Korean shopkeepers (courtesy bob-owens.com)

“If you don’t have a gun, get one and get one soon,” a poster called A Concerned Cop posts on St. Louis Cop Talk forum ahead of the grand jury decision in the Michael Brown homicide case: “It will be your responsibility to protect them. Our gutless commanders and politicians have neutered us. I’m serious, get a gun, get more than one, and keep one with you at all times.” Scanning St. Louis Cop Talk for more feedback from the boys in blue, a clear message comes shining through: the cops at the sharp end have little to no faith in their superiors. Here’s self-professed 33-year St. Louis police vet Jim Donaldson’s take . . .

I certainly understand the concept of following orders but the first night and those to follow did not turn out so well following inexperienced Commanders orders.

This is a prime example of what we have ended up with when the higher Commanders and Politicians get their “Unqualified” kids hired as Officers and promoted right up the ranks. Years later you are now seeing first hand how that arrangement worked out.

Now that the time has come for strong leadership to protect the Coppers and the Community look what we ended up with. Someone who should have continued to pick up after “Beatrice” and where the hell did he get all of those yellow service stripes?

I wish I were younger and able to stand shoulder to shoulder with those who are going to be on the next front line.

Just remember that when it gets down to it, do whatever you have to do to protect one another and be certain you all get home to your families who love and depend upon you.

Be certain to file a Workman’s comp lawsuit for each legitimate injury you sustain over this badly managed matter then quit and find another occupation to support yourself and your families.

Huh. Uncle Cracker [sic] offers a more upbeat message:

Hang on boys and girls. The pendulum is about to swing back. During the past 8 weeks I have had 5 meals bought for me while on duty. I have had countless people stop me and voice their support, one lady simply wanted a hug. The public support us, they’ve just been afraid to come out publically(don’t want to be viewed as racist).

The organizers of these protest have set themselves us to lose anything they may have/could have gained when they hitched their wagons to the violent, ignorant, destructive protestors that have and are now infiltrating our community for PERSONAL gain (yes, I mean Sharpton, et al.)

The penddulum is ready to swing. When the good people of the St. Louis area are personally impacted in Clayton, on our interstates or in their communities they will demand and end to this outlaw behavior. Simply speaking, muckracking at 3am is not going to be tolerated. Looting and burning our businesses wont be tolerated.

Hang in there. We will weather this storm. Brighter days are on the horizon, we just have to bear a little more.

[h/t BH]

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88 COMMENTS

  1. The police don’t just take reports. Sometimes they manage to save someone from the bad guy in the nick of time. It’s a great feeling when it happens. But ultimately one should not depend on the police being there right when needed (unless you are rich enough to afford that service). No matter if you are in St. Louis or somewhere else.

  2. Hmm wasn’t the kkk saying something similar about protecting yourself? But of course msm wasn’t a fan of that stand. I think I remember hearing “wait you want people to combat violence with more violence?” Yeah there are a lot of people that think if a bunny rabbit wanted to kill/ rape your family that you should let them because they are oppressed rabbits and we should love them without any other thought despite their actions. Rabbit, Spiderman, Saint Nick, or an alien should be held at bay with any and all means necessary to keep you and yours safe. Why would it matter who wants to burn your house down or kill you? Same evil no matter what color. Same protection applies even if your an officer.

  3. “I wish I were younger and able to stand shoulder to shoulder with those who are going to be on the next front line.”

    Front line? Sounds like a soldier talking about going to battle rather than a policeman serving the community. Not that I don’t recognize the dangers they face, but the police would probably be better served if they stopped thinking in an “us vs them” mentality.

    • When the outside, professional agitators are intentionally creating an “us vs. them” environment, and are actively calling for revolution, violence, and bloodshed, then you can either accept that an “us vs. them” environment exists, and pick a side… or, not.

      When those agitators are creating a pseudo-war zone (as they are threatening to do post-verdict), then the police are the front line, between the lawless, violent mobs, and the law-abiding residents and business owners.

    • As long as they don’t start giving orders like “AT 100 YARDS, VOLLEY FIRE PRESENT! AIM! FIRE!”, they can say whatever they want IMO. In this situation, protestors have put themselves directly against the cops, and I’m willing to bet many aren’t locals that are protesting.

    • When you are meeting a force walking down the street, that has amassed with weapons ranging from rocks and bottles to homemade grenades and firearms, it IS a battle. The rioters set the tone of the confrontation. The police only prepare with what they need to meet, and conquer, that illegal force. Pretty much says “front lines” to me.

