“The Obama administration on Friday proposed two new executive actions to make it easier for states to provide mental health information to the national background check system, wading back into the gun control debate after a months-long hiatus,” foxnews.com reports. “One proposal would formally give permission to states to submit ‘the limited information necessary to help keep guns out of potentially dangerous hands,’ without having to worry about the privacy provisions in a law known as HIPAA. “The other proposal would clarify that those who are involuntarily committed to a mental institution — both inpatient and outpatient — count under the law as ‘committed to a mental institution.’ According to the administration, this change will help clarify for states what information to provide to the background check system, as well as who is barred from having guns. “
BREAKING: Obama Releases New Executive Actions on Gun Control
Robert Farago
2A should simply be a right that everyone across the political spectrum supports 100%.
No matter what you believe, the 2A is there to allow you to defend yourself from criminal aggressors, as well as political tyrants of all shades.
Liberals seem to forget that every four years, a conservative tyrant could be just around the corner. The same goes for conservatives. No single party is immune from a takeover. No party affiliation is a guarantee against a cabal of narcissistic power-hungry murderers from taking control of this country.
Liberals were dead terrified of Bush not leaving office in 2008. I remember there being a serious undercurrent of fear on various liberal forums I was on (I thought I was one at the time, did not know I was really a libertarian) that the neocons were going to fake a disaster in order to declare martial law and maintain power. A lot of liberals went out in bought guns in 2008, just the same as a lot of conservatives did.
They emitted a collective sigh of relief upon Obama’s inauguration, and then gave up on the idea that they may have to do something about it by force. They have attacked the 2A ever since, having associated its supporters entirely with the religious right, and actively denying that there is anyone on the left who supports the 2A. Supporting it now means that you’re not “in” with the party’s approach to governance.
Here’s to hoping that more liberals wake up to what’s really important.
One proposal would formally give permission to states to submit ‘the limited information necessary to help keep guns out of potentially dangerous hands,’ without having to worry about the privacy provisions in a law known as HIPAA.
Of course they don’t have to worry about the privacy provisions of HIPAA. It is only federal law. It only applies to His subjects.
step #2316 of the slippery slope.
Yeah, there’s some real incentive to seek treatment for things like PTSD. One more way to screw out veterans.
I’d like to see a comparison between this and Cerakote concerning durability.
Ah who needs patient privacy anyways!
This is a dark day for mental health in America.
In Illinois this information is asked for an FOID and CCW applications. I don’t like or trust the Feds to use this information properly.
I’m excited. Looks awesome.
“1) Accuracy — The patrol rifle is better for “stand off and containment
ability to hit a target decreases even further in the stress of a life-or-death encounter. If this is a big issue for highly-trained police officers, wouldn’t the same concern apply to average folks as well?”
1) The general public don’t have to deal with stand off and containment, Yes accuracy is a factor for the average person as well, but they to will suffer from degradation of accuracy during life/death encounters (as do many military folks)
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“2) Ease of Use — While it’s probably assumed that a police officer has sufficient training to use his or her service pistol competently, for the average person the time and expense required to obtain equal skill with a handgun can be prohibitive. The self-defense alternative is usually a shotgun, but using scatterguns can present problems: “[T]he recoil and manual operation of the shotgun has historically proved to be an issue with some Officers.”
2)Yep and that’s all it is, An Assumption…not every officer is a “gun guy/gal”, a large number simply qualify with their firearm(s) once a year (or as required by their dept) and never shoot otherwise.
I know a number of “average joes” who regularly train with their firearm(s), and do so more often then the “typical” officer. The officers that aren’t “gun guy’s/gals” are the same one’s that can’t figure out the simple manual of arms that a shotgun uses.
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“3) Safety — Another concern for the police is the potential for bullets to penetrate through walls and hit a target that wasn’t intended. According to the manual, this is another area where the patrol rifle shines: “[T]he most popular patrol rifle round, the 5.56mm NATO (.223 Remington) will penetrate fewer walls than service pistol rounds or 12 gauge slugs, and the patrol rifle is also safer because having “potentially a more accurate weapon … lowers the liability to the department.”
3)The same penetration concerns apply to the “average joe” as well (and even more so as they aren’t typically exempt from prosecution and “own” every bullet that leaves their firearm). I notice also that this study only mentions 12gauge slugs and not various “shot” and having a “potentially” more accurate weapon doesn’t mean a thing with an inaccurate shooter.
