“Former Arizona Rep. Gabrielle Giffords and husband Mark Kelly are trying to enlist veterans in their effort to bring about changes in gun laws, most notably to expand the use of background checks,” the AP reports. Which is especially heinous considering all enlisted men and women must swear an oath to uphold and defend the United States Constitution, whose Second Amendment prohibits any and all infringement on Americans’ individual, natural and civil right to keep and bear arms. Oh wait, wasn’t Kelly in the Navy? And didn’t Giffords swear the same oath before taking office? Huh. “Kelly joined Friday with a handful of former military leaders to announce the formation of Veterans for Responsible Solutions . . . Kelly says veterans provide a unique voice to the gun debate because they know how to use firearms responsibly.” As opposed to . . . ?
Another alphabet organization. How do they keep track of em all?
Why would they need to keep track of them? Who the hell ASKS them about it? They can just keep making up this shit, unchallenged.
We all can play this game. Okay… they just created GYPSY TRANSIENTS FOR SENSIBLE RESPONSIBLE SOLUTIONS.
Your turn…
Mother’s Institute for Legal Firearms… MILF for short
I thank you for allowing me to turn my gag into the “straight man”‘s line! That doesn’t happen every day.
hahahahaaha made my day
Firearms Owners And Devotees.
FTW
Ralph wins.
hehehehe….. I see your cunning plan.
Mr. Kelly (Mr. “I better by an AR-15 before they become illegal”) may have another one up his sleeve: Veterans Who Can Pass a Background Check and Buy AR-15s Just to Prove how Lax America’s Gun Laws Are.
Considering the pain in the ass paperwork to get INTO the service about six years back, is it any surprise that an average veteran can pass a background check? After all, AR-platform rifles are the LITTLE guns.
Unfortunately, one of the most vicious debates I experienced on gun control was at a military base with an Air Force NCO.Being that I was the junior member, I had to tactically retreat from that engagement.
I thought that was just an outlier, but then I heard from fellow Airmen that they had problems getting approved for Air Force base gun permits.Turned out their NCOs, unlike my supervisor, were antis who’d never sign the approval paperwork.
This is a cause for more concern then we realize.
the US military as an organization overall seems to have crumpled to the anti-gun politics, regardless of branch.
Just the officers and higher up NCOs like brigade sgm and the sma E-7 and below are pretty much for gun rights in my experience.
Speaking as an FGO who organized 5 members of my office plus two of their spouses into a group to get or CHLs, plus arranging weapons familiarization training for 400 cadets, and this spring trying to get time on a range for those cadets headed to field traing. Not to mention routinely debating some of my cadets on the virtues of firearms ownership and their responsibility to the constitution over political ideaology of leadership let me invite you to go pound sand.
You are entitled to your opinion but as a former E5 told by his O2 to sell his guns and stop keepin em in my off post apartment (at the time I lived across the street from the main gate and owned quite a few guns) my opinion stands. I was hamstrung on promotion boards thanks to that lil prick. I made it to 5 but couldn’t get past that since he was one of the guys on my board hence why I transferred to the guard where they at least let us show off our toys and play with em at the company picnic at the training area.
Funny it was the Guard NCOs that I found to be the absolute bottom of the barrel professionally. From the one E7 who was functionally illiterate to the E8 who left her loaded rifle unsecured in reach of our Iraqi cleaning crew to the other E8 who threw a temper tantrum when told to do something that was “beneath her” during a FOB defense exercise. I guess since you can lump md in with a single example of a bad officer I can assume you are right there with these bottom feeding NCOs right? That can be my opinion after all.
Or you could drop the childish “officers are soooooo stoopid” shit. The most professional NCOs I know or have ever known squash that crap and I do the same if I ever hear cadets or junior officers talking bad on the enlisted. It is unprofessional and divisive regardless of how long it has been going on. Which is kind of an issue in a professional volunteer force where manpower issues mean we are all in each others pockets. Just my opinion though, since you were kind enough to permit me to have one.
(ch)Air force? No one actually cares what they think.
Way to marginalize a branch of the Armed Forces! Major snark points!!!!
I’m just kidding! Of course we care!
Sounds lame, until you consider that a lot of those chairs go, like, 10,000MPH. (To be fair, some of them only recline that fast, but this is the case in every branch)
Never rag on a bunch of folks who have the god-given good sense to bring an A-10 or a B-52 to a gun fight.
