Constitutional and permitless carry are divisive topics among not only the general population, but gun owners as well. Some feel that if we allow anyone to carry a gun without a permit, the nation will turn into a cliché version of the Wild West, with blood running in the streets.
Curiously, most detractors are left stuttering when questioned how permit requirements stop hardened criminals from breaking the law.
As of this writing, half of the states in the union have some form of permitless or constitutional carry, with the nation being no more bloody than it was before. With this in mind, let’s look at some reasons why constitutional carry should be the law, and not the exception.
Turn and Face the Strange Changes
I recently moved across the country for work. I’ve left a Midwestern state with relaxed gun laws, and found myself in the southwest. Unfortunately the laws here aren’t quite as good as they were back home, but I’ve managed to avoid anything resembling draconian states like California.
As a new resident, it’s time for me to get a new carry permit, as the new home doesn’t recognize my old state’s permit. Here, we have to be permit holders to legally conceal carry throughout the state. Open carry is legal without a license, but I’ve spoken elsewhere about the shortcomings of that method.
My first step is getting a state-issued ID for proof of identity before setting up a permit appointment. My new state requires an appointment for any DMV services, with wait times currently sitting at six weeks for appointments at the earliest.
Once I get my new ID, it’s time to schedule an appointment for my CCW permit. These wait times are currently averaging 120 days to be seen by a local law enforcement agency. That means I have nearly six months of waiting to get my carry permit to be legally covered, and that’s if everything goes right on the first attempt.
Think about that for a moment. I am legally prohibited from effectively protecting myself or my family for half a year without a piece of plastic saying I passed the lowest common denominator test, and cutting multiple checks to our benevolent overlords.
Criminals, by the way, aren’t held to this standard, and unfortunately, crime doesn’t wait. Lots of people — especially women — have been hurt or killed while waiting for carry permits and to take possession of their firearm purchases.
These two articles detail just a few examples of those whose lives could’ve been saved if they were allowed to carry on demand (HERE) and (HERE).
Where Do We Go Now?
That leaves us with three options for now; open carry, illegally carry, or don’t carry. I’ve mentioned my concerns on open carry elsewhere. Breaking the law is never something I recommend people do, as that instantly takes you from “law-abiding” to “criminal,” no matter the moral justification. Everyone is welcome to make their own choices based upon their personal values and risk assumptions.
Not carrying is far from ideal as well, as we can see above. Of course the gun isn’t our only method of personal protection, but it’s an incredibly effective one, and provides capabilities not possible with other tools.
That puts the average citizen between a rock and a hard place, facing the long arm or the law, or the knife point of a ne’er-do-well.
Won’t Back Down
Self defense is a natural right, inherent to all creatures in the animal kingdom, yet somehow we’ve allowed ourselves to become the only creatures in the animal kingdom to willingly restrict our ability to protect ourselves and others. Lions have claws and fangs, scorpions have their tails and claws.
People have our fists and technology. Forcing people to disarm for lack of paperwork is both illogical and unethical, even more so in the face of a criminal element that discards these “requirements” like an old shoe, ready to prey upon the vulnerable.
As we’ve seen recently, these laws are not set in stone. States have been steadily making changes to their permitting process, and that has only been helped along by recent SCOTUS rulings forcing many places to reevaluate their policies.
As citizens, we must make our voices heard and fight for the expansion of our rights everywhere. Not only to help ourselves, but those more vulnerable as well.
If your state doesn’t allow permitless carry, do the work to change that. What have you done to help expand the right of self defense for you and your neighbors?
So moving to occupied American doesn’t look so smart does it?
Have you filed suit yet? Ref: Bruen
That’s rather harsh, isn’t it?
“I recently moved across the country for work.”
Firearm regulations likely weren’t his only consideration in making that move, nor should they be. He’s conscientiously trying to conform to the laws in place to be legally permitted. He’s explaining the hurdles that he’s having to overcome, pointing out the inefficiencies and illogic of the process. Some posters here have done the same.
By bringing these intricacies to light, he’s informing us on the issues that we should work to change. Should he sue? Easier said than done, and quite costly in money and time.
