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(AP Photo/Brennan Linsley, File)
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From the Second Amendment Foundation . . .

The Second Amendment Foundation today filed a federal lawsuit challenging the recently-signed Illinois gun ban legislation, alleging it to be unconstitutional and asserting the state has criminalized “a common and important means of self-defense.” The case is known as Harrel v. Raoul.

Joining SAF in this legal action are the Illinois State Rifle Association, Firearms Policy Coalition, C4 Gun Store LLC, Marengo Guns, Inc. and a private citizen, Dane Harrel. Named as defendants are Attorney General Kwame Raoul, Illinois State Police Director Brendan F. Kelly, and other officials in their official capacities. The lawsuit was filed in U.S. District Court for the Southern District of Illinois.

Illinois has banned the future sale, importation, purchase, delivery and manufacture of the most popular rifle in the United States, along with their standard capacity magazines,” noted SAF founder and Executive Vice President Alan M. Gottlieb. “People who already own such firearms must now register their guns with the State Police. This ban violates the constitutional rights of Illinois gun owners, and we intend to prove it in court.

“Once again,” he continued, “Illinois lawmakers are scapegoating firearms and people who own them in a transparent attempt to convince people they are doing something about the horrible violence the state has suffered in recent years, especially in Chicago. In reality, it’s an effort to distract the public from the fact that these same lawmakers have been unable or unwilling to crack down on criminals responsible for violent crime.”

Modern semiautomatic firearms banned under the new Illinois law have been deliberately mischaracterized as “assault weapons” and even “weapons of war,” Gottlieb explained. He called this patently dishonest and deceitful.

“Anti-gun politicians tout this sort of legislation,” Gottlieb observed, “while they know it really won’t accomplish anything beyond creating the false public impression they are making the community safer. No neighborhood, no city and no state ever became safer by restricting the rights of law-abiding citizens.

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    • RE: “The Second Amendment Foundation today filed a federal lawsuit challenging the recently-signed Illinois gun ban legislation, alleging it to be unconstitutional and asserting the state has criminalized “a common and important means of self-defense.” The case is known as Harrel v. Raoul.”

      Nobody gets a dime from me until these so called on point defenders of the Second Amendment sue to abolish Gun Control. I am sick and tired of seeing Gun Control and its rot sitting all prim and proper in courtrooms when history confirms Gun Control is an agenda rooted in racism and genocide.

      When are these defenders of the 2A going present evidence of racism and genocide specifically against Gun Control on a court of law? How about exhibits being Slave Shacks, Nooses, Concentration Camps, Gas Chambers and everything else left in the wake of Gun Control?

      2A defense in the Land of Lincoln amounts to please mr. Gun Control nazi, please mr. Gun Control kkk those lowly Blacks and Jews need, “common and important means of self defense.”

      • OK Debbie, please explain for the class, in detail, exactly how they are supposed to “sue to abolish gun control.”

        Let’s start with who they sue. Please tell us who the defendants are. I’ll wait . . . .

        Then tell me what the cause of action is, and how the plaintiff has standing to assert it. Again, I’ll wait . . . .

        And then you can explain how you will defend the inevitable Rule 12(b)(6) motion to dismiss for failure to state a claim upon which relief can be granted.

        Bottom line: Take it from this old federal court litigator, the SAF and the FPC know what they are doing. On the other hand, Debbie hasn’t a clue.

        • I am a member of three orgs and the money I’ve sent recently hasn’t been much as there are other considerations for me and mine. I feel the bite of inflation as others have.

          I refuse to give to the NRA even though I do with my state affiliate. But even that has dwendled. They have only updated their merchandise by including companies that are leftist anti gun America hating communists. I know that very little is made here anymore but some things are just ridiculous.

          At some point all this will reach a head. We are seeing things busting at the seems. We are ALL going to have to deal with this. Catering to the left will only make it worse. Weakness is not only disrespected but that too will make it worse.

