TTAG reader MM writes:
I just read Elections? You wanna talk elections? at philly.com. It got me thinking; after the recent gubernatorial race in Virginia [where pro-gun control candidate Terry McAuliffe eeked-out a victory over pro-gun Republican candidate Ken Cuccinelli II] could the same thing happen in Pennsylvania? I decided to head over to the website of Democratic front-runner Allyson Schwartz and take a look at firearms-related bills that she’s either sponsored or cosponsored and hooolleee shit! Schwartz has her name attached to house incarnations of just about every infringement thrown around by the civilian disarmament industrial complex, from “Large Capacity Ammunition Feeding Device Act (H.R. 138), which would bar the sale or gift of large-capacity ammunition feeding devices” to “The NRA Members’ Gun Safety Act (H.R. 21), which seeks to implement five common sense gun safety reforms that polling shows are supported by at least 63 percent of NRA members.” Does this signal the potential for dark times in Pennsylvania?
I’m not that worried. Note that all those measures are brought up–mostly by the disarmament, big-state, big-city crowd in Philly–and are summarily shot down by the entire rest of the state. NO representative or assemblyman outside of Philadelphia is willing to vote for any of that crap, because their constituents would run them out of town on a rail if they tried.
We LIKE our guns in PA, and they know it (for frame of reference, we have looser gun laws than TEXAS–open carry is legal, no permit required, and a CCW is shall-issue). While I do see Corbett losing his job in 2014, I see the state houses staying pretty much the same. That means she can crow all she wants, they aren’t gonna let her have any of it.
That said, no excuse not to stay vigilant.
Couldn’t have said it better, thank you Jim.
Yes, well that is all contingent on the republicans holding their majorities in the legislature.
Mid state dems in PA have alway remained progun. Look at the first castle doctrine vote under Rendel.
“It can’t happen here” is said most everywhere it happens, before it happens.
I’m even concerned about Florida.
Not to mention that we used to feel safe in Colorado.
Until we got overrun with low information voters. . .
I said unlikely, not impossible. Can it? Yeah. Will it? Probably not, but keep eyes open anyway.
No excuse not to stay vigilant.
Absolutely. We thought Toomey would do us a solid too.
Lets see PA lose the pistol registration, then we’ll talk about how its a bastion of 2A freedom.
We don’t have pistol registration. What we have is that the PA state police (PSP) are doing the background checks via its PICS system. There is a bill in play to get rid of PICS and use the FBI NICS system. What PSP is doing is using the transfer database as a defacto registration system. But, there is no registration law in PA. If you move from out of state you don’t need to get gov’t permission to own a handgun, nor are you required to register.
They do keep records on handguns (despite the no-registration law), and you can’t legally x-fer a handgun here without going through a FFL. So, it is de facto registration for all handguns obtained while you are here.
So basically you just said what I said. There is no registration law in PA. Remember it was our fabulous PA supreme court that allowed PSP to keep doing what it’s doing. It’s a very incomplete database. It does not contain gifted or willed firearms or guns that were brought into the state.
Yeah, your right. I got hosed because I purchased the handguns I own while in PA. I wish it were otherwise, but too late for that.
Agree with Jim R. Prior to Corbett, we had a Liberal Dem. gun-grabber from Philly – Gov. Ed Rendell. He requested more than one bill to the floor which were all shot down…by most of our Dems as well. It’s just not popular in this state outside of Philly.
That being said, always stay vigilant and vote your mind!
With all due respect, In Texas no gun permit required, is a shall issue state, only difference is no open carry in Texas, yet. We like ours guns too.
Which is why I will be fleeing the people’s republic of the socialist state new jersey to Pennsylvania the first chance I get. Hell I can live in Easton and still be close to all my family and friends in Jersey and New York.
Representing Easton, its turning around! and some excellent gun shops
Va used to feel this way not all that long ago. Then a NYC mayor pumped money to Terry Mc and a Tx liberal Dem backed the libertarian candidate and Cuc lost a close one.
Virginia isn’t the “next Virginia.” Pro Second Amendment forces have a super majority in the House of Delegates.
true, probably zero chance of any gun control legislation getting through
It may not happen this year or next, but if the former head of the DNCC, a carpetbagger Clinton crony who finished third in the primary four years ago, can win a statewide election with Obama, both Clintons and Bloomberg publicly stumping for him, nothing is safe. With all the recent transplants, our demographics more closely resemble Colorado than any midwest or Rockies state. Obama has imparted the (D) party with a glow of cool, and if the (R)s run enough weak candidates or kooks, it’s all be over. I wish we had more 2A (D)s, but the Obama aura also seems to have sapped the existing ones of any principle.
