“I am a Child Psychologist, and know that children who start killing innocent animals early in life, thanks to their hunter parents, will later go on killing other living creatures, including people, very easily, without remorse or guilt. Killing becomes very natural to them, very sad.” – Nancy Garcia Alvarado in a comment at the Anti-Hunting in America Facebook page
Yet another deliberately ignorant “educated” person.
If that statement were true there would be an epidemic of mass murders in the Inuit and other native American clans that hunt to live. But alas, there is no such epidemic and no proof at all to this moron’s statement.
She must be a vegan.
After thought. Why are there mass murders connected to Tyson or Purdue chicken farm employees or Angus Beef? Don’t employees there kill “innocent animals?”
Can’t be a vegan, honestly, unless that person is in full control and monitors the supply chain for their food, which is highly unlikely. Deer and other animals are commonly dispatched to protect crops that they enjoy eating.
This is for all crops, to include things like grapes (for wine).
As for the blanket statement – good Lord, how obtuse! If that were the case, that behavior would be the norm and therefore acceptable given hunting has occurred over the entire history of humanity.
The human being has been created as an omnivore… which means he can eat any kind of aliments, including animals! Therefor anyone’s free to choose whatever he wants to eat, that’s it! I love to debate with vegan, they’re so predictable and always ignoring reality (like anti-guns).
And they’re just pure hypocrites, always mentioning that non-vegan people eat meat, and meat comes from living animals (well… actually they’re dead by the time they come in my plate, but anyway). Always mentioning the whole “harm caused to animals”… “they feel the pain when they’re killed”, etc…
But they prefer to ignore the fact that vegetables are also feeling pain when we cut and slice them. A study proved a cucumber can feel pain when we slice it… So they’re doing as much harm to vegetables that non-vegans do to animals. It’s just more hypocrites because they just _can’t see_ it…. Just like most people can’t see either any animal when we buy some meat, wrapped up with cellophane at the supermarket.
Hunters actually have real notions of what they’re eating, and therefor they’re the less hypocrite here.
We raise our own animals for food. There is a level of respect, care, and deliberacy when we harvest one of our animals. The act and it’s consequence is not lost or taken lightly. In fact, there is a greater and deeper appreciation compared to buying some prepackaged product where the harvest was done by proxy and machine.
You got that right! I come from a family of deer hunters, never hunted humans!
For a “Child Psychologist” she is pretty dense. It’s children who torture & kill small domestic animals who tend to become psychopaths.
If you torture and kill animals, you don’t become a psychopath you are one.
so the 97% of people on the planet who eat meat are psychopaths?
The data show over 90% of US murder is committed by people in cities virtually none of whom hunt deer.
Since the likelihood is that hunters kill humans rate much lower rates than non hunters do, what does that do to your theory?
Key words are torture and kill. It’s not someone who hunts deer, but rather the kid that derives pleasure from mutilating and smothering kittens and puppies. A child psychologist should know the difference and I question her credentials if she believes otherwise.
Most of these mass shooters seem to have been completely isolated from death, weapons and violence until they pull the trigger and kill a classmate. I might venture to armchair that those who have hunted, gutted, and dressed a deer are less likely to be killing people like it’s a video game, because the reality of death and violence is more apparent.
Then again, if the person is mentally disturbed, it’s not going to matter.
T M stated,
“I might venture to armchair that those who have hunted, gutted, and dressed a deer are less likely to be killing people like it’s a video game, because the reality of death and violence is more apparent.”
I had this exact same thought.
So do you buy meat at the grocery store? Ever been to a slaughterhouse?
Every deer and elk my father and I have ever shot has lived its life as “organic” as possible, in the great outdoors. Only a few times did the animal not go down in one shot, running a short distance before dropping, or going down right there on the spot.
The hunted wild animal suffers very little, compared to the cow you are eating in your fast food burger.
Decent human beings have all their killing done for them by paid laborers or servants. They never witness the killing to harvest their meat, they never witness the killing to protect their crops for harvest. For defense, decent human beings hire armed guards to kill for them. For we all know that decent human beings are urban and wealthy. Inexpensive firearms must be banned to keep guns out of the wrong hands: the hands of the uncivilized savages of the lower classes. Those who kill directly are tainted by death! Ostracize the burakumin!
Apparently the “Greatest” Generation was all driven to mass shootings since it was made up of a lot of people suffering from an early onset of huntingitis. Luckily Hitler was there as a healthy outlet of their frustrations.
