The gun control crowd almost fixated on banning large capacity handgun magazines. You know: the big-ass “clip” that spree killer Jared Lee Loughner used in the Tuscon massacre. When that didn’t fly, they retrenched into “fixing the gun show loophole.” In other words, they focused their energies on championing legislation that would prevent private individuals from selling private property to other private individuals without the federal government’s notification, taxation and, eventually, intercession. Good luck with that. Not. Meanwhile, how about a little help guys? Seems that we have a BIG problem with illegal immigrants that could lead to a lot of “illegal guns” on the streets . . .
An Associated Press investigation has found that addresses of dozens of the same businesses and homes across New Mexico were used over and over again by people to get driver’s licenses in a pattern that suggests potential fraud by immigrants trying to game the system.
In one instance, 48 foreign nationals claimed to live at a smoke shop in Albuquerque to get a license. In another case, more than a dozen claimed to live at an automotive repair shop over a one-year period. The scenario has been repeated at other addresses since New Mexico changed its law in 2003 to allow illegal immigrants to get the same driver’s license as a U.S. citizen – one of just two states allowing that.
Republican Gov. Susana Martinez is pressing the Legislature to scrap the law because of public safety concerns about widespread fraud. She contends New Mexico has become a magnet for out-of-state immigrants seeking a license, which can be used to board airplanes, conduct financial transactions or get another license in some other state. The governor’s proposal will be considered by a legislative committee on Thursday.
Notice what’s missing from that list of activities illegal immigrants may pursue once they have a state driver’s license, or two? I’m thinking . . . purchase a firearm. Or several firearms.
Remembering that Uncle Sam’s mandatory pre-purchase National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) doesn’t check for U.S. citizenship. In fact, clock the word “optional” in bold letters in the box on ATF Form 4473 marked Social Security Number.
Having an address in New Mexico is a critical part of getting a license. Applicants without a Social Security number must prove their identity with multiple documents such as a passport or notarized English translation of a foreign birth certificate. They also must show New Mexico residency with other documents, including property lease agreements, utility bills and bank statements. Of the more than 90,000 licenses issued so far to foreign nationals, it’s impossible to know how many are illegal immigrants because the state doesn’t ask a person’s immigration status.
Don’t get me wrong. I’m all in favor of changing the legal immigration system to allow illegal immigrants a path to citizenship. And thus, gun rights. Seeing as the right to self-defense is a human right and all.
But if gun grabbers believe that criminals buying firearms at gun shows is a larger problem than “undocumented Americans” purchasing weapons from gun stores using an illegally obtained ID, I’m thinking they’ve missed the boat. Again.
I mean, gun control advocates prattle on about the possibility of terrorists purchasing firearms in the U.S. Did they forget that Mohammed Atta secured a Florida driver’s license that allowed him to fly on passenger planes without attracting the attention of the authorities?
Oh and Washington state has the same issues with illegal immigrants and drivers licenses. And not to go all Colombo on you, one more thing . . .
To combat crime in general and illegal firearms in specific, gun control advocates might want to take a stand against the California bill ordering cops to ignore U.S. immigration law as well. Just sayin’.
Thanks for bringing this to our attention, Robert. I didn’t realize fake driver’s licenses were so easy to get. And yes indeed, this has grave ramifications for the illegal gun market.
So, who is to say that a “firearms license” would be any different?
The license isn’t fake, only the information given to procure it is. South Carolina was the other state foolish enough not to make sure those here illegally, the invaders, are not applying for the gateway document to living here against the law.
they are not fake – they are the real deal, that’s the problem. most of the 9/11 hijackers had VA drivers licenses.
Good point. Removed the reference in the original post.
At the time in Virginia (I believe it has since changed), it a terrorist wanted a license all he needed to do was have another terrorist who already had license go to the DMV with him and swear that he knew the guy. To top it off, if the first terrorist didn’t know how to read or write in English he can (still) have the second terrorist “translate” the test for him.
I think voter fraud is a more certain goal of this process, not firearms possession.
I agree Skyler. But, having a valid driver’s license can open the door to other fradulent activities.
The liberals will gain the votes and then have ammunition to propose more “sensible” gun control legislation when–not if– firearms are purchased. It’s win-win for the anti’s.
It all stinks and politicians are scared to death to do what’s necessary to stop this practice.
No, its most likely for employment reasons: Its trivial to fake a social security card, but you need a GOOD fake drivers license for employment, as both are checked for the immigration form. And also so you don’t get deported when pulled over by the cops, since they actually check that a license is valid by calling it in, so a fake ID is useless.
Its really REALLY lousy for voter fraud: if you want to conduct voter fraud, you don’t need ID, and even if you did, a few votes are worthless: fraud which counts takes place in the counting operation.
I myself think gaining the ability to drive and fly, provide identification, is the goal in seeking the licenses. The fraud about one’s address is done to make it possible. All the other frauds, voting, gun purchase, medical treatment, etc. flow from the one big fraud. The laws should have never allowed licenses without providing accurate SSN’s, because every citizen, and legal permanent resident by law is required to have an SSN from the age of two (certain limitations apply). Other folks have their home-country passport to identify them. The law is just a result of farmers, housewives, and sweat-shop owners wanting their laborers to have a ride. MikeyB: Have you been living in a cave? “I didn’t realize…”
They need to either secure the Mexican border or start some kind of more lenient immigration process to encourage Mexicans to come to America legally. In an ideal world they will do both.
