Home Gun Nation Incendiary Image of the Day: Blue Cross Canceled My Health Care Policy.... Gun Nation Incendiary Image of the Day: Blue Cross Canceled My Health Care Policy. So How Can I Trust Democrats When They Say I Can Keep My Guns? Edition By Robert Farago - October 30, 2013 139 Facebook Twitter Pinterest WhatsApp Email Post Views: 12 RELATED ARTICLESMORE FROM AUTHOR Runenation: No One Is Coming To Save You [VIDEO] The Gun Rights Movement Is Far Bigger Than Any One Organization RECOIL Magazine Takes Blowback for Chris Cheng Cover Art 139 COMMENTS That’s…. that’s…. Actually, that’s a pretty interesting point. Reply Well, to be fair to Mr. Obama, nothing in the ACA package removes the low-tier policies some insurance companies offer. (Most of which are garbage, anyway.) The insurance providers cannot sell any new policies of that tier, but they are free to continue those already in service. Obviously they are choosing to cancel them. Essentially you’re blaming the administration for the actions of a private company. Reply The President said (repeatedly) “If you like your health insurance policy you can keep it. Period.” Well, I can’t. Period. He’s also said a few words about being able to keep my guns. Period. Why would I trust the Prez and his party on that score? Reply If you like your insurance plan you can…be forced to pick a new plan which is 15% more expensive with half the coverage. You’re welcome. Reply “If I like your plan, you can keep your plan.” Only 15%, you got lucky, mine was dropped and a comparable new plan costs 87% more. Haha, only 15% more??? In your dreams maybe. From CNBC: “Aetna alone will pass through to its customers over $1 billion in taxes and fees associated with the Affordable Care Act that need to go into the pricing,” [CEO] Bertolini said. And didn’t the president say that once implemented, health insurance will be cheaper, have lower deductibles and have more coverage for everybody? I want what he’s smoking. Well my policy only went up 9% for me and my family. But I get that through my employer. Next year I expect to see it jump even higher once the employer mandate kicks in. Try *500*%. Just came over the horizon. Cheap, affordable. Which are actually two different things, but what do you expect from a professional liar? 15%? What planet’s Affordable Care Act are you referencing? I make half-way decent money. At my age I could not afford a private plan here in Pennsylvania without working a second job to pay for it. AND they’ll call that package an upgrade. SHEESH!!! What’s a matter, Farago…you gotta problem with “Change(TM)”? Reply Hope and change, motherfvckers. Hope and change. Who knew those buzzwords was all it took to take a nation. Oh, wait, didn’t Germany do something like that? The secretary of HHS wrote new regulations that have prevented millions of plans from being grandfathered until those new regulations. Dont be naive and think Obama didnt vet all of that. Try and keep up. Reply The shills are up to speed. They know what has been done, but they are doing their level best to hammer on a few BS talking points and hoping they can ride this out. Disgusting. Completely in character, but disgusting nonetheless. Reply HHS head, aka Weird Alien Lady: “Many men actually do need maternal care.” Reply The Obamination is completely responsible for everything involving the Unafordable Healthcare Act, especially the lies Reply I am still waiting for the piece of Democrat I have as a senator to explain why, after I paid out of pocket for my Vasectomy and my wife’s tubal ligation, for the love of God, why do I need to spend 1900/year for maternity coverage? Reply “Many men do need maternal care.” Not so in my case. I had a major medical policy with a high deductible-by my choice. I’ve worked in the insurance industry, and understand coverages and how they are written. My existing policy was non-compliant with the ACA. What this means is that MY CHOICE of medical coverage is no longer allowed under the law, and I am being compelled to purchase a policy that is significantly more expensive than what I have now. Period. You cannot put lipstick on that pig. Reply At least putting lipstick on pigs would be something you can see and touch, as opposed to the ACA, witch operates like a black hole. You cant see it, nobody wants to touch it and all the money swirls to the center and disappears. Reply I am so stealing your comment :). Since you think we arent being fair to Obama here is a link to an article on NBC which can hardly be characterized as partisan right: http://investigations.