A Chigaco-area scumbag is perforated, but alive today after he and an accomplice traveled to Gary, Indiana to rob the inaptly-named ‘Safe And Sound Social Club.’ The club may have looked like a soft target because it’s a popular hangout for senior citizens, but the two armed perps seem to have forgotten that Indiana is a ‘shall issue’ CCW state. Unlike the defenseless sheep of Chicagoland, there are armed sheepdogs among the flock in the Hoosier State. And when the Chi-town yoots started shooting up the joint, one of them had the effrontery to shoot back . . .
From ABC-7 News (Chicago):
Five people, including the suspected gunman, were shot at the Safe and Sound Social Club in Gary, Indiana. Officers responded to the members-only club Wednesday around 11:30 p.m. in the 2200 block of Broadway in Gary.
Police say the suspected gunman is a 23-year-old from Chicago. They believe his motive was to rob people at the senior citizens club…
“They had hoods on like this, you couldn’t see their face,” said witness Jessie Sturgis.
Sturgis says one gunman took off while the other pointed a gun at him and three other club patrons. Sturgis says he escaped through the front door. As he called the police from outside the club, he said he heard several shots from inside. Some of the club patrons hid in a utility closet.
E.C. Robinson, 65, a Gary resident, was shot but managed to defend himself and others with his own gun.
“He shot him twice, that is when E.C. started shooting back,” said one witness.
The suspect hid in the bathroom after he was shot until police came and took him into custody.
Sturgis said he hopes the shooting will send a message to the younger people who want to cause trouble from Chicago.
“We’re in Indiana, they [are] from Illinois, they don’t know people got permits to carry guns, so bang bang, that is what happened,” Sturgis said.
Four innocent people were hurt, but a mass robbery and shooting was stopped in its tracks by…a good guy with a gun. This shows why Indiana is a safer place to be a law-abiding citizen. And why Chicago is paradise only for the lawless and violent.
The mommy cult would have us believe that this kind of thing never happens, but it happens every week as it happened here. Bang, bang, that is what happened.
Any word from moms demanding, or mayors against, or (d)evolve???
Bueller….. Bueller…..
My thoughts exactly.
A 65 yo was shot twice and then returned fire. And the guy that shot him, who was much younger, was found crying in the toilet waiting to be rescued by the cops.
E.C Robinson is Latin for Brass Balls? Somebody with a better education than me step in and correct me if I’m wrong.
I suspect him getting shot had something to do with him getting his own gun out, rather than the idea that this was going to be a massive grandparent killing. I’m perfectly happy with some robber getting plugged (better yet, put in the ground) but I hope that everyone else is okay. Wonder who shot the other victims.
Not to stereyotype, but generally young bangers dont know shit and are carrying something underpowered like a .22 .25 or .380 but those in the legal carry arena understand that 9mm is a acceptable minimum and hollow points prefered. So if homie exchanged a couple LRN .22LR for 230gr JHP golden sabers, he might not feel so hot
I was waiting for someone to bring out the 45 debate. But if you read carefully, everyone survived. Even the thug who took a 45 didn’t drop dead and evaporate.
That is why I carry a Romulan disrupter and nothing less.
He was probably was using leftover FMJ ball rounds from WWII. Maybe if he was using R.I.P. rounds….
Even thugs deserve to live, because people can change, given enough motivation.
So, even though Dave Letterman makes a joke of it, I thank God no one was killed.
yyyessssss – the weapon of the enemy, the disruptor.
good call.
But his soul was killed.
“But his soul was killed.”
Or ready to be redeemed. I’ll bet the guy is ready for a career change.
Rich, I admire but do not share your optimism. I suspect any piece of human garbage depraved enough to go into a senior citizen’s club and start shooting people over a few dollars isn’t the sort who reforms that easily. I’ll bet dollars to donuts this guy A) has an extensive criminal record already (and thus, many previous opportunities to straighten up) and B) will continue to be a piece of shit when he gets out of prison.
@pyrate Id prefer a Klingon disruptor if I HAD to pick 🙂 Glad to see the nerdiness thoroughly permeates TTAG!
Why shoot some one twice? .460 Rowland, 180g bullet, 1550 ft/sec; 1000ft/lbs at the muzzle; 44 magnum ballistics in a .45 ACP gun.
As close as a one shot stop without carrying a .500 S and W. or a shot gun loaded with slugs and 00 buck.
