HWFO: The Only Way to Reduce Mass Shootings Is for More Eli Dickens to Kill More Shooters

By
Dan Zimmerman
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104
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HWFO has discussed at length how media organizations such as Vox and CNN make millions of dollars by pushing freakoutery for clicks, and how their rampage shooting coverage approach increases the incidence of rampage shootings by one third because of copycat effects which are mathematically shown to be media driven.

As of July 20th, CNN.com had nine articles about the Greenwood Park Mall shooting, including one opinion piece devoted to “debunking” the idea that good guys with guns can stop rampage shootings even though one just did. Currently they have two hundred and twenty nine articles about Uvalde. That’s twenty five times more coverage.

I will not claim that CNN’s stated goal is to glorify rampage shooters, but that’s the exact effect CNN’s behavior has in the mind of a potential rampage shooter. If CNN reversed its behavior and gave twenty five times more coverage to Dicken instead of Uvalde, then the psychological effects would dampen rampage shooters instead of inciting them. This very rampage shooter may have been spurred on by CNN’s behavior, and CNN gets 30% more rampage shootings to farm for clickbait money because of their behavior.

If the United States were to string together three consecutive incidents of rampage shooters getting plugged by private citizens within seconds, as happened in Greenwood Park Mall, and CNN were to give each of them the sorts of coverage they give to Uvalde, the rampage shooter dorks would be too scared to try it. They’d stay in their basement playing XBox instead of shooting people, and the second order effects of constitutional carry would exceed 11.96 saved per incident, because there would be fewer incidents.

CNN not covering rampage shootings at all would reduce rampage shootings by one third. If they elevated coverage of failed rampage shootings stopped by citizens, they’d probably reduce them by an additional third.

But they don’t want to do that, because they’re hemorrhaging money. They need as many of these things to transpire as possible to make their bottom line. They are beholden to Moloch, trapped in a cycle that gets people killed, and the only way I can figure out of this cycle is to produce a lot more citizen shooters like Dicken.

The only way out is to shoot our way out and it’s CNN’s fault.

— Handwaving Freakoutery in Eleven Fewer Dead People

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104 COMMENTS

    • “inaugural members of the anti-mass shooter hit squad”

      Fake news, Rittenhouse did not stop a mass shooting.

      Eli dickens is the hero who the evidence shows stopped a mass shooting within about 15 seconds.

      • If he stopped something that never happened, how do you know it never happened. Rittenhouse is still a hero, even if what never happened (fires, looting, murders, by BLM/the 13%) never happened.

      • minor49IQ…By all accounts Rittenhouse did not stop a mass shooting. He did however stop a bunch of white trash. Yes or No?

        • Under some definitions Rittenhouse committed a mass shooting. Having said that, it was justifiable self-defense under the (extreme) circumstances and the jury agreed.

      • Rittenhouse cured 2 progs of their uncivilized anarchist proclivities. So a win.

        Think of it as a self-administered abortion if that what warms your little marxist cockles. Rittenhouse was just the “Dr” who brought the forceps/shop vac.

      • Miner writes a short, concise comment praising the actions of a private citizen stopping a mass shooter?

        Not so sure this is the real Miner.

        • Just so you and everybody is aware. Once you enter your email address in the comments box. You can use whatever name you please.

        • Of course you can, and several trolls in the past have rotated thru a variety of names to throw people off, but it seldom works. That’s why a registered Gravatar helps so much. Weeds out the fakers and lets us all know who the real Haz is.

      • Notice that after Rittenhouse defended himself the riots in Kenosha stopped dead in their tracks. Who knows how many lives and how much property were saved because of his actions?

      • Rittenhouse put a pretty quick stop to your buddies who were tearing up the world then shezzam riots practically stopped overnight. Seems you guys didn’t want to get popped by a good guy.

        Remember to pay your taxes on your Soros checks.

      • The point is 49er, Rittenhouse had / has what it TAKES! Kyle, while under incredible stress dispatched his attackers with precision. Obviously it was poor youthful decision making to openly carry an AR during a high octane riot. Doing so destined him to meet up with brainless idiot.

