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Pulse nightclub (courtesy

Over the last four days TTAG has posted dozens of articles on The Pulse nightclub massacre. Scanning the web, we haven’t seen this kind of rabid anti-gun agitation since Sandy Hook. While there’s no question that the Connecticut spree killing had a greater impact on the nation’s psyche, the Orlando mass shooting fallout feels entirely different.

The presumptive Democratic presidential nominee has come out of the civilian disarmament closet, the NRA and her Republican rival are down with “temporarily” denying Americans their gun rights without due process, California is busy redefining the term “full retard” on gun control, the 9th Circuit Court pissed on the Heller and McDonald decisions from a great height (upholding a de facto ban on bearing arms), the Supremes aren’t going to run to the rescue, and the Senate’s set to vote on universal background checks — again — and the whole “no-fly, no buy” misegos.

With Trump negotiating with the NRA and the NRA’s Texas guy Senator Cornyn negotiating with Dianne “Ban Them All and Let God Sort Them Out” Feinstein, there doesn’t seem to be a bright light at the end of this tunnel — unless it’s the headlight of an oncoming train. I’ve never been so pessimistic about our firearms freedom. Or is it me?

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DeSantis Gunhide Question of the Day: What Happens to Gun Rights If Hillary Clinton is Elected President?">Previous Post
DeSantis Gunhide Question of the Day: Are you a Gun Rights "Fundamentalist"?">Next Post


    • It’s an election season, of course it’s different. What pains me more is that Republicans have ran into a great moment of weakness at the worst time. However, now is not the time to despair. Right now is the time to start writing letters making calls, and putting real pressure on our representatives. Traitors like Cornyn will be kicked out of office soon enough, but we need to make it clear that we mean it. Remember to vote this November and in every election you can. RINOs like him need to go and stay gone. Let them know we will not tolerate traitors in our government.

    • The worst of times for gun rights will be next summer when they start rounding up guns. Hillary will be elected with a same-party congress and we will have Australian Style Gun Control.

      Trump is behind in all but one poll over the last two weeks and Hillary leads most of them by double digits. Unless the GOP dumps Trump for an electable candidate, The Game Is Over.

      The Government is NOT going to go house to house collecting weapons, they will use banks, mortgage companies, insurance companies, utility companies and employers to do their dirty work. Hillary’s anti-gun SCOTUS will uphold all of the new laws and regulations. Sorry, but that’s what’s coming.

      • I agree. Operation ChokePoint will be expanded to every financial transaction. The simplest step will be to require all liability insurance companies to include provisions that guns, gun equipment, negligence, possession will void all provisions of the policy, and the attempt to file a claim by persons in possession who attempt to file a claim while declaring they have no guns, etc., will be guilty of fraud without recourse if evidence of guns or ownership is revealed. This would apply to homes, persons, automobile liability insurance.

        Any guesses as to how many gun owners would abandon their guns rather than risk losing everything in a liability claim?

        Or maybe financial institutions will be required to refuse services to any company that does not require a sworn statement by employees that they will not engage in dangerous activities, such as owning or using firearms?

        Or maybe credit/debit card issuers would be required to disapprove any purchase of firearms (kinda hard for FFLs to sell guns for cash only), or gun equipment or maintenance items.

        Or maybe under O-care (or whatever they will call universal government healthcare), if you are a patient who is brought in unconscious and with a firearm, care will be denied, or the patient will be responsible for full reimbursement of whatever care they receive?

        Effective disarmament does not require forced confiscation. You just gotta understand the mindset determined to control every aspect of your life. They are clever, cunning, treacherous, relentless.

    • “Doom and gloom…”

      In the end, Cassandra was correct.

      If declaring warnings is “week”, why should anyone warn anyone of anything?

      If you are receiving urgent warnings, it means something needs to be don to turn things around. Whatever is being done now isn’t getting the job done. Doing the same thing over and over while expecting different results is……

      And if there is nothing to be done except continuing the same ol’, same ol’, then we ARE doomed.