          You ask what to do:
          No pro sports or Disney. Reject Nike, TikTok, Facebook, and Amazon. There are many others but every vote for a Democrat and every dollar given to them is any step toward self destruction.

        • Debbie is stuck in the past and stuck on stupid. She’s too stupid to see Dems want to take everyone’s guns away, black or white, it doesn’t matter.

          I shoot regularly with a couple of black vets I worked with as a contractor, and despite what Debbie the Dipshit would have you believe, black people in 2023 can actually buy guns.

        • LKB :

          Have you seen this recent Mark Smith video about a 1994 SCotUS case called Staples v. the US, that he seems to believe may help folks busted for possession of an SBR with a brace on their pistol?

        • lkb…You certainly established yourself as the spokesman for Gun Control…Sieg heil counselor.

          Abolish Gun Control like Slavery, Jim Crow, etc. or is that too court complicated for you? The evidence clearly shows those atrocities all walked in hand with Gun Control so I ask you…Where is Slavery? Where is Jim Crow? Where is Discrimination? Where is Eugenics? Where is Lynching? Where is Segregation? Where is the kkk? For Pete’s sake where are Civil War statues in the courts? And then where is Gun Control? Gun Control is alive and well in The 1968 Gun Control Act and has standing in courts. If Gun Control was abolished would it hurt the wallets of those who profit from throwing softballs at Gun Control…Yes or No?

          Your pompous qualifiers and Gotcha attempts tells me you do not have the balls to confront Gun Control like its sidekicks racism and genocide were confronted. My money says it would be a cold day in hell before you would ever put Gun Control on the hot seat to hold it accountable much less ever stood in front of the class and define Gun Control by its confirmed history of rot

        • jr… Count after me…One, Two, Three Sar9s. One Warthog semi 12 Ga. Now count to 7 Sar9s I have sold per my recommendation…All that’s left you to do is crawl back under your rock.

        • it’s easy to explain who, any politician who has ever proposed a law that is in violation of the constitution should be arrested and charged with treason. everyone ever swarn into office took an oath to uphold the constitution NOT violate it. these anti second amendment politicians willfully and blatantly violated the constitution, their actions and laws that they try to or have supported or successfully passed are all the evidence that should be needed to convict them

        • Geoff:
          I think he overstates the utility of that case.
          Yes, it might well help you “beat the rap,” but it won’t help you “beat the ride.”
          And all ATF has to do is send you a warning that your braced AR pistol is considered an SBR, and if they can prove you received the warning and continued to possess the weapon, that satisfies the intent/scienter element and moots the Staples issue.
          Again, the stakes are too high for those of you who might be affected by this to be getting your legal advice from online blogs. Call your lawyer and get actual, tailored legal advice.

      • @Debbie W

        You can’t ‘sue to abolish Gun Control’ because ‘gun control’ doesn’t exist as a single ‘thing’ in law and is a term under which collectively lies numerous laws and actions. You have to go after each law and action in the collective of what is termed ‘Gun Control’ and that’s what is happening now. Unfortunately, we have to take the cases as their come up and when standing is established.

        • Forget it Jake, you can’t fix stupid.

          Debbie obviously knows nothing about how the legal system actually works (and what you have to do to get it to work for you). Call her out for her obvious ignorance, and you must be in league with the gun grabbers. (That I’m one of the gun grabbers will probably be a surprise to my friends at FPC, to say nothing of anyone who has read anything I’ve written on the subject.)

        • Not only can you not fix stupid, Debbie can’t can’t stop turning into Super-B1tch every time someone disagrees with her.

          Maybe its brain damage from eating too many lead paint chips as a child.

          Debbie, name a black person who can’t buy the same guns or just as many as white people living in the same area in 2023. Name one white person who won’t be affected by the proposed gun laws that are being proposed.

      • I did, too, plus the SAF. It hurts with this inflation, but I feel I must. I’ll just cut off the booze for several months.

