Are you any less mauled if a young dog bites you as opposed to a fully-grown pitbull? Not really. Hence why reasonable and prudent people will draw down on a snarling, charging dog of any age approaching them.
This goes double for pitbulls with their reputation for fearsome and vicious attacks on people and animals alike.
Such is the case of a concealed carry gun owner stepping out of his home in a just-published World Star Hip Hop video. The man steps out, surveys a beautiful day, then hears a dog’s barking.
Moments later, barks turn to snarls as a pitbull charges.
The resident executes a pretty respectable draw, and backpedals as he shouts at the dog. Then he fires once, and as the dog momentarily hesitates after taking the first round, the CCW holder then fires three more times, ending the attack.
Hearing gunshots, another man is heard shouting, “Bro, it’s just a f****** puppy bro!”
Here’s the video. Caution: NSFW (language and violence).
“It wasn’t gonna bit you, bro. I swear to God, bro,” the apparent dog owner shouts after the attack was ended with a judicious application of ballistic therapy.
Sorry, “bro.” A snarling dog, especially an aggressive canine breed, charging a stranger doesn’t fit most reasonable and prudent people’s definition of harmless puppy.
Moments later, the gun owner tells one of his family members who came outside to see what happened to call 911 when faced with at least one more angry neighbor upset with him shooting their “puppy.”
The profanity-filled recriminations flowed back and forth as the gun owner justified shooting the dog while the dog’s owners claimed that the gun owner “didn’t give them a chance.”
Later, when the gun owner pointed out that the dog’s owner didn’t even call off their dog, the neighbor said, “I tried to… I didn’t think- I didn’t think this rope was gonna come untied. My momma… she tied him up bro.”
Amazingly, a couple of minutes the wounded pitbull tried to get up and continue the attack, taking a few steps before collapsing once more.
The bottom line from the video: You never know when you’re going to need your safety rescue tool. If this gunowner didn’t have his gun this day and the skills to use it well, he probably would have suffered multiple, potentially crippling dog bites.
I was mauled by a “puppy” despite not provoking it in any way, and still suffer never damage as a result.
That being said, “a dog is just a dog” and if attacked, I would not hesitate to dispatch it.
I know that I will face the wrath of dog owners who consider their pets to be “family”, but I don’t care.
The gun owner was absolutely in the right.
I reserve the right to shoot anybody who takes a shot at my dog without a DAMN good explanation, which they will have 30 seconds to give before I put them in the dirt.
Ok tough guy. This is way beyond your usual laughable drivel.
You assume I’m posturing. You’d be wrong. Without my dog, I’d probably be dead by now. As far as I am concerned, my dog is worth more than 99.999% of the humans on the planet.
No, he really is that stupid and mentally unstable. Clearly a red flag case just waiting to happen.
These are the kind of idiots that the Gun Control crowd loves — the “typical gun owner” that they can clearly show is both irresponsible and aggressive.
It’s right on par. If he were this badass in real life he’d be in a grave three times over.
@powerserge. Keep in mind his gun is drawn and he’s warmed up. You might want to get therapy for your irrational prioritization of animal over human life.
A pit bull owner is a menace to Societies everywhere. You are worthless no goods that care only for yourselves and your mutated monsters.
Then you would have him at your heel, where he belongs, and not running down the street because you ‘thought he was tied up’.
Most people are worthless.
Don’t be like them.
Ikr! These pit sh*ts always gotta flex their weak little online keyboard muscles when it comes to their worthless mutts. That guy was within his right to blow that sh*t bull away! The filthy mongrel entered onto his property aggressively and if Mr. Hot shot internet muscle flexer even tried that that man would have blown him away to and with good reason! So sick of these worthless internet mutt warriors trying to act tough when in reality they would not do a damn thing! lol. Glad the mauler was given the lead pill!
dude watches cartoons and probably screws his dog. Nothing you say will matter and you can believe if his mutt gets loose and shot all he will really do is cry about it on some anime board.
As for the other keyboard warriors echoing thus ‘tards sentiment know that your dog is not family. It’s property and that’s about it in the eyes of the law. Nobody gives a shit about your dog but you so keep it contained
I can’t imagine why anyone would shoot at your dog… because if you’re the person I think you are, you have control of your dog. And your dog doesn’t go “off-leash” and attack people for no good reason.
But if your dog or any other comes at a full-charge at me, my wife and/or my twin babies, yeah, I’m going to draw and engage. And if the dog’s owner then comes unglued and attacks as well, I reckon I’d cross that bridge when I come to it as well.
True, like I said… A DAMN good reason. The only reason Gomer would attack AND be ABLE to attack somebody is if they were an imminent threat to me and said person was somewhere they had no business being.
As I said below, in these cases, I feel bad for the dog. It’s not the dog’s fault that the owner is an irresponsible moron.
Don’t leave your dog outside unsupervised. It’s common sense.
I hear ya man, but if your dog is going to attack someone they have the right to shoot it, and if you draw on them while they are defending themselves, then they can shoot you too. Be careful out there.
You won’t need those extra rounds. Fire once at my dog, and you’ve just become a threat. Bye.
Old son, if your damn dog attacked me unprovoked, I’d put it down like a bad habit. And if you, then tried to draw on me for defending myself, I’d put you down just as quick. Control your animal, and control yourself, or suffer the consequences.
This ties in directly to the entire “open carry” movement represented in the Hawaii v. Young case that’s working its way through the Ninth Circuit. So many people here on TTAG say they think open carry is stupid, but some of us who live in areas (such as L.A. County) that do not allow CCW permits want open carry for exactly this reason…when we’re jogging on mountain trails or through suburban/rural neighborhoods, sometimes dogs get off the leash and come after you. It’s happened to me personally four times over the years, and all I had available to me was pepper spray and a stick. One of those times, the dog got through my defenses and actually bit me, requiring a trip to Urgent Care. We want open carry.
Damn, this story drew a lot of keyboard commandos.
Assaulting old people and now attacking people defending themselves from your dog. Wtf? How are you not it jail yet? You are why we have red flag orders you best pray no one actually finds out who you are. But hey internet anonymity.
Still not hot on the reading comprehension skills I see.
Dude you’re an idiot and you have a skewed sense of morality. Please leave this planet, the exit is three doors down on the left.
Ryno, if your dog comes off the leash and onto my property in a clearly threatening manner, and charges at me as it approaches a close and distance that present imminent danger to me, I will shoot it. I will keep my gun drawn and at the low ready if you yourself then follow it onto my property and approach me in a threatening manner.
Not too many smart people on TTAG today.
Our laws view dogs as property, basically no different than a garden gnome. Just as you cannot legally apply deadly force against someone who destroys your garden gnome, you cannot legally apply deadly force against someone who destroys your dog, whether or not they were defending themselves from your dog’s attack.
If someone unjustly destroys your dog, our legal system has remedies such as civil liability and most likely criminal liability as well. Exacting revenge on the human who destroyed your dog is NOT a legal remedy.
Disclaimer: I am not an attorney and my opinion above is not legal advice.
Let me simple it up.
If someone takes a shot at my dog without cause, I have every reason to believe they will continue to shoot at ME without cause. As a courtesy, they get 30 seconds to explain to me why they aren’t some random psychopath who decided to start his attack on my by attacking my dog.
You can’t reason with someone who doesn’t have morality, man. This guy clearly has a screw loose.
It doesn’t matter how much you love Fido, if he gets loose and attacks someone that person is well within their legal right to protect themselves and the owner can do *nothing* about it. An untrained animal is a danger to us all.
What is it with people today who can’t read simple one paragraph statements? I swear, it’s like we got the Libertardian meth-head convention in town or something.
That could very well be true and a successful defense if your local prosecutor takes you to trial.
That would hinge on the jury’s notion of “without cause”. Off the top of my head, someone coming onto your property and killing your dog (regardless of method) or killing your dog while it is well behaved and on a leash outside of your yard would probably satisfy the jury as “without cause”. If your dog leaves your property and is rushing someone in a threatening manner (as in this case), that is just cause to kill a dog.
Anyone who allows their dangerous dog off property to rush me in a threatening manner is a threat to me. If necessary, I will dispatch the dog. And based on several comments in this thread, I will prepare to defend myself from the irresponsible dog owner.
I am a dog lover, I am a dog owner, I own a pitbull myself, and I have had several precarious interactions with dogs throughout my life. If my pitbull runs off property and rushes someone in the same threatening manner as this case, I will NOT direct any grief toward the defender.
If you don’t want someone to brutally/fatally kick, stab, bludgeon, or shoot your dog, keep your dog under control at all times.
I’ve also seen idiot kids attack dogs for no reason. One of my former neighbor’s asshole kid decided to kick my dog a few years back when I was talking to his mom and Gomer was lying down on a leash a few yards away. All Gomer did was jump up and run behind me to hide. That’s called good socialization. … and if you don’t think a 100lb Bulldog can take a random punk who decided it was a good idea to kick it for no reason, I’ve got news for you.
“it’s like we got the Libertardian meth-head convention in town or something.”
I’m gonna steal this!
I’m with you 100%. I have three dogs which I consider my family. They are not aggressive, but I know that they will defend me when the chips are down. And I will do the same for them.