–Semper Fi.
Well, I can see them enlisting Wesley Clark.
We’ll see how long they will last with this. MAIG has done ads with military leaders before and it didn’t move the needle much in their favor.
http://www.guns.com/2013/02/27/maigs-new-demand-a-plan-with-generals/
DUBIOUS DEMOCRATIC EX-PENTAGON SHILLS FOR SENSIBLE RESPONSIBLE SENSIBLE SOLUTIONS.
I want to start my own little group:
Furiously Phlegmatic Fathers Fighting For Firearms Freedom from Federal F-ckups
Its pronounced “FFFFFF-“
ANOTHER group?! When did these groups get genitals and start reproducing?
Without a doubt the most used quote on this blog applies here too….”I say we nuke them from orbit. It’s the only way to be sure.”
That’s the problem with libs…. they breed.
Too bad they support abortions for minorities, but guns just for them and their cronies, amirite?
No, they metastasize.
Start a veterans organization opposed to 2nd amendment infringement. I’m sure you’d get more members and make Kelly look like an even bigger ass.
There is, it’s called the Oath Keepers.
http://oathkeepers.org/oath/
Good thing the Oathkeepers don’t support gun control, right? 😉
Yeah no Mac from the Military Arms channel is a velcro patch wherein member.
????
Isn’t that the VFW? You know, the guys with the cannons on their front lawns?
I joined the VFW and the American Legion cause the drinks were cheap. I dropped my membership when I quit drinking. I have no idea what their stand on 2a is.
I am a veteran. I would massage my gums with an AR-15 before I would disgrace the constitution by joining such a group.
Same here.
+2
Hooah same here then again I was never an officer or in a staff position so I’m not considered an enlightened and anointed one.
In my time we talked of the 2 wars we had to fight. The one against the enemy. And the one against the officers.
Speaking as an officer headed for my staff tour next year as well as a life NRA member, CHL holder, and advocate for the uninfringed interpretation of our oath let me say thanks for your faith in us.
Ease up the enlisted have been makin fun of officers for time untold. like saying the 4th ID unit patch is indeed four butter bars pointin north.
If it’s any consolation check the website’s own description of their membership:
“Veterans for Responsible solutions is a national constituency of retired flag officers, retired senior officers and former enlisted members of the U.S. Armed Forces.”
Flags, retired senior officers and former enlisted members….see who’s missing? Being one myself I take pride in seeing no love for (from) the former field or staff officers.
pyt, I guess you never heard the old saying”The time to worry about the soldiers isn’t when they’re grumbling, it’s when they’re quiet.” From the days of the Legions and before, to now, barracks room talk has probably not changed much if any.
+3 Hooah!
Right on Hal.
Add me. Active duty starting 20140121
Godspeed Jwestham! Good luck!
Thanks! Can’t wait for BCT!
Me too. I have a W88 with his name on it.
+1. USN 23 yrs here and CAPT Kelly does not speak for me nor do I know any senior officers personally who believe in gun control. Quite the opposite but of course you wont read THAT in the State Run Media™.
While I sympathize with he and his wife for her traumatic experience I find his abuse of his position as a retired officer and astronaut to be disreputable and misguided at best. This smells like another coordinated sock puppet group likely funded by same network of Soros affiliated Think Progress and OFA “nudge” groups. Propaganda pure and simple.
“… sympathize with HIM and his wife.” It is a fact that I do not “sympathize with he”.
I’m a vet and this in no bueno. One, having served carries different weight and respect, it does not make us magically superior in the manipulation of firearms nor morally superior in telling the people it’s okay to have any right that is protected in the Constitution infringed upon.
However, I have seen more Air Force dudes wanting to regulated the 2nd than compared to other services (like “assault weapons” are not for “civilian” use) and it’s mostly career officers in any branch that love any all forms of gun control for everybody (whether a civilian or a service member).
Sadly that is true then again officers are the politicians of the military it’s not who you know it’s who you blow. and what better way to climb that ladder than throwin in with high power politicians’ views on guns.
I don’t know about that bro, my dad is retired USAF O6 and he’s very pro 2A, I got out as a CW2 and I’m as big a “gun nut” as the rest of y’all. We can’t make generalizations like that. We all need to stand together, Officer, warrant NCO and enlisted.