      • CORCY: (first reply was a bit jumbly)

        “Doom and gloom…”

        In the end, Cassandra was correct.

        If declaring warnings is “week”, why should anyone warn anyone of anything?

        If you are receiving urgent warnings, it means action needs to be taken to turn things around. Whatever is being done now isn’t getting the nation where it needs to be. Doing the same thing over and over while expecting different results is……

        And if there is nothing to be done except continuing the same ol’, same ol’, then we ARE doomed.

  1. Nothing to see here….F your vote….the UNI-PARTY just just took a huge swirling dump and it landed on our parchment.

  2. A nicely orchestrated attack on a minority by a clandestine government agency with an all too handy muslim fall guy finally gives them the excuse they wanted to push through the beginnings of the confiscation. We are, as ever, screwed.

    • Why do you idiots come out of the woodwork every time something like this happens?
      Even if there were “false flag” operations, isn’t there a chance that just one of the mass shootings was carried out as reported? Do you not think it possible for someone to commit mass murder? Then why do you brain dead geeks claim every single one as a conspiracy? With zero proof, I might add.

      • Indeed. Not to mention that, if this had actually been a false flag op, the “shooter” would have been an NRA life member, regular Church-goer, frequent commenter in various gun blogs, registered Republican voter, etc.

        • Don’t you know that is what he is now? The narrative went from him being a registered democrat, islamo-fascist to now supposedly being a closeted homosexual who sent emails to co-workers with pictures of black men hanging from trees and black babies shackled to welfare programs. What will they add tomorrow?

  3. When gun rights go away, it’s time to use them.

    It’s never too late to remind your governmental employees that they are just your stupid neighbors who needed a job. If they’ve overstepped their authority they need to pack their gear and go home.

    • I prefer life outside of a jail cell. I’ll let you do all the reminding.

      Meanwhile, I have no problems with Republicans and

      • So, you think one should be jailed for telling government employees to live up to the oath of office they took?

        Interesting view point.

        • Funny too, love,
          L O V E
          the way people go about like it’s never happened before. We’ve done it and we’re only ~ 235 years in. The French has had a revolution, the U.S. has had a border war with Mexico since late 1800’s but in earnest as late as 1905. The U.S.S.R.s not the same, Most of Europe ain’t what it used to be. We nuked Japan partly because of China, now we might pay Japan to nuke China for us. Venezuela’s about to go zombie horde in 71 hours. . .

          Keep messing with the plan, and the plan gets chucked.

          Don’t just assume you’ll be invited in on the successive plan. Either way, you better be bringing your gun to that party. If you ain’t got one? Tough turd, you should’ve paid attention in History class.

        • Talk is cheap. Politicians will accuse you of threatening their lives. Read the first sentence. What needs to be done will be done when it needs to be done. Not talking beforehand. They aren’t listening anyways.

        • Who’s talking? If they can’t protect my right to free speech, they won’t get any warning from me.

          If “they” feel threatened they need to seek counseling and maybe get on some medication. Either way, I would consider it a disqualifying disability on their part.

  4. I think most sensible people saw this coming in 2008 with the election of BHO, and have hopefully used this time to acquire all the weapons they need. They work incrementally, eventually getting to point where you will be unable to legally purchase a firearm….then we will be one crisis away from them wanting to take the ones we have. I will never give mine up to them, and I hope that I won’t be alone.

    • Obama convinced me to return to shooting. I’ve bought a Ruger 10/22, Ruger SR556c, Glock 30sf, and yesterday a M&P Performance center 9mm. I also started hand loading and joined a private gun club since he was elected. I’m teaching my daughters and wife to shoot and recently got a CCL license.

      • Now that’s how you fight back.

        Support the gun economy, culture and next generation.

        Now just when did you have this conversation with BHO that got you all into bullet shooters? I know he’s a great gun salesman, but dayum!


        • FWIW. After having Obama rammed down my daughters’ throats in the local public school district–I will guarantee neither one of them will ever be a liberal. They HATE him.

