Tyler Barriss was arrested in the fatal swatting of Andrew Finch
courtesy Glendale Police Dept.
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The Call of Duty gamer who allegedly ‘swatted’ a Wichita man, resulting in his death, has been arrested. And according to the LA Times, he’s apparently an old hand at his craft . . . L.A. man arrested in fatal ‘swatting’ hoax in Wichita has been accused of making false threats before

A 25-year-old man was arrested Friday in South Los Angeles for his suspected role in a “swatting” hoax incident in Kansas that resulted in the fatal police shooting of a man.

Tyler Barriss was arrested on a fugitive warrant related to the Thursday shooting in Wichita, said LAPD Officer Mike Lopez. Barriss is being held without bail, Lopez said.

Barriss allegedly attempted to swat another gamer, but was given a false address for the object of his attack. A resident at that address, Andrew Finch, who was in no way involved with the dispute, opened the door when police arrived and was shot and killed.

Several officers arrived and surrounded the home, braced for a hostage situation. When Finch went to the door police told him to put his hands up and move slowly.

But Livingston said the man moved a hand toward the area of his waistband. An officer, fearing the man was reaching for a gun, fired a single shot. Finch died a few minutes later at a hospital. Livingston said Finch was unarmed.

Barriss was apparently upset with the other gamer over a high stakes competition they were engaged in.

Dexerto, an online news service focused on the video game world, reported that the fatal series of events began with an online argument over a $1 or $2 wager over a “Call of Duty” game in an online tournament operated by UMG Gaming.

There’s no word yet as to what charges Barriss will face besides, you’d have to assume, filing a false police report. Manslaughter or possibly even a second degree murder charge could also be in his future.


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    • No. I’m absolutely certain that that is a picture of a millennial SJW, that was never spanked, that is probably gender fluid, that was never taught that losing is a possibility in life, that got a trophy for just showing up every place he just happened to stumble into, that’s entitled to every dime you make because he believes in socialism, and is very likely a welfare baby that’s probably going on the 2nd or 3rd generation.

      This is dog excrement. I believe in eye for an eye. That means that either a cop shows up and plugs this little bitch baby in his gut and watches him die or a family member of the deceased with enough grit gets the honors.

      I’ve actually had two brothers murdered, one I had the unfortunate horror of watching it happen on video in court proceedings. Seeing it hurt in a way I can’t begin to describe. Seeing it happen in real life is something I’m not sure I could come back from. At least they caught this little bitch. The cops are only batting .500 on my brothers. They caught the one that shot and killed my brother home on leave from his 2nd tour of duty in Iraq, he had just re-upped. The other brother was ran off the road on his motorcycle, nobody got the license plate number and the bastard is still at large.

  1. “Dexerto, an online news service focused on the video game world, reported that the fatal series of events began with an online argument over a $1 or $2 wager over a “Call of Duty” game in an online tournament operated by UMG Gaming.”

    Two bucks.

    Un-fvcking believable…

  2. Are there any reports stating what he has been charged with? All reports I have seen so far just say “a fugitive warrant,” which I presume means just that he has been charged in Kansas, so they arrested him in LA for extradition.

    • The cop may or not be charged depending on Kansas law. Murder requires intent which there was none. We don’t call 911 as a public service assassination squad. The comon public expectation is that the cops will exercise prudence and place public safety first…. something screwy happened in Wichita. This idiot can easily beat a murder/manslaughter case because the only way a DA can push the case is to throw the cops under the bus. Thats not going to happen. The above idiot will be charged with this:

      148.3 California Penal Code

      “(b) Any individual who reports, or causes any report to be made, to any city, county, city and county, or state department, district, agency, division, commission, or board, that an “emergency” exists, who knows that the report is false, and who knows or should know that the response to the report is likely to cause death or great bodily injury, and great bodily injury or death is sustained by any person as a result of the false report, is guilty of a felony…”

      • No intent necessary for manslaughter. If you do something criminally negligent, like driving while intoxicated and someone gets killed because of your actions you are guilty of manslaughter. And murder charges are viable in probably most districts. For instance, if you’re involved in a robbery, say you’re the get away driver, and your partner shoots and kills someone while you’re participating in the commission of the crime – you go up for murder. Even though the get away driver never intended that anyone get hurt and may have never even touched the g un.

      • In many states, if you commit a crime and someone dies as a result of that crime, it is murder, often as if it was premeditated. For example, if you rob a store, and the cashier dies of a heart attack during the robbery, it is murder as if you put the cashier on his knees and put a bullet in his head. Do you want to bet Kansas will seek the death penalty. I would assume if California does not try to block extradition, he is never going to see the outside of a prison.

