As of January first, Texas residents with a CHL permit can carry their holstered firearm openly – except where prohibited by law. To ban open carry inside a building, owners/operators must post a 30.07 sign at all main entrances. If they want to ban both open and concealed carry, they have to post a 30.06 sign as well. Click here to watch a video report from Lubbock on creating a 30.07 sign. The bottom line for any business that wants to disinvite open carry Texans: $65. But it’s not the money that represents a big win for gun rights advocates. Simply put . . .
it’s the size of the required sign.
Penal Code Section 30.06(c)(3)(B) states that 30.06 concealed carry prohibited signs must “include the language described by Paragraph (A) in both English and Spanish; appears in contrasting colors with block letters at least one inch in height; and is displayed in a conspicuous manner clearly visible to the public.” [Unlike the Whole Foods sign above.] Same deal for 30.07.
Get this: if an establishment wishes to ban both open and concealed carry, they have to display both signs. That, my firearms freedom-loving friends, is some major window space. Better yet, if a CHL holder violates the sign and refuses to leave (and why would you?), the first-time penalty is now a $200 ticket.
In short, banning open carry from a business is a major PITA. As it should be, IMHO. Agreed?
Banning any civil right SHOULD be a major PITA.
You don’t have a civil right to be under someone else’s roof. Kicking you out of my house for voicing a political opinion I hate doesn’t violate your free speech, for example. The restriction on carry under someone else’s roof should be no more difficult than a clearly visible sign saying “Carrying guns isn’t welcome here.” The intent is clear.
He didn’t say anything about someone’s private property.
P.S. You’re a dope.
On an article about owning anti-gunners by making signs forbidding carry on private property a headache? It’s not hard to put 2 and 2 together.
DMZ, aka Rocket Surgeon, just FYI “isn’t welcomed” does not equal “prohibited”. It’s more of a preference.
Educated by unionized teachers?
The second amendment to the constitution trumps your feelings. If I feel the need to keep my gun on my person, I have the right to. Heck, if I just WANT to, I have the right to. In a public business, picking and choosing who can come in the door just isn’t going to fly. True Constitutional carry would be for anywhere, anytime, honestly. Giving the government any say in the matter is counter to the intent of the amendment in the first place.
Not really. You are arguing from a 35 year old interpretation. Go back and read what the founding fathers really said. Check out Madison’s daily record of the Constitutional Convention. The truth shall set you free.
These businesses could stop wasting time freaking about guns, and look at how to increase their profits. They seem to be stuck on stupid.
Infringing on my civil rights is a PIA. Not should be.
I don’t know how much weight these signs actually carry in Texas. A $200 fine I wont loose sleep over.
Here in Florida and Open carry is coming. The signs carry no weight to speak of.
Concealed means just that.
Open carry when it comes here and it will next year. If a property owner who has posted his place of business or private property properly. Has to know you have a weapon. Which if open is duh….and ask you to leave. Then and only then if you refuse. Or are dumb enough to wait for a cop to come. You can be charged with trespassing. Nothing more, big w00p. Not sure if that can cause loss of a CWP but Id never stick around long enough to find out.
With all the political shenanigans that happens behind closed doors in legislation making look for ‘signage’ to rear its ugly head before open carry becomes law here in Fla. The head cops are already trying to water the OC law down with amendments to where they can ignore it and attack citizens with impunity like they have been doing in some counties. The only way to force the cops to actually obey the law themselves is to take away their immunity and discretion over carrying firearms. If you can’t charge someone with an actual crime instead of infringing on their natural rights then you as a cop ought to get hammered, without being able to hide behind the badge.
And this is what Pinellas County Sheriff Gualtieri wants do do to you.
so let me get this straight..if i walk into a business with no signage (30.06 or 30.07) at the entrance, with OC and the owner / manager says “No OC here” i can then cover my OC with my shirt/coat which would make it CC…however with out signage i read the owner can still ask you to leave…am i right? so then why would i test them with OC I’ll just stay CC…
Because it’s 110F outside & humid, and the only thing swampier than your crotch is your IWB holster
Well, I dunno. If you have an armload of produce and maybe some eggs when ordered to leave, promptly dropping them in order to comply expeditiously might affect the vigor with which you are ordered to leave tomorrow, when you have the same items in your arms. Or, it might get a sign put up.