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4) Firepower – The increase in firepower is a huge benefit to the individual: “The Rifle is a force multiplier. The advantages of the rifle permit a single person to effectively deal with multiple adversaries without the disadvantages of being only armed with a handgun. If it’s important for a single officer, with radio backup, to have a “force multiplier” at his disposal, then why wouldn’t someone want a similar advantage when defending his or her home and family from “multiple adversaries”?
4)The force multiplier would probably be even more important to an individual who is defending his home/family as they don’t have the advantage of a radio backup (which in the case of law enfocement is likely already on the way)
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5) The AR is King. — The report looks at a variety of rifles with different chamberings, including the AK-47 and traditional .30-.30 lever action rifles”
5)While I like the AR platform just fine, as it does have lot’s of options for customization, it isn’t alone on that fact and while I’d also agree that if it’s good enough for a role in law enfocement I’d disagree it’s “King”, after all, depending on the make-up of your interior walls, over penetration can occur with Any caliber.
Shot Placement is “King”, anything else is subjective.
People with mental health issues are far more likely to be victims of crime than perpetrators.
Let it be shown that this administration actively seeks to disarm victims.
ACLU where are you?
Oh, that’s right, guns.
I think it’s a good looking gun.
Good for him. I’m glad he landed on his feet. Best of Luck.
This makes me long for the days when fancy guns were shown in a display cabinet and a shotgun was kept in the closet.
I already have a pocket pistol made by company that stands up for gun rights — Beretta. I won’t be running out to spend my money on the hot shiny new toy from Remington.
They did a lot of bluffing in MD. If they really stood for your rights they would have moved out of MD like they threatened to do once the unconstitutional laws hit the books.
You just don’t close down before you have an alternative in place. You need to establish a new location unless you just think Beretta should cease production for the time being. They are in the process of site selection now. They will phase out their Maryland plant when they have some place else to produce product. With the election of Terry McAuliffe they have scratched Virginia off the list even though the legislature remains in the hands of pro Second Amendments forces. Actually, I think Remington is doing the same thing. They are expanding production elsewhere and when they have sufficient capacity I bet they move their operations out of New York State.
here we go again
Guess i should try to have that low dose Zoloft prescription scrubbed from my medical records.
This will discourage individuals with mental problems from ever seeking treatment. While most people with a mental disorder are not violent, some are. Those with violent tendencies will now more likely go untreated, likely resulting in violent outbursts and injuries to others.
I know, I know, this covers only involuntary commitment, not voluntary admission to a facility or even voluntary outpatient treatment; with or without prescription drug therapy. Well.
Who would ever seek even voluntary treatment for mental illness, if they knew up front that their privacy would be trashed? Given that, their own responsible, voluntary act of seeking treatment could later be used against them to justify involuntary commitment.
Then there go your firearms rights and any other right which nameless, faceless, Kafkaesque bureaucrats unilaterally deem you no longer fit to exercise. Once you let that statist genie out of the bottle.
Anybody got eyes on James Yeager?
So get on youtube and leave some intelligent, well worded pro-gun comments. Let them know that we are here, we vote, and we will not stand for it.
This explains why the administration was encouraging everyone returning from Iraq and Afghanistan deployments with the military to claim they had PTSD to get some veterans benefits. Suckers.
Interesting post. In my e-interaction with Rabbi, he has been unfailingly pleasant.
I still only carry one gun. With no extra mag. When I feel like it. No I don’t ever expect trouble.
Actual scientific studies show that the mentally ill are not more violent as a group than the general public, and the seriously ill are usually too disorganized to obtain food and an income, let alone conduct mass murder.
I wouldn’t automatically lump all people with mental disorders into one big pile and label it “Potential psycho chainsaw mass murderers.” Disorders differ in degree and type, after all. However, neither would I buy into a “scientific” study advancing broad conclusions about the mentally ill population as a whole.
There isn’t any consistent scale as to what constitutes a disorder. One person feeling down might get antidepressants and be counted as ill. Another might be told just to buck up and be considered fine. There are also different standards as to whether particular symptoms amount to a legitimate disorder. One doctor might diagnose your eight year old boy as being AD/HD. Another doctor might diagnose your eight year old boy as being……an eight year old boy.
Hell, there’s even medical profession controversy over what even is a disorder. For example, 40 years ago, homosexuality was a mental illness. Today, it’s just another lifestyle.
To put it simply, a psych diagnosis is somebody’s opinion. Nothing more, nothing less!
