We pride ourselves on being a state of responsible gun owners, but permitless carry begins dismantling Alabama’s culture of responsible gun ownership. Government issuing concealed carry permits is one of the few backstops we have to ensure responsible gun usage. HB 272 would take away a vital tool for law enforcement. One that works: to protect survivors of domestic violence, prevent people suffering from mental illness from gaining access to a more lethal means of harming themselves or others, and ensure that a person carrying a gun in public isn’t a criminal with a dangerous history.
Take it from the City of Opelika, where the police chief and sheriff have voiced opposition to permitless carry. Opelika Police Chief Shane Healey said, “In 2021, OPD made 78 cases for carrying a pistol without a valid permit. In the last five years, it had 333 cases; in the last ten years, 445 cases. In over 60% of these cases, it led to other charges such as assault, possession of stolen property, drug crimes, a plethora of things.”
If you don’t think those crimes are severe enough to be thankful a gun charge unearthed criminal histories, remember Oklahoma City bomber Timothy McVeigh was initially arrested on a gun charge. Gun laws can get murderers and terrorists off the street. These laws help protect girlfriends and wives from the most extreme forms of domestic abuse, and they keep people with histories of mental illness from shooting themselves or others.
— Alabama State Rep. Neil Rafferty in Permitless carry would begin dismantling Alabama’s culture of responsible gun ownership
The idiot’s tryin to convince people that the only reason the thugs are carrying is because of the permit less law!? Yup, sure lots of other idiots will believe em.
It’s busy body drama queens like Alabama State Rep. neil rafferty who wind up catering to the criminals they claim to disdain. What kind of pervert minded pos do you have to be to deny a woman the right to carry a firearm in a purse or under a coat? Pray-tell what could she do if stalked and confronted by a large size knife wielding criminal? Could she call Alabama State Rep. neil rafferty and ask him for help? Of course we all know by the time Alabama State Rep. neil rafferty heard the phone ring the damsel in distress would have more holes than Swiss Cheese.
You purchase the firearm, you carry it concealed across a parking lot in a case to your vehicle and transport it. You exit the vehicle and carry it into your home. Then you keep it conceal it in a case, etc. and later off you go to a range, etc. This process is repeated day in and day out over the years and somehow you need to pay for a permission permit to put a firearm in a purse or under a coat.
The hoops never end for the law abiding while the carefree criminals Alabama State Rep. neil rafferty and his keystone cop pals cite carry firearms and other weapons, “concealed.” Criminals know concealed carry laws provide them the upper hand and puts citizens complying with such laws at their mercy. The one track mind Alabama State Rep. neil rafferty failed to mentioned that fact.
Bottom line…Alabama State Rep. neil rafferty is peeing on your leg while telling you it’s raining.
𝐈 𝐠𝐞𝐭 𝐩𝐚𝐢𝐝 𝐨𝐯𝐞𝐫 $𝟏𝟗𝟎 𝐩𝐞𝐫 𝐡𝐨𝐮𝐫 𝐰𝐨𝐫𝐤𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐟𝐫𝐨𝐦 𝐡𝐨𝐦𝐞 𝐰𝐢𝐭𝐡 𝟐 𝐤𝐢𝐝𝐬 𝐚𝐭 𝐡𝐨𝐦𝐞. 𝐈 𝐧𝐞𝐯𝐞𝐫 𝐭𝐡𝐨𝐮𝐠𝐡𝐭 𝐈’𝐝 𝐛𝐞 𝐚𝐛𝐥𝐞 𝐭𝐨 𝐝𝐨 𝐢𝐭 𝐛𝐮𝐭 𝐦𝐲 𝐛𝐞𝐬𝐭 𝐟𝐫𝐢𝐞𝐧𝐝 𝐞𝐚𝐫𝐧𝐬 𝐨𝐯𝐞𝐫 𝟏𝟓𝐤 𝐚 𝐦𝐨𝐧𝐭𝐡 𝐝𝐨𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐬 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐬𝐡𝐞 𝐜𝐨𝐧𝐯𝐢𝐧𝐜𝐞𝐝 𝐦𝐞 𝐭𝐨 𝐭𝐫𝐲. 𝐓𝐡𝐞 𝐩𝐨𝐭𝐞𝐧𝐭𝐢𝐚𝐥 𝐰𝐢𝐭𝐡 𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐬 𝐢𝐬 𝐞𝐧𝐝𝐥𝐞𝐬𝐬…
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Hey BITCH! WTF does your bullshit have to do with carrying a firearm for self defense.F’n dumbass!
