Wisconsin Prosecutors Drop Charges Against First Shooter in Order to Prosecute Kyle Rittenhouse

Image source: Kenosha County Circuit Court

On October 13, 2020, the Gateway Pundit broke the story that the person who fired the first shot the night Kyle Rittenhouse was forced to defend his life, Joshua Ziminski, was arrested and charged.

The man who fired the first shots from behind Kyle Rittenhouse during the fatal incident in Kenosha has been charged.

Joshua Ziminski, 35, has been charged with disorderly conduct and use of a dangerous weapon for firing his weapon during the incident on August 25.

On the face of it, that would appear to bolster Rittenhouse’s self-defense claim. He was being attacked at the time by Joseph Rosenbaum and someone fired a gun. Sane people would accepted that he had reasonable cause to fear for his life. Apparently the prosecutors think so as well.

This is Ziminski’s jail booking sheet:

Ziminski jail booking sheet

The only charge that remains is disorderly conduct; the felony recklessly endangering safety charge for firing the handgun will not proceed. Having to argue in one case that Ziminski fired the first shot that night might have proved embarrassing while trying to prosecute the Rittenhouse case, where their story is that Kyle started all the trouble. So Ziminski’s inconvenient gun charge has simply gone away.

Also an oddity in the Ziminski situation: the lack of any charges for possession of a firearm. Per a Wisconsin Right Now report, Ziminski has multiple convictions for violating harassment orders, which may make him a prohibited person for domestic violence. He also has a 2005 marijuana conviction which definitely gave him prohibited status.

The Ziminski charging document, as seen above, makes it clear that not only do the police have video evidence of Ziminski in possession of a firearm, but Ziminski and his wife both admitted that he had a gun. Other people have been convicted of unlawful possession on weaker evidence, but the Wisconsin prosecutors cannot admit that a bad guy had and used a gun that night before Rittenhouse did.

It appears that the prosecutors prefer to let a violent criminal off rather than lose the chance to persecute Kyle Rittenhouse.

comments

  1. avatar Sam I Am says:

    Interesting. The authorities think Rittenhouse will not use the original charging documents to damage the prosecution case?

    1. avatar Geoff "I'm getting too old for this shit" PR says:

      I’m sure the prosecutor knows Rittenhouse isn’t being represented by morons.

      So that leads to the question of why would the the prosecutor pull a stupid move like that in the first place?

      1. avatar Roger J says:

        Mike Nifong prosecutors don’t care about incidental inconvenient facts. They want a conviction and will do anything to obtain it.

        1. avatar Green Mtn. Boy says:

          FREE KYLE and JAIL the PROSECUTOR

        2. avatar SkyMan77 says:

          ^^^^ +1

      2. avatar Sam I Am says:

        “So that leads to the question of why would the the prosecutor pull a stupid move like that in the first place?”

        Zackly.

      3. avatar Xaun Loc says:

        Easy to understand.

        The prosecutor will argue that any testimony about Ziminski is inadmissible because it is irrelevant without proof that he attacked Rittenhouse with that gun. Whether that argument will be accepted depends on which judge hears the case. And, of course, the prosecution will do everything possible to ensure the case is heard by an ‘appropriate’ judge.

        1. avatar Bruce Tucker says:

          Xuan Loc, legally speaking it doesn’t matter whether the guy was actually trying to hit Rittenhouse or not. What matters is whether Rittenhouse had a reasonable fear of death or severe bodily injury. The fact that someone in the crowd chasing him fired a shot is absolutely relevant to that issue regardless of the shooter’s actual intent (which, of course, Kyle would have no way of knowing anyway).

      4. avatar Geoff says:

        Democrat.

    2. avatar SKP5885 says:

      Sam, I am only posting on your comment to get it to the front.

      To all, do not purchase from http://www.lockedandloaded.com. I recently made a purchase from them of an “in-stock” item. They accepted payment and then proceeded to hold the money for approximately 20 days before notifying me that they did not have the product in stock. Unless you want to give them an interest free loan do not buy from locked and Loaded!

      1. avatar Simon says:

        All gun retailers are facing delays, and inventory mistakes happen to all ecommerce stores. I also recently made a purchase from Locked And Loaded. They took about 2 weeks to ship what I ordered (explicitly stated on their website that orders would be delayed), but I received it and their price was fair.

        1. avatar SKP5885 says:

          Simon,

          So you are okay if a company takes your money, holds it and then returns it at a later date with no consideration given to you. Understood. Personally for me that chaps my rear end. I have no problem and was expecting delays on shipping. My point is, as a Company you do not take payment for something you do not have. Or cannot fullfill. I will continue to post my original comment once a day for the next 20 days. I feel by that time things will be square.

        2. avatar Geoff "I'm getting too old for this shit" PR says:

          “My point is, as a Company you do not take payment for something you do not have. Or cannot fullfill.”

          And if the company had an order with a distributor that told them the order would be filled by a certain date, and then failed to do so?

          Manufacturing and distribution takes place over a matter of months. Sometimes *many* months. If the dealer believed the shipment would come in and it didn’t, how is that the fault of the retailer?

          “I will continue to post my original comment once a day for the next 20 days.”

          That says a lot more about you than it does them. Now you’re the one being vindictive…

        3. avatar hawkeye says:

          Supply chain disruptions & preferred vendor programs play hob with just-in-time inventory systems. Just the way it is, any more. Although, most platforms don’t apply the customer’s payment until the item has been confirmed for processing & delivery.

