http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2AXr6JIl04
The last time a teenager lived under my roof I discovered a simple technique for maintaining discipline (i.e. maintaining my own sanity). If my step-daughter asked me why she couldn’t do this, that or the really expensive, time-consuming other thing (without any adult supervision in the evening on a school night) I’d simply say “I don’t do why questions.” And then I’d STFU. Oh how I wish one of these open carry advocates would have implemented this conversational strategy while the other stayed schtum. And then both of them had stayed schtum. All this pointless schmoozing! No, it’s not debating. It’s Second Amendment checkers for dummies. “If you let me look at your AR I’ll show you mine.” Sure thing officer. Right after you show me your dick. And now you know why I don’t open carry. Much.
On a whole, I believe stiffer penalties should be imposed. That said, the solution is to give people respect and compassion.
If an idiot performs a crime and goes to prison you should welcome him back into the populace upon his return after he has learned better. If you feel that he/she should not be welcomed back into the populace… then maybe he/she didn’t serve enough time. Ex-con’s typically can’t own any guns, and many of their rights are typically violated because of their history. I think they should have a very stiff penalty but be welcomed back when their time is served. A stiff enough penalty that they wouldn’t dream of needing a 3rd or 4th chance to return to society.
These days a criminal is sent to prison and can’t get a job after he gets out because of “criminal background checks.” Left between options of a high standard of living doing criminal activities or living in complete poverty flipping burgers which do you think they are going to pick? And… we don’t really give them an option. Ex-felons do not get decent jobs – no company is going to hire them.
You might feel… they deserve it; they brought it upon themselves. They deserve being watched and “suspected” by LEO’s and their neighbors. However, those people should also accept that they are ostracizing and separating people who have “done their time/paid their price” and should also accept the consequences of continued resentment.
There are hundreds of companies that hire ex-cons and hundreds of programs to help ex-cons return to a normal life. Here’s just one list of national companies that hire ex-cons. http://www.ranker.com/list/list-of-companies-that-hire-felons/business-and-company-info
Ex-cons might have more available programs than laid-off workers. Use google to find them. There’s too many for me to list. There’s even a Prison Entrepreneurship Program that helps ex-cons get low-interest loans.
The reason that so many re-offend is because they’re no damn good, not because they’re denied opportunities. Screw ’em.
It’s incredible how these like minded Dems launch an all out 2A attack at the city, state, and national levels by railroading new legislation or bypassing the legislative process entirely.
Outstanding cool on the part of the officer. If you have the right to open carry and do so for protection, that’s fine. If you open carry for the purpose of provoking a public response, allowing you to take up a public servants time while you record it, you’re just open carrying for entertainment, and that’s wrong. Jerks.
1 Super Awesome police officer, 3 total wastes of oxygen. They were totally trying to force him to do something they could use to make him look bad.
Natural selection at work.
Count the rule violations:
#1: Check
#2: Check
#3: Check, big time
#4: N/A. There really wasn’t a target, at least if she pulled the trigger.
If 1 or 3 had been followed, this doesn’t happen. If 2 had been observed, no one dies.
I’ve got eight Garand clips loaded with ’06 black tips just in case. 70 year old technology solves a “modern” problem.
I’ll stick with Intuit GoPayment for mobile and Stripe for web. Reliable, easy to use, no bullshit fee schedule that is up front on their websites and easy to understand. Intuit’s current policy mirror’s Square’s old policy, which is understandable and acceptable to me.
Gotta love a cop w/ brains and a level head. These guys were just trolling to provoke a response they could complain about.
I’m a non firearm related business and I canceled my Square account. I switched back to GoPayment, which I stopped using originally because of the Nordic Components shenanigans. I will look into this company further, thank you.
so if this is the states guarrantee on gun safety, can I sue the state of california bcuz I wasn’t allowed the correct firearm necessary to protect myself & my family from the criminal who has his? sounds like a plan to me…
So, how should the officer have responded to several calls of “there are strange people walking around with guns”?
I mean if other people in the community thought it was suspicious enough to call the police, shouldn’t the cop find it suspicious?
Also, would we be all over this officer if he just ignored the folks walking down the roadway with a slung rifle and they commit a robbery or shooting shortly there after?
I might be playing devils advocate here, but I think it would be unreasonable not to talk to these guys and check them out, just like it would be unreasonable for the cop to not check out a broken window on a parked car.
I think you make an excellent point. If the police just ignored these guys and they ended commiting a mindless crime this cop would be hung out to dry. I have had a policeman stop me for running to the post office in shorts during a blizzard. It was weird he was curious i wasnt butthurt. How could he know i lived a block away? It is his job to be proactive and curious.
Why hasn’t anyone stepped up to sue the hell out of this state?
