New Black Panther Party Tests the Right to Keep and Bear Arms


On Wednesday, there were conflicting reports from Reuters about whether the New Black Panther Party has instructed its followers to carry firearms when they stage a rally in front of the Republican National Convention in Cleveland next week.

Ohio is an open carry state with a license required only for open carry in an automobile. Earlier today, Reuters reported that the New Black Panthers were going to take advantage of Ohio firearms law when they show up for a demonstration outside the Republican National Convention in Cleveland next week.

The New Black Panther Party, a “black power” movement, will carry firearms for self-defense during rallies in Cleveland ahead of next week’s Republican convention….

Several other groups, including some supporters of presumptive Republican presidential nominee Donald Trump, have said they will carry weapons in Cleveland.

“If it is an open state to carry, we will exercise our second amendment rights because there are other groups threatening to be there that are threatening to do harm to us,” Hashim Nzinga, chairman of the New Black Panther Party, told Reuters in a telephone interview.

“If that state allows us to bear arms, the Panthers and the others who can legally bear arms will bear arms.”

Nzinga said he condemned the Dallas shootings.

Now, however, Reuters claims that NBP jefe Hasim Nzinga is walking back that statement.

“The New Black Panther Party is not instructing anyone in any way, shape, form, or fashion, to bring weapons to Cleveland,” Hashim Nzinga said in the statement. “Any person (outside of NBPP) who exercises that ‘right’, only does so as a personal choice, not by the instructions of the NBPP National Chairman, any of our National staff, or membership.”

Reached by phone on Wednesday evening, Nzinga said a Reuters story published on Tuesday misrepresented his statements. “The truth and honesty don’t sell,” he said.

(To give the devil his due, Nzinga may have just been speaking personally, or about the choices he and his cohort were making to tool up, and not issuing a ‘directive’, in which case he may be technically correct.)

Regardless of whether NBP members carry firearms due to an official directive or just because they think it’s a good idea, Ohio law appears to be pretty clear – it’s indeed “legal for protesters to carry weapons at demonstrations outside the convention under that state’s ‘open carry’ law….”

The police are viewing the situation with a bit of trepidation. Steve Loomis, president of the Cleveland Police Patrolman’s Association has urged demonstrators to refrain from carrying firearms.

I partially agree with Mr. Loomis.

On the one hand, carrying pistols at a demonstration just seems like a good idea, particularly in the tense and somewhat violent political climate that exists after the events of the past week/month/year/presidential term/etc. Handguns are, by their nature, defensive weapons, the effective range of which is measured in feet.

On the other hand, rifles — the “queen of personal weapons” as the late Col. Jeff Cooper famously remarked — are offensive weapons. They’re a solution to the problem of being confronted by a bunch of armed, nasty fellows who are actively seeking to do you harm from a football field or two away. Whatever their intentions, a bunch of guys with pistols strapped to their hips are simply prepared to defend themselves if they’re attacked. A bunch of guys with rifles slung over their shoulders are prepared for both defense and offense.

Bringing rifles to a political rally seems unwise to me due to the message it sends: we want to achieve our political goals, and we have an army ready to fight if you oppose us. That’s the kind of thing Ben Franklin must’ve been weighing when he said, “A Republic, if you can keep it.” I’m not going to go to the mat on that one – it’s my opinion on political tactics. Obviously, rights are rights, and — as Dean pointed out earlier — even in Dallas last week, open carrying wasn’t the issue at all.

Nevertheless, as my old constitutional law professor used to say, “wise” is not the standard for behavior that is legal.

My constitutional law professor knew much about wisdom, but didn’t avail himself of it in his sartorial choices.

If you believe the Southern Poverty Law Center, the New Black Panther party is a “virulently racist and anti-Semitic organization whose leaders have encouraged violence against whites, Jews and law enforcement officers.” The SPLC offers these examples of the kinds of things the past NBP leadership has said:

“Our lessons talk about the bloodsuckers of the poor… . It’s that old no-good Jew, that old imposter Jew, that old hooked-nose, bagel-eating, lox-eating, Johnny-come-lately, perpetrating-a-fraud, just-crawled-out-of-the-caves-and-hills-of-Europe, so-called damn Jew … and I feel everything I’m saying up here is kosher.”
— Khalid Abdul Muhammad, one of the party’s future leaders, Baltimore, Md., Feb. 19, 1994

“Kill every goddamn Zionist in Israel! Goddamn little babies, goddamn old ladies! Blow up Zionist supermarkets!”
—Malik Zulu Shabazz, the party’s national chairman, protesting at B’nai B’rith International headquarters in Washington, D.C., April 20, 2002

“I hate white people. All of them. Every last iota of a cracker, I hate it. We didn’t come out here to play today. There’s too much serious business going on in the black community to be out here sliding through South Street with white, dirty, cracker whore bitches on our arms, and we call ourselves black men. … What the hell is wrong with you black man? You at a doomsday with a white girl on your damn arm. We keep begging white people for freedom! No wonder we not free! Your enemy cannot make you free, fool! You want freedom? You going to have to kill some crackers! You going to have to kill some of their babies!”
— King Samir Shabazz, head of the party’s Philadelphia chapter, in a National Geographic documentary, January 2009….

The SPLC goes on to document some of the other beliefs of the NBP:

A document on the NBPP website entitled “The Nationalist Manifesto” claims that white men have a secret plan to commit genocide against the non-white races. It also refers to black people who condone mixed-race relationships as the “modern day Custodians [sic] of Uncle Tom’s Cabin.”