        4. avatar SKP5885 says:

          Geoff, dam’t. Your right. I am being vindictive. I had a couple days to cool off and agree you are right. I wasn’t mad about the money, just that they would take payment without the product in stock. It was a good size order too. Anyways, no more shitty comments from me. That said, buyer beware and do a quick google search on companies that you are buying from the first time. I would have probably still ordered from Locked and Loaded because it was a good deal, even though they only have a C rating from the BBB.

          Anyways, point taken.

          SKP

    3. avatar C B says:

      They probably expect that they will be able to have it suppressed since the charge was dropped. Prosecutors are not the “knights in shining armor” they once thought they were. The Democrat ones, at least.

      1. avatar Sam I Am says:

        “They probably expect that they will be able to have it suppressed since the charge was dropped.”

        The law is the law. Justice is not important.

  2. avatar Paul says:

    Well, hell. The fact that they charged the lowlife had me almost hoping that justice would be served. Ziminski isn’t the only rioter who needs to be charged, convicted, and imprisoned. Who was that chucklehead who hit Kyle in the head, knocking his cap off? That other fool who tried to deliver a drop kick to Kyle’s head? Is it the position of the DA that NO ONE broke any laws that night, except for Kyle Rittenhouse? Who started the fire that Kyle extinguished?

    All I can do, is to donate another fifty bucks to Kyle’s defense fund.

    1. avatar Chip Bennett says:

      And here’s the real kicker: I don’t think it was actually Rittenhouse who put out the fire. I am pretty sure it was someone else, who may or may not have looked similar to Rittenhouse. The rioting mob who tried to use a dumpster fire to attack a gas station thought (likely incorrectly) that Rittenhouse was the one who put out their makeshift firebomb, which was the impetus for them to chase and threaten him.

      Charges dropped or not, I assume the charging documents for Ziminski are now public record and thus admissible as evidence. (I fully expect the persecution to attempt to exclude them via motions in limine. As it constitutes Brady exculpatory evidence, I further assume that any decision to allow it to be exclude such evidence would constitute reversible error.) Besides, he is still charged with disorderly conduct. I presume that his presentation and discharge of the firearm is the basis for that charge, as well. So, the State will still have to argue and provide evidence that Ziminski presented and discharged a firearm while chasing Rittenhouse.

    2. avatar Cale15 says:

      We should be using a rope a tree and that district attorney for being tyrannical!

      1. avatar Thixotropic says:

        SELECTIVE PROSECUTION is one of the FIRST tools of a Communist Govt.

        “…show me the man, and I’ll find your crime.”
        Lavrentiy Beria, Deputy Chairman of Counsel of Ministers, told to Joseph Stalin

        1. avatar Geoff "I'm getting too old for this shit" PR says:

          ““…show me the man, and I’ll find your crime.”
          Lavrentiy Beria”

          I’ve read a little about Beria, that was one pure-evil, cold MoFo.

          At least he was executed in the very execution room he engineered…

  3. avatar Old Fur Trapper says:

    This is a criminal injustice from the start! I hope Kyle’s lawyers file charges against the prosecuter for that and get Kyle set free of all charges.

    1. avatar Free Kyle says:

      Who are these prosecuters? This prosecution becomes smellier by the day. Do they work for Soros?

      1. avatar FedUp says:

        The county DA has been around a while, and he has a long history of vigorously prosecuting righteous self defense. Didn’t need Soros’ money to get into office, unlike the St Louis DA.

        The Associate DA and Assistant DA who are actually persecuting Kyle, well, they’re just following orders, like Angela Corey did.

    2. avatar Mark N. says:

      Doesn’t work that way. Only the prosecutor can file criminal charges. The prosecutor is civilly immune for his discretionary decisions as to whom to charge and for what.

      1. avatar Paul says:

        “The prosecutor is civilly immune”

        And, that is one of BLM’s more legitimate complaints. Qualified immunity can’t be done away with entirely, but it is often used to “justify” injustice. Bad cop, bad prosecutor, bad judge, they should all be held accountable. Turning a blind eye toward one bad actor only helps to make all the rest look bad.

        Qualified immunity needs to be reexamined, and either re-written, or challenged in the courts.

        1. avatar Chris Mallory says:

          Sure immunity can be done away with. If a government employee makes a mistake he should face the consequences. It will give government employees a bit of incentative to make sure they are not being tyrants. If you take a man’s freedom you need to be 100% right.

        2. avatar Paul says:

          Chris Mallory says: If a government employee makes a mistake . . .

          Actually, qualified immunity should protect government employees against “mistakes”. You shouldn’t be able to sue a cop for misspelling your name, or citing a statute in error. Mistakes happen, you don’t lock people up for simple mistakes.

          It’s the gross miscarriages of justice for which no one should be immune. Best example comes immediately to mind, is Kamala Harris covering up evidence that would exonerate prisoners. On any given day in America, there are probably dozens of decisions made by cops and/or prosecutors to prevent discovery of evidence by defense attorneys. That would be punishable with imprisonment, if you or I did it, but when a cop does it, he is immune.

        3. avatar FedUp says:

          If you don’t like Qualified Immunity from lawsuits for cops, am I to assume that you are also against Absolute (unqualified) Immunity from both criminal charges and lawsuits for prosecutors and judges?