        Kyle Rittenhouse would stop an active shooter given the same circumstances, that being you swap places with Eli and Kyle.

        Of course there are other factors that must be considered such as luck. Just as in the Dean Mellberg killing at Fairchild AFB with an incredible shot, how much was perfection and a little luck shaken on top?

        But everything being equal, Rittenhouse has the DNA mix to do what needs to be done, not what spinless girly-men cowards these day act like, which for a Montana boomer like myself makes me want to puke!

      • MINOR Miner49er No he did not “stop a mass shooting”. But he did stand up to your ANTIFA & BLM stormtroopers in Wisconsin.
        For ONCE you are correct, Eli is a hero. I am shocked that you would admit so.

      • No he didn’t, correct, this time.

        Rittenhouse stopped a lynching by you leftist shit bags in a most epic fashion. Cannot wait to see your ilk try it and be likewise dealt with once again.

  2. While stopping a gunman as soon as possible is certainly a good thing, I don’t know that it will result in fewer events. At least in the instances of active shootings as opposed to mass shootings.
    The gunmen already know that they are likely going to die, and often that seems to be their goal. There is something else that is spurring these events.

    • But if they know they won’t achieve near the notoriety (aka number of dead victims) they were aiming for?

      • Appears we have a cleanup on aisle one.

        Photos of the perp before being shot and after being shot will weigh on the minds of many potential perps.

        Too bad the adults in charge of a school in Uvalde TX were not prepared like Eli Dickens. Of course those running th÷school did not receive an once of blame. Blame was shifted to the firearm and the law abiding who own firearms.

        The stampede to take a bite out of the 2A following the acts of criminals must end. It’s waaaaaay past time to ban a history confirmed insane agenda called Gun Control.

        • Think that the “educators” running a government “school” can prepare for an event like that shootem up? These leftist educrates can’t even handle their core mission of “education”.

          I agree with the article.

          Good that the “room temp” moron had the decency to expire on an easy to clean tile floor.

        • Keeping in mind that had the 3 doors on the west side of the school been kept locked per established Safety Protocols. None of the 19 children and 2 teachers would have DIED. Those doors were left unlocked purposefully by teachers, administrators and other school employees to they could retrieve items from their cars and substitute teachers. Who hadn’t been issued keys could enter and leave with passing through the Secured Front Entrance. Per established Safety Protocols. 19 children and 2 teachers DIED for want and convenience of an Unlocked Door.

      • Not trying to be a conspiracy theorist here…but let’s look at the mass shooters and who they are.

        Look at the agenda they are trying to push, and what the goal is.

        They want to disarm the population, so they think that by becoming a martyr for the cause and the goal is reached – they have won.

    • “There is something else that is spurring these events.”

      Mental health illness.

      All mass shooters exhibit some form of “trouble of the mind” mental health illness of some type in their will and desire to carry out murder. Its not something listed in the DSM yet, but its acknowledged by the mental health community as something they have not yet diagnosed and they have no treatment for.

      When you see the mental health aspects being talked about in the media with their experts, or in studies, you will frequnlty see it said that some or most mass shooters did not have a mental health issue. What they are talking about a re those things that have already been diagnosed and appear in the DSM 5 manual.

      The mental health community has not yet diagnosed that which is present in all mass shooters. It can be anything from depression based to hatred based to a combination of mental health issues.

      I think also some are motivated by the media coverage and it only feeds this as of yet undiagnosed mental health issue.

      I think also our own present government has contributed greatly to the issue of mass shootings. They keep talking about all the very issues that trigger most mass shooters, for example, race issues that triggered the shooter in buffalo.

      I think the anti-gun groups also contribute. The keep talking about the MSR like its the most powerful thing in the universe and one thing all mass shooters have expressed is their desire for the power that let’s them dominate. The anti-gun groups also keep glorifying the mass shooter and there are just people in this world who see such as an infamous way to make their mark on the world in a glorious manner like this.

      • Correction:

        “The anti-gun groups also keep glorifying the mass shooter and there are just people in this world who see such as an infamous way to make their mark on the world in a glorious manner like this.”

