“Election day is approaching fast,” the NRA reminds us [via ammoland.com]. “The NRA Political Victory Fund has rated, and in some races, endorsed pro-gun/pro-hunting candidates for the Florida Primary Election and others. These candidate ratings and endorsements can now be found at the NRA-PVF website. Before casting your vote in the Primary Election, please visit this site [click here] to learn who will best protect your Second Amendment rights and sporting heritage.” OK, so . . .
Is there any case where you wouldn’t vote your guns? Where some other issue would take precedence over firearms freedom and you’d vote for a candidate who was squishy to antagonistic about gun rights? Have you ever done so before?
I vote the whole constitution, so if someone would be willing to gut the rest but still try to appease gun owners I would be worried, but that is not typically the way it happens. So, No I always vote guns first.
They’re starting to do that. The past few days we’ve seen more than a few articles saying that the Dems don’t want to take our guns away, yet people still don’t know that there are more and more laws being made that restrict our privacy rights, due process and constitutional protections. All in the name of “safety”.
Can you say Governor William Weld, now the VP candidate with Libertarian presidential candidate Gary Johnson? Anti-gun guy who says he is for freedom. That’s a mouthful of crap. And the fact that Johnson chose Weld tells me that he is anti-gun, too.
I like to think they nominated him because Trump is squishy on guns, and they don’t want to put forward someone who will take many 2A votes away from trump. I would like to think the Libertarians put forth a soft candidate so that more libertarians would hold their nose and vote Republican.
I’m not convinced I’m right though.
I’m convinced that you are engaged in wishful thinking. The Libertarian party has no interest in getting Republicans elected any more than democrats. They see what is probably the best opportunity ever for a shot at a third party getting elected due to extreme strife within both establishment parties. There are plenty of libertarians also unhappy with Johnson and Weld for a variety of reasons but my thought is that they were nominated because they were recognized, respectable, and potentially electable. They are squishy libertarians, but on a debate stage they would look like the adults in the room.
On guns, Weld came from an anti state controlled by his opposition party. I don’t think Johnson is a 2A absolutist, but I’ve seen nothing suggesting he’s anti either. As president and vp congress would set the tone for any and all action on guns, but there would be hell to pay at the next LP convention if they took any anti-liberty stances in office.
No, no, and no.
If the Second goes down to defeat or is gutted, the rest will surely follow.
Yup. The 2nd is the “canary in the coal mine” for the Bill of Rights.
Yep yep yep. Plus it seems to me people who respect the second generally have a much better understanding of and respect for the rest of the constitution too.
I keep it even simpler. I just never vote for a fucking Democrat. Never.
While I wouldn’t call myself a single-issue voter I do find that a candidate’s position on the people’s right to keep AND BEAR arms does save me some time: if they’re wrong on that, they’ll likely vote the wrong way on anything else.
Only if someone were going to destroy the country while appeasing gun owners. But it’s easy for me because the people who want to revoke the second amendment usually want to do things that destroy the country or otherwise just don’t resonate with me. So, vote guns.
Yes, if Donald Trump were the Republican nominee.
Hold your nose and vote for Trump, don’t be stupid and throw your vote away.
You can tell a lot about a candidate based on the tactics his supporters use. This is the first time I can remember that the Republican candidate’s supporters were reduced to calling people stupid and telling them who they had to vote for. He’s an ass, and I’m not voting for him. Deal with it.
Republicans are saying that about the Libertarians and the Democrats are saying that about the Greens.
What makes this cycle exciting is both outside parties have the power to swing this election.
I’d never presume to tell someone how to vote, but I would like to point out two words from history that demonstrate why I am willing to choose the lesser of two evils rather than vote for a third party.
Agreed! Between swing states and the electoral college, your vote isn’t as important as you might think. But if third party people do well, that’ll send a message that we need halfway decent candidates. It’s the only vote that really says something positive.
Support your gun rights by joining the NRA and voting pro gun people locally rather than getting upset about people not wanting to support Trump. He’s an idiot (AND he supported the assault weapon ban up until a few months before he ran so….)
Then the freedoms you take for granted will be gone. Deal with it!
I don’t take freedom for granted. If you think Trump the statist will defend freedom, you’re delusional.
You can tell a lot about a candidate based on the tactics his supporters use.
Democrats for the past 40-50 years have regularly and systematically falsely accuse the entire Republican party and base to be Sexist, Intolerent, Xenophobic, Homophobic, Islamophobic, Racist, and Bigoted (SIXHIRB as Prager coined). Their actions have done real harm to our country. Hildebeast’s campaign is entirely based on the Balkanization of America.
“You can tell a lot about a candidate based on the tactics his supporters use.”
“He’s an ass, and I’m not voting for him.”
Yea, real genius there, like super-genius. Did you get that from an ACME catalog, genius?
“Democrats for the past 40-50 years have regularly and systematically falsely accuse the entire Republican party and base to be Sexist, Intolerent, Xenophobic, Homophobic, Islamophobic, Racist, and Bigoted (SIXHIRB as Prager coined). Their actions have done real harm to our country.”
Quite true. And Trump’s nomination was the moment the Republican party became as disgusting and destructive as they are.
“Yea, real genius there, like super-genius. Did you get that from an ACME catalog, genius?”
Well, he is an ass. And I am not voting for him.