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/10/28/21213547-obama-admin-knew-millions-could-not-keep-their-health-insurance?lite Reply The impression I get is that any changes made to a policy, regardless of what degree the change is, it is considered a new policy at renewal and must meet the ACA requirements. This includes paying for services and coverage that a person doesn’t want or give a crap about. Then, when they shop for a new policy their premiums and deductables skyrocket. Reply Well, it will only increase for those who are forced to pay for the rebates provided to others. Wow, not much comfort in that, is there? This whole thing is starting to stink to high heaven. Reply Starting? This thing was a rotten stillborn corpse. Now its just souping in the sun. I’ll gladly blame the administration for letting private companies write the ACA themselves… which forces you to buy insurance from private companies. Reply They laid down with dogs. They will end up with much worse than fleas. Reply 1. They are being canceled by the ACA since they are not “true” insurance. Hence they are canceled so those users have to get a government defined healthcare plan. 2. Plans were only grandfathered if they were in place in 2010, AND there are changes to the policy. If your premium, co-pay, benifits etc changed (i.e. even influenced by inflation), it is considered a new plan per the rules for consideration under the ACA. Refer to point #1 to determine if you can keep it or not…. Reply Awesome. This is the talking point that the Obamacare defenders are trotting out now. Your plan sucked anyway!!! Reply No dice. They are cancelling them because they are now ILLEGAL. The reason they are illegal is because the president signed a law purposefully, and knowingly, making them such. Don’t worry, they were ‘bad policies’, ‘discriminatory’, and ‘unsafe’. See, they are doing you a big favor by forcing you to buy what they say you have to buy. They are just protecting us hapless consumers. While I’m on the topic of consumer protection, about those dangerous guns you have….. Reply Wrong. the policies are getting cancelled because they don’t meet the minimum standards the administration wrote. The insurance companies warned this would happen. moral: you can only keep your guns and your healthcare if its administration approved. Reply With respect, Sab. You’ve just spouted the same kind of gibberish we are tired of hearing. “You get to keep your policy of you like it” means something … in English. It means that the ACA requires nothing which which would directly cause someone to lose a policy they like. The ACA has SO MANY provisions regarding exactly waht kinds of coverage are “allowed”, that your attempt at a “nuanced” disclaimer defies any sense of reality. People are losing their coverage over something as simple as $5 deductable increase … which triggers the ACAs provisions requiring you to drop that coverage, or for the provider to drop you upon threat of onerous fines. The statement “If you like your policy, you can keep it!” is a bald-faced lie, according to any rational, standard definition of the word “lie”. Reply Obama lied, repeatedly. The policies are being cancelled because ACA mandated they be cancelled. Why should we be fair to a liar? This is the biggest political lie in my lifetime. Pelosi said our premiums would decrease by $2500 on average. She lied too. Hoyer admits lying. All the high level Democrats lied, over and over. Never believe anything a known liar tells you. Reply Sorry, Seb, that’s a bullshit hack left talking point that has no connection to reality. Read: http://investigations.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/10/29/21222195-obama-administration-knew-millions-could-not-keep-their-health-insurance?lite Reply Absolute Hogwash. Anybody with rudimentary understanding of economics knew that these policies would be gone the minute the ACA took effect. Reply that’s the stupidest spin argument on earth. If the government raise the minimum wage to $100/hr and walmart cant afford to pay every cashier $100/hr, by your logic it isn’t the government’s fault! Reply Obama is a lying skunk! The only reason any insurance company is canceling old policies is that the Obama Care law requires certain “Minimum” coverages for all -i.e, maternity, free birth control , mental health and on and on.. – even for a single male who would not have had/needed that coverage prior. Now his premiums must cover those conditions. SO don’t blame the insurance comppanies- Place the blame where it belongs on Numb Nuts and his administration… Reply So If I am a relatively young, healthy individual who only wants coverage for catastrophic injury or illness, I won’t be able to buy it now because it is considered “low cost garbage coverage”? So now I will be forced to purchase a plan that deprives me to choose what I want or can afford, under the threat of a penalty aka “tax” that increases each year? So I am, in effect, being force to subsidize other people with my increased costs, which increased about 15-20 percent last year already. But of course, you statist know best, better than me on how I should care for myself. Reply Get ready to bend over and grab your ankles. Reply It’ll hurt a lot less if you keep at least one hand free to self lube. You know they ain’t gonna supply any. Reply Hey, blood is a lubricant…kind of Reply I hear you can also use blood to water certain Liberty Trees. I don’t think anal leakage works on those trees. Your request to self lubricate has been denied. Under current ACA guidelines that is a medical procedure but your new insurance will not cover it. Reply At least you’ll be covered for the necessary surgery and painkillers after they rip you a new one. I am sure they figured out how to get KY covered. Reply https://scontent-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/q71/1375904_10200534391636469_1830071663_n.jpg Reply Apologies to the moderators if I’m linking this incorrectly. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfl55GgHr5E http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DrxUBMlCyiE http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DE5h1oA6_K4 Reply This is what happens when the government takes over anything. Reply The statement that an insurance company is free to continue an existing, non ACA compliant plan if the company so chooses is not completely correct. The regulations imposed by the Dept. of HHS permit grandfathering only if there are “no significant changes” made to the plan after the ACA became law. Examples given of a significant change include a change in deductible, a change in coverage or a change in benefits. If there are any “significant changes” made to the plan after the ACA became law in 2010, the grandfather clause no longer applies and the plan either has be made compliant to all ACA requirements or be dropped. That is a key factor in why current estimates are that 40% or more of people purchasing private insurance are likely to lose their existing plans. So it may not be the choice of the insurance company, but in fact the result of regulations (not law) imposed by HHS. Reply “Examples given of a significant change include a change in deductible, a change in coverage or a change in benefits.” So … That covers just about anything except the price of postage to mail the letter and the paper it’s printed on. Reply Was there ever really a time where we could trust Democrats to begin with… about anything? And, to be fair, or Republicans, also? (crickets) Yeah… that’s what I thought. Reply We can’t trust any politician. Just look at the New York Republicans who voted for the SAFE Act. Or consider Bush the Elder’s Gun Free School Zones Act. Or Reagan’s elevation of the ATF to federal agency status. But civilian disarmament is in the Democratic platform. Period. Reply But … But … It’s all for our own good, right? Right? Reply PREACH! Reply There was that one time….. no, that wasn’t Democrats. There was… no, not then either. What about when they…. no that wasn’t the government was it? OK. I got nothing. Someone else want to try? Reply Well, yes. there was… Wait, Um… OK, I got nothing either. Reply +1 The George Carlin comment about bipartisan only meaning that there is a greater than normal amount of deceit going on comes to mind right about now. Reply File a lawsuit of false advertisement. He advertised that you can keep your insurance. He lied about it. Reply Good way to get your name on the Do Not Fly List and probably a future drone list. Reply I got a similar cancellation letter. Mine, however, offered me an opt-in (which I took) to continue with my current plan until December 2014. After that I’m SOL and will be forced to replace my plan with an inferior (less doctors in network, less medicines covered), higher cost plan. Reply Good catch, RF! It’s the same “silent asterisk” is both phrases: “If you like your policy, you can keep it!*” *As long as it is a plan we have approved. “No one is going to take your guns!*” *As long as they are guns we have approved. Reply My daughter has a well baby plan for my grand daughter. Vaccinations, checkups, the normal stuff. After Dec. 31st, it goes from 118 to 460 bucks, because it now has to cover mammograms, paps, etc… She’s 5 years old. Reply Yes Tom, but according to people like Sab (the A-hole who posted above defending obama) You should be happy because that plan probably was garbage anyway. Reply Calling me an a-hole is a bit much. I could be wrong, and if so post a rebuttal. Personal attacks are childish and ineffective. Reply Not childish, accurate. Several posters have posted rebuttals already, so it would be redundant for me to do so. Now run along back to Media matters, I am sure they have some more talking points for the Obamanation. If you have made an honest mistake (you have basically no info on this issue and you just happened to come across a Dem talking point), then you are ignorant. I would not savage you for that, but you certainly don’t earn any respect. Voter ignorance is one of the biggest reasons were are in this mess. If you are not ignorant, but are trying to push this absurd talking point, then you deserve personal attacks. Yes, like calling me racist and sexist (bitter clinger, the lists go on) because I don’t agree with his policy. You’re right Sab, childish, it’ll never work. That’s fantastic. No wait, that’s not the word I wanted. F*cked. That’s the one. Its awesome that the ironically named ACA is actually costing alot of people alot more money because the insurance companies know they have everyone by the sack and can charge more or less what they want. This is that ‘Change’ and ‘Progress’ being rammed down our throats. Reply It is not the insurance companies “that know they have everyone by the sack”. Due to the nature of this law and the coverages it mandates, along with the fact that people who are healthy can opt to pay a tax until they absolutely need insurance and then can not be denied, the only actuarial sound thing to do is to price the plans higher. And as it is, expect even higher increases in the future years if the steaming pile of crap called the ACA/Obamacare continues. This law forces adverse selection on insurance companies with no alternative. If I didn’t have employer subsidized health insurance, you can bet that I would be looking closely at the numbers of not being covered and what direct prices for routine care I could negotiate with local docs. And then build the nest egg to cover deductibles and coinsurance costs in