Being “outgunned” does not appear to be the case. pic.twitter.com/EEvwlAdaeE
— Gun Facts (@gunfacts) March 22, 2023
“Our police are outgunned,” they worry. So naturally, law abiding citizens must once again surrender another chunk of their rights. So it goes.
In fact, as if reacting to an invisible clarion call from the ghost of FDR himself, Democrats and gun control zealots from Dianne Feinstein to Martina Navratilova rushed to social media to make their case that, as the Uvalde shooting clearly showed, a criminal with an AR-15 is such a menace to police — police in Uvalde having concluded that, as Zach Despart “reports” in the Texas Tribune, to take on such a killer would prove fruitless, so the best course of action was simply to clear the building and wait for him to stop slaughtering helpless children and teachers — that the obvious answer is to ban AR-15s, a semi-automatic rifle platform that, as Despart writes, is “less powerful than many rifles, such as those used to hunt deer or other large game [but] has significantly more power than handguns, firing a bullet that has nearly three times the energy of the larger round common in police pistols.” One of the officers involved described the shooter’s weapon as “a battle rifle.” …
As Despart tells us in his piece, an Investigative Committee on the Robb Elementary Shooting report, released in July of 2022 — while “comprehensive and scathing” — “made no mention of the comments by law enforcement officers in interviews that illustrated trepidation about the AR-15.” Despart, showing a generosity to the officers I’m not certain he might elsewhere, lets this seeming omission over officer trepidation at the prospect of having to face a “weapon of war” linger over his story like a braunschweiger fart: why weren’t we told by the Texas House investigative committee, chaired by Republican Rep Dustin Burrows, the implication is, that the real issue police had was with the shooter’s rifle?
I can answer that. Because it’s bullshit. This was a case of cowardice, calculation, and self-preservation. Nothing more. And because of that, it is abundantly clear that self protection is the best, most reliable form of protection, and that our Founders and Framers, in their wisdom — and having come out of an armed revolution with a new country founded from their particular “insurrection” — knew that the right to self-protection was not only a natural right they sought to forever protect, but one essential for a free people to remain free.n …
Every police officer who responded that day had access to a semi-automatic weapon. Many even had AR-15s. So the obvious question is, why should law enforcement, but no one else, be given access to semi-automatic rifles if not to stop a shooter they had vastly outnumbered and outgunned?
The bottom line is this: They didn’t act because those children meant less to them than their own lives. And that is precisely why it is a potentially lethal mistake to outsource your own safety and that of your family solely to civil servants who have nothing more than an oath they may or may not uphold, at the moment of truth, to incentivize them to act on your behalf.
I like to tell people that, in my house, we are each our own militia. What the Uvalde police — along with the Democrats and their gun control advocates quick to latch on to this latest anti-gun narrative — have proven so magnificently here, is that it takes good guys with guns to prevent bad guys with guns from running amok in a country awash in guns, most of them held legally by people who commit almost none of the gun crime.
A badge, a duty weapon, and the ability to write parking citations or bully kids for loitering in front of a gas station Quick Stop, does not “a good guy with a gun” necessarily make. The audacity of Uvalde police [trying] to justify their own measured calculus by laying the blame on a single weapon they know to represent a cultural flashpoint and wielded by a single, untrained teenager — and for the left to use that cowardice as reason to take away weapons from those who would have been more than willing to rush into that building, to be those “good guys with guns” — is as abhorrent as it is cynical.
— Jeff Goldstein in Democrats for “Assault Weapons”!
gubmint-parasite sequence of events:
.gubmint-parasites create obiden-murder/gf zones
.gubmint-parasites proclaim exclusive gun rights in obiden murder zones for le
.obiden punk shoots innocents
.le armed with more/same weaponry refuse to confront obiden punk(s)
.gubmint-parasites file/promote new “laws” which prevent/restrict law-abiding self-defense
The US Supremes in 1855 ruled in SOUTH Vs MARYLAND, 59 US 396 IN ONLY 7 PAGES, THAT PUBLIC SERVANTS OWE NO DUTY TO PROTECT ANYONE FROM CRIME.
THE COURT NOTED THAT SAFETY FROM CRIME IS A PERSONAL OBLIGATION AND NOT GOVERNMENTAL.
NO PERSON HAS STANDING TO SUE IN COURT OVER INJURIES SUFFERED FROM CRIME THAT PUBLIC SERVANTS COULD NOT OR DID NOT PREVENT.
USE THIS FACT WISELY!!!
This was reaffirmed by the Supreme Court and a Federal Court.
Police Have No Duty to Protect You, Federal Court Affirms Yet Again | Mises Institute
Justices Rule Police Do Not Have a Constitutional Duty to Protect Someone – The New York Times
sue them for not letting you do what SCOTUS said you can do…”THAT SAFETY FROM CRIME IS A PERSONAL OBLIGATION ” and the cops at Uvalde prevented the parents and other law enforcement from doing just that
And yet when they did go in, they were able to overcome the shooter with superior numbers and tactics. A few of the police were hurt, but no more than would have been hurt had they acted sooner.
If memory serves, the door they sought entry to was unlocked all the time.
Should we forget the Uvalde School Police on a “Respect man authoriteh” power trip.
The bodies of the murdered children are just stepping stones to her next promotion.
Uh … duh! People outsource the most important parts of their lives because of stupidity and laziness. It’s actually quite funny; trusting cops and teachers who make $40,000 a year and no legal requirement to lay down their lives for those of your children, all because you want to make more money to consume more garbage.
People are dumb and get what they deserve.
I wish we only paid teachers that much up here we might actually get what we paid for. 60-90k is more typical.
