Let’s be honest about that. It really is upto the rest of you to get yours. It’s not my responsibility to give you yours. I wont stand in the way but I’ll take care of me and you take care of you. If you need help then fine, I’ll do what I can. Just don’t look down on me for my efforts to get mine. That’s the way it should be.
Not really, the SRA is too busy buying trailers, pizza, and ignoring new members after their check clears to do anything gun related. John Brown Gun Club is too busy being gropey and rapey pervs. AntiFa doesn’t vote. So that leaves two niche groups of confused people further propping up the party of disarmament with their self-righteous angst.
Leftist may have figured out that the 2A allows them to protect themselves, but they are not smart enough to have figured out that if they don’t vote for their rights they will lose them. For the example just look at lil_d and minorIQ and all the Fudds, to misquote Forrest Gump: Stupid is as stupid votes.
NO. I mean, it’s a necessary evil but no, I’m not happy filthy Commies are armed because they get to break laws and then skate, whereas people like you and I do not.
Amusing insofar as it plays on stereotypical assumptions.
I’m really not sure why anyone would think that gun rights would suddenly become a top priority for a large percentage of the newbies.
When you buy a car does state abuse of DUI laws or civil asset forfeiture fishing schemes for revenue-ing purposes even cross your mind? Is it common for people to buy their first house and suddenly make it their top priority to reform property taxes?
I hate when people say “y’all” or “folks”/”folx” these days. Those terms have been tainted by Libtards overusing them on social media. They use them to sound like some “inclusive” downhome fudd.
so gfy I will use my colloquial “y’all” and “folks” all I want. I am the south you f ing yankee. you wouldn’t know good sweet tea if it was pissing on you. turn your firearms in at the next buyback while you’re at it. such an insolent pos.
We kicked your ass once you know. We don’t have to include Y’all the next time we set things right.
If you knew anything at all about the civil war, you’d know the north didn’t “kick the south’s ass”…
And if you knew anything about the modern American economy and industry, you’d know the north would never win in a modern rematch made up of the same states.
Though obviously, the coming civil war will be nothing like the last one. Other then it also will be incredibly violent and bloody.
Hey Ansel, what Ron said, only add a hearty dose of me laughing at you pathetic Yankee elitists to it.
I don’t really think that continuing to cede language to the Left is a good idea. That’s a game we have never managed to win and likely never will. If we do we’ll still lose 80% of the time.
One of the Left’s big reservoirs of power is college English departments and there’s a damned good reason for that. Yuri Bezmenov told you all about it in the 1980’s but to this day few seem to recognize it.
You can make fun of Libertarians all you want, but they are the people that want ALL of our citizens’ freedoms. What some might use to relax is only one of them. We support any of your rights to live as free as you want if it doesn’t affect anyone else’s freedom. It seems that the party is being hijacked by people that have other priorities, but the limited government, lack of intrusion is a good thing. Freedom to barter, have neighborhood exchange policies without being taxed for egg or milk money, goes along with how America was built.
I am proud to take the Libertarian stance – I want all corporations to lose their “citizen” identity and stop the people in power from hiding behind that wall.
I do wholeheartedly engage in ribald laughter at the Libertarian Party, because it doesn’t seem like anything. The Party WAS taken over by lunatics. Now, libertarian principles I very much enjoy for the most part and completely agree with, like every one you listed. But the main issue I have with the total libertarian mindset is that it condones, necessarily, rampant hedonism and frankly presupposes that if morally and philosophically untethered, people just won’t infringe on one another, which is absurd. See the entire history of humanity for proof. Libertarianism for financial and economic growth and stability, Conservative and moral social values for human nature.
And because I don’t feel like engaging in a drawn out, overly pedantic debate with anyone, Christ’s teachings. I am a recent convert to Christianity after basically spending my entire life as an atheist, and I’ve never been happier. And you don’t even have to believe in the Divinity of Christ or in God Himself for the teachings of the Bible to be true and good. Strictly anecdotal, but that’s just to explain my position.
And @rt66paul, I was certainly not trying to disparage you with any of that, you’re good people.
Correct Dude. That is exactly how we have ended up where we are.
I want all corporations to lose their “citizen” identity…
Libertarians essentially want ALL citizens of the U.S. to lose their “citizen” identity because you support open borders which means you essentially want no country at all. Without borders there is no such as a country and its citizens.
