John Crump writes [via ammoland.com]: Ever since the shooting at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in Parkland Florida the anti-gun groups have been out in force to try to strip people of their god given right of self-defense.
They have paraded many student pawns out on that national stage to promote their gun control agenda. They have been using emotions as their facts to try to persuade the public to give up their rights.
Not only is this Astroturf campaign going on at a national level, but it is also going on at the state level. One of the places we see gun control being pushed is in Oregon. An interfaith group has submitted a ballot initiative petition that, according to them, would prevent mass shootings.
What Initiative Petition 43 would do is ban most semiautomatic rifles and nearly all pistols.
The initiative states any rifle capable of accepting a magazine and one of the other cosmetic features listed in the initiative would be banned and labeled an “assault weapon.” Also, if the rifle is less than 30 inches, it would be considered an “assault weapon.”
Any pistol that is capable of accepting a magazine that holds more than ten rounds would be an “assault weapon.” This initiative would ban virtually every semiautomatic pistol since all can take a magazine that holds more than ten rounds.
It will not matter if the owner has a magazine over ten rounds. Just the fact that the pistol is capable of using a larger magazine would be enough to ban them.
All magazines that hold over ten rounds would also be banned. The initiative refers to these magazines as “high capacity.” The group seems to have borrowed text from a similar bill (H.R.5087) that was introduced in US House of Representatives by Rep. David Cicilline (D-R.I). We have also seen similar measures with the word for word same language pop up in other states such as the bill introduced in Minnesota by Rep Linda Slocum.
The initiative would also ban most semiautomatic shotguns. The initiative would ban any semiautomatic shotgun that holds more than ten rounds or takes an external magazine. Any shotgun with a pistol grip or without a fixed stock would also be banned.
Residents would have 120 days to transfer their firearms out of the state, turn them over to police, or register their guns. Residents who don’t get rid of or register their guns would be committing a felony. There is no word on how police would enforce the law.
One of the leaders of the interfaith group is Alcena Boozer. Boozer is the Reverend at St. Philip the Deacon Episcopal Church in Portland. She has praised the Black Panthers and Malcolm X for the positive things that they did during the 1960s. St. Philip the Deacon is connected to the “Urban League of Portland“. The Urban League is a member of the “Coalition to Stop Gun Violence.”
Another leader of the interfaith group is Rabbi Michael Z. Cahana at Beth Israel in Portland which preaches Reform Judaism (also known as Liberal Judaism or Progressive Judaism). Rabbi Michael Z. Cahana writes reviews of science fiction shows for Variety. Beth Israel is also pushing their congregation to take part in “The March for Our Lives.” They are going as far as canceling their services that day to “take to the streets of Portland” telling their members that they must “pray with their feet.”
The final leader is Rev. Walter J. Knutson of St. Mark’s Lutheran Church. Rev. Knutson has been a pastor of the church since 1945. Out of the three congregations, this is the only one that seems not to be overtly political.
The initiative would need to get 88,000 signatures by July. This feat might seem like a long shot, but this campaign has the full weight and check books of the Urban League and the “Coalition to Stop Gun Violence” behind it. And they intend on using school students to gather signatures. Gun owners must stand vigilant against encroachment of our rights.
And up next, a crusade against those deadly assault speedloaders that allow criminals to load six rounds at once!
(Maybe I shouldn’t be giving them ideas….)
I blame the fucking metric system. Stupid base ten. If we stuck to English units, we could at least have a dozen rounds.
My car gets forty rods to the hogshead and that’s the way I like it!
Oregon is doing in 5 years what CA took 20 to do. To think I once had OR on my move to short list.
California blazed the trail, and everyone else on the West Coast is following behind.
True, although if something like this were to pass (a long shot to be sure) Oregon would take a pretty commanding lead on the war against the 2A. A lead, no doubt, CA, N.Y. and NJ (amongst others) would fight tooth and nail to take back.
Leftists gotta try to out-left each other. That’s what they do.
In fact, it’s in the name; Progressive.
It’s the dynamic at play behind virtue-signaling.
They can’t help it.
They’re broken, and it’s all they know how to do.
Washington State had a similar proposal in its legislature. It didn’t go anywhere this session, but they’ll try again.
But this is a ballot initiative. Its surprisingly easy to convince lemmings to vote away their freedoms and Constitutional rights. CA is a great example; they are destroying thrmselves thru ballot initiatives
The gun grabbers and press are in the same echo chamber. 95% of journalists who donated to political campaigns were Democrats. They reinforce each other and have deluded themselves into thinking the represent the majority.