“In over 60% of these cases, it led to other charges such as assault, possession of stolen property, drug crimes, a plethora of things.”
Meaning, the remaining 40% of cases were people who otherwise were law abiding citizens, who were bludgeoned with unreasonable and unconstitutional penalties, merely for possessing a weapon that The Man didn’t approve of.
Which part of “shall not infringe” do the authoritarians not understand?
A person who commits a crime should be punished for that crime – whether it be assault, battery, assault with a deadly weapon, murder, or whatever. Unless and until he uses his weapon to commit a crime, there is no “gun crime”.
And in that 60%, they were arrested for other things, and the carry without a permit was tacked onto the list.
We’ve become far too comfortable with making all kinds of things illegal just so the police have an “in” to conduct searches, manufacture probable cause, and create whatever charge they want. Not just with firearms, but also monitoring online speech, setting ridiculously low speed limits, treating broken headlights like the crime of the century, etc. In driver’s ed., back in the day, a police officer visiting the class told us that, “if the police want to pull you over, they can find a reason.” Now they can find the same reason by checking out your Facebook posts or (in Canada) sniffing out which protests or charities you’ve donated to.
I believe in law and order, but I also believe in liberty, and the balance is way out of whack these days. A surveillance state that infringes upon God-given rights is not policework, its oppression.
Apparently they ” pride themselves” on tongue washing boot leather.
Unless I’m mistaken, wasn’t McVeigh initially stopped because he had no plates on his car? Chief Healy undermines his own argument when he cites the number of unlicensed carriers during the period when the carry permit system was in place. His logic is also questionable given that he believes making it hard to get a CCL somehow protects survivors of domestic violence.
So you don’t believe requiring permits to carry outside the home keeps abusers from shooting people who by definition, live in the same home?
No, I don’t believe making it hard for the past and potentially future victim to arm herself enhances their protection.
I was being sarcastic, but the [il]logic works both ways. Despite Rafferty’s red herrings, laws that require (or obviate) a permit to carry outside the home have no effect on ability to buy or own a gun – or to use it inside one’s home on a victim, abuser, or oneself.
That was my first thought upon reading this piece of misinformation. McVeigh somehow lost his rear license plate was the reason stated for making the stop. That said, we will never know whether that was the real reason or if it was made up because the cops wanted to check out every vehicle leaving the area. They needed p.c. and it is amazing how many stops are made due to license plates being missing, license plate lights being out, stop lights being out, bald tires — you name it. I worked in court and we used to joke that marijuana smoke caused rapid deterioration of automotive wiring. I can remember one case where the cop stopped the car full of young chicanos and told them their rear light was out. They replied that it wasn’t and so he smashed it with his nightstick and said, “It is now.” Of course, they weren’t believed. It was the word of the LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER who had no axe to grind — yeah, but he wanted a bust that night because he had an argument with his wife before he left home to go on duty or some other thing that pizzed him off. Maybe the sergeant chewed him out for not making busts so far that month. Who knows. There were too many instances of faulty equipment stops that lead to marijuana arrests that it caused disbelief among the folks who had to listen to it day after day. Imagine this scenario: driving down a six lane high-speed, intercity highway with heavy traffic at night and being able to discern that the vehicle in front of you has faulty tread on its rear tires. Excuse me, shouldn’t you be paying attention to the cars on either side of your patrol car and behind you instead of eyeballing the rear tires of a car traveling at 45 to 50 mph in heavy traffic so closely that you can discern that they have insufficient tread on them? Excuse me, Officer Eagleye, I have serious doubts about your testimony. Wasn’t the p.c. a carful of young latino males?
Constitutional Carry passed the Alabama House yesterday. The Senate Bill is headed for the floor. We fear what amendments might be tacked on, but it looks as if we’re about to score a touchdown.
Sherrifs will lose some revenue from Reese pistol permit fees, but the permits are legal proof of ID in AL, so some will get them for that reason. Many of us will still get the photo permits for when we carry to states with reciprocity. As a former Prosecutor, the whining about “losing a good law enforcement tool”, is bunk.
Sheriffs can also spend that money as the please..just like leftover inmate meal funds..one Sheriff even bought a beach house in Orange Beach…Ethics Comm. did NOTHING!