        • California will block the extradition unless the charges are reduced to a misdemeanor level. Life is cheap in Cali and getting cheaper every day. Theft of less than $1,000 is no longer a real crime there.

        • I can’t argue against any of the above. The DA is going to have to get creative with this one. I don’t think they’ll block the extradition but, yes, life and livelihood is cheap out here. Everything else costs a fortune. I hope they double dip this one and nail him in both states with consecutive sentences.

        • ‘California will block the extradition unless the charges are reduced to a misdemeanor level.’

          How do you know this guy’s an illegal alien, Ollie?

      • “We don’t call 911 as a public service assassination squad.”

        Perhaps you and I do not. Certainly Tyler Barriss does. He is apparently an “old hand” at it:
        “Man arrested in L.A. in fatal ‘swatting’ hoax in Wichita, Kan., has been accused of making false threats before” -http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-swatting-suspect-20171230-story.html

    • Kansas has the “Hard 40” sentence instead of the death penalty. 40 years of hard labor, then you are free to go if you survive. California has issues with the death penalty, but the wagon train dropout state does not have the death penalty. It is 40 years of turning boulders into gravel. Anywhere but Wichita and that POS from California will be convicted.

  3. Is anyone concerned about the actions of the SWAT team? An innocent man answers his door and is obviously stunned and confused by the presence of men in full tactical gear and gets shot because he does not comply? I imagine the SWAT officers were screaming at him with lights in his eyes. That could be anyone of us. SWAT mentality, Shoot first, ask questions later?

    • “Don’t hesitate” means “do not think”.

      This Is what they teach in Warrior Cop Seminars AFTER an hour of video clips (assembled from decades of film) showing encounter after encounter in which the cop died. That is Brainwashing.

      In 2017 only 44 died from a LOD shooting. That is way less than 1 in a million encounters.

      • I read a while back that the number of uniformed officers with arrest powers was around 750,000 – 800,000. That would mean that on average a LEO would have to serve 18,000 years on duty before being killed. Of course being non fatally shot or stabbed wouldn’t be much fun either.

      • There are “no hesitation” targets that police departments use to “desensitize” their “officers. These targets are of pregnant women, old men, and yes, children and toddlers…sick…

    • They don’t care. The guy was white, so they’ll be no outrage from NAACP, BLM, the Congressional Black Caucus or the ACLU. They’ll be no white congressmen calling for independent investigations into the officers conduct, no crying family members on the national news…just a quiet out of court settlement and a few months at home PAID for Mr. Triggerhappy, because if he’s been on the job more than a year the union will make it impossible to fire the shitbag.
      I feel for the family.

    • DUG & Arandom Dude, you seem to be the only ones paying attention here. Why is a heavily armed SWAT team anxious to shoot an unidentified person? They have lights, cameras, body armor, superior fire power and the ability to stand off and EVALUATE the situation before making a rifle(?) shot to the head. Why shoot till you see a weapon? This was not a quick draw contest.

      The swatter needs to stand trial for felony murder (2nd degree = 10 years to life in Missouri). The shooter and his supervisor should be charged with manslaughter. (1 to 10). They could all be cellmates.

      Frankly this and the recent Arizona hotel killing reminds me of Vietnam era mentality. “We had to burn the village to save it”. Despite the screaming of the 24 hour mentally deficient media, police deaths by hostile gunfire is down 1/3 this year (44 vs 63 in 2016).

      P.S. Let’s show the video to a grand jury.

      • …problem is, grand juries are presided by cop-friendly prosecutors, who almost NEVER prefer charges against cops, and can easily sway grand jurors not to prefer charges…happens all the time…

      • From reports I heard, the swatter called the Kansas police and told them he had his family “hostage” and made some threats to them and any police who showed up. In essence, he “primed the pan” for the police to prepare for a lethal encounter. No doubt the poor victim was confused and bewildered and not aware his movements could be misinterpreted by the officers.

        For those claiming the police are at fault or bear some fault, let’s ask a few questions. How do police tell if the call is real or someone trying to “swat” someone? How much leeway do officers need to allow a suspect who doesn’t comply with their commands? If we demand leeway from the officers, then neither can we hold them responsible of a suspect kills a hostage or blows up a school because they didn’t act fast enough. Think on those questions.

        Lastly, the officer who fired is likely distraught over having killed an innocent person. At the instant, he thought he was facing a potential killer and acted using that belief. It’s probably he will need some form of counseling to deal with it.

