There’s a new product that you’re helping to launch?
We’ve got our latest platform added to Ghost Gunner: a Glock 19–compatible frame able to be made [into a working gun] in 30 minutes. People have been waiting a long time for that. It’s the first time we’ve done a polymer frame rather than an aluminum one. So it’s moving into a new space. It’s also the first time we’ve involved the community in our [research and development] flow. I believe it’s going to lead to quicker product rollouts than we’ve seen in the past.
Making Glock-style weapons available to be essentially manufactured at home in half an hour seems likely to spark a whole new shitstorm. Does it make you nervous to be releasing a product like this when you’re under attack from multiple angles?
Most of our lawsuits are centered around DefCad [the now—dormant software-sharing part of the business, distinct from the Ghost Gunner machine]. Still, everything makes you nervous. You know, Shopify kicked us off without notice over the summer. A lot of random stuff happens to us, which makes me lose sleep. I don’t mind the problems that I see coming, but we’ll see.
– Zach Weissmueller and Paloma Heindorff in When Gun Control is Censorship
was $1200 about 2-3 years ago.
Sounds like a great application where 10 friends split the cost (which is $200 each for our math-challenged friends) and make Glock 19 frames for $200 a piece (plus some nominal cost for a polymer billet or similar).
Fun question: how much to complete a Glock 19 build in this scenario? You would need a trigger group, barrel, slide, metal rails, magazine release, striker, and magazine/s. I have to imagine those parts could easily total $300.
Thus, you could make your own Glock 19 for about $500 each if you can find 10 friends to share the cost of the miniature CNC mill.
“…and make Glock 19 frames for $200 a piece (plus some nominal cost for a polymer billet or similar).”
It doesn’t use an extrusion of a polymer for a starting point, it requires an 80-percent frame that costs about 150 bucks…
The parts can easily surpass $400, even $500 if you go for some minor upgrades. You can buy a new one for cheaper and a gently used one (e.g. police surplus) for much less.
This is a great concept, just don’t start with the wrong reasons.
Thanks for the information Geoff PR and Bob!
The ‘Ghost Gunner’ for an AR uses an 80-percent aluminum lower for a starting point, as well.
The Leftist scum would *love* everyone to think the Ghost Gunner spits out complete guns every 5 seconds from a raw block of metal, but that isn’t the case.
Since 80 percent lowers have no serial numbers, it allows one to construct working ARs and Glocks with *zero* ‘official’ paperwork (less the credit card info if you order it on-line).
Buy your 80-percent lowers for cash at a gun show, and you have as close as possible a ‘sterile’ firearm…
Not that anyone should write a letter to ask (seriously, don’t do it) but such a ‘group buy’ with the stated purpose of producing guns for multiple others, using others money, and with the machine ultimately ending up owned by one of them, is likely illegal manufacture. At the end of the day, money is changing hands in exchange for guns, whether or not the button-pushing is done by them. Yes, the law is dumb, and we should have been changing it the past two years instead of letting the Dems promote their ban on all personal manufacture, but “Cest la Republican’ts”
It’s a dam shame they had to choose an inherently flawed design like the glock. I understand why, because like the Corolla, Camry, there are simply a lot of them in circulation. Also like the Corolla, Camry, there are way better alternatives.
Glock hit the market early however, since that time, their aged design has been vastly improved by a number of manufactures.
I can see how a prosecutor some place would try to prosecute using the “reasoning” that you stated.
I can also see it as being totally legal as long each person produces their own handgun. I say that it should be totally legal because multiple people could share the cost and the function of an electric drill which they use to make their own firearms — and that should obviously be legal. If sharing the cost and use of an electric drill is legal, then why is it illegal to share the cost and use of a mill?
You have a problem you can not sell the finished part not without a FFL is against the law. You get an 80% lower means 80% of the gun is finished. Than you finish it for your self only. You cannot sell it of give it away. If you have an FFL than you must put a Ser: Number on the part and the person buying the finished part must go NCIC. to buy the part. Check the Law for your self.
I simply proposed a situation where 10 friends pool their money to purchase a mill, and each of those 10 people uses that mill to make their own personal firearm.
The commenter who calls him/herself barnbwt expressed concern about the legality of sharing the cost of the mill. And I stated that it should be no different than sharing any other tool.
At no point did barnbwt or I say anything about using that mill to manufacture firearms for sale or gifts.
Will they go Ka-Boom like the originals?
Or will this fix… the terrible trigger? …the awful sights? …the unsupported barrel? or the unnatural grip angle? Among other inherent flaws?
No? Than pass, and wait for a sidearm without those flaws…say a P320 AKA M17.
Cost of making a Glock at home = 2500.00
Making a Glock off the radar = priceless
Or just finish your 80 percent Glock or AR at home with a 70-dollar ‘Harbor Freight’ drill press and save 2,000 bucks.