Quite true. And Trump’s nomination was the moment the Republican party became as disgusting and destructive as they are.
How do you make it through daily life without being able to discern BAD from WORSE?
Again (and McCann) the Republican Party did not select Trump. The Rep Party is about evenly between RINOs (mostly NE & West Coast flaming moderates) and Conservatives. NEITHER want Trumpy.
Trumpy was selected by a minority of “never showed up before” fed up mixed lot of newbies. Then all the other candidates dropped out.
BUT for all those (Conservatives) who have been holding nose and voting for RINOs since 1988, Trump is at east a different holding nose candidate and NOT an Fing RINO. So I predict most will vote for him. I will.
IN ANY CASE. freaking ANYONE by the Dowager Empress. And that does not include some “3rd party” pothead candidate. None of these bozos are ever going to get elected you certifiable.
It’s either The witch or Trump. You know exactly what you’re get with the witch and perhaps will Trump will come thru perhaps not. I don’t think (or hooe) he is the machiavellian/cynical liar about what he says that is Hellery. If you’re assuming that he is lying about everything he says, then you think he is 100% identical to Hellery. Do you? If there is 1% difference between the 2 then you have to vote Trump.
“Again (and McCann) the Republican Party did not select Trump.”
We did, though. The fact that it’s regrettable doesn’t mean it didn’t happen.
Right, because Trump winning the White House is so much worse than Hillary occupying the White House and appointing 3 U.S. Supreme Court Judges who will effectively overturn the Second Amendment.
If that is most definitely NOT what you want, you sure have a funny way of showing it, not voting for Trump and all.
Honestly, I can see the elderly SCOTUS associates toughing it out for 4 years in the hopes Trump’s replacement will be better.
Meaning, we get to replace Scalia and that’s about it, for now…
That’s a bunch of wishful thinking that is not based in reality.
The Democrats just spent 4 days detailing how Hillary would be different than Trump.
You gonna just dismiss that also?
Yea, maybe so. On the other hand if HRC is elected, these same justices will see the writing on the wall and at some point will self-sacrifice themselves to insure that they are replaced by her.
So what if you think they will try and hold out for one cycle? So for all we know then next 4 years will be Trump or someone better… you have to make your decision in the now.
Donald Trump IS the Republican nominee. There is no other Republican on the 2016 ballet. You can vote for a Republican who can win or you can vote for a Democrat who can win. That is your entire choice.
Well, that’s just not true. It’s my vote, I can do as I please with it. I won’t be voting for either Trump or Hillary.
Any vote for any candidate other than Trump is a vote against the 2nd Amendment. Your conscience or your pride is all thats going to be in your gunsafe if Hillary gets elected. So suck it up and do what needs to be done.
Of course, you are right. I meant and should have said:That is your entire choice if you want your vote to help get someone elected president. Only Hillary or Trump will be elected president.
“Only Hillary or Trump will be elected president.”
Whichever it is will do it without my vote.
Can’t he vote for a different loser?
No, because quite a few simpletons believe that he has to vote for the platform they firmly believe in even though he doesn’t.
“No, because quite a few simpletons believe that he has to vote for the platform they firmly believe in even though he doesn’t.”
Slip of the mask?
We here unabashedly ‘believe in’ the ‘Pro Gun’ platform. So, yeah…if he even THINKS he is ‘pro-gun’ he kinda sorta HAS to believe in the same platform as the rest of us.
On the other hand, if he doesn’t believe in the same platform, he ain’t pro-gun.
It’s really kinda simple, a fact that does not necessarily make it accessible to some folks.
There is only one platform in the running that is at least trying to appear to support gun rights, and that’s Trump’s platform.
Gun rights are an issue, not a platform.
“Gun rights are an issue, not a platform.”
Which platform has a decidedly anti-gun plank and which does not?
As I said, it’s a very simple concept, but seems for some reason to be beyond the reach of many POTG.
I got educated by a bunch of comments about voting and the Electoral College. Apparently, it does not matter how you vote for president. Only the vote of the Electoral College matters. So why not vote for whoever you think has the funniest name? Hillary could get 95% of the popular vote, and still lose in the Electoral College. Same for Trump. All these years, and I just now figured-out the popular vote for president is just to keep the public happy.
– as always, lasttoknow
Sorry, words mean things. Trump’s an ass. I’m not voting for him.
So, the sum of your argument is “Trump’s an ass.”
That’s pretty weak minded. And not “Pro 2A” at all. In fact, it borders on downright ANTI-2A.
Who cares if he’s an ass or not? This is not voting for “Bestest Buddy” popularity contest. It’s a vote for who will nominate SCOTUS justices, roll back or pass EO’s (that advise the ATF and FBI, for example) and have veto power/signing power of legislation that comes out of Congress.
“He’s an ass” sounds like a whiney 13 year old girl that does not like the girl at the next lunch table because “she called me a slut” or something.
It’s an argument with no substance.
I’m kinda lost on this one. I did not declare anyone to be “an ass”. I was responding to someone who stated there were only two candidates a person could vote for. Knowing there is always more than one presidential candidate on a ballot, my question was why couldn’t a person vote for one of those who are sure to lose. Now that I know the popular vote means nothing, my only real influence is on all the other offices.
So, the sum of your argument is “Trump’s an ass.”