        4. avatar Mark N. says:

          Very generally speaking,governmental employees are liable for their negligent acts that result in physical harm to property or persons. There are of course many exceptions, such as a prosecutor’s decision to not prosecute, or an officer’s decision not to arrest or detain. But if a cop rear-ends you and he doesn’t have lights and sirens going (and even if he does), he can usually be sued civilly for damages. He will be defended by his public agency and covered by his employer’s insurance, but that is true for anyone driving in the scope of their employment. The one major exception to prosecutorial immunity is when an arrest is made without probable cause, when charges are brought without probable cause, or where the prosecutor fails to turn over exculpatory evidence to the defense. These are violations of civil rights and the perpetrators of those violators may be civilly prosecuted for damages. Remember that case where a prosecutor went after a bunch of guys from a lacrosse team (Duke?) for rape, but then played hide the ball in order to get them convicted? Not only did he lose the case, he lost his license to practice law ans was held liable for civil damages including emotional distress and attorney’s fees.

          Let me put it this way. A sovereign is absolutely immune except when it agrees to be sued, and in most circumstances is liable for the same sorts of things that the general citizenry can be held liable. However, there is absolute immunity for discretionary and political activities, such as issuing licenses and permits, inspections and issuance of notices of violations, enacting legislation, judicial and quasi-judicial activities.

  4. avatar TruthTellers says:

    If Ziminsky was a PP, then wouldn’t the Federal Gov’t be able to charge him with unlawful possession?

    1. avatar Chris Mallory says:

      So you are in favor of uaing unconstitutional laws to imprison people you don’t like? But ignoring that do you have any evidence the commie is currently using or addicted to a prohibited substance. A 15 year old conviction is not evidence of current usage.

      1. avatar Tom Lindley says:

        Commies shouldn’t have constitutional protection, so there is that and regardless of whether he is a prohibited person or not he is atleast partially responsible for the unfolding of events that occurred that night. F— him. The only good commies are dead ones.

      2. avatar Ing says:

        Whether a law is unconstitutional or not is a different question — at the very least, we should be able to expect that whatever law exists will be applied impartially and equally to everyone.

      3. avatar tdiinva says:

        The Fifth Amendment says rights cannot be violated without due process of law. The Language clearly state that if you through the criminal justice system and are found or plead guilty your can be abridged.

    2. avatar Miner49er says:

      Prohibited person?

      But I thought all gun laws were unconstitutional?

      Oh, that’s only for Republican conservatives, I see…

      1. avatar tdiinva says:

        Try reading the 5th Amendment ,Skippy. Did Ziminski receive due process or not for previous illegal actions?

      2. avatar The Crimson Pirate says:

        All gun laws are unconstitutional, but if your going to hold us to them then you damn well better hold the uncivilized savages to them. Rule of law either applies to everyone or no one.

      3. avatar Ron says:

        Interesting as you only want conservatives charged for gun related crimes but not liberals. This is a gun control law you and your side champions yet here you are arguing liberals should be free of prosecution from it. Typical leftist shill.

        Turnabout is fair play.

  5. avatar Phil says:

    More proof that AG Barr is a traitor. The DOJ could bring federal firearm charges against Ziminski, but he’s too busy running his mouth to actually do anything. He’s all show and no go.

    1. avatar Nanashi says:

      I’m shocked the guy who actively interfered with efforts to prosecute an FBI sniper go after he shot an innocent, unarmed, woman in the back is corrupt…

      1. avatar Miner49er says:

        “guy who actively interfered with efforts to prosecute an FBI sniper go after he shot an innocent, unarmed”

        You know, I wondered when someone was going to bring this up.

        I think most of the people here have plumb forgot about the real story regarding Republicans and freedom.

        Why don’t some of you folks look up a gentleman named Len Horuchi.

        1. avatar The Crimson Pirate says:

          Lon

          And WTF does he have to do with Republicans?

        2. avatar CplCamelToe says:

          49er is one of those none-too-rare individuals who sees their world in a binary orange=bad, D=good.

          Lon Horiuchi has exactly nothing to do with the RvD debate. There’s just literally nothing of substance between 49er’s occipital lobe and his cock holster.

        3. avatar Not Again says:

          Lon and the insanity that occurred at Ruby Ridge and Waco was under the Clinton regime. If Biden wins and the dems are allowed to propagate their summer of love shenanigans we’ll be watching different versions of RR and Waco play out with more frequency. The jackbooted thugs will spawn more Timothy McVeigh’s and maybe even a few Henry Bowman’s (read Unintended Consequences for some good background on how the US got to where we are today on the firearms laws). Interesting times!

        4. avatar Miner49er says:

          It is amazing how you conservative Republicans can lie with a straight face, regarding historical facts that are beyond dispute.
          You have learned well from your Liar-in-Chief Typhoid Trump.

          Your claim:

          “Lon and the insanity that occurred at Ruby Ridge and Waco was under the Clinton regime.“

          It seems your Russian handlers are ill-informed about United States history.

          At Ruby Ridge, Lon Horuchi was acting under the direction of the George Bush administration, a conservative Republican who ran on a ‘law and order’ platform.

          Comrade, Bill Clinton was directed on November 3, 1992 months after George bush’s jackbooted storm troopers had killed Vicki Weaver.

          “Ruby Ridge was the site of an 11-day siege in 1992 in Boundary County, Idaho, near Naples. It began on August 21, when deputies of the United States Marshals Service (USMS) initiated action to apprehend and arrest Randy Weaver under a bench warrant after his failure to appear on firearms charges.”