We need more people in America who are ready, willing and able to become Americans. Being an American means a certain set of civic principles that have to be nurtured and promoted.
We do not need people moving from one country and transplanting their civic principles here.
Exactly so. Thank you, Mr. McNabb for stating what should be obvious.
Tim, does that “certain set of civic principles that have to be nurtured and promoted,” include the fact that gun ownership is a natural human right, that raped women cannot abort and that the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan were good?
Typical red herring, MikeyB: Our civic culture, our laws and responsibilities, do not require personal position on abortion, only factual compliance with current law. For a given foreign war our constitution merely directs which agency of government has the power to declare war, Congress: Nothing prevents a person from having an opinion for or against. I’m sure you’ve mastered the culture that is Italy, where they say “Taxes? That’s the other guy’s problem!” and in which crime is the only thing that’s organized south of Milano.
Troll food: How about a person who commits no criminal acts, participates in society in a functional way and contributes to the overall welfare of the community by maintaining employment. FLAME DELETED
Tired argument, but throwing the word rape around tends to get people their way. Sadly this and medical necessity only account for a fraction of the staggering number of abortions every year in the US,. Mostly they are irresponsible people seeking an easy out, and nobody can argue that stopping this would not allow exceptions for rape and medical necessity. If any of the majority had any sense of personal responsibility they wouldn’t put themselves in the position of “needing” one.
Illegal purchase of guns isn’t the first thing I thought of, Motor Voter was.
The first thing I thought of was having a valid driver’s license might deflect people from asking for a green card or passport. Not only that, but it’s useful for opening a bank account, using a credit card, buying plane tickets and any time “valid ID” is required.
Voter fraud would be well down the list in my estimation. It’s really only useful for voter fraud if the state demands ID when you vote, and most states do not. Voter fraud is far easier in states that allow same-day registration and don’t require photo ID.
Fake ID is hilariously easy to get thanks to the illegal immigrant trade. Go to Las Vegas, NV with about $1200 bucks in your hand and you can have an ID package within a couple days.
The immigration raids on the meat packing plant in Greeley, CO a few years back were prompted when the ID thieves boosted the ID of an INS agent with a hispanic surname in Colorado… and this led to an investigation of the ID mill, which led to the arrest of those who purchased ID’s. A lot of good people are getting their ID’s and credit histories mangled due to this trade in illegal ID’s.
Go to Las Vegas, NV with about $1200 bucks in your hand and you can have an ID package within a couple days.
That’s not a bad deal. Most people who go to LV with $1200 in their hands come back with zilch.
The main reason for the driver’s license shenanigans is voter fraud. Our governor is trying to crack down on the practice of giving everyone with an “ez” on the end of their name a license whether or not they can prove residence or citizenship (but if you are white and from out of state, they’ll give you a nice bit of the bureaucratic runaround,)
Yes, they probably buy guns with the license, as well. Or by private sale.
Interesting that Full Faith and Credit requires honoring the permit to drive, but somehow not other kinds of permits.
That’s because driving a car is a privilege, while bearing arms is a right.
Hey, wait a minute . . . .
My personal faith in the American voter has actually been destroyed by their common ability to get lost in empty arguments about something as simple as accurate ID provision and rules of legal residence. Everyone against well-validated tamper-resistant ID is, in my experience, for some particular form of crime. It doesn’t matter to me whether they want cheap illegal farm labor, easy immigration for their cousins, or the ability to hide for years while still transacting business in the US. There is no motive that does not involve a petty personal interest in the violation of some law. The BS about “papers please!” identification with Nazis was always Hollywood myth-making. Nazi’s didn’t need to see your papers to throw you into a camp. Mere appearance was enough in many cases. Good ID works in Sweden and Switzerland. The “fight the ID” bit is just another game people play. An idiotic game. In a nation which is building national identification registries based on credit and finger prints, your information is already known, including what you bought last year and what countries you’ve traveled to. Isn’t it time we accepted a piece of tamper-resistant ID so we the little guys (as opposed the FBI) can know who we are really dealing with in a transaction?
I am continually amazed by the people I encounter in my life, people I already know, who are staunchly against voter ID. I can usually determine in advance how people are going to fall on the gun issue, and some others, but not voter ID. People I know to be rational, logical people have surprised me greatly on several occasions by their immediate negative reaction when the subject of voter ID comes up. The most common line I hear in response, in almost always exactly the same words is, “Voter identification laws have traditionally been used to great effect in voter suppression,” and it goes downhill from there. Maybe it’s my lack of debate skills, but I’ve never managed to get any of these people to budge off their positions.
Well, the reason why they won’t budge is that they’re correct. Voter ID laws *do* suppress voting, especially by those people who are metabolically challenged.
This could have highly deleterious consequences to elections in places like Chicago….
Wife worked in Head Start with a Latino who encouraged the illegals to send their kids to the class. Wife had to do follow up visits and the counterfeit documents these Latinos had was extensive and authentic looking. The illegals even had real drivers license, just usually no insurance. Most of this was not necessarily malicous as these people really wanted to work, but many would arrange to get US Government assistance in addition. I suppose if they had good enough ID, they could buy guns.
I do know that they had a case in Texas of a gun show where an OFWG and Vietnam Vet sold a Mexican (who had a fake Texas drivers license) a gun and was entrapped by the BATF. The OFWG is looking at 5 years labor in a Federal Pen. The Mexican walked free out of the court room.
There’s nothing to do between Driver license and buying a gun , They Can’t run a background check just with a DL , so please don’t hate just appreciate! and read more before your racist comments…