In January, we wrote of the Senior Citizen Defender, a laser-equipped, horizontal forward grip for pistols. The device is an assist tool for people with manual dexterity or mobility problems. Mounted with a laser to a soft-shooting Ruger Mark IV pistol, it’s an effective firearm for those with hand and strength issues.
The Defender is now on sale, through telephone orders using the number given on the web site. It was still in the latter stages of development in January, so having a product ready to ship now is fast work.
At this time, they are selling the complete system: Defender, Ruger Mark IV 22/45 pistol (model 40107), laser, and batteries (they even include ten targets). The list price is $499, which sounds fairly reasonable given the stand-alone price of the firearm; shipping is free. Since the system includes the pistol, you will need a local FFL to receive it.
The company notes that, “Because of the run on gun purchases we do not have a large number of units available,” so you may want to get your order in now.
At this time, they are not selling stand-alone SCD/lasers. Mike, with the company, says that the SCD only works with the model 40107 Ruger and not older Mk IVs. They may sell kits to FFLs later so they can mount them on their own 40107s and resell them.
It would seem some amount of familiarization is necessary in order to routinely bring the laser effectively on target, in a timely fashion.
I originally had a laser on my Ruger SR9c because I worked nights quite a bit.
I found that if you once sighted the laser in on the range it was no trick to find and hit the target with it and no training required. If that red dot was on the target (within about 10 yards) THAT was where the bullet was going to hit.
I still have that laser, but I took it off during a tactical pistol class when the instructor showed me that with the proper technique and stance I was faster in daylight without it.
It takes less time to find the front sight, put it on target and squeeze the trigger than it does to try and locate that red dot in daylight – it’s just a distraction.
I can see where it would be an advantage for an older or disabled person, however. Dot on bad guy, shot on bad guy. Simple.
“Dot on bad guy, shot on bad guy.”
Agree. Just pondering the efficiency of an older person in quickly adjusting arms and hands to get on target quickly, without a little bit of hand-eye coordination practice. And that thought is based on watching the light shows at the range as people try out their new laser-equipped guns.
I think you’re painting all senior citizens in a light that they are uniformly frail physically, their reactions dulled to the point of ineffectiveness. While some may well be in that state in their 90’s, THIS senior citizen was an active search and rescue tech on call until last year, who shoots 3 days a week and competes in IPSC. I don’t think you need to unduly worry about us having adequate hand/eye coordination. The vast majority have been around long enough they’re unlikely to become panic stricken and hysterical with an imprending threat; we didn’t live to a ripe old age through panic. We’ll be much more inclined to put the laser between the BG’s eyes and put 10 SUPPORTED and controlled rounds there
“I think you’re painting all senior citizens in a light that they are uniformly frail physically, their reactions dulled to the point of ineffectiveness.”
Actually, keyed off the subject of the video, who supposedly had not ever fired a gun. Beginning there, the true newbie, my thought was that the laser itself would not be as effective an assist fo new, older shooters, without some practice bringing the laser on target from several resting positions. Experienced shooters probably would not be presented with the same dynamics.
Cheers,
Too bad there isn’t a stand alone kit that doesn’t require an FFL.
I have elderly parents and a Mark III 22/45 they could use.
Wondering if the accessory would work on my Mark I.
Interesting…being a “senior citizen” I can see the utility. No problem at all with handling an AR or semiautomatic pistol. But I do have a very good female family friend with grip problems & mobility issues. Getting old sux as she grew up with guns in Colorado cowboy country…F
I’ve always wanted Ruger to bring out a Mark series type pistol in a larger caliber like 9mm. I think they’d sell like crazy. It would be sort of a Luger wannabe but still, it would be cool.
I don’t think an all steel Luger sized 9mm would do so well in this market that favors concealed carry guns. Especially not if it’s a single stack.
Maybe not.
But dang it, if Ruger (ARE YOU LISTENING!!!) would come out with a 22mag Mark iv pistol and/or 10/22wmr rifle they would sell like hot cakes to the POTG.
I have spoken.
Didn’t Ruger make a lever action .22mag based off the 10/22?
The 94-22 if memory serves.
22 WMR 10/22 Take Down would be cool..Heck I pretty much like anything Ruger makes. I have a Mark II with the long bull barrel target model..
They made a 10/22 Magnum from 1998-2006. Apparently didn’t sell like hot cakes, or they’d still be making them.
There are good reasons why there’s only been, what, three or four semiauto .22 mag autoloader pistols on the market, ever, and only one currently. It is a terrible cartridge for an autoloader, made worse by the very limited time to build up gas pressure in a pistol.
you can find those. savage has a22 and a17.
