Over at gawker.com, Hamilton Nolan finds the reaction to Guns & Ammo‘s pro-gun control screed funny—in that condescending “gun owners are dopes and fanatics” kinda way. His TTAG quote from our editorial on Metcalf’s editorial refers to “The People of the Gun.” Which triggered some shudders from Gawker’s commentariat. “Guns have become mythologized to an incomprehensible degree,” Chatham Harrison opines. “Their worshippers are unapologetically and irredeemably tribal, and they take every opportunity to enforce unity in that tribe (see: “People of the Gun”) and see to it that no other group, such as the rest of America, can keep them from their totems.” In other words, “‘People of the Gun’ is a scary fucking thing for anyone to say.” Is it? Is PotG needlessly exclusionary? And do we care what people who call us “gun nuts” think about the tribal ID?
I’m okay with that phrase, but can’t stand the terms “gat” and “po-po”. I’m aware of their origins but I find they come across as juvenile in journalism.
Just my 2 cents.
I’m okay with the phrase also, but prefer the terms “heater” or “roscoe” and everyone knows the proper term for the police is “copper” or “dicks”…………
I think if you want to build consensus and increase following, better terms to use are Pro 2A people, People of the Constitution, Americans.
People of the Gun makes it sound like the gun is making the decisions.
I’m finding “pro-self-defense” a fun phrase. It completely short-circuits the automatic reaction some people have to “gun” or “the second amendment”, and puts them in a position that invites actual thought: namely, who wants to be “anti-self-defense”?
awesome. I will have borrow that.
“pro-self defence” is awsome! If we used the term “firearms enthusiast” they would replace the word enthusiast with extremist. Pro gun translates to them as “pro-violence” or pro-death. Anything using the word militia is construed as extremists looking to overthrow the gubmint. It is like labeling anyone that says that they like kids is a pedophile, but pro-self defence is a bit harder to twist into a negative.
Or pro-choice for self defense. Let them argue against being pro choice 🙂
“Pro self defense” is really good! I was going to suggest “Self defense oriented.” “People of the gun” sounds stiff and awkward. It’s hard to be against either of the first two phrases.
I’ve found the same thing. Especially when I’m talking to someone who favors strict gun control, I’ll just say that I disagree with them because I believe that self defense is a fundamental right. Self-defense is positive and empowering — almost no one will disagree with the right to self defense. So this automatically establishes the reason for owning and carrying guns as being valid, even if some may still disagree with the choice… which just leads to another issue where we win, personal choice.
I’ve always taken “people of the gun” to be a useful reference to people who are really serious about them, as opposed to people who just own guns. But it’s a pretty bad term for winning hearts and minds to our side.
Using NewSpeak is not going to change the way those people think about you. Personally I would replace POTG with “Men” and gawker-commenter with “girly-men” but PC isn’t my thing.
My wife is a person of the gun, and also a better shot than I am.
I’ve said pro 2A, pro constitution, pro liberty, and the more cumbersome “pro-choice in matters of self-defense.” Any of these works. “People of the gun” does sound a bit insular and might tend to place more emphasis on the object rather than the person who owns it.
As a general rule, I make it a point to reject statist limits on the language we use, but in this case it may be in our best interests to chose another term (one they will hate even more, since it will make us harder to demonize).
When is Cheaper Than Dirt doing this?
Can a married TTAG-er tell me what the text says?I’m 26 years old and can’t get past the caption photo…..
damn. who dat?
Jacquline Fischer
http://www.gorgeous10.com/post/Jaquline-Fischer-She-Sings-She-Spars-Shes-Sexy.aspx
Down boy! You already have Shannon and Tiffany! And Rebecca, I suppose, if you’re feeling generous…
I like it. Nothing seems to fit better. I dgaf what some anti thinks anyway.
Truth! These are people who think of us as nothing more than cavemen, they and their opinions are the next level up from pond scum.
Any term you use will be made derogatory coming from the mouths of the antis. Just pick a term that works for you and don’t worry about it.
This guy gets it.
I love being a Person of the Gun. Do Hamilton Nolan or Chatham Harrison like being People of the Irrational Fear of Personal Responsibility or People of the Incredibly WASPy Name?
Personally I never thought of myself as one of the “people of the gun” but rather as a person who thinks of a gun as just a tool, and that is all it is. It is a multi purpose tool, it is used by me for recreation, personal safety, and food.
I don’t like the term. It implies that guns are all I’m about. They aren’t. It’s just a tool I carry on my hip, much like the blade that’s in my pocket. In fact, I carry a knife everywhere but past the security checkpoint in an airport. It goes everywhere I go, including the places where it’s illegal to carry a gun, like my kids’ schools. Which means I’m more likely to have a knife on my than a gun. So does that make me a Person of the Blade too?