It’s all about the political demographics. The state is 50/50 The Democrats win 80+ of the vote in 25% of the districts. The Republicans dominate the rest of the state for 60%+ of the seats in the House of Delegates. There is no way for the Democrats to control the state legislature and therefore no way for McAuliffe to enact gun control or any other part of his agenda.
As you describe, D districts are urban/cities. They will those things 90-5, 75- 22, etc. The suburbs and rural are were the R’s are and those are a bigger majority. Heck, Romney won more congressional districts than that big eared jackass but the liar win’s big in philly, miami, denver, etc. Look at Ohio in the romney vs liar race. The whole state is red except the cities. The liar won big in columbus, cleveland, toledo, etc. Those city hellholes want everyone to live like them.
Obama is going away soon enough, and let’s face it, the significant chunk of his area was basically being “not Bush”. This is fading away over time, and now he has his own mess to answer for (Libya & Syria and the whole NSA fiasco, for example).
Whether the next president will be D or R, I expect him to be more centrist.
I wish I could share you optimism. With so many low information voters, voter fraud issues and the main stream media, there is no way an R can win again. I am 33 y/o and consider myself a Libertarian/Conservative in the manner of Goldwater and Reagan. I weep for my country. However, when it comes down to the election, you can not beat Santa Claus with all the things the Dems simply want to give out. If Hillary runs, she will be President. She will want to make her mark, just like any other Dem and will simply try and out-Obama Obama. They will shift even further to the left to secure their political legacy.
Our only saving grace will be a financial collapse due to our debt and deficits that shuts the government down and forces us to reset our Republic. It will be during these time politicians will not have time for “gun control”.
The anti-gun forces are treating VA like a national referendum on Gun Rights. It can’t be further from the truth. They only won by 2 or 3% points and we can’t assume the only issues that went into the voting decisions were gun based. I’m sure there were a myriad of other complex issues (ranging from economic to social).
This is far from a nail in the coffin for VA…there is still the legislative process to consider and VA’s governor, from what I understand, has little power because of the state’s constitutional safe guards against tyranny.
With PA…Corbet and Cuenncilli are two very different candidates. The anti-gun candidate lost to him in 2010. I voted for Corbet in 2010 before I moved back to (*Gulp*) New Jersey. I think Corbet will win more hearts and minds than Cuenncili whose platform and persona were more geared towards agitating people interested in social issues. Corbet also has the benefits of incumbency. As for the PA House and Senate, they were able to hold the line during the 8 years of Ed Randell. I don’t think much has changed since then.
2%, 3%, it doesn’t matter. I doubt when Big Mac is designing his Four Year Plan, he’ll think, “Hmm,that was a squeaker. Guess I better moderate my stance.” Not bloody likely. Everyone forgets once the oath is taken.
Ever hear the saying that the President proposes and Congress disposes? That applies at the state level too. The Republicans in the House of Delegates are going to McAuliffe to pound sand and there is nothing he can do about it.
Earlier this year, when everybody was in a panic about an assault weapons band and reduced magazine capacity, cooler heads (and I am not mentioning who) pointed out that the gun controllers didn’t have 60 votes in the Senate and the Republican House isn’t even going to consider the matter. Same thing applies in Virginia. As a matter of courtesy the Republicans in the House of Delegates won’t even bring gun control to the floor because they won’t want to embarrass the new Governor.
Va win for the marxist was all about the radical dems running a BS throwaway “third/pot party” candidate. Funded well enough to peel off votes from the Rep who was in fact a conservative. The RINO GOP and henchmen put in NO real $ to getting the Rep elected (“you can have Va if we can have NJ/fatboy”). The GOP GAVE VA to the dems.
The NRA should conduct a members only poll on what measures we really support or oppose. The antis just make stuff up most of the time.
They did, in one issue of American Rifleman. This was not long after that figure came out that supposedly, 90% of Americans support the “universal background check” law.
Not surprisingly, it showed that NRA members overwhelmingly oppose stricter disarmament laws of any kind.