If it were built with the same quality, I’d snap it up.
In America we have a growing number of folks that decided to not have kids for one reason or another. That means no grandkids. Which leads to people growing older without a support system.
If you’re alone in the world at 70+ and have no close family net you need to think hard about how to protect yourself. A tricked out .22 is better than a threat to call 911.
You also need to vote for pols that will not impede, even encourage you, in your efforts to tool up for your protection.
Got a brother in Floriduh who turned 69 today. Fractured several vertabra in a fall a few months ago. Married no kid’s on purpose. But he is the very definition of a libtard. Worshiped Obama(😩). Horse to water…nope. I believe he would die before he thinks I’m right about anything. And there’s a lot of old idiot’s out there.
You too? I have a hippy dippy liberal brother and has little kids he does not want around my kids with nerf guns, because they’re guns. He would have had a fit if he knew I concealled carrried to family gatherings.
Just had a great idea!
Partner with Medic Alert (Help! I’ve fallen and I can’t get up!) to include one of their alert devices in the weak-hand grip.
Pop off a few at the bad guy and call for help at the same time.
Fun fact: I sold versions of life alert some 30 years ago. Vitalink & H.E.L.P. company(home emergency life protection). Fairly obsolete with smart phones,emergency tracking and GPS all the rage. My 45 year son tell’s me he had a video chat with his 80 something grandparents right before I talked to him today. Brave New World Cliff…
I’ve got a bell on my wheel chair. Just watch what happens when I push it.
If I ever wind up in a wheelchair I want spring blades on the wheels and a scabbard for my war ax and my bow.
You would have the advantage of surprise, as most people don’t expect folks in wheelchairs to be dangerous, except for running over their toes. The downside is, if you live in an area that values drunks and junkies, or near low income minorites, then the wheelchair makes you a target, kind of why you dont put handicap plates on a vehicle.
My buddy in a chair, carries 5-5.7 mags, 3 for his bug pocket 9mm, 5 inch fixed blade knife by his support hand, and a rifle plate under his cushion. A distraction of tipping backwards would be used on a junkie or state thug, with a drawn weapon. His backpack has all sorts of stuff as well.
Plus, he can take rounds below the belly button and stay in the fight. He has no option to retreat, which means he is calm under fire, as his adrenaline rush is geared to removing the evil coward in front of him, over running for cover.
It would be cheaper to buy a S&W 15-22 than to buy a Ruger pistol and this plastic POS.
I’m a big fan of the Ruger MK 1-4 pistols. I think they are one of the best .22 pistols you can buy for a reasonable price. I just don’t think they are the best option in this case.
The S&W 15-22 pistol, if still made, plus a laser would be at around $500. But which would be easier to chamber a round?
The Hunter Mark iv pistol model w/ the 6” barrel IF IT WERE CHAMBERED IN 22wmr would be a great SD gun.
Maybe a little loud, but with we seniors I’m not sure that would matter.
Brings the question to mind, since I have never handled the Mark IV…
It is probably a blow-back system. Can the .22 WMR be used in a blow-back or would the locking mechanism need to be redesigned?
What about a Ruger 57? Better ammo reliability and more capacity in a lightweight pistol. And soon enough Ruger will do a 57 Charger. That’ll be the bees knees for those with strength and dexterity issues.
They will certainly need hearing aids after firing that loud sumbitch in the house.
Charging a Ruger mark bolt requires a fairly high level of dextarity. Something like a Ruger PC charger makes way more sense. If 9mm is too much the 10/22 Charger also available. And you can add a pistol brace to provide more stability if needed.
This…
“ halo” Charging Ring for the Ruger® Mark IV™, Mark III™ & 22/45”
at…
https://www.tandemkross.com/halo-Charging-Ring-for-the-Ruger®-Mark-IV™-Mark-III™-2245™_p_294.html
That is a wonderful idea. I think that would work by golly. And it’s on sale, it can be purchased. At this moment I am a pissed of possum. I haven’t acquired a firegunm for quite a while.,years, decades. Money. Impulse buy, what the hell, no I needs to it,. And like a kid in a candy store, there I stood, they’re outta Tootsie Rolls.
The candy store would never run out of tootsie rolls because tootsie rolls are terrible
Candy corn, corn nuts, tootsie rolls, gummy bears….who eats that nasty shit?
Really on including gummy bears? You’ve said a lot of inane shit on this site but man, saying Gummy Bears are in the same class as Candy Corn is really top of the shit-list.
kandy korn gets really nasty once jessica is done with it. or at least i always fingered it would.
if you’re stuck at home as though you’re quarantined you can always read the amazon reviews for the sugar free gummi bears. some value there.
what i want to know is who the hell eats those weird orange circus peanuts? guilty pleasure? expose yourself.
tsb. I forgot about those vile things.
gummydude. Gummybears are nothing but recycled condoms with some sugar in them. Enjoy.