Warrants in my experience are a totally different critter than officers. by officers I meant those above colonel the career guys one star and up or those buckin for a staff posting. There is a HUGE difference between officers, leaders, and commanders.
1 Officers are the guys that will send men into harms way while they stay behind and play politics.
2. Leaders will go with the men into combat after ordering them in and give up their safety and comfort to be with their men.
3. Commanders will send entire units out on missions while takin care of the paperwork and may or may not actually go into the fight with them but will make damn sure they are taken care of out in the field or back at base.
Today’s army has many officers but few real leaders or commanders.
Roger that hooah. I know some damn good officers though. A bad apple or two doesn’t neccisarilly spoil the bunch. On the other hand, when i got deployed, I was in the guard, so my experiences may or may not be the same as yours. I’ve heard some horror stories regarding douche bag officers from some of my buddies…
Warrant officers are a bit different I guess. We are mostly there as airborne jeep drivers. After Rucker, I was just there to do my job, slinging loads and hauling troops. I never personally had any dreams of making a career of it. I just liked helicopters…Still do.
It’s probably because, out of all the services, the USAF has the least hands-on experience with weapons (and I say that as an airman, so I do know wherefore which I speak; in my 14 years of service I’ve been to qualify maybe 4 times).
I’m personally of the opinion that every servicemember should be required to carry in uniform; if they can’t be trusted to be basically competent with it and illustrate an ability to not be an idiot with it, they shouldn’t be in the military. We are a profession of arms and I think it is criminal that we have moved away from that. It’s no wonder we have people joining the military and being completely unaware that, by nature, the job includes violence and a very real possibility that you might be tasked with causing the violent end to somebody’s life. It’s like the military is being marketed as an arm of the Peace Corps.
I teach at one of the larger AFROTCs in the country. I guarantee you that ever single cadet in our program and the nearly 1100 around the country that went through the Field Training encampments I worked this summer know for a certainty that the profession they are entering involves violence on other human beings. My cadets know because it is a part of my classroom where I bring every job from pilot to intelto personnelist to acquisition officer back to that one end. Not to mention how it is an integral part of the curriculum through discussions like LOAC. The cadets this summer sat for several hours listening to an AF Special Tactics Officer make the point simply and eloquently.
When I toured the Beast which is the culmination of BMT and at each enlisted graduation, I have been to 4 in the last two years, this same point was made, violence is our profession.
So as FahQ said nice try. You are dither cherry picking examples from your experience or just making it up.
Umm, no, I’m not making it up. But thanks so much for exposing yourself as a prick.
Holy Guacamole. 4 times?
I know it’s different between branches; hell, there are significant differences inside the branches according to specialty.
But wow – as an Army red leg (field artillery) in an infantry brigade, we qualified 3-4 times a year. Probably more. And we took a PT test every two months or so. That might have been a mild anomaly related to my unit being the Army’s newest Stryker brigade at the time, though (and our O-6 wanting his star). We actually went through the whole process of getting certified as a counter-guerilla warfare unit – supposedly the first brigade to do so since Vietnam (allegedly).
That would be four enlisted graduations in two years. Considering I am stationed several hours from Lackland that is not to shabby. The larger point being that hearing the discussion of what the profession of arms entails at numerous events across several years from different speakers suggests this isn’t random luck but rather a consistant theme of discussion.
My job as a medic when I first enlisted put me at the bottom of the totem pole as far as qualifying is concerned. And while we may have switched gears as far as how the air force handles weapons training, I have been flat out told (by security forces) that air force ranges were never built for everybody to qualify every year. So as much as I would love to get out on a range and qualify every year, I can’t. And it’s not for lack of trying.
Funny, I am active duty AF and you don’t hear that shit from us….nice try though
Never said it was coming from the troops. We all know differently. The idiots in charge – there’s a different story. And then there’s the ads to join, none of which I’ve seen that involve using a gun (but I also dropped cable a couple of years ago and didn’t have time to watch much tv before, hence the dropping of said cable. Then there was being stationed overseas, deploying, you get the picture). Lots of cool footage of jets flying, but the rest all seemed to be people sitting in front of radar screens and the suggestion to Aim High or whatever the new catchphrase is.