Sheep—————-Sheepdog————–Wolf
It’s relatively easy to go from Sheep to Sheepdog, and easy for those who make the choice to go from Sheepdog to Wolf, but once a Wolf you lose the trust to ever become a Sheepdog again. The only choice is to be a sheep.
“Sheep—————-Sheepdog————–Wolf”
Yeah, but I’m a Human. Each person is supposed to be a sovereign being, relating with peers in whatever manner they choose. Of course, if you want to be a sheep, that’s your privilege – just find a shepherd you like. But if you send men with guns to force me to join your herd, I will resist with everything I’ve got.
(that’s the generic editorial ‘you’; nothing personal.)
Well, Sheepdog6; not so much, unless the sheepdog; ie(police) are given special permission to kill the sheep; even if by accident, without consequence; then it’s easy to become a wolf among the sheep they are supposed to protect;
I’m guessing you’re being ironic about the rest of just staying a sheep
@Sheepdog6. Screw that “Sheep”-sh1t – anybody that messes with my furry-ass is going to get BIT !…
Stereo type would of course be that the old guy (I’m not that far behind) had a good old 38 Snubbie.
But really don’t know.
Didn’t someone recently get killed really dead in a movie theater with a .380? And wasn’t that .380 wielded by a tactical ninja stealth ranger cop? My point is that we can’t assume that bad guys carry mouse guns, nor can we assume that good guys carry 9mm+P or better, and we have to remember that even .22’s have filled many a grave.
A study done by the University of Pennsylvania showed that, in Philadelphia,:
In 1985, of 91 homicides
44% .38 caliber revolver
19% .25 caliber pistol
14% .22 caliber revolver
14% .32 caliber revolver
3% 9 mm pistol
2% .357 caliber revolver
In 1990, of 204 homicides
23% 9 mm pistol
18% .38 caliber revolver
16% .357 caliber revolver
16% .22 caliber revolver
10% .32 caliber revolver
Man, that must’ve been a pretty bad 5 year period between 85 and 90. Also, if I’m interpreting the stat correctly is seems to suggest that the number of homicides increased in proportion to the increased use of larger caliber pistols.
My Walther PK380 with +P .380 ammo is equal to a standard 9mm, rugged, relialble and easily carried concealed.
Do not mess with old guys. They can’t beat you anymore, so they will definitely just shoot you if you deserve it.
“Safe and Sound” Social Club – safe and sound because some members were armed with GUNS!
GUNS! OMG GUNS! The senior citizens HAVE GUNS! THERE’S GOING TO BE BLOOD IN THE STREETS!
Yeah, think of the children…
It’s pretty obvious they already did… or did you miss the part where an armed citizen was prepared to stop what ever thuggery he came by?
I think PistoleroJesse , he was using irony to make his point.
“Age and treachery will always triumph over youth and skill”
“We’re in Indiana, they [are] from Illinois, they don’t know people got permits to carry guns, so bang bang, that is what happened,” Sturgis said
Love it, love everything about it.
+1
+2
+ 3
Wow, there’s nothing about this story that can be spun in a negative way. I suspect this wont last long in the news cycle.
What kind of self control does it take to shoot back only after being shot twice? I dont have it….
They will certainly attempt to spin it that if they had just given up their social security checks peacefully then nobody would have gotten shot. All injuries are the result of the vigilante with a gun going wild west and forcing the disadvantaged teenager to shoot back in self-defense.
See, that was anger. The yoot made him mad.
If you don’t think you will have it in you to fight back then you won’t. Attitude is everything. What doesn’t kill you should piss you off enough to fight back.
Sounds fair to me. It’s to bad that Chicago is exporting it’s criminals. Also to bad for them that they were stupid enough to go where the second amendment counts and concealed carry is legal. Maybe they should have stayed where they were.
You know the “where do crime guns come from?” maps that always show southern states as the “major suppliers?” Why does it never occur to the authors/illustrators of those maps that in order to “export crime guns,” a criminal from one of those states must first export himself to the free state in question? And why is there never a “where do gun criminals come from” map?
Exactly. The places that are net importers of “crime guns” are net exporters of actual crime.
The mommy club would say that a bunch of people got shot over what would have been a robbery and not a shooting. We’ll see if the little rat decided to shoot grandpa for no reason or because grandpa was about to ventilate him.