        Should have been…

        The anti-gun groups also keep “glorifying” the mass shooter by keeping it fresh in the publics mind and there are just people in this world who see such as an infamous way to make their mark on the world in a “glorious” manner and indeed some mass shooters have expressed this.

        • Shazam.

          “The mental health community has not yet” found their a ss. The BS that is the pshrink scam is no different than the prog “science” of Freud/fraud, Marx, Phrenology, Palmistry, or manmade global warmin. Pshrinks are just guaranteed demtard voters (VERY expensive taxpayer funded voters). They CURE nothing EVER with either their couches or their pills.

          Locking up crazies is the ONLY solution, just as in 1922 or 1822. F-ACLU.

        • Depression being a chemical imbalance was probably propaganda pushed by Big Pharma. Depression happens when you have difficulty dealing with negative events in your life. It doesn’t take decades to figure that out…unless there’s tons of money to be made altering your chemicals with a daily pill.

          If Big Pharma fooled people for years about depression, then what else have they lied about? Hmm…

        • Dude,
          I believe clinical depression exists, but also that it’s a tiny subset of diagnosed depression as you said. Although “Miracle on 34th St.” was lighthearted, John Payne’s concise synopsis of mental health was brilliant and should be the legal standard.

        • There’s a very fine line between depression, the human condition, and the normal reaction people have to bad things that happen to them in life.

          It’s probably just about impossible to go through life without having at least a few hopes and dreams get utterly crushed. And that’s a hard thing for people to have to learn to deal with.

          Of course, there are better and worse ways to learn to deal with that. And as a society I think we do a very poor job, in general, of helping people to learn the skills to deal with it in a healthy, constructive way.

          So here we are.

  3. The msm just eggs these things on. The mass/active shooters, anything they can claim is racial, illegals crossing the border is good, climate change, bidets great economy, and the sheep are asleep and fall for it.

  6. Let ye who is without sin, cast the first stone.

    Bashing fifty (50) million Xbox users when attempting to correlate it to a loser/rampage shooter lifestyle is zero (0) percent different than the left attempting to pin the tertiary unverifiable garbage to shooters, which they do.

    Please, rise above yourselves. If we are going to reunite firearms communities left, right, and middle… we need to become better than either side.

    So, I beg you, stop the petty slanders. Deal with facts. This Hoosier kid saved lives… THAT is inarguable. Let that truth speak for us.

    • “Bashing fifty (50) million Xbox users when attempting to correlate it to a loser/rampage shooter lifestyle is zero (0) percent different than the left attempting to pin the tertiary unverifiable garbage to shooters, which they do.”

      That’s not what was happening. It was used in a reference to the stereotypical ‘loner’ thing of a loner in their moms basement playing video games they are obsessed with. Most mass shooters exhibit a similar thing before they go on their rampage, an obsession with something and being a loner.

    • I have killed plenty of bad people. While playing video games, tabletop war games, and Dungeons and Dragons. In my teenage years, and in my early 20s. I have yet to kill a for real bad person. But I am training for that day if it ever comes.

      And I must say that playing war games does put you, or at least me, in a certain self-defense mindset.

  9. There are NO Leftard gun owners I want to unite with. Quoting bible verses out of context is a fool’s errand. JESUS also stated “judge righteous judgement”. This article is spot on!

        • Joke re shopping in person where carrying a licensed pistol in a store that does not explicitly welcome firearms via a posted sign will be a felony Sept 1st when mass shooters will be redirected to ban states (NY included)

        • You don’t make our laws and they deserve ridicule so good to go as far as I care. Next time I will try to be more direct with the joke.

        • Jokes aside, you have my utmost sympathy. Growing up in rural PA, I quickly learned that there were millions of like-minded folks next door (maybe even more than in PA) who had the misfortune to be chained to a city that made their votes irrelevant.

          Since PA underwent a triple-barreled demographic implosion while I was on active duty, I happily retired elsewhere.

        • Grew up just outside Philly so very used to my vote not counting at state or local levels. Hilariously have more relevant votes in upstate NY now even though we are talking a hard left turn into a mix of Huxley and Orwell.