          “In 1992, while working at sniper position Sierra 4 for the FBI Hostage Rescue Team at Ruby Ridge, Horiuchi shot and killed Vicki Weaver and also wounded her husband, Randy Weaver, and family friend Kevin Harris.[2]
          After his first shot hit and wounded Randy Weaver, Horiuchi fired a second shot at Kevin Harris, who was armed, some 20 seconds later as Harris was running into the Weaver home. The bullet fired at Harris struck and killed Vicki Weaver through the doorway just beyond Harris, who was entering the home. Weaver was holding her 10-month-old child behind the door through which Harris was attempting to enter;[2][3] the round also struck and wounded Harris.”

          You people selling your revisionist history are pathetic, sad, hypocritical conservative Republicans who don’t have a patriotic bone in their bodies.

          Hypocrisy, thy name is conservative Republican.

        5. avatar James Campbell says:

          Hey whiner GFY.
          Reno was a FULL BLOW Jim Crow liberal, pro-choice DemoKKKrat, and was calling the shots at Ruby Ridge.
          Bush was a chimp of a POTUS, with members of his cabinet running unchecked.
          Trump/Pence 2020…..0% chimp leadership, that’s LASER focused on stomping ACTUAL criminals into oblivion!
          Glad to clear that up leftard.

        6. avatar James Campbell says:

          1st time poster posts…..”Waco was under the Clinton regime.”
          Whiner49er responds….. “It is amazing how you conservative Republicans can lie with a straight face, regarding historical facts that are beyond dispute.
          You have learned well from your Liar-in-Chief Typhoid Trump.”

          Nice script job turd. A member of your trollfarm posts a comment, then you respond with BS condemning all “conservative Republicans” on TTAG. What a pathetic POS you TRULY are. Your trollgame is sub-par to put it nicely.
          Winter is coming demoKKKRats!
          Trump/Pence 2020, come for the changing season, stay to see the shivering TDS leftards out in the cold.

        7. avatar Miner49er says:

          Go ahead, admit that the Lon Horiuchi killing of Vicky Weaver occurred under the Republican administration of George bush, following 8 years of the Republican administration of Ronald Reagan.

          The Republicans owned the ATF for 12 full years, it was their culture and direction that brought about the killing of Vicky Weaver at Ruby Ridge.

          The Clintons had nothing to do with Ruby Ridge.

          Really, you need to follow a more reputable and accurate news source than Fox News, they have led you astray regarding American history.

          For extra credit, you should check the exact mileage between the Branch Davidian compound in Waco and George W Bush’s ranch.

        8. avatar James Campbell says:

          Hey whiner, CplCamelToe summed you up to a tee……

          “There’s just literally nothing of substance between 49er’s occipital lobe and his cock holster.”

          Couldn’t have said it any better myself.

        9. avatar painlessbob says:

          Not Again: Ruby Ridge was Bush 41’s deal.

        10. avatar LarryinTX says:

          Hey whiner, are you still gonna be paid after you democommies get your asses whupped in Nov?

      2. avatar Miner49er says:

        “49er’s occipital lobe and his cock holster“

        There goes James Campbell, thinking about my cock again, naughty boy!

        1. avatar James Campbell says:

          CplCamelToe summed you up to a tee……

          “There’s just literally nothing of substance between 49er’s occipital lobe and his cock holster.”

          Context matters whiner. I referenced a comment made by someone else.
          Well, I guess for a lefttard hack like you, context DOESN’T matter.
          Nevermind turd!
          Trump/Pence 2020

  6. avatar F R E E K Y L E N O W ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! says:

    He must be acquitted of all charges!

    1. avatar Miner49er says:

      Thank you Freeky Leon!

      1. avatar James Campbell says:

        What’s the “W” for?
        Whiner49er is a POS leftard shill?
        Trump/Pence 2020.

  7. avatar Hannibal says:

    I guess he’s state’s witness

  8. avatar Rusty - Molon Labe - Chains says:

    I am beginning to think Barr is either part of the swamp or incapable of managing his entire portfolio. What happened to the FBI pursuing Hunter Biden with the contents of his laptop? What about all the charges that should have been placed against Comey or Strzok, not to mention Rosenstein, Clapper, and Brennan?

    Vote Trump, the swamp needs more draining!

    1. avatar C.S. says:

      Trump made a candid comment during one of his campaign rallies recently, along the lines of (paraphrasing): saying he was going to drain the swamp, but didn’t realize how the swamp actually is…

      It’s a f***ing fascist cesspool, President Don. Not to mention it has 8 years of Obama, Hillary, _and_ Biden to prepare (more if you include the Bush installed Never-Trumpers). Even communist Bernie face-slapped by it twice already.

    2. avatar Mark N. says:

      The DOJ, according to the most recent information I have, is trying to determine the authenticity of the information contained on the lap top, or whether it is a disinformation campaign by the Russians to undermine Biden. As you have probably heard, Putin prefers to deal with Trump while Xi would rather deal with Biden.

      1. avatar Victoria Illinois says:

        I just heard that Hunter’s lawyer had asked the repair shop guy to give back his computer. I’d say that’s proof that it IS HUNTER’S computer. He’s as stupid as Anthony Weiner.

      2. avatar Manse Jolly says:

        Some obscure Mac computer repair shop is the center of a Russian disinformation campaign?

        Not buying it..not even for a second.