A gun isn’t always the best option and I think we should recognize that sometimes, when property is at stake and there are a lot of bystanders around with multiple assailants, the better move may be to give up the watch. But that choice doesn’t need to be made by a politician or activist.
I fully believe that the better move is always to to be willing to give up the watch. Or wallet. They are only things.
But my life? Someone else’s life?
Nope. That’s why I carry.
And sadly I’ve been hearing more and more of tales where despite compliance, the vic’s get hurt anyways.
All my stuff is insured and replaceable. My life an the lives of those around me are not replaceable.
My CC instructor said basically the same thing, that it will cost about $8,000 to clean up a “mess”. He said you are much better off just watching someone carry off your shiny new tee vee.
Do you know if a regular homeowners insurance pays for that clean up?
“Do you know if a regular homeowners insurance pays for that clean up?”
Actually, that’s a very good question. Next time I buy a house that’s one of the things I’ll have to remember to check on. I also wonder, if you have a fire extinguisher in each room and 2 in the kitchen and garage (and basement), would you get a break on fire insurance?
$8,000 for what? Professional Cleaning of scumbag brains?
Compliance is a bragain, a compromise. For compromise to work both parties must act in good faith. I’ll always assume someone criminally attempting to relieve me of my things is incapable of acting in good faith. Therefore any action by me that is percieved as complying with a criminal is really an attempt to gain a tactical advantage from which to defend myself with or safely retreat from the situation.
Was reading some stats on this just a few days ago…compliance still results in victim injury about 50% of the time. Injury was broadly defined.
I get it. The pacing of posts on this site is based on action film pacing: First something as depressing as Evolve, then a cheering report about senior-citizen self-defense in Gary, Indiana. Well, it works. There has to be some relief now and then. Brass balls indeed. And the hoodlum who hid to be rescued by the police? Typical.
An armed Senior Center is a polite Senior Center.
The Grey Panthers are alive and well. And armed.
A message to all Windy City thugs and bums — stay in the Chicago City Council where you belong and keep out of Indiana.
Sadly, it was not one of the many Chicago City Council members who deserve a bullet. One can only hope.
“Everyone was on the floor but the gunman kept pulling the trigger, Lay said. “The dude came in, told everyone to hit the floor. But the dude doesn’t wait and starts shooting,” he said. “He pointed the gun all around. He wasn’t aiming. . . People were hollering and shots were popping.”
http://my.chicagotribune.com/#section/-1/article/p2p-79284549/
I wonder if Al Sharpton will stop by the club for a latte. No? What a shame.
Why the racist-baiting? I didn’t see any mention of skin color in the article.
Rich, I don’t think it’s race baiting, but because Because Al Sharpton is fundamentally racist himself. He portrays himself to be an advocate for the disadvantaged or downtrodden. Senior citizens by virtue of their age are at risk. So where was Al Sharpton to express his outrage?
BTW – I agree largely with your thoughts. I’m 62 and conceal carry myself in Indiana. I hope all embrace the responsibility that goes along with this right. Use of the weapon is only justified if you have reasonable belief (1) to prevent great personal bodily harm or death; (2) to prevent a forcible felony, e.g., kidnapping, rape, assault with a deadly weapon; or (3) to prevent a person to terminate a home invasion or a car you are occupying. But it’s also complex in these instances – a matter of proportinality. Say if you are a 40 year old 200 pound male standing in your bedroom, and a small female appears wearing a ski mask and threatens you with a baseball bat. Would you shoot her? Yes, if you want to spend the rest of your life in jail. This is somewhat similar to the guy in Florida recently found guilty of murdering that poor boy playing loud music. The guy belongs in jail. GZ however proved beyond a reasonable doubt that he was not guilty. I read the facts of that case and the jury made the right decision even though Al Sharpton disagrees.
Where is Madam Twatts? isn’t this her backyard? She really needs to get OFF the MAIGs and get to straightening out her own house. /sarcasm on/ after all you can’t possibly have the people defending themselves like that?/sarcasm OFF/
Yeah, except what the MSM is barely reporting is that this senior citizens club was also an illegal gambling parlor. On the stupid people/places/things yardstick that’s at least a 2.
As bad as Chicago is, only Gary would have a senior citizen club/illegal gambling parlor. Gary is one scary place.
So it hasn’t changed since the 70s. Good thing to know.
Why is gambling illegal? Where is the Constitutional authorization to regulate people’s private behavior?