NBPP members also hold black-supremacist religious beliefs. Some think that blacks are God’s true “chosen people” and that the people normally called “Jews” actually are impostors (this ideology is remarkably similar to the white racist theology of Christian Identity, which says whites are God’s real chosen people). They believe that blacks are naturally superior to people of other races. In September 1997, Khalid Muhammad said that he could not be anti-Semitic because Jews had no claim to the term “Semite.”

Members of the original Black Panther Party, which has no connection to the NBPP, have heavily criticized the New Black Panther Party. An open letter from the Dr. Huey P. Newton Foundation, which is run by members of the original Black Panther Party, decries the NBPP for being a hateful and unconstructive group. Bobby Seale, a famous founding member of the original Panthers, calls the organization “a black racist hate group.”

Got that? The original Black Panthers think that the NBP goes too far. The NBP is bad news. I want nothing to do with these people.

But…if there’s no evidence that the NBP is planning to do anything more than protest, wave a few banners, shout a few racist obscenities and then pack it in and go home…well, they’re citizens, right? They have every right to do that. Rights aren’t optional just because some of our fellow citizens are loathsome.

If there’s evidence that they plan to stage a riot, or engage in any kind of violence, then the Cleveland PD (and other security services) should come down on them. Hard and fast.

But absent that evidence, yes, they should be allowed to demonstrate while carrying firearms — with rifles. That’s what the word “right” means.

No, I’m not happy about this. Emotionally, it seems foolish, an unwarranted risk, to stand by and let a group like the New Black Panther Party stage a protest outside a major political rally while armed. I’m a little concerned about how this will play out. But rights aren’t optional. Much virtual ink has been spilled here and elsewhere talking about the balance between liberty and safety, and how we’ve tilted it toward liberty in America. These aren’t principles that should only be honored in the breach.

So, New Black Panthers, go ahead. Exercise your rights like men elsewhere in the world can’t. Show us that you’re better than we have any reason to expect. Maybe even learn that for all of its faults, the land you apparently despise protects your rights in ways that would surprise you.

The rest of us — if you’ll pardon the cliche — should put our faith in God, and keep our powder dry.


  1. avatar Jeffrey Blanchard says:

    I would encourage anyone and everyone to exercise their constitutionally-protected rights, especially the 2nd. I do not necessarily believe in or support the Black Panther Party, but I do support their rights.

    1. avatar Jeremy S. says:


      Additionally, if the NBPP cherishes its right to bear arms, it should be protesting in front of the DNC, not the RNC. Conservatives, libertarians, the NRA, etc is where the NBPP will find people defending their 2A Rights.

      1. avatar Benny the Jew says:

        My thoughts exactly. I have my issues with republicans, but, in the words of Sinead O’Connor, “Fight the real enemy.”

      2. avatar anonymoose says:

        They’d trade in their guns for EBT cards. They could easily steal or make more guns in an all-out Chicom-style gun ban, but they ain’t gettin no handouts from Trump.

        1. avatar Jason dayne says:

          Haha racist piece of shit. Always go to the EBT card… like your dad boned your sister for 10 years while you beat off watching. Love stereotype bitch trolls. Excuse me… watermelon and fried chicken your mom made is ready.

    2. avatar peirsonb says:

      I agree 100%.

      I may advise them, however, that it might not be smart to start shit in the Kent State state.

      1. avatar barnbwt says:

        During a political rally. While the National Guard is present.

        Something about stupid things, places, people…

        1. avatar anonymoose says:

          A friend told me Case Western is trying to send all the summer students home and reduce staff to a skeleton crew, and they’ve put up the Ohio National Guard in the dorms.

      2. avatar Klaus says:

        Are you serious? Eff Em! Let them. There haven’t been a lot a goddamn ROTC buildings burnt down since Kent State. Not many at all.

    3. avatar Jonathan - Houston says:

      Yes, but why do it here? Stay home, outside agitators.

    4. avatar J0shua says:

      Local radio is reporting that the NBPP is planning on protesting without applying for a protest permit because they don’t think they should have to get one. Doesn’t sound like a legit protest or a legit use of amendment protected rights to me.

      1. avatar John in Ohio says:

        Having to petition to assemble peacefully is an affront to Liberty. Likewise for so-called Free Speech Zones. I can’t fault them for snubbing their noses at a First Amendment permit any more than I can fault them for snubbing their noses at a Second Amendment permit.

        1. avatar frijoli says:


    5. avatar int19h says:

      This is not BPP. This is a completely different organization, put together by different people, with a different ideology, under the same name (hence the “New” in front).

  2. avatar Tom in Oregon says:

    Well, this might get interesting.
    The NBPP, the feel the Bern crowd, the anti-Trump crowd, all wanting to protest the convention.
    Glad I’m not there.

    1. avatar Geoff PR says:

      “Well, this might get interesting.”

      Yeah, in the ‘Ancient Chinese expression’ way.

      It’s gonna be that in spades next week…

      1. avatar waffensammler98 says:

        It’ll be Oppression Olympics 2016; groups constantly upstaging each other outside the convention to see who will be crowned “Most Offended”

        1. avatar Geoff PR says:

          *That* we will see at the DNC-Con next month.

          Occupy, Feel-the-Bern, BLM, and who the hell knows who else will *all* be there for that freak-fest…

    2. avatar Joe R. says:

      You loot, we shoot.

