President Donald Trump took aim at Virginia Democrats and their push to stiffen the state’s gun laws, saying that the U.S. Constitution was under attack just as thousands of armed militia members began arriving in Richmond for a Monday gun rally.
Trump doubled down with his support of gun enthusiasts in the state, which Hilary Clinton won in 2016 and where Democrats took full control of the state legislature for the first time in a generation in November, as candidates made passing stronger gun control laws a central campaign theme.
“Your 2nd Amendment is under very serious attack in the Great Commonwealth of Virginia,” Trump wrote in a post on Twitter Friday night, referring to the amendment in the Bill of Rights that gives Americans the right to keep and bear firearms. “That’s what happens when you vote for Democrats, they will take your guns away.”
I’m the chair of the Va House Public Safety Committee, the Committee he is referring. We WILL be bringing sensible gun violence prevention laws to Virginia. The voters have spoken. Thank you.
— Patrick Hope (@HopeforVirginia) January 17, 2020
The Virginia Senate late on Thursday passed bills to require background checks on all firearms sales, limit handgun purchases to one a month, and restore local governments’ right to ban weapons from public buildings and other venues.
– Brad Brooks in Ahead of tinder box Virginia gun rally, Trump says Constitution under attack
Civil War is not only inevitable but it’s coming now.
Between Virginia and the phony Trump impeachment the Stalinist Democrats have pushed to far.
Sanders People talking about Gulags and shooting Trump Supporters.
Might as well get it started so we can win and restore a Constitutional Govt.
Govt studies as far back as 1981 reveal the fact that the PEOPLE WILL WIN, the only variable in the various scenarios is how long it will take US. THIS is why they are so intent to grab our AR pattern rifles NOT handguns.
This is a battle for “hearts and minds”. Whoever throws the first punch is going to lose. I still think this whole affair in Virgina is a means of suckering us in to throwing that punch and you’re the target demographic of that campaign. Don’t play their game. We’re winning in Va. There’s no reason to go full retard.
It will be time to commence firing if the government actually attempts confiscation. We would have no other choice because, once successfully disarmed, we will suffer the same fate as the victims of Adolf Hitler, Joseph Stalin, and Chairman Mao regardless of legislative or judicial victories.
Virginians (and the rest of us) should prepare a plan now to successfully defend against confiscation by force of arms. Perhaps the pro-2A Sheriffs can assist.
Otherwise, keep lobbying, voting, litigating, ignoring demands for registration, and other civil disobedience against unconstitutional laws.
Once the State uses force; fire at will (preferably in a “regulated” manner).
California Richard is correct, 100% here.
If we have our rally and end up killing someone, it’s game over for us.
The anti gunners have to be allowed to throw the first punch.
The best outcome for our cause would be for our side would involve a sentinel event where the anti gunners are the clear Bad Guys to any outside observer.
Various government are already confiscating firearms from good people who have no criminal records and have no malicious intent.
Groom yourself, dress in a nice suit and tie, sling an unloaded rifle over your shoulder and on your back, then walk down the sidewalk on Wilshire Boulevard in California. Tell me that government agents (police) will not confiscate your rifle and imprison you.
Or, carry a concealed handgun without a California license and carry a sign which says, “I am a peaceful person with NO criminal record, I have NO malicious intent, I do NOT have a California concealed carry license, and I AM carrying a concealed handgun.” Tell me that government agents (police) will not confiscate your handgun and imprison you.
I could go on and on with example after example of where governments are SUCCESSFULLY confiscating firearms from good people with no violent criminal convictions and no malicious intent — even breaking down doors and invading homes to do it in some cases.
Face it: various governments are already disarming good, peace-loving people in our nation. Why is wide scale, public, door-to-door confiscation somehow a bridge too far?
I know you mean well. Please understand a critical fact: Progressives view us as evil deplorable people who deserve all the vitriol, hatred, violence, and government punishment that we receive. Many outside observers will consider gun-grabbers throwing the proverbial first punch as a long-overdue, righteous, justified action.
This all boils down to the fact that many people have depraved minds and are okay with any action which suppresses, silences, neutralizes, imprisons, and/or kills their political enemies. Tribalism is arguably one of the most defining factors of humans and it is responsible for billions of atrocities and murders throughout world history.
Our choices declare that we are not part of the Progressive Democrat (gun-grabber) tribe. As a result, they WILL come after us sooner or later. More and more events suggest that “sooner” may be it.
Depends upon where in CA you live, and which LEOs you come into contact with. If an officer or deputy doesn’t know you, you might have an issue. But if they do know you (a reason why smaller communities are better IMHO), you’re probably good to go. Those who are in my close circle of friends have told me they understand that people “need to do what they need to do”, and they don’t care if someone is carrying concealed for their own protection. After all, concealed means out of sight and hopefully never used, anyway. I myself carry whenever possible, though I have to weave my way around all the myriad state & county laws to do it as “legally” as I can. For example, as stupid as this may sound to those who live in Free America, if I carry my Baby Glock with the slide removed from the frame and on the opposite side of my body, it’s not a firearm under CA law (from what I understand of our law, plus what my LEO friends have told me is their understanding as well). If I’m ever in an unexpected dangerous situation – which has happened a few times in my life – it only takes me a few seconds to assemble, load, chamber, and re-conceal. I will not allow my wife to be exposed to possible harm just because the Leftards a few hundred miles away in their Sacramento ivory tower tell me they don’t trust me, despite having never met me.
Mad Max-“It will be time to commence firing if the government actually attempts confiscation.” This isn’t something they are going to do all at once. The core strategy of leftism is incrementalism. One piece at a time. If they go to fast or take to much in one bite it all comes tumbling down. Lets hope their tendency to get out over their ski’s is their downfull
“For example, as stupid as this may sound to those who live in Free America, if I carry my Baby Glock with the slide removed from the frame and on the opposite side of my body, it’s not a firearm under CA law (from what I understand of our law, plus what my LEO friends have told me is their understanding as well).”
Mark N, can you verify this?
If they keep doing it slow, we can continue to use the soap box, ballot box, and jury box, along with litigation to defeat them.
Stunts like Virginia Democrats are pulling will help us in the long run as long as we don’t actually have to shoot them.
@ I Haz A Question
“if I carry my Baby Glock with the slide removed from the frame and on the opposite side of my body, it’s not a firearm under CA law (from what I understand of our law, plus what my LEO friends have told me is their understanding as well)…”
This is at least the second time I have seen you pushing complete nonsense bullshit as CA law. These absurd “appeals to authority”, ie. my LEO friends, lend no credence to your claims which are factually untrue and if followed are likely to land someone in a heap of trouble.
Here is the relevant information that you could have found on your own in about 5 minutes had you bothered to look instead of asking your LEO friends who apparently know dick about the laws they are supposed to enforce.