        • I must respectfully disagree with Billca’s premise. Police MUST be held responsible for their actions, even in a situation such as this. If an ordinary person reacted in the same way as the police, he would be facing charges…the old “double standard” when it comes to the “thin blue line”…

      • Kansas has the “Hard 40” sentence for murder. Plus, Wichita is the most Liberal city in the wagon train dropout state. Their cops are the most likely to shoot first and let the DA’s office ask the questions. It is also the city where the ER Doc was convicted of stalking after one of the estimated 300 women he raped had become pregnant and he was trying to stop her and her husband from aborting the child. She had tried to get him charged with rape, but the Judge decided that since she was unconscious, it was consensual. Wichita is incredibly corrupt.

    • ^This.

      You can’t stop the swatters from making their calls. The police need to adjust their procedures. And grow a pair.

  4. The official A-hole that pulled the trigger is equally responsible. He is on paid leave. Which one will go to jail ?

  5. I’m betting that the part: “But Livingston said the man moved a hand toward the area of his waistband. An officer, fearing the man was reaching for a gun, fired a single shot” turns out to be total bullshit. That’s a line right out of the standard police ass-covering play book just like other standard lies like, the suspect tensed up, clenched his fist and took up a fighting stance. They use that line even when it’s total crap because it clears an officer of excessive force.
    Later on, it will be released that the “initial reports were wrong” Face it, some ignorant cop fu– up and there is full course meal of coverup in progress.

    • Modern police culture dictates that it’s acceptable to kill innocent civilians in order to preserve a potential future tactical advantage. They won’t put it that way, but that’s what stock arguments like “if you wait until you see the gun, you’re dead” or “even a seemingly peaceful 9 year-old girl can draw and shoot before you can react” boil down to. To make matters worse, Graham v. Connor has the effect of letting police make their own rules when it comes to the use of force, and nobody, including those who pay their salary, can gainsay them.

  6. I do not know what ” swatting” is? … Witcita Ks. is a pretty nice town, you can walk the streets at night and not get mugged, if your careful. I’ve lived there, in St Louis I slept in the bathtub. It’s not as safe, Kansas City not so safe either.

    • “Swatting” is when, for spite or as a lame joke, a person calls the police and tells them that (insert name and address of joke victim) just killed his girlfriend/mother/family and is holding other hostage – or similar baloney. Police sends a SWAT team to the victims address, busts in his door, etc. Finally it gets sorted out and swatting perpetrator has a great chuckle at all the trouble he’s put everyone through.

      In this case, he didn’t even have the correct address for his proposed victim – somebody else, who wasn’t even part of this shenanigan, ended up dead for opening the door to an amped-up hostage rescue/SWAT team.

    • SWATing is making a false allegation with the intention of drawing a tactical team to the victim’s house or apartment.

      Say you and I get into an argument and I decide to doxx you. Now I know your home address. I call up the cops in your town and say I saw some serious shit at your house. You offloading loads of narcotics and weapons, or taking a bound and gagged person out of your trunk or something.

      The cops think they have heavy gang/drug activity or human trafficking or an abduction or something so they send a SWAT team to hit your house.

      • In other words: A hit squad on the taxpayer’s dime. And cops don’t know they’ve been had because they’re all too stupid and there’s never any liability when the shit hits the fan and somebody gets shot.

        • Dont absolve those bastards by saying they don’t know because they’re too stupid. They may not be too bright, but they’re not so retarded as not to be culpable.

    • Ironic, so you lived in the worst few square miles of North STL City? Because that’s the only place in the entire Metro you actually have to actively worry about being shot, let alone without being ‘involved’ in something.

  7. I hope that loser spends the next 40 years in a medium security prison.
    Secondly, I live on a large property my driveway is two hundred yards long; I’ve lived there for five years NOBODY has EVER come up my driveway to the house (Except UPS If I’m expecting a delivery). IF I hear knocking/banging on my door at night, There’s a 99.9999% chance I will be armed If it’s the police/swat/atf or whatever I’m gong to die for no reason but being prudent trying protecting my family. What do you do? MR govt. Thug drunk on power kicks my F***ing door down in the night……….Our rights are paper thin. The tree of liberty is withering, most rather be comfortable……………..

    • In fairness, there have been cases wherein people have shot the police under similar circumstances and were acquitted. There was a guy here in Texas who was served with a no-knock warrant in the early morning hours. All he knew is that someone was busting through his door, so he shot the guy and killed him. Turned out it was a Sheriff’s deputy. He ended up getting no-billed, if I recall correctly.