        1. avatar C.S. says:

          Yup, all those personal photos of Hunter, including him with a crack pipe… yup…

  9. avatar Debbie W. says:

    The fact remains…Somebody else shot first and that’s enough to start the ball rolling to help justify self defense. Letting the perp off shows the mike nyfong prosecutor assumes he has a bigger fish to fry.

    TRUMP/PENCE 2020.

  10. avatar Shire-man says:

    Nothing means anything. There is no right or wrong. There is no justice. There is no peace. Only chaos and war. I’m starting to buy into the critical thought you are either oppressed or an oppressor bullshit and I think I know who the oppressor is. Ironically it’s not who the critical thought Marxists keep trying to tell me it is.

    1. avatar Ing says:

      When the Left chants “no justice, no peace,” they’re deadly serious. Nobody will be allowed to have either when they get their way.

  11. avatar Woody W Woodward says:

    “Liberty and justice for all” – – but only if you’re able to pay for it.
    [W3]

    1. avatar Miner49er says:

      Welcome to the world of the minorities, who have been deprived of justice for hundreds of years.

      To the privileged, equality feels like oppression.

      1. avatar Ron says:

        So you admit that those alive today must pay for the wrongs committed by those from hundreds of years ago?

        You agree it’s “the whites turn” to be oppressed?

        Do you not realize what that will inevitably cause?

        1. avatar Miner49er says:

          “So you admit that those alive today must pay for the wrongs committed by those from hundreds of years ago?”

          That is not what I said at all, nice deflector shield.

          My point is that minorities have suffered unequal justice for hundreds of years. I would call the government sanctioned, involuntary servitude, torture and killing of minorities a denial of equal justice under the law.

          And it is a violation of the Constitution’s assertion that all men are created equal.

          Slavery is, and always was, a violation of the Constitution but I see so many so-called ‘patriots’ celebrating the very symbols of that violation with some sort of pride that can only be based on racism.

        2. avatar Ron says:

          No, no you don’t. That’s a complete MSNBC lie.

        3. avatar Dude says:

          “for hundreds of years”

          Welcome to 12 years ago, where a black man can be elected the President of the United States. Or you can keep living in the past and railing against the unfair treatment of blacks by democrats.

        4. avatar Sam I Am says:

          “Welcome to 12 years ago, where a black man can be elected the President of the United States. ”

          You’ve got this all wrong; all wrong.

          The fact that a black man can be elected president, a black woman can become a billionaire, a black man can become CEO of a famous pizza chain, a black man can invent the three position traffic signal, and a gas mask, a black man and woman can become Surgeon General of the US, a blackman can be CEO of a huge entertainment empire, a black woman can become a world renowned opera singer, black men and women can be elected to Congress and the Senate….all that is due not to a lack of racism, but an expression of white guilt about being racist.

          These black people (and many more) did not succeed because of their talent, drive, education, experience, but because wealthy white people felt the need to assuage their guilt by letting a very few blacks become headliners. Any form of assistance by whites to blacks is just more racism. Any form of forbearance by whites to blacks is just more racisism. Any white acknowledgement of the humanity of blacks is rasssissness. Any move by whites to remove obstacles to black success is race. Even the end of slavery was racist, a move to starve an entire group of people seen as too backward to ever care for themselves without white help. Even recognizing black persons as human is rassissness because only a privileged, white power structure could establish a society where admitting that other racesses are human is evidence that whites believe non-whites are not human. As noted elsewhere, even the lack of obvious racississmm is proof the whites are hiding their racess nature deep in their minds.

        5. avatar Miner49er says:

          So you think a 350 year head start on owning property and accumulating wealth by white people, while they beat, maimed and killed minorities in order to steal the fruits of their labor from them and sell their children down river, is meaningless even today?

          I understand why you want to ignore history and the rights of others.

        6. avatar Miner49er says:

          “No, no you don’t. That’s a complete MSNBC lie.”

          My copy of the constitution says that “all men are created equal and endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights”.

          Help me to understand, do you disagree that the United States Constitution states that, or do you disagree that minorities are men like white people?

        7. avatar Dude says:

          Miner: “head start”

          Is that how you think people come to own land and make enough money to support a family? So, it wouldn’t be possible for me to obtain an education and a marketable skill without centuries of minority oppression?? Do you ever think about this stuff, or do you just regurgitate any retarded (no offense) dem talking point you’re told?

          I bought land when I was 24 while I was engaged to get married. I didn’t inherit it or pay for it with all of this imaginary wealth that you think every white person has due to oppression of others in a previous generation. My future wife and I didn’t get a penny from our families. You know who has that wealth? People like Beto O’Rourke, Kamala Harris, and yes, Joe Biden. All of their families owned slaves. They all had a more privileged life than I did, yet I have to listen to those rich a**holes and their followers (like you) tell me how terrible I am just because I was unfortunate to be born with a particular skin color. People are sick and tired of being preached to by you down the nose racists.

          Here’s a shocker for the party of science. Most rich people here are self made. America is the land of opportunity. Anyone that wants to can succeed, but everyone won’t be a millionaire or even rich. C’est la vie.

          “Of those folks, 67.7% were self-made, while 23.7% had a combination of inherited and self-created wealth. Only 8.5% of global high-net-worth individuals were categorized as having completely inherited their wealth.”

          https://www.cnbc.com/2019/09/26/majority-of-the-worlds-richest-people-are-self-made-says-new-report.html

        8. avatar Joe “...all we want are the facts, ma’am.” Friday says:

          ‘My copy of the constitution says that “all men are created equal and endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights”.’