She isn’t who she claims to be. Run a quick search and you’ll find a Nancy Alvarado who teaches psychology at Cal Poly Pomona but the photo there is obvioualy not the same person. There is also a therapist named Nancy Garcia-Ruffin in Brooklyn.
I haven’t found much, either. I did find a post where she’d agreed with a suspended Dallas area teacher who had told an Hispanic student to “Go back to Mexico.” In that post, she described herself as a substitute teacher and educational psychologist. However, I found no match against her name and anything close to that field with the TX state licensing board’s database.
I’m thinking she may have some light training, possibly a low level, undergraduate practitioner certificate or something, but does not hold graduate degrees and an actual license to practice under those legally defined occupational titles.
her facebook page is full of stupidity.
And we cant have children learning to put down livestock to harvest the meat. Ban farming.
“I am a Child Psychologist” So why can’t I find your credentials or listing on the web??
Maybe on my facebook page I should claim to be a male lesbian. If it’s on the internet, it has to be true, right?
She shares a name with a psychology professor at Cal Poly Pomona but that’s it. She’s lying about credentials.
The standards for being a “psychologist” are quite low. They are nothing compared to psychiatrists. Remember that psychologists studied the least academically rigorous field they could find, most often because they wanted to understand why they are themselves so disturbed.
There are good ones, but we should be wary of the common category I described.
The standards for being an actual psychologist are pretty stiff, actually. The problem is that many people who get a master’s degree in social work pass themselves off as psychologists, and that degree is more akin to dog training than to anything therapeutic. Then there are the Bible schools with counseling courses that turn out more dog trainers, just with Bible in hand.
This gal is at best one of the M.S.W. types, who know just enough to really harm people.
The Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1989 gave Medicare permission to allow MSW types to provide “psychological counseling” to medicare-qualified seniors. The reason? There were not enough Psychiatrists and Clinical Psychologists to provide the counseling at fees Medicare would pay. During the ensuing years the APA dropped the rigor of its psychology graduate program accreditation efforts, leading to schools like The California School of Professional Psychology, now Alliant University, gaining accreditation. That school, which last I looked had 3,000 PhD students enrolled, answered CA’s “diversity and freedom” self-assigned mandate. In the 1960’s and ’70’s clinical psychology graduate programs were very difficult to enter. No more.
Pump the brakes there, Nancy, he is native American. I believe that means gaia requires you to respect his customs, no matter how backwards you think they are (see; islam). Besides, what about the evil white men who killed all the buffalo over a hundred years ago? Aren’t THEY just as much to blame for this?
This is almost the most laughably bias thing I’ve ever read. I would love to see the scientific studies conducted to prove that theory. Furthermore, psychology is an ever changing field. People used to think Freud was a genius, now he is considered a nut case. This lady sees what she wants just like all the rest of them.
“Furthermore, psychology is
an ever changing fieldalmost completely bullshit.”
Fixed it for you.
I did laugh.
Simple truths are funny sometimes.
No, no, no… you don’t get it. We don’t need studies, because she “knows” it. QED!
Gee, why don’t people respect psychology?
Because we’ve had over 100 years of psychology and we now have more nutjobs roaming the streets than we’ve ever had before… and some of them have credentials in psychology.
I am not a Child Psychologist…but that is pure BS. I don’t recall the Island Vista murderer having a family tradition of hunting or the Columbine shooters or Lanza…huh?
Ah, maybe not. But Palin the moose and caribou hunter, she’s a killer! Guaranteed to go postal someday, just you wait and see! (sarc)
LOL, “hold my beer…I’m going to jump this shark”
Think of all the food service people she must fear. And Mid-Westerners. And all the rural peoples of the world. And people who use mousetraps.
My brothers and I as well as my cousins all raised on a farm. At about 8 or 9 we were taught to kill chickens and domesticated rabbits. If not that, we were catching lambs blood in a bucket. At about 12 we learned to hunt squirrels with rifles…and then upland game and the deer etc. Both boys and girls.
Last I checked, no crazy killers in the entire family
The difference in the doctors definition that is missing is the following — killing small animals with malice versus a purpose: defense of the chicken coop or for food. Those kids killing kittens when young just for fun are different than those taught to kill chickens for food.
So, in short dear doctor, you are wrong/
I learned quite the opposite from hunting as a youngster. Respect for life and nature and the rule of law. Not to mention firearm safety, self sufficiency, etc, etc.
This…1,000 times this. Hunting (and fishing, too) teaches respect for life in a way that people who ONLY buy food from “the store” can never, ever know.
And raise you a ditto.
