, so if they see one, what are they suppose to do, if they asked to see their permit, they r considered racist, r decriminalization, which is just made up words, so the government, lawyers, media, can pad their pockets and change laws to undo the laws that kept America free, lawyers made it easy for criminals, government office’s opened the door by letting it happen, old law took the right of freedom from the criminals, New law takes the freedom from the law bidding people and given to the criminals, then make the bidding people pay to maintain to house them, ALOT like paying e-legal aliening to enter the U.S. without permission, and not do a damn thing about it,except pet them on the back, while the citizens of America goes to the unemployment lines, and are turned away because they have to hold that money for the blacks and e-legals.so I fully understand the police forces.

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