This just popped-up in the comments section, from Magpul Industries founder and CEO Richard Fitzpatrick:
This is a more complete statement..
With our distribution model, it would be difficult to enforce such a blanket policy, and would be a symbolic gesture. Just as it is difficult to stop $50 and $100 PMAGs at the retail level from resellers that buy through multiple levels of distribution, stopping sales to specific end-users would be almost impossible for the same reasons . . .
On the other side of this, we have seen the efforts of the Larimer County Sheriff and others in the CO Sheriffs’ Association, who have been incredible advocates for the Second Amendment here in the fight we are currently in. If a ban passes, these guys would be the ones hurt, and the politicians wouldn’t care. They would also be on our side. On the same front, about 600 of the NYSP have come out in protest of the NY SAFE act and in support of responsible Citizens and the 2A, at the risk of losing their jobs, their retirement, and the safety of their families. Are these the guys that we want to punish? Lumping all individual officers together and wanting to punish them all is no different than politicians who want to punish responsible Citizens for the behavior of criminals. Would a check box on the LE/MIL order form affirming 2A support for all Citizens make a difference? How many out there click on “I Accept” for terms and agreements before an iOS update without reading or caring what they are? Would anyone NOT click such a box? Chuck Schumer would even click that box if he was trying to order PMAGs. (We wouldn’t ship that one.)
If these LEOs who support our cause, and are “gun guys” find employment elsewhere because they can’t get the right gear to perform their jobs safely, or if politicians fire them for voicing their objections, they will simply be replaced with new faces that aren’t gun guys, don’t know any better, and may gladly stomp on your rights without a second thought if given the order. As it stands now, these pro-gun LEOs in occupied or potentially occupied territory are the only voices of reason among the LEO ranks there. Do we really want to purge them out and replace them with guys that wouldn’t know the difference between an AR and a Hi-point, and so couldn’t care less which one they are armed with, and that will also blindly follow anti-2A directives without objection? If you think that politicians will be affected by LE or MIL having less effective tools to do their jobs, you would be mistaken. I enlisted in the USMC during the Clinton years. I know better. If something did get ugly, I’m pretty sure I know who’s side CO Sheriffs will be on. Some folks take their oaths seriously.
Regardless of political views, these guys face violent criminals, make 2 am traffic stops, serve felony warrants, raid meth labs, etc. We refuse to punish LE collectively for the anti-2A beliefs of some, or even of their politically appointed chiefs, who could care less about properly equipped officers in many cases. We see this as no different than demanding that legislators do not punish all of society for the actions of criminals by taking away rights from the law abiding.
Because of this, we won’t bend from our principles, and if anyone decides they need to not buy our products based on this stance, then we are fine with you not bending on yours. If you’re selling any of your Colts over this, I might be interested.
Although we absolutely support the goals of the companies willing to stand up in this effort, we don’t believe a policy like this is the best way to achieve those goals for us. Right now, we are engaged in the fight of our lives for 2A rights here in CO. Despite the high costs that moving would entail, we would actually be better off financially if we had just moved, rather than staying in the fight, based on the time, effort, and resources that we have poured into this battle, and are still pouring in. Simply running away wouldn’t be our style, though, and would be a betrayal of our friends, neighbors, the free Citizens of CO, and would concede a defeat for gun rights across the country. So, we are fighting. We are in this fight on both the state and national levels. Do any of us really want to uproot our families, leave our homes, and head out of the state? Hell no. But we will.
For those of you who want to call it a corporate greed business decision, or that we are following a monetary necessity, we had every opportunity to cave and probably could have written whatever exemption language we wanted if we would have backed off and sold out CO Citizens to completely protect our ability to manufacture. They probably would have cut all kinds of deals to get us to back out and not make the jobs and economy part of the issue, and we didn’t. They came to us prior to the vote on the day the exemption was presented on the floor and asked, basically, “Are we cool now?” To which, we responded NO, and that NO exemption or condition would keep us here, and that we didn’t support that amendment, let alone the bill. We are standing by our principles, and if yours differ, that’s fine, and we encourage you to stand by them, whatever they are.
For right now, we feel that efforts towards this end on our part would be more effective by looking at agency sales on a case-by-case basis behind the scenes rather than with a blanket policy shouted from the rooftops that punishes individual officers, and that our efforts are best directed where we are using them currently. We encourage others, whether friends or competitors, to do what they think is best, also, even if it differs from our position. This may evolve, but for right now, that is where we are at, and while we are always open to listening to reason, no boycotts or flaming will change our minds from doing what we feel is the right thing to do.
Not sure if I agree, but this statement was much clearer and more focused than the the one from Armalite.
I think MagPul has done a truly outstanding job as a corporate advocate for individual gun rights. So they don’t participate in the NY Boycott — boo freakin’ hoo. When did that become the only way a company can support us and protest unjust gun laws?
