The National Shooting Sports Foundation is the firearms industry’s lobby group. The Sporting Arms and Ammunition Manufacturers’ Institute (SAAMI) sets the industry’s technical standards. The NSSF and SAMMI issued the following joint statement, pretty much calling on the ATF to restrict the sale of bump fire stocks under the National Firearms Act. Reading it, I can only conclude . . .
that the firearms industry as a whole is happy to have the ATF violate the letter of federal law in a misguided, not-to-say doomed attempt to prevent future spree killings and/or appease gun control advocates. True? We report, you deride.
Our thoughts and prayers continue to be with the families and loved ones of all those killed and injured in the criminal attack in Las Vegas. The manufacture, distribution and sale of automatic firearms and their components has been stringently regulated by federal laws since 1934.
We believe the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) should interpret and enforce existing laws and regulations.
We call upon ATF to conduct a prompt review and evaluation of aftermarket trigger activation devices such as bump stocks to determine whether they are lawful to install and use on a firearm under the National Firearms Act of 1934 (NFA), or whether, if they have no function or purpose other than to convert a conventional firearm into an automatic firearm, they are regulated items under the NFA.
We urge Congress to allow ATF to complete its review before considering any legislation so that any policy decisions can be informed by the facts and ATF’s analysis.
These people obviously believe that when the leftist bear begins to chase, all NSSF needs to do is outrun you.
Perhaps the brand name gun advocates are convinced the tide is against them, and the best they can hope for is to sacrifice slowly, to put off the end as long as possible.
Knowing who not to give my money to just keeps getting easier.
+1
I’d just like to know which of the alphabet soup of 2nd amendment lobby groups actually DOES represent us.
NRA = No, not really
NSSF = No, not really.
oh…ps i’m from California, where gun rights go to die.
Gun Owners of America and the Second Amendment Foundation.
SAF supports universal background checks so screw them too.
CABELA’S caved ….. no more $$ Money from me. — They pulled and want ” Restrictions ” on bump stocks.
This has become a Leftist war on all gun PARTS …… Thanks coward NRA + NSSF
Republicans also push BAN on ” Parts ” … new bill …. HR – 3999. // Vote them ALL OUT !
Who knew that you could shoot yourself in the foot with a bump-fire stock and that the wound could be fatal?
This may end up being to these supposed “gun rights/pro Second Amendment” organizations the equivalent of “taking a knee” during the national anthem. NFL, NRA, NSSF all committing suicide before our eyes.
Sounds like they’re throwing one of their own under the bus preemptively. NSSF just wants this to go away before the feds start in with wide ranging
Or…
They’re saying let the ATF review the bump stocks and the NFA again, then consider legislation after that. The ATF is going to look at the NFA, read the part about “per trigger pull”, and take six months and 130 pages to say that a bump stock generates multiple trigger pulls with one round fired each, not multiple rounds from a single trigger pull.
By that time, people will have cooled off and be complaining about baseball players peeing on flags during the national anthem, so nothing will happen from all this.
That’s how I read it. Except it’s per trigger function, not pull. That’s how you get binary triggers.
Agreed. So, I’ll state the obvious, the title of the article is not accurate; nothing in the NSSF statement calls for regulation. I wish that were the same case with the NRA statement.
Agreed. NSSF is dancing the dance. How skillfully is the real question. The NRA capitulated. Maybe not completely by calling for legislation, but they caved on the issue.
Sounds like they’re throwing one of their own under the bus preemptively. NSSF just wants this to go away before the feds start in with wide ranging regulations.
The atf already reviewed it.
It’s legal.
Any review would probably confirm that. Then the question becomes whether to make a new law — and that’s where Congress’ famed inability to get anything done comes into play. Plus, by that time the “do something…anything!” hysteria will have gone away.
By framing the issue as a fairly narrow one involving fully automatic firearms, which are already covered by well-established laws, the NRA and ATF have (in theory) staved off what would otherwise have been another Sandy Hook style run at all gun owners.
If bump-fire stocks do get banned anyway, well, maybe losing a frivolous accessory is a small price to pay for keeping the rabid prohibitionists at bay. Or maybe this is a bad precedent that will return to haunt us. Time will tell.
It’s already out the thoughts of most. They’ve moved on to Weinstein the pervert and the burning vinyards.
Virtually nobody remembers anything happened in LV now unless reminded. The only shooting to get buried faster was the black power guy who shot up a church last month.
Awwwww. There you go, and ruin it for the rest of us.
Now we’re emboldening the anti-gunners. “This is common sense legislation! See, even pro-gun NRA and NSSF agree with us!!!”
^ This!