      Your life isn’t worth half a wet tick-turd, it ain’t worth 1/100th of a ring of a bell on the back of a door to a 7-11.

      1. avatar GunsForFuns says:

        Or three fifths of a man’s?

  3. avatar Andrew Lias says:

    “The truth and honesty don’t sell,” he said.

    Got that one right on the head.

    1. avatar Jeremy S. says:

      The truth doesn’t sell when the lies are more interesting.

  4. avatar Vhyrus says:

    I find it interesting that, according to SPLC, the New Black Panthers and the KKK seem to have quite a bit in common ideologically.

    1. avatar SteveInCO says:

      If even a bunch of leftist pukes like SPLC is willing to condemn them…they must be out there.

      1. avatar neiowa says:

        Likely the 1st time EVERY the SPLC pukes were correct about anything.

        WOW a full General. 4 stars. Impressive.

      2. avatar John in Ohio says:

        SPLC is all about the $$$. I met with Dees back in the day. A real jackass clown and so is the whole lying sham of an organization. Don’t believe a syllable out of their pie holes.

    2. avatar Cliff H says:

      A few years back, after hearing a racist tirade from a black driver on the CB radio following a fairly innocuous comment by an obviously Mexican driver, I came back with the comment in defense of the Mexican; “Consider the source. Bigots come in all colors.”

    3. avatar int19h says:

      Why should it be surprising? Racism is a common sentiment across many cultures and ethnicities.

  5. avatar PeterW says:

    Who is the New Black Panther Party presidential candidate, again?

    1. avatar Stuki Moi says:

      Not sure, but by extrapolation, he’s probably named Shabbazz…..

    2. avatar John says:

      They can fight themselves out of a paper bag. Shit or get off the pot. Trade in black for real job. Their president drive 200,000 car

  6. avatar Robert April says:

    Since Hashim Nzinga is a convicted felon, I will assume that he will not be carrying a firearm himself.

    1. avatar Klaus says:

      And if he did, who do you think would arrest him? And even if he got arrested, who do you think would prosecute that case?

  7. avatar Ralph says:

    The NBPP isn’t going to do anything violent at the convention. They talk the talk, but they don’t walk the walk.

    Let them carry legally — if any of them aren’t felons, that is. Don’t be turning this non-event into another Mulford moment.

    1. avatar Chris T from KY says:

      At least someone remembers history.
      Thanks Ralph.

  8. avatar James in AZ says:

    This is what happens when you dont name your kid properly

  9. avatar Renner says:

    I support their right to bear arms and open carry, just like I support ours to do the same. That being said, I wouldn’t get caught in the same state as that freak show they call a protest. Armed or not.

    1. avatar John in Ohio says:

      A couple of decades ago, there was a public works project that put a line of explosive charges north of Columbus. The idea is that if northern half of Ohio ever goes rabid, the Governor can dump old Yeller into the big lake. We tried to give Cleveland and a few other northern cities to Canada but they turned us down. 😀

  10. avatar jjimmyjonga says:

    too bad Sanders did not get the Dem nomination…then they could protest both conventions against white male and jew. Crackers.

    1. avatar Cliff H says:

      Mmmm. Crackers.

      1. avatar SteveX says:

        Now THAT was hilarious!

  11. avatar FormerWaterWalker says:

    Gee I thought Micah the murderer was a big fan of the NBP…how come black fellows don’t get painted with the same broad brush as white Christian NRA members open carrying ? Sure open carry-if any of you aren’t felons(per Ralph)…oh wait we got a “guns for all” bunch on TTAG. Fun times in Cleveland.

    1. avatar Cliff H says:

      You may define it as “guns for all” – we prefer to consider it “Second Amendment for all”. As 2A absolutists we have to recognize that the Second Amendment contains absolutely no limitations on the right of the people, even convicted felons, mentally challenged, or people under domestic violence protection orders, only limitations on the power of government.

      We also, most of us, continually point out that there is no “gun violence”, only violent people with a gun. The gun is an inanimate tool, nothing more. In and of itself the firearm is NEVER the problem, it’s the person holding the firearm and his intent.

      The entire point of the Second Amendment is and always has been that if the intent of the person with the firearm is evil, that is criminal or tyrannical, the rest of “the people” have the ability to shoot back. If the intent of the NBPP in Cleveland is to be evil or criminal then even though they have a natural, civil and Constitutionally protected right to bear their arms the people have the same right to shoot back.

      The NBPP should keep in mind, however, given the almost ubiquitous presence of video cameras these days, that it will be very difficult to misrepresent the event should it be of their own instigation. Bigots intent on assaulting the NBPP should keep that in mind as well.

      1. avatar David B says:

        It really is a “guns for all” position. I can’t count the number of times RF has said that felon’s should have gun rights. The 2A also doesn’t say anything about age restrictions. “Give ’em to 2 year olds. It’s their right!” you might bluster. The Constitution was written by and for men with a moral character who possessed common sense. Common Sense–sounds like that could have potential for a book title about that whole independence thing.
        2A absolutism is like giving a cookbook to Jeffrey Dahmer, a blackjack to Tonya Harding (bless her soul–she’s really a nice person I hear), or an intern to Bill Clinton. You can’t trust certain people.

        1. avatar Cliff H says:

          And who gets to decide which people can be trusted and which cannot? The point of the Second Amendment was to take that authority away from the government so that the people could protect themselves not only from criminals, but from their own government if the need arose. Recent events may prove how right the Founding Fathers were in this regard.