Exactly. And if everyone is so serious about this boycott thing, they nobody will be buying a gun from a major manufacturer ever again. There is a reason every name on the boycott list is a relatively small company. Large manufacturers can’t afford to ignore an entire group of states LE/Military sales. It was a smart business decision that Magpul had to make. Besides, we’ll all have moved on from this whole boycott thing in a few weeks
How very sad. They have gone from rockstars to a legitimate villain in the span of what, 3 days? Initially, I was with them. However, I believe they have just made a fatal mistake. Ironic how so much of their language seems similar to the gun grabbers. I wonder how much gear they think they’ll sell to only LEOs and Government agencies?
I’ll continue to buy from Magpul. And I’m just a regular, non-Government employed dork. Speak for yourself. And please post the video of you destroying all your Magpul stuff.
Ed, I have to agree. Unless they come up with some alternative to the LEO Loophole as a way to fight for the 2A, they don’t deserve civilian business.
Remember when #43 said stupid things?…..
for all of you that are patting MAGPUL on the back for this stand then how do you feel about BCM putting its money where its mouth is and withdrawing from a bid to supply Milwaukee City Police with AR’s because of the testimony of there Chief?
BCM took a stand to support gun rights, MAGPUL took a stand to supply those who would take away our rights with magazines. question. was the Storm Trooper as evil as Hitler or was it Hitler alone that bore the blame. remember. Hitler never once pulled the trigger during the war.
Hooray for Godwin’s Law!
BTW, I agree with you, I just think the accuracy of that law is astounding.
most of the time i would agree that i got caught in that “law” but when it comes to basic disarmament …in this case law enforcement having what citizens cannot, then i think that the law might not apply.
either way though. you got me !!!! ;))
Lefties envision they will be in power forever, regulating and controlling more and more of everyday life. Thus a compete disarming of American citizens is necessary to turn them into the proper defenseless subjects the Left wants.
Everything — everything — the Left says in regard to firearms is a lie. It should never be taken at face value.
They view that time is on their side, and will say any lie that helps to advance their way toward a firearm-free future (as applies to us, of course). Toward that end, they will advance by a thousand microsteps, taking another century if necessary. For all righteousness is theirs.
I agree; and we would have been right to sell to individual officers of the SS as long as they said they didn’t personally want to gas anyone.
Seriously, what a crock. In a free state, government enjoys no rights that an individual doesn’t have. Read Bastiat.
They make too much money off of LEOs – this is just a pile of propaganda to pander to the magpul fanboys that don’t particularly believe in a free state.
The Law by Frédéric Bastiat [1850]
http://constitution.org/cmt/bastiat/the_law.html
Good God, who cares who’s right about the legal use of the gun. He used it and he got charged by the police. He will have his day in court. That is American. Get over it. In court, he gets to convince a jury or a judge that he feared for his life, and he will probably claim he is not real intelligent (this is when men act like little girls), and he is ignorant about law cuz he’s not very smart, and he shot out of extreme fear these men were gonna rape his ugly ass. If they believe him, no harm no foul.
However, in the meantime, if they find the bodies if these strangers (aka intruders) or his wife and kids (aka intruders) or his business parters (aka intruders), buried in the woods, well they already have him in custody.
Robert, whats your source for that quote? Is it from a print-only article? Is it from something available online?
RF should have included the link, but Google is hard, yo.
http://www.fieldandstream.com/articles/guns/2013/02/gun-control-joe-biden-interview
It’s the sixth question.
If the cops armed with ARs are being outgunned then there must be a lot of bad guys out there running around with Garands and M-1As.
Check out the “frequently bought together” on the amazon page, a Walther P22 thread adapter. Hmm. . .
Both Magpul and Armalite have a point about punishing individual officers but they both said it themselves: it’s symbolic. The case-by-case bit at the end makes it sound like they might not sell to certain agencies that support gun control and if that’s the case, kudos.
In the end I don’t agree with their continuing to sell to LE but I’m not going to boycott them for it either. When I read this statement and they say it’s not financially motivated I believe them. If it was all horse pucky they wouldn’t have put so much effort writing it and then basically telling us to pack sand, in maybe the nicest way possible, if we don’t like it.
Sorry Magpul, while I understand where your comIng from, in our fight, every little bit helps. Even if that means boycotting LEO sales in banned states. Looks like I’ll seek Troy for my future magazine and stock upgrades.
well by the Huff n post article on the Empire State shoot out, it seems to me that the cops are terrible shots and I can protect myslef better then they can protect me. All i need is to have the cops try and save me from an armed thug and only shoot me and my family.. No thanks guys, ill handle it myself and call you when its done. If anyone is gonna shoot my family by accident while trying to protect them, its not going to be some flat foot!
I am confused and maybe this was discussed before…..is magpul now staying put in CO?
Only if the gun control bills get shot down.
“these guys face violent criminals, make 2 am traffic stops, serve felony warrants, raid meth labs, etc.