A “firearm” is defined by federal statute –
18 U.S. Code § 921. Definitions:
(3) The term “firearm” means (A) any weapon (including a starter gun) which will or is designed to or may readily be converted to expel a projectile by the action of an explosive; (B) the frame or receiver of any such weapon; (C) any firearm muffler or firearm silencer; or (D) any destructive device. Such term does not include an antique firearm.
Take special note of (B), this applies to what you are describing. Now on to California law –
CA 25400 PC.
(a) A person is guilty of carrying a concealed firearm when the person does any of the following:
(1) Carries concealed within any vehicle that is under the person’s control or direction any pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person.
(2) Carries concealed upon the person any pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person.
(3) Causes to be carried concealed within any vehicle in which the person is an occupant any pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person.
(b) A firearm carried openly in a belt holster is not concealed within the meaning of this section….
(A) The pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person is loaded, or both it and the unexpended ammunition capable of being discharged from it are in the immediate possession of the person or readily accessible to that person.
So in short your pocket full of parts and bullets is still a loaded firearm according to the law.
This said, I support your right to carry your firearm in this absurd condition or in any other, whatever floats your boat. What I don’t support is your incessant supposing to know what a law you have very obviously never read says. So put your big boy pants on and reassemble your gun so that it will actually work if you should happen to need it as you will likely face criminal penalties should you be found to be carrying it in either condition.
You are wrong. Anyone who takes your right to protect yourself has “thrown the first punch”.
Winning? House, Senate, and Gov demoncrat. How is this winning,?
Riddle me this, then. Why is it that CA does not consider a disassembled AR as a firearm? In fact, the DFM (Drop-in Fixed Magazine) and Juggernaut solutions take specific advantage of this, in that the gun is not legally a firearm when the upper & lower (akin to a slide and frame) are not fully engaged and therefore not operable. CADOJ has publicly approved both of these solutions (among others) for just this reason.
Californians are specifically advised to disassemble non-compliant ARs or other guns when coming back from out of state, in order to avoid violation of CA’s gun laws.
Removing the slide from a Glock’s frame and placing it in a separate area does exactly the same thing. Read that long stretch of Penal Code again and consider just how much you yourself are the one peddling the BS.
CADOJ follows the BATFE definition of a firearm, which itself has been in trouble lately due to the recent slate of successful challenges to its wording. Serialization must be placed somewhere, so a handgun’s frame is where the ATF chose to define the default location. Same process as for any gun…the ATF had to choose some place to define as the “firearm”. However, Glock lowers encounter the same difficulties as AR lowers, in that they do not appear to fully possess the attributes defined in the regulations to be a “firearm”.
As I clearly stated in my comment further up this thread, I said all the LEOs I’ve ever had this conversation with have stated that they don’t care if an otherwise law-abiding citizen is carrying concealed, and certainly wouldn’t care if the gun was disassembled and in an unusable state. Your own mileage may vary, depending upon who you speak with or which cops you tangle with. So (1) I stand by my statement that this is my understanding and the understanding of the LEOs within my circle of friends.
The first rule of self defense is survival. You can’t argue to defend your rights if you’re dead.
@ I Haz a Question
As seems to be your standard operating procedure, you have completely and utterly failed to grasp what are really basic and fundamental concepts.
In CA a semi-automatic rifle or pistol with specified “evil” features is legally held to be an assault weapon. By separating the upper and lower, a semi-automatic rifle or pistol is no longer held to be semi-automatic, thereby rendering it exempt from regulations that apply to assault weapons.
California Code of Regulations Title 11, Division 5
(3) With regards to an AR-15 style firearm, if a complete upper receiver and a complete lower receiver are completely detached from one another, but still in the possession or under the custody or control of the same person, the firearm is not a semiautomatic
It is still a firearm, just not a semi-automatic firearm and therefore not an assault weapon.
You really need to pull your head out and stop relying on your drinking buddies for legal advice about firearms.
That PDF shows proposed regs. Go straight to the CA Penal Code for text of established law.
CA P.C., Pt 6, Title 1, Div. 2, DEFINITIONS, 16520(a)
“…“firearm” means a device, designed to be used as a weapon, from which is expelled through a barrel, a projectile by the force of an explosion or other form of combustion.”
Subsection (b) immediately following states that the “frame or receiver” is considered the firearm for the list of references below it, but (a) clearly states that CA considers a firearm to be a device that is capable of expelling a projectile. A disassembled gun is not capable of this.
Once again, I very clearly stated that this is my understanding as well as the understanding of the sworn officers with whom I’ve had this conversation. As you know, these are the people who will decide whether or not to arrest you if they believe you’ve committed a crime. So if all those LEOs with whom I’ve consulted say they don’t consider a disassembled gun to be a “firearm” that justifies their attention or an arrest, then that’s what they’ve said.
Furthermore, I very clearly stated that YMMV, and that you may encounter officers in urban areas who may interpret this differently and act accordingly.
Are you perhaps correct in your interpretation, based upon the PDF you dug up? Maybe yes. Am I perhaps correct in my interpretation based upon going to CA P.C. itself on the CA Gov website? Maybe yes. But since a cop would be making the decision to handcuff you, all I can say is that the cops I’ve questioned lean toward my interpretation, and told me they don’t consider a disassembled gun to be a threat. They may think differently if they patted down an arrested gang member and found a slide and frame on opposite sides of his body, but they told me they side with an otherwise law-abiding person’s need to protect himself, and if stepping into this gray area of rendering a firearm unusable (and arguing that it isn’t a functioning gun under the P.C.’s own Definitions), then so it.
I carry because I’ve been attacked over my lifetime by men and animals, and I absolutely saved my life on one occasion when I simply presented my gun to thwart four men who were converging on me. So I will do the legal tap dance and carry a separated gun with the intention of arguing my defense in court if ever necessary. After all…the ATF’s definition of an AR stood for many years, until it was recently (and successfully) challenged. Many of CA’s onerous gun laws are unconstitutional and are reversed or forced into revision because someone eventually challenges and argued against it.
If you choose not to “split carry”, then of course you don’t have to. But I noticed that you didn’t enter this conversation with the intention of merely presenting your interpretation with supporting links. You jumped in with name-calling and spite right off the bat. So for that reason I don’t consider you to be someone to listen to. If you had conducted yourself as an adult – even if we continued to disagree – I would have at least respected your ability to debate.
@ I Haz A Question
You seem unwilling to accept basic facts, and more than willing to to argue the one point on which I have already stated that we agree. So I will finish with this.
I support your right to carry any way you choose, absolutely and completely. Full Stop.