      I’m not saying you’re wrong. Just that it’s not always so black and white.

  8. ‘[T]he man moved a hand toward the area of his waistband.’

    Do the cops MEMORIZE the phrase in training? Absolutely impossible to cross-examine so as to determine if it is truth or merely CYA fiction. Especially in Minneapolis where the Cops never turn on their body cameras (discretionary use). 99% of males carry their ID where? You guessed it. In the “area of his wasteband”.

    This stinks to high Heaven.

    • Fact of the matter is this; all the cop has to say is “I was fearful for my life” and he walks. The thin blue line circles the wagons, the taxpayers will be on the hook for a multi million dollar settlement, and the cop will skate. Mark my words.
      So far this year cops have killed:
      Unarmed white male in hotel hallway,
      Unarmed white female who called 91 to report a rape,
      And countless others without repercussions.
      Maybe a pregnant Asian lady is next? It’s like they’re actively trying to find what they can get charged for.
      And cops wonder why they don’t get the respect they used to?

      • …a minnesota somali already murdered a white woman in cold blood. He is not saying anything and still has not been charged, six months later…

        • Particularly infuriating. Any non-police who blew someone away because they were startled would be in jail awaiting trial.

      • Look up “No Hesitation” targets. This company manufactures targets depicting children, pregnant women, senior citizens, and other vulnerable people holding firearms. These targets are used by many police agencies to “desensitize” their officers and pretty much gives them “carte blanche” to shoot whatever they want, while using their magic “get out of jail free and get a paid vacation” card–“I feared for my life”. Wouldn’t it be nice if us mere citizens could use the same excuse and get rewarded for it?

    • Actually, being that he’s from South L.A. he’s more than likely a member of MS-13, which he most definitely looks the part.

      • Nah, no facial tats. No tats, no affiliation. Just some immature wise-ass with an anger management issue who plays Mr. Tough Guy on the other side of a computer screen.

      • No way. You ever seen an MS-13 member whose face wasn’t covered in tattoos? And, as much as I hate to say anything positive about such bloodthirsty bastards, if he was MS-13 he wouldn’t have called the cops to do his dirty work, he would have gone to the dude’s house himself with a machete. Which would still be more respectable than calling the state-sponsored death squads

    • If you remove the raw anger and the open call for killing cops near the end (neither of these attitudes help us get to where we want to be) the author of the article you link here has some good points.

      If this case follows the well-established norms, there will be an investigation, there may or may not be charges and a trial, but regardless, the outcome will be a finding that the officer acted reasonably given the circumstances and information he had at hand, at the time.

      That’s the problem. We need to figure out how to change this culture so that the information he had at hand, which was CLEARLY insufficient – since a factually innocent person was killed – is not determined to be a reasonable justification for the use of deadly force.

      As the article noted, our state of technology today completely obliterates our reliability on such indicators as Caller ID for ANY purpose, let alone justification for the use of deadly force.

      I hope this horrible disaster will be a spark that ignites large scale change in how law enforcement interacts with their employers, the citizens. I hope the right people with the right voices and reach can do just that.

      • Maybe we’ll stop calling for the death of cops when they stop murdering us, or start being held accountable for it when they do. Until then, fuck em

  9. I thought about it. ME: I wold yell thru the door (It’s glass I can see who’s outside) Identify your self, Why are you here. Police: ******** County sheriff/Swat We’re here because XXXXXX open the door. ME: OK, Can I secure my firearm In my room before i open the door, My wife and daughter are with me how do you want us to proceed?

    • They would yell police as soon as they blew your front door off the hinges. After they cap.your dog and zip tie you and the family they’ll ask why you called 911.

  10. Pretty sad state of affairs when the police aren’t held equally accountable for improper use of deadly force as law abiding citizens.

    I guess this is yet more proof of the wide gap of interpretation and consequence of breaking the law being unconstituionally different for law abiding citizens and the police…

    • Go look up the incident of Kelly Thomas. Four cops literally beat a defenseless man to death, it was ruled a homicide, they all walked. It was all caught on video, screaming “Help me dad” “I’m sorry” and on it went. There were weekly protests, city council members were recalled, and there was a federal investigation which was eventually dropped. The family received a settlement of $4m dollars from the city. To this day there has been zero accountability. It happened a few miles from where I live and I visit the scene of the crime every now and then..

      Their defense is that this is how they were trained to do their job. The jury bought it. This is why i don’t talk to the police, I exercise my 4th, 5th, and 6th amendment rights and say nothing.