          Miner, I thought this error had been sorted prior, yet you persist. You are paraphrasing the Declaration Of Independence, not the Constitution. At least according to the U.S. documents—perhaps you are referencing some other country’s docs?

      2. avatar Paul says:

        In another conversation, in another venue, I stated that I would be happy to help an “oppressed” man up. I was immediately attacked for being a racist. It was “presumptuous” of me to think the guy at the bottom needed a lift up. After going ’round and ’round, I realized that no one on the other side wanted equality. They want revenge. They want to be on top, and they don’t want to share power or privilege.

        That attitude almost guarantees a race war. Someone needs to get some clues before SHTF. I, and millions of other Americans, will be forced to choose sides against the underdogs, because we can’t pretend to be one of them.

        Accept my hand in friendship today – or we will one day meet in battle. No one will be happy about paying the fiddler’s price.

      3. avatar Mike V says:

        “To the privileged, equality feels like oppression.”

        Equality of outcomes is oppression, which is the only equality the left cares about…

        1. avatar Miner49er says:

          All citizens should have equal access to all government programs, that‘s equality of opportunity.

          And Black people have been denied equality under the law for decades, here’s but one example where, after a long court battle citizens were able to win against an oppressive government that had systemically deprived them of their rights:

          “WASHINGTON (Reuters) – Thousands of black farmers who were discriminated against by the U.S. Agriculture Department will be eligible to receive $1.25 billion in a settlement, the government said on Thursday.

          The settlement of the case, known as Pigford II, is contingent on Congress approving $1.15 billion for the farmers, in addition to $100 million already provided in the Farm Bill.

          For decades, black farmers said they were unjustly being denied farm loans or subjected to longer waits for loan approval because of racism, and accused the USDA of not responding to their complaints.

          The original Pigford lawsuit, named after North Carolina farmer Timothy Pigford, was filed against the USDA in 1997, and settled two years later when the government compensated black farmers left out of USDA loan and assistance programs.

          More than 13,000 farmers able to provide proof of their claims of discrimination were awarded $50,000 each and given debt relief in a package worth more than $1 billion.

          But tens of thousands of claims were denied for missing the filing deadline. The settlement in Pigford II would allow these farmers to again make their claims.

          “We have worked hard to address USDA’s checkered past so we can get to the business of helping farmers succeed,” USDA Secretary Tom Vilsack said in a statement.“

      4. avatar Ing says:

        I never felt like I was privileged, except through being born in the United States of America — a privilege I share with 300+ million people.

        So yes I do love my privilege. And I’ll fight to keep it, because I want everyone else who is born in this wonderful place to have it, too.

        1. avatar Miner49er says:

          “I never felt like I was privileged”

          Of course you never ‘felt’ like you were privileged, that’s the deal with systemic racism.

          It’s easy for a privileged person to look around and say my privilege is normal, but walk a mile in a minority shoes and your ‘feelings’ will be different.

        2. avatar Dude says:

          Yeah Ing, no matter how bleak things may have felt, you ALWAYS had your WHITENESS. That means you always had a leg up on the likes of billionaire Oprah. Whenever I see poor, struggling people in Appalachia that are upset because their trailer caught on fire or flooded, I just remind them that they still have their whiteness.

  12. avatar Jeff says:

    These liberal prosecutors should just come out and admit that they will charge self defenders past the full extent of the law and let rioters, looters, and arsonists off without charges. The writing is on the wall, we have a whole new type of DA that is trying to outlaw honest citizens while allowing dirtballs to walk free.

  13. avatar Mercutio says:

    I’m thinking the Persecution, er Prosecution is vunerable for both civil and criminal proceedings:

    https://www.justice.gov/crt/deprivation-rights-under-color-law

    1. avatar Sam I Am says:

      So many people are enamored of the “color of law” statute, yet how many cases have ever been brought? How many were successful? How many cases involved significant ranks of government agents? It is not like we just suddenly discovered this statute two years ago.

      1. avatar Eric in Oregon says:

        I’d actually like to know the answer to that.

        1. avatar Sam I Am says:

          “I’d actually like to know the answer to that.”

          Indeed. I have been unable to uncover a source for the answer, probably because I use the wrong search terms, wrong target, or something. I need to store a link to the answer, so every so often, I pose the question. Given the lack of easy access to the date, I suspect the cases get swallowed up with the general heading of “civil rights”, and are difficult to suss out.

  14. avatar What The Hell...?!!! says:

    Hmmm…the handgun was conveniently stolen a few days after the incident. Me thinks it was already stolen, and now lies at the bottom of a river in Wisconsin.

    1. avatar Miner49er says:

      Maybe it was in one of the boating accidents you folks are so fond of citing.

      Hypocrisy, they name is conservative Republican.

      1. avatar CplCamelToe says:

        Well, you see, there, Dipshit, those “boating accident” jokes are a reference to explaining to your cuckolds what happened to LEGALLY ACQUIRED weapons that real, actual, thinking people don’t want to have to explain why they’re not giving up.

        The analogy in question is in reference to the disposal of a weapon that was likely illegally acquired in the first place.

        The only thing apparently deeper than your throat is the depth of the failure of intellect.

        Go gargle you some Joe, now. His dust sack is getting full and needs relieved, and Wolf Blitzer is all puckered-out.