Drive thru a guberment school parking lot and note the# of new $40000 SUVs lining the employee section. Then tell me about underpaid.
better let the new applicants know that there are 24million of those out there and they might possibly have to face one.
existing duty sworn should resign themselves to self elimination if confronted, meaning those that would not advance.
jr…The vast majority of “new applicants” already have “those” and are allright with citizens having those too. IE…Friends, family, neighbors, teachers, firemen and the like who have decided not to be classified as victims. After all criminals will criminally misuse anything they can get their hands on. Try not to lose sight of that when an inanimate object is being singled out solely on the behalf of Gun Control. Cop safety, the children, etc. amount to nothing more than props used to convince fools to surrender their rights to Gun Control zealots peaceably.
And this is why the Marxists in our country ( headquarters in D C ) are scared of the rest of us, our Second Amendment and it’s fruits of liberty.
One of the great mistakes we made as a nation is allowing the goobermint to educate our children, the second greatest mistake is “Gun Free Zones”. Combine the first two with cowardly police officials and there you go, lots of needless deaths.
LOL … it’s becoming clearer by the day … it was a mistake allowing women to vote.
If women never voted, We would have never had a Democrat president since FDR. Unfortunately too many women think with their glans instead of brains.
Women vote on feelings. Women elect Democrats, men do not.
MB…Women just cannot wait to stand in line so democRat joe can sniff their hair…C’mon man you sound no different than a high and mighty democRat expecting Women, Mexicans, Blacks, etc. to vote for them…well don’t you?
A case of not being right in philosophical egalitarianism but also not being incorrect with the facts. Yes women across all races and income groups tend to be majority democratic voters.
@Debbie W. If you bothered to read the full statement I said “too many women” not “all women”. If you took that to mean you, there is nothing I can say or do to correct that. There are women who use logic to solve problems and make choices. Facts are facts. You may interpret them any way you wish, but that doesn’t change them. Prove me wrong.
Safe…If you and your like minded pal’s bs flies then you bozos contribute to it, hold hands and take a bow.
Deb see MB for further details, look up voter data, take your self down off that cross tear it down build yourself a bridge and get over your baseless butthurt.
MB…I do not need a comprehension lesson from you.
You prove yourself wrong when your rethoric confirms too many men think they are the superior gender…I didn’t say, all men.
Safe…I said hold hands and take a bow…That did not mean hold hands with MB for support…snowflake.
Case in point ^ Thinking with feelings rather than facts.
It is a verifiable and objective fact that women vote left more than right by a large and consistent margin. That’s all that was being pointed out here. If we as the gun community, both male and female, can’t think, reason, and decide based on objective facts, we’re sunk.
Lol damn Deb way to prove the points others made, ok then you do your Dacian stuff again and we will wait till you come back around to something useful.
Apparently the govt agrees with MB… The Democrat ideology is the best woman for the job is a “transitioned” man… OBTW, why are ALL of the various “women” of the year actually biological men? Time for women to wake up and realize who really respects them for what they are…
@Debbie W. I’ll write this encounter off as you having a bad day and see me as an enemy, I’m not. You are entitled to your own opinion, you are not entitled to your own facts, or are you trying to prove my point?
safe…So you are lost for words and lay it off on MB and now you pull darcian out of your butt…Since I have been on this forum I have never used or posted under any another moniker…Ask Zimmerman et al. That’s unlike the gutless wonders who do respond to my posts using concocted monikers…perhaps that may ring a bell for you?
So still using hurt feelings and ignoring facts cool cool. Still reacting irrationally and emotionally like Dacian does when confronted with facts. And totally ignoring the context and content of the issue because you don’t like something about it. You may as well be Minor or Dacian for this topic. Typically you do better with thinking through topics but you can get oddly fixated on dumb shit when you get emotional. Take it for what you will but don’t expect anyone to honestly say you are correct on this one.
MB…So you’ll write the day off and diagnose me as someone having a bad day…Sounds like your day is filled with superior thinking…Which is more the basis for your argument than the stats you and yes-george safe cite and use as an excuse to puff out your chests…You two bozos have been deflated.
safe…As if you handing off the football to MB and then to darcian wasn’t bad enough here comes minor49iq…pathetic.
MB…”If women never voted, We would have never had a Democrat president since FDR.”
Is that all women or most women?
Fortunately it was a Republican male who cast the deciding vote for women to vote…At the time of that vote bozos like you were very emotional and having a bad day.
That’s nice Deb, you are still objectively wrong https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2021/06/30/behind-bidens-2020-victory/
Women still make up most of the democratic voters across all ages races incomes and education levels. Not saying they shouldn’t vote that was some emotional baggage on your end. When you are ready to discuss things like an adult we will welcome it as you do have a wealth of knowledge even as a minority conservative 😉 also quit trying to twist context that is a Dacian/Miner thing after all.
Women have been taught to believe the state is the place to turn for assistance, help, etc.
Instead of turning to their husband. Or their two parent home. Because the husband has been replaced by government welfare, of all types.
“free” college tuition
Affirmative Action, which by the numbers has helped far more white women than any other group.
That is why Women, of all skin colors, vote in such large numbers for democrats.
@Debbie W. You seem to be determine to make this a male chauvinist issue, well yet again, you read too much into what was said. I was just stating fact. If you have an issue with facts, you have bigger emotional issues. Please feel free to ignore my future posts if you are not adult enough to have a debate without getting ridiculous. Or we can have a forum to exchange ideas, your choice. Just wondering why you didn’t pick on Johnny L, who mentioned women, I only added context to his statement.
From Pew: In 2020, men were almost evenly divided between Trump and Biden, unlike in 2016 when Trump won men by 11 points.
It’s stuff like this that make you go hmm about the 2020 election results. I’d love to know the explanation for such a massive (unusual) demographic shift.
Dude there was a lot about that one that was weird in just the right places but insert various talking points on why it’s not worth digging into and you are insert talking points for suggesting we should 🤡
If Debbie can’t face the reality of this thread, she needs to poll any group of 10 gals and see the responses to “Red” vs “Blue” questions.
The 19th Amendment was a bigger prog failure than the 18th.
Debbie’s a girl??
One of the greatest mistakes we made as a nation is allowing the government to act like they are a government instead of the servant of the people government is suppose to be.