      • The difference is those who don’t wear a badge and kill aren’t given months of paid vacation and a medal. And FYI, cops are civilians too

        • Doesn’t change the fact that you are agreeing the left wing gun grabbers argument that reduced capacity firearms will lead to less deaths. If you agree with that absurd notion then maybe you should hop on over to the democrats side.

  11. From what I’ve read he IS NOT A GAMER, had no involvement in the game .
    He was asked by one of the gamers to swat the other player .

    • That just doesn’t ring true. If your bud calls you up and says that some dude on a video game dissed him, “call up the Wichita PD and SWAT him for me”, would you do it or tell him to f*** off?

  12. The guy who made the call needs to go to prison, but so does the cop who did this. We can’t have cops shooting everyone who makes a “furtive movement” because a lot of the time it’s completely innocent. Cops are supposed to protect and serve, and shooting everyone who seems like they MIGHT be dangerous is counterproductive.

  13. I place this shoot directly on the SWAT cop. You don’t shoot BEFORE you see a weapon. The cop obviously was already pointing his weapon at the guy. The guy couldn’t get the “drop” on him and he was unarmed. SWAT is supposed to be the best your department has. Obviously not. Why the cop was there in the first place is a different issue.

    • If you’re a cop, that’s exactly what your training teaches you to do.
      Haven’t you paid any attention to the articles here on the great ‘kill everybody’ lessons from the Farce Science Institute?

      However, it doesn’t really matter to me what 800,000 cops teach each other to do, the laws regarding homicide are clear, and “just following training” does not override the law.

  14. They deusch bag denies any culpability… From another new report:


    Guy deserves the death penalty.

  15. The deep pockets on this debacle could run awfully deep.

    I wouldn’t even put it past the family of the deceased to go after Activision on this one. Not saying they’ll win, or should win, but i wouldn’t surprise me one bit if they did.

    • Don’t give them any ideas, they’ll be suing Glock or S&W or whoever the irresponsible gunmaker was who put that g un in the hands of a dangerous cop.

  16. So, disregarding the officer and the guy that made the swatting call for the moment, what happens to the third guy? Does he bear any legal responsibility/punishment for giving the caller an innocent persons address that ultimately lead to the death?

    • “Hey man, give me your address. Imma gonna f*** you up!” Uh, sure dude.

      Would YOU give the guy your real address? I sure as heck would NOT! That it just “common sense”!

      • Agreed, giving out your own address is insanely stupid. Yet that doesn’t even come close to resembling an answer to the question posed. Does giving an innocent party’s address to someone threatening swatting fall within criminal negligence making this person liable for the death as well?

        • Supplying the swatter with a real address seems like a crime to me. The guy doing so obviously believed that giving his own address would endanger himself, so he had to realize that it would endanger the people at the address he did give. I’d posit that he was at the very least was an accessory to murder.

  17. Ah…. that’s a stretch. He might bear some moral responsibility if he had any reason to think something might actually occur at the address he gave. But other than that? The biggest liability lies with the guys who pulled the trigger. They guy who made the SWAT call deserves to be pounded. But he’s still not the one who pulled the trigger. None of us would get a pass if we shot somebody who we thought was drawing on us and it turned out to be a wallet. Why should somebody who is supposedly a trained professional LEO get a pass?

  18. Sounds like a case of twitchy fucking cops. Stupid asses. They should go back to carrying .38 revolvers, instead of dressing up in wannabe ninja suits and carrying big boy weapons. Militarization of the police is a slippery slope.

        • Stop deflecting the point of my post. Demanding police carry six shot revolvers is as asinine as Diane Fienstine demanding we all turn in our ARs.

      • Wouldn’t be an issue if there was literally ANY accountability for those bastards. Or, to put it another way, we unwashed masses should be able to purchase what we want and be punished only if we use it to harm someone. The same SHOULD be true of cops, but since the ONLY way we’re getting any kind of accountability is a mass purge and rebuilding the entire justice system from the ground up, well, that’s obviously not going to happen. But it’s at least theoretically possible to reduce the degree to which they are armed.