How about a Kel-Tec PMR30… 30 rounds of .22 magnum ready to go in case you need a few extra shots to get your home invading opponent(s) to take you seriously, and there is a nice big rail under the barrel to mount a horizontal handle / light / laser pointer onto much like shown in the video above.
A .22 WMR 40 – 50 grain projectile traveling at ~1900 – 2250 fps may not be up there with 55 grains of .223 zipping along at 3000+ fps (AR-15), but it would sure beat heck out of a standard .22LR 40 gr at only ~1250 fps or so. And still nice & easy almost completely recoil free fun. A properly equipped 30 rounds of high speed get-the-hell-out-of-my-house could be handy for someone with grip and/or mobility issues, hopefully with rounds to spare unless a small damn army breaks in…
Just thinkin’ out loud…
Pa John,
I like your train of thought. Let’s take it to the next logical step: convert the PMR30 handgun into a super lightweight carbine with 16-inch barrel.
And when I say lightweight, I mean it. Make the barrel as thin and light as possible, even using carbon fiber over a super thin metal tube if necessary to reduce weight while maintaining the minimum necessary barrel strength to maintain structural integrity. Next, omit any fore-end grip or, if the super lightweight barrel is just too ridiculously thin to hold, include a hyper-skeletonized fore grip. Finally, add a super light skeletonized butt stock. And — voila! — you have a carbine that probably weighs no more than three pounds and should be pretty easy to handle for senior citizens with strength/dexterity deficits.
That three pounds should be enough to mitigate .22 WMR recoil. And the 30-round magazine capacity, together with the ballistics of the .22 WMR cartridge out of a 16-inch barrel, should result in a respectable self-defense platform for seniors who could not otherwise handle any other firearm platform. Come to think of it, that three pound carbine in .22 WMR would be a fine self-defense platform for responsible children who are not physically capable of handling larger calibers/platforms as well.
And I suppose this will also be a highly desirable “survival” carbine if the barrel is easy to detach.
Whoever manufactures and sells this concept will sell a ton of them (actually several tons!) and make a lot of money. Please send me a royalty check for each 100,000 units sold!
Ha ha, after posting my above comment I checked the Kel-Tec website. They manufacture their CMR30 rifle (carbine) which appears to be a carbine version of their PMR30 semi-auto handgun. It only weighs 3.8 pounds and I’ll bet it would be fairly easy to reduce that weight to 3.0 pounds if Kel-Tec decided to do so.
Now get the price down to $400 retail and I would be all over that like a hobo on a ham sandwich.
vinegar?
Also remember that .22lr is only doing 900-1000 fps out of a pistol length barrel.
22mag out of a 16″ barrel probably has triple the energy of .22lr out of a pistol.
That is big
Art out West,
The numbers that I have seen indicate .22 WMR would have double the muzzle velocity out of a 16-inch barrel compared to .22 LR out of a handgun-length barrel. Since energy is a function of velocity squared, that means .22 WMR out of a 16-inch barrel has FOUR times the energy of .22 LR out of a short barrel.
Having said that, I don’t think energy is as important as bullet expansion and penetration: the bullet fired from a .22 LR handgun platform will simply not expand nor penetrate near as much as the same bullet fired from a .22 WMR carbine platform. That is where a .22 WMR carbine will really outshine a .22 LR handgun.
For reference, doubling the velocity means that:
(a) The bullet fired from .22 WMR carbine will expand significantly more than and yet penetrate just as deeply as the same bullet fired from a .22 LR handgun.
— or —
(b) The bullet fired from .22 WMR carbine will expand the same as and penetrate much deeper than the same bullet fired from a .22 LR handgun.
And when we combine those details with the intended application — for people with strength/dexterity deficits who would have trouble operating any handgun (regardless of any conceivable modifications) and for whom operating a traditional shotgun/rifle/carbine is out of the question — a lightweight carbine in .22 WMR seems like the optimum self-defense firearm.
I don’t know. Seems gimmicky to me. If someone’s 80 year old grandma likes that set up and can use it, who am I to criticize?
I’m 72 and I sure as hell don’t need one of those gismos to defend myself. Maybe when I’m 82 I’ll think about it.
My mother turned 86 April 5th this year. She has a S&W model 10 And she can shoot the eye out of a running pangolin at sixty feet, she can also shoot two bats with one bullet by throwing a knife in the air and splitting the bullet..