There have been a few stories about kids who did not want to walk out to support gun control, and a few schools which treated walking out as unauthorized absence; but they were so buried that I am convinced it just reaffirms how delusional the gun grabbers and press are, that they have to suppress what they believe to be a very small opposition.
Where this will lead, I do not know. I believe they are in or a rude shock, soon, but I can’t predict what form it will take.
i saw one sign that summed it up best: “LET’S MAKE THIS A VOTING ISSUE”
my immediate reaction was “Please lets make this a voting issue”. Until proven otherwise, gun control does not win elections. if i’m wrong i’m wrong but i don’t see it as ‘different this time’.
echo chamber gonna echo.
I am not sure that the bill would ban virtually all semiautomatic handguns, as California has long banned handguns that accept more than ten rounds, but we have on the Roster many handguns that are legal because they are shipped with 10 round mags, e.g., Glocks, many of which can hold far more with a different mag.
I doubt that it is a long shot to get 88,000 signatures. They needn’t venture outside of the greater Portland/Salem area to find enough college students and liberals to get this on the ballot, and if past voting is any guide, the liberal urban areas outvote the rest of the state, just as they do iin California and Washington.
It’s in the details. This particular initiative would ban pistols that have the *ability* to accept more than 10 rounds, regardless of whether you have such a magazine. That’s pretty much every pistol (not revolver) manufactured today.
I hope you realize, they will consider that a feature, not a bug.
Because, Guns!
Sure. I don’t think they actually understand the difference… at all… but they’ll be happy until it gets knocked out by a court.
I believe it was NY that was toying with passing a similar law (7 rounds instead) but someone who actually knew how guns work warned them that it would never get past even a relatively liberal circuit court so they changed it to make it a crime to load more than 7 rounds in any magazine. That was also laughed out of court.
1911s for the win!
I went looking for the actual text. All links were dead except to Initiative 42, which is apparently identical or nearly so. The definition of “assault weapon” vis-a-vis pistols is the same as California’s and it applies only to AR/AK style pistols with a second handgrip, a barrel shroud other than a slide, the ability to accept more than 10 rounds in a FIXED magazine, thumbhole or folding stocks. So it isn’t the end of the world as these articles suggest.
There are plenty of 11+ round 1911 magazines out there.
It is statistically unlikely that a person would need more than three bullets for any legitimate self-defense purpose. A revolver with five rounds is overkill, in my opinion. It is therefore reasonable for Oregon to regulate revolver magazines to less than ten rounds.
Armor-piercing hollow-point bullets should be banned too, because these are cop-killer bullets.
/sarc?
Unlike what your grade school teacher said, opinions can be wrong, and your opinion is wrong.
Handguns are notoriously bad man stoppers. 9, 40 and 45 have ver little stopping power. It may take many rounds to end the threat. Also, the number of multi person attacks is just under 50% and that percentage is rising.
That is statistically unlikely because the hooligans will most likely run away even if you miss. Pepper spray will stop a robbery in its tracks all the same even if the robber is a bear.
This is probably sarc. Poet’s law still applies for the OP.
Brian: No, it a high school child. We have been starting to get them the last couple weeks.
He’s right that, statistically, the chance of needing more than 6 rounds to defend one’s self in a lifetime living in most of the US is INCREDIBLY unlikely.
hell, even needing a gun at all is unlikely
(so is needing a fire extinguisher or smoke alarm in your house but here we are)
This isn’t even Junior Varsity level trolling…but, I can’t resist saying I don’t give two shits what anyone thinks I *need*.
I don’t know where you got your information. The most effective rule of thumb in defensive firearm use is to shoot until there is no longer a threat.
https://www.usconcealedcarry.com/many-times-shoot/
http://blog.thejustnation.org/2012/01/how-often-and-where-to-shoot-an-attacker/
If it takes more than three rounds, you’ll need more than three rounds.
If you’re talking about banning any firearm the you do not ‘support the second’.
Is there such a thing as armor piercing hollow point bullets? Cool, where can I buy them?
At the cop killer supply store, duh!;-)
They’re Teflon coated dum dums.
Good, I hate it when my bullets stick together.
Looks like Oregon knows nothing about firearms don’t be surprised when the citizens play 1776 to force libtards their political positions which the founding fathers gave us the right to.
I actually would very much be surprised because I’ve been hearing that line for decades and no second revolution has occurred despite assault weapon bans, magazine restriction, laws against bearing arms, etc .