  1. Where is the NRA on the list of litigants? I’m a Benefactor Life Member for what? The NRA is nowhere to be seen actively fighting for our rights.


    • The NRA is fiscally plus morally bankrupt and a lot of people have stopped donating.
      Wayne LaPierre and his board have been using the NRAs money as their own pocketbook.
      To make it short, the NRA has not been relevant in 4 years.

      “Plaintiff Harrel is a retired Lieutenant Colonel in the U.S. Air Force and is currently employed as a civil servant for the USAF Air Mobility Command Headquarters in the Operations Directorate. He is a member of ISRA, SAF and FPC.”

      Wheaton, Ill., attorney David Sigale filed the lawsuit on Jan. 17 in the U.S. District Court for the Southern District of Illinois so yes they did do some shopping.
      The thing is this the only FEDERAL lawsuit so it just gets to SCOTUS faster.
      Sigale’s argument is sound so if you care about you 2A rights wherever you live,
      give $ to any of the three, ISRA, SAF or FPC.

  2. “No neighborhood, no city and no state ever became safer by restricting the rights of law-abiding citizens.”
    The whole truth and nothing but the truth.

    • Hush,

      True–restricting rights has not made any neighborhood, city, nor state safer. Note, however, that restricting rights has been wildly successful in making the Ruling Class safer.

      In the immortal words of Paul Harvey, “And now you know [long pause] the rest of the story.”

  3. As I predicted . . . they forum shopped it and filed in SD Ill., where they drew Stephen P. McGlynn as their judge.

    He’s a PDT appointee.

    Motion for TRO coming in 5 . . 4 . . 3 . . .

    • It gets better . . .

      From a press release from a leftist group that unsuccessfully opposed Judge McGlynn’s confirmation, because, inter alia:

      Ideological and Partisan Affiliations: Since 2005, Mr. McGlynn has been a member of the National Rifle Association (“NRA”), the extremist advocacy organization that has engaged for decades in a massive lobbying campaign to oppose common-sense gun safety laws. From 2005-2013, he was also a member of the NRA’s Illinois affiliate, the Illinois State Rifle Association.

      Works for me!

      • Terrific! Just talked to an old friend(50 years) who lives in downstate ILL annoy. He has a LOT of gats. As does another friend nearby. SAF is a big un. Sending $/joining a few groups. We don’t give a damn if Debbie do…still moving east. BTW princess black Dims led the charge & passed all this BS. Not raciss Jim Crow.

      • lkb…What works for most stick in
        the mud outhouse lawyers is nothing more than a perpetual tit for tat courtroom clown show…When it comes to getting real justice for those on the receiving end of the Gun Control whip it’s difficult to tell who is more placid…you, the forum’s resident bigots or mitch mcconnell.

  4. Best way to fight most of these laws where possible is to not comply and be a civil disobedient.
    There are more of you than them and they don’t have the personnel to go door to door checking who has this or that. If they come to your house without a warrant and try to enter invoke your Make My Day or Castle Domain law and do what is necessary to protect yourself, family and property. Same goes if you own an AR15 or AK47 pistol or variant that has a brace.
    Don’t comply. They just want to disarm the American Public so they can overwhelm you with power. As long as you keep your firearms and are willing to use them against violations of your 2nd Amendment Rights they cannot win. You have them by over 50 to 1.

    • “Best way to fight most of these laws where possible is to not comply and be a civil disobedient.”

      Are you personally willing to throw the future of your family right under the metaphorical-bus and be literally homeless so that you, personally, make your little point?

      Because it will literally come to that if they chose to target *you*.

      Fight smart, not stupid…

  5. Strangely enough the Law does not ban or restrict M1 Garand’s, an actual weapon of war designed for combat and was used in combat. And by the Law, under antique and reproductions of them, it seems a Gatling gun is also allowable.

  6. “Illinois has banned the future sale, importation, purchase, delivery and manufacturer” But they LOVE them some illegal aliens.