“What have you done to help expand the right of self defense for you and your neighbors?”
Neiowa, what have you done?
“What have you done to help expand the right of self defense for you and your neighbors?”
I’ve voted for the “right” people to quell these unfair practices and talked to my neighbors about it. That’s it. The man chose to move. When you choose you accept the responsibility for your choices – smart or not. Our state is “shall issue”. All things being equal, you take a class and get your CCW in 30 days or less. Baddabing!
At least he had six months of permitless open carry available to him. Here in May Issue Massachusetts, we have none of that.
“Here in May Issue Massachusetts, we have none of that.”
Join the fight. Financially-support challenges to that bullshit…
“Should he sue? Easier said than done, and quite costly in money and time.”
He can start by financially-supporting legal challenges with an amount he can afford to budget.
Suing isn’t a hard individual yes/no decision. I *really* hope the Second Amendment Foundation (SAF), Gun Owners of America (HOA) and others will start hitting hard on this kind of messaging…
The GOA, not Satan-worshiping Leftist-Scum ™ run HOAs… 🙂
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Man Armed With Knife Is Shot And Killed By Homeowner During Attempted Invasion
https://concealednation.org/2022/08/man-armed-with-knife-is-shot-and-killed-by-homeowner-during-attempted-invasion/
With the myriad of differing U.S. State laws it would be almost impossible for anyone taking a trip to be aware of all the vast differences as to when you can and cannot use deadly force as you constantly were crossing state lines. So the concept of Constitutional Carry is absurd.
Some Hillbilly States do not even require training or a permit to carry which worries civilized states because they do not want just anyone being permitted to carry a gun in their state, which is just common sense (something completely alien to the Far Right)
quote————Self defense is a natural right, inherent to all creatures in the animal kingdom,——–quote
Wrong, that is what separates the stingy, cheap and viscous animals of the Far Right from the rest of the civilized human people in the country who are not crazed wild animals looking for a fight to the death when another man briefly glances at their wife or over saving a pocket full of change in a robbery. They do not squeeze every penny so hard it screams for mercy.
Well, bless your heart.
Pulling your head out of your ass everytime you want to type your racist screed must be a real pain in the ass. Especially with that fat head.
Nah, muckraker, dacian’s ass is well accustomed to things being shoved in it and removed from it. I think of him more as a pinhead than a fathead, so maybe that makes it easier.
While I fully accept that it is impossible for a moron like dacian to keep track of firearm laws when traveling, many of us have been doing it for years. I NEVER drive across a state border without checking the laws in that state. But then, dacian has trouble remembering his name, so there’s that.
darcydodo…Permit or no permit one false move from a pervert like you is all it’ll take.
Your fascism is shining through again, dacian. Your denial of basic human and civil rights points you out as a true storm trooper.
You keep being you. I wouldn’t have it any other way.
Here in the “hillbilly” state of Georgia we don’t require training or (finally) a permit. Neither of those items should ever be required, I guess that makes me a member of the uncivilized far right the nitwits of the communist inspired left are forever caterwauling about.
Yes, I believe that a criminal who gets shot when attempting a robbery got what he deserved, as does a carjacker which we have had a spate of in my area. The long discredited wild west shootout nonsense only occurs between criminal gangs and that behavior goes back to criminal gangs of hundreds of years ago. Little d, you can choose to bend over for whatever a criminal chooses to take from you or do to you as that is your right; I have chosen to carry a firearm for my protection and that of my family.
From the “hillbilly” state of Georgia we don’t require tra!ning or (finally) a perm!t to t0te. Neither of those items should 3ver be requ!red, I guess that makes me a member of the unc!v!l!zed r!ght the nitw!ts of the c0mmun!st inspired l3ft are f0rever caterwauling about.
Yes, I believe that a cr!m!nal who gets sh00t when attempting a r0bbery g0t what he deserv3d, as d0es a carjack3r which we have had a spate of in my area. The long discredited wild west sh00t0ut nonsense only occurs between crim!nal gangs and that behavior goes back to criminal gangs of hundreds of years ago. Little d, you can choose to b3nd 0ver for whatever a crim!nal chooses to take from you or do to you as that is your right; I have chosen to carry a f!rearm for my protection and that of my family.*
* s0rry for the cr@p version required by 0verl0rds.