They have. There are a number of cases that were held for several years while Nordyke was pending in the Ninth. Then Nordyke fizzled, and the Ninth seems in no hurry to decide those that remain on its docket (three California cases were argued last year that have not been decided.) In addition, there are a few more that are slowly working their way through the federal trial courts–and that too is a lengthy process. It seems that everything here hinges on what the SCOTUS does with Moore v. Madigan and/or Woollard v. Maryland. If cert is granted in either case, we can expect further delays–perhaps several more years–before we see any action out of the Ninth. This is an issue on which few courts are willing to lead, preferring to wait for the Supremes to “clarify” the law for them.
What does this mean for travelers? I travel frequently to ca and I take my ca complaint 1911 with me to target shoot when I have days off.
Yep, yesterday was still another home invasion in my town. There’s been a whole string of them. And while I’m pro law enforcement I’m enough of a realist to know that the cops can’t watch over all of us all the time. So pack a piece on you at home and have a shotgun or rifle close. Or both.
If he stops and asks questions, he’s apparently trying to infringe on their rights. If he doesn’t ask questions, and those 3 jerks shoot a bunch of people while taping it all, the cop is an idiot and to blame.
So, where do we go from here?
As for the “Reasonable and articulable suspicion”; that wouldn’t apply here. This was consensual contact, which the officer made clear. He even went above and beyond and informed them that they had the right to refuse questions and leave at any time, which few cops will do. This was not a detention, yes he did work the info out of them, but as I saw it he was trying to abate their (reasonable) concerns about what he was asking. And you are lying to yourself if you think OCing a rifle is common behavior, while it may be legal, it will still raise concerns to the uninitiated. Much like if you were to ride and Amish buggy through a major city. Should it change? Yup, and this is how it changes, but in the mean time, LE still is going to respond when there may be a public safety concern. Even though they don’t have to.
“They were drinking”says it all -guns and alcohol don’t mix well
Guns vs. Cars, a diagram
We should do some tests, walk around and ask people on video to pick on an unlabeled version of this graph which one is gun deaths and which one is car deaths. Then show them what the labels are so they can be shocked. I am sure a lot of low information people will think the 46k deaths is gun deaths because guns are so “evil”.
Actually the article didn’t specify if it was the cops or the burglar who shot her.
Good info to know, just in case.
Stop being a car grabber.
I think parades may share partial blame for this, let’s ban them too.
Wonder how many people I could get to sign a petition on change.org?
I forgot about that site….I’m thinking I need to push for a ban on di-hydrogen monoxide.
Worked in my IPC class, who pretty much all did Global Warming as their “important topic” speech…The only guy who didn’t sign my petition was the chemistry major, who was trying not to laugh and give away the game throughout my whole presentation..
Would these police also have the 50 pound springs on their service pistols?
Put the house up for sale. Have a big garage sale an move from the stinking state. Same with Cal. and now Colorado.
Judging by the handicap plates it woukd be the first scenario most likely…
if i see something like this patrolling the streets i’m shooting it, plain and simple.
“California still has no less than 46 civilian disarmament bills floating around in the Sacramento legislature. It’s a slave state for sure.”
Cali Res here….
This is total BS.. I literally lost my shit last night.Microstamping? Please… more like a dremel and 2 minutes of time… *poof* Helping to solve crime? How? Most of the firearms used in crimes are stolen or purchased illegally (read: stolen or straw purchased). I mean…. Yeah sure, some ass hole is gonna loose his shit, but at the end of the day it’s not much help to know that, yeah the guy with the gun you have in custody, was infact the shooter. Where the gun came from is of little significance, unless… Oh yeah.. It’s not about the guns, it’s about disarmament.
I feel like the Queen of England in that Monty Python skit: “I think she’s dead.” “No I’m not!”
Cf. Texas, I guess. This will not end well.
While home carry is good advice, we must remember this incident took place near a college in New York State. I have it on good info that the Cuomo Comintern tends to frown on private ownership of firearms, and hapless Andrea would have been permitted only 7 rounds to defend herself with.
Some of us still (and will always) have guns at the ready here. But on Long Island, home invasion is becoming the crime of choice. Rather than burglarize an empty house and have to search for loot, why not hit an occupied house and “persuade” the occupants to give up the goods? They’re all too willing. Especially when the probability of hitting a residence with arms is probably less than 5%.
It would be tragic if the woman was hit by a cop’s bullet, but it would still be 100% the fault of the scumbag who set the series of events in motion by invading the sanctity of someone else’s home.
No one in COMMIEFORNIA will be needing a gun in the future, because this useless state will fall into the ocean when the big one hits.