          Whenever Obama talks about “assault weapons”, I figure he wants me to buy a gun.

    • my first gun was purchased just before his re-election and I immediately went and got my CCW. I have what I need, but not everything I want.

  5. I’m still getting email blast on discounted AR parts and fully built uppers from places like PSA Primary Arms etc.

    MidwayUSA still has 30rd PMags in stock and standard capacity pistol mags as well, and they are only imposing 10qty limits.

    Ammo is a little bleak, but most places are only reporting delayed shipping times and moderately increased prices vs last week.

    Overall this is a way better place than we were in the days post Sandy Hook. The fervor with which both sides are pursuing the issue scares me a little bit, but so far the legislative response looks tee’d up to be a damp squib.

    • “…but so far the legislative response looks tee’d up to be a damp squib.”

      Fingers crossed my friend, fingers crossed.

    • Shipping times have been slowed a tiny bit in some cases. I bought a lower from Primary Arms and it took a day or so extra to get out of their warehouse.

    • PSA has snuck in some price increases on popular upper assemblies, and a number of other items.

      • Their Mid-length slim railed Freedom upper went from $269 to $299
      • “Freedom” BCG went from $79 to $99
      • Mid-length freedom 16″ stainless with BCG and CH went from $279 shipped to $319+Shp
      • Dedicated Glock AR lower from $129 shipped to $159 +Shp
      • 11.5″ Stainless railed upper went from $219 shipped to $299+shp (big increase on that one)
      • D&H Mags went from $6.99ea to $8.99ea
      • Stripped blem lowers went from $69 to $79, but they’ve been higher than their regular $59 ($49 on sale) for quite some time.

      Several other examples, but that is just a sampling. That said, several other items remained unchanged in price, but most of the uppers have gone up in the last few days.

      Yes, I am sick and keep track of these things. 😉 I’m always buying/building something.

  6. Considering all of the progress we’ve made over the last decade for carry rights, I don’t think these are the worst times for gun rights. There’s certainly a potential for things to head that way, but I would say that this is definitely a low point for the NRA. Donald Trump is a Liberal Populist and the NRA throwing themselves at his feet shows the depths to which they’ve sold their souls to the Republican Party. I know who truly stands firm in defense of my rights, and it’s Gun Owners of America.

    • The only bleakness I see is that there is no political will in Washington to stand up against No Fly-No Buy legislation. The only contention is the means of implementing it, and that scares the bejeezus out of me. As for the Peruta ruling, it changes nothing initially. However, it has been used as evidence in Norman v. State of Florida in the Florida Supreme Court to support the contention that the OC ban is unconstitutional. If Florida were under the 9th Circuit, then case against Florida’s OC ban would be a slam dunk. It isn’t and therefore the actual Peruta ruling doesn’t actually amount to a hill of beans.

    • The NRA is only playing the hand they are dealt. And it ain’t much, courtesy of all the Trumpkins out there who wanted to “Burn The B*ch Down” and to Hell with everything else.

      Well, that everything else is now coming home to roost. What do you expect the NRA to do now? Stomp their feet and start a war in the anti-Hillary camp right before the elections?

      On an entirely different level, they are negotiating by demanding due process and delay instead of blacklist and denial. I simply do not see the Dems agreeing to anything remotely resembling what the NRA is asking. Do you?

      • I expect the NRA to support the Constitution, especially 2A, and stay true to the principles that most NRA members hold dear. This is not the first time the NRA has sold out and it will not be the last. I’m letting my membership expire this month and going all in for the SAF. They seem to be the only organization actually moving anything forward for us.

        I understand (but don’t agree with) waffling on the part of politicians. They need to get elected. I expect my gun lobby to stand firm.

  7. This last week feels like we are going to watch as our rights get shredded because of how this attack in Orlando makes people feel, instead of having a concerted effort to look at the facts of the terrorists life and how the many red flags that sprang up before his final act could have been thwarted.