As usual, if you weren’t full of shit, you wouldn’t have to make things up.
Trump is the republican canidate, but unless it looks like Texas might swing blue, I won’t vote for him. I typically vote at the end of the day anyway. Not voting for trump isn’t throwing away your vote. It sends a message. If I lived in a swing state, I would feel differently, but I don’t.
If you think that not voting “til the end of the day” gives you some capability of knowing how the rest of the state voted, you haven’t watched many elections. There will be no indications of results until all of the state’s polls are closed. As always.
Voting for someone other than Trump (or not voting at all) will feel good. Unfortunately, doing anything other than voting for Trump undermines the Second Amendment on this election.
What is more important to you? Doing what feels good and undermining the Second Amendment? Or voting for Trump and hopefully bolstering the Second Amendment?
That’s unfortunate, but not dispositive. I am not a single issue voter, and I don’t trust Trump on gun rights anyway.
“I am not a single issue voter,”
And there’s the real answer.
I’m guessing you are the type that has used the phrase (or one similar) to “Our Hobby” when talking about guns. You want your guns, but apparently are willing to give them away for these other “issues” that are so important to you.
That’s a bad trade.
Many of us understand that an armed citizenry is the ONLY thing that protects all the other rights, and indeed “individuality” itself over “the State Collective.” I don’t know what other ‘issues’ you throw into the mix, but it seems quite clear you don’t value individual, natural rights very high on the list.
See the remarks above about “Canary in the Coal Mine” the 2A represents for clarification if you don’t follow.
As for your other point, not trusting Trump is one thing; thinking Hillary will be better is a whole nuther ball game.
” but it seems quite clear you don’t value individual, natural rights very high on the list.”
Any other really stupid, baseless conclusions to share with the class?
The fact that I do value individual freedom so highly is the main reason I’m so put off by the hive-mindedness of many progun communities.
@McCann…..No it’s not a “hive mind”.
You can see and read that many Republicans are conflicted that they have such a poor choice. Therefore you end up with the Never Trump which unfortunately will not be for the betterment of America.
In contrast you do not see any of the Democratic party establishment leading a Never Hillary campaign against the thievery and national security violations of Hillary. There isn’t a “standards issue” with Hillary because the Democratic hive has no standards to violate.
You’re currently running on emotions and feelings and that is usually the Democratic trait that results in poor decisions.
“In contrast you do not see any of the Democratic party establishment leading a Never Hillary campaign against the thievery and national security violations of Hillary. There isn’t a “standards issue” with Hillary because the Democratic hive has no standards to violate.”
That just isn’t true. Bernie Sanders was booed by his own supporters when he endorsed her, for example. And even if it were true it wouldn’t make me more likely to vote for Trump.
“You’re currently running on emotions and feelings and that is usually the Democratic trait that results in poor decisions.”
Give me a break. I’ve never voted for a Democrat in my life and, barring some seismic shift in the political landscape, almost certainly never will. You, on the other hand, aggressively exhibit the kind of tribalism that makes them, and now Trump supporters, so disgusting. Whether you like it or not, people who disagree with you often have valid reasons for doing so.
“Whether you like it or not, people who disagree with you often have valid reasons for doing so.”
Yeah, “valid” reasons dimwitted reasons like “he’s an ass.”
We got it. You don’t LIKE him.
This election is not about what you like or your ‘feelings’ about the candidates. It’s about what the candidates will DO…or, at least so far as it can be told, what they SAY they are going to do.
Someone being an ass is a valid reason for not supporting him for the office of chief executive. He’s also a trade protectionist who advocates bad economic policies and only recently decided to start lying about his support for gun control.
But, of course, prior to my last message I never offered Trump being an ass as a reason that I’m not voting for him. I disagree with his positions; I’m not voting for him; and I don’t owe you an explanation as to why.
I read a bunch of comments yesterday between two readers who were fighting over agreeing with one another. The popular vote for president is just bread and circuses for the masses, as I understand it. According to the comments yesterday, our opinion only counts in how members of the Electoral College are chosen. It may be different for all the other elections.
The electoral college makes good sense just like it did 200+ years ago unless you want Mexifornia to decide every election.
“The electoral college makes good sense”
I don’t know if it does or does not, but I do know my vote for president means nothing. I will be looking for the goofiest name available for president, and vote that one. For the rest of the list, I will vote principle as much as possible.
No. Any politician who does not understand and respect the right to keep and bear arms certainly would not understand or respect any of the other rights guaranteed by the Constitution.
The RKBA is a bellweather, even more radical and extreme than freedom of hate speech or throwing out tainted evidence. I can’t imagine any politician standing up for the Second Amendment under all circumstances, yet stomping over the others, but if there were one, it would be an obvious lie.
Usually those strong on the second amendment follow pretty well with the rest of rights.
I do many folks that yout themselves as strong on civil rights that only look at the 1st and 4th. And then only really support your rights if you agree with them and say what they think is appropriate.
We will only survive is we worry about other people’s rights. All of their rights.
Agreed. Although it’s not the only right it’s one of the easiest for people to make the excuse of “cutting back” and therefore it’s going to be a first indicator of other undesirable eliminations to come. No candidate is perfect when it comes to such things either, even our founding fathers had a lot of debate over the contents of the constitution and they’re likely some of the purest proponents thereof as a whole.