case of major events that would require me to get my undeniable coverage. Reply The loonies aren’t really new. They decreed several years ago that all kids must have Hep-B and HPV immunization as they obviously all are future morons that would thru drug use and queer sex self-infect with these dread diseases How is it that these neomarxists are driven by the Rule of the Lowest Common Denominator but don’t understand the Law of Untended Concequences? Reply Neiowa, Just want to clairify something for you ok..? You stated the following: “… and queer sex self-infect with these dread diseases” HPV is more commonly transferred from male to female, and is typically very (read nearly impossible) hard to detect in the male to begin with… Sorry, your claim is inaccurate and your ignorance is showing… Reply Be careful neiowa the hep b and HPV immunization started under Bush’s reign Reply Specific to the healthcare issue, there are numerous reasons why that plan might be discontinued. For example, numerous women’s health options must be covered (not applicable to you specifically I know), and limitations on pre-existing conditions and policy cancellation policies have to change. As a result, your current policy would be invalid as of January 1. His wording aside, the intent was that employer-based coverage wouldn’t change. Since you’re on the individual market it’s not really what he was referring to. That being said, this transition process is a giant pain. The policies have been completely restructured, so you have to go back and re-learn everything you need to know about your plan, even if you are employer-covered. I will say that despite the website issues, people are legitimately getting coverage where they couldn’t before, and at much lower cost. That’s not just a line, I personally know people who have gone through the process. Reply Yes, some people will be paying less, at the expense of others who are now being forced to purchase more expensive plans. Reply Realistically we were all paying for those who weren’t carrying insurance before the ACA as well, it was just coming out of our taxes. In CT, I believe the state ponied up about $1 billion to compensate hospitals for unreimbursed care last year. Every state does pretty much the same thing since nationally, hospitals are prohibited from denying care based on the individual’s ability to pay. Part of what this is doing is shifting those costs up front so that the states can phase out those reimbursements. Reply I’m self employed and have been buying individual insurance for my family (myself, my wife, and 2 kids) for almost 6 years. I’m trying to navigate my way through the Obamacare mess and, while I’m not in love with the law or the administration of the law, this is the first time that it looks like my whole family will be covered under the same health care plan. I feel for people that are being forced to give up their plans to conform with the mandate and there are definitely better ways to do this. But now, for the first time in along time, I’m buying care under the same rules that my friends that have employer offered plans follow and I can get my family covered under one plan. I live in Virginia, no one in my family takes any medication or has a chronic medical condition The insurers can and have denied me coverage for trivial issues. I could do without the government subsidy, the mandate as it is currently written and the onerous rules that are forcing people happy with their coverage to change, but something has to done to the health care system. This may not be perfect, but I consider it progress. I don’t think anyone could honestly say that the way we deliver health care in this country is really effective and I’m surprised that the GOP hasn’t put together a plan to compete with the ACA. Politically, a big mistake in my opinion. My 2 cents Reply As I remember, the only thing resembling a plan from Republicans was a nebulous idea they floated several years ago — and it sounded a LOT like what we now have with Obamacare. They were for it before they were against it. But anybody is welcome to correct me if I have it wrong. This was some time ago, and memory doesn’t always serve. It’s not working because the government has already had their hands in healthcare for decades. If they would just mind there own business, things would run more smoothly. Thanks for your story. I think you are right, the Republicans made a huge political mistake not coming up with a viable alternative to the ACA. There certainly could have been a bi-partisan, well-thought out alternative, but the far right wing of the party insisted on playing what amounts to an all-or-nothing game, and lost. Not sure what Kyle in Ct is talking about. Republicans weren’t even allowed any input into the ACA when it was being crafted. Since gaining the house, numerous changes have been made including lifting 1099 reporting requirements for any vendor a business buys more than 600 dollars worth of product from. The tea party republicans weren’t even in office when this disaster passed. Yes, leftist anti-discrimination is present even in insurance. It’s not fair for anyone to be at more risk for health problems than anyone else, therefore they pretend it isn’t so. Of course, that is factually untrue on earth, so they force young to pay old rates, healthy for sick rates, and males the pregnancy