Maybe you just don’t think you should have to hide your gun like some kind of a criminal or coward would.
Whenever I see a “no firearms allowed” sign outside a business, I pause and wonder exactly which criminals out there do they think will be deterred by the sign?
My bank has such a sign at the entrance. Do they honestly believe a bank robber approaching the door will see the sign and just go home? Or, that after reading it he will go back to the getaway car to drop of his gun before returning to the bank to try an unarmed robbery?
One upside for banning open carry in a place like a bank is that they can run their alarm immediately. Without the ban, they would need to wait until the criminal initiated the robbery – essentially, it is a presumption of criminal intent.
Of course, none of this helps if the criminal is carrying concealed.
I always thought the logical spot to trigger the alarm had to do with the donning of a ski mask.
Fair enough – but you still look for an indicator of trouble before triggering an alarm. If a bank bans open carry and you still carry, you are a criminal (misdemeanor if you just ignore the sign, felony if you rob the bank).
I would argue that banks are a bit unique as they present a target that exists to provide the ultimate fungible good and thus operate under different rules of engagement. I can’t think of any other place that has silent alarms available at each employee’s station.
Much better then the signs that I have seen at some stores that are no more than a few inches tall hidden near the ground behind a display counter.
I don’t read the signs outside stores. Why would I?
And the signs should have the header “This place of business does not respect the rights of individuals guaranteed under the Constitution and Bill of Rights”.
It’s nice when the government bullies individuals to support our passions, but it would be better for the government to gtfo… A privately owned business should be able to respectfully choose who to do business with in whatever manner they choose… What happens when hypotheticalvile mandates that the default is gun free and businesses require a three foot sign to allow carry?
It’s bullshit. It’s a win for the second amendment, a loss for freedom from government meddling…
It is government meddling and I would prefer that businesses have the right to ban carried arms with whatever signage they choose. The trouble is the penalty for ignoring the sign.
If there was no direct penalty for ignoring the sign, just that you will be asked to leave if seen carrying (ignoring which, you would be criminally liable), I think any sign of choice or lack thereof would be ok. However, if a specific criminal penalty applies because I fail to heed written notice, it better be in a place where I can see it and see it clearly. I wouldn’t be upset if the signage needed size and contrast but didn’t have specific wording requirements, but I wouldn’t be surprised if an anti-gun business owner either made the language confusing or otherwise difficult for the average person to understand. It is that same issue that necessitate a bright line rule.
I’m a little surprised that Texas lawmakers had the wisdom to legalize open carry and quasi campus carry, yet allow the signage law to stand at all. It’s completely ridiculous. However, now that it’s only a ticket, I’d conceal carry anywhere without caring about stupid signs. Here in fake pro gun Florida, signs have no force of law but we have no open carry or campus carry. The current bills will most likely be gutted by anti gun republicans.
It’s actually not as simple as that. The problem is the Texas is also a very big private property and pro-business state. It’s a balancing act, and the signage is a compromise to protect the rights rights of both CHL/OC and businesses.
There are businesses, particularly in the Austin area that are anti-gun. There are also so pro-gun business owners. I think the vast majority don’t really care, but don’t want to be caught up in drama between MDA and OCers, because they view it as extremists on both sides trying to make them choose as position. I suspect you’ll see quite a few places opt out of open carry, just avoid the hassle of having their business become a battleground.
Phase 2 of the OC battle is just beginning. MDA is pressing Dems to make a business/private property/local control case for curtailing the 30.06/30.07 signage requirements.
In short, banning open carry from a business is a major PITA. As it should be, IMHO. Agreed?
PITA would make no difference to some places especially if corporate policy requires it. It should be a major revenue loser, and they should be made to know it is a revenue loser. THAT will get their attention.