      2. avatar formerwaterwalker says:

        What is this “WE” you speak of Cliff? You only speak for yourself. I don’t want violent felons to have guns…call me crazy. The criminal will get his gat anyway…oh BLAH BLAH BLAH.

        1. avatar John in Ohio says:

          Not crazy, you’re just afraid of being free. You want government to do that which is your responsibility. Protect yourself or invite tyranny.

          You want tyrants? Because this is how we get tyrants.

        2. avatar Cliff H says:

          “…oh wait we got a “guns for all” bunch on TTAG.” Your words, not mine. I consider myself part of that “we” you refer to in that statement and therefore as part of that we have at least some ability to speak for the group. I did not see a single follow-up comment by any of those people, including RF, distancing themselves from the comment(s) I made.

          And furthermore, who gives a rat’s patoot what YOU want? The Second Amendment says exactly what it says and no more. Its intent is to protect us from the government and that is why it prohibits the government from infringing in any way on the right of the people to bear arms. Any people, all people, whether they scare you or not.

          Perhaps your attack on me was because my response was too close to the truth?

        3. avatar Andrew Lewis says:

          I identify with the absolutionists but I don’t want violent or crazy people to have guns. I also don’t want them walking around freely.

          What I want is to make it very easy to tell a good guy from a bad guy. Bad guys are in prison. Bad guys stay in prison until they stop being bad guys. If you aren’t in prison you must be a good guy.

        4. avatar FormerWaterWalker says:

          Good LORD you guys are insane. Hey-how about you understand RF doesn’t weigh in on everything? He does a click-bait thing. I don’t want violent convicted felons to have legal guns-whether KKK azzwholes or lowlife black panther wannabe’s. Duh…that ain’t freedom-it’s just stupid.

        5. avatar John in Ohio says:

          “Duh…that ain’t freedom-it’s just stupid.”

          In other words, “common sense” gun control?

          (It’s curious that you start off inviting others to call you crazy and you end up calling others insane. Interesting, that.)

  12. avatar BLoving says:

    Some ideas for any of you in town that day: troll these guys… hard. Some ideas:
    1. Pass out bottles of water. “Those black uniforms must be very hot…”
    2. Dress up a seven-year old in the same signature black jacket, beret and shades tostand next to them with his Super Soaker held at the ready just like the “big boyz”
    3. An adult in same jacket and shades with Super Soaker, but also a Rainbow afro wig and red clown nose… same pose next to them.
    4. Have a couple of girls in harem outfits softly fan them with palm fronds…
    5. A man approaches Quanelle X while holding a radio softly playing Kenny G… ask him if he’d like to dance…
    Please add more yall!!!

    1. avatar Yawnz says:

      Replace bottles of water in #1 with watermelon. See how many jimmies you can rustle.

      But seriously, is “other groups threatening to be there that are threatening to do harm to us” oppression-speak for white people in general, Republicans, or just Republicans voting for Trump?

    2. avatar barnbwt says:

      You’d have to be a goddam idiot to bring a kid anywhere near that hot mess. Even if fights don’t break out (sorry, but large bodies of young black guys on a hot day generally means a fight or two) and present physical danger, there can’t be a single possible benefit of the experience for the kid. Racist assholes shouting at ignorant assholes (sorry, but no one who shows up to these things is generally savvy of the issues) in the hot sun until someone is hospitalized by a crowbar, dehydration, or diabetus.

      In case Party guys are reading; we told you RNC guys at least a year ago this was a stupid place to hold the convention.


    3. avatar Ing says:

      I’d love to see that.

  13. avatar Joe says:

    I’m in Cleveland, about a mile from downtown. I can see the baseball stadium out of my bedroom window. Feels like the calm before the storm.

    1. avatar FormerWaterWalker says:

      Sorry to hear that Joe. I was in Cleveland 45 years ago today competing in the teenage national weightlifting championships. It seemed nice then. Stay safe…

    2. avatar Will says:

      Go Indians! Indians v Cubs — that would be a heck of a series!

      1. avatar Joe says:

        Ha! Right on

      2. avatar formerwaterwalker says:

        Sounds great to me! Hey Hall of Famer Lou Boudreau was from nearby(to me) Thornton, IL. Player/manager for Cleveland in 1948 world series champs. AND was a Cubs broadcaster for years!

    3. avatar JM says:

      I’m a little south of Cleveland, Medina here, and you could not pay me ANYTHING to be near downtown during this fiasco. Hospitals were told to prepare for “siege like conditions” and not expect supplies for up to 96 hours.

  14. avatar Curtis in IL says:

    Pray for peace, friends. Pray for cooler heads to prevail. Pray that every protester respects everyone else’s right to protest.

    Pray that we all have the courage required to protect the rights of people who use those rights to vomit out hatred and ignorance.

    We will demonstrate to the world that we Americans are peaceful, yet we are armed. An armed society is a polite society.
    Or not. God help us all.

  15. avatar Jim says:

    I’m putting the over/under for Cleveland rally deaths at 7. I had it at 4 until articles started popping up saying Cleveland PD are being told to “stand down” on protestors.

    1. avatar Joe says:

      It might be worse than you think. I read local reports that said the PD is understaffed. They were counting on supplementing their forces with police from other cities, such as Cincinnati and Denver. Those have since been cancelled. So instead of the expected 4k police, they have less than 2k. They’ve given out permission for at least 100k protesters.

