There’s a Right Way and and Wrong Way to Handle a Defensive Gun Use

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  1. Police protect criminals more than the law abiding. Question is if the police know/care about that dichotomy. The courts are more dangerous than some criminals.

    Shame one needs to debate the right and wrong ways about defending you and yours.

    • It’s not the beat cops that are making these decisions, it’s partisan (usually leftoid) DA and local governments that are telling the cops to make these decisions.

    • The US is the only “civilized” country that threatens woth law to turn its law abiding citizens into criminals for simply acting lawfully and exercising their rights while at the same time ensuring the rights of criminals are upheld in law.

      • The United Kingdom has entered the chat, and while they’re here they want to issue you a citation for your state-unapproved use of the word “booger” in your handle.

    • THe Police are NOT Judge and Jury they only administer the LAW they do not make it. You, the electorate, make the law through an elected legislature. It’s called DEMOCRACY.
      The Police in general terms is only as effective as the electorate want and enable it to be. In any real Democracy with the Police can only operate by the consent and the co-operation of the people it serves and they are as subject to the lawa as any other citizen. Unfortunately is seems to us in the UK that the US Police are too often swayed by public opinion and you can trace that back to having ELECTED Police Officials from the Local Sherrif to the City Police Chiefs having an eye on the next round of elections.
      Anybody who is in an elected post can, if the checks and balances are not properly in place be ‘bought’ in one way or another. Money elects US and other Presidents that’s for sure. And it’s money mainly from, but not exclusively so, from the ARMS MANUFACTURERS and the wider civil firearms industry that is preventing America from implementing far more stringent gun control measures by buying ‘off’ parts of the judiciary, the SENATE and COngress and no doubt people like Donald Trump.
      Here in the UK the electoral system if s far from perfect but any Parliamentary candidate is severely resatriucted as to how much he or she can spend on an electioin campaign and every MP has to delare income and contributions.
      You may have been made aware that our UK Prime Minister will be subjected to a Leadership Election because his Parliamentary Party had become dissatisfied with his PRIVATE LIFE and PERSONAL MORALLITY and that another leader of the TORY [CONSERVATIVE] Party will be elected and automatically becomes Prime Minister. He has not ‘lost it’ because of his POLITICAL PERFORMANCE. Boris Johnson had the strongest POLITICAL and PERSONAL MANDATE of any PM since Mrs Thatcher second term as PM. That’s what happens in the uK if you get too bloody g big for your boots!!
      Boris Johnson like Mrs THatcher has not been dismissed by the electorate but by his own Parliamentary Party —

      • Al
        The USA isn’t a democracy we’re a Constitutional Republic. If you can’t even get the basics right STFU.

      • FIRST OF ALL, Albert L J Hall, British Communist, the US is not a “democracy?” Nor is Great Britain, The US is a REPUBLIC. And Great Britain is a “Constitutional Monarchy.” Your Constitution is a series of laws that started with Magna Carter.
        SECOND, A police chief is appointed by and answerable to a national or local government, with the main exception being elected sheriffs in the United States.
        THIRD, It is the American CITIZENS that are preventing further “gun control” measures. For us, “gun control is a good two hand old on our pistol or rifle with proper sight alignment.
        FORTH, you are as big a Dunderhead as dacian or MINOR Miner49er

        • In other words, Albert Hall’s reply is pure, unadulterated balderdash. Sheriffs are elected by the people, so tend to be accountable thereto. Police chiefs are appointed by bureaucrats and so are accountable essentially to the “establishment.” The Second Amendment is absolute, whether or not it hurts anyone’s feelings.

  2. Well, I’ll tell ya, here in Mayberry, our bodies don’t spread blood everywhere when you drag them around.

      • Paul, you just described about 2/3 of the guys I worked with. No kidding. We all used to laugh at that “drag him inside” thing. If it was hunting season, odds are one of us had recently drug a deer. Kinda looks the same.

        • “They say in combat you don’t rise to the occasion, you sink to the level of your training and experience. Honest, officer, I was acting on instinct when I gutted him.”

    • I know a cop who specifically said do not do that. Forensics has gotten good enough that it will not fool them, and you become the prime suspect.

  3. Almost all stranger to stranger homicides remain unsolved. If at all possible, shoot, scoot rather than shovel. and shut up.

    • About 87% of them remain unsolved,. Sometimes they get lucky and get a little closer in those but extreamly rare they actually find the killer.