With respect to the law, you need to educate yourself as you are woefully ignorant of how law is written and implemented. The legislature passes a statute, or a proposition is passed at the ballot box. After a bill or proposition has become law, the Office of Administrative Law (OAL) implements the statute by issuing regulations that are to be enforced. There is a public comment period. Once finalized, however, those regulations are in effect “the law”. The PDF that I posted are those regulations as they pertain to CA “assault weapons” and their registration. Notice the very first words on the upper left corner of the page. You will see that these are the final regulations.
They make several things abundantly clear; among them are these:
1 – A semi-automatic firearm with a “fixed magazine” is not an “assault weapon”.
2 – A completely separated AR style upper and lower are not a “semi-automatic“ firearm and therefore not an “assault weapon”.
The devices you listed (DFM, Juggernaut Solutions) are methods to make a “fixed magazine” semi-automatic firearm that does not qualify as an “assault weapon” due to its having a ”fixed magazine”.
Complete disassembly of an AR style upper and a lower is an acceptable way to render your AR style firearm non “semi-automatic” and therefore not an “assault weapon”.
These are not methods to render them “not firearms”. If they were, then any criminal could simply disassemble their firearm in the few seconds that you claim it takes and avoid any any all firearms related charges. Surely even you can see that this is stupid.
These are not interpretations, or opinions, they are facts, written in plain English text, facts that you refuse to accept or refuse to read due to the lack of pictures, presumably because I violated your safe space. Perhaps after you have had some warm milk and time to color with crayons you will be able to rethink your absolutely idiotic belief that your Glock is not a firearm if the slide is removed, and that the opinions of your “circle of friends” will be of any value whatsoever in a courtroom.
But whether or not you are able to swallow your pride and learn something is of secondary concern to me. Of first concern is your incessant dissemination of false, ridiculously false, and absolutely absurd statements about California law. Most Californians do not live wherever it is that you and your good ole’ boys club of legal geniuses live. If people believe the garbage that you refer to as ”your understanding of CA law”, and put it into practice, they will put themselves into legal jeopardy, so STOP IT! Really, I mean it, STOP IT!
Given that reading comprehension is clearly and issue for you, here is a link to the CRPA assault weapon webinars. There are several. Please view them. It’s important that you actually understand what you are talking about.
Believe me, the CRPA is the last place I’d reference for correct information. One of their spokesmen publicly stated last year that it’s a felony under state law for a California hunter to return across state lines with even a single unused cartridge. That’s false. As per amended P.C. 30368(b)(15), the ammo importation restrictions do not apply to:
“A licensed hunter who purchased the ammunition outside of this state for use in a lawful hunting activity that occurred outside of this state if the person brings or imports no more than 50 rounds into this state and the ammunition is designed and intended for use in the firearm the hunter used in that hunting activity.”
They also made the statement that it’s illegal for a Californian to take ammo out of state, shoot some of it, and bring the unused leftovers back home because the act of bringing something inbound constitutes “importing”. If this were true, then every time I visit NV or AZ and return home, I’m re-importing my vehicle and guns and must re-register them, since CA law requires registration of all imported vehicles and guns. Per Oxford, Mirriam-Webster, and Black’s Law dictionaries, “import” means introduction from a foreign source. Something that originates with you within CA (on which you already paid taxes or registration) and simply accompanied you on your travels is not imported.
There’s more, but I need to get ready for work, and I don’t think you’ll care anyway.
If you’re so easily upset about a source you believe may be giving erroneous information, it’s ironic that you choose to castigate me here where practically nobody (but you) cares what I say, while championing an organization that has provided certifiably false info.
And remember, this all started because I mentioned something that was my understanding based upon my research as well as the LEOs I’ve questioned about the matter. I also stated that you yourself might find other LEOs that would tell you differently. I said this now three times. I also mentioned that I believe I’m correct, but allowed for the possibility that you’re correct. But you won’t budge and continue to berate to make yourself feel superior, so there’s no point in further discussion with a brick wall.
Anyhow, I need to warm up my milk and take out my crayons as I get ready for work. Have a nice day.
I’d be interested in links to those studies.
I would like to see those studies too.
The numbers seem to substantiate the claim that the people will win though.
With 660,000 in law enforcement, 1.2 million active duty military, and 800,000 reservists; a maximum of 2.66 million are available to the government. Many of these forces will join the people’s side and bring their arms and armaments with them.
On the people’s side, we start with the 3% theory at 9.84 million. There are over 130 million gun owners.
The people’s forces need “regulating” to be successful.
You are wasting your time asking for a link to the studies they cite.
University of Hawaii study on Democide.
Why do you think they have all the Military and all of Law Enforcement?
As for the Virginia NG, you’re going to send them to take guns away from themselves, family and friends? Bullshit I’m not buying it.
Frankly if it goes Boogaloo do they realize the NG may in fact use their weapons against the State of Virginia? Not that far fetched.
Democrats have stripped off their clothes and are running naked for the finish line.
They are out numbered on Lobby Day. Do THEY really want to go there? There will be no turning back if Civil War is ignited. It will spread across the country. You won’t put it back in the bottle.
I didn’t say that they would have all of military or law enforcement.
“Many of these forces will join the people’s side and bring their arms and armaments with them.”
I expect between 40% and 60% defection from the military and law enforcement (likely more from the military side).
Mad Max I meant that as a general statement it was not directed at you.
I think we have a number greater than 60% of the Military.
As for Law Enforcement in many areas you have a bunch of Jackbooted Thugs with a badge. Many parts of the country you have those who support and would honor their Oath to the Constitution. It is encouraging when you see Sheriffs in blue states like Colorado and Virginia who say they will support the 2nd Amendment.
It could come down to Badge vs Badge.
The Democrats are really gambling. Northam is an arrogant ass. We are dealing with someone who things it’s ok to kill a baby after birth just like the NAZIS.
The National Guard will not want to perpetrate another Kent State incident, and go down in history as the bad guys who stormed lawful gun owners defending their constitutional rights. They’ll hold themselves back.
California definition of firearm: https://www.shouselaw.com/firearm-definition
Be wary about using Shouse as a source for your info. They’re often incorrect. For example, the page you linked states:
“A person may legally own a gun [in CA] if he has a valid handgun safety certificate,…”
This is absolutely false. A person must take a test to obtain a BFSC in order to purchase or transfer thru an FFL per CA law, but there is absolutely no license requirement to simply own a gun. Otherwise, all the gun owners who purchased, received, or assembled their guns before respective cut-off dates (such as myself) would all be criminals now.
Not now you won’t. The modern surveillance state has put an end to any hope of freedom.
@I Haz a Question:
Thanks Haz, I stand/sit corrected. I had no idea the source google gave me was suspicious.