        The abuse needs to stop, and given that we can’t hold them accountable, we need to find a more roundabout way to stop or at least reduce the amount of abuse. It’s not ideal, but it’s a unique issue whose arguments don’t apply AT ALL to the question of the proliferation of small arms in private hands. And if a bunch of cops quit over it, and PD’s have a hard time recruiting new ones, well, that’s just a side benefit. We don’t need more heavily armed leeches with legal immunity to write fucking speeding tickets

  19. I have to play devil’s advocate here. The police have to bear some responsibility, especially if the person answering the door was not armed. Too many cops have a “shoot first and ask questions later” attitude, as they are almost NEVER prosecuted for a “bad shoot”.
    Of course, the person who initiated the “swat” action should be tried and convicted for murder, as well…

  20. This swatting homo deserves the chair. Fry his ass so all these losers worldwide can watch and learn the real meaning of fear. Meanwhile this officer deserves serious punishment as well. We as a society need to start making very public and brutal executions again, to re-civilize it. Execution works, when it’s done in your face.

  21. I think it is well past the point we get rid of SWAT teams. They’re largely useless. They’ve produced none of the supposed results they’re supposed to, and they’ve clearly become a liability in most other situations.

    Get rid of them and their mentality, and train the average beat cops to a higher standard of performance.

  22. What is the chance that any cop organization will admit that the shooter here was in the wrong? I am unaware of anytime the “good” cops admitted that bad shoots should be prosecuted as a serious crime. I hope this is an oversight on my part.

    • I’ll join you. Can anyone find any instances of a good cop publicly condemning a very obviously bad shoot by another cop? I can’t. But 99% of them are “good” right? That’s what the bootlickers keep telling us….

      • Right. So your openly stating your going to go out and start murdering police officers? Maybe you need to be reported. The gun rights movement doesn’t need any psychopathic leftist lunatics like you destroying our cause.

      • Killing random/all cops would be stupid and evil. Cops that commit murder like this should be put down though, preferably with legal due process. That legal process is pretty unlikely to happen though, he/she will little doubt be found to have been following department procedure. No, I am not advocating that anyone extra judicially execute them but rather just positing that the murders (all of them, not just cops) earned it. No-one should have to sacrifice their lives to make it happen though. Voting for representatives that will remove cops immunity simply because they followed department procedure would be the much better way to deal with it. Ostracizing all police and court officers for protecting them might also be an appropriate response.

  23. Hey folks, you are missing the point here. The swatter is a scumbag & created the situation, but WATCH the police video.


    Hey Dan Zimmerman! Put up the damn video!

    This looks a lot like a police murder. If a citizen shot a person from the far side of the street, concealed by a truck, in the dark with a scoped rifle, they would be in jail making collect calls to the public defender’s office. What identifiable threat did the guy on the porch present to anyone 90 feet away?

    • Good link. Looks like they shone the flashlight on him, he moves his hand to block the glare from his eyes and the officer drops him. All from across the street. That footage is the difference in this part of the case.

    • ‘…with a scoped rifle…’

      Damn. I had imagined this going down at much closer range, but it looks like he opened the door and the ‘officer’ just immediately dropped him. Seriously hope the cop does some time over this. And his department, I mean the taxpayers, are out several million dollars for sure.

      However, if you SWAT someone, you HAVE to be aware that this could happen. Make an example out of both of them, IMHO.

    • Yeah that video ain’t pretty.

      Seems like nowadays the furtive motion defense is granted nearly infinite weight in justifying an OIS, so much that it pretty much overwhelms the totality of circumstances. Whereas IIUC it didn’t even really exist as a defense before the 70s or so.

      • Boy can’t you all see how much danger the cops were in if the guy did start shooting….a pistol…randomly into the dark….while being blinded by a searchlight….while being outnumbered 20-to-1 with guys wearng body armor and AR’s.

        F’ing Nazi SWAT gangs.

      • Forget “furtive motion”. We’re almost at “Well you see, the dead citizen had arms. Our officers were afraid he was going to move them. So, we shot him… for safety reasons.”

  24. How about some consequences for the cop who killed an innocent, unarmed man based on what was basically an anonymous phone call. If this is an example of the way we can expect interactions with the police to go then perhaps all citizens should take steps to protect ourselves from a fearful, incompetent police community.