And we don’t face home invaders, sexual predators, robbers, looters, car jackers, and miscellaneous other thugs? Thanks, Magpul, for your classist logic that our lives are worth less than Bob the police officer’s.”
Don’t be foolish, I’m not saying it doesn’t or can’t happen but LEO’s face violent criminals, felony warrants and 2am traffic stops ALOT more than an average citizen will ever face a REAL robbery or home invasion. Come on let’s be smart about this! I support Magul for their stance and other companies for theirs. We are all on the same side and we need to focus our energy on the liberals that are fighting to take our rights away not fighting with each other!
What a windbag. I never expected Magpul to move, and it’s not. It was all just PR and posturing. Lenin was right — capitalists will sell the rope used to hang them.
LEO’s do not make laws, but they do make a decision if they will enforce them or not.
Just like you and I, average Joe’s – if our company asks us to do some unconstitutional, or otherwise shady – we have a decision to make.
Comply or leave (or get fired as a third option for refusing).
LEO’s are not exempt from this.
LEO’s are paid to enforce the laws, whether they are good or bad laws is irrelevant. That is their job. They have no obligation to serve and protect you – they have nothing that compels them to act in your best interest. This is not anti-cop talk, it is just the facts of the matter.
Claiming LEO’s are the one’s creating the laws is weak at best, at the end of the day they are the ones charged with enforcing those laws.
– D
“The VP is offering great advice and everyone should practice this outstanding home defense strategy.”
-Every Door Manufacturer in America
This is the man who is in charge of the executive branch’s push for civilian disarmament? My gods, perhaps I shouldn’t have asked for stupid opponents…
He’s in charge of the shell game to keep us occupied while the real thinkers tighten the noose around us.
As discussed in yesterday’s “How to Buy a Supressor” post:http://www.reginfo.gov/public/do/eAgendaViewRule?pubId=201210&RIN=1140-AA43
LEO are citizens, just like you and me. If we can’t have certain hardware then they shouldn’t be able to either. But the militarization of the police has blown all that out of the water for years.
As to “putting officers at risk”, well the same applies to us as non-leo citizens and If not having certain hardware makes their job tougher then it’s important to remember that Law Enforcement is a JOB, it’s not a class or a caste, and nobody HAS to be an LEO.
Hey Magpul, what’s good for the goose is good for the gander. All laws should be applied equally to ALL people regardless of class or job.
“If you’re selling any of your Colts over this, I might be interested.” Boom! Im not selling mine.
As if the heavy steel golf ball launcher listed next to it wouldn’t be a superior platform. Perfect for serial number as previous poster noted. These traps have been around forever, I saw an antique brass one for a turkish 8mm mauser..
Bet you could make one with polymer putty just centering the muzzle threads between the filter’s threads (filter suspended rigidly) with petroleum jelly as release agent, and filling like a creme donut & then adding external support with more putty. Or on the 3D printer with printed threading. Or taking dies to a nylon bushing.
I really hope that everyone who is now boycotting magpul “which is real easy to do when there are NO pmag’s to be found” man’s the FVCK UP and sticks to there ever so high & mighty principals and boycotts, COLT, GLOCK, S&W, BLACKHAWK, SUREFIRE, CCI/SPEER, FEDERAL, HK, FN, OAKLEY, NIKE, 5.11, WILEY X, WINCHESTER, TRIJICON, AIMPOINT, BRAVO COMPANY, DANIEL DEFENSE, and every other company who currently sell’s to LEO’s and /or federal agencies.
Yeah, thats what I thought…………
There’s a huge difference between selling to people and the government and what Magpul and ArmaLite did. Magpul and ArmaLite issued public statements telling law-abiding citizens to go to hell and that government employees are superior. I don’t recall any other companies issues such statements about the superiority of government thugs.
To be clear Magpul and others banning sales to anti-2A states wouldn’t be enough. What will bring change is our votes. 2014 cannot come soon enough!
My two cents says I’m with John Boch on this one.
That’s great Joe. I hope he realizes that somebody is likely to take his advice to heart and end up killing an innocent who they didn’t identify before pulling the trigger. It’s really just a matter of time. Then what?
What a load of marketing tripe. Bottom line, Magpuls got a sweet LE contract they don’t want to lose out on. Their stance has everything to do with business and nothing to do with the 2nd Anendment.
In the military, when one guy screwed the pooch everyone hits the deck and takes the heat. I empathize with the ethical LEOs position in all of this: yet they are a part of a collective, and when a member of the collective screws up they need to push Texas with their anti-gun colleagues. That’s how bad guys in the mix get weeded out , when the good guys in the team do what it takes to reform the team.
Wow.
Last saturday night, the houses on either side of mine were broken into. The burlar fled when my neighbor came home. Why my house wasn’t chosen is unknown to me.
Might be the spent 12 gauge hull wind chimes?
Same thing happened to me 10 years ago with my appartment. Could have been the NRA sticker on the welcome sign.