And she’s still single? Unbelievable.
I dunno about this thing.
It may have some application but a lot of older people I know need something they can shoot one handed due to balance and strength.
I have worked with a couple of people.
One bought an LCR 22 burt the trigger was heavier than a 38 LCR. He ended up with a 38 LCR loaded with hornady 90 grain. So basically a 380 revolver.
This is an advantage for a 38 revolver. Loads can be chosen based on skill level and recoil sensitivity. And no worry of limp-wristing a revolver. Another went with a 327 LCR ( hard to find) and loaded 110 gr 32 H&R from GA ammo.
For two hands, I will probably lean toward an M&P 15-22 or a Ruger 10/22.
Or a Ruge 22 Charger with a laser (I guess). Those take 25 rounds mags as well.
I know your a Specialist (in) 38 but…
A 90gr .38 is NOT a .380.
Not even close.
And (in my experience as an instructor) most peeps that have recoil aversion have no issue shooting .38 wadcutters. (Avg weight 148gr)
What works, works for one, not all.
Out of a snub, that 90 grain hornady load (titty pink polymer nose) bullet runs 850-900.
Out of my LCP an 85-90 grain bullet runs…..about the same.
With 4 inch bbl 380, you could best it by around 100 fps.
Maybe your chrono says different.
Now if I loaded a 90 grain load …. it would be much hotter….but it would kick more…so I would just with 110 bullet as the next step up. And I was looking for a load they could acquire locally.
With a cast 100 grain wadcutter, it’s no trick to break 1000 fps out of a snub. Same powder charge will be faster with pure lead over jacketed. But more recoil.
And you wont find too many mainstream manufacturers loading to that level. Most 38 ammo is nowhere near top pressure. BB, Corbon, and Underwood excluded.
And we did go through the 148 wadcutters, they chose the 90 grain HP.
And could shoot much more accurately with it. And faster times.
38 offers a lot of range in loads …… that’s a good thing.
90s, 110s, 125s, 148, and 158s …. lead and jacketed.
My main carry is Golden Saber +P 125s, but I also carry a 158 HP loaded to around 1100.
Those were right out…..
Specialist38,
Are you saying that you have a load which launches a 158 grain bullet out of a snubbie at 1,100 feet-per-second? That has to be seriously encroaching on .357 Magnum pressure to accomplish that feat.
Uncommon.
Yes. From an older reloading manual. Moderately slow powder.
From my 38s, they drop free and do not have flattened primers.
The “FBI” loads from Winchester, Federal, and maybe Remington are not nearly as robust as they were 40 years ago.
I imagine Buffalo Bore’s 158 +P is the real deal on +P.
Specialist38,
If an elderly person cannot possibly handle a lightweight carbine and therefore must resort to a revolver, wouldn’t a reduced-recoil load in a revolver chambered in .327 Federal Magnum make the most sense?
Seems to me like they could use .32 H&R Magnum loads. According to Wikipedia, someone makes a .32 H&R Magnum load that launches a 90 grain lead semi-wadcutter at 963 feet-per-second which seems to be about ideal. That should penetrate significantly at that velocity — and yet recoil should be mild. Of course trigger pull should be manageable since that is a centerfire cartridge.
I noted one person did just that in my original post above. That shooter went with GA ammo 110 jhp and was happy. That round will penetrate pretty well. I have personally taken a 150 lbs hog with load.
The steel frame of the LCR 327 soaks up a lot of recoil with the 32 H&R.
Just harder to find 327 or 32 H&R snubs.
The 38 gives a lot of option just by switching loads. And many 38 loads are widely available, even if a little pricey.
A reloader will gave a field day…..plenty of options.
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Needs a tandemcross halo those bolts can pinch you pretty good, and ruger mags are crap until you run them for awhile
How about a green laser-much more visible[glaucoma compromises red/brown color spectrum],will the Ruger et al be chargable[chamberable] for folks with poor hand strength,is the Ruger ambidextrous..some of us are mandatory southpaws?,how about the Aquila SSS 60gr 22LR ammo in a handgun?,perhaps a marine distress flare pistil[albeit 1 shot] would work..that magnesium flare ought to give a varmint a solid case of heart burn
OK. Someone needs to add the theme music of The A Team to the video.
10/22 Charger is $300.
Add a laser/light.
Add 25 round mags.
Done
Makes a lot more sense than the gimmick gun in the article.
My concern about the laser attachment to the Senior Citizen Defender is that it requires you to remove the front sight on Ruger Mark IV and no tool provided. The average person then needs to shop for the tool to remove the front sight to attach the laser. Can be very frustrating for someone that already owns the Ruger Mark IV weapon.