They are an important part of my life and who I am, but they’re not all of either. In fact, they’re nowhere near the top in my list of priorities of life, nor should they be for anyone not directly in that industry or those that support it.
This “tribe” isn’t actually exclusionary. Either way I don’t think anyone here actually sees it in a “mythological” sense. It’s just a less boring term than “gun owners” or “2A supporters”.
It’s actually the Gawker types who mythologize guns. To us actually, they’re things, items, tools. To them they’re evil, corrupting, anthropomorphic.
They call us obsessed because we won’t hand just ‘hand over our property already’. Because they themselves would see no appeal in retaining it.
I see no need for a fixed gear bicycle, and think there’s a bit of a “cult” around that kind of thing, too.
I’d change it to ‘people of the guns’. You make it sound like there’s only one, and I don’t like sharing.
Just got odd looks at work trying to contain my instant laughter
I’m OK with the term and my tribe. If other people have a problem with it, that’s their problem not mine. And if it makes them fearful, I’m OK with that too. The whole PC thing is getting out of hand and I find it very tiresome.
Why should TSA agents be armed? There are armed cops all over every terminal that I’ve ever been inside, so TSA gropers are among the most protected non-politicians in the US.
If such well protected people need guns, than what about the rest of us who can’t expect Officer Friendly and a dozen of his well-armed pals to appear in ten seconds?
Personally, I’d prefer “American citizen”, it’s inclusive to those who are not people of the gun because we welcome them into the fold, but I have no personal objections to The People of the Gun. I can see the fence sitters and hoplophobes fearing the term and using it derogatorily.
They would still hate us if we called ourselves something politically correct like “respecters of the gun”. I don’t see a problem with us using it. Does it look bad to people on the fence about gun ownership? Maybe, and that would be the only reason to stop using it.
We have to learn how to stop playing defense against the anti’s and learn some offense. Hit them where it hurts and use their words to make them look bad.
Just one question.
Why should I take seriously ANYTHING written at Gawker by folks with “Hamilton” and “Chatham” as first names?
i’m a supporter of all my constitutional rights and i know the 2nd amendment protects the others. with that being said, some limits might seen reasonable, BUT the reason we don’t like someone lecturing us about gun control is simply this, the gun controllers are always trying to coddle the real criminals, and instead they want to blame the gun. secondly, sure common sense should prevail when speaking of the limits of any right, BUT why should law abiding gun owners get preached to when most violent crime in this country is being committed by democrats and there is not one thing being done to reign in the crime epidemic by addressing the problems honestly. we know that most gun laws are just gun grabs, and in they are not designed to seriously go after the criminals. most criminals will not stop breaking laws because of gun laws. most women are at a natural disadvantage to a man, and even more so if there were no guns at all. so eff off to anyone who doesn’t have the circles to tell the truth.
Thanks, Matt, for introducing us to the lighter side of self-defense. I can use a laugh now and then as a break from fighting against all the threats to our RKBA.
RF,
Yes you should use this term.
“People of the Gun?” Well, as long as you asked, I prefer “Children of the Corn.” But I think it’s taken.
We already have a title for ourselves, and that’s citizens. The anti’s are the serfs, slaves and subjects of slave masters, the democrat party. We need no other title than citizen, as it implies all the things we hold dear about the constitution. Think about it.
I don’t mind the term and don’t give a rats ass what anyone else thinks. Although i’d rather be referred to as a “People of the Constitution” person.
Sorry to burst your journalistic bubble, but Dr. Janina Dallas in her first interview said it simply had to do with the fact that Tanya Mount, an Army veteran, posted it on facebook. Dallas then later changed her story, of which there is no evidence to prove her statements, that Mrs. Mount was disruptive. I would also like to point out that that it takes a great deal of paperwork, medical and criminal background checks to become a volunteer in GA schools… a similar process is gone through to get a weapons permit. Dr. Janina Dallas in NOT a hero.
People like that probably believe the stupid “sh*t” they say and tell themselves… And they think we are nuts?
“DontForgetTheRainSqarr
I know eh? How does the rest of your life have to be going for you to construct your entire identity around worshiping an inanimate object that is mass-manufactured for the purpose of killing and injuring. Today 11:42am”
I’m completely surprised that someone identified a gun as an inanimate object… but then they lost it when they ignored the purpose of protecting, defending and feeding… they got it half right.
“People of the Gun” always reminded me of “People of the Book”.
Take that for what it’s worth.