    I blame this man, his wife, the FBI, his employer G4S, but I don’t blame his SIG MCX cause last time I checked it was merely steel and aluminum pieces, and not an autonomous drone under the control of an AI, but a machine operated solely by a human being.

    I wonder where we go from here once the next massacre occurs? Do we lose the entirety of the 2nd by 2017? Will the next deaths be used to politically pressure law abiding gun owners into being further regarded as criminals by the general public and our representatives? What will the next capitulation be? This bodes ill for our future.

  8. The sad part is, we are the only ones feeling the pinch. The majority of the population, right and left, don’t realize the undercurrent. The AWB came and went and gunnies are the only ones who noticed, or cared.

  9. Not even close RF. But stock up. Illinois is better than ever(FOR NOW!). My grown son practically jumped for joy when I just told him I’ll spring for training and his own gun(previously it was contingent on a JOB).

  10. When an actual terrorist attacks and kills 50 people and people’s honest response is “BAN ALL THE THINGS!”

    Yeah, you can bet we are in for a hard time.

  11. Only Trump can save us now. If Hillary gets elected it’s game over for the 2nd amendment. Think about the massive job loss that an all out ban would result in. 100’s of companies put out of business overnight.

    This is pure Tyranny and if we sit back and let it happen we will insult everything that our founding fathers and all those men and women who gave their lives fighting for our freedoms stood for. Might be time to get off the couch, get in shape and get ready to defend Liberty by whatever means necessary.

      • Maybe but a civil war under Trump would be a war between the classes / citizens and illegals. I’m pretty sure that I know how that would turn out but a civil war under Hellary would be the government against it’s citizens and we certainly don’t want that.

        • With how much the members of our armed forces are slanted right, there’s a very real possibility that the militia’s, that the democrats love to make fun of, will have air support.

    • Donald J. Trump

      I will be meeting with the NRA, who has endorsed me, about not allowing people on the terrorist watch list, or the no fly list, to buy guns.

      Jun 15, 2016, 9:50:31 AM

      Good luck with that.

  12. “I’ve never been so pessimistic about our firearms freedom. Or is it me?”

    There is no room for pessimism. Take action. Tell the NRA what you think. Tell Congress what you think. And I don’t mean something like, “Hey guys, Larry here. I’m not sure I like what you’re doing.” Get pissed. You should be anyway. Channel that anger into empassioned speech so the NRA, GOA, Congress- whoever, knows you mean it.
    Maybe you’ll have an impact, maybe you won’t.

    One thing is certain though: Doing nothing is the worst possible course of action for us, and if it causes us to lose even one inch, we’ve already lost a mile.

    • Pessimism is merely an attitude, not an action or inaction. There is always a time for pessimism when the writing is on the wall. Yes take action. Action as a result of warranted pessimism.

      • I never said it was an action or inaction. I said there’s no room for it. And whether it’s warranted or not is irrelevant; the gun community needs optimism right now. We need to remind ourselves that we can defeat the anti-gun crowd and maintain our rights.

        • Michael in GA – You’re not a realist- you’re a quitter. Thank God most gun owners don’t share your losing attitude. If they did, we would have been disarmed decades ago.

          Can’t believe you would go out of your way to pick apart a fellow gun owner who was only trying to remind others to stay vigilant and that hope isn’t lost. You’re a real credit to the cause.

        • You are blinded by anger and missed the part where I said take action. I never implied give up. We’re all pissed off at the state of the world right now. I think we just define pessimism differently. You believe it results in inaction where I personally can believe the shit’s going to get ugly and will fight to restore freedom.

  13. Yeah… If the best that the Demokkkrats can come up with is the two proposals they needed to strong-arm into even getting a vote… Not concerned.

    They can have their petty little victory, we’ll clean house in November, one way or the other.

    • If our guys had any balls at all they would be in the middle of a “counter filibuster” to limit the number of abortions a woman may have in her lifetime. Lol imagine the fun they could have spending the whole day proving empirically that single mothers kill more children through abuse and neglect than all the nations guns combined!