Blood in the streets !… Shootout at the OK Corral !… Murders everywhere !… The Sky is FALLING !… Sorry Chief Chicken Little, we’ve all heard this fairytale time and again. What you REALLY mean is ” We’re going to sure miss that permit fee slush fund money.”
@Pb
Just logged in. Glad I read the comments before responding. You said everything I was planning on saying…only better. Thanks!
Here in Montucky the streets are NOT awash in blood…most people are choosing to carry covered or concealed for personal reasons. Only a few open carry’s and they are all low-key and chilled out. We only have a few stores (like Costco) that are posting “Target Rich Environment” signs at the door.
Yep, all the bad guys/gals are just waiting on a constitutional law to pass so they can celebrate by carrying. What a joke.
Getting a permit here in Alabama is not difficult. No more than getting a drivers license is difficult. So long as you are not a convicted felon, etc. Nor has any permit scheme ever prevented someone who should not have a firearm from getting/carrying 1. Those who feel the need to carry for self protection are going to have a gun permit or no. Same with those who are of criminal mindset. All the whole permit scheme does is give the police and local DA another thing they can charge someone with if they get caught with a weapon. As well as put $25,00 a year into the Sherriff’s Dept. Coffers. for each permit issued. A tax on the exercise of your rights.
The claim of how the permit scheme somehow gives law enforcement a way of keeping miscreants or DV suspects/perps from being armed is absolutely false. As is the idea that no permit would endanger police etc. Again, the same people who might be a danger to leo’s or anyone else, are going to carry without a permit.Just as they do now.
Now, I do have a permit. And will continue to keep a permit. Because I do cross state lines, or need to go where unpermitted weapons are prohibited. Would love to see such restrictions dropped across the country, but we know politicians, and law enforcement will not be willing to give up even the small amount of power and control. And that is what it comes down to. Power, control over people’s daily lives and money.
“Gun laws can get murderers and terrorists off the street. These laws help protect girlfriends and wives from the most extreme forms of domestic abuse, and they keep people with histories of mental illness from shooting themselves or others.”
These laws help endanger girlfriends and wives from any type of domestic abuse, not to mention the victims of people with histories of mental illness.
more democrat propaganda
Dimmest thing I’ve today-so far. Sweet home Alabama where colored folks are still screwed…
blah blah blah…
1. A criminal who wants to carry a gun will still do so even with no permit. There is no permitting system on earth that stops a criminal from carrying a gun if he/she wants to do so. This article has the perfect example with this…
In 2021, OPD made 78 cases for carrying a pistol without a valid permit. In the last five years, it had 333 cases; in the last ten years, 445 cases. In over 60% of these cases, it led to other charges such as assault, possession of stolen property, drug crimes, a plethora of things.
Despite having a permit system, it did not stop people from violating the law or committing a crime. Basically criminals in Alamaba have what law biding people do not – they have the opportunity to carry a gun without a permission slip.
2. There has never been even one documented case where a gun permit system in a state stopped a single in-progress crime.
3. Then this little nugget of fairy tale falsehood…
These laws help protect girlfriends and wives from the most extreme forms of domestic abuse, and they keep people with histories of mental illness from shooting themselves or others.
There is not one documented case where a permitting law stopped a suicide, a crime, or a mass shooting, or domestic abuse, or a person with mental health problems from doing bad things. People who are committed to doing these things will still do them even if they need to use another method to do it.
On this part. Wanting to commit suicide or acting to commit suicide or having a desire to murder, or harm others maliciously, is defined as a having a mental illness. There is no need to have had a history of mental illness for this form of mental illness to happen. There is not one documented case where having a permit system ever stopped this mental illness from happening or stopped a person with mental illness from committing an in-progress act of wanting to commit suicide (ideation) or commiting suicide or having (ideation) desire to murder or harm others maliciously.
Although there are people who use firearms to commit suicide it is not the epidemic its claimed to be in alarmists rhetoric just because a gun is available. Over 90% of people committed to committing suicide will choose another method other than a firearm even if they have access to a firearm.
Nation wide in 2021 (month ending Sept 2021 reporting period starting Sept 2020) – 99,543 reported deaths due to drug overdose, and according to the CDC that’s under reported due to incomplete data. 78,388 of those were confirmed suicides using the drug overdose method. 95.4% of those drug overdose suicide people also had access to a firearm, but used drug overdose.