On a much more important topic:
why won’t FlashPlayer install on my LT?
Cause I’m a Person of the LapTop
Nope, I do not like it. I like ‘Citizen’ a whole lot more but “We the People” works well too.
I always thought the term was a bit stupid – it seems like an quaint anthropological term that some scientist, studying a remote tribe, would pin on us all, ref: “The Forest People” by Colin Turnbull, about the Pygmy tribes of equatorial Africa. “The People of the Gun – an anachronistic tribe of totem worshippers, found disseminated through North America….”
But I find that term far less annoying than “Armed Intelligentsia” – which has that same pompous, air-of-superiority tone that permeates Rush Limbaugh’s broadcasts.
We The People (of The Gun).
Oh…and that pesky little thing about a militia….which would prove obsolete once we instituted a standing army.
WE have a standing army, which means YOU don’t need a gun! I laugh at all the wann be crime fighters! Oh baby! tough guys!!! Uuuuuuu…..I’m gonna shoot the bad guys! Yeah, after you urinate in your shorts! LOL….Lincoln said that armed resistance the the government in insurrectionary or revolutionary…maybe I shouldn’t quote Lincoln! I know the Stars and Bars is revered by so many gun nuts.
Hey, it’s better than being a “Wonkette”…
Robert is now famous: http://news.yahoo.com/guns-ammo-editorial-controversy-203042117.html
When a disparate and varied people find themselves surrounded by a common enemy, they do indeed look like a “tribe”.
Put another way – this is a fence calling the field a yard.
“People of the Gun” is an expression of commonality amongst an otherwise categorizable/definable population.
I don’t have a problem with the label. The implied subtext of a people united by ideas in the face of persecution is accurate enough.
As for being a tribe, I have one question: Where shall we build our first casino?
If you’re upsetting a statist, you’re probably doing something right. Keep it, even if they use it as an insult. No matter what title we use, it will be twisted to use against us.
I wonder if they would consider “Gay” or “LGBT” tribal and cultish?
Who gives a shit about gawker? Of course keep using the term.
It’s simply a term used to differentiate gun enthusiasts from hoplophobes. I do not worship material things, nor do I claim to be of any tribe. What these people think is completely irrelevant to me.
I think “People of the Gun” is perfectly fine. It’s all-inclusive. It’s just a term for people who enjoy guns and defend their right to keep and bear them. “People of the Gun” might be straight, gay, black, white, Asian, Latino, Christian, Atheist, Muslim, Jewish, or a variety of other things. They might live in a farm in Arkansas or a high-rise in a metropolis. They might own an FN-SCAR and a collection of Glocks, or just a 30-30 lever gun and a few single-action revolvers.
The fine folks at Gawker (that rock-solid bastion of unfaltering excellence in journalism) seem to think it means that people of the gun are ALL we are, but I don’t see it that way. Most POTG have many other interests and pursuits in life. Identifying yourself as “gay” or “conservative” doesn’t mean that you are ONLY that, does it? So why would that be the case with POTG?
Its also less conceited than “armed intelligentsia”.
HAIL TO THE TOTEM!
Robert, stop getting lured into these Alynski-esque scuffles with the antis. Mike Vanderboegh has made it abundantly clear that for these people, the means only justify the ends. Keep running with the tag. It’s a good one.
What that particular commenter said isn’t particularly inaccurate, he just tried to phrase it in the most negative way possible to reflect his personal views on the matter.
Said differently, “Pro-gun enthusiasts and hobbyists are a strong community. They are highly vigilant against attempts to disarm them or disenfranchise them of their rights and property.”
I took all his “devil terms” and turned them into “God terms” while maintaining the overall meaning of the message. And, I even managed to be more succinct than them.
I like how they call us tribal, yet every other day its seems there is some new anti self defense group popping up in the news.
I can’t stop looking at the pink dog.
That’s a funny comment in that it is extremely hypocritical. The statement itself is polarizing, exclusionary, and tribal in nature, basically saying “look at that crazy group, our group is the only logical and right group”. At least he said we have unity, something the other side of the table can’t claim. “People of the gun” is a perfectly legitimate term that is acceptable to any reasonable person (see what I did there?). There are “gun owners”, “hunters”, “professionals”, and then there are people that fully believe in our rights; people of the gun.
If you look at the author’s other articles he’s full of doomsaying, demanding, demeaning, b!tching and moaning. He sounds like one of those perpetually miserable opinionated assh*les that gets off on spreading their misery and the sound of their own raving. I’ll bet he’s one of those guys who gets dumped because his partners get sick of his endless ranting.
http://hamilton_nolan.kinja.com/
well I just thought it friendly.