What your wife needs is a double-barrel shotgun. Two blasts from your balcony and that burglar problem’s solved.
While I’m partially protected fom burglary and robbery by living in a shotgun shack in a rural area known for back yard shooting ranges and not much in the way of liquid assets – other than guns and tools – my li’l helper is always handy.
You just never know.
I am sorry to hear that you had to endure such a terrifying event NCGlockin. I am thrilled to hear that no one inflicted any physical injuries on your family. Of course it will take time to heal from the fact that someone with unknown intentions violated your home.
That said, welcome to the ranks of armed citizens. Make sure you advocate for our right to bear arms to as many family, friends, neighbors, and co-workers as possible.
And please consider getting your concealed carry license so that you have a firearm on you at all possible times. Imagine if you were unarmed and had to confront the intruder yourself? Better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it.
Oh, and please encourage your wife to get her concealed carry license as well so that she can have a firearm at all possible times. If there is a next time, you might not be able to intervene.
Magpul, I love you.
Interesting story. It made me think about my normal practices. If someone knocks on my door that I don’t recognize (I live in a 65% occupancy apartment complex in a not-great area), I routinely don’t answer the door. But in all honesty, after looking through the peephole and “not answering the door,” I usually just walk away. I never really gave a thought to what I’d do if they tried to get in after I didn’t answer. Food for thought.
Great advice! Oscar Pistorius claims this was his line of thinking when he defended his home against a brutal and well armed invader by firing blindly through a door. It worked out well for him.
Maybe “tail gunner” should be re-named “door gunner”?
Do they make holsters for guns with the “filter” attached? You have to be careful, I still can’t find a holster that will fit my Ruger Charger with a bi pod and optics attached.
I think the most important point is that they really don’t have control on who the customer is. Their business model does not include retail. Their products are primarily sold through distributers. Those distributers then can sell to whoever they want, as long as it is legal, and at w/e price they want.
Good for you, Ginny. I’ve worked in Chicommieo too many times to count, and I ALWAYS CARRIED. Never got caught, because I didn’t have to shoot anyone. Had I, though, my gat has no papers, was loaded while I wore surgical gloves, and I was ready to swear (through an attorney, of course) that “honest, officer, the deceased thug turned his head to look at a noise source, I disarmed him, and in the struggle, the gun went off several times. Dang, that was lucky; darned near lost a $400.00 watch (to paraphrase Slim Pickens in Blazing Saddles)”.
I’m pulling for ya. I’d love FL to move in this direction, but I’d settle for the bill currently in play that decriminalizes brandishing in self defense.
I too live in the Charlotte area and have had some of the same issues in my own neighborhood. The only difference was the woman was home and the intruder beat her up and put her in the hospital. We live in an upscale development that up the last year has never had anything like this happen. Now it seems to be happening on a much greater frequency. I have since made my wife take a gun safety and a shooting classes. She will also be taking her concealed to carry class this Saturday. Glad NC is a gun friendly state and the county I live in is really gun friendly.
Exactly right, Adam. Crony capitalism at its worst: Joe Biden and the door makers/sellers of America.
agree entirely.
THANK YOU, MagPul, for everything.
now, PLEASE MOVE THE FUCK OUT OF COLORADO (if 1224 becomes law).
you’ve still got my biz, esp when you bring the 15-rounders to market.
Every gun has two enemies:
1. Rust
2. Politicians
He realizes his political future is in trouble. His office has probably gotten tons of calls and emails from people who put him in office and they demanded that he change his position, or else.
Sounds like a battle won. Chalk one up for the good guys.
Be smart about this decision and make sure you make the complete investment. That means obtaining a firearm you can handle and being able to store it properly.
First time buyers tend to go high and right with the gun, buying too much gun for the job. They go low and left with the safety and get the wrong safe or none at all. Trigger locks are not the way to go in an emergency. You’ll fumble with it and it will fail you.
Then practice at the range at least once a quarter (preferable more). Make sure your wife is proficient too. Consider getting a CCW. Practice with your family at home about where to go and what to do. Have a plan. Have a back up plan. Then make a contingency back up plan.
Magpul’s statement was very well written. I like it!
If you are not a wolf you can choose to be a sheep or a sheep dog. Gun Control regulations are the same as forced removal of a sheep dog’s teeth. Funny yet sad that the gun grabbers would never allow such a cruel thing to be done to real dogs which they do to humans.
Reasoning by analogy gets one nowhere. The gungrabbers are imbeciles, whether by choice or by training.
So Magpul won’t sell to gov’t agencies that ban the magazines from us regular citizens. They may sell to individual police officers who are acting as an individual not as an agent of the state. So if the officer uses said magazine on the job, aren’t they acting as a straw purchaser for the state? Would the officer get in legal trouble for acting as a straw purchaser for his neighbor? Doggone those pesky moral issues!!!