About done with bothering to comment….might as well leave it for little d, since the Overlords of w0rdpiss automate suppression of non-leftist viewpoints at disadvantage.
To you the thought of constitutional carry may be absurd. But you need to get used to it. It is coming. Soon.
“With the myriad of differing U.S. State laws it would be almost impossible for anyone taking a trip to be aware of all the vast differences as to when you can and cannot use deadly force as you constantly were crossing state lines. So the concept of Constitutional Carry is absurd.”
You state a problem, but arrive at a false conclusion. The rules of self defense need to be standardized, with actual common sense so that everyone is aware of that standard. Easy enough. A common sense rule is a forcible felony is reason enough to use lethal force in self defense. See how easy that is?
“Wrong, that is what separates the stingy, cheap and viscous animals of the Far Right from the rest of the civilized human people in the country who are not crazed wild animals looking for a fight to the death when another man briefly glances at their wife or over saving a pocket full of change in a robbery. They do not squeeze every penny so hard it screams for mercy.”
Self-defense is not retaliating when someone looks at your womn. The fact you resort to such hyperbole shows your immaturity.
Your example of robbery, regardless of the amount is still robbery. It doesn’t matter if it is a nickle or million dollars, it isn’t yours to take. If you decide to rob someone you are the one making the calculation that your life is worth the risk, not the victim who may under common sense may resist your actions.
Now you may think others property should be communal in nature, civilized people disagree. You and others who think that way need to find employment and be part of civilized society and earn your keep. Don’t sponge of everyone else.
to Strom Trooper
quote———You state a problem, but arrive at a false conclusion. ———quote
Wrong again genius boy as you are blind to reality. The States are not about to give up their power to regulate firearms. Most recently New York laughed in the face of the latest Supreme Court ruling and simply put so many new regulations on concealed carry it is now actually worse than before.
quote————-Your example of robbery, regardless of the amount is still robbery.———quote
I never said it was not. But genius boy losing your life over a few pennies in your pocket only proves the stupidity, cheapness, stinginess and selfishness of the far right who squeeze every penny so hard it screams for mercy. Most people killed in a robbery are far right lunatics who try and shoot it out with the robber because losing a penny in the pocket is worse to them than death itself. The good news is that this leaves more liberal voters for our socialist causes in the next election.
quote————Don’t sponge of everyone else.———quote
This is the sickening credo of the stingy, cheap far right. They will not spend a penny to help truly needy people and they scream from the roof tops when they have to pay a penny in taxes to do so. They are selfish and greedy to the max and regard people in genuine need as expendable.
And yet, you lying shitweasel, EVERY SINGLE study ever done on the subject has demonstrated conclusively that self-identified “conservatives” and “Christians” contribute to charity at rates double or more the rates of “liberals” and “progressives” . . . so once again, you are not only wrong, you prove yourself a bigoted fool. Quelle surprise!!
Go micturate up a cable, you fascist bigot.
“The States are not about to give up their power to regulate firearms. Most recently New York laughed in the face of the latest Supreme Court ruling and simply put so many new regulations on concealed carry it is now actually worse than before.”
The States do not have a choice. They will be dragged kicking and screaming as they have been in the past over civil rights.
“I never said it was not. But genius boy losing your life over a few pennies in your pocket only proves the stupidity, cheapness, stinginess and selfishness of the far right who squeeze every penny so hard it screams for mercy. Most people killed in a robbery are far right lunatics who try and shoot it out with the robber because losing a penny in the pocket is worse to them than death itself. The good news is that this leaves more liberal voters for our socialist causes in the next election.”
Who is this documented that “most people killed in a robbery are far right lunatics who try and shoot it out with the robber ” Never heard of such a claim. I have heard of robbers committing bodily harm and killing victims over not getting enough money.
You are not true liberals, you are insurrectionists. Own it, be honest in what you are.