Seeing as how there are no background checks required, no fees, and all thats required is to be a legal resident, not even a citizen really, I’d say “exclusionary” does not mean what he thinks.
but if it bothers him that much, I’d say use the term early and often. this, from a “gawker”
I don’t mind the term. I do not personally use it, nor does my husband but it works to identify the particular community. Firearms have always been a part of our lives. From my husbands perspective hunting and shooting was a part of life growing up in Missouri before he joined the Army. For myself, well not being originally from this country it was a matter of personal security. I joined the government intelligence service where training and carry were mandatory. We have lived here for years and I am still amazed at how many people take our constitutional rights for granted, or actively oppose them. Not all people around the world are so fortunate to have such set in law.
I may not say we are “people of the gun” be we have lived our lives with them and both carry concealed to this day. We support the second amendment, along with our other rights. If this all makes us a part of “the people of the gun” so be it.
Sorry if this comment has taken overly long.
http://gawker.com/5965621/the-50-least-important-writers-of-2012/
He’s toward the bottom of the list where they make fun of his crappy writing style.
A list of unimportant writer’s with Thomas Sowell on it has no credibility with me.
Looks like it could use a vertical foregrip and not the angled grip…seeing by how he has to pinch the angled grip…
I didn’t see or participate in the survey, so I need to ask – Did it filter out those who are NOT in AZ? It makes a difference in the validity of the results.
Leftist ideologues yapping about how politically involved gun owners are a tribalistic group that don’t tolerate dissent?
I laughed so hard I spilled water on my keyboard.
They are pathetic.
Why review useless range toys? These “pistols” are nothing but inaccurate bullet hoses and a total waste of money.
Oh I don’t know. I’ve been thinking about scoring a 5.56 pistol. My state’s CHP is good only for concealed handguns and something like this (or a PLR-16 or an AK pistol) would make a great car gun in case of sudden civil unrest.
But so what if you don’t think it has a use? I’d rather read the review and decide for meself.
Uh, no. The point of them is to make them into rifles via some quick gunsmithing and a $200 tax stamp.
So, speaking of which, what’s the scoop on SBR’ing these bad boys? Easy or hard to get a stock on there?
I don’t know about y’all, but I’m not bringing a knife to gunfight, even if it is a $300 pocket knife.
Yes.
I’m done discussing this.
Tribal? Perhaps, but then everyone seeks a feeling of inclusion and I think POTG enhances that for many of us here. We humans are also hard wired to view people as either in-group or out-group, it’s a survival mechanism. Why we should be concerned about what out-group people think about our in group lingo is beyond me. Let’s face facts; Out-group members are always viewed as potential enemies. In this case they actually are. We’re not willing to give up our rights or our guns and they won’t accept that, thus we are enemies. What they think now is only valuable to the degree that we can use it to prevail over them.
Is that the proper way to use an angled fore grip? I hear the ATF can arrest you for not using products like that properly as the designer intended.
When thinking about “The People of the Gun,” I think we need to evaluate our goals.
Is our goal to (re)normalize gun ownership via examples of normalcy (e.g. safely enjoying the gun range)? Or is our goal to champion gun rights everywhere via examples extremity (e.g. Open AR carry in Starbucks)? In my estimation – a successful political / cultural movement likely needs both examples. If we consider the success the LGBT community has had normalizing it’s perspective into modern culture – we might have an example.
There are of course the classic examples of the “angry queer” all throughout the history of that community’s argument for mainstream acceptance. However, within that community there are also loads of examples of what might be called the “normal LGBT” person (N.B. I’m making no value judgement – just a cultural distinction). In reality – both act as agents of cultural change. The first shockingly disrupts society’s norms, the second co-opts the norms and presents an example of the LGBT life that isn’t so shocking – and thus begins the acceptance.
Now – with respect to gun rights – we need to determine – what is TTA?. Is TTAG the voice of the angry gun owner? The girl who shamelessly open carries her AR to Wal-Mart just to make a point? If yes – the People of the Gun is right. If no – then we might be in want of a new moniker.
The issue here (in my opinion), is that RF’s sarcasm is sometimes nuanced and not readily accessible to an irregular audience (Dan’s brazen tongue is a bit different). So when the kids from Gawker come by – they’re terrified. Do I care – maybe – only in so much that I want people to believe that gun owners are just people. We spend a lot of time saying that a gun is just a tool – I’m not sure being identified as “People of the Gun” illustrates that well. (Yeah yeah – cultural symbols are important – but this a blog comment – not an essay).