No. As stated before, there are not very many neutral people. Most folks have already made up their minds one way or the other. The whole III% movement has its name because only ~3% of the population participated in the American Revolution. Moreover, the left controls the media and will always win the propaganda battle by spinning the reporting of events to fit their narrative. We will always be painted as the bad guys anyway.
The soap box has been ignored.
The ballot box has been rigged.
The jury box has been bought.
And that leaves only the cartridge box.
The longer we allow this to continue, the more legitimate it becomes in the minds of the people and the weaker our position comes.
What needs to happen is the crowds to knock down the flimsy temporary fence and storm the capitol building and forcibly evict any politicians found inside. If this requires shots to be fired, so be it. But I’m betting the police won’t be willing to go “Rules of Engagement” on a much larger crowd of their own citizens who are all armed and equipped for battle.
How can the Jury Box be “bought?” It only takes 1 juror who abides by the Constitution, instead of the Judge’s instructions, to hang a jury. The reason jury nullification is seldom used today is simply that jurors aren’t taught their rights and duties, and judges lie to them about it when giving the jury their instructions prior to deliberation. The Fully Informed Jury Association (FIJA) has lots of data available for free download and public distribution on their website. They have also been advocating for decades for a law requiring judges to correctly inform jurors of their right to nullify bad laws before deliberation. Don’t count the jury box out just because it hasn’t been tried much yet. Given the number of pro-constitution folks in Virginia’s jury pool, it should be very likely that there will be at least one such person on most juries trying cases arising from these new unconstitutional laws.
So why has there not been a spike in applications for NFA stamps?
It’s not “Civil War”. Those of us in the North stand with our brothers in the South on this one.
Think Hansobs. The local solution to a National problem.
Correct,if there is to be a coming Boogaloo it won’t be north and south,it will be the Left versus Americans.
You refer to Stalinist Democrats, well ever since the USSR came apart I’ve thought that the Democrats DID hire ex-Soviets as advisors on techniques and the act of disinformation of repeating a lie often enough that it is believed. Another clue is the way at an hour’s notice every Democrat can be parroting the exact same buzz words. When was the last time you heard ALL national Republicans repeating exactly the same words on a Sunday morning show? I think it took about a week to hire them. For all, I know Jessica Tarlov is the offspring of one of them.
“your” second amendment rights?….”our” would have sounded better…..
“Between Virginia and the phony Trump impeachment the Stalinist Democrats have pushed to far.”
You ain’t seen nuthin yet. Just wait until these people really seize power. They’ll never let go.
Let’s look at some proposals from the folks that say Trump is trying to “shred our institutions.”
Pack Congress (with democrats) by creating more states.
Pack the Supreme Court (with democrats) by adding more Justices
So it’s past time for liberals and the left to consider court packing: When they next have control of the House, the Senate, and the White House, Democrats should add at least two new seats to the Supreme Court and then fill them, ideally, with left-wing, well-qualified women of color. They could even call it “court balancing.”
“We The People Should Throw Out The Constitution”
These things will get the Democrats a revolutionary response.
If Trump had any real balls he would tell the NG to stand down ahead of time.
But he won’t. I fear all sides will be watching this to point fingers and further divide our nation.
Not time yet.
If Northam calls them up against gun owners, Trump can nationalize them and order them to stand down.
This is the crux of it.
Until the Virginia National Guard is Nationalized by the president for some Constitutional reason Trump has no authority over them, their are a State military force under the control of their governor.
But if the need arises to nationalize them on this account the first thing they should do is surround the State house and governor’s mansion and take those politicians under arrest who voted for these unconstitutional laws for violations of Virginians civil rights and violations of the 14th amendment as well.
It is unfortunate, perhaps, that there is no federal law against being stupid.
18 USC 242
Maj Gen Timothy Williams has told Northam to “stuff it”.
“Maj Gen Timothy Williams has told Northam to “stuff it”.”
I may have missed something but that seems to be an article written anonymously by a supposed guardsman. Where does it say anything about a Major General?
I see that they need to be mobilized. Maybe he can send out a memo telling the NG units in all states that they should not obey Unconstitutional laws?
They already took an oath to that memo. Unlike the Governor, those Guardsman didn’t see it as a mere formality.
Dems are like a child blowing up a balloon. They keep going, keep adding pressure, until it blows up in their face. Then, like a child, they’ll be surprised and start to cry.
And like most coddling, well intentioned, ignorant American parents, those people will be picked up by ignorant well intentioned liberals and told “everything is going to be alright”…… Liberalism has gotten as big as it is based on the vast numbers of ignorant well intentioned Americans who just want to “help people”…… and we’ll be painted as the meanie mean heads.
Well… as long as the child doesn’t release more than one balloon per hour, everything should be ok
trump is an anti gun dem. he is only seeking votes.
His proposals and actions are not exactly in line with the typical anti gun dem.
The bump stock thing was/is a fiasco, but I don’t remember the dems screaming for it to be banned. I think most people didn’t know about it until the Vegas shooting.
The only other thing I’m aware of is the dumb comment about the red flag laws. Has that been pursued since? Any action? Please list the policies he has in common with the typical anti gun dem.
Keeping the BATF on a leash would’ve helped his pro-2a stance. But nope. I’m not a fan of Trump, but he is 1000% better than HRC would have been.
I still believe that the bump stock ban was written to fail judicial review purposefully.
Time will tell….
Perhaps and only if RBG fully reverts back to dust before the Dems take back presidency and congress and do their court packing.
I think if we can get a true majority conservative Supreme Court before packing is attempted, the Supreme Court itself can nullify the effects of any attempt at court packing (but not court packing itself) through their own internal rules, policies, and procedures (Congress has no control over the inner workings of the Supreme Court as it is an independent, co-equal, branch of government).
I think his actions are in line with a democrat running as a republican. He can’t go full gun control and will ease restrictions on things that don’t actually give us more freedom but will push gun control where he thinks he can get away with it.
Just because the democrats have gone full socialist does not mean you can point to them and act like that’s all the democrats are. The republicans are becoming the old school dems and everyone is acting like the dems have always been bernie warren types.
So no list of common policies?
Just a couple of offhand tough talk comments? But no push for these policies officially or continued advocating for it in the media and at rallies? So you think he’s a double agent sent in from old school democrats to eventually take your rights away?
What are you talking about? He is a Business democrat from 30 years ago. Literally. Just because you run as a republican does not mean you are pro small government and freedom.
All he has done is say he is pro gun. It’s all fudd stuff though.
Fix nics, bumpstock bans, red flag laws. Also the surveillance state, taxes are worse. He is still spending like crazy. He is a democrat. If that is what a republican is too you then there is zero point in voting for either party.
Also now the reformation has been redefined and the shotgun from fostech. I put this stuff squarely at trump’s feet
He could have made a pro gun at. He just a real bad appointee.
Let’s stay on topic or people might mistake you for Vlad.