  25. If anything, police should be held to a higher standard than that of the public…As it stands now, police can commit crimes with impunity because, in most situations, they investigate themselves…Behavior that would get an ordinary citizen charged, convicted and incarcerated is routinely ignored by “the powers that be” because police are considered to be “above the law” as the “law” is whatever they say it is, the Constitution be damned…
    Police officers are the only group that can murder someone by falsely claiming that “they feared for their lives”, have 48 to 72 hours to “get their stories straight”, and have a union lawyer and compliant prosecutor-steered “grand jury” absolve them of responsibility.
    Police demand immediate compliance (Israeli-style)–with two or three cops issuing and yelling out conflicting commands, it is easy to see how a person under police control could lose his life for merely attempting to follow conflicting directions.
    Ever notice that police unions are “fraternal”? This should tell you something. The “thin-blue-line” is a gang, little different than street gangs–at least when it comes to “covering-up” their questionable and quite often, illegal and criminal behavior.
    In today’s day and age, “officer safety” trumps de-escalation of force. This, in part, is due to the militarization of the police along with training in Israeli police tactics. This becomes a problem, with the “us vs. them” attitude that is fosters, along with the fact that Israel is a very different place, being on a constant “war footing”, its police tactics are very different.
    There are too many instances of police being “given a pass”, even when incontrovertible video and audio evidence is presented. Grand juries, guided by police-friendly prosecutors, quite often refuse to charge those police officers who abuse their authority.
    Police officers, who want to do the right thing, are quite often marginalized and put into harms way, by their own brethren…When a police officer is beating on someone that is already restrained while yelling, “stop resisting” THAT is but one reason police have a “bad name” in many instances…this makes the “good cops” who are standing around, witnessing their “brethren in blue” beating on a restrained suspect, culpable as well…
    Here are changes that can help reduce police-induced violence:
    1. Get rid of police unions. Police unions (fraternities) protect the guilty, and are responsible for the massive whitewashing of questionable police behavior that is presently being committed.
    2. Eliminate both “absolute” and “qualified” immunity for all public officials. This includes, prosecutors and judges, police and firefighters, code enforcement and child protective services officials, and others who deal with the citizenry. The threat of being sued personally would encourage them to behave themselves. Require police officers to be “bonded” by an insurance company, with their own funds. No bond= no job. You can bet that insurance companies would be more diligent in weeding out the “bad apples” than our present system…
    3. Any public funds disbursed to citizens as a result of police misconduct should come out of police pension funds–NOT from the taxpayers.
    4. Regular drug-testing of police officers as well as incident-based drug testing should take place whenever an officer is involved in a violent situation with a citizen–no exceptions.
    5. Testing for steroid use should be a part of the drug testing program. You know damn well, many police officers “bulk up” with the “help” of steroids. Steroids also affect users mentally as well, making them more aggressive. The potential for abuse of citizens increases greatly with steroid use.
    6. Internal affairs should only be used for disagreements between individual officers–NOT for investigations involving citizen abuse. State-level investigations should be mandatory for all suspected abuses involving citizens.
    7. Prosecutors should be charged with malfeasance IF any evidence implicating police officer misconduct is not presented to the grand jury.
    8. A national or state-by-state database of abusive individuals who should NEVER be allowed to perform police work should be established–a “blacklist” of abusive (former) police officers.
    9. Most people are unaware that police have special “rules” that prohibit them from being questioned from 48 to 72 hours. This allows them to “get their stories straight” and makes it easier to “cover up” bad police behavior. Police must be subject to the same laws as civilians.
    10. All police should be required to wear bodycams and utilize dashcams that cannot be turned off. Any police officers who causes a dash or body cam to be turned off should be summarily fired–no excuses. Today’s body and dash cams are reliable enough to withstand harsh treatment. Body and dashcam footage should be uploaded to a public channel “on the cloud” for public perusal.
    11. All interrogations must be video and audio recorded. Police should be prohibited from lying or fabricating stories in order to get suspects to confess. False confessions ARE a problem in many departments. Unknown to most people, police can lie with impunity while civilians can be charged with lying to police…fair? I think not…
    12. Any legislation passed that restricts the rights of ordinary citizens, such as firearms magazine capacity limits, types of weapons allowed, or restrictive concealed-carry laws should apply equally to police. No special exemptions to be given to police. Laws must be equally applied.
    13 “Asset forfeiture” is a form of “legalized robbery under color of law” and must be abolished. We must return to Constitutional principles when it comes to “crimefighting”. The so-called “war on drugs” is actually a “war on the citizenry” and has had an extremely corrosive effect on the Constitutional principles that our country is (supposed to be) founded on.
    14. “No-knock” raids must be abolished as they put both police and (especially citizens) in harms way. Even the Nazis “knocked on the door” before gaining entry.
    15. SWAT teams must be reigned in on their “dynamic entry techniques”. Utilizing SWAT teams for routine situations is dangerous to both police and citizens. Smashing everything in sight “just because they can”, blaming it on an “adrenaline rush” must end. There is NEVER a reason for destroying property.
    16. The “21 foot rule” must be modified or abolished. American police training assumes that ANYONE that gets within 21 feet of a police officer and is deemed a threat, even a non-life-threatening situation is “fair game” for the use of lethal force. Persons with rakes, sticks, knives, or even their fists have been executed, even when non-lethal means would have been more appropriate. Police hide behind the “21 foot rule” in order to justify questionable police shootings. Their “excuse”, when brought before a prosecutor or grand jury is “that is the way they are trained”. THAT has to change. Police have a greater responsibility NOT to use deadly force against those that they could easily subdue by other means.
    Police work is not inherently dangerous…there are many other professions that are much more dangerous.
    A little “Andy Taylor” could go a long way in allaying fears that citizens have of police.