The bill is broad enough to ban all semiautos…
If this legislation gets passed it is only a matter of time before they start peeling off all those mall ninja accessories attached to AR-15s all over America.
In fact, if they were smart (unlikely, just evil) their next piece of legislation would be to make illegal any device that allows the easy attachment or removal of accessory devices to any rifle such as picatinny rails, etc.
“the NRA and ATF have (in theory) staved off what would otherwise have been another Sandy Hook style run at all gun owners.”
That is a totally naive view of the situation.
I’ll grant you that IN THEORY the NRA may be thinking like this. But it’s a totally wrong approach.
This is NOT a “negotiation”. This is a capitulation to the LOGIC of banning objects to prevent crimes. It will be used against the NRA and the NSSF for years to come as more legislation chips away at other forms of firearms ownership until there is no Second Amendment because every bit and piece of a firearm and its possession have been legislated away.
That’s why I said “in theory.” If you look at it from the perspective I mentioned, it makes sense. But it could also be very harmful in the long run if it opens the door to more anti-gun legislation and more lawmaking by agency fiat. Like I said, time will tell.
I think that’s their stance as well.
It’s politics. We can’t be seen as doing nothing. So we do something that amounts to nothing.
It’s stupid. And it’s why I hate politics.
“It’s politics. We can’t be seen as doing nothing. So we do something that amounts to nothing.”
Maybe ATF needs to review belt loops as well. Ooohhhh, that’s right, one can bumpfire without using even beltloops. Guess we need to have ATF determine that people need to be included as “other” under the NFA.
Who needs enemies with friends like these…sheesh.
My thought exactly. I’ll be up here in the woods, when you all decide to actually DO something about all this unconstitutional bullshit we’ve had crammed down our throats for decades…let me know. My guess is everyone will roll over and give up more freedom in the name of goverment safety. I have what I NEED. But I’d also like to keep aquiring things I WANT. Really, how much more are we gonna take???
So it should be the “National Shooting Slowly Foundation” then…
Ok.
Based on this language, doesn’t this mean they want the ATF to begin to ban everything? all it would take a another shooting for this language to hurt us “We believe the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) should interpret and enforce existing laws and regulations.” With more shootings, semi could get banned, no? I understand that that maybe not what they really mean, but from the left, isn’t that what it means?
How the hell…? Who is really behind this?
And why don’t I see any such wobbling and backstabbing from the citizen-disarmist side?
Mr. Pratt and the GOA hasn’t gone over, unless I missed something.
I call for a prompt review and evaluation on how the ATF has any authority to issue rules and laws ignoring the second amendment of the constitution.
I certainly don’t recognize their authority to do so and will nullify any jury seeking a conviction based only on firearms regulations.
I now intend to go rip apart the peace and quiet of this fine autumn afternoon with tannerite and my slidefire stock.
All these .org groups are terrified of Congressional Republicans because almost all of them are week kneed worthless wimps who will sell out at the drop of the least hint of them having to stand on principle. We need to carry the fight because this won’t stop with those worthless bump stocks.
Oh, good. Eventually we won’t have any limp talkers to donate to, and we can just do it the old-fashioned way, with violence.
They’re sounding an awful lot like the National Schutzstaffel Foundation right now.
“They’re sounding an awful lot like the National Schutzstaffel Foundation right now.”
Not even close. Stay on the page, and try to keep up.
It’s time like these where you find out who your friends are (and are not).
“It’s time like these where you find out who your friends are (and are not).”
You find out who your friends are if you are buried on a rainy day. But it is a bit late, at that point.
In the name of political expediency all these “gun rights organizations” will US (the actual law abiding gun owners) and the constitution right down the river in the blink of an eye.
I find it interesting that so few see this move by NSSF, the NRA, and others as the clever strategy it is. Think of it this way. The ATF has already reviewed the product and determined it legal based on the letter of the law. Demanding that the ATF review again delays the rapid fire legislation efforts of the left (assault legislation?), but also relies on already proven interpretations of the laws involved (NFA definition of a machine gun still unfulfilled). There is just no room for creative interpretation here. At least not if you don’t want a very obvious and blatant misinterpretation of clear law on your record.
Pelosi, Schumer, and gang get delayed by the very bureaucracy they want to inflict on any rights they disagree with, all while opening their mouths further and exposing them for the self righteous fascists they want to be. Remember, time is not a friend of the left when it comes to exploiting tragedies. Lefty can’t dance with a dried up shirt.
People keep saying this, but it hasn’t. Both Democrats and Republics have gone all in for gun control and this hasn’t impeded them in the slightest. They aren’t waiting for the ATF.