How does this affect you? This is about penalizing GOVERNMENT agencies that screw up in reporting.
We already covered this one.
“Red flag laws”
You haven’t heard that this is off the table? Where have you been? You think Trump is pushing for this?
Fucktard, 70% of the federal budget is stuff Trump can’t touch. He’s “spending like crazy” on things which are the legitimate concern of the federal government. This is why libertarians are just as bad as commies.
So Trump is in favor of more deep state spying. Interesting.
“taxes are worse”
Your taxes went up? You’re in the minority there.
“spending like crazy”
Do you miss those real fiscal conservatives like Paul Ryan that was on a mission to decrease spending? How’d he do with that? The dems let Trump get some of what he wants as long as they get some of what they want. Otherwise, it’s a standoff and the government shuts down. It was a political calculation to not shut down the government again this time.
Biatec, you are absolutely correct. Astute observation.
The best defense against unconstitutional red flag laws is a conservative judiciary. We won’t get that by voting dem or third party.
Dude. I never said I liked Paul Ryan. I don’t understand your defense of Trump. Any answers I have been given for Bumpstocks just confirm he is anti gun or people will vote for him either way.
It’s not off the table when Trump says things like take the guns first and due process later. He has a set an anti gun culture in government. I don’t even know what you are arguing at this point?
All you have confirmed to me is there is no point in voting at all actually. Yes upper middle class taxes went up after removal of itemization stuff. I know lots of people who had to pay more. Even Reid Henrichs at valor ridge payed more.
(Youtuber who does training ) started watching him after he brought paul howe on.
Yes Trump should have shut down the government over fix nics. The only position should be that the nics system can not work. It can’t. That is a fact.
idk why pwrserge said what he said I never said he could change the spending bill?
Anyway this is going nowhere dude. All Trump had to do was not add to gun control. He pushed for it. I’m done with him.
I’m not sure at all what you are arguing. If it’s simply he is better than the current democrats I don’t care. I’m definitely not voting dem but I can’t support Trump either.
One more thing. The fact you compared me to Vlad is disgusting and just confirms you are not interesting in real discussion are going to keep goal post moving without actually refuting anything I say. Instead you argue against me throwing paul ryan at me or comparing me to vlad. It’s gross.
He should not have done the things he did. There is no legitimate defense of it. I thought he may be a step in the right direction when I voted for him.
“It’s not off the table when Trump says things like take the guns first and due process later.”
That was an offhand, blustery comment. What has been done since? Any meaningful push? He literally said recently that any legislation on more background checks is off the table.
“Yes upper middle class taxes went up after removal of itemization stuff. I know lots of people who had to pay more.”
You know who’s taxes also went up? Upper class folks with high state taxes. Folks like Reid are in the minority since he’s in a low tax state. He must have some pretty big mortgages. But your taxes didn’t go up? Most went down, but you would prefer the alternative?
“Yes Trump should have shut down the government over fix nics. The only position should be that the nics system can not work. It can’t. That is a fact.”
Are you arguing against Fix NICS or NICS in general? To remove NICS entirely is a different discussion from removing Fix NICS. Otherwise your left with just NICS which has been proven to only work sometimes.
“He pushed for it. I’m done with him. If it’s simply he is better than the current democrats I don’t care. I’m definitely not voting dem but I can’t support Trump either.”
Two words: conservative judiciary.
“One more thing. The fact you compared me to Vlad is disgusting and just confirms you are not interesting in real discussion are going to keep goal post moving without actually refuting anything I say. Instead you argue against me throwing paul ryan at me or comparing me to vlad. It’s gross.”
Go back and read your comments. We were talking about gun control and YOU changed the subject to taxes, spending, etc. The Paul Ryan comment was about you complaining that Trump was a big spending democrat. That’s exactly what Vlad does. I was only responding to YOUR “goal post moving.”
Biatec slapped both of you retarded apologists so hard with a heavy hand of logic that all we saw was a cloud of orange dust fly from your mouths. *tread harder daddy*
Says the guy that advocated voting for Bernie as a strategy for gun rights. You and Biatec are birds of a feather. And I don’t apologize for anyone. I call it as I see it. I’m not a partisan or a one issue voter. Don’t worry. We’ll do the heavy lifting for getting that conservative judiciary while you and Biatec stay home (or vote for Bernie) and complain.
“limit handgun purchases to one a month”
So criminals can only purchase one per month? So this will stop criminals from committing the dreaded one gun per hand holdup (unless they wait another 4 weeks before committing said crime)?
Yep, just like shooting someone being a Felony will stop the criminals from doing so and Drugs being illegal will stop people from using or possessing them………Brilliant
Gun control is never aimed at criminals. It’s passed to make criminals out of us.
“Commonsense gunviolence prevention measures” means simply “taking power from the people by disarming them”. Anything to make gun ownership more expensive, burdensome, legally dangerous and onerous helps to shrink the number of people who will bother.
Dude, of course not, criminals already have one gun and only need purchase another. Or, they can save the money and borrow the 2nd gun from a criminal friend. No brainier, criminals don’t care about laws even those regulating gun purchases. Besides, who thinks they purchase guns as in, go shopping at a gun store FFL!
No, the new rule only applies to purchases, you can still STEAL as many handguns as you can carry so, therefore criminals should be just fine…
Now that we know that nobody will be allowed on the capital grounds with a firearm, and will be funneled through metal detectors and wands, what are they going to do? I read a lot of tough talk here about “revolution” and “civil war” … what are you/they going to do? Will you go and start shooting at the police or other law enforcement agencies? Is it the goal to attack the capital and occupy it and start killing legislators who vote for an assault rifle ban?
I hope cooler heads prevail.
Take a look at the VCDL website. They are organized and have a cool plan. Trump is right about the 2020 elections. Hopefully VA citizens initiate civil disobedience, refuse to comply, and then vote these twits out. If we can have a bloodless revolution like the founders intended with the founding documents I’m all for it.
I hope the refrain, “We won’t get fooled again” is on the mind of every freedom loving VA resident at the next round of elections. If this rouses the lazy and apathetic it will be a good thing.
It wasn’t apathy and laziness on the part of voters that got us into this mess.
1) We got boned in a gerrymandering case that saw the lines redrawn. Once that happened, Big Daddy Bloombucks and his ilk poured millions into Dem campaigns.
2) A lot of us didn’t have anybody to vote for as Dems ran unopposed in several races around the state.
I hope we can vote these shitheads out but I’ll settle for a good old fashioned tar and feather party if that fails.