        • I’m not sure when you grew up, but NY has been among the leftmost states at least through my lifetime. In terms of gun rights, it took that “turn” in 1910 IIRC.

  12. Things like this is the very reason I do not watch CNN. I’m not going to get news from them. I will get propaganda.

  13. This, just in:

    “With assault rifles, exit wounds can be a foot wide. The victim’s skull explodes on impact. Organs rupture, bones shatter, the shards serve as shrapnel and tear tissue to pieces.

    There is a reason we never see the images after a mass murder—many of the bodies no longer exist.
    -Rep. Lucy McBath (@RepLucyMcBath) July 20, 2022
    https://twitter.com/RepLucyMcBath/status/1549790416614064137

  15. A gruesome picture and its pathetic T Tag even published it. Of course the Far Right will be sexaully excited over it, and will be dancing in the blood of what was a mentally ill young man which is all the more revolting and obscene. This is not to try and minimise the death and destruction of the innocent people that the young man murdered either.

    When the Far Right Savages take pleasure in the death of other people, even mentally ill people, it makes them no better than the mentally ill people who also took pleasure in the killing of innocent people. It is the same type of depravity and sickness and savagery.

    In the 50’s such mass shootings were almost non-existent and there were semi-auto rifles available back then too. True, they were not as available but I think that had little to do with it, rather our society has become sick to the core.

    With the breakdown of family life, drug addiction, lack of high paying jobs, lack of affordable health and drug care, and rampant Far Right Racism, all enhanced by the Republican Gangster Criminals, young men continue to just throw their lives away by committing mass murder, its suicide by cop pure and simple.

    Its a shame that the sins of the few always result in the punishment of the majority but no civilized society can go on having mass murders every other day. It takes a long time to cure the ills of society and sometimes they are never cured as society just disintegrates into madness and chaos and that it seems is where the U.S. is headed hell bent for leather today.

    Although Trump was not the cause of our rise in political hatreds, racist hatreds, anti-refugee and anti-immigrant hatreds, he certainly encouraged it and promoted it when he ran for office and then infested and denigrated the office of the Presidency for four long years of utter corruption, madness and chaos. Trump destroyed the credibility of the Supreme Court as well by appointing 3 crazed psychopathic Far Right Justices that have made a mockery of the courts former respectability. The current court has turned itself into a completely corrupt partisan cesspool with zero regard to the Constitutional rights of the people, especially women, who they now regard as nothing more than harlots and sex slaves. We even have a rapist on the court, proving how low the standards of the Republicans have sunk to.

    Its also interesting to note that when Rome started to disintegrate both economically and socially the Government used the immigrants as scapegoats and blamed the immigrants who were in reality enhancing the economic prosperity of Rome. After immigration was cut off it only hastened the fall of Rome. The Rich in Rome hogged all the wealth and bankrupted the country with their endless wars and tens of thousands of Rome’s people ended up on welfare, the Government also had no money to pay retirement benefits to its Soldiers and the people refused to serve in the military . History repeats itself in the U.S. today. At least Rome can say “We lasted 1,000 years), while in Capitalvania it lasted only 246 years.

    As Jimmy Carter so aptly put it, “We are the most war like nation on earth”. And I might add the number of civilians the U.S. has killed since WWII has equaled or even surpassed the death toll caused by Nazi Germany. Just as Nazi Germany ended up destroying itself so to the U.S. has chosen to do also.

      • Perhaps his/her/its mommy can go down to the basement and have a retroactive abortion. OR just make sure is taking the meds.

      • He sure is triggered by the sight of another comrade martyr to the cause of unchallenged world socialism being murdered before his time by the oppressive capitalist criminal Dicken (his time being AFTER he gloriously sacrificed another dozen or so capitalists to maximize the hysteria and accelerate us down the road to the Revolution).

        • quote———He sure is triggered by the sight of another comrade martyr to the cause of unchallenged world socialism——–quote

          I am sure the voices in your head or your crystal ball told you if he was liberal, conservative or independent.

    • “…will be sexaully excited over it…”

      You’re projecting again, and you’re so excited that you can’t even spell it correctly. I didn’t bother to read the rest of your rant, as it’s likely more of the same.