We fought a resolution over a tea tax, in which the rate was close to 5%. If you total up all the taxes we pay today, its closer to 50% and Americans are too lazy to get off the couch to do something about it.
If I might deign to sally forth with another observation, it is worthy of note that shotgun bullets hold as many as a hundred pellets inside. This would classify all shotguns as assault weapons too because these weapons fire more lethal projectiles than the archetypal machine gun.
Troll MOARRRR!!!!
No, really, your simpleton posts are amusing. Keep them going.
He said revolver magazines. Man, that is priceless.
and ” shotgun bullets”
Kind of reminds me of the AntiFa parody videos from last year.
it is worthy of note that shotgun bullets hold as many as a hundred pellets inside.
Shotgun bullets?
They will get the signatures, and get most modern guns banned.
Because they will inflame the fears of the stupid.
The only way that can be stopped is for SCOTUS to be solidly conservative, and declare those laws unconstitutional.
Until then, hang on, its gonna be a *bumpy* ride.
I hope Tom in Oregon isn’t particularly fond of his house, because he’s likely gonna need to relocate someplace freer, like Idaho.
Unless Idaho is set to go bat-crap-crazy like Oregon…
Tom is not the only one of us in Oregon that may be in trouble…
I personally feel this is a lost cause because unlike the liberals, conservative folks, free thinkers, or any other pro self defense person is not willing to rally in large groups across the nation. The conservative minded celebrities are not willing to support awareness.
Most people of the gun don’t want to be in any spotlight, part of that mindset includes wanting to be left alone, or includes folks concerned about being filmed, photographed, or arrested for the cause just puts them on the top of the gun grabbing lists.
Most of these liberals are not at risk to lose anything, they love the attention, and they aren’t hindered by modern stages prohibing their thoughts s like we see with Facebook, YouTube, and Twitter.
All that comes together to a lack of the American people seeing positive outcomes from our line of thinking, lack of role models to rally behind and get excited about. Our public image is shaped by the shooting incidents that nobody wants to exist.
The comments here are either hopes and wishes, depression, or threats for more bloodshed. None of this is making the situation better.
Things like Crowder’s change my mind series help, using the Socratic method to force opposing views to deeply understand their position, and exposing more people to safe gun use with lots of other people also being safe is helping.
Hiding in the closet with the guns just alienates us more because it either makes us appear to have something to hide, or worse, it minimizes just how many guns are around people in their daily life that don’t kill on their own.
/End soapbox
These things are cyclical and we have ups and downs. Feeling the illusion of power, antis will overreach and hurt themselves. It’s pretty reliable human nature. Congress has always sucked. That is not cyclical, it is a constant.
Correct. The 2A community needs to quit being invisible and get off the couch. It’s not enough to just send money to the NRA any more. If we don’t get active in the streets the whole country is going to look like New Jersey and California.
The real power is at the ballot box, not marching around like useful idiots. We have and will continue to out vote these fools. Even if we could march like the left, the media wouldn’t cover us. Voting and hammering legislators is where it is at. That’s why in WA we crushed them this year (albeit a bump stock ban did get through no thanks to some traitor RINOs).
“They will get the signatures, and get most modern guns banned.”
Bullshit, even if they get it on a ballot it’ll go down in _flames_. The bill is so incredibly broad that it’ll be trivial to attack. Quit being dramatic.
And arrogant overconfidence is a popular way to lose a battle.
Master the art of kind verbal persuasion and you will most likely never need any type of firearm at all. Say to Mr. Robber “Kind sir, Sorry to take up some of your time but I haven’t any monetary comestibles of the sort you might be inquiring into.” This will most assuredly placate Mr. Robber.
Unlike some here, I enjoy your sense of humor.
Citizens’ initiatives are the worse idea ever. Direct democracy is basically mob rule. When was mob rule ever a good idea?
Pretty much never.
“Any pistol that is capable of accepting a magazine that holds more than ten rounds would be an “assault weapon.””
I distinctly recall seeing extended stick magazines and even drum magazines for 1911-pattern pistols.
That’s gonna put a serious cramp in some folk’s style…
In other words, anything capable of accepting a magazine.
That’s a feature not a bug.
All these gun-control nonsense has only one purpose, disarm the law abiding citizens so that only police and criminals could own firearms. If they decide to ban all motor vehicles too (because they also kill people) I will give up on my dearest hobby of target shooting.