Pa is defiantly headed purple at best. While it is true that most of the state is pro 2 A. The infringement cult from NY is infiltrating the North and especially the North Eastern part of the state. Pittsburgh and surrounding counties aren’t much better than Philly. North of Philly the commies are occupying Bucks and Montgomery Counties. The real shame is that the Federal Second Amendment is a watered down version of PA’s “Second Amendment.
alleghany county is terrible but the surrounding are very pro-gun. i walked into one of the satelight offices for my carry permit and walked out with it in 10 minutes just east of pittsburgh in westmoreland county
Montgomery County was 10 minutes also (for me).
There was a point where the lines were long (as the “Gun Permit Line Forms Here” sign at the entrance to the permit office indicated).
If your state is home to a city greater then 1 million, you have reason to be concerned.Gun control ,leftist groupthink and large urban centers go together like side effects on a pill label.
““The NRA Members’ Gun Safety Act (H.R. 21)”…reads, in part:
“Requires each state that allows its residents to carry concealed firearms in or affecting interstate or foreign commerce to establish a process through which a resident must obtain a permit to carry a concealed firearm. Requires a state to: (1) ensure that a local law enforcement agency participates in the process; and (2) require an applicant to be a legal U.S. resident of at least 21 years of age, to demonstrate good cause for requesting the permit and that he or she is worthy of the public trust to carry a concealed firearm in public, to complete a firearm safety training course, and to not have been convicted of a crime of violence.”
…wow. Orwellian name, there…
(specifically, I’m pretty sure the NRA is not on board with turning every state into ‘May Issue’)
Couldn’t the NRA sue for misuse of their name? They don’t endorse the legislation.
That’s probably why it was named the NRA *Members*, rather than just the “NRA’s”… although I’m not sure you can sue over someone using your trademark on a law anyway.
Here’s the summary for H.R. 21:
NRA Members’ Gun Safety Act of 2013 – Amends the federal criminal code to prohibit a person who is not a licensed firearms importer, manufacturer, or dealer from transferring a firearm to, or receiving a firearm from, another unlicensed person, except: (1) through a licensed dealer or a law enforcement agency, which shall conduct a background check through the national instant criminal background check system; and (2) after inspecting a permit that confirms that such background check has been conducted. Specifies exceptions, including for: (1) the transfer of a bona fide gift between immediate family members; (2) a transfer that occurs by operation of law or by an executor or trustee because of the death of another person; (3) a temporary transfer that occurs in the home of the unlicensed transferee who believes that possession of the firearm is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to the transferee; and (4) certain temporary transfers without the transfer of title at a shooting range, at a shooting competition, or while hunting, fishing, or trapping.
Sets forth requirements for a licensed dealer or law enforcement agency that assists in such transfer, including requirements to: (1) notify the transferor and transferee of compliance with background check requirements and of the receipt of any notification from the background check system that a transfer is prohibited, and (2) report to the Attorney General on such a transfer and on transfers of two or more pistols and/or revolvers to the same unlicensed transferee during any five consecutive business days. Permits such dealer or law enforcement agency to assess a processing fee.
Prohibits a licensed dealer from authorizing an employee to possess or transfer a firearm or ammunition in the course of employment unless such dealer has received a notice that the Attorney General has determined that receipt of a firearm by the employee would not be unlawful.
Authorizes the Attorney General to deny the transfer of firearms or the issuance of a federal firearms and explosives license to any individual if the Attorney General: (1) determines that such individual has been engaged in, or has provided material support or resources for, terrorist activities; and (2) has a reasonable belief that such individual may use a firearm or explosive in connection with terrorism. Allows any individual whose firearm or explosives license application has been denied to bring legal action challenging the denial. Permits the Attorney General to withhold information in firearms and explosives license denial revocation suits that would likely compromise national security. Authorizes the Attorney General to revoke firearms and explosives licenses and permits held by individuals determined to be engaged in terrorism.
Requires each person who owns or possesses a firearm to report its theft or loss to the appropriate local authorities within 48 hours after the theft or loss is discovered.
Requires each state that allows its residents to carry concealed firearms in or affecting interstate or foreign commerce to establish a process through which a resident must obtain a permit to carry a concealed firearm. Requires a state to: (1) ensure that a local law enforcement agency participates in the process; and (2) require an applicant to be a legal U.S. resident of at least 21 years of age, to demonstrate good cause for requesting the permit and that he or she is worthy of the public trust to carry a concealed firearm in public, to complete a firearm safety training course, and to not have been convicted of a crime of violence.