      Of the killers they do know and can find, only about 8% actually get arrested because they have enough evidence and about 3% of those get convicted.

      If its any consolation, its about the same overall in every country. Varies a little in % but overall about the same.

      Stranger on stranger murder is one of the hardest crimes to solve.

      • Overall… nation wide in the US….

        In 1985 over 50% of rapes, robberies, and assaults (collectively) were committed by strangers. The arrest rate for those was 16% and the conviction rate was 7%.

        In 1997 slightly over 60% of rapes, robberies, and assaults (collectively) were committed by strangers. The arrest rate for those was 13% and the conviction rate was 4%.

        In 2021 almost 75% of rapes, robberies, and assaults (collectively) were committed by strangers. The arrest rate for those was about 10% and the conviction rate was less than 2%.

        In 2021 criminals used a little over 40% fewer guns in the commission of stranger on stranger rapes, robberies, and assaults (collectively). The preferred weapon for these were a combination of knives and hands.

        • On average nation wide, 33% of murders annually are determined to be suicide because there is no qualified medical person available at the time to differentiate between non obvious signs of murder vs suicide. Only 9% of these are investigated after its later determined to have been murder and not suicide. Poisoning is the most common non obvious sign of murder among these, staged hanging is second, staged gun suicide is third, staged drug overdose is fourth.

        • On average nation wide, around 60% of suicide by gun is later determined to have been accidents or murder. If muder, less than 8% of them are investigated and perpetrators caught, the conviction rate of those 8% is 12%.

          22 of 50 states do not report these changes in the case to state or federal stats databases, thus they remain in states and federal stats databases as gun suicides when in reality they were either accidents or murders.

        • What are the statistics on Arkancide by a Clinton? You know the ones I mean – suicides who shoot themselves in the back of the head 3 times. I think arrest and conviction rates are just about zero?

        • As of April 2022 – in the United States, there are an estimated ~11,000 stranger-on-stranger serial killers active. ~70% of these are active in states with democrat dominated government.

          As of April 2022, for stranger-on-stranger serial killers: California, New York, Illinois, and New Jersey lead the nation in the number of stranger-on-stranger serial killers active in the states with California having the most at ~2,233 stranger-on-stranger serial killers active in the state. South Dakota has the fewest number of active stranger-on-stranger serial killers at ~8. California had the most victims of stranger-on-stranger serial killers at ~1,716 and has the most unsolved stranger-on-stranger violent crimes of which less than 4% are investigated.

          The dominate methods of the stranger-on-stranger serial killer are the more non-obvious murder methods such as poisoning or events staged to look like suicide or accident, sometimes they get more hands on with more obvious methods like a cutting/stabbing ‘implement’ of some type. Its estimated that ~30% of stranger-on-stranger serial killers are female.

          note: ‘active’ used here means stranger-on-stranger serial killers are either actively killing OR they are still not caught – it does not mean that are all actively killing as of April 2022.

          Not all serial killers are stranger-on-stranger serial killers. Of those who are not stranger-on-stranger serial killers but are serial killers the FBI estimates there are between 30 – 50 overtly actively killing in the United States at any given time.

          The threat you can not see can be just as dangerous as the threat you can see. Unfortunately, our law enforcement in the United States, and basically the world, is really bad at solving crimes committed by the threat they can not see. Which is why stranger-on-stranger violent crimes go mostly unsolved with stranger-on-stranger murder being the most unsolved.

          note: stranger-on-stranger serial killers = basically, those that are suspected but for which no legally actionable evidence that would result in a conviction has been found tying them directly to the crime and were random strangers to the victim.

        • So thus end’s for now – an outline of the threat you don’t see bought fourth but results in an increase in general lawlessness that law enforcement and government do not pursue.

      • Overall, of all the violent crime in the United States annually; less than 9% is represented in crime stats. Of those represented in stats, ~88% of the perpetrators are not arrested and about 2% are convicted. Of all the victims of violent crime annually, less than 13% are represented in stats because no convictions have happened. Of all the victims of violent crime not represented in stats and all the violent crime not represented in stats …. ~3% of those crimes were committed with a gun.

  4. Aren’t you supposed to keep an old machete around so you can stage it with the corpse?

    That is what I have heard.

    Wink, wink.

    • “Actually, I don’t see what harm it could cause to drag the body back inside.”