The recent re-emergence and victory of the Mises Caucus illustrates this in spades, and the fight they had to regain the party was pretty damned savage too.
It’s simply that not many outside serious LP membership pays any attention to the internal machinations of the party because the LP really has no traction at this point, partly because when the Lefties ran the joint they ran everyone else off and partly because the LP has always been small due to a philosophical unwillingness to “grow the brand”. The fact that Mises regained control is, in some ways, surprising. Happy, I guess, but surprising.
Either way, at this point anyone who identifies as a Libertarian is easy to marginalize with mostly banal and imprecise accusations (which are mostly Lefty created slander, honestly) by people who attribute extreme minority positions within the LP to everyone who might espouse the title. Which in some regards is both ironic and hilarious since the Right now uses the exact same attacks that the Left used 10-15 years ago. Nearly word for word too. Funny how capture by a skilled adversary works, eh?
In many regards this is due to a fundamental weakness in the bulk of Libertarian philosophy (by which I mean most schools of Libertarian thought that you wouldn’t call “right leaning Libertarians”).
Ultimately, the weakness of unbridled Libertarianism, which you might say is the more Left-leaning form of Libertarianism that has been dominant for the past decade as well as the “squishy middle”, is that it philosophically assumes that there is no right to preemptive self defense in the form of a rule-making system.
The classic example of this is that a Left-leaning Libertarian society would permit the existence of a Communist enclave within the greater Libertarian society but that if the Commies took over they would not permit the continued existence of a Libertarian enclave.
Lefty Libertarianism is a shockingly unstable philosophical framework that was the insertion point for actual Lefties that took over the LP, essentially, by force and hostage taking which were accomplished by basically using Marcuse as a playbook. This transfection was possible because most of the rest of the Party was full of people who were not predisposed to confront the Left and whom were no prepared for those who would *fail* to argue in good faith. In some respects this is the nature of a small, mostly untested, club.
When resistance was met from right-leaning Libertarians they were, at least initially, quickly dispatched as a minority of “extremists”. Odd considering that they were totally cool with everyone else until five minutes before this, but such is the nature of human social interaction when a skilled manipulator arrives.
It’s pretty hard to argue that the LP of the last few years resembles anything like the Ron Paul platform. End the fed, end the wars and make the Constitution the guidestone of the country. Where’d that open borders and trans shit come from?
I must have been drunk and unintelligible when I spat out that word salad.
Not much of a defense, but it’s what I got.
No, this statement was perfect. You did get out there on that one a while back, but I don’t even remember what it was about. Besides, who cares? You’ve built up a ton of good capital, you’d have to say something that made it sound like the Pod People got you before I would ever discount anything you said, whether I agreed with it or not. I always read everything you post. Hope you’re well amigo!
You mean “my sister is a Printed and Electronic Media Archival and Interpretive Retrieval systems specialist? ”
I think our school district hired one of those recently – starting salary of $105,000.
She musta been one of the smart ones from the litter.
Did the person in question have a MS in Library Science?
Serious question, because, yes, that’s a real thing and it’s a common basic qualification to be a librarian. Strange as Hell IMHO, but common nonetheless.
Awaiting moderation for some reason. Sis got her master’s degree for that.
This page might be too old for moderation. I’ll try again. My sister already worked in the school system as a guidance counselor. She got her second master’s for the specific purpose of applying for that job. They no longer call them librarians. She got the job but wasn’t making $100k.
*Found the moderation culprit: I tried to say media [special list]
VOTE DEMOCRAT AND SAVE –
Affordable Health Care
Children’s Lives
Women’s Rights
The Right to Vote
Stopping censorship and Book Burning
Constitutional Rights For All Americans
The Right To Form A Union
A Livable Wage
Social Security
Medicare
Medicaid
Public and Affordable Education
Reduced Environmental Pollution.
Saving the Planet from the Greenhouse Effect.
The Poor
The Elderly
The Working Middle Class
Common sense gun laws
YOURSELF
Remember when Obamacare was supposed to give us affordable healthcare and instead it just got more expensive along with a big fat tax if you didn’t get insurance? All lies. The poor lol! We’re all more poor thanks to dem stagflation. Save the planet! From what? Half a degree?
As usual you twist the truth to fit your own demented political agenda.