The Ghost Gunner is for someone with little or *zero* shop skills.
Nothing wrong with that, but it it will cost you the price of a Ghost Gunner machine…
You’re absolutely right about that, but the market of people with money and without skills is pretty huge. Also, the Ghost Gunner is a box you can set on a desk in an apartment, while a drill press has more involved set up.
Or people interested in developing the skills to manipulating things with computer controlled manufacturing without taking a ton of classes on it.
When I worked with robotic welders the guys who serviced them got paid stupid amounts of money and usually couldn’t fix them without the operator tech standing next to them and tweaking everything they did. You can get experience with both sides if you own something like this.
As much as I like the idea, you can finish a poly80 frame with hand tools. I have a manual bench top milling machine I got from little machine shop dot com. I would much rather have a cnc setup but its an option for the financially challenged.
“As much as I like the idea, you can finish a poly80 frame with hand tools.”
Eh, it’s arguable you will do a better job of it if you can drill straight holes using a simple drill press…
You can’t stop the signal. The 80 percent lower is a modern day version of bathtub gin and moonshine whisky.
Except it’s not illegal…so it’s not really the same at all. Garage MGs are today’s bathtub gin…and they are few, far between, and the vast majority of the population has no idea how to make them, and no idea how easy it is to make them (even by accident)
I think that “bathtub blowback MGs” probably exist in greater numbers than we know. On top of that their prevalence is probably directly tied to the number of people who build their own guns.
That’s tied directly to the market, which generally speaking provides all the legal firearms and mods you might want. Were that to change I think that you’d see more people building guns and therefore MGs.
You see the same sort of things with electronics and software. Where there’s a gap people build or hack together their own workable solutions and do so in surprising numbers. Doesn’t seem to matter if it’s a windows script or a better bluetooth CGM (which really pisses off the FDA) or even taking apart a IR pulse/ox sensor to reconfigure it to check blood sugar without breaking the skin.
Defense Distributed holds press conference, 9/25/2018
Gun Control Is Still Dead: Paloma Heindorff on the Future of the Homemade Firearm Movement, Feb 8, 2019
Bummer that Cody Wilson turned out to like sex with underage teens (allegedly), plus he paid for it and fled the country to escape arrest. As dirty secrets lurking in a person’s background go, he did manage to hit that one right out of the ball park.
Have to say tho, Paloma Heindorff appears to be doing very well running the company. Fascinating too that she’s a British person from London with no gun background at all before becoming involved in this.
It sounded like Cody was possibly setup. Right when things started to get heated a girl came around pretending to be of age. Then he was told he is a rapist and the feds are coming for him. He panics and flees as if he is Julian. Now he is trouble for sex crimes like Julian (who was dragged out of an embassy to go to court for).
Meanwhile the Catholic Church is still smooth sailing.
Sweden dropped the sex charge against Assange years ago, so your info is highly dated. All they have now is failure to show for a non existent charge, and the US’ word that “we want”. But the US’s word is g-d in the UK, so that’s all they need. The US’ fevered whims. At least for now…
I would say gun control died with the internet and Ghost Gunner is just dancing on its grave.
Yet internet based corporations are censoring gun related information to stop the dissemination.
How many people have modern gun making classes to teach people how to build guns and magazines at home? Wouldn’t it be nice to teach Americans how to create guns, magazines and ammo from scratch before it becomes necessary?
Let the building commence.
I haven’t done a P80 on my GG2 yet but everything else I’ve done on it is spot on. So far I’m happy as hell with it and I have some CNC experience. There’s nothing like giving a giant middle finger to the failed state of Illinois and the feds every time I fire that bad boy up!
Erma Gerd! Blood in the streets!
The “Ghostgunner” portion of this, in and of itself, doesn’t interest me much. As others have pointed out, the same ability exists elsewhere.
The underlying tech and the methods for dissemination of data do interest me, particularly where the 1A is concerned.
The real question in my mind is how long it will be before there’s an attempted crackdown on this entire class of technology and how that attempt will play with the public.
“The real question in my mind is how long it will be before there’s an attempted crackdown on this entire class of technology and how that attempt will play with the public.”
You raise an interesting point – CNCs are rapidly becoming ubiquitous in communities nationwide, so that nut is gonna be tough to crack.
Where I can potentially foresee action by the Leftists is some of the necessary tooling being declared ‘controlled’, critical components like deep drills and chamber reamers.
I think we’re a ways off on that though.
We can nip that in the bud by SCOTUS declaring home-built firearms expressly constitutional to construct at home.
If there are any states or localities that have outlawed home firearm builds (NJ, NY?), we need to load up the lawsuit pipeline with challenges to those laws and drop them in the lap of SCOTUS…