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It seems like the small and quiet firearm is all the rage these days. I love my suppressed 10/22 takedown, but there’s something to be said for applying the same treatment to a 9mm carbine like the Kel Tec Sub2000. Liberty Suppressors posted these images on their Facebook page (via Reddit) of a concept design they did for that very firearm using an integral silencer and a rather short barrel. It looks bad-ass, and given the volume of the can, no doubt it would be whisper-quiet as well. There’s just one problem . . .


They don’t intend to sell any. Apparently the firearm is too expensive to produce commercially, which is a shame. I want to see the small and quiet trend continue. Nevertheless, concepts like this one are things that I love to see coming out of shops. Wacky, zany ideas that may not work of make fiscal sense, but will no doubt inspire other people to pick up where they left off and have a go at something.

The road to innovation is littered with failed prototypes, but it’s a damn pretty path to walk.

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  1. Doesn’t look very complicated to me. Why is it so much more expensive to produce than any other combo? (especially considering that the host firearm is a Kel-tec)

    Also, considering that cans get hot, how to you hold it with your support hand?

      • Lol there’s a weapon in Fallout 3 where the operator has to wear an oven mitt to use it.

        Personally I’d add the vertical front grip from from a 1921 Thompson. It could use a touch of class.

      • Heh. I had to check the calendar when I saw this. I thought it was April 1.

        And…since no human can actually get their hands on an Sub2K, the actual availability of this would be…unobtanium. Or Watufakonium?

        • That’s not true. I wanted one for my birthday in June, so I went to a dealer. He opened up a safe and I saw probably 4-6 sub2ks in there. He had the one I wanted (G17 compatible) and I walked out with it. Easy as pie! You just need to find the proper dealers.

    • I suspect that the cost is primarily a function of that baffle. A) It’s huge, and is probably titanium, B) It would likely have to be entirely CNC machined, titanium is a PITA to machine, and you have to start with a giant block of it C) The design of the baffles involves some complex geometry which will involve more CNC operations and thus more machine time.

      • 1/8-1/4 inch aluminum that is laser cut and laminated together with an interference pin would do the same thing (think wooden cutting board) and would cost less than $10 to manufacture in volume.

        There is always a better way to build a mousetrap
        While they are at it, they could design it to look less like a block and more like a proper handguard. Nobody says that silencers have to be round.

    • I bet it is more than the cost to manufacture. The total cost of ownership (wholesale price, retail establishment markup, taxes and government fees, etc.) may be too high to attract enough buyers to allow them to build at the quantities they need to lower the manufacturing cost enough to turn a profit.

      • This right here. There’s a limit to how much you can reasonably expect a Kel-Tec to fetch in the market, integrally-suppressed or not. By the time you add up all the costs, this design is probably quite a bit above that point.

    • All you need is a mill and a lathe and lots of free time…and a $200 tax stamp of course. I wouldn’t even think about cheating the gubment out of their tax money….

  2. I think it’s more of an aesthetics thing. That monstrosity looks like somebody nailed a 2×4 to the front of a PPK and added a stock. I think it wins the “ugliest carbine of the year” award hands down.

    • They probably aren’t producing it for fear of being sued for patent infringement. I think Glock holds the patent on “gun with ergonomics of a brick”.

      I never thought it would be possible to make a carbine uglier than the Hi-Point 995, but dang if they didn’t do it.

  3. That baffle design is about as expensive as you could possibly get. Why not a simple tube with K baffles to knock the cost down? I could do without the boxy look anyway.

  4. I’ve only shot one 9mm in my whole existence.

    I was 10 or 11 years old, I shot my brother in law’s Ruger something or another.

    Since then I’ve felt anything in nine millie to be a big ole ball of “meh”.

    Those Beretta Storms are endearing (in 9mm), but they aren’t on my priority list.

    Maybe I’m missing out on not having any 9’s in my arsenal.

    And yes, indeed, as poster stated above- that thing is ugly.

    • We’re sorry to hear that the most prolific pistol round in firearms history doesn’t excite you. Hopefully we can remedy this travesty soon.

      • You know, Dickie J, I rescind my previous post.

        A Browning Hi Power has crossed my mind for a long time. That is, to my limited knowledge, one hellaciously good 9MM to own.

        • Yes, it is a nice 9mm. I bought mine circa 1980 for $325, brand new. I had to sell it in the mid 90’s because I needed the money (got $500 for it). Wish I still had that pistol…the most accurate pistol I have ever shot…easily hit soda cans at 100yds first shot.

  5. Mono-cores are generally more expensive to produce, and that’s probably a 2 stamp weapon system. The Kel-Tec may be “cheap”, but the can and 400.00 in stamps probably keeps it from being commercially viable. And yes, it is fugly.

  6. Why on God’s green earth would you want to carry that big-assed thing just to get pistol performance? Why not just machine your barrel with threads and screw on a silencer for your CCW gun? Lighter, cheaper, MUCH more compact.

    Interesting thought though.

    I really like my Sub2000. It’s a niche gun. I carry it in my luggage in case the zombies spring up while I’m in my hotel bed, so I can fight my way to my car to access my AR.

    It also sometimes sneaks inside my computer satchel and as been known to accompany the missus in her travels as well.

    Unfold, run the bolt and let the fun begin!


  7. Part of the reason for the boxy shape is so it can still fold in the middle. As far as cost, you could shorten the bbl and hang a Silencerco Osprey on it for the same effect and with 147 gr subsonic loads….fairly quiet, but still 2 tax stamps (and some waiting).

    • I think they should bring back the original sub-9 and sub-40 with the aluminum receivers. I love my sub-40 but haven’t been able to find a sub-9 IN half decent shape AND have the cash all at the same time.

      I’m just not a huge fan of plastic versus metal in most applications.

  8. Suppressors are cool 99% of the time…this is the 1% in which peoplel shake their head and go: “WTF?”

  9. Had a sub2000. I wish I still had it. That being said I never had a desire to trick it out. Folding it up into a laptop case was major attraction to me. This is goofy…

  10. Love my Sub2k’s. Really do. But I can’t see investing any real cash into that platform. The design is great, but man… it’s not exactly a world class built weapon if you know what I mean. If they made the thing to some higher spec – perhaps a carbon frame, high quality steel internals, well machined and polished, etc… then maybe. But dropping a can on a Sub2k is like putting a kick ass race car body on a Ford Fiesta frame.

    • Dealer I know says that his ATF contact says (I know, I know, nameless faceless “they” 3x removed) LEO letter buys 1mo. off approval times because ATF doesn’t really like/approve of not needing them for Trusts.

      Also says, filing them separately only restarts the clock.

      Sounds like throttling.

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