The first time I ever had a deer in my sights and my finger started moving toward the trigger, I suddenly understood the native American prayers I’d both read and heard from that portion of my ancestry; I grasped the deep respect for all life inherent in putting food on the table by taking a life. I’ve never looked at a deer — or cow, or chicken, for that matter — the same again. Being a hunter raised them from the level of living object to that of fellow creature.
There is no direct correlation between hunting and violence. Violence is part of the human condition. People either control it or they dont.
Of course one look at her facebook page and her agenda is clear…….Animal fanatic….anti hunting.
Yeah, the “killing innocent animals” is a bit of a clue.
How do we really KNOW they are innocent? And, innocent of WHAT?
What a bunch of tripe.
I know that I lay awake at night worrying about the thousands and thousands of baby plants that the average whitetail murders each season… Shouldn’t it be her duty to hunt these horrific animals that mercilessly slaughter defenseless plants?
What about the innocent insects that could be on the leaves of those plants? Will no one cry for them?
I don’t kill innocent animals. I only shoot bucks that have raped countless doe and have violently fought members of their own herd.
I shoot does for the hoes they is before they can produce those vile bucks. That and they taste better.
Ms. Nancy Garcia Alvarado’s statement is absolutely pure propaganda. She has her agenda and will pervert this tragedy to support it however she can. I suspect these anti-hunting people are pro-choice.
ahem I am a lisenced clinical social worker and it’s when kids needlessly torture animals to death that predicts problems. This lady is merely a hack
You’re a Childish Psychotic?? Ohhhhh….. Child Psychologist. Oh OK, uh huh.
Great theory there. So all hunters become spree killers then huh? Brilliant. I guess we should all be like YOU and let others kill our animals for us. Or are we all supposed to be vegans in your world? What a joke.
I think anyone who takes their kid to see this ‘child psychologist’ should get their money back. Maybe she needs to see an ‘adult psychologist’ asap.
What about the kids who learn from their parents to pay others to raise animals in captivity with the ultimate goal of having them eventually killed at more affordable prices?
Why, they’ll run the trains, of course…
Wow, what a deliberate misrepresentation of facts and research. The difference between a kid hunting for sport and a disturbed kid who kills all the neighborhood cats with a hunting knife are pretty far apart. Just another attempt to twist information to make any use of a firearm as a precursor for psychotic behavior.
So, what of kids raised on farms?
Want to see killing on a semi-industrial scale? Get on a farm. Every day, it seems as tho there’s something that needs killin’. Pests, insects, weeds, old or crippled stock, you name it.
It’s too early in the morning for this level of stupid. I haven’t even finished my coffee yet.
Psychology and its research is more of an art than science. Sure they can draw some conclusions based on some observed behavior but do so without the usual scientific investigation. This Child Psychologist (not sure why we need to capitalize) is convinced in her ‘knowing’ so I guess we should accept any conclusion she can come up with.
As a scientist who works with research every day I KNOW that increased exposure to ignorance makes us all a little bit more stupid. Banish stupidity at once!
Well said. There’s often a very fine line between theory-as-bullshit and theory-as-insight and, if you don’t have the right playbook, the anti-gun apparatchiks hope you won’t be able to tell the difference. They’re wrong of course. In their hubris they forget that we know as much about this stuff as they do. Bring it on.
As someone who is part Native-American, I ought to be deeply offended by this psychologists racist remarks. So, he is saying that because hunting is important to Native-Americans that Native-Americans are somehow predisposed toward violence.
Yeah, see, progressives get to use epithets like “Savages” but in long-winded, fancy sounding language all the while calling us racist, homophobic misogynists.
They have spent many a decade manipulating for control of the language.
There’s been several people post exactly those sentiments. They get deleted fairly quickly. Amazing how that happened….
I have been hunting since I have had the ability to hold and safely operate a firearm. I have never had the slightest inclination to cause harm to an innocent person. Kids that do things like this young man did, did them because the parents were not involved enough in his life to see the most of the time obvious signs. Liberals want to blame everything children do on something else. If they got bad grades it’s the school’s/teacher’s fault, if they are violent it’s the video games or w/e. It boils down to the parents involvement with their kids. There is no individual accountability to these people, it’s always some external factor that caused it.
Hunting teaches respect for life IMO. The need to sustain wildlife and the resposibility to only kill what you can use. Ther is no murderous conflict in hunting.
+1000 What you just said.