Well put.
http://reason.com/archives/2012/12/26/who-is-too-unbalanced-to-be-armed
mental health professionals are notoriously bad at predicting which of the world’s many misfits, cranks, and oddballs will become violent. “Over thirty years of commentary, judicial opinion, and scientific review argue that predictions of danger lack scientific rigor,” notes University of Georgia law professor Alexander Scherr in a 2003 Hastings Law Journal article. “The sharpest critique finds that mental health professionals perform no better than chance at predicting violence, and perhaps perform even worse.”
So even if the mental-health criteria for rejecting gun buyers (or for commitment) were expanded, there is little reason to think they could distinguish between future Lanzas and people who pose no threat. Survey data from the National Institute of Mental Health indicate that nearly half of all Americans qualify for a psychiatric diagnosis at some point in their lives. That’s a pretty wide dragnet.
So once again Obama issues an executive order in violation of federal law? If I were a state authority (like a governor), I’d say no dice. Get your orders and laws in order, I’m not doing a thing until you do…
Much as I like pretty guns, so it gets dinged up? That happens to tools, if you can’t live with it, I’ll give you 10 bucks for it…
Yes, I’ll certainly be interested in this model if it proves to be reliable and if they can keep quality control up.
Judging by the last couple 870s I’ve handled it looks like they are trying to get the QC back up to standard.
How many times have you heard a leftist scream “gun owners are all insane!”? Now they have the means to make you not be a gun owner by force. All they have to do is call 911. “help, my neighbor is insane, I think he might hurt somebody and he has a gun!”
“…without having to worry about the privacy provisions in a law known as HIPAA.” [This is a quote from Fox news, not the actual document.]
Still, this worries the living crap out of me. I don’t own a tinfoil hat, but I remember reading about Stalin and Hitler doing this exact thing.
http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2014/01/03/fact-sheet-strengthening-federal-background-check-system-keep-guns-out-p
Great post. Well said. Signed….Another-Stake-Puller (Now in TX, formerly from CA)
I arm based on where I’m going. Heavier in the city, less so in the country, and heavier in remote areas.
How many fire extinguishers are in your house?
1? 3? 7?
Full on sprinkler system?
I think it comes down to risk. How much are you willing to put yourself out to ensure you can put out a fire in your house, or can deal with a certain size of fire?
Multiple carry guns are the same.
I may not make the same choice as you, and think your choice is crazy…and that’s the great thing about living in a relatively free country, you make a choice, I make a choice, I stay out of your business, you stay out of mine..
Health Insurers are now asking, “are firearms present in your home and if so are the firearms secured or unsecured.”
The delayed Pedersen action apparently reduces felt recoil, and the low barrel reduces muzzle kick. The video on GunBlast of people firing the R51 shows rapid fire with little in the way of muzzle rise. A fixed barrel should make it accurate.
There is a similarity to the H & K P7 to this design (apart from the cost) – it looks simple and effective. There are some swage lines that give it a retro art deco look.
The advertising (by Bat Masterton) of the Savage semi auto emphasized how the high trigger (compared to the contemporary revolver) made point shooting more natural, and curbed the tendency to shoot high and left in a revolver. The R51 has this feature even more emphasized.
General Patton often wore his Remington 51. This seems a good recommendation. The only remaining concern would be a light (4 -5 lb) single action trigger in what could be a pocket pistol (in a coat). It is reported to be easy to operate, and suitable for women shooters. For lovers of metal guns, this looks to be a bargain.
The first is for yourself. The second is in case of non-clearing jams or a NY reload. The third is to hand to your buddy who, for whatever reason, needs it. 😉
I love it. It’s a fantastic carry gun. A fresh change from all the plastic guns. I will definitely be buying.
Must be hard to draw from your nomex suit. Unless you practice helmet carry…
Sometimes I carry 3 guns. A 9mm behind my hip, a .380 in my briefcase, and, in the winter, my 9mm car gun goes into my coat’s pocket. The problem in winter is that you can’t get to your waistband dressed for bitter cold.
It just works out that way sometimes.
Think of it this way: if you knew you were going to be attacked how many guns would you carry?
Two…
Is this being presented involuntarily for a hold or would this refer to having the people doing the hold decide you ARE a danger? Those are two seperate things.
Also, you can’t frigging commit someone to an outpatient facility. You can order them to seek counseling, but I’d hope to god that isn’t enough; that’s a pretty regular case of any CPS/APS investigation.