Geee…why would they only want police, military and criminals to have guns?
I just have no idea?
Indiana Tom: I know it is not what your thinking, but I suspect it is largely that they are afraid of having the responsibility for their own well-being, especially self-protection. It seems that they also see nobility in victim-hood. These ignorant students have been transformed into temporary rock stars by their victim-hood alone. It is a powerful thing for the progressives.
but I suspect it is largely that they are afraid of having the responsibility for their own well-being, especially self-protection.
Do you think it might be a dream of world wide new order socialist government where everything is wonderful due to a government which is always all knowing and good?
Yes, I no longer have to make hard decisions and accept responsibility for my failures.
I no longer have to think for myself. Group think.
Again…ridiculous definitions…thinly veiled ban…and will do nothing to stop violence…gun or otherwise
Geez OreGONE…I’m sure we’ll be seeing this BS in Illinoisistan. Fight the Power😡
My pocket pistol would be banned as an assault weapon. That’s hilarious. And terrifying.
I would think that a ban on commonly used firearms- especially the same ones used by local police or sheriffs would be blatantly unconstitutional. But then I think the average upstanding citizen should have access to full auto.
That said, I am fond of my lever action rifles and revolvers. Yeah they will eventually come for them but most progressives are ignorant and think my .357 less scary than a black 9mm, my 30-30 much less powerful than a scary black AR-15.
As for revolution? I don’t see that happening until after all people of the gun are actively voting and getting no where. Certainly possible if ever they come door-to-door confiscating weapons.
The best bet to roll back idiotic people control measures (gun control is ALWAYS people control) pushed by progressives is a Mark Levin style convention of states to reject socialism with finality- cutting off their access to the public trough and re-instituting limited government.
“There is no word on how police will enforce the law”….the only possible scenarios that can play out short of total confiscation(door to door) will be isolated instances of traffic stops with vehicle searches, rightious self defense where firearms are used including car jackings , home invasions where the police come into your home after the fact(crime historians) and they should find you in possession of contraband weapons and possible frivolous orders of protection leveled against a law abiding gun owner….there could be other instances, but those are the ones that come to my mind…..if you live in the remote rural areas of any of the major anti-gun states, more than likely you may never encounter the police and probably go about your daily business and still enjoy your once legal semi-automatic weapons without fear of any legal entanglements.
I bet they could walk the list of concealed carry permit, or start pulling people over when they run plates in traffic and see you have a permit but nothing registered. That could get them into over 20,000 homes in Washington county alone.
Some churches and kids getting what they want but all of the gun owners in AMERICA can’t get national reciprocity. Somethings wrong, some how we’ve got to let our voices be heard, letters to congress, state senators aren’t getting the job done. It seems the people getting the results are the ones organizing and taking it to the streets. Why can’t gun owners do the same?
They will likely get the signatures, and the overly blue, low information voters will get this passed.
This ballot is written in such a way that it’ll ban virtually every semi auto pistol and rifle.
Unless you want to register them.
And magazines that hold over ten rounds. Register them, turn them in or take them out of state. Or face a B felony. Per item.
Oregon is going down the toilet.
One unexamined side effect of these excessive gun control pushes is how they deprive their state of talented workers and with it reduce the dynamism of the state’s economy.
If I own a few thousand dollars worth of firearms, I’m not going to forfeit them when moving into a new state; hence, any desire I had if moving to rural Oregon will be gone if this plot is exacted. It is really short sighed for states to follow this way of thinking…
Good thoughts. I’m sure I can be replaced where I work, but it’ll take time. And time is money. On a good day, I put out 100-150K in product.
I’ll be contacting a company in Idaho to look into possible job openings.
I will truly miss where I work, but I can’t live under tyranny.
They don’t need our money. More money comes from transplants to Oregon, mostly high paid high tech professional from California. They keep saying how more people are moving here than born here.
They also recently emergency voted against public feedback sky high min wage over the next few years to give the land of freebies feelz so they win a D vote..
When California (or coastal California) secedes from the United States, we should make Oregon and some parts of Washington state go with them.
Hmm so if a criminal has, say 17 rounds in his hand gun and his 3 other buddies do too.. Breaking into a house in a democrat state will be cake!!! I mean legally the homeowner can only have 10 rounds in a mag right!! Holy crap that’s easy pickins?? Now if that becomes reality, let’s just pay attention to all the states pushing this, because home invasions, robbing and raping will skyrocket for sure!!! And when it does, I’m also sure the lawsuits against the states pushing this will be astronomically high.. What a cluster.. I mean seriously democrats are so dumb they can screw up a cup of coffee, this gun control crap is only going to backfire on their stupid asses… Geez they just love to set up people for a slaughter…
Well said, “setting up people for slaughter”.