I can appreciate much of their response, but I do have some problems with parts of it. First of all, the suggestion that a boycott only hurts the local law enforcement folks is tough to swallow. To suggest that a cop will stop being a cop and go into another line of work because he can’t get Magpul magazines is kind of silly. If all of the major gun and accessory makers got together and boycotted New York State LEO sales, you can bet that the politicians there would revisit their approach. The local police unions would be screaming for changes and many police officers would be calling in sick. Change would happen damn quickly. On the other hand, a patchwork response by some, but not all major companies, creates exactly the situation that Magpul claims to want to avoid. It does not hurt the cops enough to raise a major hue and cry, but will cause some problems for cops in a few cases.
Ideally, the NSSF should have gathered the major manufacturers together and agreed upon a united front against NYS. This is not slitting their own throats either. Other states seeing what happened to NY would be quick to change their approach to anti-2A legislation and NYS would likely concede as well. In the end, everyone but the anti-gun politicians would win.
Many of these companies send funds to the NRA. To boycott these companies would be counterproductive.
This seems like a lot of work and leaves a paper trail. It’s a shame that suppressors are so difficult to make.
Underwater range anyone?
Expect to see those express lane magazines at a gun show near you, for $80.
Oh, I know! Those bastards who want to take our guns, they all wear pants. And this greedy and evil Magpul CEO also wears pants. Our work is cut out for us, ladies and gentlemen:
LET US BOYCOTT PANTS!!!
Oh and did you know that pants were invented in China? This is true! The Chinese invented pants for the purpose of horseback-riding. Until pants were brought to Europe by the Huns and other migrating people, our ancestors knew no pants!
Do you want to bow to China like Obama does? Is it not enough that our manufacturing went there already? Do you want our dignity to go there as well?
LET US BOYCOTT PANTS!!!
Oh yea!
I have multiple weapons stashed around the house – almost one in every room. Shottys, pistols and flashlights.
Hidden, I hope?
It always bothers me when people have their guns in plain view. Not because I’m squeamish or anything (I lol’d at that thought), but I would prefer that an intruder couldn’t just scan the room and figure out why I’m lunging for that flowerpot. Plus, toddlers can’t screw with what they can’t find.
But I keep mine hidden more for the “gray man” factor. The exterminator and AC guys don’t need to know that I have a gun in every room. Much less why.
well, that’s like buying cannabis seeds online. It can be done, BUT………
Special, always special. US? NOT special.
In the immortal words of Dana Carvy, “isn’t that special?”
It’s my understanding that day time burglars will quite often knock on the door. If they get no response they assume the house is empty and commence to burgle. I always answer any knock on my door. Not in condition white, but I always answer. I have my snubby on me and at front and back doors I have pepper spray.
The film industries are getting millions of dollars in tax incentives too (I think Django Unchained had more the 8 million). When Hollywood said the wealthy should pay their fair share, I guess they meant OTHER wealthy people. So, we have the Hollywood definition of a law: “Reasonable rules by which we expect other people to live their lives.”
This is actually great news.
When you shoot a home invader with your illegal 8-round magazine, just tell them you were filming a left-wing documentary about the social injustice that drives the oppressed to invade homes. Bingo–no prosecution AND you get a tax break.
Screw concealed carry permits, I’m joining the Screen Actors Guild.
If you have a smartphone, you have a movie camera.
That is a GREAT comment Nickbnumbers!!!
The exposed hammer IS NOT a problem . I carry mine in an Uncle’ Mike’s pocket holster and it literally disappears in a pocket of my shorts . As long as I don’t wear tight jeans I can keep it in the pocket and it draws out very well with no hang ups.
[Quote: “It’s OK Dad, it’s just me! I wanted to get a little fresh air!” At 2am. With a new boyfriend hidden from view.]
I would never ventilate my daughter ns a self-defense scenario… but depending on where I find the new boyfriend’s hands on my daughter, I might “accidentally” discharge the weapon. In his foot. Or groin. Or face.
Groin will make sure it doesn’t happen again. Shot to the foot my get him some sympathy lovin’
I would give up a weeks pay to see the facial expression on that F&S interviewer when ole’ “shotgun joe” said “shoot thru the door”….priceless…god he’s an embarassment to this great nation of ours
Ok I’ll admit my first review was bias, so I’ll try to be more objective in this one.
The magazines are thin, they are classified as a double stack mag but real close to a single stack. The top groove of the mag catches your thumb a lot during loading, Speed loaders need to be shimmed to keep the mag centered under the plunger.
The control levers are an easy reach, grip, and operation with the thumb, safety is back a bit, it is up to be on, for me that’s a plus.
Mag release very nice, sticks out far enough for the thumb to find.
The trigger pull could be eased/lightened off a bit ,
A very easy to grip slide pull on the rear of the slide.
The Tri-action feature for the hammer, single and double action is really all you need, having the pre cocked hammer spring and light trigger pull are an accident waiting to happen, but why not have the option for those that do want it, after all not everyone has to use that third action.