        1. avatar Miner49er says:

          “explaining to your cuckolds”

          You mean ‘cuckolds’ like Donald Trump’s Republican activist friends Roger Stone and Reverend Jerry Falwell Junior?
          That pool boy in Florida had the best summer job ever!

          And what’s this you’re saying about ‘legally acquired firearms’?

          Once again, I thought the prevailing opinion on this list was that all firearms laws are unconstitutional?

          I wonder why you don’t think that applies to this citizen?

        2. avatar James Campbell says:

          Hey whiner, STFU you loser!
          Trump/Pence 2020
          Enjoy that TDS, and the leftard BS you attempt to peddle on TTAG.

  15. avatar Anymouse says:

    This has nothing to do with Kyle. The videos clearly show and record the flash and bang of a gun being fired. It doesn’t matter if it was done by this person or Casper the Friendly Ghost. They also could subpoena all the evidence the police gathered if they cared, of which more video might be useful.

  16. avatar Mike Carbine says:

    Some here think this is going to be an easy win for the defense. I do know that George Zimmerman’s cost almost $1.5 million and 3 years of his life before he was free and clear, case closed.
    And all this was for one fatal shooting, in a Redstate, in his ‘own neighborhood’, and had Florida’s Stand Your Ground statute, as a part of his defense. He was also head of the neighborhood watch and had a permit for CCW. His counsel had to contend with “witness fraud, obstructed justice, and lying repeatedly under oath in order to cover up their knowledge of the witness fraud” on the part of prosecutors and state authorities.

    Pray for Kyle with me folks, he is going to need it.

    1. avatar tdiinva says:

      Kyle is being represented pro bono.

      1. avatar Paul says:

        Pro bono is great and all – he won’t be impoverished for the rest of his life.

        He still has a long and winding path through hell. When he finally gets to an arraignment, his bail will be set somewhere around 50 billion dollars, and he will have to sit in jail beside convicts and/or lowlifes for many months, possibly several years. And, his life will be in jeopardy all the while.

    2. avatar Eric in Oregon says:

      “and had Florida’s Stand Your Ground statute, as a part of his defense”

      I agree with the rest of your comment, but please stop repeating this particular misinformation. Whatever people (some who should know better) may have commented, SYG was *literally* never part of Zimmerman’s actual defense. He was on the ground so it just wasn’t a factor.

    3. avatar Geoff "I'm getting too old for this shit" PR says:

      “And all this was for one fatal shooting, in a Redstate, in his ‘own neighborhood’, and had Florida’s Stand Your Ground statute, as a part of his defense.”

      Zimmerman never invoked ‘stand your ground’. He plead and won with a claim of self-defense :

      “”Stand your ground” is a law that excuses the use of deadly force if the defendant felt threatened for their life. Though highly controversial, in the case of Zimmerman, the use of this law seemed a natural defense, since the fatal shots were issued during a scuffle between Martin and Zimmerman. Yet, as discussed in the July 24 episode of The Jury Speaks, the defense chose not to invoke “stand your ground”. Instead, they cited self-defense to support Zimmerman’s not guilty plea.”

      https://www.bustle.com/p/george-zimmermans-defense-team-didnt-use-stand-your-ground-but-it-impacted-the-trial-anyway-72271

      1. avatar Mike Carbine says:

        Ok, I read it in every news article at the time, if it was not so… I never said, I sat in the court room. Thanks for the heads up. Any how the point STILL stands, the State had the Law on it’s books and the state still put oll’ Zimm through the ringer.
        Kyle don’t even have a “Stand Your Ground” law in Wisconsin as a possibility.

  17. avatar Miner49er says:

    Let me get this started here, Zimiski was in fear for his life so he fired a warning shot because people were menacing him with guns.

    Even after he fired a warning shot, Kyle did not take heed and leave the area even though the other ‘militia-men‘ apparently did.

    I guess that’s why the other ‘patriots’ didn’t kill anyone that night, they took the hint of the warning shot and unassed the AO.

    I’ve always heard that discretion was the better part of valor.

    1. avatar Eric in Oregon says:

      See? Warning shots don’t work.

      1. avatar Sam I Am says:

        “See? Warning shots don’t work.”

        I wonder if kneecapping someone, as Biden suggests, is considered a “warning shot”?

    2. avatar tdiinva says:

      Let me translate your post into plain English for you: “this jerk should have cowered to the might Sturmabteilung…err I mean Anti- Fascists.”

    3. avatar jwtaylor says:

      The entire first two paragraphs of your comment are made up. Not surprising. You have no ability to see the truth.
      You constantly lie. You are incapable of anything else.

      1. avatar James Campbell says:

        But lies are all he knows.
        Without those, he would have NOTHING to post on TTAG.

      2. avatar Datahut says:

        My interpretation of those first two paragraphs is he’s proposing supposition/argument on the part of the prosecution to counter what will obviously be equal supposition/argument on the part of the defense. Not a declaration of fact. Given the ‘facts’ I could think of a number of other not so far fetched proposals to the jury on both sides. The final question that makes all of these comments irrelevant is what the jury will think of the circumstances and motives. None of you will be on or would be chosen for that jury. Of course every circle I moved in during the O.J. trial said ‘guilty’. Conclusive evidence didn’t come until the civil proceedings. Whenever someone threatens me with some legal consequences, I just ask them what a jury would say and that’s the end of it.