And to make it perfectly clear, I HAVE MET PEOPLE WHO JOINED THE AIR FORCE AND DIDN’T KNOW THEY WOULD BE RESPONSIBLE FOR HELPING KILL BAD PEOPLE. So if you guys want to call me a liar again, by all means. I know who I know, I know who I’ve served with, and I know who I continue to serve with.
As an Arizonan, a veteran and a gun owner, I am disgusted with Kelly’s ventriloquist act. Thank you for your service; now FOAD.
From my understanding oath keepers are somtimes very extreme and you may want to be weary of them. I’m currrntly active duty and would wholeheartedly supports veterans fir gun rights.
I have a quote for you, “moderation in defense of liberty is no virtue, extremism in pursuit of justice is no vice” Barry Goldwater
I’m guessing the liberal/progressive “social justice” brigade hadn’t been fully formed when Goldwater said that. He probably didn’t think it through completely anyway; extremism and justice are rarely compatible.
extremism and justice are rarely compatible
Please so advise the Founding Fathers. They didn’t get the memo.
I’m at a loss to understand what gives someone a right to declare who’s an “extremist” or not. To my way of thinking, Ralph, all charges of “extremism” are a cry for challenges: “WHY is this ‘extremist’? Please state your reasons in clear, unambiguous terms… and none of that defining one term in terms of another bull hockey…
Sometimes extreme measures are the only way to get results. From reading their about us page it looks as though they just want the government to go back to what it should be. A CONSTITUTIONAL REPUBLIC not the ungodly entity it is now with phones being tapped all of us required to have govt. approved health insurance and the like. I kinda like the group but I’ll need to know more before I think about joinin.
Disregard my last after stumblin across this post on their forum I’ve gotta say they are a tad on the extreme side.
http://oathkeepers.org/oath/2013/10/21/oath-keepers-is-going-operational-by-forming-special-civilization-preservation-teams/
Yeah, civilization will never be in any danger.
I read that post and others. Looks more like what you would read on CERT and FEMA emergency prep official guidance websites with the additional experience of SF A-teams in how-to do training with inexperienced civilian population.
I’m sure you can cherry pick a comment from ANY group and spin it to delegitimize what they offer. In fact it would be entirely expected that a network of well funded left leaning activist community groups would coordinate to plant disinformation and agitprop on TTAG and other pro 2A forums. Classic soviet style Alinskyite tactics since Lenin carried on now by MAIG MDA and OFA.
Your understanding of Oath Keepers is not a good one, and extreme they are not.
I have too look into them now I just don’t want to put my career into a tight spot since my views are so different from my command.
Depending on rank you have 3 options.
1. Transfer command
2. Show your command the longest finger on your right hand and do it anyway.
3. Pass a PT test or open a chili mac MRE and claim your E4.
Will these two ever get real jobs? Geez, I’m tired of them popping up like zits on a teenager.
Why would they? They get so much money from their sponsors just for parroting gun control points. Its just so much more work for them to do desk jobs and paid normal salaries.
Remember, they’re both retired. Why not get someone who’s not as cunning and deceitful as you to pay your travel and expenses while you tour the country speaking and looking human for the camera. “Opportunistic ghouls” is the term you’re looking for.
Kelly is no more retired than Hilary.
Adding a Veteran-based speaking-points project (which is all it will be, a banner) is fine with them. It simply creates another affiliation group which politicians can pretend is supportive of ever more burdensome regulation.
The new post-Biden approach to achieving gun-banning legislation is to seed public opinion much more heavily through media opinion pieces (using donor-controlled media) before launching anti-gun legislation as a hot-button issue into the 2014 campaign season. The link between the astroturf groups at the weekly WH-sponsored round table (Mayors Against Illegal Gun Control, the Brady Camp, Moms Demand Action, Americans for Responsible Solutions, Center for American Progress and Organizing for Action) and the donor/supporter media push is clearly Jarrett. That structure gives the donors/supporters of the party, and their controlled media, some protection against being strictly identified with the anti-gun PR groups. This minimizes the risk of loss of readership/viewership by those who react strongly against the PR groups themselves.
It isn’t a conspiracy. It’s a very well thought out program. If you think the bizarre G&A and Runner’s World placements over the last week are a fluke, I’ve got a bridge to sell you.