I like “People of the Gun”. It has a sense of community; unity. Now, if only more People of the Gun looked like her… much easier on the eyes!
It’s a shame Guns & Ammo can’t stand behind its author. Metcalf’s column was discussed in planning meetings. It was approved, it was written, it was edited, it was fact checked, it was run past legal, it was approved again, it was mocked up and it was eventually printed. Dozens at G&A people touched or worked with this article. To think that Metcalf somehow did this on his own, without knowledge of other G&A editors and his boss is laughable. A small group of subscribers threatened to pull subscriptions which made G&A and their advertisers nervous. So instead of Jim B. stepping down, he did the cowardly thing and fired the author. Jim said” I made a mistake by publishing the column. I thought it would generate a healthy exchange of ideas on gun rights. I miscalculated, pure and simple. I was wrong, and ask your forgiveness.” And then instead of falling on his sword, he shot Metcalf.
Come on guys, why are we even having this discussion? Political Correctness was invented by lefties to shame us into feeling bad for everything from carrying a gun, to smoking, to being more successful than some other guy. I would bet my favorite heater / gat / roscoe that not too many of us here are the least bit PC nor care what the libtards at Gawker / NYT/ Huffington think of us. They are going to make up labels for us anyway…..why not own up to them? The best way to disarm a bully is to take away their ammo. So everyone of us should proudly declare ourselves “THE PEOPLE OF THE GUN”, or “GUN NUTS”, or whatever else you like and tell the bullies to go F@&K themselves! For I would submit that the term is just as inclusive as it is exclusionary and given the choice I think there are quite a number of Americans out there who would rather be with The People of the Gun than The People Not of the Gun.
Especially if we can get them all to wear tee shirts like this: http://www.spreadshirt.com/red-target-women-s-t-shirts-C3376A5967302
Why does his picture look like he just put saran wrap over the toilet?
According to a book that many regard as infallible, my ancestors were slaves in the land of Egypt. While I don’t expect any reparations, I do keep myself well armed and trained to avoid any further intrusions on my independence. If any groups should rejoice in the rights protected by the Second Amendment, it should be the blacks and the Jews, who should well understand the consequences of being unarmed/disarmed.
If ignorance, stupidity and bigotry are the hallmarks of being a gun owner, then Mr. Mystal should have a very impressive armory.
And that’s the picture of we the people slipping through the fingers of the government.
Call us Americans. If you do not defend your constitutional rights, every last one of them, you are not an American. America is not the law, the government, or political body. It is We The People. Never forget that.
What’s the backstory behind this video? Unfortunately, I don’t read Chinese.
There are three things I thought of while watching that:
1) Those people could use some 3D printers.
2) I suspect the cops, upon seeing that video, would use the wide shots to figure out which apartment it’s coming from, and send those people to “reeducation camp”.
And scariest of all…
3) When the line of shield bearing cops, and later the cops with the handcuffs, were interacting with the protesters, those enforcers of communist dictatorship were less violent than American cops are with people who aren’t 100% deferential, and far less violent than American cops were with the WTO protesters and Occupiers.
Sounds and looks great I am looking to purchase one at a local shop and find somewhere to shoot it in New Jersey
Metcalf posted that crap so he can have a shot at nudging me aside for first dance and drink with Shannon Watts(TM). I see you MotherF**ker! I see you!
Americans suffer overreaching fools to almost no end. That’s why this website exists.
I never go running with any music devices so I can hear vehicles hauling ass behind me before they pass.
I quit reading G&A when Col. Cooper passed. I don’t have any plans to restart.
@ Pete Mack: Even the 1939 SCOTUS ruling disagrees with you since automatic weapons have a military purpose. The reason they didn’t like sawed of shotguns is they claimed they did not have a military purpose. Furthermore, you should take a look at what the Finns did to repel the Soviets in WWII when the Soviets were in league with the 3rd Reich. They defeated the Red Machine despite being heavily out numbered and out armed. They operated in units made up of neighborhood militia units. The 2A isn’t there for just now but the future should it fall to the people to make a stand against an enemy. Who knows, in 50 years it could be the Mexicans, Red Chinese, or someone that isn’t even on the current radar. Look at our military strength between WWI and WWII. Our unorganized militia was probably our best defense for a 15 year period.
I just have one word.
Baddabing!
The attorney for the Maryland home defense case should be calling for the US Attorney General’s office to investigate the state prosecutor’s office for conspiry to deprive the man of his civil rights. I know it will fall on deaf ears considering who our AG is, but we need to be raising the spectre of this sort of action should a less hostile administration ever be elected in the future.
Anyone wanna take bets on when his big, fat, sloppy, heart will explode?