and mammogram rates. Reply You can’t. Reply As a side note for people who are seeing dramatic rises in their costs, you may be better off (if you are otherwise healthy) getting a “catastrophic coverage” plan that will cover you in case of something happening to your health suddenly (car accident, heart attack, etc.) and paying for your routine costs out of pocket through an HSA. I’m pretty sure you can set up an HSA as an individual, with certain restrictions. Reply I have a friend whose catastrophic plan went from $25 to $200 a month, with a $2500 increase in her deductible. Reply I’d be willing to bet that has to do with the lifetime limits going away. The previous plan probably had annual and lifetime maximum coverage limits, so if something happened and you had an extended hospital stay, you would end up with a bill at the end for the amount over the coverage limit. Based on my experience, it wouldn’t be hard to go over that cap if you have any appreciable hospital stay. Regardless, it does suck. Based on the CT plans they would definitely qualify for an HSA, which would at least help with the increase since it’s pre-tax dollars. Would your friend qualify for any of the tax credits? That may offset the increase partially, which doesn’t help with the sticker shock but makes it less painful on an annual basis. Reply She might qualify, and HSAs are great, but the problem is she got a catastrophic policy because she’s a young woman in good health with good health habits. HSAs are useless if your annual healthcare outlay is miniscule. The point is her costs are skyrocketing for a service (by that I mean healthcare in general) that she makes virtually no use of. I’m in a similar boat. I don’t get sick, ever, and when I do it’s one quick trip to the doctor. I’m looking at ~$1200 a year for my newly required insurance with credits that I’m eligible for taken into account. I’d bet if you added everything I’ve spent on healthcare in the last seven years up, including eye exams and contacts, you wouldn’t reach what I’m now expected to lay out per year. I don’t get angry very often, but I’ve found if I spend more than 10 continuous minutes thinking about Obamacare and its effects on me, I get what can legitimately be described as “spitting mad.” Hang on to your shorts. The obamacare crud also limits how much you can put into an HSA. pretax. its down to 2500 per year. I think the takeaway here is that it’s not a bad idea, but the execution is deeply flawed. With regards to the HSA limits, I don’t know where you got the 2,500 number: http://www.flex-admin.com/news/the-irs-recently-released-the-2014-health-savings-account-hsa-limits My employer plan (we have several to choose from) was a high deductible plan with an HSA and optional FSA & dependent FSA, which had no premium whatsoever. So what I did was I paid into the HSA whatever my premium would have been for the other HSA plan, so I’m basically paying a “premium” to myself. I love it, and I’m very thankful that it is not changing under Obamacare. Well, except that going forward it is no longer premium-free, I’ll be spending a whopping $17/month for it. Still a great plan, and I can’t blame everything on Obamacare for certain, but I’m thinking that if my company wasn’t paying an extra $1,000,000 in arbitrary fees due to the ACA that my rate might have stayed at $0. Reply Those are only available for people under 30. Unless you want to pay the ACA tax penalty. Reply Beat me to it. I turn 55 in a couple months. I can’t buy what you refer to here in Oregon. Cheapest plan I can get is about 980. up just a little bit. I was paying 527. I already pay around 52% of my income in all the taxes here in Oregon. I’ll be darned if I’m going to pay that stupid fine so some jackwagon sitting around can have free insurance. Reply That seems exceedingly high, might I ask what taxes are included in that? Just wondering if that’s including FICA and Social Security, property taxes, etc. Yes. property taxes, gas taxes, FICA. Everything that a normal person is likely to incur. Mind you we don’t have a sales tax, that’s why the Costcos are filled with cars with Washington license plates. Last list I saw a month or so ago ranked us as #-3 highest. And yes, I could avoid gas tax (.48 per gal) by riding a bike 17 miles to work. I could quit my job and stop paying into FICA, unemployment and all that. Uh, that’s what I had. Replacing it with the lowest compliant policy is at least a 30 percent jump in my premium. Reply Robert, let us know how your old and new policies compare after you get signed up with O’Care. Reply All politicians lie (or at the least most). The only person I trust to rule me is myself. Not some asshat that was voted in by people who do not want to have to work for themselves. Reply I totally stole this from someone else, it was written by a woman who saw her policy double under Obamacare. Given the vast numbers of people who are losing their current insurance and having to replace it with more expensive policies or seeing their rates skyrocket, they should change the name from the Affordable Care Act to the Available Care Act. Yeah, it might be available to people now that it wasn’t before, but nobody’s gonna like their options. Reply It’s not even available at the moment. It’s been one giant hilarious Soviet-style **** up because people in government are rarely held