@Robert pwrserge could take a cue from you on how to post a coherent and un-crazy comment.
Cool. Drawing on a person who already has a pistol out and ready is generally not a good idea. I wouldn’t shoot a dog without a good reason. If you draw on me, you can RIP with your mutt, bro.
While walking in our neighborhood one day, the neighbor (nice guy, actually) released his swarm of mutts – German shepard, big labs, and other assorted mixed breeds. As they approached, barking, I drew my sidearm, and my wife and I backpedaled out of the area. He drove up to meet us and asked, “You weren’t going to shoot my dogs, were you?” To which I replied, “Not unless they needed it.”
He’s been much better about keeping the mutts off the road since then.
Go ahead and reserve that right. See how far it gets you.
Seeing this video, the shooter had a damn good explanation. Keyboard warriors talk tough, but when putting their theoretical actions to the test in the real world usually ends up with them crying before the judge while being sentenced.
Man have you ever been bitten by a dog? Ever had one of your family attacked by a loose dog? I’ll bet you haven’t. I was bitten in my face by a family members dog. Took $10K worth of work to fix my face. This guy did not have control of his dog. He was using a rope for God’s sake!! Once the dog is loose it becomes everyone’s problem.
Yes, I too would pull my gun to protect myself and family. And yes if you pulled yours…. So drop the bluster and always make sure you have control of your own dog! A$$hat
Again with the lack of reading comprehension.
Completely irrelevant and exceedingly stupid comment.
Bad idea. You’ll go to prison for that. And now you’ve announced your intent to the world, it’s clearly premeditated murder. As much as we feel for our dogs, they are not humans. Legally, they are mere property. In most states, you cannot use deadly force to protect mere property.
Pepper spray is a good less-lethal choice. A dog’s mucous membranes are right at the end of his nose. Cops and citizens are too quick to shoot dogs, when OC might be a perfect answer.
One my instructors in my OC instructor training was a Captain in charge of a vice squad. He told us that he’s seen drug dealer’s hit by 9mm, .38, .357, .40, .45, and 00 buck. Pepper spray stopped EVERY one quicker. In his latest drug raid, a charging pit bull was hit in the shoulder with 00buck, and kept coming. He sprayed it with OC, and it reversed, ran under a bed, and stayed there until the vet came.
Sorry, the Captain said drug dealers’ DOGS hit by those various calibers, not the dealers themselves.
I EDC Sabre Red 30-foot range spray for just such an occasion while bike riding. Now I carry it, riding or not…
I often agree with many of your comments. Control your dog dude
Somehow, I doubt Serge’s dog greets people with teeth bared, snarling and lunging…
You laid an egg on this one.
It might be a good idea to hold someone that shoots your dog for the police rather than executing them yourself since this comment could be used to indicate premeditation. Also the follow up comment in which you state that you value your dog’s more than human life could be used to indicate that you have depraved indifference to human life.
I would hate for a fellow animal lover like you to be branded a cop killer because you do not bother to determine if someone is a cop on or off duty in or out of uniform or plain clothes detective before shooting.
“O, wad some Power the giftie gie us
To see oursels as others see us!
It wad frae monie a blunder free us,
An’ foolish notion.”
If your dog menaces someone off your property, that qualifies as a DAMN good explanation.
The legal status of pets and other livestock is that of personal property. It is illegal to use more force to protect a pet than can be used to protect your television or your lawn mower. In addition, if the pet is already dead, you are too late to defend it. At that point, use of any force constitutes an attack which cannot qualify as defensive.
Sorry friend, that does not even come close to being a “right.” If I were you, after everything you have posted here, I would not own a dog or a gun. It’s evidence of a serious danger to others, good for a few days in a state hospital, and if you clear that, jail time. Think about this.
Previous comment somehow posted in wrong place. Meant for the poster of the first poster on this article who seems to have serious issues. And I don’t know how to move it. Sorry
hey fellow with that feeling you do not need to own a dog or a gun I have had dogs all my life and I will never tell anyone my dog will not bite I will tell he has never bit anyone yet and for you to take that a dog is more than a human is not very smart your dog comes at me he’s dead and if you try and do something about it you will be laying right beside him if I have a dog that does not listen to me and bites someone I will kill him myself but my dogs have always have been contained the one I have now run loose in my fenced yard
Sounds more like a typical Pibble owner than a responsible cc.
Sure, tough guy. If a dog was threatening your life, I’m sure you would defend yourself as well, so stop the whining.
If your dog is a deemed dangerous dog, especially a pit bull , that is all the reason you will need. Letting them roam around freely is your mistake not anyone else’s. Why can’t you face that fact when it happens every day with these beasts? We are tired of you morons living in your fantasy worlds where your pits are angels and wont ever do a thing to anybody unless provoked. News flash fool, they do it every single day. Look at how many family loved pits went pit on them, a loved one or just a passer-bye and do some research on them that were attacked and wonder what you would do if you were in their position and have to live with their scars. Your poor choice of a pet is not a good one, believe that!
You have a really bad case of denial. To think your dog wont attack anyone for no good reason is your problem. Pit Bulls do it all the time. If you ever read, you should know this. I always say to people like you, I hope the next person to get attacked is you, not some small child getting off the bus or even one that is being a child and slaps your mutant on the ass! It shouldn’t ever be close enough to a child for them to do that.
I don’t “think”, I know. Why? Because I’ve actually done my job when I was raising him. I’ve seen my dog get kicked by a punk half his weight and respond by running behind me to hide.
You really kicked the hornet’s nest on this one Serge. The amount of morons who lack reading comprehension is truly staggering.
As someone who trains service animals, I have my own notions on why dogs do what they do. However, if someone were to wantonly shoot at one of my dogs, I would have every reason they would shoot me next. As such, I would be compelled to defend myself and dispatch the threat. That is because I don’t let my animals run about untrained, nor uncontrolled. The dog in the video was neither. The breed is irrelevant. The owner is at fault.
All the internet lawyers and bootlickers here amuse me though. So much support for blatantly unconstitutional ‘red flag’ laws just because someone said he would defend his animal!
I find it ironic that people can’t see that they are using the same argument as gun grabbers.
A properly raised American Pit Bull Terrier is no more dangerous to the general public than a properly handled AR.
… and yeah, the lack of reading comprehension fully justifies my mild misanthropy.
@pwrserge WRONG, an AR doesn’t break free of it’s holster, escape from the safe, run across the yard and rip the windpipe out of a 7 year only playing in his back yard…
Neither does a properly socialized APBT. Try again.
“properly socialized”, AKA beaten until terrified of humans. Nope. Dogs are wild animals with better manners. No different than a wolf or coyote. You can only trust any of them so far, a little bit more than a 200 lb wolf who is likely more afraid of you than a 6 pound Chihuahua.
Clearly written by somebody who has never raised a puppy.
WWDD. What Would Dennis Do.
It’s a simple personal value judgement. My dog provides value to me, a stranger does not.
I’ve never seen a video be so on point, yet the dog lover feeling the need to restate how the video tore him apart. I can’t believe the guy replied to this.
Your an idiot. The dog came into the guy’s yard.
At a dog park. Allright. You need to give the benefit of the doubt.
But if a snarling dog comes onto MY property. Its at my discretion what happens to it.
Control your dog and there won’t be a problem.
I am saying this as someone who has owned and hunted with dogs all my adult life. All of my dogs will walk at heel with or without a lead.
You live in Illinois. Shoot someone for shooting your dog, assuming it is acting like this one in the video, you’d be enjoying a backseat trip to your local jail.
Incorrect. I can use lethal force to defend against any violent felony. Firing a gun at my dog for no lawful reason certainly qualifies.
You could probably convince a jury that the shooter was committing a violent crime against you if he were shooting in your general direction and hitting your dog. A dog owner in such a situation would probably shoot out of fear of being shot.
I’ll shoot any dog plus owner if he/she makes any harmful move towards me for ptotecting myself againt their pet monster.
Ha! Yeah. Sure you would. Considering that the person who was just attacked by your dog still has there gun in there hands, and you are going to come over there making imminent threats of SBI or death? Good luck with that.
Just because you suck at relationships and can’t seem to care about anyone as much as you do your subservient animal doesn’t give you the authority to start flinging lead over someone shooting it; especially if you didn’t have the good sense to properly restrain a dog that is vicious enough to unprovokedly attack somone.
You seem to think I give a shit. Here’s an idea… don’t want to get bitten by my dog? Stay the hell off of my property.
Click Click boom and the dog goes to the Chinese food restaurant.
Actually, no you don’t.
You must be fun to talk to at parties
Guys like you are what give dog owners a bad name. Any dog that growls and presents teeth at me is going to be looking down a .45 cal hole. If that dog advances on me, he’s a dead dog. I don’t care who you are, or if the dog is a puppy or not. If you were a responsible dog owner, you’d have that animal trained properly to not growl or bare its teeth except on your explicit orders. Same with making aggressive moves toward someone. You own it, so you’re responsible for it. Since I don’t know the dog, and it is displaying aggressive behavior, I’m within my rights to put it down. If you try to get froggy after that, you’re looking to get put down as well. Certain breeds of dog were bred, some for hundreds of years, as war/fighting dogs, and you can’t remove that instinct in a few short years in modern times. Such dogs should be outlawed for general ownership.