Yes it was true some Americans had increased health care costs but over all the majority of Americans saved millions because they no longer had Insurance caps which forced them to seek super expensive high high risk insurance companies and Obama care did away with pre-existing conditions which caused the same outrageous expenses to the average America. Plus children were able to stay on their parents health insurance at a far older age further saving families millions of dollars.
Now Dud Brain try and lie your way out of this one with your often slick distorted picture of what actually happened.
Nope. You always hurl insults and call me a liar, but you never prove it. Obama told me I would save $2,500 on my insurance premium. He knew that was a lie when he said it. Guess what? My premium went up! A LOT! Then he said, “If you like your healthcare plan, you can keep it.” That lie was so egregious that even left wing outlets called it the lie of the year.
I could easily refute your silly little list of lies that Dems are always promising to fix (and instead make worse), but what’s the point? You’re hopeless. It’d be a waste of time. I’d have better luck having a conversation with a lamppost.
Dud brain you moron
Even if it were true what you have lied about guess how much more it would have costed you if you had cancer and your corrupt criminal insurance company could have legally put a cap on your incurred medical costs and then on top of that slapped pre-existing conditions on your medical records. Guess what you idiot you would have went bankrupt for life. You only look at the world from your immediate expense not from any long term benefits. That is why the average cheap, stingy far right stooge does not want to pay even a penny in higher taxes and would rather go bankrupt when he needed insurance coverage or help when he lost his job or needed to go back to school to be retrained.
You just earned the “stupidity award of the year”
And I do not believe for a moment you incurred that much more in insurance costs. If you did you sure as hell were to indolent and shiftless to change insurance companies.
My insurance costs as well as all my relatives went down dramatically and I now get higher benefits as well.
Your turn , try another slick lie.
“Even if it were true what you have lied”
It has been well documented. I’m not the only one who had increased cost. This isn’t news unless you only consume propaganda.
“My insurance costs as well as all my relatives went down dramatically and I now get higher benefits as well.”
That’s because you’re on welfare. I pay for your and your relatives healthcare. I also paid for your Covid bucks. You’re welcome.
Really? Because they let you out of the asylum way before you were cured. Must’ve been those premium benefits at work Vlad…
That’s rich, the pathological liar calling everyone a liar. Jerry, you’re severely fucked in the head.
to Dud Brain
I am not on welfare. Now try another lie
“I am not on welfare.”
If you have less expensive Obamacare insurance, then yes you are. That’s how it works. The subsidies are based on income. Even the upper end of Obamacare is more expensive than it used to be. If Obamacare solved affordable healthcare, then why are people still asking for affordable healthcare? Gee, I wonder. It’s because it caused many more problems than it solved.
I wanted to save $2,500 on my premium. I’m not just bitter because it didn’t work. I’m bitter because he knew Obamacare was a lie. One of the Obamacare architects said as much. It turns out that taxes and subsidies got passed on to people like me to help people like you. When I work overtime, I’m working for you and your family, not me and my family.
Another video from one of your trusted sources:
Dud brain you can try every conceivable outrageous lie but they are just that pure lies.
Everyone pays taxes and those taxes go towards social programs so your far fetched ranting against Obama Care are really bizarre to say the least.
Also you hid the fact that Obama never wanted Obama Care that came about because Obama had to comprise with Republicans because they refused to pass Universal Health Care that all the other civilized nations of the world have had for decades, some over 100 years.
outrageous lie?
I laid the proof out for you fool. They lied about it. I understand how taxes work. You, on the other hand, do not understand what welfare is. I don’t take a dime from the government in the form of any type of subsidy or welfare. I never have outside of a small grant every year in college. I also didn’t receive a single Covid check. How about you? How do you think you got that? How do you think your insurance subsidies are possible? Is it magic?
One would hope so.
But the leftward-bent do tend towards the “I got mine, f— the rest of you.” mindset.
That also happens to be the National Rifle associations outlook on machine guns.
Let’s be honest about that. It really is upto the rest of you to get yours. It’s not my responsibility to give you yours. I wont stand in the way but I’ll take care of me and you take care of you. If you need help then fine, I’ll do what I can. Just don’t look down on me for my efforts to get mine. That’s the way it should be.