I weigh all candidates by their support for the entire Bill of Rights. I prefer candidates that are strong supporters of individual rights.
This election will certainly test me. If Trump could just STFU, I would feel a lot better about voting for him. Seriously Donald, just don’t say anything.
If they can just silence him to an occasional sound byte. Do a polished media blitz. Get him ready for what promises to be an extremely challenging debate series (Hillary may be the most dishonest politician in modern history but she’s no fool).
The packaged message resonates with people. That with the hatred and distrust the majority of Americans feel for Hillary could win the day.
My conclusion is that Trump is a clown, syaing whatever outrageous things get the most applause, while Hillary has 40 years political experience trying to look serious, even if she has no more grasp of basic economics than Trump or Sanders. I suspect that Trump will baffle and confuse her in debates, wrong foot her so often that she will lose her cool in exasperation. Trump’s supporter don’t want a serious wonk, they’ve had enough of establishment speakers.
I despise Trump as a wannabe Mussolini mini-fascist. But Hillary scares me more, because Trump hasn’t got the focus to follow through, and he’s too volatile for any consistency to surface.
“My conclusion is that Trump is a clown, syaing whatever outrageous things get the most applause”
Then you are fooled by the MSM and the cuck punditry.
Trump is anything but a clown. He is a master strategist, and everything he says is calculated to produce a result: exposure of weakness in his political enemies (which includes the press).
Look at the Russia thing the other day…a simple throw-away joke that had them talking more about him than the people speaking at the DNC that day. Or the deal with Melania at the Republican Convention: they were talking about her comparing her to “First Lady” making that psychological connection.
You folks need to wake up and smell the “Victory” in Trump’s actions. He won the nomination and he’s beginning to show real signs of winning against Hillary (much to the naysayers chagrin that “he can’t beat Clinton”), and he’s making these victories for a reason.
(And no, it ain’t because his followers are ‘stupid.’ It’s anything but. Trump supporters are among the most educated and intelligent demographic, and that statement is based on the polling data).
If you think Trump is a master strategist, you may be right, but it ain’t in pursuit of what you think or want. He IS a clown, can’t voice any coherent plan, thinks he can actually round up 12 million Mexicans, thinks he can build a 2000 mile 100 ft high wall and get the Mexican government to pay for, thinks judges enact laws ….
I expect Trump to win precisely because his master plan to to not appear coherent in the establishment manner. He is dumping out tea leaves by the bucket load and laughing at all the fools who think there is coherency and planning present. His financial wizardry is a joke; he started out a billionaire and has basically treaded water ever since, lots of splashing, lots of up and down from the waves, but that’s all.
Which is precisely why he does not scare me as President nearly as much as Hillary does. She also has no coherent thought, she hasn’t got the understanding of reality or economics provided by a summer class, and she has the ethics of kings and dictators, buttressed by an entitlement attitude built up over 20 years of political snubs, reinforced by having to pretend Bill is honorable and faithful.
I don’t care if you are one of the Trump gullible. It’s your business, not mine. But it annoys me no end that you think there are only two opinions about Trump: for and against.
JR is right.
Look at that ‘offhand’ remark about Putin finding the 30,000 e-mails.
With that one ‘casual’ crack, he *completely* kicked the legs out from under the DNC convention’s message, that comment OWNED the news cycle for TWO DAYS…
The only thing Trump is masterful at is self-advertisement. Your own proofs prove nothing else. His stated goals conflict every other day; trying to pin him down on any real plan other than drawing attention to himself is a lost cause.
He will win the election because, like all the Trump supporters, no one knows what he really stands for. He will win the debates because Hillary is only good at repeating what little wonkery supports her goal of fulfilling her destiny of being elected, and she has no idea how to counter someone as volatile as Trump. She is like a decomissioned battleship, plowing ahead from inertia alone, damn the torpedoes, full of obsolescence and happy in her ignorance of it, while Trump is like a squadron of speed boats with no overall command or guidance.
And Trumpets see all his mindless activity as strategy, while its only goal is to dazzle the news helicopters. At the end of the day, Hillary will be stalled at sea, motionless, floundering without headway, completely at a loss as to what happened, and Trump’s speedboats will have crossed the finish line and be looking for a new mindless goal.
So . . . . you’re going to vote for Clinton? Or maybe for Johnson, an also ran who will never be in the WH, in which case you’re giving Clinton another vote ahead. It’s people like you who have put us in the position we’re in by not standing united.
Nothing I have more contempt for are people who say a wall can’t be built by the only country that set foot on the moon 45+ years ago when the fastest computer was slower than a 4$ calculator today, Second, if Isreal can build a wall through their rocky terrain that keeps out crazy Islamists we can build one to keep out Juan Pablo the taco maker.
Lastly, I don’t give a F#$k how much it costs, I’d gladly pay my share for it, but at the same time taxing money transfers back to Mexico seems entirely feasible.
What’s the fun in that… I want him to keep talking, especially once the debates start and he is saying sh*t to/about Clinton other folks wouldn’t dream of saying.
All aboard the Trump Train: I am not saying it won’t wreck, I’m just saying it was going to wreck anyways, so might as well have fun.
That’s a loaded question. If a candidate was like we are going to genocide (insert any ethnic group here) but you (insert other ethnic group) can keep your guns I would still vote for someone else, while buying lots of Ammo and enough mags to make them disposable.