No, he wasn’t. Had it been my dog, well…better not say so I don’t get banned.
Control your shitbulls.
Pitbulls and rottweilers are next to hogs and bobcats on my animal shitlist and don’t qualify for the same patience as someones hyper Labrador or German shepherd. I’ve had to chase one out of my yard before and the trash neighbors that owned it were moving out on the same day. One was nailed for stealing cows (obviously in jail now), the others didn’t pay their rent. GTR.
Be warned, blasting away all your problems often creates new problems. Dog owners aren’t too kind to those who shoot their pets and while you are killing the dog, the owner may be drawing his own problem blaster in order to stop you. He may keep tabs on which vehicle you get into after the fact, snap a picture of your face, any number of things to seek revenge with.
People can’t always rely on cameras to be around to document the happenings of life. If only the dog owner survives the encounter and has a fine record just as you do, its their side of the story and only their side. In the event an errant round skips off the pavement and strikes a bystander, you are on the hook for the resulting lawsuit and its going to cost a whole lot more than some nerve damage or a few staples.
If someone immediately retaliated after having their dog killed in front of them, I would accept “Crime of Passion” defense as a jury member and argue for either reduced sentencing or total acquittal. If the owner is actively trying to regain control over their pet, that alone may make the shooting unlawful on a sate by state basis. A gun is supposed to be the last ditch resort, not a first use nuclear option to solve all your problems.
Can’t say if this shooter was right or wrong, I probably wouldn’t have drawn given its in the middle of a damn neighborhood and would in the least argue for public endangerment charges for both the dog owner and the person that shot it. Stupid on both sides.
“I probably wouldn’t have drawn given its in the middle of a damn neighborhood and would in the least argue for public endangerment charges for both the dog owner and the person that shot it. Stupid on both sides.”
Please be serious. The victim isn’t required to let the dog actually maul him before shooting it is reasonable.
A swift kick to the head, 2X4, or even a knife would have been a more suitable first use option.
Read my comment earlier above. I’ve been attacked by dogs who got off their leashes four times over the years while jogging in surrounding neighborhoods here in L.A. County. All I had was pepper spray and a large stick – similar to what you recommend, and they weren’t enough. One of those times, the dog bit me and I needed shots and stitches. We want open carry returned to us.
The defender did not appear to have a 2×4 nor a knife.
And many people do not have the physical ability to deliver a hard enough kick to dissuade an attacking dog.
Furthermore, attempting to kick a dog is dangerous in itself because now your leg is extended and you are balancing on one leg. In that precarious position it would be exceedingly easy for that dog to tip you over or for you to even fall over all by yourself. And once you are on the ground, it gets incredibly ugly, incredibly fast for the human. That dog could rush in and deliver permanent injuries in a few seconds.
I haz a question, A piece of wood worked for me and I was around 8-12y/o at the time. Try swinging harder.
This is one of the stupidest arguments I’ve heard against shooting a dog in my life. If you think that self defense requires you to use the lesser forms of force before escalating your firearm, in you are going to have to defend that any time you pull a gun. “Why did you shoot the knife wielding man, when you could have kicked him in the head, slapped the knife out of his hand, pulled out your pocket knife, shot him in the hand, etc.”
You have to accept that dogs are not people, and they can cause serious bodily injury or death, therefore, the burden for you to use force on them is much lower. You also have to accept that when a person owns a vicious animal, such as the one above, and they don’t take proper measures to control the dog, they are being reckless with a piece of property that could hurt or kill someone. They are totally in the wrong, and if it costs the dog its life, so be it. No law-abiding citizen should ever have to allow an animal to start hurting them before defending themselves, and in the cases of a dog, using anything but a firearm would be the equivalent of bring a knife to a gun fight.
Arc- The crime of passion scenario you would agree with, is insane. You are trying to excuse the dog owner losing control of their emotions and murdering a person. The dog owner would be exactly the kind of low impulse control vermin, that We concealed carriers carry a gun to use on in self-defense. The dog owner would be who the death penalty is meant to be used on.
Well over 20 years ago most states eliminated the “Crime of Passion” Defense which only at the time applied to a spouse who found his mate in bed with someone ese and killed them both. Today in well over 90% of the States you will not find “Crime of Passion” listed as a viable defense for any issue.
Instead we have EED as a viable defense. Same difference.
Dispatch any other family members that attack you also. That’s part of the 2A and Stand Your Ground. Don’t want to get shot. Don’t attack someone. DUH.
Sadly, I’ve seen plenty of people attack dogs for no reason.
Do you consider a dog with teeth bared, snarling, lunging, fur ruffed up, ears flat against the head to be an acceptable reason for someone to draw their weapon for potential defense?
Is that a “Good reason”?
Depends if you’re somewhere you shouldn’t be, doing something you shouldn’t do. i.e. Inside my house taking my shit.
That’s “nerve damage”…
You should hesitate because you’re likely to miss. Even if you hit a small dog the bullet could pass through. The owner is likely in the line of fire, as they try to stop their dog.
A lot of gun owners are shit at hitting their target, especially if that target is moving fast. Cops can get away with missing and killing innocent people because government protects government.
Could you really hit a small dog rushing at you with the first shot? I doubt it. I bet you never practiced such things.
Don’t assume just because you have a gun that is the solution to everything. Sometimes a boot to the face is all that needs to be done. It’s rare that a dog will keep attacking a grown man once they find out he is not scared and can fight back. A pack of dogs is much more dangerous because they hype each other up and think they can take down a grown man as a group.
Same applies to animals like mountain lions. They will go after small or perceptively weak prey until they experience enough resistance to their attack.
I’ll keep that in mind if my neighbor’s Yorky goes Cujo on me….
If you are out in public with a dog, or other animal, you are legally obligated to keep the dog under control. And that means a lead or harness. My dog is very friendly and will walk at my side without a problem but I ALWAYS have her on a lead when outside my premises.
I have seen “friendly” dogs go from happy and playful to full on killing machines at the blink of an eye. Nearly all are some kind of staffy or pit bull.
I’ve had a number of very expensive vet Bill’s from unrestrained animals. One reason why I wear steel capped boots when walking the dog.
We consider our dogs ‘family’, but wouldn’t expect anyone to stand there and be attacked! No, we do NOT have pit bulls!
Sadly, in these cases it’s the dogs who pay the price for their owners’ criminal stupidity.
Or, had a bystander been hit by a skipping bullet, the stupidity of both the dog owner and the shooter who discharged in the middle of a neighborhood.
I know it’s a cliche, but pit bulls can be the sweetest dogs if raised properly. Obviously when they are not trained, they can be quite dangerous. If you own a dog of certain breeds, regardless of how well trained they are, keep a tight leash on them for their own protection. That’s true of any dog, of course, but take no chances with your pit bull, Doberman, etc.
Anyone owner who’s dog is killed under such circumstances should be charged with animal abuse. This could easily have been avoided had the dog owner taken a modicum of precaution.
Pittbulls kill more people than any other breed. You can’t put train breeding as many of the dogs involved in fatalities have zero history of aggression or abuse. Get literally any other breed and you will be better off.
Clearly said by someone who has never raised a puppy. Dogs need to be socialized properly. It’s a lot of work, but when done correctly, it will keep any breed from attacking unprovoked. My dog will walk up to strangers, and roll over looking for belly rubs. Why? Because he gets his cues from me and was raised to do so.
“My dog will walk up to strangers, and roll over looking for belly rubs. Why? Because he gets his cues from me”
Can I give you belly rubs Serge?
Don’t argue with me, argue with the statistics. Plenty of people who have lost friends and loved ones to those demons said the same thing.
I already explained that statistic. A person who’s not going to take care of their dog properly is more likely to own a pitbull than any other breed.
Absolutely false. There are somewhere around 15 breeds commonly referred to as “pit bulls.” There is no breed called a “pit bull.” There has never been a single living thing killed by a non-existent breed. If you don’t know the difference between a Staffordshire Bull Terrier, an American Pit Bull Terrier, and a Presa Canario, it’s probably a bad idea to repeat meaningless information you found on the internet. Every one of those dogs is going to be called a “pit bull” far more often than their actual breed. When the person filling out the paperwork for animal control puts “pit bull” on the bite form, your comment about how many people are killed by what breed is shot to hell.
Now let’s talk about your claim that “You can’t put train breeding as many of the dogs involved in fatalities have zero history of aggression or abuse.” There’s so much FAIL in that grammatical nightmare, It’s almost painful. For the moment, I’m going to assume you meant that you can’t put training as an example.” Again absolutely false. Especially since you don’t even know what breed you’re talking about. Just for the sake of argument, let’s pretend that everyone ever killed, bitten, or been severely annoyed by a “pit bull” were actually accosted by an American Pit Bull Terrier. If APBTs are genetically aggressive dogs, and training isn’t going to erase that aggression, what is a dog show? Hell, pick ANY dog with a “pit bull” appearance. I only used APBT because it’s the only dog that legitimately COULD be called a Pit Bull.