Gee and their polling is soooo accurate and unbiased. It’s great how when you call the lefties to the carpet on the polls how the truth comes out[of course they are not interested in facts so no problem for them]’poll conducted with 982 people 5 gun owners and ,of course that 982 were from the Democratic rosters.So Golly look 192% of the people back gun control,oh wait I mean,let’s see if I just remove the ‘1’ then that will make ’92’ ,oh ya ,Ok ‘92% OF AMERICA SUPPORTS THIS SO WHAT’S THE PROBLEM?
The percentage of union workers in PA has declined from 20.9% of the workforce to its current low of 13.5%. But that still leaves 734,000 union members in the state, and all the unions are in bed with the Democrats.
Pennsylvania backed every Dem presidential candidate in six straight elections since 1992. Philadelphia is owned by the Democrats. Pittsburgh is controlled by the Democrats. Even the Republican party in the state is dominated by the Democrats. Only the more rural counties have a lick of common sense, and they are outvoted.
The typical PA Dem is anti-abortion and pro-gun, but how long can that last?
For now I would say that gun control in PA is a long shot. In VA the DC area is really what tipped the scales for the gun disarmament folks. Here in PA Philly and areas around Pittsburgh are our biggest concern but for the time being don’t represent a major threat. Of course we will stay vigilant but I think gun culture is much more widespread in PA then in VA (I have lived in both states for many years and have a pretty good baseline on it).
Why do they call gun friendly politicians cowardly and craven for refusing to back their unconstitutional vision of America?
If 90% of Americans truly supported laws like Universal BC, then wouldn’t opposing those laws make those politicians brave?
Dark times indeed. The lights are going out everywhere.
Virginia doesn’t paint the picture you think it paints. There were three candidates, McAuliffe, Cuccinelli, and Sarvis. McAuliffe “won” with 48%. That means 52% voted for Cuccinelli and Sarvis, both are 2nd Amendment supporters. If people vote according to their preferences for the law, then 52% of voters are 2nd Amendment supporters and 48% are not.
I’d also characterize McAuliffe as the one who lost the least. There were no winners in VA’s governor race.
“There were no winners in VA’s governor race.”
That’s especially true when you take the residents of the Commonwealth into account. . .
Since a vote for Sarvis was a vote for McAuliffe, I’s say that your new governor won handily.
Sarvis is an opportunist, a former Republican with a grudge who ran a “rule or ruin” campaign. He was nothing but a straw man for McAuliffe.
Oh, and he’s also a creep.
In so far as the 2nd Amendment goes, a vote for Sarvis was not a vote for McAuliffe. The problem with Americans is that Americans do not understand plurality voting at all.
Pennsylvania voted for Obama in both the ’08 and ’12 elections. Enough said.
Philly/Pittsburgh voted for Obama…
And that is why demographics are going to bury us.
Yup. While a lot of people pay lip service to the RKBA when polled, when push comes to shove most people in the USA are Statists.
…that’s one interpretation. The other would be that a lot of people support gun rights but don’t see them as the only issue in an election.
I’m really surprised that the last five years seem to have taught us d!ck. Yeah, we survived the Aurora/Sandy Hook/Manchin-Toomey disarmament push on a national scale, but Colorado, New York, Maryland, Connecticut and California didn’t. Another couple high profile “events” and Jack and Jill Middle America will fall to the gun grabbers — they don’t have dogs in the fight and they get tired of fights quickly anyhow, so they’ll just let whomever’s louder have what they want for peace and security.
Guys and gals, we are scary paranoiacs. Ten rounds is the new “standard capacity.” This is the drumbeat Jack and Jill Middle America get and none of this will stop. Virginia has given Watts and Feinstein hope, however misguided. If you let a disarmer win, assuming she or he won’t be effective, you’re playing Russian roulette with your rights. COMPLACENCY KILLS.
10 rounds?!? That would make you a criminal in New York.
there are alot of dedicated pro-gun people in PA, we have and will hold the line not matter the casualties. i’ve been to harrisburg for some pro-2a rallies, these are passionate and educated men and women, i have no worries for my home state until new york and jersey fall into the water and their people are transplanted here
I’ve attended some of those rallies, and it is indeed encouraging. Would be nice if the press covered them, but what can you expect?
we had the whole steps in front of the capitol building with maybe 12ish counter protesters and not a peep in the newspapers
Guns were not a significant part of the VA gubernatorial election last week. Cuccinelli lost because educated women in northern Virginia would not vote for him, and they looked elsewhere because of Cuccinelli’s positions on abortion/marriage/divorce and his attack on climate scientists at UVA. Men throughout Virginia more or less split the vote between the two major-party candidates.