Not really, the SRA is too busy buying trailers, pizza, and ignoring new members after their check clears to do anything gun related. John Brown Gun Club is too busy being gropey and rapey pervs. AntiFa doesn’t vote. So that leaves two niche groups of confused people further propping up the party of disarmament with their self-righteous angst.
Leftist may have figured out that the 2A allows them to protect themselves, but they are not smart enough to have figured out that if they don’t vote for their rights they will lose them. For the example just look at lil_d and minorIQ and all the Fudds, to misquote Forrest Gump: Stupid is as stupid votes.
Malicious before stupid as protection for me but none for thee see also NY democratic politicians and a few rinos.
😉
Well now commies got gunz…happy?
NO. I mean, it’s a necessary evil but no, I’m not happy filthy Commies are armed because they get to break laws and then skate, whereas people like you and I do not.
Since when did they not?
Amusing insofar as it plays on stereotypical assumptions.
I’m really not sure why anyone would think that gun rights would suddenly become a top priority for a large percentage of the newbies.
When you buy a car does state abuse of DUI laws or civil asset forfeiture fishing schemes for revenue-ing purposes even cross your mind? Is it common for people to buy their first house and suddenly make it their top priority to reform property taxes?
I hate when people say “y’all” or “folks”/”folx” these days. Those terms have been tainted by Libtards overusing them on social media. They use them to sound like some “inclusive” downhome fudd.
Looks like I forgot the N in my name.
so gfy I will use my colloquial “y’all” and “folks” all I want. I am the south you f ing yankee. you wouldn’t know good sweet tea if it was pissing on you. turn your firearms in at the next buyback while you’re at it. such an insolent pos.
We kicked your ass once you know. We don’t have to include Y’all the next time we set things right.
If you knew anything at all about the civil war, you’d know the north didn’t “kick the south’s ass”…
And if you knew anything about the modern American economy and industry, you’d know the north would never win in a modern rematch made up of the same states.
Though obviously, the coming civil war will be nothing like the last one. Other then it also will be incredibly violent and bloody.
Hey Ansel, what Ron said, only add a hearty dose of me laughing at you pathetic Yankee elitists to it.
I don’t really think that continuing to cede language to the Left is a good idea. That’s a game we have never managed to win and likely never will. If we do we’ll still lose 80% of the time.
One of the Left’s big reservoirs of power is college English departments and there’s a damned good reason for that. Yuri Bezmenov told you all about it in the 1980’s but to this day few seem to recognize it.
“..I hate when people say “y’all”..”
What? should we say ‘youse guys’? lol.
You can make fun of Libertarians all you want, but they are the people that want ALL of our citizens’ freedoms. What some might use to relax is only one of them. We support any of your rights to live as free as you want if it doesn’t affect anyone else’s freedom. It seems that the party is being hijacked by people that have other priorities, but the limited government, lack of intrusion is a good thing. Freedom to barter, have neighborhood exchange policies without being taxed for egg or milk money, goes along with how America was built.
I am proud to take the Libertarian stance – I want all corporations to lose their “citizen” identity and stop the people in power from hiding behind that wall.
I do wholeheartedly engage in ribald laughter at the Libertarian Party, because it doesn’t seem like anything. The Party WAS taken over by lunatics. Now, libertarian principles I very much enjoy for the most part and completely agree with, like every one you listed. But the main issue I have with the total libertarian mindset is that it condones, necessarily, rampant hedonism and frankly presupposes that if morally and philosophically untethered, people just won’t infringe on one another, which is absurd. See the entire history of humanity for proof. Libertarianism for financial and economic growth and stability, Conservative and moral social values for human nature.
And because I don’t feel like engaging in a drawn out, overly pedantic debate with anyone, Christ’s teachings. I am a recent convert to Christianity after basically spending my entire life as an atheist, and I’ve never been happier. And you don’t even have to believe in the Divinity of Christ or in God Himself for the teachings of the Bible to be true and good. Strictly anecdotal, but that’s just to explain my position.
And @rt66paul, I was certainly not trying to disparage you with any of that, you’re good people.
That libertarian mindset you’re describing is how we ended up with mentally ill deviants putting on sex shows for children.
Correct Dude. That is exactly how we have ended up where we are.
I want all corporations to lose their “citizen” identity…
Libertarians essentially want ALL citizens of the U.S. to lose their “citizen” identity because you support open borders which means you essentially want no country at all. Without borders there is no such as a country and its citizens.