There ARE instinctively aggressive dogs. Chihuahuas for example, and no, I’m not joking. Ask 100 people, at random, if they’ve been charged and verbally assaulted by a Chihuahua more than 3 times in their lives, 99.9 of them would say yes. The last guy took too long to answer, so he didn’t get the full point. That’s fear aggression, and it’s the default setting for Chihuahuas.
Yea, dude. You should hear some of the crazy s*** my neighbor’s little jerkwad chihuahua says about my mom and wife. Verbal assault indeed…
How many of you same heart-bleeding neophytes talking about murdering someone over your injured or dead dog have had s*** to say about Adam Lanza’s mother?
Whatever. Bunch of nonsense. Dog stories always bring out the know-it-alls. I’ve got three Chihuahuas, two German Shepherds and a Catahoula Bulldog. I’ve had similar dogs for decades. None of ’em ever bit anybody, all of ’em would if someone threatened “their people,” especially the grandkids. PITBULLS are dangerous, unpredictable, and yes, of course, some are “sweet,” but you shouldn’t have to train a dog NOT to attack.
OK, just so I got this, ask 100 people at random if they’ve been “charged and verbally assaulted” (so like a good cussin”?) by a Chihuahua and “99.9%” of them will say yes? So 1/10 of a person has not had this happen, by your random sampling? Got it, I’ll put this to the test, if I can find these people broken down into 1/10ths. Little fellas, I assume. My guess is this won’t hold up to scrutiny.
The point on Chihuahuas is a valid one. As of last year they’d been the number 1 dog to bite and result in an ER visit for years running.
That’s not widely reported in the MSM because a degloved finger sucks but it doesn’t draw eyeballs like a mauling but you can go look it up pretty easily.
There’s also a simple reason for it: Chihuahuas are, in fact, quite aggressive but they seem cute and easy to deal with. They were bred to be this way for a reason. As such the breed requires a lot of work. However, that’s not the reputation that they have and as such they’re often “purse dogs” for some idiot who just thinks it’s cute and “small = cute = easy” (we see this in the gun world with subcompact pistols too).
The result is that a lot of Chihuahuas are not properly socialized, exercised or trained for what they are and a lot of people get bit by “poopsikins”.
The reason, ultimately is the same as with subcompact pistols in the hands of a total novice, people didn’t really think through all of what they were doing and don’t really understand what they’ve got. The mismatch of reality and expectation creates problems. Sure, you might not make TTAG if you get attacked by a Chihuahua but that’s not going to change the fact that you’re on antibiotics and/or minus a digit.
As the owner of a rescue staffordshire terrier / italian greyhound mix (basically a pit head and chest on a sleek frame, or a cinderblock with a jetpack), I am fully aware of my dog’s temperament, training, and general response to the world. I am also fully aware of how society sees my dog, and is totally ignorant of those things.
Due to this, for *his* safety, he is always well harnessed and held close in public. When people or other dogs want to greet him, I kneel down to his level and keep his leash taut with my weak hand, keeping my strong hand ready to pull him or my weapon if the need arises. While I love him, I will not hesitate to end him if the situation demands. Of course, because he is secure in his harness and literally right next to me, he never has reason to be nervous or skittish, and therefore never has reason to become aggressive or defensive, and I can more closely watch for signs of incoming, rather than outgoing, stupidity.
I have no use for idiot owners of any dog, from teacup poodle to mastiff. Dogs may be smart, but they are still animals, and they often need clear guidance. Letting them run around half-ignored at the end of a 25′ retractable leash is a recipe for a bad time. I don’t let him do it, and I don’t let him get near any dog that does.
Stupid people, stupid places, stupid things….holds doubly true for dogs as it does for people.
@that one guy : Your post is one of a thoughtful and responsible dog owner. Thank you, If you could bottle that it would be great for all those people who say they love their dogs but in reality only care about themselves, not about their neighbors welfare or their dog well being.
For RidgeRunner who wrote, “…but you shouldn’t have to train a dog NOT to attack.”
Virtually all dogs need to be trained NOT to attack. Even yours. You may not have done it intentionally, but it is part of proper socialization.
So correct. Officer I worked with at a previous job noted that this has been true in his numerous encounters with pit bulls. It does not help that pit bulls rank poorly in the spectrum of canine intelligence. Every pit bull he has been required to shoot (protection of others or self) was raised from puppyhood with a caring family. The owner(s) always said that their pit bull had never attacked anybody before nor displayed that level of viciousness requiring a call to police. The last loose pit bull he had to shoot required two shots to make it stop, and both shots were squarely in the pit bull’s center of mass (I was allowed to see the police video). Of note, it did not die immediately. The pit bull is a durable animal bred for killing other dogs in a fighting pit. Think about that when choosing a reputable brand of personal defense ammunition.
Some of the best dogs I’ve ever met have been pitbulls, and other ‘scary’ breeds.
Unfortunately, those same breeds are super popular with idiots.
I’m so glad I made it out of the trailer park.
And dog bites even those that do not rip the skin/muscle can still be very dangerous to your health.
I was bit over 20 years ago and my leg still has places that do not heal where his fangs entered my leg. I was lucky my leg was big enough he couldn’t get the leverage to tear it and bite harder.
Luckily the dog was a known biter and the guy paid my hospital bills. I told him what the heck was a dog like that running loose. Turns out he forced his way thru the door to get to me out in the yard. (I was making a delivery and had never been to this place in my life)
I had a pocket knife and if I’d know then what I know now, I would’ve taken it out and stabbed him till he let go.
My first and only dog bite in my life.
Imagine if a few school kids happen to walk by and not Clint Eastwood the kids would,ny stand a chance and you can’t sue the “kind of folks” who own pitbulls they are broke &#$#^^$$%^&’s
Pitbulls are no more dangerous than any other breed when raised properly. The incident you see is when people buy big scary dogs as a status symbol without putting in the work to take care of them like you would any new member of the family. The reason you see pitbulls involved in these sorts of incidents has more to do with the sort of cretins that would buy them rather than with the breed itself.
Then the owners should be put down with their dogs.
I would agree with pwrserge on this point. Granted, my couple of decades’ worth of dog training has been with Labs and Beagles, but the basic training principles are the same regardless of breed. A properly trained and socialized dog will follow the lead of the owner/handler, and can be taught to exhibit a remarkable level of restraint. More so than many humans, as you pointed out. And, a properly trained and socialized dog will be happier and healthier.
This excuse never gets old. Pitbulls are genetically wired for fighting and pretending that they are a tame, social breed is no different than trying to say a high content wolf is a lap dog. You may get anecdotal exceptions but they are not the rule.
…and the only anecdotal exceptions are dogs that haven’t been triggered *yet*. The breed literally only exists to fight.
This. Years of genetics for aggression doesn’t just go away with “good boy.”
No they don’t. There’s a reason why raising a puppy is about as hard as raising a baby. (Just a lot less total duration.) If you do what you’re supposed to be doing in the first 12 months of the dog’s life, the genetics matter very little.
I’m not claiming they are a “tame, social breed.” I am claiming that proper training can overcome a “genetic predisposition.”
I once obtained a 1.5 year old black Lab that was a rescue dog. Probably the most intelligent dog I’ve had, but for some reason was deathly afraid of water at the time I got him. I spent the better part of a year training him to the point where I controlled him with hand and whistle signals, with the goal of making him into a duck hunting buddy.
He had one fault, however. I would have him in the bow of my canoe, out in the middle of the pond, and I would tell him “outside” which was the command to get out of whatever he was in, whether kennel, vehicle, canoe, etc. Worked like a charm everywhere except the canoe. He would literally pat the water with a front paw, feeling for something solid to stand on as he prepared to get out of the canoe. He would of course not feel anything solid, and would look back at me with sad, brown eyes and whine, telling me he just couldn’t do it. I would repeat the command, and this time as he reached out to feel the water again, I would gently rock the canoe so that he plopped out into the water. Once he was in, he was fine. He swam around excited like a puppy with a new toy, and would swim along, following me around the pond, retrieving on command, just swimming, or whatever. He was fine once he got into the water, but for some reason the process of getting in was initially traumatic for him.
So, what I had was a smart-as-a-whip dog, with a centuries old genetic predisposition of being a water dog, that had apparently somehow been “trained” to fear water as a puppy. With some time and intensive work, involving a local river, chest waders, and wood ducks, I was able to “untrain” that fear that had somehow been instilled into him as a puppy and bring him back to maybe a 90% comfort level with getting into water.
The point is, whatever had happened to him as a pup very decisively instilled into him a behavior that clearly was in opposition to his genetic heritage. As intelligent as he was, he required some intensive and specific training to overcome that behavior, and even then he never fully reverted back to the genetic predisposition that should have been as natural and automatic as, well, falling out of a canoe.