“This is the sickening credo of the stingy, cheap far right. They will not spend a penny to help truly needy people and they scream from the roof tops when they have to pay a penny in taxes to do so. They are selfish and greedy to the max and regard people in genuine need as expendable.”
As pointed out by Lamp, conservatives do give more of their own money to charitable causes.
A person in genuine need has the resources thru several organizations and individuals that lend a hand up. I doubt you have given much to charity, your personality here comes across as such. You come across as a taker of things, not a giver.
When I said” Don’t sponge off everyone else ” does not mean I won’t give a hand up, sometimes people have hard times and need a little help to get thru them and back on their feet. It means I will not support someone’s lifestyle choice because they don’t want to do so on their own.
dacian
Your mom said to get a job or buy your own pizza rolls and take the trash out
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
I was thinking the same damn thing.
Ok, just what training or permit is the punk in the hood or meth head from the trailer park going to get? As for stingy, no, we prefer to help at the local level and make sure those who need the help get it, instead of the government or some board of directors.
Point being, no permit scheme or ban or restriction has ever stopped the criminal from committing their crimes or from arming themselves. All the crap you demand does is protect the criminals and bureaucrats.
Hey dac… with all humility I ask that you please, please create a new bot to comment in these forums. My Lord, I’ve never read a more unimaginative comment. Read some books so you can produce a better bot. W. Somerset Maugham comes to mind. Um… you can read, right?
The Bill of Rights never mentioned required training for the second amendment. Also, those ‘Hillbilly states’ are where people tend to learn gun safety about the same time as riding a big wheel…if not sooner. Thanks for showing your bigotry.
“With the myriad of differing U.S. State laws it would be almost impossible for anyone taking a trip to be aware of all the vast differences as to when you can and cannot use deadly force as you constantly were crossing state lines. So the concept of Constitutional Carry is absurd.”
Actually, it’s pretty simple.
https://googlethatforyou.com?q=concealed%20carry%20reciprocity
There are a number of websites that provide this information.
Dont you have a Soviet flag to hang up or something?
The only thing worse than a communist is an old communist.
All regulators legislators must be required to pass a firearms competency exam before being allowed to enact or vote on firearms rules and legislation.
I know I am ridiculous. I do not care.
I’d love to see that as a general principle, not just firearms.
I expect self-imposed term limits and strict enforcement of insider trading prohibitions to happen first.
It’s a nice thought, but it will never happen. The vote is their only test. In my opinion, the only way forward is for freedom loving people to move out of blue states and into purple states, like say PA. Deep blue states are a lost cause. People are spinning their wheels trying to square the circle. Converting purple states to red states will not only protect the citizens of that state, it will give them more power at the federal level. Do you only want electric vehicles? Do you want to trans your kids and your neighbor’s kids? Do you want the cities full of homeless and druggies? Do you want to get permission from an out of touch elite governing class for pretty much anything? Then move to California. Interested in freedom? Move to a purple state and make it red. You’ll also need to vote in the primaries to kick out the establishment.
“…in order to prevent misconstruction or abuse of its [treaty] powers, that further declaratory and restrictive clauses be added”
We should be practicing Bad Elk v US on a whole host of issues.
Back in the dark ages, when Florida didn’t have CCW licenses and I wasn’t an LEO, I was a criminal. A felon. I carried a Colt Series 70 Government Model and a spare magazine. Everyday. Everywhere. Fuck ’em if they can’t take a joke.
As was I. Grew up in Ft Walton Bch and carried everyday by the time I was 20 in 1981.
Gadsden and Klaus, remember all the ‘Letters to the editor’ in the local newspapers when concealed carry was being debated? It was *hilarious*.
Predictions of gun battles in Wal-Mart parking lots over parking spaces. Local streets and roads would be vast running rivers of blood. It passed into law anyway. More letters lamenting the foolish choice Florida made.
And then, utter *silence*. None of those predictions came true…
Why so cryptic? Which state is the author talking about here?
Curious. New Mexico or Nevada?