    • And? You want them to battle a violent mass of rioters with hugs and kind words? When it gets that bad then yes, it is an Us vs Them issue. To think it any differently is to get yourself killed.

  4. That coming pendulum-swing, especially in St. Louis County, is very real – palpable, even. People are sick of the agitation, the protesting-with-no-real-message, the continual dead-horse dragging of “Justice For Mike Brown”, and all the rest. People don’t care about a “militarized” police response, when that response was predicated by a lawless mob shooting guns, looting stores, committing acts of arson, and terrorizing local residents.

    No, I don’t see the locals putting up with another outbreak of lawless mobs. And if that happens, I believe that the local LEO will find plenty of support.

  5. Front line was used alot when Police were out doing all kinds of pro active crime fighting. Robbery details, beat walking, plain clothes details etc etc.

  7. If trouble starts again after the grand jury no bills Wilson the residents of the area will be happy to see that “front line” complete with ARs and MRAPS. Try going there if the trouble starts again and shouting “Militarised Police!” and see how fast you get a real response from shop owners and scared citizens.

    Every law abiding citizen should be armed 24/7. But our taxes pay for professional law enforcement officers and they should be the “Front Line.”

    • I’d be willing to support the police force more if the chief were ELECTED instead of appointed in most areas. I think the public would have more of a vested interest in the force if they had more choice in it’s leader.

      • We elect the people who appoint the cheifs. Make those elected ones suffer for every misstep a chief takes.

        • The problem with bureaucrats is that the admins rotate out, but the system doesn’t change. This holds true for police and all other public funded organizations. You can’t vote out an infection, it has to be eradicated.

          This is more painfully obvious on the federal level.

        • The elected officials come and go but the bureaucrats and appointees stay as a constant with little to no accountability to the public.

        • I was proud to see recently that my OVERWHELMINGLY democrat heavy area re-elected a former Marine running on the R ticket for Sheriff. That alone is MASSIVE progress for my district.

    • Support law enforcement pay raises.

      Nope. They make more than enough as it is especially if you count the lifetime pensions which are unheard of in today’s free market. The local po-po has been feeding heavily from the “first responder” sympathy trough for the past 13+ years since 911. The widows of actual 911 police/firefighters got ginormous payouts and there is zero justification for local copper increased compensation. As has been pointed out many times, the occupational fatality rates of police don’t even make it into the top 10 most dangerous.

      • For a good cop who can effectively deal with the dynamics of human interaction in an oft hostile sometimes deadly environment with good judgment without being needlessly overbearing and judgmental, it’s well worth it.

        I didn’t say that most cops have those skills, but those who do have well earned their pay. The downside is that with current compensation and low accountability arrangements, the big headed riff-raff get a pass.

  9. Absolutely sick to death of this. I have been told my whole life that I am the problem. No matter what white people do it’s never enough. And I’m done trying. Bring it on bitches.

  11. Was at the local Cabela’s (Hazelwood, Mo) Saturday and the line in front of the firearms counters were three deep with a line of around 40 waiting to submit to the NCIC background check. What is that famous quote/unquote, “We have awakened a sleeping giant”. I think the locals are finally awakening to the need to protect themselves!

    • “I fear all we have done is to awaken a sleeping giant and fill him with a terrible resolve.”

      Japanese Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto regarding the 1941 attack on Pearl Harbor by forces of Imperial Japan.

      The rioters will have done this in the Ferguson area and Obama did this with the American voter this past Election day.

    • Good.

      And they won’t forget this learning moment and I expect they will not let their kids or grandkids forget either that it’s better to be prepared.

  12. “… do whatever you have to do to protect one another and be certain you all get home …” — Jim Donaldson

    Unfortunately, Mr. Donaldson failed to mention how the boys in blue must accomplish their mission without violating anyone’s rights.

    Well, as they say, “What is good for the goose is good for the gander.” Something tells me the police won’t be very happy when the good people of our nation apply the same standard themselves in their interactions with the boys in blue.

    • Unfortunately, Mr. Donaldson failed to mention how the boys in blue must accomplish their mission without violating anyone’s rights.

      As far as everything that’s happened in Ferguson is concerned, this is largely a straw man. The LEO here have violated very few civil rights throughout this whole mess.

      • Mr. Bennett,

        Please explain the “strawman” in my comment. There are videos of multiple instances of police in the area detaining/arresting, firing teargas and rubber bullets at, and threatening to kill people and reporters exercising their First Amendment rights. Much of the police response in August was outright criminal.