Certain breeds of dog have been bred over centuries to be aggressive and were used for guard dogs, war fighting, hunting dangerous game, etc. You can’t expect such a breed to not default to its genetic nature under extreme conditions. A dog is not a human with reasoning, and while you might realize a situation is not dangerous or alert worthy, the dog might not know that. Since training to the level required to override instinct is very expensive, you can’t rely on the average training a dog gets to stop him in time to prevent an attack. I had a friend years ago who raised pedigreed Dobermans, and trained them as guard dogs for sale. He was well aware of their potential for violence, and was careful. One day one of them attacked his 9 mon pregnant wife out of the blue when she went out to feed the kennel. After he made sure she, and the baby, were going to survive, he went home and shot every single one of those dogs, and got out of the breeding business. That’s why I won’t trust any dog that has a history of being bred for such uses.
Did he go to jail for indiscriminately slaughtering those dogs, aside from the one that attacked his wife, that had done nothing wrong at all?
I also question why he was letting his pregnant wife go into a kennel of dogs that he was specifically raising to have heightened attack instincts.
Tyranosauras Sex has it right. These animals have a genetically driven skillset for “heightened attack instincts”. You can’t “train it out of them.” You can only manage it.
A family member has raised 2 pit bulls with zero problems, but he raises them from puppies and treats them properly. They just want to be petted when approached. It is all in how they are raised.
We have an attack Yorkie and strangers should beware!
A shame the dog in the story had to be shot, but the owner is the one to be blamed more than the dog or the shooter. Owner’s neglect cost a dog his life, and for what?
They can be put in prison and that’s happened to people whose dogs have mauled someone to death.
“He wasn’t even gonna bite you, bro”
But he was going to get up after being shot at least 3 times and try to continue the attack. Bro.
Hate to see any pooch get killed, but there wasn’t much else the guy could have done here.
What I saw on that video was not enough (off-frame or obscured) for me to conclude it was, in fact, an attack. Maybe it was, I can’t say, though I often find people unused to dog body language see an attack any time a dog approaches at a run. That the dog attempted to walk a couple steps after going down does not warrant the conclusion it was “attempting to continue the attack”.
Excellent decision-making skills.
I’m amazed at how many people are sure he made the right decision based off a split second the dog is in frame before being shot, most of that seen only though a bush.
“It’s not the dog it’s the owner.”
Should be legal to shoot the owner too. That should make the breed of peace a little less common.
I have been bitten by a dog. A little one. I was selling something in home. It still hurt and bleed. If it was a pitbull all bets are off…and Serge you are insane. We ain’t buddies even if you live in ILL. ALL the dogs on earth aren’t worth one human being!
You have a much higher opinion of humans than I do. My opinion on most humans is neutral. My dog has saved my life. When it comes to a value judgement between the two, there’s no question.
Wow you done lost your mind if you think animals are above humans. For someone who rants continually about Communists killing their family you certainly seem more than willing to commit the same atrocities.
Wow… somebody has reading comprehension issues. MY dog is above most humans TO ME because he is MY dog. Do I have to break this down for you Barney style?
Everything is either: Animal, plant or mineral. Take your pick!
You sure about that? I was just reading about a woman who threw her 11 yo son off a 4th floor balcony.
I would trade people for a good dog any day. For as sacred as human life is supposed to be, people sure don’t act like it these days.
I think the way I would say it is I prefer the company of most dogs over most people. I’d rather hang out with my six dogs than pretty much any group of people. That’s my pack, bruh. My ride or dies.
That is a very irrational thing to say. All value is subjective. Who would you choose to save from a fire – Gerald Goines or a dog that never harmed anyone?
I’ve met some very good dogs and very bad people
when you see your daughter mauled beyond recognition by one or more pit you’ll think differently
That’s the exact same “argument” gun grabbers use. A dog is no different than a gun. It’s incredibly dangerous when not treated with the care and respect it deserves.
Guns are inanimate, dogs are not. It is possible to not point a gun at someone. It is not possible to do the same with a violent dog. A grenade with the pin removed is a better analogy.
There is no such thing as a “violent” dog. There’s dogs that are raised carelessly and are more aggressive as a result. My dog has literally let people kick him (neighbor’s asshole kid) without doing anything that running and hiding behind me. (And he’s a 100lb Olde English Bulldogge who could easily pull me around.) That’s called proper socialization and it takes a lot of work. The problem is people who get dogs as fashion accessories and don’t bother to put in the work. Same as the people who carry Glocks stuck into their waistband as some sort of accessory. The inevitable results of both behaviors are solely the responsibility of the cretin who owns the dog / gun.
This is one where I’ll quibble with serge on the topic.
There are truly “violent” (hyper aggressive) dogs that simply cannot be dealt with. They are, however, extremely, extremely rare.
Occasionally you get a dog with an improperly wired brain. Again, extremely rare but it does happen.
Agreeing with you. I was amazed, when we adopted our last dog, that the shelter asked us if we realized that owning a dog means spending money on food, medical care, leashes, bedding, etc. Apparently, some people do not think about dog-care. Likely that also means they have not thought about training and control. Owning a dog (or any pet, really) requires educating your self on how to give your dog a happy, healthy life. Not everyone does that and the dog pays the price, as in this story.
Pull your weeble ass around? Bulldogs are indeed incredibly strong, but dayum!
Olde English Bulldogge… He’s about the size of a small bull mastiff. When he was a puppy, he pulled my mom clear off of her feet when she wasn’t used to just how strong he was. Oh, and that breed is 1/6th American Pit Bull Terrier, so he has about as much APBT in him as the average fighting dog breeder rescue. (The remainders are 1/2 English Bulldog, 1/6 Bull Mastiff, 1/6 American Bulldog.)
Dogs are dogs, they will do what their Gene’s tell them to do. Owners on the other hand, most times dont seem to have enough common sense to own a dog of any breed. Second most overused response; he’s never done that before!
why do millennials coddle their dogs like babies? the baby talk and refusal grow up is across the board. what is WRONG with the younger generation? Who told these fools fighting dogs were infants?
For some, it’s because dogs are far less expensive and far easier to raise than children. Of course, they don’t live as long as children, but they also won’t scream “I HATE YOU!!” at random times until one of you dies.
I baby talk my dog and the only reason I don’t have a kid is because of miscarriage so… what is it that they say… oh yeah, OK Boomer.
I shot my neighbor’s Pitbull, in my backyard, after it jumped the fence into my backyard for the 3rd time charging me or fighting my dogs. I called Animal Control the first 2 times and they warned the owners that I would shoot the dog if it did it again. After I shot the dog, the owners pasted it all over Facebook and I had over 100 death threats there. The owners filed a temporary protection order against me and the judge approved it and extended it for 4 months because I fired in “a residential area”. I was also investigated by the District Attorney’s Office for negligent discharge, etc. So if you are going to shoot a dog, make sure you have a solid reason because it is going to be a pain in the ass. And make sure your concealed carry insurance policy covers dog attacks in case the government comes after you.
Sounds like shooting the owner would have been a good thing too.
Anarchyst and all the others who would sooner blast all their problems away, should take some notes from you, having learned via experience.
I had the ghetto trash neighbor’s pitbull in my yard once and I was going to club it to death with a chicken coop stand. It broke contact and got chased across the yard, back through a gap in the fence. I may be in unincorporated land but with the freeway nearby and 3-4 people in their yard (They were moving out.), shooting was simply too much liability. Not to mention they were probably in bed with gangbangers which would be even more problems.
That’s kinda how it works, if you got nothing, you can get away with causing problems for people because what can they sue you for? Likewise, if you got money, you can be sued for it.
“Anarchyst and all the others who would sooner blast all their problems away, should take some notes from you, having learned via experience.”
You are dead wrong…
I have extensive experience in dealing with feral animals, not just dogs.
It’s not about “blasting your problems away”, but SELF DEFENSE, nothing more. There are far too many “dog owners” who should NEVER be allowed to have a dog.
In my case, by the time I came back from the hospital, the offending dog was dispatched by a .22 to the head by the dog’s owner.
I have no desire to harm anyone, either human or animal, but when attacked, WILL provide the proper response to PROTECT AND DEFEND MYSELF, others and yes, even livestock.
When it comes to livestock, once a dog tastes blood, it’s all over. The dog must be dispatched or removed from the country environment. Once a dog attacks livestock, it will do it again.
If he was threatening you especially over Facebook it should of been no issue 1. Getting a restraining order against him and 2. Getting the charges dismissed. He should be in jail for a minimum of terrorist threats. Your story does not add up.
Depends if it was pre-9/11 hysteria or not.
If he managed to threaten someone over facebook 8 years before facebook became a thing the average neighbor had access to…..
I called the Sheriiff’s Dept over the Facebook stuff. They told me to get a protection order against the neighbors. Judge denied it. She was elected for the first time 6 months before this happened. Obviously anti-gun or she just hated OFWGs like me. And the neighbors beat me to court the morning after it happened. Their application for the TPO was completely fabricated. Judge wouldn’t let me challenge their accusations calling my testimony hearsay. That’s when she tacked on another 3 months to the original 1 month TPO against me. The neighbors didn’t actually threaten me on FB – they just churned up a lot of other people to make those threats and you never know when one FB nut-job will actually decide to do something. Our little Sheriff’s Dept told me they didn’t have the resources to go after any of the FB posters.