    • I totally support displaying the pictures of dead criminals. If we have to look at pictures of dead white Europeans in concentration camps or crematoriums. And we have to look at pictures of dead people in the Cambodian concentration camps. Or we have to look at pictures of black people hanging from tree limbs.

      Then I think there is nothing wrong looking at the pictures of dead criminals. Shot dead as they tried to murder innocent people.

    • While there is a lot to not agree with in dacian’s post by a lot of people here….wishing retro-active abortions, name calling and denigrating that person does nothing more than cause a wider rift.

      We need appropriate communication and dialog. Not hatred, vile. When you do that, you make your position that much less attainable. It works on both sides this way.

      Have a civil dialog, show your points with FACTS and REASON. Hate just shuts people down and when people are shut down, no flow of ideas can happen and no good change can occur.

      So, please….engage like an adult that can have a reasoned conversation. You wouldn’t/shouldn’t engage your child in this manner…so why would you engage another adult this way. Show respect, even for those that you do not agree with if you wish to get it in return some day.

  18. the left claims they dont like good guys with guns

    but then they failed to use water cannons to stop the rioters

    they want carnage

  19. this is not a new thing really. The medical health community has been talking about it for years, that media coverage since the late 90s” has made it certain that those who commit heinous crimes become celebrities.

  20. that picture will just feed the bleeding heart narrative…I wish they would not have released it..just sayin…. but it don’t bother me… adios zipper head..

  21. old media rule “if it bleeds it leads!”
    AKA they rather have your whole family dead on camera then you be able to defend yourself for more money!

  22. WELL NOW .. WHAT DICKINS DID I BELIEVE VERY RARE AND VERY BRAVE .
    AS VIETNAM COMBAT VETERAN IN TWO FIRE FIGHTS KNOWN MURPHYS LAW APPLIES ,
    HAD BACKUP WITH OTHERS CARRYING M16 , TO TAKE ON A SHOOER WITH AR AND HAVE A PISTOL TO DO IT WITH . WHEW . OUT STANDING PERSON .
    AS FOR MYSELF LTC , HAVE 38 WITH 1.87″ BARREL , HAVE TO BE IN 30 FEET OR LESS AT MY AGE 72 . STILL I KNOW WANT TO RUN AWAY , RUN FOR COVER , IS MORE REAL TO LIFE .
    GLAD HE DID WHAT WAS NEEDED , PRAYERS ALL AROUND . AMEN…

  23. Put rifle teams and 2A education classes back into the high school and Junior High School Systems.
    I want more good kids with guns.

  25. “The Only Way to Reduce Mass Shootings Is for More Eli Dickens to Kill More Shooters”

    That may well be the most idiotic, ill informed and outright stupid headline I have ever seen on TTAG!

    Yeah, absolutely a common citizen shooting a mass murderer, stopping the attack in the act, is outstanding! Give that guy a medal and big cash award!

    But no, this is not the only way or even the best way to stop these attacks from happening. The best way is:
    1. Early Detection
    2. Behavioral Threat Assessment
    3. Planned Intervention

    It works. In nearly every case of a mass shooting it is found that had these three steps been applied the killings never would have happened in the first place. Same methods the Secret Service uses to protect Presidents. Same approach the FBI and many police agencies have been developing and applying for decades.

    Google “Behavioral Threat assessment”. Google “Safe Schools Initiative”. You will learn that it ain’t about the guns it is about the people doing the violence. You will learn of hundreds of success stories to detect and prevent planned attacks.

    Yes, we should have more good people able to shoot back, I support that 100%. But putting all our eggs in that basket means that we always wait for the bullets to be flying and honest, innocent people to be getting slaughtered before we act.

    To only focus on the moment of desperation is to lose more lives needlessly.

    That’s both stupid and tragic!

    • The problem with this plan is it requires someone to care enough to notice. Lack of caring is probably the genesis of the problem.

      • And more chillingly, would involve delegating enormous, normal-life-ending power to teachers and shrinks in the hopes that they jack up [only] the dozen or two actual criminals per year, and not the millions who offend their left-wing sensibilities.