It could very well be a state law, so the US Constitution would not apply.
“It could very well be a state law, so the US Constitution would not apply.”
Boy, I hope this was intended as sarcasm.
Just FYI, Article. VI.
“…This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof, … shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding. …” (emphasis mine)
— http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/charters/constitution_transcript.html#6.0
An unconstitutional law isn’t a law.
C’mon, Rich. Gambling is illegal unless (i) the state does it, (ii) the state profits from it, or (iii) you’re rolling dem bones on Casino Night at Our Lady of Holy Smoke.
Yeah, I know. I was asking, why? For the fscking chiiiiiiiillldruuuuuuunnnnnnn?
…bingo?
I guess he kept the hot card in his wallet, huh?
In the words of one my favorite Hip Hop Groups Brand Nubian, Punks jump up to get beat down! Obviously these idiots thought they could use the same tactics across state lines. These guys didn’t think about the Bang Bang policy that’s in place in Indiana.
Dear Rahm:
Keep your Illinois-ing thug voters on your side of the fence, unless you want fewer voters.
This is part of a new city council program designed to promote and export their stupidity nationwide.
Heyjackass.com
You have a Shot-In-the-Ass-O-Meter?
Someone is going to have to send me to jelly school after seeing that.
There isn’t anything I like more than perps getting perforated during the commission of a crime.
Another Wayne LaPierre “told you so” moment.
Dear hoodie-clad Chi-town punks,
They didn’t get this old by being sissies. Stay home where you are safe.
Cordially,
The Bang Bang Social Club.
I thought maybe it was a local thing but increasingly the DGU reports make me wonder:
Around here most the youngest CCW holders typically carry something too big but they carry it every day for a few months then slowly slack off.
The middle group, say 30-50 break down into a few daily carriers and the rest carry on occasion.
By 65 though the ratio changes, maybe it’s retirement, maybe its a generational thing, maybe it’s that older men often aren’t trying much to be fashionable and their clothes better suit comfortable carry, but it seems to me that aside from the dedicated EDC guys who make a life style around it its the old men who are most constantly armed. I suppose the realization that you’re not going to run very far or fast and that you can’t fight like you used to is a part of that, but at any age we all know the risks so there must be other things at play.
The take away is don’t pick on seniors, its morally repugnant and there is a better than average chance they’ll (I so happy to get to use this stolen line) violently install a ventilation system in you.
Yes, Ardent, I’m not as mobile as I was in my youth. Or as able to go hand to hand with a male half my age.
Also, us older guys are more likely to have been raised in the old school way. We were taught in church, in school, in our homes, in our boy scout troops and finally in the service that the strong looked after the weak. It was our job, as men, to protect those around us.
That training seems to be missing in a large portion of the younger guys.
I can’t deny that last at all JWM. These days it seems grown young men have no shame in completely shirking their duty to provide for themselves or others in any arena, self defense included. I could point out shining examples but they are outweighed by far to many who come to the table with nothing but needs and a sense of entitlement.
In my work I see them day in day out, in their 20’s, didn’t finish school, never had a job and battling addiction (I shudder to think how they managed to pay for drugs). You’d think perhaps they would start with an apology for their sorry situation and a can do attitude about facilitating in any way they can the help you’re about to provide them with, but instead what I often see are sullenness, helplessness, and the expectation that you will do everything for them right down to complaining about even filling out forms for free housing and health care, as if filling out a form was more work than housing is worth. . .
I have no solutions, except perhaps advocating and training and permitting system for parenting (mostly kidding).
“The take away is don’t pick on seniors, its morally repugnant and there is a better than average chance they’ll (I so happy to get to use this stolen line) violently install a ventilation system in you.”
Assertive force in defense of life and limb isn’t violence.
The Demanding Moms are HQ’d safely in Indiana and have no idea how much they are being protected by the CCWs all around them.
I thought if they had a hoodie they were a good guy, I’ll tell you, this senior can barely keep track anymore.
Regardless of who shot whom, I think it is pretty obvious why the “Moms” aren’t going anywhere near this story.
Yes, and I think its in part for some of the same reasons that a senior citizen is less likely to hesitate before shooting in defense; they look awfully good in front of a jury (or camera) from the defensive end in the first place, and it’s hard to gin up sympathy for someone who attacks the elderly.
Taken further, its hard to say this guy was out ‘looking for trouble’ unless the local senior citizens center is a hot bed of criminal activity.