  14. With each one of these incidents the antis get more despicable. They look to incrementally implement useless infringements because they can’t get traction on the bigger issues. I am hoping that we are stronger now than post Sandy Hook because we gained many people into the fold after that incident. I personally know dozens of people who tooled up after Sandy Hook. Does that mean they are politically active? Maybe not. But we have the numbers beyond ever before. We all need to be putting pressure on our representatives as usual.

    • I tooled up just before Sandy Hook. I sat on 1 box of 9mm ball ammo for the better part of a year because I couldn’t feed my firearm. I now have enough ammo (and some reserve ammo in calibers I don’t even own a firearm in).

    • “I personally know dozens of people who tooled up after Sandy Hook”

      That’s me, before SH I had no guns – always been a supporter of gun rights but not an owner.

      Now we have a number of them, including carry permit and working on having enough ammo.

      • Hey good to see a relative newcomer(I got into guns a few years before Newtown) that sounds like they’re NOT…good moniker too.

  15. It’s never fun when a body wholly ignorant of a subject sets up to dictate to someone who is knowledgeable of the subject the parameters in which that subject should exist within reality.

    2016 witch hunt. Just be glad we’re not dogs or the monsters would just vote we all be put to death ala Denver, CO.

  16. I actually hope that the “no fly, no buy” bill passes. Under the current system, there is no right to air travel and there are clearly functional alternatives available. As a result, standing is an uphill battle. Extend it to the 2A and you should see it overturned.

    The universal background check, on the other hand….that has me more wary.

  17. Yup. I think it “feels” different this time too.
    I was going over my inventory last night to see where I’m short.
    5.7 ammo is my only shortage.
    Might just buy a few lowers as a hedge.

  18. I think we are at the high water mark as far as gun rights and availability are concerned. In Muscle Car years, it is now 1970.

  19. I can assure you the worst is yet to come. When Hillary wins and the Senate turns, you can kiss your rights goodbye.

  20. Over 8,000 Americans died that same day, yet these 50 that died dancing, and or drunk and trying to get laid are the ones that mattered most in so many of our imbecile fellow citizens pea brains.

  21. I never need to buy another gun. Don’t own and don’t want to own an EBR. Stock up on a few more boxes of ammo and I’m doing ok.

    I will continue to support the pro gun cause. But it’s past time for us to come together and work as one. No more lame ass statements like “move to a free state”. Unless we work together there will be no such animal as a free state.

  22. This Texas senator should surrounded by a thousand open carry Texas voters the next time he visits the state. The signs should read you will be replaced.

  23. No. Most of you are young, so you don’t remember the lack of opposition to the laws put in place following the deaths of the sainted Kennedy clan brothers. After Robert Kennedy was shot, oh, the wailing and gnashing of teeth. The Democrats controlled the Congress and the White House, and so the GCA ’68 sailed through – because one drunken Irishman (Dodd Sr.) got his lace panties in twist that “guns had killed” two other Irishmen, JFK and RFK. So Dodd Sr. cribbed the GCA from German gun control laws in the 1930’s, and here we are. Prior to the GCA ’68, there was none of this nonsense we have today with FFL’s. If you wanted to be a gunsmith, you got some tools and hung out a shingle.

    The one thing that is better about this time than the 60’s is that we’re now rid of the “Camelot” twaddle that surrounded that bunch. Most people now see them for what they were – a bunch of no-account, drunken womanizers.

    The Kennedy clan: Good riddance to bad rubbish.

  24. Gun rights become more threatened as the electorate becomes more stupid. And right now, the electorate is so stupid that it can’t wipe it’s own ass without a book of illustrated directions.

    The Orlando night club disaster was the one thing that the gungrabbers have been praying for, and they got it.

    • All rights are becoming threatened as the electorate becomes more stupid.

      The hand-waving over due process rights is absolutely infuriating.