“because they (veterans) know how to use firearms responsibly” Twenty one years in the US Navy. Fired about 200 rounds with and old 1911 in boot camp and got an expert medal. Twenty years later got to help get rid of some old .45 ammo off the fantail of the USS Saratoga. I had to ask the gunner to show me how to operate the 1911 because I had not touched another one in all those years. Since retiring I have become a certified NRA instructor in five disciplines, all as a civilian. Most vets get very little firearm training while on active duty. It’s just another anti-gun scam.
Also a vet, also a supporter of our natural rights as citizens. Part of the reason these silly groups are multiplying is the funding from several wealthy anti’s. You can surmise their names. It’s astroturfing to swing the 2014 elections.
So sorry I don’t support HYPOCRITES. As or ass for Frankenstein and her ilk I remember someone equating vets to terrorists or some such thing not so long ago. Let them get bent the lot.
Ah, that’s one of Nancy Pelosi’s brilliant one-liners. It’s also been echoed by Senator DiFi, U.S. Attorney General Eric “We Must Brainwash The People” B. “Fast & Furious” Holder, former U.S. Attorney General Janet “Waco” Reno, and current Secretary of Homeland “Security” Janet “Ruby Ridge” Napalitano.
Absolutely scum of the Earth. ALL of them.
I’m a Navy veteran myself, and I am quite frankly quite disgusted at the fact that Mark Kelly served in the same branch.
I would ordinarily say that he should know better, but rabid, anti-rights, Statist hypocrites like him never do. Neither him nor his wife take their oaths very seriously at all, despite any and all claims to the contrary. Really the only voices in the military calling for any form of gun control are primarily career offices and staff NCOs: FUDs, the lot of them. Enemies to the Bill of Rights and, by extension, to us. While they are in fact a very small minority, they are both quite vocal about it and throw their rank and time-in-service around to make it stick — even though most of them have never been to front-line combat, much less fired their weapon in anger.
This instantly brings me back to former Gen. McCrystal and his incessant regurgitation of the same exact bold-faced lies as those mealy-mouthed gun-grabbing fucksticks. When was the last time that man ever did any grunt work at all? I’ll guaran-damn-tee you he hasn’t done anything more than qualify in at least 15 years, doesn’t know the first thing about terminal ballistics nor just how absolutely deplorable the performance of the M855 ball really is, and he’s definitely forgotten where he’s came from both as a soldier and as a citizen.
It would not surprise me one bit if none of the so-called “veterans” that have signed on to this tripe never actually served a day, just like all those phony SEALs that Don Shipley busts every week (YT: buds131). If they did, they have out-right forsaken their oaths, too.
Of course, all they’re ever clambering for is gun control for us peasants, and not for them or their armed bodyguards. That’s all it’s ever been about: what makes them comfortable, Constitutional jurisprudence and crime statistics be damned! They don’t give a rat’s ass about anybody but themselves, just like their money-grubbing shills on Capitol Hill. But, what else is new? I’m just pointing out the obvious at this point.
Yep. And once they make 0-6 their quals are pencil-whipped.
Naw pencil punched is more accurate.
I am a veteran with thirteen years service in the USN and the USMC. Sign me up for a veterans pro 2A organization.
They just want to use veterans as a shield from criticism. How can you disagree with a veteran? Why do you hate our veterans? This sort of junk is why they start an org like this. It also plays well with the main stream media who can pretend that the only veterans group speaking out on gun rights is Kelly/Gifford’s group. All other groups standing up for gun rights will be ignored. It’s all about perception and telling a lie to the public over and over, until the public buys it.
It also allows them to scam more money out of people’s good will toward veterans as I will bet my house, they never mention they are a gun control group in their fundraising letters.
Absolutely spot on. Veterans enjoy a measure of respect and favoritism that li’l bloomberg could only wish to attain, despite his billions. They love to front “vet” to deflect criticism.