That comes form a song written by Peter Townshend of the Who. It illustrates the futility of it all. I hope POTG can make a more positive change. Here are the lyrics:
“Won’t Get Fooled Again”
We’ll be fighting in the streets
With our children at our feet
And the morals that they worship will be gone
And the men who spurred us on
Sit in judgement of all wrong
They decide and the shotgun sings the song
I’ll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
Then I’ll get on my knees and pray
We don’t get fooled again
The change, it had to come
We knew it all along
We were liberated from the fold, that’s all
And the world looks just the same
And history ain’t changed
‘Cause the banners, they are flown in the last war
I’ll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
Then I’ll get on my knees and pray
We don’t get fooled again
I’ll move myself and my family aside
If we happen to be left half alive
I’ll get all my papers and smile at the sky
Oh I know that the hypnotized never lie
There’s nothing in the streets
Looks any different to me
And the slogans are replaced, by the bye
And a parting on the left
Is now a parting on the right
And the beards have all grown longer overnight
I’ll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
Then I’ll get on my knees and pray
We don’t get fooled again
Don’t get fooled again
Meet the new boss
Same as the old boss
The idea of controlled entry and wanding thousands of potentially armed people is almost hilarious. The people that will submit themselves to that weren’t planning on harming anyone. If there are the number of patriots that we expect to be there, that entry control point won’t be controlling anyone.
This is not the time for armed insurrection. This is a time to make it known that there are lots of capable people that view this legislatures proposals as tyrannical. It’s an opportunity to turn that tyranny around.
If the time to use those arms ever comes, it won’t matter what the rules are in the square. The people will enter if they really want too.
” Now that we know that nobody will be allowed on the capital grounds with a firearm, and will be funneled through metal detectors and wands, what are they going to do? ”
Easy. All the cops will be watching the front door where the metal detectors are. So go around back with some bolt cutters and open up the fence.
President Trump the President who illegally enacted a gun control law and publicly stated he didn’t like silencers and wanted to get rid of them. Pshhh
He needs to look in the mirror on this topic because he’s not much better.
When this is all over, Northam should be hung.
Sic semper tyrannis.
The discussion with my teenage daughter was one that involved Feathers & liberal amounts of tar.
I see what you did there…
I think we can all agree on that Max !!
I am going out on a very long limb here…but please hear me out.
Almost all of the attention that the “mainstream media” is “ginning up” is directed at the purposely and dishonestly mischaracterized 2nd Amendment advocates, describing them as”right wing gun nuts” while ignoring the communist left and “antifa” groups.
Let’s not forget that these left-wing groups do not want their 2nd Amendment rights taken away from them either.
It would be a refreshing change to see BOTH the conservative groups and left-wing groups JOIN and go after the real problem-the government officials pushing their ant-2nd Amendment agenda.
Stranger things have occurred…
You aren’t going out on a limb at all. They’re using the white supremacist angle to scare people. This protest has absolutely nothing to do with white supremacy. It’s about equal rights. We get to have what they get to have.
I hear Antifa is coming to protest against gun control.
According to the Constitution, non-prohibited members of Antifa have as much of a right to keep and bear arms as I, or any of you, do.
“…as thousands of armed militia members began arriving in Richmond for a Monday gun rally.”
The leftists are masters of twisting and manipsnating words. They have their narrative and will do and say anything to push it.
Are they going to use the same Demoncrap people counters they used at the President’s inauguration to count the “armed militia members” converging on VA’s Capitol? Doesn’t seem that they are.
Since the object is to scare the hell out of the suburban moms, it would be to their advantage if the media inflated the numbers as much as possible.
This is a statement of truth…..any vote, for any democrat, at any level of government is a vote to end the 2nd Amendment. Gun owners need to understand this, accept it, and deal with it at the voting booth……and yes…they want your pump action Duck gun too…….and yes, they want your bolt action deer rifle too….. both of which are actually Military Grade weapons…since they are both in active service with the U.S. military. That is the little thing they won’t tell you hunters when they say you can keep your shotgun and rifle……
It would be INCREDIBLE if the POTUS would make time in his schedule for even a brief visit to the rally.
That would be a Secret Service nightmare.
Could be a nightmare or while standing amid thousands of armed Patriots becomes the most protected individual on earth.
Though, I suspect the Secret Service wouldn’t want to test it.
I agree Hankus but there is no way to make it secure without making a spectacle of himself.
I never voted. I Never said a prayer other than when my sons where born but I just got my voter registration card and I will be praying for this to end peacefully and in our favor. I would go to Va on monday but I’ve got a union meetingand a weld test possibly leading to a shot at work at the 2nd cracker plant and I have to take it. A vote and a prayer are all I can offer but if I get on at the Cracker plant I’ll donate 20x what I already have to vcdl and goa.
You have a choice to vote for a leftist gun-grabbing Democrat, Trump, some other candidate from a third party that has no chance of winning, or not voting.
Voting for the Democrat or the third party candidate or not voting are surely a vote for gun control and against liberty. A vote for Trump; not so much.
Voting 3rd party(your conscience) is the only way to send a message in Dem states. Freedom and/or liberty will not come without changing the 2 major political parties.
It’s also another way to put the Dem in office that’ll REALLY teach em a lesson, yep, you really showed that Dem, I bet that strategy is WAY up there on the Leftists list of shit to fear….
Nah. In deep blue states and cities, your vote matters not at all. There are more than enough surplus progbot voters to drown out you and everyone you know.
In that case, you’re a free agent. Opt out entirely — or vote for whichever candidate will piss off the proggies the most — whichever you prefer. In my state, where even a corpse with a Democrat tag on its toe would get 65% of the vote, I can do whatever I want. I plan to vote for Trump not because my vote matters, but just to piss people off.
MAD MAX spot on again !! Trump is the only reasonable choice . At least he’s predictable.
I’m not so sure he is a reasonable or predictable choice but he is the only choice (unless Wayne LaPierre somehow gets the Democratic nomination – but I think Trump would still be the better bet).
This was a poorly worded header for your article.
Brad Brooks of Reuters writes
“Supporters say more restrictive laws would help decrease the number of people killed by guns each year. Gun-rights activists assert that the constitution guarantees their right to possess any firearm.”
NO, Mr Brooks, Gun-rights activists assert that the more restrictive laws would NOT help decrease the number of people killed by guns each year. We have plenty of statistics and anecdotal evidence to back that up. The law makes know this to be true and pass the useless laws anyway. Oh, and assert that the constitution “recognizes” their right to possess any firearm and prohibits the government from doing just what they are doing anyway.
“Reduce the number of people killed by guns.” “Reduce gun violence”. It’s all lies. If they *really* wanted these things, they would be looking for ways to reduce the number of people killed (including or primarily non-gun suicides, swimming pool accidents, medical errors, and so on), or reducing violence and attitudes that commonly lead to violence in general. No, they are really only saying that they do not trust you to own a gun, it is too much responsibility for any individual. While all the real mass murders in history have been committed by governments, not individuals.