        I have no qualms about police using a “heavy hand” when they catch someone in the act of stealing from or setting fire to homes or businesses. I take great exception to police using a “heavy hand” with people and reporters exercising their First Amendment rights.

        • Please explain the “strawman” in my comment. There are videos of multiple instances of police in the area detaining/arresting, firing teargas and rubber bullets at…

          All fully appropriate responses to an unruly, rioting mob committing crimes and refusing to comply with lawful police orders.

          The lawless mob activity brought about the police response, not the other way around. Police using tear gas, rubber bullets, and arrests to restore order does not constitute an inherent violation of the civil rights of the lawless rioters.

          …and threatening to kill people and reporters exercising their First Amendment rights. Much of the police response in August was outright criminal.

          IIRC, this officer was fired because of that incident, as he should have been.

        • Mr. Bennett,

          Please explain how the police response of arresting the reporters at a restaurant was “appropriate”. Please explain how the police officer who pointed his rifle at multiple people (who were neither unruly nor violent) and told them that he was going to kill them was “appropriate”. Please explain how the police response of shooting tear gas and rubber bullets at reporters and people (who were neither unruly or violent) was “appropriate”.

          • The McDonald’s was closed at the time, and those present were trespassing.

            That police officer was fired.

            Those protesters were impeding a public roadway, violating a lawfully imposed curfew, and were disobeying lawful orders from the police.

            Next?

      • But the ones they have, they’ve gone way over the top on.

        http://media1.s-nbcnews.com/i/newscms/2014_33/612886/140812-ferguson-police-4a_8e17302df8b8fc3a893931ba7505d731.jpg

        Boston’s had someone killed by a rubber bullet – I don’t care how less-than-lethal they say this shit is – you better have a damn good reason to be pointing a gun at me.

        With all that sensory robbing gear on, all it takes is that copper on the far left to trip and maybe fall into the guy in front of him and that dude on the sidewalk (agitator or not) is left with a few extra holes.

        This was not a situation that required SWAT teams – but that’s all they brought and that’s all they know. 🙁

        • I don’t dispute that there have been isolated incidents of overreach and/or abuse and/or violation of civil rights. But in a situation such as this one, those are things that you deal with the specific perpetrators when it happens, and then assess for improvement after the threat (i.e. lawless riots) has been dealt with successfully.

      • One is enough. It is well past time to start disarming cops and firing any one of them that thinks “going home at night’ is more important than a citizen’s rights.

        • One is enough. It is well past time to start disarming cops…

          …an utterly absurd assertion. Let’s disarm all LEO because just one overstepped his authority. I think you’d fit right in with the #gunsense MDA idiots. They believe the very same thing about non-badge-wearing, law-abiding gun owners.

          I invite you to join the festivities on West Florissant, after the Grand Jury decision is announced. Unarmed, of course, since you demand that of police officers. And if you’re unwilling, you can find some sand to go pound.

          …and firing any one of them that thinks “going home at night’ is more important than a citizen’s rights.

          Indeed, and they have been. Next?

        • That’s stupid everyone including cops have a eights to go home safe to their families. As a matter of fact police are civilians just like the rest of us and I promise you that just like you have a right to go home safely they do to. Now you can argue that they know what they are getting into when they wear the badge. But people knew what they were getting into when they decided the best way to morn the death of the Thug Michael Brown was to loot and riot as a form of protest.

          I bet those rubber bullets don’t hurt as bad as thrown bottles and Maltae

        • “…an utterly absurd assertion. Let’s disarm all LEO because just one overstepped his authority. I think you’d fit right in with the #gunsense MDA idiots. They believe the very same thing about non-badge-wearing, law-abiding gun owners.”

          Such irony coming from someone advocating treating ALL protesters and the media the same as criminals. Hows that boot taste?

  13. I have to agree with the police officer’s calling it a front line with an impending riot about to happen. I hope and pray it doesn’t happen, and if it does, I hope and pray that the violence and destruction is minimal, and no one gets killed. What a waste of resources and energy that could actually be better used to improve the community instead of burning it down. I remember the riots of the 1960’s, the Rodney King riots (God rest his soul) and what the looters and vandals and arsonists never remember, is that when they eliminate local businesses, many do not get rebuilt or replaced. There were whole communities in LA that had no stores to buy food for many many years after the 1960’s riots. Why would any reasonable business build or rebuild in a neighborhood that will burn you out just because it seemed like a good idea. I’m glad I’m not living there right now, and I wish all who do live there and can’t get safely out for whatever reason, please be careful and protect your families

    • I don’t understand why people burn down their own neighborhoods. Seems counterproductive.