It really boils down to the fact that you either get what the Constitution, the Bill of Rights and the American Experiment is all about or you don’t. Sure, veterans and all kinds of other people took one oath or another and to some of those folks an oath is a malleable thing that they will make conform to their own particular slant on life, their philosophy and their convictions (or lack thereof). In their minds they are on the side of all that is right and good in the world and if we dim Neanderthal bitter clingers would just get with their program and get the hell out of their way the world would be a far better and more peaceful place. That they are unequivocally and demonstrably wrong has little or nothing to do with it; no amount of data, logic, reason, historical example or insight into human nature will sway them from their quest, nor would they let truth get in the way of an appealing ideology. The fact that some group or other has decided that “the Common Good™” far outweighs one’s natural, inalienable, essential, fundamental, civil, human and Constitutional rights has little bearing on the matter. Their minds are made up, they are the True Believers, they are on a Mission, they will not be deterred, stand in their way at your peril. What we’re looking at is a clash of cultures. What we need to do is to make sure that our culture grinds theirs into the dustbin of history.
Very good assessment!
Here he goes again, pimping the Mrs and victicrat mentality. I am very sorry what happened to her, but those were the actions of Loughner, not me nor millions of other gun owners. I am a law-abiding gun owner and I do not intend to be disarmed by him or anyone else. I’m a veteran and proud member of the NRA, GOA and my local shooting club. I served to protect the rights of all Americans, while this tool works to take them away. I am very politically involved in working to protect my 2A rights in my area. Mark Kelly is like a wooden puppet with Bloomberg’s hand up his rear-end. I don’t care whether or not he is a veteran or an astronaut, his current actions speak volumes about his nature. I am a veteran too, and I will oppose his bullcrap agenda until my last breath. Asshat….
+1
+1
You can be 100% sure that anybody who puts “responsible” or “common sense” next to their solutions has neither responsibility, nor common sense, nor solutions to the problem at hand…and odds are, the problem they’re on about doesn’t even exist. Unless the lamentable excess of freedom in this country is the problem they’re trying to solve. They’re trying their best on that one.
The theory is, “a lie told often enough (and stridently enough) eventually becomes a “truth”.”
It worked for Hitler and Goebbels. That’s the playbook they’re working from.
It worked for my first wife at our divorce trial too.
A group like this is a slap in the face of all veterans. It is like if somebody would say that only Navy SEALs should own AR’s because they have the training…. Oh, wait a tic……
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2013/09/robert-farago/failed-ma-senate-candidate-wrong-oppose-assault-weapons-ban/
@ Kelly. As a veteran I’m deciding to add my unique voice to the debate, do the responsible thing and not join. Probably for the very same reasons you think I should. Oh…and I think you’re a peckerhead.
+1
“Oh…and I think you’re a peckerhead.”
ROTFLMAO! 😀
Last week, Obama said that we have to back our veterans all the way. Tell me he didn’t know that this week Captain Asshat would announce that he was trying to organize a veterans anti-constitution group.
I guess that Americans for Responsible Solutions just isn’t getting enough Bloomberg and Joyce Foundation money to support Captain Asshat and his social parasite wife in the extravagant style they prefer.
Oh, I get it alright. Here you have an elite demographic imbued with special knowledge and experience due to their status as “veterans”. Of course they should be allowed to arbitrate what’s right for me and mine, as they posses the pure true knowledge like no others, therefore their word should be law. Well, all I can really say to that is that they can kiss my sweet Irish ass and I’ll make it my mission in life to see them all in Hell; the ignorant, pusillanimous, traitorous tools that they are.
This kind of reminds me of Gabriel Gomez, the SEAL and US Senate candidate from Massachusetts that recently had the epiphany, after he lost the election, that all of those nasty “assault weapons” don’t really have a place in mere “civilian” hands. What the hell, if you’re going to shake hands with the Devil, you might as well slip him a little tongue and spread your cheeks while you’re at it.
Our first group isn’t working, what do we do? CHANGE THE NAME! Surely that will make everything better.
They’ve successfully divided the American people so next up? American Veterans.
Divide and conquer, the oldest trick in the book.
Responsible solutions? To what? Beer on base while doing a tour in Afghanistan? I’m all for that!
They do have beer on base… Near beer but hey least it’s somethin. as for alcoholic beverages, those will result in a lighter collar because they are illegal for US forces. The Brits and everyone else can we can’t.
We already have such an organization:
http://oathkeepers.org/oath/
As an officer I greatly dislike officers who discourage their soldiers exercising the RKBA. If I knew of an NCO discouraging their soldiers from exercising that right I would flip.
I had an officer debate me earlier this year that only cops and mil should have semi auto guns. This mentality scares me.
