“Well, see, sometimes, when you get emotional and you say, ‘Well, we’ve got to do something,’ …the reality is, sometimes, something is — actually makes it worse, or something creates other problems. You’ve got to think these things through and the implications. And the National Guard right now wouldn’t make sense.” – Illinois Governor Bruce Rauner quoted in Rauner rejects National Guard as way to quell Chicago violence [via chicagotribune.com]
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Well, I kind of think it’s a double-edge sword as well…Could you imagine the reverse…A twisted Liberal progressive globalist want-to-be tyrant such as Massachusetts Attorney General Healey having a Liberal government in Massachusetts summons the National Guard to collect “AG deamed , so called Assault Weapons” from NRA /GOAL domestic terrorists “. Who may be promoting gun violence….Morality from the twisted minds of Left-wing fuzzy-logic thinkers!* If this type of action can be done to particular group…Then it can be done to others on the other side of the political fence…*
The answer is obvious.
Snake Plisskin in Escape from Chiraq.
America, nay, THE WORLD!!! needs this now!!!
Sure! If Trump gets elected! Hell, build a wall around Chiraq, VC-DC , NY, MD., Massachusetts—If my relatives are able too escape…Or any other Liberal bastion, and Sanctuary City!!!
No, no, no, your people stay, too
No one escapes. It’s all or nothing.
Not all of us who live in Chicago believe in what this city does… You never know who you are spitting on with this sort of thing.
Some of us are here because of family, or work, or whatever, and are working to correct the problems of what is a pretty neat city that has been badly mishandled. Wall us in, or lump us in, and you may be part of the next sliver identified for sacrifice. You won’t see chicagoans who otherwise agree with you coming to your aid!
OK, fair enough, I’ll defend us not building some hypothetical border around Chi-Iraq… If you arm up and come on down to Texas and help us with our actual border with Mexico, which is rife with crime, rape, murder, and drugs… Deal?
Sorry Jack, Have been to Chicago many times in in the last 25yr. Now on the boycott list and I refuse to go to the cesspool unless some overwhelming need. Only time since 2010 was in May to pickup a free truck for my FD at Hines VA hospital. There is NOTHING in Chicago that on a personal level that makes it a worthwhile destination.
Great Fire #2 would be a great cleansing event. Perhaps the N Koreans would consider do so during a demtard coven gathering.
We all have our fights, eh RockOn? Glad to support yours in any way I can. At the end of the day, it is the same war, different front.
Neiowa, not too proud to come here looking for handouts, but too good for those of us trying to help things? Sorry right back atcha. I have no problem with someone boycotting chicago, I do too, to the degree I am able. But wishing a “cleansing fire” on the residents? Shame on you. You’re better than that. Didn’t anyone teach you not to throw the baby out with the bath water?
You mean I gotta come out of retirement? Well, ok…never did unpack my “go-bag” anyways….
You know, he’s right. Sometimes you do have to stop and think or risk making a pointless choice at best, or one that makes things worse.
Serializing ammo comes to mind as an example of the former.
These people (the gang- bangers) are criminals and need to be dealt with by the police and the justice system. Deploying an actual military force, even the State National Guard, to occupy and pacify an American city would set a very dangerous precedent, IMO, especially if part of their mission was to attempt to enforce unconstitutional gun laws.
The nose inside that tent may be small, but I think it is attached to a very large, ugly and MEAN camel.
National guard? To do what, exactly? Does somebody think the bangers will show up for a scheduled battle, or something? Or are we just angling for more free money from DC?
My guess….The same thing the city gangs did before in a number states that had called out the National Guard…The gangs would take “pot-shots” at them from out of the darkness…And when the guardsman are made busy….They jack all or any M16a2’s- or-M4 carbines. Or any heavy military ordinance lying about unsecured. It happened before…It would happen again….Remember, groups like MS-13 have Regan era trained Ex-military, and Ex-Sandinsta-police commandos working within leadership….Not a complete bunch of [email protected]$$e$….