Neighbor’s pit bull used to literally climb over the 6-ft property fence when it was young and lean, threatening me and my wife. I was finally able to catch it in the act of climbing, and took photos of it as it was at the top, jumping over, and charging me. Submitted them to Animal Control and filed a complaint, telling them I would end the dog’s life if it came over the fence again (didn’t say it would be with a gun, just said I’d kill it in defense). Animal Control notified the neighbor, but neighbor never did anything. I guess he didn’t care about being sued for medical/bite damages. Fortunately, the dog soon started to gain weight and became too heavy to continue jumping the fence.
Some people just shouldn’t own dogs. If it had come over again, however, I already had photographic proof of the danger as well as the complaint on file, so I would have certainly shot it.
Anti-social dog-owner (does not care if his dog endangers someone) = anti-social dog (was not climbing the fence to ask for a belly-rub).
Smart thinking to document and report; good attempt to protect your family and the dog.
My dog was surrounded by five unleashed and clearly aggressive 70-90lb very muscled but not sure they were all or pure Pit Bulls at a dog park. My first thought was how unhappy I was with the careless ass that brought them – very very unhappy. Because of such problems the rule is two dogs per person and no viscous dogs. I had to think hard and fast about what to do. It was at that time that I realized that situations where a six shot revolver (like I was carrying) really was at best marginal, do happen. The biggest complication was that owner looked like the sort I would also have to deal with if I tried dispatching his dogs. In an instant I experienced much fear of the governments response – Minnesota at the time. I ended up wading into the dogs and pulling my dog out with the remarkably restrained use of a large stick. I realize those dogs could have easily put us both in the dirt and think I got very lucky we made it out without me shooting or both of us being exsanguinated. There was no blood, if there had been my response may have been different.
Kudos for your measured response and willingness to risk your own safety for your dog!
This is exactly what Bear Spray (olecapsicum) is for. I always have a smaller container with me when I go jogging on mountain trails, as well as a phone and knife.
Gun or no gun, I carry this :
Very nice. I like that it’s a gel, full strength OC, and contains marking ink. I’ll buy a couple.
Forget it, Jake. It’s WorldStarHipHop.
World Star Hip Hop is one of the best national resources for the police to catch criminals. Seriously. Social media in general is where many criminals are caught in the act, by local cops.
But its also where to gun grabbers go to find you and your hunting kill pictures. And you Holding your gun.
And then they flood you with nasty grams.
It’s also very enlightening about the nature of some people.
In WA State, if the dog is off your property, except in an authorized dog park, IT MUST BE ON A LEASH and UNDER YOUR CONTROL at all times. Law says so.
Some owners attach leash and then drop it. SEE? It’s on a leash. Ha ha asshole. Nice try.
Recently I was threatened on my own property by a negligent neighbors dog. I was not armed at the time. Called the Sheriff to see what my rights were. They did not hesitate. “Shoot it.”
So I’m mowing the lawn, a dog appears threatening me or my family, I go in side to get a gun…
NO! That’s premeditated. You have to HAVE the gun with you.
Deputy…do you pack heat when YOU are mowing the lawn?
My point here, I guess other than 24/7 carry, is know your local laws. I was within my right to shoot, but would be at legal risk in this scenario of arming up in the middle of an incident.
Then there’s the civil suits that will follow for killing precious Snookums.
Why aren’t you carrying when you’re mowing the lawn? How are you going to say “Get off my lawn!” with any authority? If the man in the video had left his gun in the house he would have had to retrieve it with a dog hanging off of his body.
. . . I carry when sitting upon the proclaim throne. Seriously, someone breaks in while you are dropping bombs, how do you fight back?! I suppose you could strip and attack them like a crazy person, slinging feces at the invaders, but I would rather have my weapon with me.
I have to mow several acres with a little push mower, carrying while mowing is a no-brainer.
“I have to mow several acres with a little push mower, carrying while mowing is a no-brainer.”
With that much land to mow rifle carry in definitely authorized for you!!!
Mow the lawn with a M1 Garand slung over your back, if you want to project the proper boomer aura.
Grumpy F’er said, ” IT MUST BE ON A LEASH and UNDER YOUR CONTROL at all times. Law says so.”
Sounds like and works sorta like “Gun Free Zones”!
Most people don’t understand dogs behavior. I deal with aggressive dogs on a near-daily basis in my line of work. That dog was not going to attack, It was simply challenging a stranger. If the man that shot the dog had a better understanding of dogs he would have understood that there was no need to shoot the dog.
Video clearly shows the dog within the 7-yard “danger” distance. The photo still shows it within perhaps four feet. I say that CCW showed considerably patience before pulling the trigger to defend himself. Clear cut case of self defense. The fault lies with the dog’s owner for not keeping it under proper control at all times, especially for a dangerous breed.
Much as I hate watching that dog get shot, I can’t really blame the guy with the gun. It was not his responsibility to put himself at risk because of the carelessness of a third party.
‘It was simply challenging a stranger’
The stranger accepted the challenge.
You’re kind of making my point for me. You don’t understand what a challenge is from a dog. They’re basically saying who are you and what are you doing here. Where I live the police caught a lot of flack for occasionally shooting dogs so they’ve implemented a training program for officers to understand a dog’s body language. That dog was not making an attack and was shot needlessly. It’s also not very tough to put a whooping on a dog that is trying to attack you, I’ve done it many times but I’m not a scared little bitch.
“who are you and what are you doing here?” is perfectly reasonable when the dog is is HIS space. it’s not at all reasonable when he is NOT in his space.
the dog does not understand “I’m the owner of this property, and you are a trespasser”.
Dogs can be territorial idiots. One of my dogs thinks every intersection we stop the car ride at is his to defend, and I have to remind him that it isn’t. By the same token, when he is challenged at his fence by some half-wit’s dog on the sidewalk that runs by my house, I don’t shut him down. That IS his yard, and he has every right to defend it.
‘scared little bitch’. Says it all. You get the dbag of the day award and anybody that gives your opinion a second thought is wasting their time.
Keep your dog that wants to challenge people on your property or it gets blasted and it’ll be your fault. Pretty simple.
“You’re kind of making my point for me.”
No, I didn’t, ‘bill’.
That was a hater impersonating me…
You can’t expect everyone to be a dog expert.
I’ve been around midsized dogs all my life and personally I don’t feel threatened enough by even an aggressive dog, if it is alone and under 60 pounds I will simply physically dominate it. If the dog is huge or there are more than one, it could be a problem.
Someone with less confidence handling a dog than you or I would definitely and understandably feel threatened by certain canine behavior. The lesson is that if your dog is not well behaved then for crissake keep it under your control.
Shop, shooting, home education and repair should all be returned, common pet behaviors would fit well in home education. Too bad it was replaced with gender studies fluff.
It’s not the intended victims duty to understand a dogs body language. It is the owner of the dogs duty to not put another human being at risk by letting his dog go wild.
I had two aggressive dogs “challenge” my dog and myself. The dogs were roaming the streets unrestrained and unsupervised. One was a malamute and the other a part pit bull. The pit bull’s challenge was to grab my dog by the ear and constantly twist and tug. Meanwhile the malamute was circling for an opportunity for an attack. The pit bull only let go when kicked in the ribs more than 15 times. The pit bull tried again a few days later but only had to be kicked twice before letting go. I called the Council who fined the owners about $600 and threatened them with a dangerous dog order which would have needed special fences and the dogs secured by chain or cable. But I was still out $600 in vet fees.
How about teaching owners to keep their dogs under control instead of being in the mind set that others should study dogs behaviors.
I’m not a cat person and I have no interest in studying their behavior , it is in NO way up to your neighbors or anyone else to study the behavior of another persons animal. Ridiculous.
Keep your pets under your control and stop making them other people’s problems
Shot one dog in self defense and yeah, it was pit. Nothing against the breed. I’ve had five. Great dogs. In this particular case the dog had bit three people. One qualified as a mauling. I accompanied animal control to take the dog until the courts could decide disposition. The owner turned him out on us. One .45 230 gr. Gold Dot ended the attack. I would rather have shot the owner.
thank you for your work and as far as I’m concerned that’s gotta be something with a deadly weapon. Sicking a dog or shooting a gun at someone should be the same crime.
It should be legal to shoot the owners.
“bruh it’s just a puppy”
Well, now it’s a dead puppy, because you’re an incompetent dog owner. Not my problem.
Those owners are the same type of ignorant trash that would still blame him had the dog had its jaws locked on his arm or leg. “It was just biting you! It would have let go! It was scared! Why’d you have to kill it??”
The stupidest segments of society love their uncontrollable inbred dogs.
That’s a goddamn shame, all the way around. Just awful. Glad the man wasn’t hurt though.
Forgot to mention. The dog’s name was Jihad. Nice.
“The dog’s name was Jihad. Nice.”
You helped it get to doggie paradise (or hell)…
That’s why I carry when I walk my lab.
Being a dog owner carries the responsibility of keeping it under your control at all times. If you can’t do that, whatever happens after that is your fault. If a big bruiser of a dog approaches me like that (on my own property, no less), I’m not going to wait around to see if he’s “just playing”. Just like you wouldn’t wait to see if an armed robber actually intends to kill you for your wallet before using deadly force.