@doesky2 Yes sir, those would be the lunatics I was referring to in my post. Your point is salient, and 100% irrefutable.
The LP isn’t being hijacked. It was hijacked.
The recent re-emergence and victory of the Mises Caucus illustrates this in spades, and the fight they had to regain the party was pretty damned savage too.
It’s simply that not many outside serious LP membership pays any attention to the internal machinations of the party because the LP really has no traction at this point, partly because when the Lefties ran the joint they ran everyone else off and partly because the LP has always been small due to a philosophical unwillingness to “grow the brand”. The fact that Mises regained control is, in some ways, surprising. Happy, I guess, but surprising.
Either way, at this point anyone who identifies as a Libertarian is easy to marginalize with mostly banal and imprecise accusations (which are mostly Lefty created slander, honestly) by people who attribute extreme minority positions within the LP to everyone who might espouse the title. Which in some regards is both ironic and hilarious since the Right now uses the exact same attacks that the Left used 10-15 years ago. Nearly word for word too. Funny how capture by a skilled adversary works, eh?
In many regards this is due to a fundamental weakness in the bulk of Libertarian philosophy (by which I mean most schools of Libertarian thought that you wouldn’t call “right leaning Libertarians”).
Ultimately, the weakness of unbridled Libertarianism, which you might say is the more Left-leaning form of Libertarianism that has been dominant for the past decade as well as the “squishy middle”, is that it philosophically assumes that there is no right to preemptive self defense in the form of a rule-making system.
The classic example of this is that a Left-leaning Libertarian society would permit the existence of a Communist enclave within the greater Libertarian society but that if the Commies took over they would not permit the continued existence of a Libertarian enclave.
Lefty Libertarianism is a shockingly unstable philosophical framework that was the insertion point for actual Lefties that took over the LP, essentially, by force and hostage taking which were accomplished by basically using Marcuse as a playbook. This transfection was possible because most of the rest of the Party was full of people who were not predisposed to confront the Left and whom were no prepared for those who would *fail* to argue in good faith. In some respects this is the nature of a small, mostly untested, club.
When resistance was met from right-leaning Libertarians they were, at least initially, quickly dispatched as a minority of “extremists”. Odd considering that they were totally cool with everyone else until five minutes before this, but such is the nature of human social interaction when a skilled manipulator arrives.
It’s pretty hard to argue that the LP of the last few years resembles anything like the Ron Paul platform. End the fed, end the wars and make the Constitution the guidestone of the country. Where’d that open borders and trans shit come from?
@strych9 I know you can’t hear me, but I’m giving you a standing ovation. That was exquisite.
Apologies.
I must have been drunk and unintelligible when I spat out that word salad.
Not much of a defense, but it’s what I got.
No, this statement was perfect. You did get out there on that one a while back, but I don’t even remember what it was about. Besides, who cares? You’ve built up a ton of good capital, you’d have to say something that made it sound like the Pod People got you before I would ever discount anything you said, whether I agreed with it or not. I always read everything you post. Hope you’re well amigo!
Hell, I don’t even think that was you, now that I think about it…
My sister was a Librarian.
But was she an elitist librarian? Makes all the difference in the world. :p
Not too many fans of the Dewey Decimal System still survive in the modern age.
You mean “my sister is a Printed and Electronic Media Archival and Interpretive Retrieval systems specialist? ”
I think our school district hired one of those recently – starting salary of $105,000.
She musta been one of the smart ones from the litter.
Did the person in question have a MS in Library Science?
Serious question, because, yes, that’s a real thing and it’s a common basic qualification to be a librarian. Strange as Hell IMHO, but common nonetheless.
Awaiting moderation for some reason. Sis got her master’s degree for that.
This page might be too old for moderation. I’ll try again. My sister already worked in the school system as a guidance counselor. She got her second master’s for the specific purpose of applying for that job. They no longer call them librarians. She got the job but wasn’t making $100k.
*Found the moderation culprit: I tried to say media [special list]
VOTE DEMOCRAT AND SAVE –
Affordable Health Care
Children’s Lives
Women’s Rights
The Right to Vote
Stopping censorship and Book Burning
Constitutional Rights For All Americans
The Right To Form A Union
A Livable Wage
Social Security
Medicare
Medicaid
Public and Affordable Education
Reduced Environmental Pollution.