I agree with the above comments in general and YES I vote Pro-2A as much as possible.
I am sure we could craft a bad combination of a candidate that we wouldn’t want to vote for as mentioned above with the current laws/conditions in place.
We’ve already had right wing candidates who’ve already violated some of the following:
Amendment 4 – against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.
In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the state and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the assistance of counsel for his defense.
This one is a bit of a stretch but allowing the FBI/CIA/ETC the latitude to install spy software on your computer falls under this as well as the 4th… some are arguing that an automated SPY is a soldier.
Amendment 3 – No soldier shall, in time of peace be quartered in any house, without the consent of the owner, nor in time of war, but in a manner to be prescribed by law.
All it takes is for any of us to be labelled terrorist (as the DHS has try to do with veterans) and ….
I am a one issue voter plain and simple. From this one issue, the rest of the candidate’s character can be plainly seen. That issue is abortion. Someone who advocates or supports abortion is a fiend, a murderer, and evil. In that order. Anybody who can take the life of an innocent child has no problems taking away your rights despite their cavils to the contrary.
I’ll explain further from a religious perspective. While I don’t understand the apocalyptic book of Revelation or agree with some of the interpretations of it, one thing that does stand out to me is how the book talks about a man’s system vs. God’s system. Much ink has been spilled regarding the “Mark of the Beast” and how it will be on a hand or forehead in the end times. It seems that this is merely symbolic of what is actually happening. A better interpretation is that the hand represents action while the head denotes acceptance. In other words, I won’t do what you do, but I’ll accept it and maybe even enjoy watching you do it. An example for today would be ‘if you want to have a bakery, you must make wedding cakes even if it goes against your religious objections.’ Without the ‘mark of the beast’, you can’t buy and sell. Here is how it is being accomplished. http://www.wnd.com/2016/04/judgment-day-for-christian-baker-violating-faith/
Returning to the issue at hand, a gun-rights politician who also supports abortion is a house divided that cannot stand. He or she will compromise your rights and freedoms and is not to be trusted. Remember this–freedom has never sprung from evil.
So, *David*, your single issue is one which could never possibly affect you, personally? Past, present, or future? Interesting brainwork, there.
Always the interesting question.
Does one support only candidates who claim they will vote your way on every issue? Does one stand and say it doesn’t make any difference what else a candidate pledges to do, they must do this one thing that is really important to me…something for which I will accept defeat on every other life issue in order to protect this one?
“Is there any case where you wouldn’t vote your guns?”
What about me…? I like to fist…
*Holds up fist* Can I fist you, too…?
Sulu’s voice. “Oh, My.”
*roars of laughter*
Although there are many other items that interest me, like the rest of the Bill of Rights including the routinely trashed by both parties10th Amendment, I am a 2nd Amendment first kind of guy.
There are some places that have the luxury of having a choice, especially in the primary: Wisconsin has the distinct honor of being able to send Open Borders Ryan packing in the upcoming primary and replacing him with Nehlen who is against open borders and might even be better on 2nd Amendment issues.
No. Not in any case.
In this election, if elected, Hillary will destroy the 2nd Amendment. Period. I don’t know what Satan himself would do to the constitution. I know what she will do because she has said so.
I have been forced by the dems suicidal stance on gun control to vote for the gop. I believe in the separation of church and state. I favor a number of social programs and believe a first world country has an obligation to it’s weaker members. I think Adam and Steve have a right to marry. Just as they have a right to tool up to protect themselves. Businesses that are open to the public should be open to all members of the public.
But because of the dems blind retardation on civil rights I have no option but to vote gop.
I’m in almost exactly the same position. I used to vote for Democrats, but that was before I saw the insane hypocrisy of their position on civil rights and their profound hostility to individual rights.
And like others here have said, the Second Amendment is the canary in the coal mine on both counts. So guns aren’t the only issue that pushes my vote, but they’re the biggest one.
+1. GOP used to be the “do it our way or else” party….now have become the party of independence. Trump is just an aweful disgusting tacky NYC personality and the type of silver spoon douche who enjoys screwing people out of money – he is a “master” alright…a master-bater. He is not a good guy, and his entire family wreak of the stench of spoiled brats. all the Rebuplicans candidate prior to the primary’s who folks on this site supported now HATE the guy, with several GOP life timers saying Hillary would make a better president. as i said before, i will vote for 2a in this election (Trump), but 2A will lose BECAUSE of Trump.
…and believe a first world country has an obligation to it’s weaker members.
And America citizens did take care of here own just like Hillary happened to mention in her acceptance speak when her…”14 YO old mother abandoned by her parents in 1933 were helped by the kindness of strangers”.
Anybody want to bet that a church may have been involved in that pre “Great Society” America help to Hillary’s mother?
The Republicans are for a governmental safety net rather than a way of life that has totally created an addiction to the government teat for 10’s of million of people.
Just so happens that our church recently got into a county program of distributing free food targeted for the poor. My wife noted that 75% of the poor people drove up in cars better then this engineers car and two of them (out of 40 or so) had new car temp tag on them and one being a nice new glossy Toyota Highlander. Kinda made you go hmmmmmm.