I do see more officers who are 2A supporters than I have for the past two years although It seems like some of the seniors are not gun fans but I know a few diehard 2A supporters.
But you must remember, Butter Bars are NOT officers…
No they are privates pretty much just like specialists are not junior NCOs just full bird private.
Never met a warrior that hates guns and I doubt I ever will.
It seems to me, as well as to a bunch of others here, that these anti-2A vets are all officers. Bush banned firearms on bases, and the officers it would seem heartily approve. Yes, officers are a political position–and being subject to the “up or out” rule, they play the politics demanded of them by the Pentagon and the CINC, because failure to do so would be a career ending faux pas.
Then again, history supports such actions. Once Rome developed standing armies (and perpetual war), weapons, soldiers, and especially armies were banned from the Capitol for fear that they would revolt and take over the government. In the Middle Ages, free men carried arms until the monarchs and rulers established standing armies with large numbers of armed mercenaries at their beck and call–and at that point the serfs were disarmed and told to go about their business growing crops and paying taxes.
It concerns me greatly that we seem to be sliding into the same errors that lead to the fall of the Roman empire. Goods are produced abroad and shipped home. The hoi polloi are generally impoverished and dependent upon the public weal–or reliant upon serving in the various armies in countries far away. When the leaders fear the people, the people are disarmed–but society nonetheless ultimately collapses after falling into tyranny.
Where are our soldiers today? Mostly abroad. And when here, they are disarmed by their commanders. The parallels between Rome and now are striking.
We are next. The threat of tyranny–not from any particular political leader but from the elitist political class that “runs” our country–is great.
You do know the truth of the matter. There’s a big problem pulling our base of support together so that our nation can begin meaningful restoration. Although the base seems to be more coherent to me in the last few years, we still appear to have a ways to go. As long as the enemies of Liberty continue to be able to draw our people towards this false “middle”, they know that they aren’t likely to feel sustainable resistance in the extreme long term. The situation is much more black and white than the usurpers have convinced so many of our base.
Yeah, military promoting civilian disarmament, that won’t raise any flags…
Another vet for pro 2A rights. Lets giturdun!!!
What’s next? Lesbian Veterinarian Agnostics With Shingles Demand Action?
And in a hilarious bit of irony, the front end of the weapon pictured there is a M14. 20 round magazine, high powered rifle, full-auto, etc.
The problem is that Bill of Rights is the LAW OF THE LAND. That means no matter who or how many (mob rule) it can not be changed by a new law, the courts, and even by a larger number of votes etc. And every public office in the LAND (U.S.A.) is under it’s say.. To do so means We have NO LAW , meaning the LAW is only what we say it is for today…..No,No….the Bill Of RIGHTS can not be changed for ANY REASONS …That is the check and balance the FOUNDERS put in place before they would accept A United States…..
I’m confused. Am I a terrorist or a “responsible citizen”? Am I supposed to be afraid of myself or pat myself on the back cause I know when to put my booger hook on the bang switch?
Uhhh good question. Judgin by the news I’d say all us vets are responsible terrorists that should be afraid of who is patting us on the back.
According to that Feinstein broad, you’re the [email protected] who invented PTSD.
In my defense I didn’t invent it until my truck found the 4th IED the hard way.
The gun control lobby believes that just be creating a bunch of organization made of the same people will create momentum for gun control. They should take a hard look at last week’s elections in Virginia. McAuliffe probably lost more votes because he was on Bloomberg’s payroll than he gained by misrepresenting Cuccinelli on social issues. Case in point was the race for the seat in the House of Delegates in Fairfax County held by Barbara Comstock. If anything, Comstock is actually more conservative than Cuccinelli and has been a target of Bloomberg’s for several election cycles. She comfortably held the seat in a district that Cuccinelli lost by 18 points. Virginians of all political factions like their guns and with a very low crime rate they are not about to be convinced that restricting firearms is going to make them safer. That is pretty much the position of most Americans outside of the urban elite, Hollywood and academia. Outside of the Northeast and California gun control is a loser.
That’s generally true. I’m a born Virginian (like John Carter!) and I’m typing this from norther VA. That said, the federal government and associated contractors (disclosure: I was one) are a major driving force between northern VA’s heavily blue-shaded demographics. People like Comstock can win because non-native Virginians tend to ignore local elections and focus on national/gubernatorial races (actually, everyone does, but longtime residents are more likely to vote in local elections that new-arrivals).