      They were completely unprepared for the Cavs championship parade. They didn’t even block off the parade route, which led to a parade that should’ve taken an hour take all day. Granted, that was close to 1M people, but it doesn’t bode well.

    2. avatar barnbwt says:

      Natural causes (i.e. heat stroke) or violent? S’pose’d to be having a heat wave next week, which is sure to mean plenty of both

  16. avatar Warren says:

    “On the other hand, rifles — the “queen of personal weapons” as the late Col. Jeff Cooper famously remarked — are offensive weapons.”

    Okay, hold up one minute. You’re not seriously arguing a distinction between an offensive weapon and defensive weapon? Just a day or two ago you were defending BLM protesters who were open carrying ARs in Dallas, and now here you’re suggesting that if NBP members were to do so, it would have an offensive tone?

    Maybe this is just me reading into it, and I truly hope I’m wrong, but that statement smacks of a thinly veiled justification of selective approval of the RKBA. Governor Reagan kicked off California’s ever-restrictive gun control laws as a response to Black Panthers marching in capitol grounds in Sacramento. Let’s not be the folks who suggest restricting freedoms, as loathsome as the person behind the gun may be. But absolutely keep an eye on them and be willing to arrest/confront them, whoever they may be, if they give reasonable suspicion of criminal motives.

    1. avatar Johannes Paulsen says:

      “Just a day or two ago you were defending BLM protesters who were open carrying ARs in Dallas,”

      Which article are you referring to? I wrote about the arguments BLM people put forth and how if the people in that movement took their own rhetoric seriously, they’d necessarily have to oppose gun control. But I don’t think I said anything specifically about the protestors carrying rifles. I do think the BLM protestors in Dallas had the right to carry rifles, as do the demonstrators from Open Carry Texas who periodically do so, and yes, if asked, I would have counseled against doing so for the reasons stated above.

      “that statement smacks of a thinly veiled justification of selective approval of the RKBA”


      It does not automatically follow that just because you have the right to do something, that it is therefore always the right thing to do.

      “Let’s not be the folks who suggest restricting freedoms, as loathsome as the person behind the gun may be. But absolutely keep an eye on them and be willing to arrest/confront them, whoever they may be, if they give reasonable suspicion of criminal motives.”

      Sure. I agree with that, as I said above in the article. I’m not sure where you think we disagree.

      1. avatar John in Ohio says:

        “It does not automatically follow that just because you have the right to do something, that it is therefore always the right thing to do.”

        If we Ohioans would have followed that advice, there would be no open carry in Ohio. We had to fight tooth and nail to keep that freedom alive and we did it by openly carrying everywhere, at any time; especially rifles. Your argument was used against even the open carry of handguns at one time here.

    2. avatar barnbwt says:

      All firearms are offensive weapons; it is in the nature of their use. They hurt the other guy, they do not protect you from his blows. Best defense is a good offense. Likewise, best offense is a good defense, which is why attackers in body armor can be so unstoppable (whereas a vest alone will do you little good against a determined attacker if you cannot escape)

      1. avatar twency says:

        Firearms are simply weapons. Classifying them as either “offensive” or “defensive” is pretty meaningless absent their actual use for such in a particular instance.

  17. avatar Steve says:

    “On the other hand, rifles… are offensive weapons. They’re a solution to the problem of being confronted by a bunch of armed, nasty fellows who are actively seeking to do you harm from a football field or two away. ”

    I’m sorry, are you intentionally trying to give the antis that routinely scour this site (pardon the pun) ammunition to use against us when we claim ARs are defensive firearms and can be used in the home as great home defense instruments?

    1. avatar twency says:

      I agree. Not only are the optics of that statement bad, it’s just plain wrong.

      A firearm is neither inherently defensive nor offensive. How it is used that determines that. Some firearms are rather more practical for certain purposes (it’s a lot easier to conceal and carry a pistol chambered in .380 ACP than a rifle chambered in .223) but that has nothing to do with whether they’re “offensive” or “defensive”.

      There are plenty of savvy MSR owners who aren’t under the foolish apprehension that their rifle is basically just for use against “a bunch of armed, nasty fellows … a football field or two away.” An AR-15 or similar can be an excellent home defense weapon, as articles on this site have discussed.

  18. avatar Excedrine says:

    I am not worried about the NBPP shooting anyone. Even if I was, I would still support their right to keep and bear arms.

    All that being said, due to the ignorance of some comments on the Beyonce debacle with the Black Panther Party (BPP), they do kill, and they have a violent history. A cursory look at the history of the BPP reveals some of these bloody incidents.

    It’s been a long 50 years under the Panthers reign of terror in America. The Black Panthers’ 50 years has been marked by violence, murder, cop-killing, anti-Semitism, anti-White racism, pan-Islamism and a host of other things that are no good for any free and democratic society. Our hate of the KKK should be equal to that of the BPP.

    Several Black Panthers are now extremist Muslims and cause celebres in the Islamofascist community, like convicted, imprisoned cop-killer Jamil Abdullah Al-Amin a/k/a H. Rap Brown. Al-Amin, who bragged, “Violence is as American as cherry pie,” killed one sheriff’s deputy and wounded another in March 2000. The group–so vicious, so violent–even savagely tortured and murdered its own. The disgusting way they tortured and dismembered their living victims was so sick, it rivals that of the Islamic terrorists we are fighting now. Ungreat minds think alike.