LaPierre Laval’s comments that the NRA supports full auto ban? That is 100% damaging to gun rights, especially when we’re looking at the first true Republican trifecta since the Coolidge years (the best chance to repeal the NFA) in 2019.
“…Demanding that the ATF review again delays the rapid fire legislation efforts of the left”
Except it hasn’t.
And doesn’t.
Dem’s and Rep’s both have bills being written up right now, this very moment.
What it DOES do is give energy to the anti-gun politicians when they get to say “See! Even the NRA agrees with us that more regulation is needed.”
NOT ONE MORE INCH!
“There is just no room for creative interpretation here.”
You obviously have no experience with “the deep state”, and bureaucratic regulators. Encouraging more review, and even “interpretation” is mother’s milk.
Neville Chamerain, the Prime Minister of Britain, tried appeasing Nazi Germany in the late 1930’s. He got World War 2. I hope this is a clever move rather than just appeasement.
It’s every bit as clever as Chamberlain was.
It does feel like the bump fire stock might be the Czechoslovakia of today. Toss them to the wolf pack to buy “Peace in our time”? Just let those wolfs taste blood and see how it works this time around.
These idiots think that they can stave off a vote in Congress by appealing to the ATF. Problem is that all roads lead to a ban. If a stock can be called a machine gun that places it in the category of post-86 sample and automatically bans it. This then opens the door to the ATF to do exactly what SHARE act was supposed to stop – ATF over-reach.
“I can only conclude . . . that the firearms industry as a whole is happy to have the ATF violate the letter of federal law in a misguided, not-to-say doomed attempt to prevent future spree killings and/or appease gun control advocates. True?”
Not even close to true. The NSSF and the NRA are supporting the regulation of bumpfire stocks because any other position would be the death of both organizations.
Bumpfire stocks were gone the second that the schmuck started shooting people in Las Vegas. Maybe some of us need to wake up to a big dose of reality.
Maybe some of us need to wake up and:
(1) Rescind demi-god status from government.
(2) Demand that government leave our rights alone.
(3) Stand up for what is right AS WE KNOW IT, not as government declares from on high.
If these three things happened, we would not have to discuss whether or not we can get enough political backing to prevent Congress from banning bump-fire stocks.
This is a battle that cannot be won. Any other position is delusional, like shoveling shit against the tide.
“Only a fool fights in a burning house.”
— Ancient Klingon Saying
Which steps, not already propounded, not already discussed, not already ineffective, would you recommend to meet your three goals? I like the ideas, but befuddled how they can be brought to life.
“Bumpfire stocks were gone the second that the schmuck started shooting people in Las Vegas.”
Bumpfire stocks apparently can be useful at distance, but in the flat open, the beltloop will be just as effective.
“Maybe some of us need to wake up to a big dose of reality.”
There is a vocal contingent on this site that thinks that just by being morally right they will win in the end. They take no heed to the reality of politics, public opinion, strategy, the harm of Pyrrhic victories or any other consideration. It’s all “because 2nd amendment” and “you’re with us or against us”. Stirring rhetoric, but it doesn’t actually accomplish much.
The irony is they are just like the rabid anti-gunners in this stance. There is no debate, no logic that can ever sway them. You have people on this site that would overthrow the government and sink this country into chaos to save the freaking bump-fire stock.
There is a difference in retreating and surrendering. The NSSF is retreating while fighting a delaying action to cover the retreat. The NRA is fighting a delaying action while surrendering. I don’t get the point of doing that. A Pyrrhic defeat?
Retreat is retreat. Either you retreat so as to buy time to mount a counter-attack, or you retreat to go home. Delaying actions can be used in both circumstances. To date, have we ever seen a counter-attack? A successful counter-attack?
Yes and yes. The only meaningful successful counter attacks have been at the state level, though.
@ double larry
“You have people on this site that would overthrow the British government and sink this colonies into chaos to save on freaking taxes!” How do you like this version?
It’s not about those stupid pieces of overpriced plastic. It’s about principle that banning some tool can’t make anyone safer and that there is nobody with authority to do the banning in the first place. Do you really believe the push will stop with bump fire stocks? Ask Pelosi about the slippery slope.
Not another inch! And I want my cake back.
“The irony is they are just like the rabid anti-gunners in this stance”
Would you propose a woman be subtle, sophisticated, and nuanced in refusing to be raped again?
So now they need to redo their logo and remove “protect” and “preserve”
Effing traitors!
If the NRA and NSSF had been around on April 19, 1775, they would have freely handed over all arms and powder to the Redcoats at Concord. And then invited them to tea.
Freaking cowards – all of them!
Well that’s sad to read. The NSSF had officially gone full Fudd.