      “Tampering with evidence” is something that could put you in prison for a long, long, *long* time… 🙁

      • You hope the police conclude that you are an upstanding fellow, who shot a lousy perp because he had to. Starting them off with the impression that you are lying and altering the evidence is not a good beginning toward that end.

    • “Actually, I don’t see what harm it could cause to drag the body back inside.”

      You could hurt your back or need to explain it to a neighbor or passersby.


      • Besides all that, do you know how hard it is to drag a dead body? This isn’t like the movies, it’s a bitch! And then you have a smear mark and then the cops show up and spray the place with Luminol and then when the lies don’t match up with the facts, well that’s just no good. It’s just better to say you were defending yourself then STFU….or in other terms, lawyer up, call Saul, just don’t talk to the cops PERIOD. They are not just curious or your friend.

        • I attended a Firefighter’s training class where a fellow firefighter mentioned he would have carried the victim out of the building.
          I stood up and said “No one in this room can pick me up”. I was 6′ tall, about 225 pounds. I then went into a dead faint and fell to the floor, totally relaxed. The strongest guy felt up to the challenge. He gave up after a few minutes.
          A relaxed body (i.e. unconscious) adult is very difficult to pick up. You have to drag them.

    • If you live in Uvalde and drag the body back inside then shut the door the police will never discover the body. So no problem.


    • Also, why wouldn’t you drag the body inside, then back outside, so you could claim you had drug it outside because it was messing up your carpet.

      P.S. I am not a lawyer, this is not legal or even probably good advice…

  5. Not sure where that particular point of view may have been generated but I doubt seriously that it represents the norm in how people handle self-defensis shootings. What perhaps should be a focus on here is the manner in which Alec Baldwin’s negligent homicide case is being handled. This is a cut and dry case of negligent homicide, and he is yet to be charged despite admitting the shooting, making a phony excuse for what happened, having eyewitnesses to what happened including the other fellow injured in the shooting, and being one of the co-producers responsible for all the rules broken on the set of Rust. This incident happened over 9 months ago and the excuses for not charging him range from its an ongoing investigation to they are waiting for a forensic analysis of the firearm and bullet.
    Everyone knows he shot the gun; a simple test would show the gun is functional, the bullet is fairly inconsequential, and you don’t need the FBI to analyze it as there are other local crime labs that could have done that. New Mexico is a blue state and they are delaying any charges because they are hoping people will forget about it. This is the type of thing that is more dangerous than the topic of this article. There cannot be selective justice based on a person’s political preferences.

    • I dont like Baldwin however I believe who ever handed him the gunm is at fault.
      Never been on a movie set but I bet theres rules about messing with a gunm after the prop man hands it to you?

      • I disagree. Being a background actor and having been killed MANY times on TV, having just been in a documentary called “The Fight Before Christmas” where I was carrying a functional revolver on set, it is EVERYONE’S responsibility to show or otherwise insure a weapon is either a look-a-like fake or is safe. That involves displaying the weapon and if a revolver, showing everyone involved the cylinder is indeed empty or with the SAA revolver which I own, the weapons loading gate should have been opened, put on half-cock and the rounds removed and PROVEN and SHOWN to be squib rounds or otherwise a non-live round. Alec Baldwin WAS 100% negligent. He was at the helm and he failed. HE PULLED the trigger!! If I was pointing a gun at someone, I’d know for a fact if the gun is real or not and if it’s real, is the darn thing loaded or not or otherwise disabled. I would KNOW FOR A FACT and not take some twits word for it. When it comes to gun safety, I trust myself!!
        Don’t be pointing a gun at me and saying….”oh it’s unloaded” BS!!

      • It is important to note that, in the case of the discharge of a weapon, whether intentional or otherwise, the “four rules of gun safety” apply to the person handling the weapon at the time, and to no one else, and to that person exclusively, just to put a fine point on it.

  6. The first and most important fact to take to heart is this.
    What happens to you after a ‘defensive gun usage’ depends
    FAR more on the political beliefs and agenda of the prosecutor/DA
    in your location than on ANY of the facts involved or actions you
    may take.

  7. Don’t live in a place where you feel like you have to do anything to further justify your correct actions

    • I dont know where that would be.
      Maybe way out there on one of them cattle ranches or a southern swamp.
      Pitcher Oklahoma has a lot of abandoned mine shafts.


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