  26. THe fact that ELI DICKENS got lucky does NOT change a bloody thing. He’s one in a thousand. If you really think that a more widespread coverage of his shooting a mass killer wiil or will be some kind of deterrent then you really ARE bloody delusiuonal. If the Death penalty is no apparfent deterrent just how much of a deterrent would the off chance of a bystander intervention be? Whta an idiotic suggestion You must be getting increasingly desperate! Sooner rather than later the question of more severe Gun Controls will become, for all parties, central to their election chances.

    WHY? Simply because ithe vast majority of such cases the perp IS killed by the Police or they shoot themselves when they see no escape. Some bloody deterrent THAT is

    • @Albert L J Hall

      “THe fact that ELI DICKENS got lucky does NOT change a bloody thing. He’s one in a thousand. If you really think that a more widespread coverage of his shooting a mass killer wiil or will be some kind of deterrent then you really ARE bloody delusiuonal.”

      1. Its not “DICKENS”, its Dicken. This is a small example of your confirmation bias, you read things as you want them to be rather than what they are.

      2. What Dicken did was not luck, it was skill. To keep it simple for you, basically Dicken performed what is called a B-8 drill with 80% accuracy in 15 seconds at 40 yards.

      The B-8 is in reference to a target type, the ‘bulls eye’ X ring score target. Its intended, for hand gun use, to be used at a maximum of 25 yards. The average basic proficiency shooter on average can do it, with some practice, in more than 15 seconds with 25% accuracy. But Dicken did it at 40’ish yards in 15 seconds with 80% accuracy. There have already been numerous civilian, military, and law enforcement firearms trainers and experts attempt to duplicate it using basic proficiency skills – to date none have succeeded in doing so (some came kind of close). This indicates that Eli’s grand father trained him in some serious firearms tactical skills because that type of proficiency for 80% accuracy in 15 seconds on a hostile target moving around at 40 yard distance and firing back at you is pure tactical skill.

      3. Mass shooters that have been caught and not killed have expressed that if there had been a known armed deterrent at their intended target they would have either chosen another target or not conducted their shootings at the time, some have expressed they would have committed suicide instead of shooting up some place if they had known their target was populated with armed citizens. 94% of mass shootings take place in ‘no gun’ prohibition areas for this very reason because the mass shooter has high confidence that most people will obey that prohibition and thus no armed deterrent (based upon captured mass shooters statements to date and fact of occurrence). When ordinary armed citizens (not security guards or law enforcement) engage an active shooter in a mass shooting incident they do so with 94% efficiency and on average (statistically) about ~3 people die if any do if the shooting starts where as when law enforcement and security do it their efficiency is about 5% and on average (statistically) ~12 people die if any do when the shooting starts.

      A mass shooting incident does not only mean the shooter has become active and is firing and people are getting shot. It also means a potential mass shooting incident where the would be shooter has appeared and the citizen does not fire (but is prepared to do so) and on average over 90% of these have been stopped by ordinary citizens with guns where as on average only 8% of these have been stopped by law enforcement or armed security – this is because the ordinary armed citizen was there it stop it from beginning and law enforcement and armed security wasn’t there to stop it from beginning when the would be shooter appeared. Anti-gun and MSM refuses to acknowledge this because in the case where a mass shooter has been prevented from starting the rampage there is no mass shooter body count of ‘3’ or ‘4’ or more.

      • Note for you Albert for the B-8 drill:

        Basically: Generally, par time per round is established at 3.5 seconds. This is based upon rounds fired per rep with 10 reps. One rep is one round fired then assume the dictated off target position and the next rep starts by coming back on target and fire one more round then assume the dictated off target position – this repeats until 10 reps are completed meaning 10 rounds are fired. Its 3.5 seconds time allotted to fire a single round. This is a total of 35 seconds allotted for 10 rounds to be fired. This is generally a score drill, the rounds that land in the black are counted for score according to the score number for that ring in the black. In terms of accuracy for scores the closer to the center circle the better as the rings progress in score from outer to the inner X in the center. The average basic proficiency shooter on average can do it, with some practice, in more than 15 seconds with 25% accuracy at 25 yards.

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