Actually, just everything west of the San Andreas, which is fine as it leaves the central valley and most of the north state intact, but the coastal urban areas will be history.
It is official. The cop killed both the perp and vic. 8 rounds fired. 7 to the perp and one to the victim.
No, he’s not the coolest cop. It was obvious in the first few seconds what these guys were doing. There was no need to continue bothering them.
I almost agree…but these guys were trying to elicit a response. If they had balls and were serious about what they were doing, they could have just said we are legally open carrying firearms, we do not have to produce ID, and if we are not being detained we are leaving. BUT…they didn’t, now did they?
I think the problem lies with public education on firearm laws. Open carry “shouldn’t” be shocking enough to have citizens calling the police each time.
The problem is there isn’t enough people knowing it’s not illegal to open carry. I’ll admit when I first moved from California to Oregon, I didn’t know about open carry. I overheard someone talking about it in class, that was the first time I heard about it. They were just as surprised as I was.
Videos like this might not be the greatest example, but at least its getting the message out there. Something more people should do.. tell a friend, mention it in community settings.. around family etc etc.
I just really like the idea of one caliber being able to be used as lightweight medium-high velocity target, varmint, and medium game round, as well as heavy subsonic replacement for 45ACP in self defense, but with 2-4X the magazine capacity of a Glock or 1911, and still be effective and accurate well out past 100 yards.
I also like the idea that in a 10″ AR pistol configuration I can shoot the heavy subsonics, or switch to lighter supersonic rounds, and reach out to 200-400 yards, with only a 200fps velocity penalty when compared to a 16″ barrel.
Add to that that I only have to buy one kind of brass, and two types of powder. One set of reloading dies does it all. Two barrels, with 4-5 different rounds to choose from, that can be fired from both. Interesting.
It just seems to me this provides a tremendous amount of versatility from a common platform and caliber. For me, increased versatility = increased value.
Is 300 AAC BLK the new do-all and end-all to make other rounds obsolete? Heck no! Not even close. But with higher performance in .308 and other calibers, in certain more limited applications, comes higher cost and reduced versatility. Choose your poison.
There are those who will prioritize high performance, and those who will prioritize versatility at the expense of high performance. I just happen to value the overall versatility and cost effectiveness of the 300 AAC BLK for my particular needs. Your mileage may vary.
A 1,000 yard bolt gun would still be very appealing, except for the fact that I can’t even see half that far these days, as the advancing years have taken their toll. The 300 AAC BLK shoots farther than I can see, and is more than sufficient to deal well with anything I am likely to shoot at, without breaking the bank, my ears, or my aching shoulder.
Did I mention fun?
This story makes me sick on so many levels. This shockingly beautiful girl is now dead thanks to the failed safety policies of the State of New York.
“This shockingly beautiful girl is now dead thanks to an armed government employee of the State of New York.”
FIFY
Questo
Certainly it’s possible.
Lousy trigger discipline could easily have had her hand in a no-no spot as she handed it off stock-first.
Also, we’re he to grasp the gun, or we’re it to encounter an obstacle such as his chest, her forward-falling body – including her finger – could’ve activated the trigger again. Semiautomatic, y’know.
As to the bit about multiple self-inflicted head shots, that does happen. All sorts of spasms can occur when the noggin gets nicked.
On one call back in my EMT days, we had a guy with half his head off reciting the ABCs over and over. An extra little finger jerk is certainly nothing special.
Funny things, brains. Even funnier when damaged.
Anybody know how often the bolt is like this from the factory in the Armalite NM rifles? Sounds like he switched with another of his rifles, anybody have knowledge of the best replacement bolt available? This review is 2 years old, anybody know if Armalite has remedied the problem? Thanks. Mike
Darn those evil Black assault cars, Peirs Morgan says LOL.
Shows Robert is right the gun grabbers are laying off till another spree shooting they let out wackos to do this like this N.O. nut job.
The car just went off. Hey, it happens.
Why do I feel like these cops cant wait to get some rounds off?? Granted he did point the gun at them, I just feel like it could have been handled a different way….I think Nassau PD officers need to hit the range more often….
A number of different techniques for neutralizing robotic devices come to
mind….EMP is one. While not off the shelf tech it’s not hard to gin together
the necessary stuff to create an EMP weapon that can do a number on
anything real close to it. The bolo idea is excellent. However eventually
these machines will be strong enough that it would have to be high tensile
rope to work. Once down a sharpened piece of rebar would do the job.
In wet environments one can arrange to supply high voltage to a puddle on the
ground….when robot steps in puddle throw switch and watch barbecue.
Effective means of attacking these things simply requires a bit of imagination
and ingenuity. It will be a LONG time before devices like this can both out
think and out maneuver humans.