Profile wise, thinner, taller, longer than composite frame weapons of the same barrel length.
The sights will cost more to have changed out to aftermarket ones, if it can be done at all.
The sights are low on the slide, the front sight dot should be a different color than the rear sight dots.
No rail for lights and lasers.
Part of the trigger arm/lever is exposed on the right side, could cause some problems, and I don’t see it as any kind of difficult solution for the factory to modify the right side grip plate to extend forward to enclose that part of the trigger mechanism.
I kinda wonder what the designer was trying to accomplish by having this section of the trigger operation exposed to the elements?
The trigger assembly grease keeps bleeding out during break in, if your going to take it out of the box and do a 1K rd rapid fire test, take a rag along.
It is very stable with the diamond cut of the grip surface,the recoil buck is more controllable.
Field stripping it is not near as mindless as a glock. For some of you this wil suck.
As a carry goes, it is heavier than the composite counter parts in the market, you know it’s on your person.
Price wise, what do you get for your money?
Reliability of operation, simple action, simple design, good machine work inside where it counts.
In the panic buy market we’re in right now for weapons and ammo, I think you get a little more with the LH9 & LH9C for your dollar.
As for my opinion of this weapon, who am I?
A blue collar worker over fifty-five who up until a month ago saw no need for a carry.
No, I don’t have an extensive back ground in modern handguns, I just went around to every gun shop in a forty mile drive from my house, fought my way up to the gun counter and checked out all of the semi-automatics until one felt righ in my hand.
If your going to pay $600 or more for a handgun to carry, check this one out before you buy.
After having my previous home burglarized, I put Strike Master Pro II’s on every exterior door ($80/each at Home Depot) to make it a little harder to kick in my doors. I do have an alarm system, but it isn’t going to me much good for an imminent threat other than to let me know it’s time to grab my gun.
That’s what I call a true statesman’s rational retort, steeped in facts and legal precedent, appropriate for a balance debate regarding gun control. The first thing that I find obvious is Mr. Marston’s dedication to freedom and adherence to his oath of office to protect and uphold the Constitution. New Yorkers of both parties can rest easy knowing Mr. Marston is working diligently to protect all their rights in an intelligent and eloquent manner.
Not using all of that self-applied intelligence to crack open a history book or two, I see.
How about this Dave: you are naive, delusional, vapid, smug, elitest f*ck hole and I hope everything you love dies slowly right in front of you. Then I hope you get a steamy hot AIDS injection via an a$$ rape.
F*ck you, f*ck your mom, f*ck your couch, f*ck your family, f*ck your State, f*ck your loser no-body office, f*ck everything you stand for, f*ck your one dumb crooked tooth and f*ck your face.
See, we can be mean too!
I find it sort of funny how both sides are calling each other Nazis these days
“2A Advocates Are “Gun-Toting Tea Party Psychotards””
Lots of emotional maturity there pal. Labeling and character assassinations are really so yesterday.
I’m amazed an elected official can start out a letter to anyone so offensive and condescending.
Sorry to hear about your mother’s aversion to the 2A. My mother has started to come around and now wants to own a handgun, seeing how the Democrats have been talking against it.
Is the 2a a civil right? I believe it is. I’ve made this point a couple of times before about private business. If your doors are open to the public and it’s illegal to ban people of color or people of a different relegion or handicapped people, how can it be illegal to ban People of the Gun. I understand at a private residence a homeowner enforcing bans, but a public business?
And because you’ve agreed to work for a business, does this negate your civil rights? Let a business owner announce he won’t hire blacks and see what happens. But can that same owner say he won’t hire People of the Gun and expect the same outrage?
I was just watching Shooting Gallery on the Outdoor recently and Michael Bane had done penetration tests… that shotgun even with buckshot will overpenetrate noticable (completely through the geletain block). 5.56 will tumble and won’t. But hey, why let a few honest facts get in the way of a perfectly fake argument.
Bummer.
As an Eagle Scout and a Democrat, this guy disgusts me. Who let him off the Abercrombie/Lacoste dbag photo shoot set? Maybe he had one too many jager bombs with his mad tight bros before writing this. Get back to the frat house buddy.
You still have the right to free speech at work but it is commonplace that certain things cannot be said or done such as undo proselytizing, denigrating your chain of command, or bad-mouthing your fellow employees or company in general without getting fired. You can, if fact, say these things and the worst that will happen is being let go. Your right to kaba should extend everywhere you have a legal right to be regardless of the beliefs of the company for which you work over and above their property rights. And that goes double for government property since they are our SERVANTS and it is OUR property collectively. You should be able to kaba everywhere you go. Now if you talk about shooting your boss, wave your gun around, or have a ND then that would be grounds for termination. But not before.
Cheers
Mr. Marston and so many others like him fail to realize something about the meaning of the phrase civil rights and also something about themselves.