A person committed to committing suicide is more likely to use other methods of suicide than use a firearm even if one is available. A permitting system does not prevent this either.
This permit alarmist thing is the imaginary hobgoblin of constitutional carry anti-gun politics. A permit does not actually stop any committed suicide person from committing suicide, does not stop crime, does not stop a prohibited person from carrying if they want to, does not stop domestic abuse.
The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.
H. L. Mencken
Over 10 years 44.5 cases per year (445 over 10 years) for carrying a pistol without a valid permit.
(over) 60% of (445) those (63% actually counting outright dismissal) led to other charges such as assault, possession of stolen property, drug crimes, a plethora of things – that’s 280.35 over 10 years – that’s 28 cases annually over 10 years.
So for at least 280.35 cases over 10 years a permit system did nothing to stop these criminals from carrying firearms.
Another instance of insulated reality. As if there are no other states with permitless carry to look to and see there is no “blood in the streets.”
Pretty sure I Grandpa didn’t have any kind of permission slip for having a 22lr rifle!
Lot of Rattle snakes on ranch.
He could always know when was in the yard from the way his Border Collie barked, stanger danger.
Life was good back in 1950s in Texas
Li
What about the people who have been a victim of a crime causing great bodily injury to them but did not have a firearm for self-defense because they felt the permit process is too encumbering for them.
Gun control folks never bring up victims of crime that did not have a firearm for self-protection.
WE in a Alabama don’t want to pay for OUR GOD GIVEN RIGHTS anymore!..Sheriffs are politicians..some with very liberal views..some have personal issues and deny some people, they dont like, their rights..take all politics out of our gun rights in BAMA!..
His same argument has been presented in every state Constitutional Carry has been adopted, and proved he is wrong
Never forget – the cops are not your friends.
“Gun laws can get murderers and terrorists off the street.”
Shucks, and all this time I thought we used murder and terrorism laws to deal with murderers and terrorists. Well, except in dem jurisdictions where they have dem sponsored get-out-of-jail-free cards…
I BELIEVE IN BACK GROUND CHECKS AND NEED PERMIT TO CARRY .
GOT MY LTC NO BIG DEAL . RATHER ENJOYED MEETING CLASS MEMBERS AND LEARNED ALOT ABOUT LAWS AND LTC , STAY ALERT AND SAFE BEST Y’ALL CAN .
You cannot fix stupid. The gun-grabbers do not care that in every case where concealed carry was authorized/permitted, none of the doomsday scenarios happened. However, the anti-gun mob survives on fiction.
Time for him to buy himself some testicles.
Places where permits are harder to get or non-existent, except for the politically connected, also seem to have higher rates of firearms used in violence. Where permits are easy or not required seem to have lower violence. It must be a coincidence.
Alabama House approves permitless carry bill
https://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com/story/news/2022/02/22/alabama-house-approves-permitless-carry-bill/6886449001/
The house approved bill is on its way to the Alabama Senate
They played the same songs in TN, there would be a river of blood blah blah blah, nothing changed lol except more freedom.
Gun control laws aren’t about controlling guns. It’s about controlling people. Freedom is very dangerous but tyranny is even more dangerous. That is why we must stay an armed society if we want to keep our freedoms.
Quote: “One that works: to protect survivors of domestic violence, prevent people suffering from mental illness from gaining access to a more lethal means of harming themselves or others, and ensure that a person carrying a gun in public isn’t a criminal with a dangerous history.” The police chief is saying that the FBI check is no good so his office has to decide which citizen is allowed to exercise 2nd amendment rights. Besides they like the cash they get for their permits.
“In 2021, OPD made 78 cases for carrying a pistol without a valid permit”
60% of that is 47 cases that was linked to other crimes.
So, it’s because of those 47 cases over the population of Alabama, the rest of the state’s residents should get a permit to carry?
What about the number of people who will receive a permit if they apply, but never do so because they just either don’t know how, don’t want to have anything to do with the government, afraid of paperwork, or just think they need it until they need it?
A criminal will illegally carry whether it is Constitutional Carry or not. It will not change anything if we are required to pay for a permit. I have had and still do have a conceal carry permit as it is required by state law. There still should be requirements for all gun owners to have a background check before purchasing a firearm period. Then you should be able to Constitutional Carry until you have your right to carry revoked by a court of law.