“Everyone goes home safe, tonight.”
“Be safe out there.”
Spoken by the NYPD Captain to the street beat cops at the beginning of every episode of the early ’80s show Hill Street Blues.
I’m old enough to remember that show too.
They never specified they were NYPD. Just saying.
From one week ago…..
Should be obvious. Their lives are not on the line. Unless desertion or dereliction of duty can be punished by execution the only people in that situation with any skin in the game were the teachers and kids. The perp already decided to die so his life was forfeit.
Same goes for doctors. They get paid whether you live or die. Like an expensive DMV they go through the motions to move you through the office and if they screw up royally insurance covers their asses.
Hey do they still give out white feathers?!? Asking for a friend🙄🙃🙁
For all kinds of reasons that would not work today.
Only if your name is Carlos Hathcock.
No in this case the AR was used as a murder weapon, now if the clops would have used their AR’s to stop the lone shooter theirs would have been battle rifles.
I think America needs to outlaw gunms and outlaw murder too.
How about an age limit? No murder until you’re 65.
Do not piss off old people. The older we get the less the term “Life in Prison” is a deterrent.
If an AR-15 is considered a battle rifle, what do the fools think of the M1 Garand, M1A( civilian version of the M-14) Springfield, M1898 Mauser, M1903 Springfield, The various British Lee-Enfield’s, or the Moison-Nagant. You know, actual battle rifles instead of intermediate caliber carbines. The 5.56 is just a pumped up centerfire 22. Similar to light hunting calibers such as the 22-250 or the slightly larger 243.
I’m counting on pissed off old people. Do you think they’d be mad if they reached that age and find out there’s no money left for entitlements? This sounds like motivation to fix the problems.
Dude I am figuring on their waiting 10ish years before pulling out the rug to ensure the demographics do not favor unity. See also #okboomer
When you get old enough, prison looks like a better option than a pension or welfare.
“Do you think they’d be mad if they reached that age and find out there’s no money left for entitlements? This sounds like motivation to fix the problems.”
They’ll blame younger people while ignoring the fact that this problem has been known and pointed out publicly since at least the Bush I administration. Nearly 20 years of generational warfare has rotted the brains of those that had any to begin with.
“Dude I am figuring on their waiting 10ish years before pulling out the rug to ensure the demographics do not favor unity.”
No need, it’s already been accomplished and there isn’t time anyway. Anyone else see Yellen’s “clarification” today? LOL!
Works for me born in 53
I read the article. The constant theme is the type of weapon. It never once mentions why someone would want to do this. It never mentions the shooter’s home life. Where was his dad? A victim’s uncle is even quoted saying the kid wasn’t the monster, the rifle was. No one is interested in tackling the real problem.
Uvalde police had everything they needed that day to stop what was happening. They had the body armor, ARs, handguns, and the numbers while standing by listening to the carnage that was taking place. They just did not have the will to save those lives when seconds counted. It was 2 federal agents that stopped the killer that day when they were many miles and hours from what had happened. Those 2 agents had the resolve to end it and they did. It should have not been those 2 agents, but the cowardice Uvalde police department should have been able to do it. Questions still remain;
1. How did a kid get the money to buy what he was wearing and used that day, when he did not have the resources to do so working at minimum wage?
2. The kid could not drive to get those things and did not have a drivers license. Who was the driver of the vehicle that drove him to around to purchase those things?
I have not found any information on this anywhere.
The only possible answer I could come up with was the cartels and no one wants to say it, but they sure want to take our rights away like last summer without any questions or answers.
You can save money quickly when you have zero expenses. If he didn’t have a car, then he didn’t even have to pay for gas. It’s also pretty common for grandparents to give their grandchildren cash as birthday and Christmas gifts.
1. Credit cards are easy to get and if I’m already a piece of shit with homicide/suicide on my mind I certainly don’t care about paying them off so 80% interest is alright with me.
2. One does not require a license, money, insurance or registration to drive a vehicle. One only needs access to a vehicle. Any vehicle.
CC companies will hand out cards to newbies. That sounds plausible. I got a $1,000 limit credit card when I was 18.
By the time the 2 Fed agents arrived there should have been nothing for them to do other than assist in working the scene. Or so it seems.
I don’t see how arguments in court can solve anything. The fargin corcksuckers want disarmament so we can’t stand up against communism. So come and take it. Let’s see just how much ammunition you can take, I want to give it all to them.
The AR excuse is pure BS.
The supposedly, we are told by anti-gun, trained police excuse for waiting over an hour is the shooter had an AR-15?
Eli Dicken, an ordinary armed citizen with a semi-auto Glock pistol, took on a mass shooter with an AR and while Eli was under fire he advanced and took down the shooter in 15 seconds at 40 yards. Eli wasn’t ‘police trained’, the only thing close to formal training he ever had was his Grandfather taught him how to shoot.
Eli isn’t the first ordinary armed citizen armed with a pistol to take on a mass shooter with an AR and stop them in less than a couple of minutes, most without any formal training.
Between 2014 and 2021, ordinary law abiding armed citizens armed only with pistols, stopped 104 out of 204 potential (were stopped before they began or criminal shooter fled without beginning when confronted by the armed citizen) or actual mass shootings, 98 of the (104) criminal shooters stopped were armed with AR-15’s – stopped where the ordinary law abiding armed citizen was legally permitted to be armed – and some of these armed citizens were under fire as they stopped the criminal shooter. Most of these were purposely left out of the FBI statistics which only counted 4% of them, because the FBI only counted those citizens with actual concealed carry permits and those in which the shooter did not flee when confronted by the armed citizen. All of those criminal shooters stopped in under 2 minutes by an ordinary armed citizen.
I’ve never taken on a mass shooter. But I have been in a situation under fire in a protracted fire fight to save the life of my wife, and I continued to advance on the threat under fire and stopped the threat. He didn’t have an AR but it would not have mattered because to save my wife I’m willing to risk my life and would have still advanced on the threat to save her even if the threat did have an AR. I’m not ‘police trained’, although I did have formal training from a class taught by a retired navy seal – a 4 day class he calls ‘tactical defensive firearm’ that he teaches for free at the range he owns. And aside from that incident, several times I’ve had to face the armed threat.