Hunting is integral to human history. We would not be humans if we were not hunters. Likewise, we would not be humans were it not for our ability to invent and use weapons to get food and and defend ourselves. This essential characteristic of humanity is intentionally lost on cosmopolites like the ever-so-much-more-caring-than-us child psychologist. Of course she knows nothing of hunting or guns or the deep cultural linkages that link them to the survival of the tribe and, ultimately, civilization itself. As a post-modern woman, intellectually and physically divorced from any sustenance she doesn’t buy in a store or any security other than turning a lock in a door she is a perfect victim of something other psychologists call “secondary ignorance”. She doesn’t know that she doesn’t know.
The dude I that commented below that picture on Fb…..”my food shits on your food”
+1 reuster. I made the same point the last few days. And I just watched a documentary on HBO about eating what you hunt. Fakebook’s Zuckerberg is a devotee. On another note if the millions of hunters in America supported the 2A RIGHTS they take for granted we’d all be OK.
So there is about a hundred thousand years of human evolution that suggests young ones who grew up hunting and gathering with their parents and went on to kill enemies and predators in order to protect the tribe/clan/family whatever but her assertions are all wrong.
I can claim I’m a Navy Seal on social media whenever I want. Watch:
What the fuck did you just fucking say about me, you little bitch? I’ll have you know…..
The very first school shooting / mass shooting suspect that appeared to be an avid hunter, and this is suddenly The Big Issue? It’s like they’re getting desperate or something because this makes absolutely no sense at all.
If this idiot took a half second to think about what she said. I bet she would retract that statement. There were more people hunting 50 years ago and most likely more kids hunting too. Why didn’t all those people turn into mass shooters?
If that was true, we’d have a lot more murders than what we have considering the number of hunters we have. Actually, if you look at stats the most murders happen in urban places and I would be willing to bet that the vast majority of murderers never hunted when they were young, nor did their parents.
She does have a point. I am also a child psychologist and I know that children that eat dead animals, will also grow up to eat other dead things, including humans. As a society, we are currently courting a cannabilistic apocalypse. If all of the young little snowflakes continue to consume once living animals, it is only a matter of time before we will have half mad, raving maniacs out trying to eat each other. We need to change course before our dog eat dog world goes to a much darker place.
Great point, pass the long pork?
Mothers milk leads to heroin ….
Hmmmmm, I hunt every year and haven’t killed anyone and carry every day… I cry bull shit
Nah, if anything, its the fishermen you have to watch out for. Trying to snag innocent fish on a hook so they can suffocate in fresh air…. THOSE kids are the ones primed to do their best Jigsaw impression /sarc.
So all those kids in the inner cities who are gang bangers and commit most of the criminal offenses hunt lots of game animals in rural areas? Yeah, I thought so.
In defense of Psychology,
The problem is not with the field of study. The problem lies with people who think that having a degree in it means anything. It is what you do with that knowledge that matters.
This woman seems to have gotten a degree or certificate, possibly.. and then promptly forgot what she learned, and wears it as a title. Her personal FB page shows her to be uneducated in spite of any degree she may have, racist, with delusions that her own personal values are the only right possible.
So, yeah.. Don’t blame the field, blame the person.
I will agree with that it’s not the field but SOME of the practitioners. I have a friend that teaches this in college and they are always commenting on how many students get into psychology to cure their own demons. This leads to these extreme viewpoints. Unfortunately these are the ones that squak the loudest and get the most press.
She is suffering from the logical fallacy of Argument from Authority. From other comments it appears that she does not even have the “Authority” credentials. But in any case that is almost irrelevant as what she is claiming is false. Also she has a clear conflict of interest as a Anti-Hunting advocate.
You don’t get to make up your own facts to conveniently support whatever agenda you are pushing no matter how great you think your ideals are.
If hunting makes it easier to kill and to do so with out remorse; all military members would be under orders to hunt.
So, by that logic the children whom parents pay other people (meat farms and manufacturers) to kill animals for food will then hire hitman to kill people in future… See how that works?
Psychology is junk science full of junk people. All theory and hypothesis, no actual science.
I have a psychologist friend who spent thousands of hours on research, all scientifically rigorous, with hypotheses discarded when shown false, so I beg to differ.
The issue, as he put it one day when I off-handedly compared psychology to astronomy, is that in astronomy we know the basic elements (which are quite literally the elements), whereas in psychology we still have no idea of what the basic unit(s)/element(s) of mind are, and until we do, all research is just trying to find the patterns that will point us toward those elements. In the meantime, they do their best to help — and in my experience, help from a psychologist beats that of a psychiatrist any day, because the psychiatrist sees you as a case while the psychologist sees you as a person.