The only argument against that would be a speculative “maybe more people will be frightened of the guns and I’d lose even more money allowing them.” Which doesn’t seem to be the case from what I’ve seen, but then no serious study has been done that I know of.
Funny how they can ban one class of people, and it’s ok, but ban another class, and the world loses it head and craps a canary.
When did descrimination become ok? I thought libs and dems thought themselves better than that sort of thing?
We should have a discussion about 51% signs in Texas at some point TTAG, I was at the long center and the sign was inside the facility which i don’t believe is allowable, same thing at the Paramount Theater Downtown, the sign is at the bar so you’ve been breaking the law for ten minutes before you’d ever see it.
There are a number of places that push to test the 51% sign. i would contact TABC. TABC will be very interested in missing out on liquor license and taxes….
The Whole Foods near my house does the same stupid shit where they put the 30.06 sign on a sliding glass door which is open and sitting behind some other door where you can’t see it. They also separates the English and Spanish version of the sign. I wonder how that would hold up in court?
According to an inquiry at Texas Law Shield i made some time ago, any charge against you would likely be dismissed because it’s not in “reasonable view” unless Whole Foods could prove you already knew it was a 30.06 area, which isn’t likely.
I know my opinion would be different from most of you guys, but I actually don’t think of this as a bad one. I own guns, have ccw license, and have anti-gun friends who understand my gun ownership. Since they understand me, I have to accept their anti-gun views too. None of us are wrong : We are just different in that part.
But what do I do when I see that sign? I will probably never shop there again LoL
You can post any sign that you want, but I will still conceal carry.
Businesses should have the right to ban guns if they want to without having to jump through such restrictive hoops. I, for one, will NOT shop anywhere guns are allowed to be carried in the open. Thankfully, I live in a SANE state
BTW: I don’t give a rat’s ass what any of you think of my statement, because IMO, you have some serious mental health issues if you have the need to carry a gun everywhere.
I work in a bank in Texas and we are in the process of posting these signs. We are posting both 30.06 and 30.07 signs to prohibit concealed and open carry, and both are in Spanish and English, and in plain view as you enter the front and side doors. So essentially, eight huge ass signs. Now if we allowed open or concealed carry in the bank, what would that solve? A person that enters a bank with a weapon usually isn’t there to kill people, they want the money. They want the money, we give it to them as fast as we can to get them out of the bank and out of danger. Now if that robbery turns into a hostage situation, then yeah I want a gun. But that isn’t likely. Robber gets his money and leaves in a matter of minutes. My life isn’t in danger as usually the type of robberies we see are ‘note robberies’ where the robber passes a note to the teller quietly making his demands. I’m not about to shoot a person because they are so desperate for money they would rob a bank, its just money, and its insured. Now if they come in guns blazing, I will do everything within my power to stop them, and I will sue my bank for not allowing me to carry a firearm to protect myself and my coworkers. Rambling post is rambling.
The point is, the business isn’t necessarily bad if they prohibit firearms. If you don’t want to do business there, that’s your right. We’d hate to see you go. (The bank president made the decision to prohibit weapons, not me nor my colleagues. We’re for it actually but we should support our president’s decision.)
It would make more sense if the law required signs to be posted to *allow* carrying, that way people from other states would be aware of it. Signs that indicate that people should not carry weapons won’t make sense to anyone from outside of Texas.
Just FYI…if you want to stay somewhat up-to-date on where businesses are that prohibit OC, CC, or both in Texas…check out this website:https://www.texas3006.com/index.php
I have stopped doing business in some places because of their refusal to allow CC. Frankly, I don’t care about OC because I’m never going to OC. When all of this started many businesses threw up the OC and CC signs because they (wrongly) thought that it was going to be the wild west out there. Since that never transpired, and I have yet to see anyone carrying openly, most all of the 30.06 signs have come down, and many of the 30.07 signs have as well. The site I listed above is a great resource and doesn’t cost you a dime.