I would guess one of those two, also. New Mexico is weird. According to the map here, they allow some midwestern state permits but not all.
https://www.usconcealedcarry.com/resources/ccw_reciprocity_map/
I’ve taken to calling this time the Great Bifurcation, at least as it comes to gun rights. Prior to the Bruen decision some states were becoming more open, others more oppressive, as an on-average gradual but general trend. Post-Bruen the oppressive states have ratcheted up the pace.
The same observation also holds with respect to the government, e.g Bruen on the one hand, the 80% “regulations” on the other.
Re moving to a more oppressive state, I understand all too well, as our household found ourselves moving west for work purposes. It was the right decision, but we mean for it to be temporary.
“Post-Bruen the oppressive states have ratcheted up the pace.”
This is what oppressors do, not just with gun rights. They exploit the weaknesses of a judicial system that was created with the assumption that all parties would be good faith actors, but today that is not even close to true. They ram through laws after Bruen that a 5th grader could determine will be unconstitutional, with full knowledge that it will take years before the very expensive court cases (which are always defended at taxpayer expense) reach a point where the laws are struck down, all the while hoping that another questionable election here and there will eventually lead to new justices that will overturn Bruen.
And here’s the key: At what consequence for this unethical abuse? NONE WHATSOEVER.
“…all the while hoping that another questionable election here and there will eventually lead to new justices that will overturn Bruen.”
Maybe, but here’s the thing –
By that time, a whole lot of people will have been exposed to freedom, and won’t be interested in just handing it back. They may find it won’t be as easy a thing to do as they think it will… 🙂
This bifurcation is happening in other areas than gun rights as well: public schooling, censorship, taxation, regulation, etc. There are two Americas now, whether we like it or not. One of them is (mostly) the old America. The other is rapidly sliding into a post-modern socialist nightmare.
I don’t understand why pro-2A articles mostly focus on being killed as a reason for the need to carry. Start including other violent crimes in the statistics that require self-defense ie. rape, kidnapping, beatings etc and you will see how much more Constitutional Carry is needed.
No one worries about getting beaten by food but you can make people fear for their lives with a pop tart in the shape of a gun.
What have I done to help?
Now you know I cant tell you that, and if I did I’d have to,,,,,,,,,
“Now you know I cant tell you that, and if I did I’d have to,,,,,,,,,”
Gnaw on my shoelaces until I kick you away?
There are advantages to being 6-feet tall standing over a 6-inch high Marsupial…. 😉
I think he’s being cryptic because his neutrino device is nearing completion. Elf bee eye and all that–bad for business.
Never like the words “law-abiding”, which the commiecrats count on us 2nd Amendment supporters to be when they pass their anti-2nd Amendment laws. The words should be “responsible” for the 2nd Amendment. “law-abiding” just means we will not break the law when they restrict our rights. Just tell us the state you moved to so we can avoid that state. Open carry is and was the norm historically within the U.S. before we were colonies and when we became a nation.
A lot of people support Constitutional Carry, but it really leaves out an important topic that is Car Carry. Not many states allow it even when you have Constitutional Carry. Kentucky was and is a open carry and car carry state even before it passed Constitutional Carry several years ago. Kentucky just rolled car carry into their Constitutional Carry law that was passed. Can you carry legally in you car in your state?
Yes I can. Ohio
As long as we’ve got .govs permission our Rights can be Rights.
Ain’t that the kick in the ass, eh?
“Can you carry legally in you car in your state?”
Yes, in Florida, and even better, your vehicle is considered to be your legal home when you are in it… 🙂
Same in Georgia
J — “Just tell us the state you moved to so we can avoid that state.”
Why not work to change the laws of one’s chosen state?
I just read that 50% of the people in Oregon own firearms and that they have Constitutional open carry ( and licensed concealed carry).
Given all the crap going on in that state, I’m losing my faith in the palliative nature of Constitutional Carry as a cure for civil collapse.
“Self defense is a natural right, inherent to all creatures in the animal kingdom …”
Dacian: “Wrong…”
You read it here first, folks. (Well, actually you’ve probably read it before, somewhere else.)
Nothing else that the asshole says has any validity nor credibility.
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