“Peace through superior fire power”. Or, WE won’t kill you if you fallow our rules. They think that they are our rulers and they know whats best. When actually they were hired to run that mess called Government. Ours is different from ever other country in the world based on this one, twenty seven word statement in our Bill of Rights. And shall not be infringed is the only place such a stern use of the words, “Shall not”, be used other then the Ten Commandments is a testament old or new (pun intended) to how seriously it was meant. The tree of Liberty is planted firmly in the iron, lead, blood, brass and souls this nation has placed at its base for the last 240 years, to give into the temptation of feelings and emotions. Trump may be a jerk BUT compared to Hillary? No flame here.
“No! No! A thousand times no!
“I’d rather die than say yes.”
— Al Sherman / Al Lewis / Abner Silver (1934)
Power comes from the barrel of a gun…ALL about guns this time. I’m not looking for a job,repubs promise much and deliver little. The hildebeast is satan incarnate. Democrats hate me and my guns. Trump/Pence 2016. God help us all…
OK I did see all of the other “Shall not’s” but there is that infringed part.
This year the choice is between left, lefter and leftest so I am voting for the candidate that will do the least damage to my gun rights. I will hold my nose and vote for Trump but only if he has a chance to carry Wisconsin. For all of you “Constitutional Conservatives” there is no national election for President so if you live in a deep blue or deep red state if you don’t want to vote for Trump you will do no harm but be sure to vote down ticket.
No I am a single issue voter. Said issue is the constitution. I am of the beliefe that the ONLY way to protect the constitution is with the second amendment. So no I would never vote against it.
It would certainly be enlightening to be able to read all the debates in Congress 240 years ago over whether the freedom of speech/religion or the freedom to keep and bear arms should be first or second in the Bill of Rights.
I hope some of these states stand up to the lies and bullshit the gun lobby produces.
The crime and murder rates when up after chicago passed concealed carry,
And look here another mass shooting.
Still sure guns make us safe?…I doubt otherwise.
Welcome back, you fucking idiot.
I’m not sure fucking idiots deserve to be smeared by association with this guy.
You see what I mean about being an idiot? You don’t doubt “otherwise” you doubt “it”. You are truly stupid.
Not a mass shooting by FBI definition. it also appears gang related.
There aren’t enough concelaled carriers in Chicago to make a difference dummy. And we have at least one carrier who stopped a gang related mass shooting.
Uber fired him for his efforts.
The shooter appears to be a jilted lover of someone at the party. Other than the shooter every single person, in violation of the Second Amendment, was prevented by Washington State law to have in their possession a firearm with which to protect themselves from this insanity, since none were over the age of 20. Still believe not being able to have/carry a gun for self protection makes us safer?
I quote: “…the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.” Please point out to me where in that phrase the government , any government, is given the authority to determine at what age “the people” are qualified to exercise this Constitutionally protected natural right. If they have such authority, what is to prevent them from deciding that the age should be 60 or above, not 21?
Wow, this tr0ll sure has you guys dancing to his tune. You give him the attention he didn’t get from his mother unless he sh!t the bed.
Which I’d bet still happens.
Let see, vote for Hillary and we get:
1) Another 4 years of Obama Policies and you know he will be somehow involved since he is moving into a home in DC
2) BLM gets a seat in the WH and can spread their hate so more cops die
3) Socialist policies guaranteed to take more money out of your pockets in the form of Taxes. There is no such thing as free college, somebody has to pay and if it is free, it also means prices will probably go up just like every .gov program.
4) More Progressive Judges. Look at the current rulings along the voting rights act. SC has pretty much the same law as CT but somehow theirs was struck down and the CT laws stays and in CT you are required to show ID when voting.
5) A concerted effort to eliminate scary black guns.
6) Too many R’s who will go along to get along and happy to compromise principles — see John Boehner
A vote for Trump:
1) He will get conservative judges. Pretty much that is all. All the other stuff needs to go through congress so he can never be the crazy man people believe he will be.
2) Our gun rights will not get better nor worse because Trump will simply not get involved in the issues.
3) Rollback of many stupid EO and if we are lucky, maybe CMP gets 1911’s to sell
I see little damage from Trump, we will become Europe and be just as broke with Hillary.
There is no choice and I will vote while holding my nose but that is the reality because most people who wanted better than Trump/Hillary simply did not bother to get involved.
“Its not who votes, its who counts the votes.”
Stock fat and deep, big war coming.
Well I’m not voting Trump. But I am voting a candidate who is good on gun rights. I’m sure there are situations where I wouldn’t “vote my guns”, but I’m not coming up with any off the top of my head.
What other candidate is there that is better on gun rights than Trump?
Or, who are you writing in?
I’m really curious to see THIS answer.
The nature of ANY government is to consolidate power and feed at the public trough. The only thing that truly scares a politician is a citizenry that doesn’t need them and isn’t afraid of them.
We’ve recently seen how the will of the people is ignored in the Electoral Process. There are jokes about how the dead have been voting Democrat for generations.
I am of the opinion that our ownership of guns is the only thing that keeps the wolf from the door. So long as we retain them, people will not disappear in the night or get loaded into cattle cars.
“There are jokes about how the dead have been voting Democrat for generations.”
Those are not jokes.