But how many of them are actual competent people versus people who are ultimately just dumb thugs? Gang members don’t tend to stay active too long — it’s as if a life of crime and danger has a very high attrition rate.
Or are we just angling for more free money from DC? But of course!
Right move. Let Rahm and Garry handle their own problems, or take responsibility for their own failures to handle it.
Gary is gone mang.
Would likely start the next civil war.
Against whom, the bloods?
Don’t get me wrong, it’s not a good idea, but it isn’t the next civil war.
Fed, getting “Rahm and Garry handle their own problems, or take responsibility for their own failures to handle it.” is never going to happen. Especially the “taking responsibility” part.
This is a fringe minority doing violence against a fringe minority. Let them continue until they either realize they are their own worst enemy or kill each other off completely. If Chicago wanted to fix the problem they should start with the removing door justice system that puts the animals back on the street every year or so. If they call out the national guard it becomes a race war. What’s the demographic make up of the Illinois NG? Does it match south side Chicago? This about undereducated no class felons killing each other, and sadly innocent people get caught up in it also.
If the federal government can unconstitutionally conscript/draft Americans into the military (see 13th Amendment: “Section 1. Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction….”) then why can’t a State conscript young people into their National Guard?
A stint in the NG might be a good wake-up call for some of these young punks and maybe even give them a usable skill to pursue other than gang-banging. It would also result in the Guard being more representative of the demographic make-up of the state.
Still unconstitutional, but why not?
Your really know diddly squat about the military don’t you?
The issue of conscription was settled a few years ago. Though it is a worthless mechanism of providing unmotivated cannon fodder.
This cdraft is a violation of the 13Th Amendment is a product of Constitutional ignorance. People of military age are members of the unorganized militia and as such are subject to a call up through the draft under powers granted in Article I. Funny how someone who claims to be a supporter of the Second Amendment wants to shirk his militia duties.
My first hand experience with “gang bangers” is that they are in no way salvageable being well past the point of no return. Why would you want to inflict such a burden on the Guard?
I’m confused, I thought it was the “racist, bigoted and murderous” cops doing all the killing? I thought the problem was that the cops were targeting their policing efforts at the blacks because of racism? (sarc)
So I guess we see what happens when the cops back off from basic policing because they don’t want to be accused of “unfairly” targeting certain minority groups.
Sorry, but the citizens of Chicago should take care of their own, elected, mess. Good ole Rahm has an agenda to push, (more gun control) and it doesn’t help Chicago
I am reminded of the riots in Cali after Rodney King. Thugs and gangs ruled the streets until the NG showed up with M16’s. The thugs, looters and gang bangers disappeared instantly.
And the thugs and gangsters stayed gone once the National Guard went home, right? They all re-thought their life choices, and now neighborhoods like Watts and Compton are peaceful, crime-free idylls.
Calling out the National Guard to deal with Chicago’s gang problem is ridiculous. It’s not the right tool for the job. That’s like using a ball peen hammer to try to fix your multiple sclerosis.
There will not be civil war! U think a bunch of untrained thugs with hipoints, jennings, and tec 9s can match ng firepower? Plus, they rarely hit what they r aiming at. The streets will b vacant, until ng leaves, then they will creep out like roaches with the lights out.
Maybe they should actually stop treating the police like the bad guy in this situation. The Chicago PD is underfunded, understaffed and is being scrutinized with a fine tooth comb for every little thing that they do. And I still read stories about police corruption and overreach and them getting away with things that they should not and it makes me mad but in an overall sense they need to be able to do their job. It’s almost like your average politicians there hate the police more than the gang members.
The “issues” of Chicago (including any at the PD) are entirely the creation of the marxist demtard party.
Pardon me if I don’t shed too many tears for the poor Chicago PD. I can’t imagine why people don’t just trust them to do their jobs. Why, it’s almost as if a century of institutional corruption and lawbreaking has somehow lowered the people’s trust and respect for Chicago’s police department and city government!