Though in the case of this claimed child psychologist, I suspect that rather than either case or person, she sees people as targets.
Diff all you want, it’s a junk science without laws…
If there are no laws to govern it then it’s not a science. Just because they used the scientific method doesn’t make a true science.
Wow. Very, very well said.
As a person having a background in a hard science field…one with fundamental empirical laws…let me extend to you a very emphatic “Thank-you” for making this distinction.
I was trying to explain this very point to my children just the other day.
JR, these crackpots throwing around theories and hypothesis like they’re as definite as the sunrise, drives me bat $hit crazy.
That’s just rubbish. Psychological research progresses by the same methods as any science. Just because we haven’t gotten to the bottom of the field doesn’t mean it isn’t science.
Actually, yes it does.
The entire field is based on anecdotal data and statistics.
You can quite literally get away with sayin,”This is what I think, so that’s the way it is… ”
Much like this lady who didn’t justify her comments with facts, just “I’m a psychology major….” Followed by verbal diarrhea in the form of an opinion.
I hate to break it to you, but until there is some kind of major, course altering breakthrough in the field of psychology, it’s more philosophy than hard science.
This is perfect, and I hope the “demonize-the-hunters” trend continues. We can’t turn Fudds into 2A activists — they think that they’re somehow special — but the leftists, statists and soccer moms can do what we cannot.
Teaching kids to hunt opens up their eyes to their own independence.
No mention of violent video games? Hmmm … I wonder if there’s a connection that has been overlooked.
All kids need is access to a firearm and the mindset to commit a shooting!!!! Hunting does nothing but teach them the importance of weapon safety and how to shoot a weapon properly……. The initiative to shoot or kill someone or commit suicide is stemmed from anger and depression…… Not from hunting!!!!!! The stupidity these experts let spew from their mouth is unreal!!!!!!
Are all gun-control nuts lunatics like this woman?
First of all: a dumb (i.e. lacking in sentience) animal is neither innocent nor guilty; it is simply a creature of instinct. It lives a life of stimulus and response.
Second: those who live off of the land – hunting for meat, raising livestock, farming for grains and vegetables, etc. – learn some fundamental lessons about life, and the world we are blessed to live in. Among those lessons are a healthy respect for nature, and for man’s role in being a good steward of the bounty of the land. Animals are not killed out of malice, or without necessity. (I could go on, but anyone who’s actually had their hands in the dirt knows what I’m talking about.)
Third: there’s not a shred of evidence that hunting – an activity that has sustained mankind throughout nearly every culture throughout all of civilization – has led to mass-killers.
So the grandparents of this child psychologist were, by his account, mass murdering-prone psychopaths? And there is no blood on his hands because his food comes in plastic wrap? Just making sure I understood.
Generally speaking, there is nothing that a spree killer does that millions of other people don’t do too (other than spree killing). That’s what makes it so hard to predict and why most lawmaking is completely impotent as a means to address it.
If you keep chasing black swans you’ll eventually step on the cobra effect.
You absolutely have to be kidding me! If this was the case there would be a whole hell of a lot more people gunning others down in the street. Yes, doing things like taking an axe to the neighbors cat or dog as a child may be an indication of a future sociopath but hunting game animals for food and sport is in no way similiar. Get your head out of your ass Mrs. Alvarado!
Amazing that she eats with that mouth.. and attempts to think with that brain.
No, you stupid bitch, teaching kids to hunt does not make them killers. Dumb ass poor excuses for parents make kids killers. People, if you are unwilling to properly raise children to be useful productive members of society, do not reproduce. Dumb lazy men, keep your dicks in your pants and dumb lazy women, keep your legs closed. Take away social media and teach your children how to interact with a live, in-person human. Problem solved!
That facebook page got more traffic today thanks to this link then it has ever received before.
Just what the world needs, another expect on kids, adults and why they do what they do.
I won’t lead with credentials like the quote above, but I know my own mind: Early exposure to hunting and to killing animals sensitized me to the value and evanessence of life. I certainly can kill an animal without remorse when needed, but I can’t kill lightly or without thought and decision. I know the weight of killing. I cannot fantasize about killing being glorious. I cannot play video games that cheapen killing. Hunting sensitized me to the consequences of pressing that trigger. It may have made me a killer, but it inoculated me against becoming a murderer.
With nearly 14 million hunters (and 5 times that many gun owners) how could anyone still be alive if Senora Alvarado is correct in her presumptions? I hope that the study that backs up her claim was not government subsidized, but I would not be surprised.