The simple fact is we need to make shit roll down hill. ALL of our efforts should focus on changing the viewpoint of ONE man. POTUS. When he gets on something he makes the right phone calls. 24/7/365 the White House phones should be melted over 2A issues.
Once we loose them, in whatever way that happens, it will be nearly impossible to get them back. Legally that is.
The only thing I disagree with is the one handgun a month ban. This is ridiculous because if you pass the background check it should not matter if you want to buy more than one handgun. This will hurt the gun business not so much because they will put a second gun away for you I am sure if you pay for it in advance but it will hurt gun shows tremendously. But then again that was probably the idea they had when they past it as the State would love to ban all gun shows which is strange since they now have the universal back ground check law.
Excellent points! If a person buys a gun on June 4 and then goes to a gun show on the 20th, he can’t legally make another gun purchase until July 1………..this ain’t good!
That’s why it was removed from Virginia law back when. It just doesn’t make sense and doesn’t solve anything.
to Vlad Tepes
I glad you support making people like Carol Bowne in NJ waiting up to 30 days to get a gun. In fact its way past 30 days and she still waiting to get her firearm and permit.
“Bowne finally decided she needed more protection in her life so she applied for a Permit to Purchase a Pistol. New Jersey law states that a Pistol Permit is to be issued or denied within a 30 day time period. 42 days after applying for a Pistol Permit, Bowne was slaughtered by Michael Eitel in her driveway. The restraining order she applied for, her pleas to the police and her application for a pistol did not protect her while Eitel stabbed her to death. Bowne was never issued her NJ permission.”
That’s what happens when you vote for Democrats, they take your gunms. Not second amendment, gunms,. Both sides are playing POTG as fools if you ask me
A good thing they can’t trick marsupials… 😉
You cannot blame the News Media or the Government from wanting to stop another Nazi type rally and killing that took place in Charlottesville. With the arrest of Right Wing Paramilitary Lunatics that confessed now to the Government that they were on there way to commit mass murder against Anti-Fa the News Media was correct in warning everyone that was going to attend the rally.
It was announced this morning some of the counter protest people have pulled out of attending the rally because of all the Paramilitary Lunatics headed for the rally to commit mass murder.
If anything all this only gave Northam even more excuses to pass his anti-gun bills and they have now passed the Senate. All the threats simply backfired on the nut cases in the Far Right that were threatening violence. And of course the rally has not been held yet so violence could still indeed happen.
cut and paste…really???
at least try to strive being a good forum idiot!
What a great leader. His statement was so powerful it has inspired all the “patriots” to stand up to the tyranny. It was way better than Lincoln did.
There are some excellent points here about not throwing the first punch or being suckered into a fight. But the sad truth is that the fake news media and democrat propagandists always take this line ,,,, a democrat useful idiot assaults a senior citizen conservative, knocks him to the ground, and stomps on him. The propagandists report that the senior citizen started the fight.
It could go down that way, but the call has already gone out to keep your cell phones as accessible as your sidearms. If the scenario you describe is recorded from 15 different angles and goes up on YouTube, not much the MSM can say about it.
“Is it the goal to attack the capital and occupy it and start killing legislators who vote for an assault rifle ban?
Cool !!!! I’m getting the popcorn ready. We will see live history happen 🙂
Mua’Dib from Dune said it best: “We have entered the time when all will turn against us and seek our lives”
Virginia Government has become what is called “Conduct Unbecoming” ?! In the eyes of the PEOPLE, against the CONSTITUTION ?!!!
They are not upholding their OATH to the PEOPLE of Virginia and the UNITED STATES !!! WE THE PEOPLE denounce your Authority as the voice of OUR RIGHTS !!!!
LOVE AND RESPECT TO THE TRUE BELIEVERS OF THE CONSTITUTION AS IT IS INTENDED TODAY AND IN HISTORY PAST !
Remember, If a politician can’t trust us with a firearm, l how can we trust them with our vote. Research facts, every large metro area / city under democrat control has high crime, poverty, corruption and excessive taxes. This will continue as long as people keep voting democrat. Unfortunately I believe that in the future as in the past, only real change comes out of the barrel of a gun.
You are aware that some of the powers the governor is using came from Republicans?
misusing… you misspelled “misusing”
I’m sure some are, but laws are like weapons, they can be used for good or evil. IMO, while legislators are crafting a bill, they should focus not on what good it would do, but how it could be abused.
See….. this is where you and the Democrats are WRONG!!
Trying to usurp the constitution is treason!!!
They cannot attempt to enact laws that go against the constitution…..
IT’S IDIOTS WHO THINK THEY CAN ENACT LAWS THAT FLY IN THE FACE OF THE CONSTITUTION WHO ARE CAUSING THIS WHOLE DEBACLE….
Can the governor and/or legislators be recalled in Virginia?
The numbers required will not allow for it to happen because Republicans didn’t show up to vote. He is there until his term is up or he dies.
I’m aware of at least two that are occurring. One has already been filed in Augusta County Civil Division on 27 December. I haven’t recently heard about the status of the second.
Virginia is being used as a testing lab to see how far the communist can push until the common pesants pushes back.
Virginia – a stronghold of God, Family, Guns, kissing cousins and Ford trucks represents a good testing media for an eventual confiscation program communist forces have in mind.
Little or no resistance in Virginia would be a good analysis of how things would go in the rest of the country, if Full On confiscation ever materializes. (except Texas)
It’s all just a Shit Show for now. Secure your weapons, stop talking about how you are going to take up arms against these communist, and remember it was Big Money (Soros) who got this idiot puppet Governor into office. Every time you talk big and post a reply, trust me – notes about you are being taken!
Organize with family, close friends, your church and others of like mind, and do it quietly!
Make them do something really stupid to draw you out of the woodwork. Give them no ammo to work with, no data to trend for an eventual operational plan for confiscation.
The communist have launched a reconnaissance mission in Virginia, seeking a model for a National Firearm Confiscation Plan. Gun owners in Virginia are under a microscope now, your thoughts and words are being analyzed, and an attack plan against you (all of us) is being built.
One more thing – stop calling these people liberals! They are all grown up now, and have matured into Full Blown Communist.
They ain’t hiding it anymore.
They hate you.
They hate America.
They hate our Constitution.
They hate our Christian Nation God.
They hate babies.
They hate anything pure, clean, wholesome.
When the old Soviet union collapsed in the late 1990s, these communist thugs didn’t really go away, they simply went into hiding.
Looking for an easy front into reestablishing themselves elsewhere, they discovered the U.S. Democratic Party offered the least resistance of any other worthwhile government worth the effort in taking.
For the last Thirty years, they have been steadily destroying all we hold dear. Very quietly, taking very small bites, they have been eating us alive…..