  25. The usual talking heads are doing their thing, and the fossil anti-gunners in Congress are trotting out their same tired old failed legislation. I’m not pessimistic in the least. I doubt if we see any anti-gun action of note in this first wave of indignant “DO SOMETHING” fervor. Then, in a couple more months, we’ll probably quietly see pro-gun progress in reducing size/number of gun-free zones and more freedom for open carry or national reciprocity.

    The harder these old dudes rail about needing to do something, the more the word gets out that doing the stuff they want to do flat out doesn’t work.

  26. “Is This The Worst of Times for Gun Rights?”

    Not yet. Pull up your favorite chair, grab a Dos Equuis, grill some burgers and watch it as it comes to a town near you.

  27. On a brighter note, more people are realizing that they need to be prepared to defend themselves and are tooling up. The last batch of pols & talking heads trot out their standard responses unaware that the next generation is beginning to catch on to their BS. This may be a tipping point in our favor.

  28. We need to realize that our team has a great chance to welcome yet another, at risk segment, into our ranks. Let’s welcome the LGBT community into ours. We don’t care about your race, your gender, your religion, etc. Welcome and good for you to start taking your own security seriously. Now go out and get a gun and some training.

    • They do not care, they vote for the Dems in large numbers because they have bought into the “I am a victim, I am owed free stuff” mindset.

      Ever stop to think our values/ideals are not universal and some groups are indifferent/openly hostile to them?

      • I think you are right; let’s suppose you are right. Now, then, how does this go? So Congressman Democrat is out in his district speaking to his constituents. A substantial minority of his LGBT constituents are “packing” (in the customary sense). A substantial minority of his straight constituents are also packing. So, what theme will Congressman Democrat be emphasizing his his talking points? All the gun control legislation he is sponsoring? Or, will he turn to his spend-tax-borrow-the-rest for the children legislation.
        It’s not out of the question for traditional Democrat supporters (minorities, LGBT, union members, etc.) to become equally concerned with their families’ personal safety as they are with spend-and-tax-and-borrow-some-more issues. This IS the formula for the “third-rail” kind-of-issue. There is nothing the Democrats can do to stop a voter from becoming more concerned about her personal safety and that of her children then she is about a “woman’s right to choose”.

      • It is time to invite them to our cause. Radical Islamic Terrorists want to kill and enslave us no matter our lifestyle choices. It is time to stand together. The political elite and the government cannot and often will not protect us. I and most on TTAG recognize that we are responsible for our own survival. The LGBT community is starting to recognize that they cannot simply hide in a bathroom stall waiting for TJ Hooker to come to their rescue. Let’s teach them to protect themselves.

  29. Guys, hate to say it but be prepared to lose alot of your freedoms over the next decade as our society is further “over civilized.” A new AWB like the ’93-’94 fiasco is the best case senario. Think instead of a new NFA category called Asslt Weapons where we pay $200 per AW to keep or buy a new AR or AK or HK or whatever your pleasure. Now you can say “I will not comply” or civil war or whatever. But when you have millions of sheep stampeeding to the left side of the boat it doesnt matter what 5, 10 or even $1,000 people do. As gun owners were not a “protected class,” we dont sign petitions by the hundreds of thousands, etc-we rely on the silent majority and pray. Not a great strategy. Maybe the NRA should be on an out reach campaign, educate real people, do petition drives. Partner with the ACLU who also hates the no fly, no buy. Do something before our shrinking 1st ammendment rights are gone as well-already everything liberals deem impolitic is labeled hate speech, bigoted or islmaphobic. Its deleted by Facebook, shamed by the media, and the insolent soul uttering it is cast out of the city, vilified and loses their job. Better do something before the “freedom for the thought we hate” is gone and our America with it.

  30. The best of times!!
    Because I see in times of crisis the people you can really count on.
    And who you can’t count on. Homosexual leadership you can’t count on. Liberal gun owners are FUDD. They will vote for any gun grabbing democrat. All tho they did vote for Bush over Al Gore back in 2000. I think now that was just a fluke.


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