  7. catco…Let’s see you pathetic snot nosed history illiterate…you mean take away everyone’s guns like Guns were denied or taken from the Irish, Italians, Asians, Indians, etc? Or like the Gun Control military wing of the democRat Party known as the kkk did to defenseless Black Americans? Or the Gun Control nazi party did to defenseless lily white Jews and anyone classified as a misfit?

    If you want to defend a document that is centuries old you do not provide standing for Gun Control by shutting the door that defines Gun Control by its history of rot.

    When it comes to Gun Control…Yesterday you idiot is the best thing there is to fight Gun Control today and tomorrow.

    • Gun control has a racist history.

      Gun grabbers have fixed that by wanting to fuck everyone over today.

      You are a brain damaged twat too stupid to see that.

  8. I just love it, the irony, American citizens have to SUE to exercise a lawfully (?) protected Constitutional Right.
    To me, I see, to be Free, In America, you must have a truckload of $$$$$ and a bus load of lawyers.
    America has become a land of sewers.

  9. Mom-At-Arms has one thing going for it, it is pro2A.
    The problem is it is just a podcast by Jill McDaniel.
    The website pretty much just steals info from say TTAG and other sites.
    All of the info on link that you posted has already been on TTAG.
    Mom-At-Arms was started 4 years ago and mainly makes money from selling T-shirts.
    The website gets 200 hits a day or 199 if you exclude yourself.
    Jill McDaniel has delusions that she is the anti Shannon Watts.
    Sigiloso1776 who wrote the blog post that is your link has a whopping 7 followers.
    What this fight needs is MONEY for attorneys and not plagiarism.
    “Oh Yay they won in Illinois!” Go take your meds Jill.

    Honestly do you even read the articles or comments on here or
    do you just stop in every 10 days and post links to YouTube and blogs?

    • not everyone sees all stuff in one place. all pro 2A ‘gun blogs sites get stuff from other 2A ‘gun blog’ sites and all of them sell or use something to generate revenue either directly or from clicks on links in reviews or other articles.

      Honestly do you even read the articles or comments on here or
      do you just stop in every 10 days and post more BS under different names?

    • why yes, yes I do. Here ya go, by request.

      Biden’s MLK Speech Insists Gun Owners Don’t Need An AR-15 & It Takes F-15s To Take On The Government.


    Illinois went too far trying to just ban guns when the real problem is that the wrong people are getting guns.

    And the Far Right oppose the very laws that would have made banning guns not necessary and that is draconian background checks as found currently in the NFA laws. They have worked well with keeping machine guns and silencers out of the hands of the gang bangers.

    Safe storage laws would have also cut way down on deraigned kids getting ahold of their parents guns and taking them to school to commit mass murder.

    Now this will be a very big test case for the usual disingenuous Supreme Court. Will they sit on their ass and ignore this as usual or do something by striking down the Illinois law. Don’t hold your breath.

    The real problem that drove Illinois to this was the lack of sane Federal Gun Control laws such as extending the NFA act to cover all weapons and enhancing it with mental tests as well.

  11. It started in Illinois in 1949 when they repealed open and concealed carry. Been waiting since the Supreme Court decision last summer for someone to file something against the FOID. It is just unconstitutional for any state like Illinois to make someone get a license to handle and own a firearm, ammunition. After this is over, I do hope the FPC and 2nd Amendment Foundation take on the FOID in Illinois.

  12. I think the real solution here is to have real costs for lawmakers and governors that willingly pass and sign laws or mandates that are flagrant and clear violations of a Constitutional rights. If they are proven to have flagrantly violated a Constitutional right during the execution of their offices they should be summarily removed from office and barred from holding future public office. This will need to be put into law (I suggest slipping it into a bill that is +5,000 pages and passes at midnight) but one that will finally get those passing laws or mandates to think twice before violating peoples rights. As it stands they have nothing to lose by passing these laws.

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