If literally thousands of ordinary armed citizens armed with only a pistol can stop a violent armed threat daily in the United States, and literally hundreds of ordinary armed citizens armed with only a pistol can stop a mass shooter with an AR-15, and most all of these citizens with any special training, ya would think the ‘trained’ police forces on scene at Uvalde with literally a few hundred (collectively) AR’s available to them thus not being outgunned and being in force could enter a room and stop a single mass shooter.
The mass shooter wasn’t even shooting at the cops at Uvalde. He was shooting at the people inside the classroom and some rounds went through dry wall into the hallway. Its not like it was targeted fire just for the cops, the shooter could not even see them and it only happened at one area of the hallway. The hallway to the room could be entered from two directions, why didn’t the cops on the other end of the hallway (not shown in the cherry picked video in the ProPublica link in this article) enter the room from the other direction because they weren’t subjected to rounds through the dry wall so whats their excuse?
Granted, the shooter was in a room and entry would have been hazardous but if the shooter did not have an AR entry would have still been hazardous.
The “oh my oh my… hes got an AR!” hand waving freak out excuse thing here is BS.
According to anti-gun, police are ‘trained’. Yet, this ‘police training’ when they respond always gives the mass shooter just what they want which is unopposed kill zone dominance of at least 3 minutes (on average). And, as an example, comparatively, Eli Dicken took down an AR mass shooter in 15 seconds and saved lives and others have done it within a couple of minutes – ordinary armed citizens did it but the police can’t plain and simple because their ‘trained’ response gives mass shooters, overall, just what they need and that is minimum 3 minutes kill zone dominance (and sometimes more) and the mass shooters know it too and you can tell it in the videos of some of these mass shootings by how casually they roam looking for targets as if they are not worried about being stopped for a while.
It took the Uvalde shooter 2.5 minutes to shoot a majority of his victims, he was taking his time, he knew there was no one to oppose him. if an armed teacher had been inside that classroom they would have had at least a chance. Heck, if armed school staff had been in the school in that 2.5 minutes, they would have had a better chance. But nope, gotta call in the police and give the shooter even more time and the Uvalde shooter won the jackpot for time.
There were officers at the Uvalde scene that tried to get to the room to stop the shooter but they were stopped and not permitted to do so. There were parents trying to go into the school and rescue kids, they were stopped and arrested. There was one lady who was stopped and detained and handcuffed then the cuffs removed, she jumped a fence and entered the school and got her kids and a dozen more and bought them out. An off duty border patrol officer getting a haircut heard the news on the barbershop TV, he borrowed the barbers shotgun and drove to Uvalde and convinced two cops to enter with him and these three armed with a shotgun and pistols bought out dozens of kids safely but when they wanted to go to the room they were stopped. None of these were afraid to enter the school, they didn’t care what firearm the shooter had, their concern was for saving lives.
But the anti-gun claimed ‘trained’ police waited around outside in the hallway, actually able to enter from the other hallway direction with no rounds from the AR coming their way, and they waited for over an hour listening to these people die.
The AR excuse is pure BS.
I wasn’t at Uvalde, that’s true, but I don’t need to have been there to know the AR excuse simply doesn’t stand up. Those cops in the hallway, and those outside who flat out refused to enter, and that chain of command that would not let the other cops enter who wanted to save these people – cowards every one.
clarification for” “and literally hundreds of ordinary armed citizens armed with only a pistol can stop a mass shooter with an AR-15”
In addition to the 104 I mentioned, there were another 231 potential (were stopped before they began or criminal shooter fled without beginning when confronted by the armed citizen) or actual mass shootings that were stopped by ordinary law abiding armed citizens
The Texas State University study, lots of things are missing and slanted by the invented exclusions and definitions, so lets take a look at them:
first some numbers from the study…
* Of the 433 active shooter attacks in the study 249 ended before the police arrived.
* In 64 of those attacks a bystander subdued the attacker 42 times and shot the attacker 22 times
*12 of the shooting bystanders were citizens, 7 were security guards, 3 were off duty police officers
Then lets explore the actual data they used and what it actually says…
In 185 of the 249 that ended before police arrived 133 of that 185 left the scene before police arrived and 72 committed suicide. The study does not tell you that of the 113 that left 108 of those left because an ordinary law abiding citizen (not security or law enforcement) with a gun brandished their firearm and repelled the attacker thus stopped the shooter without firing a shot.
The study also does not tell you that of the 72 that committed suicide 68 did so either while under fire by a ordinary law abiding citizen (not security or law enforcement) with a gun and they could not escape or keep firing being suppressed by the citizen weapons fire but were not hit by the citizen weapons fire or the citizen brandished and the active shooter simply stopped firing and killed their selves when seeing the citizen brandish.
some math: 185 – 72 = 113 attackers left to subdue but they departed the scene before being subdued and before police arrived …. so 249 – 72 – 113 = 64 attackers left to subdue on scene.
This 64 is interesting because you will notice in the study it includes two categories of defenders as if there are those with firearms and those without – those that shot the attacker (22) and those that subdued by physical force (42). Of those defenders that shot 12 were citizens, 7 were security guards, 3 were off duty officers. Its interesting because it does not mention that of those subdued by physical force that the shooter was stopped first in 18 of them by a citizen (not security or law enforcement) brandishing a gun but not firing but the attacker stopped firing when confronted by that armed citizen then the attacker was able to be subdued by physical force.
So of the 433 attacks in the study an ordinary law abiding citizen (not security or police) stopped the attack …
108 + 68 + 12 + 18 + 25 = 231 attacks stopped by an armed citizen (not security or police) with a gun
(note: I count this 25 as a separate attack because it was. The 25 were stopped and repelled. They left ‘defeated’ at the point. But they came back to start again. This is two separate instances of their appearance in the target zone and required two separate instances of successful defense to repel them.)