    So there’s really no reason whatsoever to celebrate that this group is still around. Yet, the Panther alums are not only celebrating. They’re expecting us to buy their extremist makeover. These murderous thugs now want you to believe they are “activists” and want you to see “a positive image.” They think donning fancy suits instead of berets and military garb will instantly erase our memory banks about their “activities.”

    They’ve tried this before, with “Burn Baby Burn” Black Panther hot sauce. But the only thing that was burning is America under their reign of terror. You can’t remake years of murderous thuggery with a sudden Halloween costume of the Black Martha Stewart. They never apologized for murdering innocent people, leaving cops’ children fatherless, taking others’ lives for nothing.

    From an apologist San Francisco Chronicle piece on the 50th confab, we’re racists because we don’t like “civil rights” groups that murder for a living.

    Black Panthers shout “Kill all white people.”

    On October 28, 1967, Oakland police officer John Frey was shot to death in an altercation with Black Panther Huey P. Newton during a traffic stop. In the stop, Newton and backup officer Herbert Heanes also suffered gunshot wounds. Newton was convicted of voluntary manslaughter at trial, but the conviction was later overturned. In his book Shadow of the Panther, writer Hugh Pearson alleges that Newton, while intoxicated in the hours before he was shot and killed, claimed to have willfully killed John Frey.

    On April 7, 1968, seventeen-year-old Panther national treasurer Bobby Hutton was killed, and Eldridge Cleaver, Black Panther Party Minister of Information, was wounded in a shootout with the Oakland police. Two police officers were also shot. Although at the time the BPP claimed that the police had ambushed them, several party members later admitted that Cleaver had led the Panther group on a deliberate ambush of the police officers, provoking the shoot-out. Seven other Panthers, including chief of staff David Hilliard, were also arrested. Hutton’s death became a rallying issue for Panther supporters.

    Violent conflict between the Panther chapter in LA and the US Organization, a rival group, resulted in shootings and beatings, and led to the murders of at least four Black Panther Party members. On January 17, 1969, Los Angeles Panther Captain Bunchy Carter and Deputy Minister John Huggins were killed in Campbell Hall on the UCLA campus, in a gun battle with members of the US Organization. Another shootout between the two groups on March 17 led to further injuries. Two more Panthers died.

    In Chicago, on December 4, 1969, two Panthers were killed when the Chicago Police raided the home of Panther leader Fred Hampton. The raid had been orchestrated by the police in conjunction with the FBI. Hampton was shot and killed, as was Panther guard Mark Clark. A federal investigation reported that only one shot was fired by the Panthers, and police fired at least 80 shots. Hampton was subsequently shot twice in the head at point blank range while unconscious.

    In May 1969, three members of the BPP New Haven chapter tortured and murdered Alex Rackley, a 19-year-old member of the New York chapter, because they suspected him of being a police informant. Three party officers — Warren Kimbro, George Sams, Jr., and Lonnie McLucas — later admitted taking part. Sams, who gave the order to shoot Rackley at the murder scene, turned state’s evidence and testified that he had received orders personally from Bobby Seale to carry out the execution. Party supporters responded that Sams was himself the informant and an agent provocateur employed by the FBI. The case resulted in the New Haven, Connecticut, Black Panther trials of 1970. Kimbro and Sams were convicted of the murder, but the trials of Seale and Erika Huggins ended with a hung jury, and the prosecution chose not to seek another trial.

    In 1974, BPP leader Huey Newton and eight other Panthers were arrested and charged with assault on police officers. Newton went into exile in Cuba to avoid prosecution for the murder of Kathleen Smith, an eighteen-year-old prostitute. Newton was also indicted for pistol-whipping his tailor, Preston Callins. Although Newton confided to friends that Kathleen Smith was his “first nonpolitical murder”, he was ultimately acquitted, after one witness’s testimony was impeached by her admission that she had been smoking marijuana on the night of the murder, and another prostitute witness recanted her testimony. Newton was also acquitted of assaulting Preston Callins after Callins refused to press charges.

    In October 1977 Flores Forbes, the party’s assistant chief of staff, led a botched attempt to assassinate Crystal Gray, a key prosecution witness in Newton’s upcoming trial who had been present the day of Kathleen Smith’s murder. Unbeknownst to the assailants, they attacked the wrong house and the occupant returned fire. During the shootout one of the Panthers, Louis Johnson, was killed and the other two assailants escaped. One of the two surviving assassins, Flores Forbes, fled to Las Vegas, Nevada, with the help of Panther paramedic Nelson Malloy. Fearing that Malloy would discover the truth behind the botched assassination attempt, Newton allegedly ordered a “house cleaning”, and Malloy was shot and buried alive in the desert. Although permanently paralyzed from the waist down, Malloy recovered from the assault and told police that fellow Panthers Rollin Reid and Allen Lewis were behind his attempted murder. Newton denied any involvement or knowledge and said the events “might have been the result of overzealous party members”.

    In January 2007, a joint California state and Federal task force charged eight men with the August 29, 1971, murder of California police officer Sgt. John Young. The defendants have been identified as former members of the Black Liberation Army. Two have been linked to the Black Panthers. In 1975 a similar case was dismissed when a judge ruled that police gathered evidence through the use of torture. On June 29, 2009, Herman Bell pleaded guilty to voluntary manslaughter in the death of Sgt. Young. In July 2009, charges were dropped against four of the accused: Ray Boudreaux, Henry W. Jones, Richard Brown and Harold Taylor. Also that month Jalil Muntaquim pleaded no contest to conspiracy to commit voluntary manslaughter becoming the second person to be convicted in this case.