accountable. Reply We had our open enrollment meeting for my company site last week. Before outlining rate increases (which were rather modest for the high-deductible plans, and pretty heavy for the traditional PPO) they covered the new fees our company has to pay, which rounds DOWN to a cool million. One person asked what these fees are for, what we benefit from paying them, and the HR rep just shook her head and said “nothing.” Someone else asked if this was a one-time fee or annual, and the HR rep told us not only is it annual, but, it could be 2 million next year, and who knows how it will fluctuate in the future. All this, and my company already offered health insurance to all full-time employees and we don’t have to change our plans one bit to comply with the new law. So we’re paying millions more year by year on arbitrary fees, when we could most definitely use that to buy more capital to increase production, which we absolutely need to do. Right now we’re supplementing production with factories in Europe since the EU is experiencing a downturn and can supplement our market with their excess capacity. But if (when) the EU has a resurgence, we’ll be up S creek without a paddle. We need more machines, more people to run them, and more brick & mortar space to put eveything, and dumping $1,000,000+ a year down the government drain is not helping. Reply Wasn’t there something else that happened earlier in the year that dealt a similar blow to the gun-control argument? I think it was the whole NSA “no we are not keeping digital records of every American” to ” well, ok yes we are now that the proof has come out”. I just remember enjoying Peirs Morgan moaning about how it was destroying the whole “no one is coming for your guns” argument. Reply Opt out completely and then structure your taxes so that you won’t recieve a refund at the end of the year. The only legal way for the IRS to enforce the “penalty” is to put a lien on your tax refund. http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2013/10/24/How-to-opt-out-of-obamacare-without-paying-the-fine Reply Can’t they garnish your wages to collect tax penalties? Reply No, ACA “fines” are specifically disallowed from being forcibly withdrawn from your bank account, or levied as liens or judgments. If your taxes are structured such that you don’t receive a refund, there’s almost literally nothing they can do to collect. It’s almost completely unenforceable that way. That said, keep in mind that according to the IRS, some 80% of tax filers receive a refund of some amount. Reply RF makes a very good point here. And many Obama voters are starting to get it. This is just too painful and obvious for the mainstream media to ignore. What bothers me is that it took this serious a blow to our country. The list of serious, verifiable-with-video-from-the-horse’s-mouth bold-faced lies told by Obama and high level members of his admin numbers in the HUNDREDS. I’ll take the outrage among Obama supporters. If that’s what we need to start getting things fixed, fine. But some of the whining on lefty blogs and mainstream media discussion makes me want to reach for a bottle of scotch. Those bastards were all in favor of redistributing other peoples’ wealth. But, oh no, not mine. Unlike my rich neighbor, I EARN mine. Disgusting. Reply They’re not going to take this as a sign to pull back. Now they’re screaming and howling for a single payer system. Reply That was the goal all along, of course. And if the Progs think a single payer system will be better after this disaster so far, they are stupid as well as immoral. Reply Not to mention ignorant of history. Yeah, after all the promises we just got the notification that my wife’s company will no longer cover spouses, and my job (29.5 hours MAX limited) provides no benefits so into the “exchange” I go even though I was told by every official I talked to that ” are covered so none of this is going to affect you at all”. I didn’t believe it then, and I don’t believe the other “promises” [with regards to respecting the Bill of Rights] either. Reply Well, I blame Chief Justice John Roberts. He is the vote that should have stopped this. “The Supreme Court, in an opinion written by Chief Justice Roberts, upheld by a vote of 5 to 4 the individual mandate to buy health insurance as a constitutional exercise of Congress’s taxing power.” He spouted off some noise about it not being the Court’s place to save the people from their political decisions. This isn’t a tax. A tax is collected by the Government, payed either by the people directly to the Government or collected by public and private entities which is then delivered to the Government. A tax refund comes from the Government; not your employer, not you favorite store, not an insurance company and not hospitals or doctors. Taxes that come to mind are percentages based on income, percentages based on sales, and percentages based of value of owned property. Hunting licenses, CHS licenses and driver’s licenses are licenses and not taxes. Permits result in fees -not taxes. We pay taxes to the Government via a store when sales tax is collected, when our employers withhold the tax on behalf of the Government and to the State for owning property. Back to the point, we do not pay taxes to insurance companies. The insurance companies are keeping this money. They are not sending it to the