Jared Loughner (Gabby Giffords shooter) was subdued by some of his intended victims who had not been wounded. However, the person who deserves credit for actually stopping him was a quick thinking middle aged woman who grabbed the magazine he was trying to load into his pistol. That interference gave the others an opportunity to jump on him.
Yes, it does happen that sometimes an unarmed bystander/victim in some way physically stops the shooter or the shooting from continuing. Its not often such a person can be or get close enough or be in a position to do so or have the physical ability to do so. In Giffords case the chance came with the shooter trying to reload in the middle of a bunch of people close enough to take advantage of that reload attempt pause.
That is not the average mass shooting attempt though. On average the victims are not in a situation like that and the shooter is at a distance from the victim(s) where its not very easy or reasonable they can reach out or cover the distance to physically subdue the shooter without being shot their self so a stand off weapon of an opposing force must be employed in some manner to stop the shooter or cause them to delay continuing. There is a lot more that’s involved and ‘physically subdue’ the shooter is not an answer all the time. If were as simple as just being able to physically subdue the shooter the police would not have firearms when they respond.
When unarmed people do physically subdue the shooter anti-gun calls them hero’s. But when a law abiding armed citizen stops the shooter anti-gun calls them ‘criminals’ or ‘the problem’ among other things, and mostly MSM doesn’t report on it and all sorts of anti-gun interest and researchers try to discredit them and claim it never happened.
For example, when Eli Diken took down the shooter Shannon Watts immediately tweeted that, basically, he was in the mall illegally armed (the owners had posted their own sign of no guns allowed which in that state does not have the force of law behind it so there was no illegal act). When some MSM outlets tried to report on and frame it as an heroic act anti-gun Bloombeg and Watts tried to stop their reporting and to counter what they did report there was a rehashing of the false claims from anti-gun studies in the MSM to attempt to discredit and as not a heroic act but that it was an extremely rare thing as if it had never happened before and they concentrated on the couple of victims that did get killed when the shooter first appeared and started firing and downplayed the fact that Diken provided the shield (and guiding them away from the line of fire) that covered the retreat of ~30 others who were targets of the shooter and would not have been able to escape unharmed without that DGU Eli employed.
In the context of mass shootings; A person who confronts that deadly threat, willingly placing their own lives at risk to stop that threat from continuing without regard for his/her own safety or life with their only concern being for the lives and safety of others is a hero – and when it comes to the law abiding armed citizen being that hero anti-gun wants the world to believe it never happened despite the facts to the contrary that it did. It simply does not fit the anti-gun false narrative.
And now that Uvalde happened with gross incompetence and cowardice…. and over all the anti-gun curtain has been drawn back on how very much less effective overall their ‘trained’ police really are in stopping mass shootings and saving lives with it being a fact that overall (many) more deaths and injuries happen waiting for police to respond than when and on scene ordinary law abiding armed citizen engages a mass shooter …. anti-gun is scrambling trying to re-frame Uvalde incompetence and cowardice as ‘the shooter had an AR-15’ in an attempt to once again control the narrative by deception.
Who ACTUALLY stepped up to stop the “Texas Tower” sniper incident? 🤔
Oh, a civilian. With his civilian rifle. 😄
They were all good little lackeys who can OBEY ORDERS and let children be murdered in the next room without showing any remorse.
But the officers did get to go home at the end of their shift. Plus callout and overtime bonus.
It’s a convenient and politically expedient CYA. Nothing more, nothing less.
“he has a battle rifle” 🤪
Soooooo, not only is the UPD a collection of cowards, they’re also stupid.
Battle rifles have a “burst fire” and/or “full auto fire” feature. A semi-auto AR is NOT a “battle” rifle. PERIOD!
The layers of cowardice and stupidity in this incident seem endless.
Remember folks, some of these so-called LEOs want to see you DISARMED and having to rely on THEM for your personal safety. 🤯🤯🤯🤯
I usually call out EVERY LEO/Fireman/Paramedic that refers to themselves as a “first responder” within earshot of me.
Almost turned into a fistfight at a barbershop in Grapevine TX last year. Told a soon retiring +300 lb LE Sargent to GFH because words matter.
He left before me, the staff was very vocal in support of how I handled him, unanimously glad I called his BS out, was told the shop has long considered him a pompous ass.
ONLY those at/near the location, and at the moment any given situation occurs are “first responders”.
Anyone who gets a call, travels to the location, gears up at a safe distance (under conceal/cover), gets instruction from a supervisor, has the luxury of time to assess the situation and their response……….is NOT a “first responder”.
There does seem to be a bit of a inverse correlation between how much ego emergency responders have to how proficient they are. Best paramedic I know has done some amazing things keeping bullet sponges alive long enough for a doctor to patch up or call code. Refers to his vehicle as the meatwagon with unending narcan. The best police officers I know are part time swat full time reporter/janitor by their descriptions…….. Also if not for the haircut would not be easy to pick out of a crowd beyond being fit past mid 20’s
They’re not stupid.
This is hiding behind the political cover they can get from advocacy groups and Democrats as a form of ass covering. It’s a lie that they’re hoping gets them off the hook because it’s a lie other people have told for a long time.
The Uvalde perp knew full well the school was easy pickings. And since the perp knew it so should parents and everyone else in the vicinity.
Forget the cops and the yada, yada, yada. If you want school kids to be as safe as possible then you want them in a school that is armed and prepared for the worse. First things First.
Democrats for “Assault Weapons”? If you are voting democrat you are part of the problem.
The law enforcement in Uvalde were COWARDS. They should be disbarred from ever holding a job in law enforcement or security ever again. The Chief that gave the orders should be in prison but he is a BETO supporter so he walks as free in being a coward as the shooter once was. Senator John “CAVE-IN” Cornyn is the same degree of coward as the aforementioned. Texas needs to revamp its laws to be able to recall politicians when they dont do their jobs or vote in a matter that betrays WE THE PEOPLE, as COWARD CORNYN has done once before. The selfish bastard wont resign because he thinks he’s in office serving a God-like divine purpose but in reality should not be able to draw a Congressional pension.