      I’m guessing the participants in such foolishness are generally not the types of people that operate with a strong sense of future time orientation or the ability to visualize consequences.

      • Happened all the time in the 60s. Most of the rioters are welfare recipients and are on the public dole with nothing else to do during the day or night. A lot of the rioters are not even from the are involved.

      • Ha! It’s no problem for them to burn their own neighborhood because they just assume the same government that pays for their food & cell phones and all their other stuff will rebuild it “for free”. They place little value on such things because they’re entitled to them. This is why you don’t see any rioters above a certain income threshold! (Black or white doesn’t matter)

  14. Well will the police be stopping the RIOTS, or going door to door collecting guns like in New Orleans ???? the guys on the roof could be attacked by the police first… Hope they survive.

  16. If the GJ no-bills Wilson, there might be riots. There might be legal — loud, aggressive but legal — protests. People are allowed to yell at the top of their lungs all they want. People can march all they want. People can air their grievances all they want. People can shake their fists all they want. That’s what the First Amendment is all about.

    Based on the comments from the “officers” quoted in the post, I’m not sure that the police will know the difference between riots and protected protests and act appropriately. It’s not only the protesters who are becoming hysterical, and when cops get their blood up, it never ends well. It ends like the Chicago Convention of 1968.

    • The STL police have not responded to mere protesting and other First Amendment-protected acts. Nor will the riots, if they happen, fall under the protection of the First Amendment – at least, based on the rhetoric of the most vocal organizers and agitators.

      Things that have continued to happen, that are not legal:

      1. Impeding traffic by blocking streets
      2. Detaining motorists by surrounding their cars
      3. “Shut it down”

      Things that happened during the initial police response, that are not legal:

      1. Assaulting police with rocks, bottles, Molotov cocktails, etc.
      2. Spitting on police, counter-protesters, and bystanders
      3. Destruction of property
      4. Looting
      5. Arson
      6. Violation of a lawfully imposed curfew
      7. Violation of lawful LEO orders when attempting to enforce a lawfully imposed curfew
      8. Resisting lawful LEO orders when lawfully attempting to restore peace/order

      I have seen nothing to indicate that LEO have acted inappropriately to any First Amendment-protected acts. I have no reason to believe that won’t remain true.

  17. Would someone please explain that police are not soldiers and are as well civilians and to stop refering to fellow citizens as civilians. That shout out goes for the media aswell. It is the police mentality that is at the root of all of this. Respect my authority or I will arrest, beat and or kill you whether I am right or wrong, whether just or unjust.

  18. The community is not now or has it ever been on the side Michael Brown. Michael Brown was a thug who terrorized the community. Employed people don’t have time to do 24/7 protesting, only the welfare and gangsta classes do. If I were a St Louis area LEO I would be getting out the word that for the first hour of disorder anybody shot by people defending their property will result in a free pass no questions asked. That in itself is probably enough to prevent any rioting.

  19. St Louis Cop Talk has been taken down and is no longer active

    Look up “civilian” in any modern dictionary where you will learn that all define “civilian” in various manners, “not a member of the armed forces, police forces or fire agencies”

    Cops are members of a uniformed, regimented force, operating under distinct guidelines, rules, regulations and laws. They have a identified ranks and operate within a chain of command and perform functions not according to their own dictates but those prescribed by those who have appointed them to their positions and supervise and direct their actions.
    .
    “civilians” have none of those restraints and are free to act and perform to whatever inner voice they listen to and admire

    • “Cops are members of a uniformed, regimented force, operating under distinct guidelines, rules, regulations and laws. They have a identified ranks and operate within a chain of command and perform functions not according to their own dictates but those prescribed by those who have appointed them to their positions and supervise and direct their actions.”

      So do McDonalds workers.

  21. Such irony coming from someone advocating treating ALL protesters and the media the same as criminals. Hows that boot taste?

    More straw man fail.

    Nowhere have I advocated for treating law-abiding protesters as criminals. I do, however, advocate enforcing the laws where law-breakers are concerned.

    Or are you so naive as to believe that what has happened over the past three months has been entirely devoid of law-breaking?

    • Oh, yes, those evil evil trespassing reporters trying to get to their cars across a Mickey D’s parking lot totally deserved to be treated the way they had been because they were such criminals! Yum yum, delicious boots.

  22. Support LEO pay raises…. Wait a minute, where I live the police make far more than the public which is paying their salaries. On top of this, they have job security and benefits that the average working person can only dream of, not to mention most get to retire comfortably at a relatively young age……and they need more?

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