Endorsing DeSantis, a man who supported TPP and has explicitly refused to go after existing gun control? What a load of trash.
oh, and he’s also one of those responsible for keeping the Hearing Protection Act locked in committee
The US has nothing else unique to offer besides gun rights. I’d have been gone a long time ago, if my hobby were shut down.
I wasn’t a single issue voter…until this election.
I don’t even like the GOP, buuuut… it’s Trump, or bust.
Unless we end immigration and start mass deportations gun rights will be lost.
How are those .gov agents, whom you’re on record as wanting to disarm, supposed to handle mass deportations, unarmed?
Will the cops and feds need mraps and apc’s to handle that chore?
Pro-life or Pro-guns… I’d have to vote Pro-life.
I don’t “vote” at all. I don’t accept anyone to control my life or pretend to “represent” me. A pox on all their houses. I do not consent. To any of it.
I vote my money first, too bad both candidates have horrible economic policies.
Nope, I am a single issue voter. If the candidate isn’t pro-Second Amendment, he or she does not get my vote. Period. A candidate’s views on the Second Amendment are always a good yardstick of their views on everything else I value.
I’m sure many of us have gotten sick of the one-party system where we vote between two people who are going to do the same thing even though they say different things. This is not the election to vote 3rd party though. Whoever picks the judges decides whether we even have a 2nd amendment or not over the next 30 plus years. Yes, Trump may bargain away some things but if we are loud enough I don’t think he’ll let it get any worse than the 5-4 court. If Hillary gets in, it will be a 2-7 (or more) court within the next eight years. That must not happen.
Second amendment first. If both have an A rating from the NRA, then we can discuss other political issues.
A close second is immigration. We can’t get a jihadist infestation like Europe, and we have GOT to stop the exploding pinata on our southern border.
A man walks into your house and tells you “I’m going to give you everything you want if you give me your guns!”. So you turn over your gun to him because, honestly. this sounds like a pretty sweet deal. Then he points the gun at you and says “give me everything you have”.
Thats why we have a bill of rights, to make sure we don’t end up giving away the house in an attempt to buy a moment of peace. There are things a politician should never ask exchange for doing their job, and if they do then they should be disqualified for their position.
Is there any case where you wouldn’t vote your guns? Yes, but very rare and the pro gun candidate has to be a real idiot such as McCain.
Where some other issue would take precedence over firearms freedom and you’d vote for a candidate who was squishy to antagonistic about gun rights? Yes, but very rare. I have voted non-gun candidates over some candidates pursuing really stupid foreign policies which were going to get a lot of people killed.
Have you ever done so before? Yes, but very rare.
Just remember, even if I vote for a non-gun candidate, I split the ticket and vote for about 5 to 10 pro-gun candidates
You can always come up with a hypothetical, but generally an originalist interpretation of the Constitution generally and Bill of Rights in particular are significantly high on the list.
Presidential candidates usually disappoint me. This year is no exception.
Every election is a tough call for gun owners. I have talked to plenty of gun owners and many vote Democrat hoping or even believing Congress will thwart any gun ban laws. Why do they do this? Simple. They know that a Republican President will never increase Social Security payments which are “not and entitlement”, never increase the minimum wage, never cover health care including drug prescriptions which have not been reformed under Obama care, never stop the shipping of jobs overseas, never cut back on military spending which now drains our treasury which leaves no surplus for civilized social programs long enjoyed by advanced European Nations for well over 75 years. Such programs as parental leave for sickness or birth are totally off the table. Child day care, off the table, free Higher Education (which Europe and the Far East have had for decades which is the main reason they are beating the hell out of us economically). Repair of roads and bridges, installation of rail road safety systems, are all vetoed by Republicans. People to them are expendable, let the bridges fall down, let there be horrific train derailments etc. etc. And do not forget emergency funds for such dread diseases like the Zika virus. Let the people contract it. Remember the big fight over funs for the Ebola virus that the Republicans then wanted to rob to pay for the Zika virus. It makes about as much sense as shooting holes in a boat and then refusing to buy a 5 cent cork to plug the holes before everyone drowns. It makes sense only to the mind of a tight wad Republican. And lets not forget reform of the Judicial System that is rigged to let Cops gun down anyone they please and never have to worry about being prosecuted for it.
So after balancing just some of this (there is plenty more) one must then worry that if the Democrats get in they will destroy the Second Amendment not to mention the Corrupt Supreme Court that except for the one time when Scalia voted to save it the rest of the many rulings have all been to destroy the Second Amendment. Not to mention the fact the Supreme Court votes according to Public Opinion not according to what the Constitution says. Examples: Let Roosevelt put 100,00 Japanese Americans in Concentration Camps in WWII and the Court did nothing, Let laws stand that prevented minorities from voting, eating in white restaurants or drinking from white only drinking fountains, or sitting in the front of a bus or the banning of interracial marriage, or letting gay people be fired off their jobs when their employer found out they were gay etc. etc. The Supreme Court is a joke and always has been and it is they that grant you your rights not the Constitution which has been defecated on so many times by the corrupt Supreme Court I have lost count. In 2015 there were almost 2,000 cop killings in the U.S. as opposed to just 12 cop killings in Germany and just 4 in China that has 4 1/2 times the population. And the Republicans say, “We do not see a problem here”, they should have shot 4,000, let God sort them out. Sure we made mistakes but who cares most were not white and they are sub-human right?