Civil rights are not negotiable and someone who seeks to deprive another person of their civil rights because they don’t like that person is a bigot.
It doesn’t matter how many polls are taken showing the “majority” in favor of gun control the issue isn’t open to debate or negotiations. A civil right can’t be voted away.
I was in Albany, New York today lobbying for our 2A rights and I asked a legislative assistant to one of the Republican state senators who voted for the gun control legislation why the senator’s constituents feared my guns. His reply was very telling and indicative of the core problem. He said “they don’t fear them, they just don’t think you need them.”
Folks its not up to anybody to decide what guns I need. It’s my RIGHT to have my guns. Rosa Parks didn’t NEED to sit in the front of the bus: it was her RIGHT!
It looks like they have a “no BS” reason behind their lack of joining the boycott. I know that I’ll continue to support them.
https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2013/02/robert-farago/magpul-provides-complete-statement-on-ny-leo-ban/
” With our distribution model, it would be difficult to enforce such a blanket policy, and would be a symbolic gesture. Just as it is difficult to stop $50 and $100 PMAGs at the retail level from resellers that buy through multiple levels of distribution, stopping sales to specific end-users would be almost impossible for the same reasons . . .”
” On the other side of this, we have seen the efforts of the Larimer County Sheriff and others in the CO Sheriffs’ Association, who have been incredible advocates for the Second Amendment here in the fight we are currently in. If a ban passes, these guys would be the ones hurt, and the politicians wouldn’t care. They would also be on our side. On the same front, about 600 of the NYSP have come out in protest of the NY SAFE act and in support of responsible Citizens and the 2A, at the risk of losing their jobs, their retirement, and the safety of their families. Are these the guys that we want to punish? Lumping all individual officers together and wanting to punish them all is no different than politicians who want to punish responsible Citizens for the behavior of criminals. Would a check box on the LE/MIL order form affirming 2A support for all Citizens make a difference? How many out there click on “I Accept” for terms and agreements before an iOS update without reading or caring what they are? Would anyone NOT click such a box? Chuck Schumer would even click that box if he was trying to order PMAGs. (We wouldn’t ship that one.)”
If you just want a burglar alarm as a noisemaker, there’s no reason not to buy and install it yourself. A number of websites will sell you the gear, check out http://www.homesecuritystore.com (I have no affiliation with them other than as a customer). They have a pretty good forum too which will help you learn how to wire the thing.
For a few hours of time, a few hundred bucks (and no monthly fees), and some cleverness, you can get a burglar alarm that calls you or texts/emails you instead of calling an alarm company. And/or makes lots of noise, turns on flood lights, etc etc.
“These are the times that try men’s souls” (Thomas Paine, December 1776).
All the acrimony, conflict, emotion, and tension expressed in the comments on this Magpul boycott issue provide us with a small taste of what Paine was describing. The cost of standing on principle is increasing as the pressure of tyranny ratchets up all around us.
During the ramp-up to the shooting part of the Revolution, this same kind of struggle was going on. Big business adhered to the King. Tory businesses tried to play to all sides. Patriot businesses suffered with the patriots. It was a sorting out process, during which the patriots learned the true depth of their own convictions regarding liberty; they also learned who their true friends were.
We have entered into our own sorting time. We are learning the price we are personally willing to place on liberty; and we’re beginning to learn who our true friends are. We will gain some and lose some, but when the shooting starts, if it is forced upon us, we will at least have gained confidence in those who stand with us.
Boycotting the bigger boys like Magpul, Colt, Ruger, etc. is hard, but it must be done. It may cost us more to deal with the smaller guys who have chosen to stand firmly the side of the Second Amendment, but what price are you willing to pay for liberty? This is just the beginning; the personal cost is only going to go much higher.
The rest of Tom Paine’s statement should give us motivation to carry on:
“The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of his country; but he that stands it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman.”
Keep pressing on!!
As for VP Hairplugs’ advice on shooting through doors:
The only person who could possibly get away using that advice is David Gregory. Most everyone else is going to be under lock and key within an hour of the po-po coming to that scene and hearing about how someone didn’t know or positively ID the guy on the other side of the door before lettin’ rip with a couple barrels of 12 ga.
Now the gun bunnies and self-styled experts on shooting start to realize the wisdom of my position about guns and self-defense. The best gun for your self-defense is (drum roll, Maestro): The one you’ve got in your hands at the time. They’re all better than a sharp stick, and a sharp stick is better than nothing. I’ll take a muzzle-loading, percussion cap black powder .54 cal pistol with miserable sights in my hands over a “perfect” gun that’s locked up and unloaded, 10 out of 10 times. I’ve grown beyond arguing about the “best” gun based on all this hypothetical nonsense, because I learned in the ’90’s that the gun grabbers will use “Goldilocks Gun Control” against us.