        1. avatar Sam I Am says:

          I agree. No one should be permitted to voice an opinion on a controversial subject, until all the facts are available to everyone. Even then, any opinion contrary to the facts should be prohibited/suppressed.

          Oh, wait: disregard the above. I believe truth over facts. Anyone expressing an opinion contrary to truth is simply a nudnick.

        2. avatar Miner49er says:

          Very good Data, exactly.

          Unfortunately, many on this list feel threatened by the free exchange of ideas.

          They demand a rigid adherence to their particular narrative and tolerate no dissension or disloyalty to their cult.

    4. avatar Me says:

      “unassed the AO”

      Really getting into the Call of Duty Cold war Beta this weekend?

  18. avatar NORDNEG says:

    “””FREE KYLE”””

  19. avatar Montana Actual says:

    Here is a thought for Trump:

    Pardon this young man if he is convicted. We have already heard Trump refer to rittenhouse multiple times, and it’s pretty clear what he thinks about the situation. So stand by your voters, your pro 2A crowd, and pardon him if convicted. Immediately. Willing to bet if this young man and patriot is convicted, there will be more than riots to worry about. What should be done is take that larping setup you have if you are from wisconsin and setup camp where kyle will be tried and the state capital. “Peacefully” infiltrate both and do not leave without a fight. We all know there would be no fight. They don’t take the fight to those who actually can win. By they, I mean the left and tyrants.

    1. avatar Nanashi says:

      He can’t. PotUS can only pardon federal crimes.

  20. avatar strych9 says:

    “He also has a 2005 marijuana conviction which definitely gave him prohibited status.”

    This is why some of this shit is hard to take seriously. This statement is blatantly incorrect in a way that the author should be ashamed of.

    The BJS via ncrjs.gov reports

    “Under the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act of 1993 (Brady Act) as codified at 18 U.S.C. § 922(g)(3), being an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance prohibits a person from receiving firearms…”

    They then go on to state the stipulations for how long being a prohibited person lasts, of which there are three. These are the rules the FBI uses to run a NICS check.

    “Multiple arrests for use or possession of a controlled substance within the past 5 years if the most recent arrest occurred within the past year;

    Convictions for use or possession of a controlled substance within the past year (regardless of offense type)

    Certain convictions for possession of drug paraphernalia within the past year.”

    There are two further stipulations not related to arrest or conviction;

    “Persons who test positive for use of a controlled substance within the past year

    Persons who admit to the use of a controlled substance within the past year.

    [All above emphasis mine.]

    2005 is 15 years ago. That’s three times longer than he could be prohibited without subsequent convictions, positive drug tests in a governmental capacity or admission of drug use on a 4473.

    Seriously, this took me under a minute to run down. Do your homework a bit better. TTAG is supposed to be a reserve of useful information about things like this.

    1. avatar Miner49er says:

      But the truth would not serve the narrative of the ‘dirty drug abuser’ cancel culture character assassination.

      Come on man, you know how propaganda works!

      1. avatar jwm says:

        After reading all your comments we all know how propaganda works. You’re not good at it. but you keep swinging.

        Serious question. You’re actually a pro Trump man working to get him a second term, right?

        1. avatar James Campbell says:

          This seems to be the ONLY logical conclusion JWM.
          Whiner excels at making brain dead comments and postulating opinions that have ZERO basis in fact.
          Trump/Pence 2020

  21. avatar Ark says:

    Letting actual criminals walk free to preserve the case against a self-defender. The absolute state of the woke justice system.

    1. avatar Skunk says:

      They’ve destroyed education, journalism, movies, music, sports, the economy in general, and the criminal justice system. We already live in a banana republic, if you’re in doubt just look at the presidential debate moderators and their bias, no questions asked to Biden about the accusations of corruption, mail in ballots found dumped on the street or mailed to the wrong recipients…

  22. avatar Skunk says:

    What? I am shocked, do you see my face? How shocked I am? Ok you can’t see but trust me I did not expect that! It blew my mind and I am feeling confused, it’s probably how Ocasio Cortez feels every day, poor gal.

  23. avatar Tom Lindley says:

    Is this comment going to be deleted as well? Rittenhouse did nothing wrong. That commie that fired his gun, first, is just as, if not more responsible for the outcome of the events in Kenosha, then Kyle.

  24. avatar red wolf says:

    You guys worship at the feet of government(MUH THIN BLUE LINE!!!!), and now you’re helplessly whining about…government.

    😂😂😂

  25. avatar Bugei says:

    Gee, it sure seems that a US Attorney could charge felon-in-possession in FEDERAL court, thus sidestepping the local prosecutor. Add they’re apparently doing in Ohio, I noticed in another article.

  26. avatar Cadeyrn says:

    Time for the Feds to step in and do Project Exile or something similar under federal statute. Drug use is a huge federal no-no regardless of how many states have now legalized pot.

    By the way: aren’t all these states getting agitated about everything the same states that legalized pot? Maybe they skipped right over the mellow stage and went right to paranoid?

  27. avatar Burley says:

    It seems like the State of Winsconsin has made it clear that they are no longer interested in Justice. I’d say it is incumbent on the People of Wisconsin to remove these power-mad cretins from office, by force if necessary.

  28. avatar Artaxus Landreaver says:

    “Wisconsin Prosecutors Drop Charges Against First Shooter in Order to *Persecute* Kyle Rittenhouse”

    There, I fixed it for you…

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