Seriously, guns were not on people’s minds in NOVA, and certainly not in the minds of women who went to the polls. As a hot-button issue guns pale in comparison to abortion/choice and climate change. Cuccinelli was a candidate of nearly caricature proportions in both these regards.
Candidates ignore the demographic of educated women at their peril. VERY few of these women have a strong position about guns one way or the other–they vote other issues.
The quiet majority in the US are centrists at heart. The excesses of the media (on both sides) and gerrymandering (again, on both sides), have enabled the viability of candidates at the ends of the political spectrum at the cost of the middle. In Virginia, this has manifested itself with governors like McAuliffe, McDonnel, and Kaine (none one of whom could have been elected a decade ago) at the expense of governors like Warner, Gilmore, and Allen.
I know quite a lot of female VA voters. Many mentioned the election in the run-up. Not one of them tried to get me to vote for McAuliffe because of gun control. Cuccinelli did not lose because of guns, or Sarvis. Fake Libertarian or not, polls show that Sarvis pulled 2 voters from McAuliffe for every one he took from Cuccinelli.
Actually, it was single women educated, credentialed or not that Cuccinelli lost. He won married women by 10 points. There was McAuliffe’s caricature of Cuccinelli’s positions on abortion, birth control and divorce and his actual positions on the subject. Cuccinelli could not ban birth control or abortion by SCOTUS decision. His position on divorce was that you must find fault when minor children are involved. .It was actually for the Children.
The real issue is the modern class division of society. There are now three classes. The elite, which in the USSR was called the nomenklatura; the client class, people who get all or most of their money from welfare; and other people, i.e., those who pay for it all. The immediate future lies with the urbanized Millenials who currently think they are part of the elite when in fact they are the other people. The Democratic Party is the party of nomenklatura and the client class. The Republicans are the party of other people. The healthcare law is an eye opener for Millenials who are waking up to the fact that they are the other people. The question is will they join the party of other people or join the client class. I am not optimistic since Millenials in general have brought up with the notion the competition is bad and to excel is unfair. On balance I expect them to choose the path of least resistance and join the client class.
As far as his attack on Michael Mann goes. That was certainly justified in light of the exposure of Mann’s academic fraud committed with public money. Climate science itself has become a parody of actual science. It follows in the tradition of T.D. Lsyenko. Anybody who thinks the pseudo-science of climate change was an issue doesn’t belong in this discussion.
If you are a PA resident, look into Kathleen Kane. Bloomberg has already purchased a PA Attorney General, and she’s done what she can to piss in the soup pot (though admittedly it’s not much). Philly is de facto may issue in defiance of State law, and Kane hasn’t done anything to make that better. She also ended the “loophole” of PA residents being able to carry with a FL permit. There may be some weird technicalities, but many people who were carrying on an FL permit would legally qualify for a PA permit under State law, but were illegally denied in Philly (they abuse the “character” requirement, denying permits based on silly stuff like parking tickets or subjective impressions). Kane is also guilty of small, skeezy stuff like putting the info on obtaining a license to carry under the “crime” section of the web site instead of placing it with other resident services. So, we need to watch that they don’t slowly put in place the pieces they need to make bigger changes.
All in all, PA residents can’t gripe too much. We have it pretty good relative to many other States. As others have said, our legislature will protect us at least in the short term. But we need to keep pushing to gain ground, not settle for holding on. The Philly Progs won’t stop pushing on their end.
Those of us in NY still look over wistfully across the border.
That video made me vomit a little.
Is PA the next VA? It is if there is a popular Libertarian on the ballot.
Let the flaming begin!!!
You know, the best way to win an election may be to run a lot of “fake” 3rd parties appealing to demographics you want to split…
Schwartz is in pretty much in lock step with Barry O. The other scary prospect is the current PA AG who’s first act as AG was to negate reciprocity for Florida CCW for non-residents of FL.
Don’t ever vote libtard (democrat). Problem solved. To bad many morons (even on this forum) don’t get this point.
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