If the Chicago PD is under more scrutiny now, it’s a textbook example of “chickens coming home to roost.” Boo-f*cking-hoo.
“Gun violence?” “Street violence?” All these violent inanimate objects are the source of all this trouble? How about “people violence?”
Allow the police to do their job without all the PC BS & hyperbole. If a fool is stupid enough to brandish a firearm towards an officer, that fool’s chosen to be shot. Same for any other person who menaces another person with any object which may become a deadly weapon or capable of causing serious bodily harm to an officer or another.
Edged weapon brandishers should expect to be shot, until they drop, if they approach an officer inside of 21 feet. Period.
While I can sympathize with you’re frustration and strong desire to do something, I have to say it ain’t that simple. Why don’t you put on the uniform and walk/drive the streets with that kind of behavior and see how well it works for you.
The national guard might suppress violent crime for a limited duration… but it’s not going to fix anything and might make things worse.
Thanks for putting the nonsense phrase “gun violence” in quotes. Inanimate objects cannot have behavioral traits. This is the left framing their desire to disarm us by demonizing the inanimate object.
I agree with Rauner. I live 10miles south of Chiraq. Enforce the freakin’laws. More murdered in the 70’sand 80’s. No plea bargains. No shorter sentences. Habitual criminals go away forever. Chain gangs too.Quit blaming “lax laws”. I hate to even say it but be like NYC and LA. The Guard would increase not decrease BS. Never happen…
So basically the idea is to implement martial law’s kissing cousin in a city where the police are made impotent by invertebrate Democrats, law enforcement hating thugs, and various other misfits. Absolutely terrible idea. As ye sow, so shall ye reap.
So some misguided fools want the National Guard to fix a problem in weeks created by the Democrats over generations and abetted by Mayor Maduro — oops, I mean Mayor Emanuel (one third world sh!thole is pretty much like the other). Sorry, folks, that’s not the way it works.
Take responsibility for your own mistakes, Chicago. Clean up your own damn mess.
Neutron bomb would solve the Chicago problem. Just saying.
Nice idea but a bit obvious. Either VX or a bioweapon might be more subtle.
Have Umbrella Corp build a facility under Chicago. Or maybe they already have……
The guard would kill allot of hang bangers but wouldn’t solve the problem. You have a corrupt democrat city that’s been run into the ground for generations, that was built on organized crime. You’d need a full regime change at the city and state level, a police force without its hands tied, and a justice system that actually works to put criminals away. Then, this new regime would also need to work on the failed schools, failed infrastructure, failed economy, and restore gun rights. In short, it would be nation building. Which we could do…. If we didn’t blow so much money and resources globally.
So they would rather have a Final Solution?
We don’t want soldiers patrolling our streets. We don’t want soldiers deciding which pols are worthy to lead us.
Let the good citizens, encourage them, to gun up. Remove legal hurdles and threats when they take on a bad guy. Make the bad guy suffer for his transgressions, not the good guy.
Make it impossible for a bg or his family to profit in court over a good guy defending life and property. And if the bg’s family and friends threaten the good guy, unleash swat to curb stomp them.
Make it career suicide for a DA to try and drag the good guy thru the courts.
That’s part of it. The other part is legalize drugs and stop enforcing victimless crimes. A few gang bangers, not all or even many mind you, would probably become legit business men and there would be no need to protect turf or any of that nonsense.
It’s a multifaceted problem to be sure but the problem at the end of each issue is Too Much Government.
Let people tool up to defend themselves, let people consume and sell drugs, let them make commerce and have life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Theft, murder, assault, etc is already illegal. Punish those crimes when they occur either by the victim rightfully defending their self or through a just trial.
I suggest taking the police dogs at ohare out for more walks…
i say just let them “neutralize” each other till no one is left standing….
