My regular source of news down Mexico way send me links to Spanish language crime reports, with his introductory comments. As he’s heavily involved in border control issues—in ways that might not be considered politically, perhaps legally correct—I can’t reveal his ID. Suffice it to say, he’s on the sharp end. And those of us who aren’t really need to be paying attention here . . .
This story [from animalpolitico.com] is getting extensive play in Mexico. Javier Sicilia is correct: Mexico is now embroiled in a civil war between the government and narco-terrorists. It will be settled by violence. Surrender to the drug cartels will result in another narco state like Afghanistan, war lords and all. Grenades, Stinger missles, 50-caliber rifles—the Drug Lords’ weapons would only be limited by finances. Although that doesn’t seem to be much of a issue given lavish financing by U.S. dopers . . .
Sicilia is also correct about the pervasive corruption in Mexico, which has led to oppressive gun control. That’s what’s missing from his five-point plan: restoring the Mexican citizens’ right to keep and bear arms. Removing that right has left the people defenseless against lawlessness and brutality. How ironic is it that America sent jets over Libya to prevent exactly the kind of slaughter that happens every day south of its own border.
Mexico is a poster child for the old bumper sticker “If guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns.” Mexican troops and police and powerless against the forces of evil; they are too easily corrupted. Only the people can stop this criminal insurgency, which is already spilling over our borders and infecting our cities with lawless and wanton killing.
The ATF got it right (by mistake). The Drug Lords have plenty of guns from “official” channels. I wonder how many of the guns that went south were headed to Mexican citizens trying to defend themselves and their families. America must not stop the flow of guns south. We must increase it—to the right people.
News flash: channel6newsonline.com reports that the Mexican authorities have unearthed twenty more bodies in a mass grave in Durango, Mexico.
Guns to the right people——I like it. Friends and family in other countries which include England, Germany, Canada, and Mexico drool over my collection of weapons and ammo.
Even if the Mexican government allowed civilians to arm themselves, don’t you think that the cartels would intimidate and make examples of the legally armed citizen? The drug cartels would tighten their grip on the populace like an addict onto his last rock (not to make light of the situation).
No, there would be too many civilians to make this it effective. the narcos are vastly outnumbered by the populace, and can only cower them because they are completely helpless to resist the armed narcos.
Miforest, I agree with you if large-scale armament is what would happen. And maybe it would! We have seen what people will do to protect their livelihoods. Economic conditions aside, I’m sure we would see a run on every kind pump-action shotgun and shot shell in North America.
But I still think the narcos would give it the old college try…
Or they could just legalize drugs.
In case anyone missed Ron Paul’s “should heroin be legal?” answer during last week’s Republican debate: 17:20 mark. Pretty funny.
while i’m not generally a fan of Paul (or his son, too shrill) i found this comment to be one of the more intelligent statements of the evening. We have too much to worry about economically to keep spending (and sending “aid” for the war on drugs) o n what ultimately comes down to an issue of personal choice.
that would not really help the situation, now the drug cartels are not just involved in drugs, they are now sort of like a mafia. They are also int to kidnappings, extortion, robbery, etc… But still drugs is the main trade so by legalizing drugs all you do is take alot of their income away which will make them even more violent as they struggle to control all the rest of the illegal markets
Having a gun for self-defense is one thing. Actually using a gun for that purpose is another. Even if all the law-abiding Mexican people were armed, would they have the stones to pull the trigger if push came to shove? I’m unconvinced.
Is the discussion about vigilantism or self defense? I would argue skepticism about vigilantism, however the defensive use of firearms is rooted in a steep tradition of what happens when push comes to shove.
I agree. This point needs to be maid in any of the debates on gun control. The sad fact in the average Mexican citizen is armless against nacre-terror and the unable and unwilling government. Think of what a different world it would be if the local police chief could count on the armed resistance of they town and cities to allow them to weed out the bad guy’s and not make themselves targets by putting on a badge.
Seems to me that if we legitimize and tax the drug industry and move the drug growing, processing and distribution to the U.S. then America would be richer and more secure. It would create jobs, a helluva tax base, lead to better drug education/drug abuse treatment and end the needless violence south of the border. Our war on drugs is a farce, when I was a kid it was much more difficult to score a six-pack of beer than to score a sack of weed or some meth. Why? Alcohol is regulated/requires ID and illegal drugs aren’t. Yes, it is that simple. This is not a gun contol issue, this is a supply-demand issue and U.S. drug laws allow violent cartels to profit by controlling the illict drug trade. If you take away the MONEY it’s like cutting the head off the snake. They found 400 people in a mass grave last week and politicians on both sides try to blame guns and not money for this type of violence. It makes me sick.