Virginia could conceivably wind up like California or Colorado – with a very blue minority of the state controlling a very angry conservative majority.
Officer who promotes 2A all day everyday. I know all the officer stereotypes, and lord knows I serve with quite a few who need to find another line of work, but this “joe knows best and all the officers are going to get us killed nonsense” gets old. I had the best NCOs in the army, and continue to serve with those of the same calibre. Enlisted guys just the same. I did have bad apples in every rank as well… Joes, NCOs, warrants and RLOs… Polarizing each rank, branch, etc gets tiresome with all the anti-officer stuff on here sometimes.
I was lucky that everyone I served with was pro gun or at least open to it… I did have a less than cordial conversation with another captain about him “understanding” magazine restrictions… I about lost it… A CIB wearing infantry guy no less… Perhaps he lost his pocket copy of the constitution…
Amen. I have worked with all branches at least some what in the last 10 years and they are made up of all kinds. I get tired of being lumped in with the bad officers the same way many of the enlisted and NCOs would be irrate if I lumped them in with some of the (literally) barely literate or irresponsible NCOs I worked with over the years.
+1. Anyone with more than one term of enlistment realies theres a lot you DONT know about the service until you advance in rank, officer or enlisted including humility and appreciation for teamwork yp and down the chain of command. Comments slandering an entire group is exactly what you’d expect of the disaffected oddball who couldnt hack it or …more likely…more of the same lefty trolls posing as vets looking to divide us as veterans and gun owners.
They are the Law Breakers as they Constitutionally CANNOT even start this institute as it is a Breach of OATH ,same as breach of contract!
Gabby Giffords, Mark Kelly Launch Veterans Group for Gun Control
I SURE AS HELL AM NOT GOING TO JOIN THEIR B.S. GROUP!!
THIS VET THINKS THEY CAN SHOVE THEIR GROUP RIGHT UP THEIR…. WELL YOU KNOW WHERE, RIGHT? LOL
—————————————————————————————
The gun control PAC of Gabby Giffords and her husband, Mark Kelly, is launching a new initiative, “Veterans for Responsible Solutions.”
According to CNN, the new initiative “will support Giffords and Kelly’s wider efforts by bringing to bear the experience of military veterans who’ve sworn to defend the Second Amendment.”
Kelly, a veteran himself, said he shares the views of the veterans in the new initiative. He also spoke of all the guns he and his wife keep in their home for self-defense and target shooting.
Along with Kelly, Veterans for Responsible Solutions say they are not seeking “to repeal or limit the Second Amendment.” They just want “universal background checks.”
Neither Giffords, Kelly, nor Veterans for Responsible Solutions addressed the fact that universal background checks will require gun registration in order to be effective. Nor did they address Breitbart News’ reports that universal background checks would not have stopped the heinous crimes of the Sandy Hook Elementary, D.C. Navy Yard, or LAX shootings.
CNN did report that the couple’s push for universal background checks has proven “politically unpalatable.”
http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2013/11/08/Gabby-Giffords-And-Her-Husband-Launch-Veterans-for-Gun-Control
Speaking as a veteran, I would like to suggest that Giffords and Kelly can kiss my ass and bark at the hole.
Does that provide a unique voice for the “gun debate”?
Great. Another “faux” profit gun ban lobby group.
As a veteran, I would have absolutely NOTHING to do with these two idiots…
It just occurred to me that this Mothers group doesn’t have many black, hispanic, nor lesbian moms. The DOJ should be looking into them.
***Sarcasm Warning***
🙂
I just sent this to the Governor of Georgia:
I 100% support your “Guns Everywhere” legislation. The people for irresponsible solutions seem to think that a citizen legally carrying a gun will magically turn irresponsible or worse if allowed to carry a gun anywhere. Please disregard their idiocy and pass your commonsense bill.
I am a veteran of Vietnam. I can see from the comments that you have little support from veterans. Call John Kerry I’m sure that bozo will be more then happy to support your quest for irresponsible solutions.
A background check list of any sort should consist of only people who are not allowed to have a gun. No other name need appear on any such list. DO NOT INFRINGE Period
But they have to investigate everyone – to find out if they’re allowed to own guns or not! ;D
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