” I share his fatalistic belief that peace is only a temporary condition. Especially for a Jew.”
Never again, indeed. I am not a Jew, but I grew up amongst Jews. Honest, kind, hard working folks. When that temporary condition falters, I will be the first to grab a rifle. The diseased theory that Jews are evil is espoused only by complete douche bags who have never known Jews.
It’s going to sell like coffee, hotcakes and bacon at 7:00AM.
I’m sick to my stomach. SICK!!! I’m hoping every single vet here is as enraged as I am… We ALL need to organize a serious protest movement if this turns out to be as insidious as it seems.
I want one now.
Why a concealed hammer and not a striker? Why go backward technologically? There does not appear to be a reason for that other than a retro look. Is this gun just a fashion statement?
Why not a hammer????
Great video Uncle Rico
My state – New Mexico – is mostly very firearms friendly: all NFA items allowed, concealed carry is cheap and easy, open carry everywhere is legal (including in most government buildings), absolutely no registration, etc. But its concealed carry laws have a restriction I have not seen anywhere else: you can only carry one gun at a time.
Anyone else ever experienced such a law?
Gabriel Mobley, 38, received immunity from the charges after the Miami-Dade appeals court found 2-1 that he was justified blah blah blah.
2-1???
One foot two foot slew foot rag, dance your baby to the sugar foot rag!
Are those the new Air Jordanians?
Sadly Kim Jong Il was unable to complete the epic film detailing his single handed defeat of the South Korean army before his death.
I got to meet him and shoot one of his shotguns, a cordoba 20 ga., at the annual MN game fair one. A truly amazing experience.
dong….where is my automobile??
Call me old fashioned, but I taught that a “duty to retreat” actually exists if you have the potential to exert deadly force. Whatever the merits of “Stand Your Ground” laws (Google Massad Ayoob’s presentation, in May, 2012, at the Cato Institute, wherein he describes the history of SYG, for example) the negatives far outweigh the positives, imho. Negatives include the opportunity for individuals asserting “self defense” to justify the homicidal prosecutions of their crimes, as well as soccer dads ending a dispute, that in normal circumstances might have ended with a bloody nose or dislocated jaw, with a gunshot that takes a husband away from his wife and family. As for Zimmerman – give me a break. That sad sack is a poster child for what not to do when confronted with a suspected teenage burglar. If I were hypothetically forced to accept him as an example of a responsible gun owner in order to keep my guns, I’d turn in my guns.
I’ve twice in my life been confronted by people whom I would have been justified in shooting under SYG laws The first time I was able to walk away without incident (i.e., “retreat”) and the second involved the use of force that fell short of deadly force. Those were my choices, and I stand by them.
Duty to retreat laws are morally indefensible. They favor the violent attacker over the law abiding defender. With duty to retreat, all rights the person attacked had to be in that space vanish, and the attacker de facto owns the space. The person attacked must cede the space to the law breaker or risk becoming a criminal himself. Only if there is no way out can he assert his right to self-defense.
Stand your ground laws only remove the duty to retreat. The standard for self-defense remains the same. The difference is the law abiding person can stay where he is legally allowed to be, and not be second guessed days, weeks, or months later by a prosecutor.
Wait a minute. The article states “Mobley, wearing only a sleeveless tee shirt,”
So, he was in the restaurant naked from the t-shirt down with his little willie bouncing around for the whole world to see? To me, this is the REAL issue. I don’t want to eat dinner with the smell of fumunda cheese coming from the next booth.
Contrary to the opinion that you shouldn’t bring a Ninja to a gunfight . . . . . . . . .
I normally dislike the casual labeling of gun control debates in “liberal” vs “conservative” terms, but this is hilarious.
$5 for the first gun rights genius who makes “FEINSTEIN’S FAUX TEARS” as a gun lubricant.
Having an opinion that does not match mine is not a tar and feather offense.
Still not interested. DA/SA trigger means I’m not interested in even picking it up, much less shooting or buying one.
Make me an alloy framed CZ-75 compact that I can actually find and I’ll be interested.
Funny…
I owned two of these, ended up sending them back to the factory. Total garbage, whatever you do, don’t buy one.
Hawt dawg.
Where else, but in Texas.
Jealousy slaps me in the face again. Hahahahaha
Pocket carry I choose a S&W 340pd in .357MAG but carry .38 in it.
NAA Black Widow with Hornady Critical Defense 45 grain 22 mag; nine ounces.