This type of shooting at schools should never happen again. We’ve been asking for armed security at our schools since the 1980(s) and it’s never been approved and this happens. The useless cops have the exclusive right to full-auto weapons which was taken away from civilians. This only shows the intent of those in power to bring WE THE PEOPLE under their total control. Paranoid tyrants and cowards the lot of them.
“SAFEupstateFML March 23, 2023 At 10:50
Dude I am figuring on their waiting 10ish years before pulling out the rug to ensure the demographics do not favor unity. See also #okboomer”
Hate to break it to you but the USA is already there.
WE may be and if so they fucked up big re timing as there will be a lot of pissed off retirees and nearly so with guns and ability to use them compared to a decade out. So in a way good news of you are correct (or at least not as bad)
They’re not worried about pissed off retirees, and for obvious reasons.
Why would they fear a bunch of people who’ve spent 40+ years paying exactly zero fucking attention? Especially when they’ve already spent the better part of the past two decades convincing those people that young people are the problem?
Look at what’s actually going on. Pay attention to things like the Copper market.
They’re plan is that they’re going to eat the retirees alive and laugh while doing it and 95% of the retirees will scream at a 20 year old for being a “Millennial” because the TV told them to. There’s is a VERY good chance this is what will happen too. Not because the plan is so awesome but because they have properly appraised the status of the marks in this scam and they know what “reversion to mean” actually looks like.
Why do you think I’ve been arguing against generational warfare since I showed up here nearly a decade ago (and for years before that in other places too).
Because it’s not that hard to see where this goes if you pay fucking attention. And the numbers have been known since, bare minimum, 1990. Which happens to be about the time that “offshoring” accelerated like an SR-71. Yet nothing was done to fix any of this for 33 years. I wonder why.
Because all profit is really specialized knowledge that is monetized. That’s why.
“They don’t want a population of citizens capable of critical thinking. They don’t want well informed, well educated people capable of critical thinking. They’re not interested in that. That doesn’t help them. Thats against their interests. Thats right. They don’t want people who are smart enough to sit around a kitchen table to figure out how badly they’re getting fucked by a system that threw them overboard 30 fucking years ago.”
Spoken in 2005, 30 years ago referring to 1975.
What happened in 1975?
Yeah I would agree that is the intended plan. I kinda hope that they fuck up the timing enough that it does not go according to plan but realistically the ginned up intergenerational strife will work as well as the ginned up racisim did.
Related gem https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDDz1Er2IXA
@Dude: That’s the year that Carlin was referring back to when he made the quoted statement. He made it in 2005, so 30 years previous would be 1975.
One of the points I’ve been trying to impress on people here for the last several years is that two seemingly contradictory things can be true at the same time because the key word is “seemingly”. Teasing that apart requires the data that no one shows the public, though it can be found and some critical thinking.
Therefore it can, in fact, be true that there is a plan and also that it’s a terrible plan being executed by morons and therefore that said plan cannot work. Further yet, it can simultaneously be true that part of what we perceive to be a plan is emergent in real time and that the plan is rather generalized, headed towards a general goal but also flexible along shorter time scales. That is, in essence, the notion of small unit tactics incorporated into an army to execute an overarching military strategy.
It can also be true that Michael Malice sums it up perfectly when he says “The enemy class is not made up of impressive people” and that at the same time those people are extremely dangerous because they have extremely powerful tools at their disposal. Even if they don’t really understand them (which the last few years basically prove). A monkey pressing buttons on a very dangerous machine doesn’t make the machine less dangerous and the monkey makes the output of the system wholly unpredictable which might be the worst thing possible. The history of the USSR pretty well shows this.
This is what I think is happening and have provided substantial evidence of over time, though not in a single post because it would be TL;DR by a mile.
The problem with such a situation at this scale is three fold IMHO.
1. Such fuckery can create disconnects that kill stupid numbers of people because these idiots don’t get what they want but still manage to, at least temporarily, break the system on which 300+ million people depend. For all the talk about prepping and self-reliance, the truth is that this is really a stats game where a large percentage of people who do everything right still end up losing. Against large events fortune favors the prepared and the bold but it does not guarantee victory or survival. Neither math nor Lady Luck will be denied.
2. This fuckery does NOT occur in a vacuum. The actions of the dipshits in charge here have reverberations around the world. Those things each have ripple effects and we have zero clue how they interact IRL and therefore we have no clue what the outcome of that would be. From a basic systems approach, the answer would be “Mostly bad shit” because no matter how you cut it the overall schema of the world does mostly function. The chances that you, effectively, randomly disrupt a functional system in dozens of ways and end up without a clusterfuck is very, very low.
3. The vast majority of Westerners, of which Americans are the subset I care about most, are entirely unprepared for any of this because mostly they’re completely unaware of it. As much as people might not want to hear it, mostly this has nothing to do with age. Hence my opposition to generational warfare. Though I might take a lot of shit for it, the truth is that “Boomers” are NOT better prepared for, well much of anything, than their arch-rival, the “Millennials”. Why do I say that? Because I pay attention and look at the data instead of the opinions that are, by definition, biased by feelz or simply a statement of feelz. Both groups, at large, deny reality because they are not given a useful input of information upon which to base decisions. Further, they’re gaslit against each other because divide and conquer works.
A lot of things compete for our attention daily and our “pool” of attention is limited. It can be depleted by extraneous nonsense. This is the point of propaganda and much of corporate entertainment/news, but I repeat myself.
The discovery that limited attention can be exploited by distraction is not new. The Romans, Greeks, Egyptians and Jews all knew this thousands of years ago and wrote extensively on it as methods of population control via politics.
The most salient point I have hoped to impress upon people is that this mess actually isn’t hard to fix, actually, and that the current situation actually presents enormous opportunity to right the ship, provided we pay fucking attention to the right things which means getting away from the distractions.