All the while weaving their communist agendas deeply into our Republic.
Right now there are only two strongholds holding them back from achieving their heavenly goals – President Donald Trump and your guns!
They know that another four years of President Trump, most of them will either be suicided, or in jail.
One massive front has been launched against Trump, and the other is powering up more each day – guns and gun owners.
With these two baracades out of the way, we are finished as a Republic.
Put your fears and cares into the hands of God. This is what he’s waiting for. He loves to Show Off, but first needs our faith and hope directed at him, so nobody can deny his involvement in the matter when he moves against these demonic forces against us.
The only way he’ll let us fall is if we continue to do things our way. This country was established with him at the helm. He’s not giving up what’s his so long as we don’t take it away from him, and let the enemy freely have it. ( like we’ve been doing)
””””””””””””””””””Virginia is being used as a testing lab to see how far the communist can push until the common pesants pushes back.””””””””””””””””’
You live in your own prejudiced myopic world. During the last two years similar laws have been passed in other States and some by Republican Governors, you conveniently forgot to mention that.
Must have stomped on a nerve. Sorry you’re offended by facts pertaining to matters in Virginia.. (stay on subject please)
Yes, there are some traitors among us. Yes there are some communist dressed in Republican Conservative clothes that feel safe going naked now, but as the swamp drains, they can no longer run from their fate of being unemployed, in jail, or suicided along with the rest of the enemy.
About now, all the communist agenda supporting Republicans have been outed. Hopefully come election time, those that remain will be under spotlight and in full view for all to see.
Those still standing with Trump now appear to be with him to the end. The Swamp Scum on top are only treading water now. No longer mixed with the good water down below.
Yes….. very well said!
Listen to this guy…. this is exactly what is happening….. it’s way more nefarious than just taking guns from some hicks in Virginia….
THIS IS A TEST!!!!
Russian freedom Novelist Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn said this about getting sentenced to hard time in the gulags:
“During my time in the camps, I had got to know the enemies of the human race quite well: they respect the big fist and nothing else; the harder you slug them, the safer you will be.”
It would be nice if the good people of Washington State could get some recognition and press. They are trying to essentially pass all of the same laws here right now. Yet VA is dominating the news cycle not a mention from Trump or anybody.
The president has spoken on this more than casually interesting matter. Talk, is has been noted, is cheap. Let’s see what action might be had, assuming that presidential action is possible or appropriate.
At some point, I expect Constitutional Law to come into effect in Virginia.
This idiot governor is is poking a very large bear with such a tiny stick. Absolutly killing the chances of Communist Democrat incumbents making any headway in next elections, except in Communist controlled states.
And with that, I doesn’t really matter. Those states have already separated themselves from the rest of the Republic anyway…
They have failed to cut off the head of King Trump with the first blow. His retaliation will be on his timeline, his battlefield, and by his rules.
He is a multi level Chess Player. I guarantee snares and traps are already in play.
He will unleash when and where least expected, and with perfect timing.
I can seriously envision a complete lockdown on D.C. With U.S.Marshals and military elements making arrest…
It’s coming ,,,,
There are always collaborators military and police
Ordinary Men: Reserve Police Battalion 101 and the Final Solution in Poland
Christopher R. Browning
Ordinary Men is the true story of Reserve Police Battalion 101 of the German Order Police, which was responsible for mass shootings as well as round-ups of Jewish people for deportation to Nazi death camps in Poland in 1942. Browning argues that most of the men of RPB 101 were not fanatical Nazis but, rather, ordinary middle-aged, working-class men who committed these atrocities out of a mixture of motives, including the group dynamics of conformity, deference to authority, role adaptation, and the altering of moral norms to justify their actions. Very quickly three groups emerged within the battalion: a core of eager killers, a plurality who carried out their duties reliably but without initiative, and a small minority who evaded participation in the acts of killing without diminishing the murderous efficiency of the battalion whatsoever.
While this book discusses a specific Reserve Unit during WWII, the general argument Browning makes is that most people succumb to the pressures of a group setting and commit actions they would never do of their own volition.
Ordinary Men is a powerful, chilling, and important work with themes and arguments that continue to resonate today.
Webster should rewrite some definitions when it comes to Socialist gun grabbing, Second Amendment and Trump hating Dumacrats. These high ranking Socialist Dumacrats have banned gun in Richmond for Monday while we still have our guns. What do you think they would do to law abiding gun owners if we the people had no guns? New Webster’s should read like this for today’s Socialist Dumacrats. Meaning, ignorant, stupid, laimbrain and evil. Any one of the four or all four. A law such as banning guns is unconstitutional and does not have to be obeyed. Believe me, packing a firearm Monday in Richmond Virginia will be the order of the day. Democrats may stage a false flag event to blame it on those of us that love our God given rights to keep and bare arms.
Words are cheap. I’d be more impressed if we hadn’t already had more federal gun control under Trump than Obama.
everywhere I see this rally mentioned they don’t tell that they have been doing this for a few years but now that the democrats are in charge and are trying to remove A lot of gun rights they are scared it is going to be violent when it has never been before the are also scared because it has gone national and the news is writing all these scare tactics stories this governor need to be recalled and things will calm down when people don’t have to fear their gun rights are being messed with GO VOTE REPUBLICAN TRUMP 2020
one mistake will light this off!
Just ignore the fact that Zion Don has already signed more gun control than Obeezy ever managed.
Exactly…. these people really need to open their eyes……
Trump even had me fooled at one time, but now I see the light….
This is infiltration of our government is WAY beyond what you can imagine….
This is the GREAT AMERICAN SELLOUT!!!!
WAKE UP NOW AMERICA OR ELSE YOUR COUNTRY WILL BE RUSSIAN WHEN YOU WAKE UP TOMORROW!
I believe that the only thing that the anti 2nd amendment group has to do is volunteer a few of it’s members to shave their heads and put a chew of tobacco in, throw on a come and take it t-shirt and then go to hearing and start a riot. That would be enough to get the fan going cause the shit is already flying.
someonbe please tell me one thing Trump has done that is Pro 2nd Amendment, besides saying he is Pro 2nd Amendment. I want to know because I have been waiting since he got sworn in and I have not seen one thing positive in this that he has done. He has done nothing. Thats what he has done and thats what you can exopect from Trump. We’re on our own folks.
Each and every candidate running for a political office, should be checked out, and held responsible for what they campaign for, if they say I’m for gun control or I’m against gun control, if they are not true to their word.they must be removed from office. Immediately. The people put them in because they believed in them, and what they were supposed to be standing for. If they lie to be elected, then the people who put them in, then those same people have the right to remove them, lmmediately,have them charge with obstruction of justice, falsely using the public to take office. We the true American people must stand and put a end to all who want to take our freedom from us.