Well, once more we have another reason to start curni9ng out homemade untraceable hardware that can’t regulate to begin with. There’s already 3D print files to make your own Slide Fire knock off. Best to get them while you can.
OK, so when a domestic terrorist decides to use a legally purchased silencer and kills “sniper-style” more than 59 people and wounding others who are watching a night concert or game at a stadium, will the politicians, the NRA and NSSF/SAAMI all join together to try to ban the sale and/or possession of silencers too?
Thousands of gun owners have bought bump fire stocks and binary triggers AND have NOT used them for criminal purposes, but they are going to be punished because of one psychopath? I hope the NRA loses members like the NFL is losing viewers.
Yes. Suppressors AND high power optics.
After all, no one needs 24x magnification to shoot a deer.
Mr. and Mrs. America, turn them all in!
Damn I’m mad!
Meh…I’ll just wait and see. I’m with Ralph. Baby/bath water…
How bout we follow the constitution and ban nothing. Because that is what shall not be infringed usually means. Allow bumpfire stocks, allow machineguns, allow SBRs, allow all the small arms. Mybe i don’t need a tactical nuke, but if it has a barrel and goes boom i should be able to own it.
I agree with you, but there are about 227 million American adults who disagree and they make the rules. I doubt even Neil Gorsuch would go along with your program.
The NSSF is a paper tiger. The Left has now learned this. They will lose what power they have.
The stupidity is high… Or they are traitors who just want money.
Could this just be a delaying tactic? NRA/NSSF ask administration to have ATF review their classification. Pro-2A has cover against taking action on ban bills – “let’s wait to see what ATF rules.” A speedy 6-9 months later, ATF rules that the original position stands and bump stocks are lawful. To change the law, congressional action is required, but this isn’t in the headlines anymore. Hardly anyone cares that the bill is ignored because XYZ is more important now.
A speedy 6-9 months later, both Democrats and Republicans have already sponsored bills restricting our rights, gotten them passed in at least one state already with many more just a few votes away themselves, and all of it setting us up for even more restrictions. And they are already saying “even the NRA agrees we need more regulation.”
NOT ONE MORE INCH!
That would be great if anyone will wait for ATF to make up its mind. But even freaking Republicans are tripping over each other filing gun controll bills.
The number of people commenting who appear to have “cognitive dissonance” about the situation and are trying to believe that somehow this action by the NRA and NSSF is somehow “genius” – as one moron put it – is disheartening in itself.
The notion that somehow if the NRA and NSSF toss a fig leaf to Congress that Congress will back off is ludicrous.
What the NRA should be doing is living up to the anti-gun crowd’s belief that it’s an all-powerful lobby that can threaten the terms of Congressional legislators. To wit, the NRA SHOULD be threatening Congress with all-out war in 2018 and 2020.
This. Whatever happened to Stand Up And Fight!?
Guys, this is happening with or without us. We can either be part of the conversation and keep the ban of bump stocks narrow, or sit on the sidelines and sulk and let it happen without us, and let Nancy Pelosi do the talking. Which would you rather have? That’s our choice. Choose wisely.
“Which would you rather have? That’s our choice. Choose wisely.”
Binary choices are the gambit of the leftists.
We (POTG) can inform everyone of our Repub representatives and Senators that if they budge a micro-millimeter toward supporting a ban, they will face primary hell. The donors to the swamp generally call the tune (which is why the swamp ignores the voters after election), but the represented can force a change of faces, if nothing else.
“We (POTG) can inform everyone of our Repub representatives and Senators… ”
Yeah that’s a great solution. Considering most ballots have one candidate from each party, let’s let them lose their seat to a democrat. No doubt that will really help us in the long run.
I think they call this cutting off your nose to spite your face.
You posited only two options: defeat or collaboration. I posited that if representatives are unrepresentative, they should pay the price.
The debunked, disabused, tired and ineffective notion that better we have representatives who act act as though they are members of the other party, than let the other party win, makes no sense in the political reality of today. The “Rebups” don’t believe they can be disciplined. A primary challenge, or loss of donations should be a constant threat.
Lemme see. I can buy a bumpstock for $150 or a rubber band for 5 cents and still bumpfire more accurately with the rubber band. Hmmm …. I think I’ll just use a rubber band to bumpfire.
Trade bump stocks for suppressors, knowing that triggers such as the fostech echo, and franklin armory binary triggers now make these bumpfire stocks obsolete. They are far easier to control, and the early versions of the franklin armory trigger could actually go faster than the gun could run. Simply make sure that the bill ONLY bans stocks and not triggers.
What makes you think that grabbers are willing to trade anything? I wish I was so young and naive again.
The ATF should regulate the M240 that was actually used…..oh, they already do that?