  26. having been .Mil and LE I don’t understand the lack of accountability. If I fucked up in the .MIL I knew my ass was grass and I would get absolutely reamed, at best. LE side is backwards. You know its absolutely fvcked when I’m more likely to get jail time for improper use of force while making war and killing a foreign civ than I am killing a US citizen with improper or uncalled for force. If popo wanna play solider then they need to enlist or suck it up and accept some form of UCMJ type extra regulation/law. Be given the tools and training to fight wars or police fellow citizens should come with MORE responsibility, not less.

    Hell that LT that killed those “unarmed” Talib spotters on a motorbike got the slammer but this guy and the one from the hotel shooting probably won’t. The swatter and swat guy both need charges.

    • Hotel shooter Mitch Brailsford has already been tried and found not guilty by unanimous jury vote.

      IIRC, the judge determined that showing the jury the video of Brailsford’s victim crawling on the floor begging for his life would have prejudiced them against Brailsford and denied him his right as a police officer to be found not guilty.

      My modest solution to the ‘SWATting’ problem:
      SWAT every police chief and sheriff in the country who maintains a paramilitary hit team.
      The ones that get killed would die in the process of proving that they are not people we could trust to wield SWAT teams.

      • That would be extremely dangerous for the cop swatter. It is unethical to encourage someone else do it. You be partly responsible for what happened to them as well as the swatted.

      • While Vic is of course right, I like the sentiment expressed. If you can’t trust your SWAT team to properly handle a false call at your mother’s house, maybe you need to examine your program and make it better or abolish it. This logic could extend to all police interactions as well. If you wouldn’t trust your officers to correctly handle a stop or interaction with a loved one (who they officers didn’t know was related to a “somebody”) then perhaps you have an issue and need to fix it. Shame that this logic won’t become contagious

  27. Obviously, gamers need to have background checks. But, how long until someone drags the publisher or isp to court for damages?

    • I’m almost positive they did or at least tried already with Columbine. I seem to recall it being a big deal in the news at the time that they claimed were inspired by DOOM.

  28. I can admit that there is a legitimate reason for manning an maintaining SWAT teams. However, I see no reason why every little po-dunk city police force needs one. The same goes for Explosive Ordnance Disposal.

    If there is a legitimate need for SWAT it should be maintained at the County Level. (possibly State level for those Eastern-seaboard states that are smaller than counties). If the boys in blue get in trouble they can call the guys in khaki.

    At least Sheriffs are elected. Police departments generally don’t answer to anyone.

  29. I wonder whether the call the swatter made was broadcast to the field. The menstrual clot swatter must have been convincing. If it was, maybe adjustments in training could be made.

    I had a troop, who slit an Iraqi’s throat. He thought the guy was going to shoot our commander.

    Unfortunately, it turns out the Iraqi was a good guy. This troop had been on base for probably less than 72 hours. His first”combat” deployment.

    My point is that there could be other factors. Heck I HOPE there are other factors…

  30. This is why I support the Death Penalty. It is always successful at preventing a person from continuing to swatt people.

  31. I usually defend the police, if I believe they were right to do what they did…but in this case, I cannot. Using the excuse that the officer was scared, nervous, wanted to go home to his family, etc, should not be used when the officer kills an innocent unarmed man. LEO’s are trained to handle those stressful situations and to deescalate. The average civilian is not. Chances are, the civvy has never had anyone point a gun at his face, especially not guns held by a bunch of dudes yelling and screaming, who look like they just left a soldier of fortune photo shoot. If the officer is scared, how scared do you think this poor guy was? And to be killed simply because you are nervous and scared, and accidentally made the wrong move, is just wrong. Anyone, LEO or not, who kills an innocent person because you are “scared”, is just a coward.

  32. It’s nice that the government has so much power now that they can just show up and shoot you for no reason, with no consequences.

    Death penalty for the swatter.


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