Most of media, regardless of type, is “bread and circuses” meant to divide your attention from what’s actually going on. I don’t GAF if that’s Facebook or CNBC (for the most discerning investors, of course) or Fox or talk radio or whatever the fuck else.
Your point #1 is one that I probably identify the most with as any form of societal collapse (katrina was fun) leads to all kinds of opportunities to get fucked over hard while doing everything right. I find it somewhat encouraging that the CNN and similar ratings are basically at all time lows and I HOPE that people are reading beyond Fox news (for the other end of the mental trap) but your earlier mention of the Fed was well placed as we may be LARPing Weimar rather soon.
“…we may be LARPing Weimar rather soon.”
We already are. Just not the part of which there are photos that gut punch people. Like the argument over a “Cold Civil War” where the naysayers ignore history and then stare at you like a cow when you mention Bleeding Kansas.
We currently have ~100 banks on the brink of collapse at this point and the Treasury had a closed-door Financial Stability Oversight Council meeting today, the day after Yellen said everything was fine as she blundered her way through a “clarification” of her statement from Wednesday that undercut JayPow’s jawing on the FOMC meeting.
And what does the FSOC say once they’re done with their private chat?
During the meeting, the Council heard a presentation from staff of the Federal Reserve Bank of New York on market developments.
The Council discussed current conditions in the banking sector and noted that while some institutions have come under stress, the U.S. banking system remains sound and resilient.
The Council also discussed ongoing efforts at member agencies to monitor financial developments.
LOL, these people are fucking clowns.
Jump across the pond but say in the same basic lane: In Germany (oh, the irony) the focus is on UBS purchasing (bailing out) Credit Suisse (But the real story is how the Swiss government bent and broke banking laws and regs to make that happen, ignore the man behind that curtain, in fact, just ignore the curtain.), but a glance under the hood shows that Deutsche Bank ain’t in good shape either, meaning that the CS “contagion” hopped the border and entered a major German bank. Oh, my.
Think the FDIC can cover $9-$18 trillion? We’re very likely gonna find out.
But change your zoom and we can make this all myopic and just talk guns in the same manner.
Again, dat copper market. Don’t just glance at the charts, check the analyst notes. For more than a decade the analysts have been puzzled by the artificially low price of copper worldwide. The commodities rules for everything else like copper say one thing but copper does the other whenever big players move. Similar to Au and Ag. Interesting.
So if the current price of copper is up against the 10 year average and all metrics say it should jump another 200-600%, what’s that do to ammo supply/price?
But hey, what do I know, right? I’m the idiot who doesn’t realize how small and immaterial ESG is when it controls a paltry 50% of world capital via one mechanism or another and whole countries are moving their retirement funds to require excellent ESG scores as a criterion for investment of retirement currency.
Transnational shipping and your 2A rights. I don’t put the two together just to sound all erudite and shit. The world’s interconnected and there is a connection between the price of goods overseas and your rights at home because instability must be “dealt with”, amirite? And someone who’s paying attention will first find that connection and then find it rather worrying.
“Order from chaos” ain’t just a Masonic saying. Things that create chaos also create the opportunity for people to seize power in dangerous ways and do so to thunderous applause rather than an execution.
This article talks about outsourcing your self-defense. The real issue in this Uvalde school shooting is outsourcing the education of your children. Not only is the public education system, which I call the government indoctrination system, failing at educating our children, but it’s also putting our children’s lives in danger. In today’s fish in a barrel schools there’s no way I would allow a child under my care to go to any public school. Homeschool is way better. The children get a better education and the teachers and staff, i. e. the parents, and even some of the students can all be armed! There are probably some private schools that have better security than public schools if you want to go that route. But anyone can homeschool their children. It doesn’t require money it just requires effort. And who is going to want your children or grandchildren to be educated more? Some liberal teacher who just wants to get paid for doing less or the actual parents who love their children? If you love your children or grandchildren you will do everything in your effort to get them out of the public schools. They are getting brainwashed to disrespect you and your beliefs.
If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don’t have to worry about answers.
Thomas Pynchon, Gravity’s Rainbow
Oh, and all those officers are cowards and richly deserve any consequences for their lack of action!
Home school and vote down every budget increase. Best we can do for now but things are looking to get ugly with medical freedom as with everything else.
The probability is that the medical system collapses.
That kinda sucks but also presents enormous opportunity.
RIGHT ON – NAILED IT !!!
ATF’s Assault on the Second Amendment: When is Enough Enough? | Subcommittee on Crime and Federal Government Surveillance – streaming now live.
All the “experts” are back for more bloviating and and self-serving bragging. Hopefully the editor can find a new topic for tomorrow.
The badge bunny has her kneepads on.
Guarantees her promotion.
Apparently, so are all the lying suckers of police cock. Wipe your chin off when you’re done.
So, two dozen (assumed to be “trained”) professional grown men armed with ARs, shotguns, semi-auto pistols wearing body armor carrying ballistic shields (and masks, can’t forget the WuFlu strainers) were “outgunned” by an 18 year old kid with an AR? (was HE wearing HIS mask?)… Good to know…
Outsourced security is good, however you’ve got to pay mercenaries a little more then ice cream vendor wanna be enforcers of a Lawman(thank u JeffPlane).
Get some of them big blck dudes from around the Cape Horn area, with omega tattoos on their arms , that place is safer then Fort Knox.
$$$ ? saves schools or starts Wars, ironicatbest.
There’s a group in Russia who will work for minimum wage rates. The name has a classical music reference.
I said this before on TTAG and I’ll say it again. Unless you’re willing to repeal all the laws, that prevent the law abiding, from being able to kill dead on site, criminals when they rob, rape, steal, Vandalize, and or break into private property, and assault, folks.
This argument is just a waste of good oxygen.
The loudest voices are coming from those who want to repeal sod***y laws and repeal drug laws.