OK, I’ll go there: Kent State.
The problem with militarized police is the shift in role from peace officer to enforcer, the shift in goals from people doing want, to “order”, and the shift in tactics from minimum intervention to escalating til you win. The dead are orderly. So are the cowed. Neither is having a lot of fun, so the real question is “What’s important here?”
People trained in escalation until they win aren’t the best choice for situations where de-escalation is the better option, if you can manage it. And de-escalation is always the better option, if it’s citizens to be served.
National Guard vs. police inside the country is kinda like using weapons for self-defense. It’s never good. Sometimes, only sometimes, it’s the lesser evil. And you have to be very, very clear about using this literally last resort. Then stop.
I seem to remember some protests about militarized policing. Something about how this just amplifies tensions; provides cover for selective enforcement; is a formula for violence under color of authority; and invites policing to devolve into thuggery, robbery and protection rackets. I’m thinking more militarization i hotspots, bad?
What Chiraq needs are a handful of well-compensated mercenary wannabes to clean up the gang-infested areas. See if Cali-Zim and Illini-Zim are available, though they are probably the same guy.
Your mom needs to buy you some meds boy…
I picture Illini-Zim in his recliner, in the dark, with the glow of the TV, cheering on Charles Branson blowing away bad guys, probably 5 nights a week. Straight up wearing those DVDs out.
Or maybe just see if Duterte is ok with doing double duty as the president of the Philippines and the mayor of Chicago? LOL
The national guard was used post Katrina down here, it helps as long as they stay, as soon as they leave, the micro gangs reappear. Arresting leaders of gangs helps for a short time, Then new leaders appear. The problem is the war on poverty, the war on drugs and the war on prosperity.(undeclared) Elimination of one and the violence decreases, eliminate all 3 freedom reigns. Starting a real war on guns will only make it worse.
What will gangs members and their leaders do, the day after drugs are legalized? Sign up for arts & crafts classes at the local community college?
No Jonathan if they’re smart they’ll either start looking for a good location to set up shop or they’ll get pushed out by competition who does. But once you don’t have police throwing flash bangs in your windows at 2AM or slamming you down and assaulting you because you have a bag filled with a plant that, just like certain guns mind you, have been deemed “illegal” to possess then yes maybe the world does seem like a brighter place.
Will the things that Matthew or I suggest create a Utopia or be a panacea? No, but it sure will be a hell of a lot better than Too much bloody government rammed down everyone’s throats. That I can guarantee.
I see the gang bangers are locked in vicious battles over alcoholic beverages.
Not to defend Rahm too much but a few years back he did ask for legislation giving longer sentences to felons in possession. (This would likely have kept one of the killers of Wade’s cousin in prison instead of murdering moms on the streets.) A group of black legislators blocked the bill. They didn’t want their constituents serving any more time. Instead, they wanted more educational opportunities for felons. So the funds for education go to prop up the teachers pension plan, the schools scrape by on what’s left, and the gang bangers go back onto the street.
The National Guard won’t work in Chicago. The NG is fine after a natural disaster where the infrastructure is temporarily disabled, or after spontaneous civil unrest sparked by something specific and transitory. That’s not the situation in Chicago.
Chicago’s problems are deep, deep, deeply ingrained. They’re even intentionally reinforced for cynical political and economic reasons. What happens there today, tonight and tomorrow isn’t some drastic deviation from their culture. It is their culture.
Adding the NG into the mix would solve nothing, while exacerbating everything. It would only introduce new targets (think IEDs along LSD) against which people would again/still direct their misplaced rage, and new rationalizations for doing so.
“Well, see, sometimes, when you get emotional and you say, ‘Well, we’ve got to do something,’ …the reality is, sometimes, something is — actually makes it worse… You’ve got to think these things through and the implications…”
Yeah, kinda like more gun control on law abiding citizens.
DEY DINDU NUFFIN YOOZ RAYSIS!