Purchashed mine in 1983 at the Rod and Gun Club at Rhein-Main AB in Germany, never had a miss fire. 100% reliable. Will shoot any round accurately. My favorite of all time.
I did see anyone pick up the round that was ejected. With ammo supplies what they are that is like leaving a dollar bill behind.
“Private Joker’s silly and he’s ignorant, but he’s got guts and guts is enough!” – Gunnery Seargant Hartman/Full Metal Jacket
Something similar happened a few years ago with a couple douchebags and an MP5 clone. I’d highly recomend the following article, particularly Pincus’ take on the matter. http://www.breachbangclear.com/site/component/content/article/10-blog/175-picking-a-fight-over-open-carry.html
Thanks JWM. now I have coffee in my nose.
Its a slave state for us & utopia for the grabbers. Hopefully we can get back to the constitution some time instead of the will of a prick dictator. Randy
Good write on the 642. This gun is my constant companion. It is my first line of defense so it has to be both really good and really handy and really simple.
I have to have complete confidence in it. The S&W 642 fills this role very well. Of course it will handle any .38 special ammo but this is one area where one should spend a little time to make sure money is spent wisely.
ScubaOz does some good ammo testing videos on Youtube.com. If you are going to buy expensive ammo know that some expensive ammo works well and some not so well from a 2″ barrel.
I think my guns are lazy. They only go off when I make them. Anyone know where I can but one of these sentient guns? Then I could just leave it on the coffee table when I go to work, and never worry about home security…………
Criminal has bystander in a headlock, and points his gun at the police. That’s an impossible situation. You’re damned if you do and damned if you don’t. The real questions revolve around how we could have prevented this situation in the first place, starting with how he got parole and why he managed to elude capture for so long after absconding.
TO: All
RE: Heh
I can ‘nail’ a target the size of a human head at 100 meters with my scope-mounted AR-15.
Who was the bozo that murdered this girl. I’m confident they were at a distance LESS than 100 meters. And why aren’t they under administrative leave before being discharged and charged in open court for committing homicide?
If we held the police to the same standard the hold US, we’d be a LOT better off.
This CYA business in law enforcement is literally KILLING US!
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[It is better for you to defend yourself, then ask the police to do so. They might kill you while trying to save you.]
The government can’t force individuals to buy something they don’t want, can they?
I’m just waiting for some mischievous member of Congress to introduce a bill named the “Citizen Protection and Affordable Firearm Act “.
>Smith: I’m going to kill her!
>Cop: Not if I kill her first!
He makes enough sense to have voted for Obama 14 times.
What a great letter. I love this guy and I love that he took the time to put his positive and thoughtful words on paper. I would have to call myself more of a Libertarian than a conservative because I believe that both the Democrates and Republicans want to get more government into our personal lives and I don’t like that. Anyway, this is really not a “political” forum so I’ve probably said too much already. I’m just proud that Antonio wrote that letter and I also want to thank you for all the good work that you do with TTAG.
The cop had to kill the hostage in order to save her. I remember something similar happening during the war in Vietnam.
And Babies??!? And Babies.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/And_babies
The other thing is that the evil in the world pushes all people over time into our direction. We should be here to accept them for whoever they are. If they believe in the right to protect themselves then they are our friends. If a new person shows up on our doorstep chances are they really need a friend. Their old ones are probably already trying to make them feel guilty and evil. Dropping politics and bashing people based on it outside of RKBA should not happen.
Can’t Understand Normal Thinking….
I’ll believe it when they’re rapping about good will towards all and feeding the hungry. Or something like that.
Hypocrisy at its finest.
Nice work and loaded with common sense! Forgetting the gun-specific stuff for a second, this guide would work for any major show of any kind anywhere, from antiques to flowers.
My liberal brother was raising his voice and cussing when he chewed me out about the nra and guns being evil and i was an azz for buying them. Thankfully i am bigger, stronger, and younger and was tempted to tell him to step outside but i just walked away. Later he felt bad and apologized and i havent heard a peep from him. Funny thing is my sis in law (his wife) is from texas and is pro gun. I suspect she busted his nancy balls for me lol! 🙂 in the end blood is thicker than water and we all are family.
What is it that we always say — keep away from stupid people doing stupid things in stupid places. “Stupid people” includes family.
If a family member breaks your agates for carrying but you don’t break his for not carrying, you’ve already tried to meet him more than halfway. Take the hint — he resents you for being a man. Halfway isn’t far enough. It’s time to broaden the distance.
If it was just before midnight, he should have asked who was there before he opened the door. He learned a lesson and is lucky to be alive after this. He must have forgotten he was back in Philly and he’s not as safe as he was in the middle east war zone.
I bet they wish they hadn’t just created all those single issue voters…