Great choices we have, pick your poison and you get it right in the neck no matter who you vote for or what party you vote for. Many years ago a retired gentlemen told me “There is no party for the working man” only for the rich and powerful”. True then and doubly true today.
Anything can happen in this election as people are so fed up many are telling me they are not even going to vote.
If it’s so wonderful in Europe then you should move there posthaste. Good luck with that.
I do not even think you realize the implication of your statement. With the tremendous and superior social benefits enjoyed by German Citizens over American Citizens there is a long, long wait to get citizenship there and ditto for France as well. When I was in East Europe I was astonished to learn that the first choice of the immigrants (this was before the Syrian Refugee Crisis of the present) was the country of Germany, then France, not the U.S. When I asked the East Europeans why, they responded in regards to social benefits, superior educational opportunity with free education and the lower crime rate. They did not consider America a safe place to even visit let alone live in. After thinking about his I had to agree with them. They were making the right choice.
The retirement benefits, family leave, medical and prescription drug benefits, crime rate, vacation time, holidays and pay rate are superior to the uncivilized country of the U.S. In France working at the equivalent of Home Depot they make the equivalent of $33.00 and hour on Sunday’s while U.S. slave troglodyte workers make part time minimum wage which because of part time work is actually less than full time minimum wage. Yes the workers paradise of Wall Mart which sets the standard for working class people in America today. Are you not glad to be an American today? What a joke.
I was speaking to a family that had moved to Sweden because their American company sent them there temporarily and when they found out about the relaxed work atmosphere and benefits they elected NOT to come back to America as they considered their children’s future much better in Sweden than in the U.S. A form of reverse immigration as their Grandparents had once long ago immigrated to the U.S. and now they went back permanently. I can say I can only envy them as if I were a young man I would have left years ago if I could have only foreseen the present decline and bleak future of all Americans. Its only after you have retired that you begin to see the vast inferiority of the American system as opposed to the social systems of many European countries if you are part of the working class and not of the upper 1 per cent of the “Ruling Elite” in America.
One colleague of mine once asked me “How in the world do these very small countries afford to take care of their people so well? I replied the answer is quite simple, instead of squandering their tax money on wars of rape, conquest and pillage they spend their tax dollars on social programs not the military. Its just that simple. Its your tax dollars and you can throw them down the shit hole of war or spend them wisely on your own people. It not rocket science.
And the reason Germany and other countries in Europe can afford to do this, is that the USA has been subsidizing their national defense ever since WWII. If they had to pay for even a fraction of forces that we provide for free, along with our generous military aid packages, their financial situation would be quite a bit different.
“free Higher Education (which Europe and the Far East have had for decades which is the main reason they are beating the hell out of us economically).”
We had a German 14-year-old boy spend the summer with us near 20 years ago who explained that to us better than you seem to understand it, let me clear it up for you. He was headed for that free education you so admire, he had been selected the year before when he was in the 6th or 7th grade (IIRC). He was one of the 3% of the schoolchildren in Germany who were going to be *ALLOWED* to attend college at all. For them it is free. Anyone else who wishes to go to college must leave the country and pay every dime of the cost. Can you imagine our government telling the first year’s worth of 6th graders (and their parents) that they are not good enough to go to college, and there is no way for them to change that ruling before they graduate high school, they will all now be funneled into training for a very limited future in trades or manual labor? 97% of them? Can you even IMAGINE?
Watch what you wish for.
Read this about FREE EDUCATION IN GERMANY NOT ONLY FOR GERMANS BUT FOR EVERYONE. THIS MAKES YOU ASHAMED TO EVEN CALL YOURSELF AN AMERICAN.
France even sends a free tutor to your home if your child is not able to meet a certain grade standard. In the U.S. students are considered expendable. If you cannot pay out of your pocket to help your child, too bad. The Rich parents can.
I do my research, I read about the people, I make the decision on who to vote for. I do not rely on the NRA GRNC, or any group there is. These people are one issue voters and that is not the way to vote.
With me my guns come 1st.
Not much else out there in my every day life that would or could change except for my gun rights.
So yes into the booth I will go with a clothes pin on my nose and pull the lever.
I suppose I have to say yes. After the RNC, I will never again vote for Ted Cruz, may actually join the party so I can vote against him in his next primary. Self-serving POS who does not have the honor to keep his word, even when the pledge was his own idea. Supports 2A magnificently, and completely disregards all other human rights of any kind, wants to regulate every facet of every life in accordance with his own superstitions. No, thanks.
The NRA is endorsing Paul Ryan over Paul Nehlen. That’s enough reason to ignore NRA endorsements.
Nehlen already has my $100, which has nothing to do with Nehlen and everything to do with Ryan. Primarying the Speaker of the House would send a pretty firm message.
“How do you make it through daily life without being able to discern BAD from WORSE?”
How are you ignorant enough to think I must endorse one of the two?
Sure there is. Consider the following: a citizen of a safely Republican state whose US senator is consistently anti-gun, but unbeatable in a primary because he controls the party machine (do I have to name the state?) Comes a point where it makes sense to vote D in the general election just to roust him out of his DC buttprint, then endure six years of the Beast before voting that one-termer (easier to pry out of office) out to replace him/her with a pro-gun candidate selected in a more open primary.
Or maybe this is still “voting my guns,” just on a longer-term strategy.