The best pocket pistol for me, would be the combination of my Ruger LCP and Diamondback 380. The Ruger eats just about all the ammo it is fed, and conceals well with a pocket holster. The trigger on the Ruger is an abomination, I am not sure I could hit the floor with a round if I was aiming at it.
The Diamondback has it all over the Ruger for shootability. It points well and the trigger breaks predictably. For me the recoil from the Diamondback seems less harsh and the gun comes back on target quicker. If the Diamondback would only feed and discharge reliably it would be the hands down winner.
Hopefully, the Beretta Pico will have the best attributes of these two guns. I like Berettas, I own a bunch of them, but if the Nano is any indicator of reliability I wont hold my breath.
Finally, In my experience, pocket carry of a 9mm is stretching it. I am 6’3” and 225 lbs and I cant conceal a nine in my pockets. I guess I could if I wore clown pants though;)
Still trying out my new p238. It is a little closer to fun size though. (P938 really is bulkier). Miss my 1st generation keltec p32. I don’t think anything newer actually compares. In a poorer day, as a night worker in a cracker barrel, I always had my .22lr NA revolver. I just wasn’t checking out in a meat freezer, ya know.
I pocket carried a G26 for years until I read on gun forums that it wasn’t a pocket pistol. So I started carrying a 442, then a 642. But gun forums kept telling me that 5 shots wasn’t enough in today’s climate of violent street crimes. So I tried a .380 but gun forums told me it wasn’t powerful enough to stop a charging Yorkshire Terrier. Then I went to a single stack 9mm but gun forums told me that my particular gun wasn’t reliable even though mine had worked perfectly for nearly 1000 rounds. After a while, I picked up the G26 again and started carrying it in an Uncle Mike’s #4 pocket holster and it seemed to carry pretty good right there in my pants pocket despite it NOT being a pocket pistol.
So I stopped reading gun forums.
I like the M&P Shield 9mm but the SA XDS-45 seems like a pretty enticing option.
I had some meth-heads break into my house while it was empty and stole the copper. Know who did it but police can’t prove it. Wish they would get this treatment if they break in on someone else. When I move back I don’t think they will give us any trouble.
If this (or the other Bodyguard) came in 9mm, I’d be all over it.
still waiting on a bodyguard in 9 and i don’t just mean a shield w/a laser
Hey I was thinking about dropping the cash on an LCP, but if this is similarly priced… I’m glad to see them offering a model sans laser.
Correct me if I’m wrong but wasn’t the Uzi built and designed in underground work shops? Then there was Stalingrad…..didn’t Germany declare that city a gun free zone?
Patrick,
I notice that you have the scope mounted from a Picatinny rail. I am curious to know what rings you used and how high above the bore it places the centerline of the scope
Considering how many people need help but DON’T get it due to lack of resources, distrust of the system, or shame, and considering the most dangerous may fall in the distrustful category, not sure how well this plan will work. I like to ask people two questions: 1. Do you think someone who is suffering major depression should have access to a firearm? (They usually say no.) 2. Do you believe constitutional or natural rights should be revoked based on a medical diagnosis or temporary state? (Answers tend to vary, but it is the SAME question.) All this leads to some interesting discussions. Should we IQ test voters? How about candidates? Prospective parents? Should sub-standard IQs mean no voice, no office, no kids? How about sterilization? I’m always shocked some agree these things are viable, leading to the inevitable comparison to other regimes in other times who went down this path. They had a very strong gun control stance as well. No, I don’t think we will go that far, but nobody does until they have. Balance? Stealing rights is not balance. Violating established laws is not balance.
Pretty solid article.
Not being a crippled weak fat ass who bitches about stairs and groans picking up a gallon of milk should be motivation enough.
The first time you squat twice your bodyweight should be reward enough. Its a pretty awesome feeling that repeats anew with every PR.
Be better than everyone else. Considering the state of American fitness you can accomplish this with very little effort.
Judging by Seattle Times’ past behavior, the article will either disappear, or the poll results will be reset, and a footnote added to the story about “outside interference” or some such.
ST is a pretty biased rag, so neither would be a surprise. It would be more surprising if they did nothing.
It took me all of about an hour to be banned from commenting on ST when I mentioned “Mandela Necklaces” in one of the first few comments on the headline story of Nelson Mandela’s death.
Smith and Wesson Model 442 Guaranteed to go “Bang” 5 times. ( and from inside a pocket!) semi autos need not apply.