Saving the Planet from the Greenhouse Effect.
The Poor
The Elderly
The Working Middle Class
Common sense gun laws
YOURSELF
A vote for a democrat is a vote for a Fascist.
Remember when Obamacare was supposed to give us affordable healthcare and instead it just got more expensive along with a big fat tax if you didn’t get insurance? All lies. The poor lol! We’re all more poor thanks to dem stagflation. Save the planet! From what? Half a degree?
Dud Brain
As usual you twist the truth to fit your own demented political agenda.
Yes it was true some Americans had increased health care costs but over all the majority of Americans saved millions because they no longer had Insurance caps which forced them to seek super expensive high high risk insurance companies and Obama care did away with pre-existing conditions which caused the same outrageous expenses to the average America. Plus children were able to stay on their parents health insurance at a far older age further saving families millions of dollars.
Now Dud Brain try and lie your way out of this one with your often slick distorted picture of what actually happened.
Nope. You always hurl insults and call me a liar, but you never prove it. Obama told me I would save $2,500 on my insurance premium. He knew that was a lie when he said it. Guess what? My premium went up! A LOT! Then he said, “If you like your healthcare plan, you can keep it.” That lie was so egregious that even left wing outlets called it the lie of the year.
I could easily refute your silly little list of lies that Dems are always promising to fix (and instead make worse), but what’s the point? You’re hopeless. It’d be a waste of time. I’d have better luck having a conversation with a lamppost.
Dud brain you moron
Even if it were true what you have lied about guess how much more it would have costed you if you had cancer and your corrupt criminal insurance company could have legally put a cap on your incurred medical costs and then on top of that slapped pre-existing conditions on your medical records. Guess what you idiot you would have went bankrupt for life. You only look at the world from your immediate expense not from any long term benefits. That is why the average cheap, stingy far right stooge does not want to pay even a penny in higher taxes and would rather go bankrupt when he needed insurance coverage or help when he lost his job or needed to go back to school to be retrained.
You just earned the “stupidity award of the year”
And I do not believe for a moment you incurred that much more in insurance costs. If you did you sure as hell were to indolent and shiftless to change insurance companies.
My insurance costs as well as all my relatives went down dramatically and I now get higher benefits as well.
Your turn , try another slick lie.
“Even if it were true what you have lied”
It has been well documented. I’m not the only one who had increased cost. This isn’t news unless you only consume propaganda.
“My insurance costs as well as all my relatives went down dramatically and I now get higher benefits as well.”
That’s because you’re on welfare. I pay for your and your relatives healthcare. I also paid for your Covid bucks. You’re welcome.
Really? Because they let you out of the asylum way before you were cured. Must’ve been those premium benefits at work Vlad…
That’s rich, the pathological liar calling everyone a liar. Jerry, you’re severely fucked in the head.
to Dud Brain
I am not on welfare. Now try another lie
“I am not on welfare.”
If you have less expensive Obamacare insurance, then yes you are. That’s how it works. The subsidies are based on income. Even the upper end of Obamacare is more expensive than it used to be. If Obamacare solved affordable healthcare, then why are people still asking for affordable healthcare? Gee, I wonder. It’s because it caused many more problems than it solved.
I wanted to save $2,500 on my premium. I’m not just bitter because it didn’t work. I’m bitter because he knew Obamacare was a lie. One of the Obamacare architects said as much. It turns out that taxes and subsidies got passed on to people like me to help people like you. When I work overtime, I’m working for you and your family, not me and my family.
Another video from one of your trusted sources:
Dud brain you can try every conceivable outrageous lie but they are just that pure lies.
Everyone pays taxes and those taxes go towards social programs so your far fetched ranting against Obama Care are really bizarre to say the least.
Also you hid the fact that Obama never wanted Obama Care that came about because Obama had to comprise with Republicans because they refused to pass Universal Health Care that all the other civilized nations of the world have had for decades, some over 100 years.
outrageous lie?
I laid the proof out for you fool. They lied about it. I understand how taxes work. You, on the other hand, do not understand what welfare is. I don’t take a dime from the government in the form of any type of subsidy or welfare. I never have outside of a small grant every year in college. I also didn’t receive a single Covid check. How about you? How do you think you got that? How do you think your insurance subsidies are possible? Is it magic?