Government (except for what will qualify as quarterly income). Therefore, insurance premiums and deductibles cannot be taxes. If you’ve made it this far…good..here’s where the crap starts. The libs are already screaming we need single payer system now cause the insurance companies are screwing the American People by kicking them off of their plans -plans that are not legal under the new law. So you saw it: The birth of a bouncing new Government Entitlement…A new Right…Gov Payed Healthcare: If the libs get it, the Dems and media will say those hateful ol’ Tea Party Republicans want to keep you from getting your healthcare rights. It will not be true and that will not matter. As everyone expects they will need healthcare at some point, – only fools believe they won’t – conservatives will have a harder time staying in office. These happen to be the people that stand up for your 2nd Amendment rights. Can you imagine a DEM super majority in the House and Senate? If enough conservative votes will show up in 2014 to vote these liberals out, we might can get the law changed enough that the plans that are being dropped now could again become legal and available. Your 2nd Amendment rights may be bolstered….etc. I’ve seen many comments on here that say if their candidate doesn’t get the nod, then they are not voting….those people are stupid. If you can’t bring yourself to vote for a Romney like candidate, then don’t vote for them, but still vote for Constitutional Conservatives for the House and Senate. When you vote you might not get everything you want, but when you don’t vote, you get nothing you want…like ACA. Reply Nailed it. There is no provision in the Connie for health care. Government can regulate insurance but has no business getting in the business of health care. GOP solution of opening up competition should be embraced. Obama cites in his first state of the union address, that Alabama only has one insurance underwriter for the entire state. Thus confirming the republicans position. However Dem solution is to take control instead of tying federal funding to competition for underwriting. Reply This is why we should have had universal healthcare. Reply …and universal ACOGs attached to universal SCARs. Reply Haha, because it’s apropos, Breitbart has this: During her testimony before Congress Wednesday, Secretary Sebelius claimed, “The website never crashed. It is functional, but at a very slow speed and very low reliability.” The site crashed literally minutes before she went before Congress and said that. http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2013/10/30/Minutes-Before-Sebelius-Testimony-ObamaCare-Site-Crashes Reply Funny thing this Newspeak. The website hadn’t crashed, because it was serving up webpages that indicated that the service was not available. Now if it had crashed, it couldn’t serve up said pages. Now I feel dirty like a politician… Reply Surprise, surprise, surprise. The Liar-in-Chief lied. How can this be? Well, it can be because most Americans have the intelligence of a sea turtle. My apologies to any sea turtles that I might have offended. BTW, the real difference between the right and the left is this: The left believes that most Americans are stupid and wants to keep them that way. The right believes that Americans are stupid and would like to educate them. And now you also know why Democrats support the teachers unions. Reply A couple of points. The Repubs did have a few plans, look it up. Everyone seems to forget the fact that they are being forced to purchase a product by the gov. If they can force you into commerce to buy insurance, why can’t they force you into commerce to purchase a smart car if you cannot show a legitimate need to own a different type of vehicle? What’s next, being forced to drive around with a little black box in your car so you can be taxed on the mileage you drive? Reply The forcing-people-into-commerce ship sailed a long time ago, back when most state govs first mandated auto insurance. This is simply the latest in a long train of abuses. Reply The purpose of auto insurance is to protect the other guy, not you. Reply That’s kind of his point – you’re being forced into a commerce to “protect” someone else. Not to mention that if the other person was all that worried, they could have bought coverage themselves. Don’t get me wrong, auto-insurance is smart, and I’d have it with or without a mandate. His point is that it’s not the government’s job to tell people what to do with their monies (minus taxes). I feel the same way about seat belt laws. But that’s still not entirely right, because the purpose of auto insurance is to use your money to protect the other guy against your negligence. Obamacare is forcing you (that part’s important) to use your money to protect the other guy against their own negligence (in the case of bad health habits like smoking) or natural processes (like childbirth; I don’t have kids, I don’t want kids, and I’ll be damned if I should pay for yours) or simple bad luck (in the case of accidents or natural illness). “…What’s next, being forced to drive around with a little black box in your car so you can be taxed on the mileage you drive?” Don’t encourage them anymore than they already are….. There are already whispers in the winds that the increases in fuel efficiency is reducing the amount of gas tax states receive and