What’s really troubling is how many people these days seem to value an animal’s life over a humans. I have a dog that I care for greatly, but if he gets away from me somehow, tries to bite someone, and gets killed in the process, that’s all on me.
Just as a person has the right to defend themselves against a attacking animal. Explain the difference when it comes to a police dog. They are acting in an aggressive manner and more times than not. Do attack and bite. Why is this form of brutality any different than a personal pet or wild animal? These dogs are considered police officers. If a human officer acted in this manner they would be disciplined and most likely fired as well as sued for police brutality. Regardless of intent this is an attack which often leads to injury. Even when the person does not act in an aggressive manner. Explain?
Well, typically a police dog only bites if you flee after committing a crime, or after disobeying a lawful command from a police officer. In fact, a lot of agencies won’t even use a dog unless the suspected crime is a felony. That’s not to say police dogs have never been involved in unprovoked attacks, but I don’t think that’s very common. I don’t see any similarities between this story and situations where police dogs are used.
Darkman, never was K-9, but worked with them. Mostly bloodhound and drug dogs. Occasionally an attack/tracker. Most of those were German shepherds. Use of force rules apply. Dog released on non-comliant felons only. Remember. If you don’t want a negative encounter with law enforcement, don’t break the law. If you do and get caught, do as you’re told. Then you won’t get hit with impact weapons, sprayed with pepper spray, tased, shot, or bit by K-9. In the words Hank Williams, Jr. in. Attitude Adjustment when he told LEO they couldn’t put him in jail. “They just smiled and said, ‘Oh, yes we will.’ Some sticks to the head and kicks to the shin. And several bites by Rin-Tin-Tin and I couldn’t wait to get into that jail. It was an attitude adjustment. It was my first time.”
The guy did the right thing, what he had to do. That dog was coming at him with bad intent. The man was on his own property, minding his own business. His reaction was actually pretty impressive. Also speaks to the sheer power and determination of the breed, caught three and still wanted to attack, or appeared to. Just wow.
Where I come from in farm and ranching country neighbours got one warning when their dogs attacked any animals or people. The only second warning was a bullet in said dog. All neighbours had no issue with that until the city people started moving to the country.
Pit bull owners usually suck.
Unfortunately, many times pit bull ownership is accompanied by various forms of douchebaggery.
The link to the video does not appear when I open the link from your email. Where can I go to see it?
Video link dead.
Anyone got an alternate?
My wife and I years ago before marriage lived with her dad while looking for a home we stayed there because my old friends were bad news and my wife was smart enough to help me realize i was a jackass and so were they lol. Anyway I used to run on the treadmill back then and decided to take out the mountain bike to switch things up (wish I still ran lol). The neighbors across the road had a small farm couple of horses in bad shape but he had these two chihuahuas they had a bunch of puppies then he got a German shepherd the hole pack wld chase cars up n down the road as you can imagine it burned the others. So I am going up the road its chasing me and it was never mean to me I thought oh that’s cool let’s race that sumb!tch bite me in the ass then it stopped I kept going on the way back I walked the bike to keep the dog away from me and I get to my driveway and it and the ankle biters run up on me I pay no mind to the little ones they start nipping me while the sheperd is eyeballing me. I was so mad I pulled my pistol and didnt even aim just drew and shot from the hip I missed it and it took off. I get in the house my future father in laws on the porch like i heard a shot what happened i explained n show him my ass and i got a nice little chunk out like just a spot where it looked like two teeth got a little bit out. So anyway he calls up the neighbors they Bs him and I just tried to hit the dog everytime it chased the car or ran up to it. 4 years later I’m down there looking at an old trailers frame he wants me to weld some stuff up so he can use it as a bridge to cross the creek to his other field. He had gotten a mastiff and I’m talking to him in his yard n I’m pretty tuned up it was a saturday six tens that week so I’m trying to chill. I’m asking him about his welder and if hes got any dry rods and this mastiff took a bite of my ass. Even with through my back pocket of my dad Jean’s wranglers he took a nice quarter sized chunk it left a bruise the size of a wide mouth jar lid. Then like 1 year later were moving out I’m getting stuff out of the garage with my dad and hes like hey those damn dogs r running up the driveway. I just turned and pulled out my pistol and just shot twice into the dirt in front of them they stopped and took off lol. Now this was in a place where you can shoot guns in your backyard their was a salt like 20 yards from the living room window lol. So yea stay strapped and f anyone who gives you any BS if you think that dogs gonna hurt you and yours then waste I wouldn’t be mad if someone did it to my dog.
One big run-on paragraph. Would have held my attention better if it were written with proper grammar and sentence structure. I bailed after the first four or five lines.
I never was much for paying attention when I was a kid in school, and when I got on-line as an adult my writing looked a bit like that. (just a bit.).
After a liberal application of the proverbial clue-bat by those I wanted to converse with on-line, I put forth an effort to improve.
My writing is still far from perfect, but I manage to get the gist of what I am saying across.
We’re not needlessly picking on you, dude. We like new folks to converse with. But please *try* to be understood…
That’s fair. I have gotten lazy because of growing up using AOL instant messenger. I abandoned everything I learned about grammar etc..
Let me tell you about the time I caught the ferry to Shelbyville. I needed a new heel for my shoe…
Good shoot. Bad owner.
My best friend is one his second pitbull (Stafforshire Bull Terrier if you are a breed nazi). It’s a sweet family dog at one moment and would be happy to maul or kill someone it sees as a threat in a split second. It almost went after me on our first meeting, but my friend is a responsible owner, and now he knows and loves me. Pitbulls kill more people than any other dog breed.
My brother in law got bit by a Weimaraner, which was her second bite and had to be put down. My Weimaraner might bite (probably won’t), but if it did I’m responsible for her. If she left my property to bite someone it would be my responsibility. Not a lot of people get killed by labs, but whitetail deer and pitbulls cause quite a bit of death animal-wise.
Not a lot of people buy labs as ghetto / redneck status symbols and don’t bother to raise them properly.
For sure. If things got real, my lab would probably lick you with great enthusiasm!
Video doesn’t show up for me for some reason.
Any dog that gets aggressive with passersby is a problem. “It’s just a puppy” isn’t an excuse, mistakes happen, but that’s an explanation not an excuse and owners need to recognize this as behavior to be corrected immediately. As an owner it’s your responsibility to retain control over the animal at all times. Even when I lived in an area where a kid liked to let dogs out of their yards, it was my job to make sure the kid couldn’t release my dogs. It wasn’t on the dogs and the kid (six or so and autistic) didn’t understand what he was doing. I did understand it, so it was my job to immediately install a lock on the fence that the kid couldn’t easily defeat.
However, the breed thing just needs to fucking die. A couple weeks ago my neighbors black lab mix came after me while I was walking on the road across the street from their property. It was most certainly in attack mode. Fortunately it didn’t expect a dominant reaction from me which is what it got. That, combined with an oncoming vehicle, gave it pause long enough for the owner to sprint down his driveway and get a hold of it. I didn’t need to draw, and didn’t draw, but my hand was on the grip just in case.
Fortunately this guy’s not an asshole. He apologized profusely. The guy understood damn right well that he had failed as an owner and didn’t try to make it about me or the dog. Instantly it was about him and his lack of control over his animal. Yeah, the dog was young, I’d guess maybe 18 months old, but the man didn’t make any excuses for the dog’s behavior, rather he apologized for allowing that situation to happen at all. He must have said “My bad” a dozen times. He was shocked that instead of being angry at that point I introduced myself to the dog properly, and the dog was chill about that, which reduces the chances it gets aggressive with me in the future. We talked, he gets it, I get it. The dog is normal, it just got excited that someone whom it didn’t recognize was in “it’s territory” and this just happened to occur when the owner was distracted. It happens but God do I hate the people who try to pass it off as not their responsibility to prevent such an occurrence.
If you aren’t going to put in the work and take the responsibility, don’t get the animal. Simple as that.
I’ve been carrying a gun every single day for going on 35 years now. I also have to deal with at least one aggressive dog a week and often many more. Never once have I had to shoot one of those dogs in 35 years. Where I work pit bulls are as common as cans in the gutter and I have yet to meet one that I could not handle. Even when it is clear that they are coming at me to attack me I haven’t had a problem dealing with them. At best the largest ones I have come across are still half my size and are dumb just like any other dog. I have even whooped them and then spent the rest of the day with it riding around with me. Dogs are very predictable and in general if they were around any people prior to about reaching about 8 weeks old they like people and respond well too kindness.