You know about “Goldilocks Gun Control,” right? “This gun is too big,” and “This other gun has too many bullets,” and “This gun is too small,” and “This gun is too accurate.”
Don’t play favorites. As we used to say on rec.guns: “Buy them all.”
Hey, look. You deleted my comment, but I was right. I overestimated the quantity, though. I said 60, and there’s only 40 so far.
“Let Me Be Clear” is what Obama and Democrats say just before they’re about to lie their arses off.
By some coincidence, I was at a gun store this afternoon where I saw a used pre-lock, six-shot, 4″ 617-1 for $499.
I was intrigued and asked to examine it.
Cons: gun was obviously owned by someone who shot it a LOT. Cylinder lockup had noticeable side-to-side play and endshake due to wear. I did not bring the gauges but barrel cylinder gap looked dishearteningly wide; I eyeballed it at in excess of .010″ on all six chambers. Gun was also filthy and interior of bore was crusted with unburned powder granules. Rear sight blade was noticeably loose in its slot with several hundredths side-to-side and vertical free play you could feel when you put your finger on it.
Pros: showed no sign of dry firing. And when I tried the trigger–with a folded handkerchief between the hammer and the rear of the frame, of course, there being no .22 LR snap caps available–it had the lightest, smoothest DA trigger I’ve ever felt in my life. SA trigger was better yet. Timing seemed perfect, as far as I could determine by eye.
All in all it looked like it ought to clean up nicely. Unfortunately there was no .22 LR available in the store for sale, or else I’d have been even more tempted than I already was.
Briefly as possible, and primarily confining the discussion to instances involving a privately owned vehicle:- regardless of where the vehicle is parked, that which is affixed to or contained within the vehicle which is the property of the owner, is well, exactly that. The property of the owner. In the case of a privately owned vehicle such as an automobile, regardless of where it’s parked — the employer’s jurisdiction over the contents of an employee’s vehicle ends at the exterior of the vehicle. The vehicle and whatever is contained within it is the property of the owner. (Also a bicycle, motorized cycle and etc., with affixed cases, bags or the like.)
Any person attempting to gain access to the vehicle must be granted permission to do so by the owner, or be subject to laws regulating the violation of the inherent property ’Rights’ of the owner.
If the employer suspects the vehicle contains something which under existing law is ’illegal’, the employer has the option of informing the authorities, in which case the authorities become subject to laws governing searches of a vehicle.
Relative to firearms, the ‘Right’ to keep and bear arms predates and preexisted every form of government established in America. The keeping and bearing of Arms includes a fire-arm and is a specific ’Right’ declared and enumerated in most State Constitutions and the Constitution of the United States.
The primary purpose for the institution of all government under a Constitutional Republic form is to ‘Secure Rights’.
Having a firearm contained within a privately owned vehicle does not violate the ‘Rights’ of any other person.
Violations of ‘Rights’ by employers who engaged in essentially illegal searches of vehicles, established rules banning possession of firearms in employee’s vehicles and terminated employees for simply having knowledge that a firearm was kept in their vehicle is what prompted legislators to begin enacting laws necessary to ‘Secure Individual Rights’.
Peculiar and unusual as this may well seem to some, such actions on the part of legislators are exactly what they’re supposed to do.
As a highly pertinent aside;- the carrying of a firearm — and most especially concealed — does not, in any way violate the ‘Rights’ of any other person.
The employer may however, under terms of employment, restrict the keeping of a firearm ( or weapon ) by the employee on their person while in their place of business, while in a company owned vehicle, and in some circumstances while ‘on company time’ and be within their ’legal’ authority to do so.
I have no doubt that my internet ammo sales are tracked. Of course I shoot all of the ammo the day it arrives officer, so no I don’t have any of it left.
To answer the question, Yes, yes he is. And Joe Biden is a gift also. God forbid they should have more articulate, informed spokes people who are savvy in the ways of effective communications meant to convince.
What these mooks don’t realize is that while the “progressives” and the MSM eat this stuff up there are intelligent, rational people out there who see and hear this stuff and scratch their heads.
And outright mean spirited, hostile jabs while again, the choir on the left eats it all up, in the end it hurts their cause.
So keep up the good work guys.
FINALLY!
Thanks to a $10 million grant from Department of Homeless Security, every member of the Mayberry Police Department can train on the challenging new three foot range.
Unfortunately, “Live Target Day” didn’t mean what they thought it meant.
And your motives were what exactly ? BS you knew what you were doing, I sincerely hope you get terminated for this, If I was a subscriber to your liberally slanted rag it would be Hasta la vista, baby
Good to know regardless…never hurts to know who owns the companies that produce what you consume.
There’s better stuff on youtube than TV anyway
Who?
He also won the cracker-tossing competition at the seminary.
1 gun:Armed and Dangerous
4 guns: Certified collection.
7: overcompensating right wing whitey nutcase.
8 + : Enemy of the State.
The Media Guide to Firearms, 2013 Ed.