Look at what’s happening in a country that stripped its populace of rights to own firearms like Brazil where innocent people fall victims to armed criminals every single day.
Of course police and government officials would be exempt.
I wonder how many of these nonsense gun laws would be struck down if our ‘betters’ were forced to live under the same rules.
What would be the chances of a federal preemption law that removed all police carveouts?
Not great since anybody in government by definition thinks that government is a good thing. But I like how you’re thinking.
If this proposal is as broad as claimed, I could see the courts maybe striking down parts of it, but upholding some others.
Yeah, but *years* down the line…
California is still waiting for that magic court ruling that will reverse all the infringements. They are still waiting for that one judge to side with the people over the government.
“They are still waiting for that one judge to side with the people over the government.”
Like that DC judge that recently struck down the “good reason” requirement that made DC effectively shall-issue? 🙂
Why do they focus on the AR-15 civilian rifle…..in 34 years, semi auto rifles were used to murder about 164 people in mass shootings……that’s right…..164 in 34 years…….while criminals murdering each other with guns in 2016 killed 11,004 people, and knives are used to murder over 1,600 people every single year.
The reason they want the AR-15 civilian rifle banned is so they can come back and demand all semi auto rifles, pistols and shotguns be banned…..they will simply say, all of them function the same as the AR-15 so they all need to go….this will include revolvers since they too, technically, are semi auto weapons..
And once you ban pistols and revolvers…you ban concealed carry and open carry of guns…something the anti gunners have always hated with a passion.
How will they do this…the courts…..obama knew that passing legislation would just lose seats in congress…so he focused on stacking the courts…and now Oregon is going to use his courts to ban semi auto weapons…..
Notice…the Oregon petition goes after all semi auto pistols and shotguns too……if they pass this in that state, they will appeal it to the 9th circuit court of appeals where it will be upheld…and if Trump can’t get two real justices to replace ginsburg and kennedy, it will be Constitutional…..since there won’t be enough votes to strike it down at the Supreme Court…
Are you sure about what sort of judge Trump will pick and what sort can make it through confirmation? Trump doesn’t seem to have much of a grasp on reality and will very likely also do anything that he thinks is of short term advantage to him personally. If he thinks POTG have abandoned him he may well retaliate.
Trump is driven by one thing – *ego*.
And the *one* prize left for his ego to claim is…
Re-election.
The way I see it, all bets are hereby *off* on what he could do…
I do very much fear that if he gets the notion that POTG are criticizing him and likely won’t vote for him in the that he will be very vindictive about it. I also hope that if he fears a loss he won’t run again since his ego couldn’t handle being fired.
Rev. Elizabeth Larsen is the current leader of St. Mark’s Lutheran Church. Knutson retired back in the 1980’s.
Obama is still large and in charge. He is getting more done on the sidelines than when he was on the field. His minions are energized by Trump in a way that no other GOP President would have.
Everything thats going on is being directed by Obama. In fact, soon you will hear talk of scrapping Amendment 22, so that he can reclaim his throne.
Trump, too, said no term limits would be interesting, a la China now.
Liberals,
Criminalizing the law abiding since 1776.
Not sure if this was mentioned above already but this is not true. The text reads:
“(B) Semiautomatic pistol, or any semiautomatic, centerfire or rimfire rifle with a fixed
magazine, that has the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds of ammunition;”
Notice the “fixed”. And (to catch AR/AK style pistols):
“(D) Semiautomatic pistol that has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine and has at least one of the following: [..]
(iv) The capacity to accept a detachable magazine at any location outside of the pistol grip; ”
Notice the “outside”.
Can’t edit 🙁 Text here: http://oregonvotes.org/irr/2018/043text.pdf
I wish they would try to ban all pistols, that would make sure it doesn’t pass. Although the class B felony for violations is a good deterrent for voting “yes”. At least I hope it is…
By some news accounts, the Stoneman Douglas shooter only had 10 rd. magazines with him. Got some ?’s though: he supposedly carried the rifle into school in a duffle bag; so now the students need to have clear backpacks??? he also supposedly dropped the rifle when he -was done-out of ammo-?????; and ran out of the school with the rest of the evacuating students. I haven’t seen or heard anything about the recovery of the weapon.