something like this needs to be addresses to recover that lost revenue. Reply Federal regulators have already proposed equipping all new cars sold after 9/14 with such black boxes. http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2012/12/black-boxes-privacy/ Reply Let’s see…Benghazi, NSA spying, Fast and Furious, IRS targeting Conservative Groups, ACA, his EPA Green Energy failures (Solyndra)…3 more lives (scandals) for this “cool cat” to go through before he is impeached? With Nixon it was just illegal wiretapping. Reply Did anyone here watch “The Wire”? Everyone is talking about how much they are going to have to pay but no one is asking where the money is going and who profits from this. Someone has to follow the money. In this day and age people dont just do things because its the right thing to do especially politicians. So who is making money? Insurance companies are not in the business of helping people, they are in the make as much money as we can business. With all these changes and costs going up for so many, wheres that money going? Is it going to poor people dont we already have medicaid? Are the insurers making bigger profits now? Which politicians are getting more money and from what companies? Lots of questions i dont see anyone asking anywhere. Follow the money. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z7M71wmwWRo Reply It’s going into the gaping maw of the federal bureaucracy never to be seen again. Reply What is this, the truth about health care? Reply No, but “The Truth That the Government Lies About Everything, Starting with Guns” seems a bit unwieldy. Reply Obamacare was designed to fail. They knew and planed for it to be a disaster. The goal is for a nationalized health care system. The politicians will come back and tell us the they tried to fix the system but it is not possible so the only choice to nationalize health care. Then we will be really screwed. Reply Absolutely, but they planned for Obama care to crash more slowly than it is. Slowly enough that they can destroy the existing health insurance industry to leave a vacuum. The ACA may crash too quickly. That’s frankly the best hope at this point. Even if we can replace it soon, though, there are millions of new people going on the Medicaid roles. What are we going to do, just kick them back off? Ugly ugly ugly. Reply An interesting summary of fees and taxes imposed on insurers under the ACA. No idea how exhaustive it is, but interesting nonetheless. http://chcnevada.coventryhealthcare.com/web/groups/public/@cvty_regional_chcnevada/documents/newsletter/c082317.pdf Reply I work as a soda delivery truck driver, and am in lots of different chain and independent grocery stores every day. Most of these companies, including Stop & Shop, have cut back all of their part-time employees (the bulk of grocery store workers are part-time) to 20 hours a week, when they used to work as many as were needed, sometimes over 40. This is because the companies know they will need to provide expensive insurance premiums to all who work over a certain number of hours, so they are ensuring that no one does. So Obama has seen to it that millions of people will make less money by creating this disincentive. Way to stimulate the economy, eh! Reply Way to stimulate welfare and government dependency, eh? Reply Interesting I got a letter from the company I work for last month that said I cannot get insurance from them and I make too much to qualify for state medicare and too little to afford health insurance on my own… thank God I still got the VA who sent me a letter saying I don’t need to buy insurance and that they will cover me. Reply If the statists thought they could get away with it, they would order all privately owned firearms turned in by December 1st and begin confiscation the next day. Reply RF, I’m so tired of the anti-Obama posts. He’s doing the best he can, and…aw hell, I’m not kidding anyone. I flat out can’t stand this lying President. Frankly I think he should be in prison for his actions. Let the NSA record that for all posterity. And for the record, I’ve been suspicious of Obama since 2007. Reply Shoot, we all knew he was crap when he said he wanted $5 gas, the coal industry run out of business, and that he’d get us to single payer but it wouldn’t be overnight. I know people that heard all that and chose to ignore it because he was black and they didn’t want to believe the worst about what he said. I have trouble respecting them. Reply If any of you SOBs voted for Barry and the gun grabbing boys, I hope you are happy. Dumb bastards. Reply Obamacare is simply just another tax on people with “enough” income designed to fund an entitlement for those without that income. Apparently, the government now defines those with “enough” income as any one who makes one dollar more than $62,040 a year. Any one that makes more than the magic number gets no refund – pays 100% of the premium. So to answer your question, you will be able to keep your guns, at a cost. They can do it through Obamacare. They can just say, “if you own guns, your premium goes up a a grand a year”, simple. Reply LEAVE A REPLY Cancel reply Please enter your comment! Please enter your name here You have entered an incorrect email address! Please enter your email address here Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. Notify me of new posts by email.