The only way that drugs should be legalized here is if the cost, and I mean *all* the cost, of their use is born by the users. If you turn into an abuser. Lose your job. Wind up on the street. You get nothing, *nothing*, from the rest of us. You get high and hurt someone you pay dearly with your property and liberty. Period.
You druggies willing to do it this way? No bleeding-heart rehab, no compassion for the weak addict. You use responsibly such that it improves society (and I don’t mean trading crime for rampant stoned inefficiency) or you disappear. Got it? That’s what the drug-free citizen demands from you drug utopians.
Having lived in a country with constant drug-related violence, I’m not convinced that armed citizens will make a dent on drug lords as powerful as the ones in Mexico. Narcos don’t have an issue with the general populace as long as their trade routes are kept open. Most killings are turf wars or clashes with the government who is attempting to close these routes. They can keep the population in check with some old fashion intimidation.
Ask Iraq vets. Many families in Bagdad own high power rifles, which do not prevent the multiple kidnappings and killings that were occuring. Owning a gun treats the symptom, it was not until the source of the problem was targeted, that the level of killings went down.
Narco gun violence is fueled by flow of cash and guns south from the USA into Mexico, in exchange for drugs and immigrants flowing north. Most of the guns in Mexico’s drug trade are purchased, mostly legally from unscrupulous dealers or at shows, in the US and then exported there illegally. Stopping the flow of guns from the USA into Mexico and the Caribbean should be relatively easy, but dumb laws and dumber politics prevent reasonable solutions to be effected. Now, of course, this is only one facet of a complex problem.
Until we Americans realize that our actions and lifestyle has an effect on the rest of the world (with consequences that then boomerang back home), ie drug users finance the narcos, easy access to guns in the US supplies the illegal gun trade both at home and abroad, excessive oil use fuels the middle east dictators and requires USA military muscle to keep the oil flowing, etc. etc, etc, I don’t perceive a solution in sight.
This is simple. Narcos get their guns from the Mexican Military, Mexican Police and black market in Mexico. The Corrupt Mexicans are the problem. NOT American gun owners. 99% of Americans do not own fully automatic weapon or grenades. I wonder if only Mexico can border the Greatest country on earth and remain a Third World country for over 2oo years?
Late to the party.
This is a Classic example.
Criminals ignore the laws they choose to ignore for their own purposes.
Good folks die, because good folks obey the law. The Government and Legislators should be proud in the manner they are “PROTECTING” the people.
Now that SHOULD BE an injustice in everyones book.
Go figure.
Fred
“We can evade reality, but we cannot evade the consequences of evading reality” – Ayn Rand
A fire and forget comment.
Basically I fail to see how the arguments
A) Illegal drug trade is very lucrative (leading to massive drug cartels)
and
B)Drug cartels that are very rich incite government corruption
lead to the conclusion
C)everyone should have guns.
It just doesn’t follow. For the normal person, having a gun is more likely to lead to an unnecessary shooting. It really has no effect on them choosing to do drugs or to get involved in drugs. One thing you have to realise is that the Mexican drugs are because there is huge demand for them in the U.S. Also- if huge cartels are in Mexico but most of those drugs go into the U.S., then there must also be massive drug cartels in the U.S. Just the much tougher policing means they are much deeper underground.
Lastly the war or drugs is lost. They should be legalized because:
1)If you legalize you can regulate
2)If you regulate you know exactly who is using drugs (ie ID required to buy)
3)Regulating means it becomes a real job, requiring license, proper care and better quality drug, leading to less deaths, less sickness, less petty crime.
4)Knowing who does the drugs also means you can target them, and provide aid to help them quit, rather than dumping them in prison and wasting taxpayer money.
5)The drug cartels would basically evaporate, as legally providing the drugs make it legitimate business, as that is easier, safer and controlled. No cartels means drug crime bottoms out. I mean it will just vanish.
6)People would use drugs less. This is because you can give them help, instead of locking them up. They are less likely to feel guilty about it and more likely to seek aid managing or removing the addiction.
7)If you look at the facts from countries that have legalized drugs, all of them have had much, much less crime. Funnily enough they have also had a reduction in people using drugs, with less starting drugs and more people quitting drugs.
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