  19. avatar Red in CO says:

    Wait, they’re gonna be protesting at the RNC? While exercising their right to bear arms? Yeah, that makes sense.

  20. avatar strych9 says:

    If you’re gonna carry familiarize yourself with the laws in Ohio, especially those about transporting ammo and a gun at the same time without a valid CCW permit.

  21. avatar JR_in_NC says:

    “But…if there’s no evidence that the NBP is planning to do anything more than protest, wave a few banners, shout a few racist obscenities and then pack it in and go home…well, they’re citizens, right? They have every right to do that. Rights aren’t optional just because some of our fellow citizens are loathsome.

    If there’s evidence that they plan to stage a riot, or engage in any kind of violence, then the Cleveland PD (and other security services) should come down on them. Hard and fast.

    But absent that evidence, yes, they should be allowed to demonstrate while carrying firearms — with rifles. That’s what the word “right” means.”

    How about reported emails between two prominent members of BLM (are they connected to NBP at all?) regarding their planned “Summer of Chaos” and their intent to commit violence at the Republican National Convention sufficient to have martial law declared?

    Some excerpts:

    JE: “Have you spoken with Mrs. Lynch [Attorney General Loretta Lynch] recently about the plan for the summer and fall leading up to the elections.”

    DM: “We spoke two weeks and they want us to start really pushing how racist Trump is now instead of waiting so the others can start getting the protesters ready to shut both conventions down.”

    DM: “If we can get both conventions shut down for messing over Bernie and for having racist Trump, then get martial law declared so Obama can stay in office we will win.


    S: “They will not be ready for the crowds we are bringing and they will blame Trump for it, especially if we shut it down. The GOP will have to replace him at that point or we will continue the disruptions nationwide.”

    DM: “I will pass the info along. Good work, Sam. You never let us down. It’s so important we stop Trump. He can not be president. He will destroy everything we worked so hard for and we can’t trust….”

    DM: “…today and he [Sam?] confirmed that there will be around 10,000 protesters disrupting the [Republican] convention. Plans are being made for other cities as well for upcoming Trump events. Ads have already been placed looking for people to help. I know you don’t care for them [white people] but this is the time we need our white allies doing a lot of the work for us. They are the ones who listen the best.”

    JE: “That will put fear into the GOP and the country when they can’t have their convention for all their racist supporting Trump. We’ve worked too hard and closely with the Obama administration to have that racist ass take it all away and Hillary…. You know I can’t stand those white allies, but yo right this is the best to use them. They hang on every word you say and will do whatever is asked. I just hate all that kiss ass they try to do. Like that changes who they are.”

  22. avatar TroyBilt says:

    If you show up to a place where you know there are people there that threatened you is it still self defense?

    1. avatar Anonymous says:

      Yea. If they have a right to be there. Yea.

  23. avatar Anonymous says:

    You know what would be really funny?

    Republicans fist bumping the black panthers after exiting the republican convention because they were openly carrying.

    I mean… seriously. That is probably what I would do if I saw people open carrying. Doubly so if they are African Americans.

    1. avatar neiowa says:

      Those that aren’t prior felons. What are your odds?

    2. avatar Ing says:

      I’d love to see this, too. If they’re peacefully exercising their civil rights, more power to ’em.

    3. avatar barnbwt says:

      Would likely be interpreted as assault & responded to with said rifles 😉

  24. avatar jwm says:

    And hillary is slipping money to the nbpp hoping they will shoot Trump. It’s the only chance she has of being president.

  25. avatar Jeff says:

    They’ll end up like their beloved Fred Hampton who fired one shot at the Chicago Police and they shot him to pieces. They’re making a dangerous and mistaken assumption that they’ll be the only ones there carrying guns.

  26. avatar Jerid says:

    People complain about being treated differently because of the color of their skin and in the same breath tell me they hate me because I’m white…..

    1. avatar barnbwt says:

      Where’s the conflict? These racists believe they should be treated better than whites, by virtue of their skin color; that they should be above the law, or at the very least subject to a different kind of law (mob law)

  27. avatar Klaus says:

    These tools couldn’t disrupt a pumpkin festival in New Hampshire.

  28. avatar Jack Holan says:

    I doubt given the HATE LEVEL of the New Black Panthers no one is thrilled to see them Armed and protesting at a Political Party Convention that in their minds exclude them an keeps them down even more than the Democrats. However personally I’d feel just as conerned if Neo-NAZIs or KLan showed up Armed preaching their HATE. DESPITE ALL THIS you are right we cannot open the door to playing with the Second Amendment when it comes to groups other than Terrorits. If we so open the door a crack ‘they will push it open with a Floodgate of restrictive Legilation to look PC and that their addressing the problem. We know the gun does not murder or rob in the hands of a legal owner with few exceptions that even having therapy is not a valid reason in most cases yet every blossom off the real problem inner city youth who see only the drug business as a means to make real money and most Judges act like it’s the 60s giving get out of jail free cards & light sentences.

  29. avatar Indiana Tom says:

    If you believe the Southern Poverty Law Center, the New Black Panther party is a “virulently racist and anti-Semitic organization whose leaders have encouraged violence against whites, Jews and law enforcement officers.”
    Yeah, and the only reason that the SPLC says that is the organization is run by Jews.
    If the Panthers just threatened white Christians, then the NBP would be totally chic and PC.