Great logical comments and experience stated, this was a whopper. I wont go into too many stories, but go directly to the law and animal nature. Sat on many a grand juries and the majority of dog attacks or bites. Etc. Were mostly from pits, pit cross breeds and akita’s. Every time the jury ruled in favor of the defender/victim being attacked, whether defending with a gun or some weapon, especially a lot of trailer court cases, lol. You pit lovers and people in general who “assume” that rearing an animal with love will produce only a loving animal. Thats a complete delusional MYTH! Wake up.. We cant even do that with human beings. I have bred dogs and been bit several times by several types. Spurred by roosters, you name it, lol. Seen a guy clawed by an owl once too! Ripped his scalp wide open and was gone in a flash. The only dog that has the most incredible temperament that I used to breed were Bassett hounds. My kids would accidentally step on their heads, trip over them, you name it and all they would do is yelp in pain and look at you with those big soulful eyes like “Why did you do that?” Instant forgiveness, never seen anything like it before or since. I dont always CC, but 99.9% of the time I have at least two knives and a packer. I’ve seen enough video in courtrooms to know how it’s going to go, so I always give the trouble maker plenty of rope to hang themselves, as there are cameras and phones everywhere now, before I respond/defend, when alone myself, so I’m in the clear if it goes to court and not defending women or children, etc. When kids are out, I’m proactive defensively, I dont give a shit who you are or what your critter is. Note to people who dont have a weapon and are being mauled. Dogs like to snap, bite, pull and tear, so dont pull away from them if your being bit, it just makes it worse, rather try to wrap/trap yourself around the animals neck or body with your leg, arm and cradle it while pushing the animal down and back with your forearm, fist or hand further into its mouth and into its throat and choke the sob to death. This surprises the shit out of the animal. I know some of you are thinking I’m nutz, but I was trained to do this and it does work. The animal will release and get away from you or you can choke it to death. Just dont let go, because the more you retreat and pull the more it anchors its body weight while tearing your flesh, so better a little flesh damage that a lot. I was seen a pit owner aggressively force two fingers up his pits ass once to get it to let loose. If your out numbered, like I was hiking once up in the black hills, alone heading back to camp after dark one night. On the reservations they have what are called coy dogs that run in packs and sometimes with coyotes or wolves. Go after the “alpha male first”. I had the smaller ones come at me first that night, I had steel toe boots on and headed for the large male wolf and had to kick a smaller domestic coy dog in the jaw first while the wolf breed watched and waited until I was about 5 yards from him before he turned and ran backwards about 30 yards and I kept going for him with a steady stalker walk. We did this three times before he ran off into the dark woods off the trail. 1983-84 winter. Found out later that some dumbass dumped fish cooking grease/oil out by the trail, so that’s what brought them close, otherwise they usually stay away from humans.
Can dogs smell fear? Damn right they can! In Canada and Alaska the wolves are much larger, more aggressive and much better hunters. You best be shooting an a stabbing your ass off, if you get surrounded.
Thank you for the informative post.
Animals are not people. Some people forget this or fool themselves into thinking a dumb animal is anything but. Before cars were around every other town had a idiot or 2 who were brain damaged from mule/horse kicks. Ask a hog farmer how many times he’s been bit. And these animals have not been bred to be extra aggressive. Pitbulls are just another reason everyone should CCW. Don’t ban em’ or tigers(more breeding tigers in the US than the wild, America, so awesome that we are keeping fricking tigers from going extinct), just be able to protect yourself.
I don’t want to be bitten, chewed on, or otherwise attacked by a dog or any other animal. But I don’t want to be sniffed, licked, or slobbered on by one either. Either way, it’s an assault on my person. I would guess that most people who let their dogs run free, however briefly, would strongly object to another human being spitting on them (the person) on their own or public property. That too would be an assault on their person. A person should be able to walk or run on a public street or sidewalk without fear of being molested by man or beast. The problem is that leash laws and dangerous animal laws have weak penalties and are laxly enforced. But I don’t see that changing. So if anyone has a solution other than shooting in self defense, I would love to hear it so I can get our city gov’t to change the laws.
Here’s an idea… quit being a pussy and learn to deal with dogs.
Ground glass mixed with hamburger?
Wow… and you have the balls to call me out for defending my dog against ignorant jackasses? You need serious help if your first response to dealing with a dog is to kill it by feeding it broken glass. You’re far more of a monster than any of the dogs you’re crapping your pants in fear of.
Wtf????….. what if someone did that to your food moron????…..
Who the fk complains about a dog LICKING THEM?????
I’m not an overly protective dog owner, but if someone did that to my dog I’d be paying them a visit……. when they LEAST EXPECTED IT!
“Who the fk complains about a dog LICKING THEM?????” Maybe people who have seen that dog spend half its time licking its own ass? The most basic right is the right to be left alone.
And then there’s this….
A Woman Needed Her Hands and Legs Amputated After Contracting Infection from Dog ‘Kisses’
Bottom line-if people would keep there livestock leashed, penned, or caged as per laws, we would not need to have had this useless thread. Dog owners who choose not to obey the law cannot be expected to respond reasonably to logic and reason. So, “a man’s got to do what a man’s got to do.”
And with that, my participation in this thread has ended.
Well, maybe just one more comment, “Remember we are out there.”
“He won’t bite you.” I’ll bet that’s the most common thing people hear from a dog owner right before they get bit.
Cry me a river you pu$$y…. most dogs are sweet and just want to play…… some dogs even play aggressively…. IT’S NOT THE ANIMALS FAULT A$$HOLES!!!!!
It’s difficult to know how to respond when a dog runs up to you like this. Is it friendly but hasn’t been taught not to jump on people or is it in attack mode? By the time you know for sure, it’s too late to defend yourself. The best you can do is to make a decision based on a could of seconds’ observation and react accordingly.
This week, Andrew Branca showed a dog attack on his website (www.lawofselfdefense.com). A small to medium sized dog ran from 100 feet away, dodged around a mother and father, and jumped straight for the arm of their small daughter. The dog hung on despite efforts by the parents and two bystanders to pull it off. Finally, the father did enough damage with a pocket knife that it released the girl and ran off.
Where we used to live, the neighbors across the street had a couple of pugs who aggressively defended their property when let loose. The problem was that they thought their property included the entire block. If you were out in your front yard, they would make mock charges to a foot away while barking and growling. Since they weren’t big enough to do more than nip my lower leg, I ignored them. Had they done so, their owners would have found themselves dealing with animal control and paying my medical bill.
I think the dog in the video could have been stopped by pepper spray. But it wasn’t the shooter’s duty to risk being bitten because all he had was a gun. Also, we don’t know if the dog had a history of aggressive behavior around the neighborhood. Animal control can’t be relied upon to pick up every loose dog that shows signs of being dangerous.
There are people, pets and farm animals mauled, disfigured and killed every day. And a vast majority of the attacking dogs owners flee to avoid taking responsibility. No apologies necessary.
Care to share where your “info” comes from?? Or are you just “guessing” about your misinformation?
Pitbulls are just the white/black trash accessory these days. And I am ok with that, if your local government allows them. Same for bears and tigers. Cept, I just chalk Americans having a right to own any dangerous animal they want, as one more legit reason to CCW.
Oooooh boy….I wish I could be as cool and well off as you (trash)…. You (trash), shouldn’t make assumptions about the way people look…
The worst kind of trash are people who look down on others….IDGAF HOW MUCH MONEY YOU HAVE, YOU’RE STILL A PLAGUE ON SOCIETY….
Dogs and guns. Two very misunderstood subjects. People are often scared of both. However, odds are there was a leash law. The dog was not on a leash. the breed doesn’t matter that much, it was no doubt large enough to be ‘thought’ a threat. While I always considered my dog a family member, I knew in the eyes of the law, it was a dog. I had a fenced back yard and a leash for when they left the house. It’s the law. No matter how friendly you dog is, if a kid hits it on the nose and it bites the kid, your dog will be seen to be at fault. You will be libel for damages. Laws don’t have to be right, they are legal.
In the eyes of the law, a dog is considered personal property, much like a TV. In most states it is not legal to defend personal property with lethal force. Possibly inside your home, but not outside your dwelling or curtilage. Definitely not if it is running loose. A loose dog charging someone barking, seeming threatening, could be considered the same as someone brandishing a firearm in a threatening manner. i.e. a threat. Legally it can be shot.
If one of my grand kids or great grand kids had been present, as much as I love animals, I would have gotten between the dog and the child and if the dog did not stop, I would have also put the dog down. In today’s society, it will be a wonder if the shooter doesn’t sue the dog owner for mental anguish and the cost of bullets.
I’ve only ever drawn my weapon in anger twice, and both times it was for dogs. Fortunately 1 was all teeth and snarl until I lunged at it and it ran off, but the .40 was out and ready to go to work. The other time I was waiting for my parents to answer the door when their neighbor’s dog (a pit mix) comes growling up behind me, completely caught me by surprise. I draw and turn in one motion, but recognize the dog. F’ing neighbor is out in is front yard, completely oblivious to his own dog barking and growling ACROSS THE STREET. I yell, ostensibly at the dog, “DO NOT MAKE ME SHOOT YOU!!!” Neighbor’s head is pulled from his azz when he hears that and he suddenly realizes what’s going on and comes to get his dog. I didn’t shoot the dog, but I had every right to, being threatened, while simply standing on my parents’ front porch. That dog was lucky he didn’t come an inch closer or this story would have a very different ending.
Preparedness goes far beyond just CCW. It’s a mindset. If you can’t carry a firearm for personal defense (ie. living in a prohibited environment like CA, NY, NJ, etc) then you should probably carry a knife. If attacked by any aggressive beast (ie. dog, thug, etc.), a knife may save your life.
this is fucked yo and anyone who thinks this is okay is fucked up
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