The people who support the repeal of those laws, almost never support repealing the laws, that will let the law abiding to starting killing criminals when they want to.
They are only about “the soft things”. They avoid the hard things like accountability.
And you got your wish. Sod***y and drug laws were repealed in Washington State Oregon and California. And it has turned those States into sh!tholes. And hundreds of thousands of people are moving out of the West Coast
And things Proposition 47 in California Made it easier to steal and get away with it.
Sod***y laws only affect consenting adults in private. Otherwise, it’s rape which is a crime with or without sod***y laws. Statutory rape if one of the participants is below legal age.
The War on Drugs has been decided and drugs won. Even a conservative state like Arizona has legalized recreational marijuana. People are hysterical about the fentanyl crisis which is only a crisis if you’re stupid enough to ingest a pill of dubious origin.
The real problem is an unwillingness to hold criminals responsible for their crimes by prosecuting and imprisoning them or by empowering their victims to fight back.
“Sod***y laws only affect consenting adults in private.”
I stand by my statement. These people have F#cked up a large portion of the United States.
They support the government Prosecuting consenting adults, a woman who happens to be on welfare and living in a public housing project. And her boyfriend. Their hypocrite pigs when it comes to sex.
They support replacing a father with a welfare check. And they support replacing the Father’s Love and discipline with the guns of a big city police department.
The [email protected] [email protected] have always been [email protected] Pr0gressive in their [email protected] [email protected] They have always supported the confiscation of guns from the law abiding. and they support the strictest of gun control laws.
I grew up in California I know exactly how they think.
dacian should take fentanyl. It is the latest opiate of the masses from those caring people in the CCP.
“dacian should take fentanyl. It is the latest opiate of the masses from those caring people in the CCP.”
Dat new shit is “tranq”. It’s not reversible with Narcan, causing OD’s to be something that can’t be dealt with on scene, and repeated use eats holes in people.
Dat new shit is “tranq”. It’s not reversible with Narcan,
Mixture of Fentanyl and animal tranquilizer… Calling it the “Zombie” drug, does some really fukked up shit to people…
The big impediment at Uvalde was the feeble excuse for a man serving as school police chief. He took command but did nothing. There were officers willing to take out the murderer but the chief refused to let them. The Border Patrol team that finally killed him persuaded their own commander to ignore the chief’s orders.
If you put rifle and handgun shooting teams back into the schools. The schools can then defend themselves against attack.
Back in the 1980s and before. Students could bring their guns to school all the time and the ammunition with it. Normally kept locked in their cars. But at some elementary schools their guns were held by the schools principal.
And on days like Halloween, some students dressed up like cowboys. And openly carried their side arms. Unloaded of course.
All that and there were no school shootings. Boy things sure have changed in America haven’t they?
Uvalde LEOs weren’t out gunned. They were out nerved.
YOU are your own First Responder. LEOs are Second Responders….take away their First Responder discounts and perks.
At least our military is strong…….
Cops, outnumbering a single guy 376:1 when he’s with a semi-auto rifle shit their pants.
This guy, alone, outnumbered, against real full-autos and grenades:
I dont know about the pension part but definitely that’s a big YES on the welfare part.
The goal of the Libertarians Liberals and the Left has been achieved. The police have pulled back. They no longer do the job we expect them to do.
We now really do have less law enforcement.
Now if they will just find the courage to repeal all laws that stop the law abiding from killing criminals dead on site. Then we can really do with less police.
“What happened in 1975?”
It was the year good pop music died.
Now it all makes sense.
“Now it all makes sense.”
Happy to be here, grateful for the opportunity, proud to serve.
Eli Dicken honored as Greenwood Citizen of the Year Award for actions during mall shooting
Eli, with no formal training and being a lone armed law abiding person with a Glock, evacuated people from the area and covered their retreat, and while under fire engaged and advanced on the lone mass shooter with an AR-15 and stopped him in 15 seconds at 40 yards. Although there were three victims killed when the shooter first appeared and started shooting thus the first sign of trouble, Eli’s quick thinking and taking action and bravery saved lives.
Uvalde…. an untrained 18 year old with an AR in a room with no where else to go and no way out, ~400 trained police surrounding the building, trained police officers inside in the hallway armed with pistols and AR’s stood around in the hall outside the door for 77 minutes listening to people die and be shot in that room as they cried out for help, and actually stopped other cops who were wanting to save those people and stop the shooter from trying to enter; Their first excuse was ‘door locked no key’ but it turns out the door was not locked and no key was needed and no one ever checked the door. Their next excuse was ‘confusing chain of command and orders’. Their next excuse was ‘waiting for a SWAT team’. Their next excuses were a confused jumble of combinations of things none of which proved to be true. Now their, and the anti-gun, excuse is ‘he had an AR’.
Those cops in the hallway at Uvalde standing around listening to these people die and be shot are cowards and liars. Those cops who flat out refused to enter the school or the room are cowards and liars. That school district police chief is a coward and liar.
But aside from all those other on scene Uvalde cowards and liars who directly facilitated and aided in the deaths and injury of these people; The anti-gun interests pushing this ‘he had an AR’ narrative as the reason for the Uvalde lies and cowardice, those anti-gun interests are liars and cowards as well and have over time, with the media, facilitated and aided the deaths and injury of hundreds by their narratives and false hoods appealing to the mental illness that drives all mass shooters to embolden them, as anti-gun gladly relishes and figuratively dances in the blood of innocents to make it a media circus for the lie and deception games they play.
Eli Dicken, a lone law abiding armed citizen with only a Glock, with no formal training, evacuated people from the area and covered their retreat, and while under fire engaged a mass shooter with an AR and ended the threat in 15 seconds, and saved lives. Anti-gun called Eli a criminal, claimed he did not stop the shooter, tried to suppress mention of his heroic actions in the media, and when it did become widely circulated in the media anti-gun launched a campaign to discredit and disparage and pointed to anti-gun backed studies and research that has been debunked and put that forth as truth when it was a lie.