  30. avatar Indiana Tom says:

    Just send in the Ohio National Guard. They seem to be hardened combat veterans against demonstrators.

    1. avatar jwm says:

      I’ve always said that full auto weapons have no place in police armories. But the guard ain’t cops.

    2. avatar Von Schmitto says:

      LOL. See my previous post. Great minds….

  31. avatar Daily Beatings says:

    “Sorry I had a fight in the middle of your Black Panther Party.”

  32. avatar James in Houston says:

    The Reason the SLPC hates the New Black Panthers is because they are against the SLPC agenda. They say no to abortion, homosexuality, transgenders, or any of that other neo liberal stuff. SLPC does not care if they are racist but they do care if their agenda is being opposed. The New Black Panthers see both the SLPC and NAACP as being opposed to Black people. That is what I am getting after having talked to their members and read their mission statement.

  33. avatar Roger Cain says:

    Personally, I love Israel and Jews. They are Gods chosen people. Islam and Mohammad, well, they will be cast into hell if they don’t accept Jesus as savior. Mohammad is a simpleton. Jesus IS God.

    1. avatar anonymoose says:

      The Hebrews were God’s chosen people until they chose to forsake His son. If they don’t accept Jesus as their Lord and Savior they will surely burn in Hell with the rest of the trash, but I’m no evangelist. If people don’t want to accept Jesus I can’t force them to, and being angry with them won’t make them want to receive His message any more. This doesn’t mean we can’t be friends for pragmatic reasons. At least Israel isn’t beheading, roasting, or stoning Christians, or threatening to nuke Western civilization.

      Also, if you’re looking at the purpose of Israel’s existence through some doomsday prophecy lens, the Selassie family (the actual direct living descendants of King Solomon) has be instated as the rulers of Israel before the Temple can be rebuilt and the other stuff in Revelations can occur.

  34. avatar anonymoose says:

    I plan to walk around downtown Cleveland doing an empty-holster protest next week. That way no one can ask me to leave for having a (visible) firearm.

    1. avatar anonymoose says:

      Also, for the record, all rifles, shotguns, machineguns, and handguns are all DEFENSIVE weapons. Anything short of artillery is a defensive weapon, and that includes grenades.

    2. avatar John in Ohio says:

      Empty? We fought hard to keep open carry alive in Ohio. Empty? *sigh*

  35. avatar John in Ohio says:

    “Ohio is an open carry state with a license required only for open carry in an automobile.”

    No, it is not considered open carry in or on a motor vehicle in Ohio. It is considered concealed.

    Also, there is no “open carry law” in Ohio. As far as I am aware, the only place in the Ohio Revised Code where open carry is mentioned is in R.C. 9.68 (state preemption of firearm regulations). The Constitution of Ohio guarantees the right to bear arms. Concealed carry of handguns has been licensed since 2005 so it is considered a privilege while the openly carrying of a handgun is considered a protected right. As such, open carry is not prohibited by Ohio Revised Code. That which is not prohibited, is permissible.

    1. avatar Johannes Paulsen says:

      Don’t conflate the word choice in the article with the legal definitions of those terms in Ohio. I am not licensed to practice law in the state of Ohio – if you want legal advice concerning Ohio law, I would strongly encourage you to hire and consult counsel that is so licensed.

      In this case, I referred to someone openly carrying a firearm on their person in a manner that was in plain sight to anyone who could see them. In some states, such carriage of firearms by persons who are not otherwise prohibited is considered open and perfectly legal without a license, even if done while in an automobile. In Ohio it is apparently not.

      Is that clear?

      1. avatar John in Ohio says:

        Now a more reasoned reply from me than I wrote earlier…

        I was not busting your chops in my original reply to the article. I apologize if it comes off that way. Of the questions I get asked, those two come up often. Can I open carry in a car or on a motorcycle? No, in or on a motor vehicle, a loaded handgun is considered concealed (even when in the open) and falls under CHL laws. Where in the Ohio Revised Code does it allow Open carry, nowhere (and then the rest of my long answer). I was adding to the original information and clarifying since I do get asked this alot.

        “if you want legal advice concerning Ohio law, I would strongly encourage you to hire and consult counsel that is so licensed.”

        I clearly wasn’t seeking legal advice. If I were, I know plenty of competent individuals to ask. However, this ain’t rocket surgery.

    2. avatar John in Ohio says:

      Self-edited: Nevermind. My reply was a jackass comment.

  36. avatar October Flores says:

    I see stupid people everywhere. It is apparent that they want to have a show of force versus a legitimate open carry gathering. The time and place of their choice, RNC convention to nominate Trump, will be used for propaganda and recruitment. Just as every successful attack ISISdoes boost’s their recruitment. What the NBPP is pushing is the false narrative that Trump is a racial bigot and colored people need to arm up and cone together to defeat him.

  37. avatar October Flores says:

    I see stupid people everywhere. It is apparent that they want to have a show of force versus a legitimate open carry gathering. The time and place of their choice, RNC convention to nominate Trump, will be used for propaganda and recruitment. Just as every successful attack ISISdoes boost’s their recruitment. What the NBPP is pushing is the false narrative that Trump is a racial bigot and colored people need to arm up and come together to defeat him.

  38. avatar Fred Delaney says:

    Oh look! A terrorist playing ‘dress up’ with his little black panther costume! Awwwww, how cute!

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