Though stereotypes can ever be misleading. . . some of the scariest guys I’ve ever known were collecting social security; stubborn, set in their ways, mean in their younger days and at least as hard bitten now, bitter about aging, jealous of youth and well aware they had a better than average chance at beating the rap if they plugged someone younger and seemingly more able.
Don’t mess with the old guy, if you win, congratulations thug, you took advantage of a senior citizen, lose and you lost to a senior citizen, and besides, it just might be that the retiree you’re zeroing in on would like nothing better than to take you down a notch and has a plan.
Shannon Watts is a flash in the pan. She will not engage in any credible debate. She makes up statistics and tells absolute falsehoods. I’m basing this on her recent tirade against the TV show “The View” when it had Dana Loesch on as a guest host. Dana had invited Watts to debate the gun control topic, but she refused. I don’t think she’s honestly knowledgeable enough to debate the subject. Besides, she needs to update her phote – must be 10 years and 50 Ills ago.
To old to fight, to young to take and asswoop’n, that’s why you carry.
Senior citizens defend themselves against armed thugs. Nothing to see here as far as the Mommyies against guns are concerned. Will get limited airplay and be quickly forgotten. Information about the innocent lives lost in the Davis affair and the need to repeal Stand your Ground will overshadow it within 12 hours.
Every lowlife crack head from the City knows there’s a boatload of legal handguns in Indiana. Homies must have been extra high/retarded to pick on old folks. Too bad he’s going to be a burden to Indiana prisons/taxpayers. He’d plead out in Chicago & get probation. No death penalty in Illinois, Indiana does.
Fort wayne journal reported 500,000 permit holders in todays paper an 85pct increase in a year. Also most are lifetime permits now.
“Mommy cult,” now your writers are going against you own policy.
Really? Interesting. Do tell.
Don’t encourage him.
I prefer to think of it as “egging on” … no? 😀
Trollfeeding/baiting.
“Mommy Cult”; that’s a great line and describes the MDA Pied Piper Watts and her minions perfectly.
I’ll have to start using that line!
Thanks for bringing the logic of that description to my attention, Shawn!
From the Chicago news media…..
A misunderstood child (they’re all children until age 24 or they move out of the basement, right?) who never had a puppy was on his way home from a prayer meeting and Bible study when he stopped at the Safe and Sound Social Club. He had just discovered an illegal handgun in the crotch of his pants that had been placed there by the gun fairy and wanted to turn in the gun at the safest place he could see. Unfortunately the gun “went off” by itself and he was met by a hail of gunfire from the crazed military veterans in the club. Police say that the alleged robber will soon be released so that he may continue his studies at the Jeremiah Wright School of Theology.
There you go!
And we have today’s Internets Winner!
“Kendell Reed, 23, is on parole for a 2011 Illinois conviction for armed robbery.”
This is my surprised face.
I am confident he submitted to a voluntary background check
This reminded me of something?
http://www.privateprotectiontrust.com/images/Gun-Billboard-Indiana.png
And I do believe E.C. was standing his ground rather enthusiastically. Shannon?
E.C. went down
but stood his ground while lay’n down
on that groud he was standing on.
I wonder if the thug that initiated hostilities (and ended up cowering in the toilet) will get a Darwin Award (dis)honorable mention?
Eric Holder will probably charge the old guy with hate crimes.
Who would take the bet that the shooter spends more time in the hospital than he does in jail?
I say we publish Shannon Watts home, I mean MDAs corporate address, in the Chicago Defender (local Chicago urban paper) with pictures and directions. She is in Indiana. Let us see if hubby John Watts mans up and decides to protect his family or will they just wait for the police.
I fail to see how he can with his cojones being held up in a jar by the door and guarded jealously by the little woman. or maybe she carries them around in her purse … hard to know. or maybe … even worse … she keeps them in her purse and then makes him carry it.
OK, that mental image cracked me up.
Reminds me of an old Sam kinneson skit.
“Guys, if you ever loved me, shoot me!”
Wha’ the…?!? They’re armed! Nooo!!!
“Tyrel, I gots me a feelin’ we ain’t in Illinois no more…”
Chris,
I would appreciate if you did not make blanket statements that refer to myself and like-minded individuals as “the defenseless sheep of Chicagoland.” I can assure you that I am not defenseless, CCW or not, and am not a sheep. Thank you.
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