Reader Michael L. writes:
I received a notification that my county police department has instituted a system called Smart911. From my research it is a private company that sells their service to government entities. It is a repository of citizen information available to first responders supposedly. It gets tied into the 911 police system. It talks about uploading photos of all family members, medical records, etc. In about a minute of research I see that noting whether firearms are “stored in the home” is one of their target areas. This is a huge intrusion into gun owners privacy and rights . . .
There are so many questions that come to mind. Who has access to the information? Will the information be used by firearm licensing agencies in California, New Jersey, New York? What protection is there from the database being hacked or misused? What legal recourse does a citizen have if the information is misused? Can you expunge information?
They say call centers across the country have access to this info. I am absolutely NOT going to use this intrusive governmental ploy. One article about the system I found regards its use in California and it clearly mentions tracking firearms.
This is from a FAQ page for Orange County Virginia:
3. How do I sign up for Smart 911?
Citizens can sign up for this free service by visiting the Smart911 Website. Smart911 can help save your life in the event of an emergency. The more information first responders know about you up front, the quicker they can act when every second counts. Smart911 is free, 100% private, secure and used by thousands of 911 call centers across the country. Smart911
My question is how did it shave 11 mins off the response time?
Drones (they seem to work for everything else).
The sad thing is that if that is the case it wouldn’t surprise me anymore. Although it could be the NSA in all fairness.
Well, if he was coughing and choking, he might not have been able to spit out the address. Having his number linked with his address means they didn’t have to wait for triangulation from his cell service provider.
That’s my guess.
If its a cell, why assume he’s at home?
Which doesn’t help at all if he is house-sitting his grandmother’s house in another town.
Actually, looks like you can provide as many addresses as you want in your profile… so you can include your work address, grandma’s address, your kid’s school address, etc. The point is, when you dial 9-1-1 from a cell phone, the dispatcher can only get a general idea of where you might be located (say within 100 or more yards) — so if they’re able to recover an address within that range using your Smart911 profile then of course its best to use that as a starting point.
Um sure it’s offered, but there is no way I would use it. Medical history? Home address? How did having the home address help the person stuck in the car? Firearms stored in the home? Would NEVER give that information to police to look up. I’ll stick with the old 911 system thank you.
I volunteer to not use this system. And here I was taught to never volunteer for anything.
The information, along with the newly required electronic medical records helps to create a national donor pre-match data base. This will match every healthy american with a wealthy politically connected person.
Look for an increase in fatal head trauma in the coming years 🙂
“Look for an increase in fatal head trauma in the coming years”
What happens when medical science finally gets to the point that they can transplant brains?
The followers of shannon watts and kapo bloomberg better be careful in that event. A like new unused brain would be worth quite a bit to a terminal rich guy.
As an EMT – screw that.
It’s a not a “huge intrusion into gun owners privacy and rights” if you volunteer the information in the first place. Just sayin’.
I would be more concerned about database leakage and who has access to the information. As the government has taught me, it’s private/secure… until it isn’t.
Until it becomes mandatory.
…But it’s for the greater good…
Ughh, where’s Simon Pegg when ya need him?
Hopefully that little whiny weasel Pegg is no where near me.
“Smart911 is free, 100% private, secure and used by thousands of 911 call centers across the country. ”
so 100% private somehow equals used by thousands of call centers across the country.
Bingo!!
It’s just saying that the Smart911 program has been purchased by thousands of 911 centers across the country. If you keep reading, you’ll see that the information is not searchable for dispatchers or first responders. 911 only has access to the information when you call — then its only available to them for a brief time until it disappears back into the database… I dont know, it’s not like they’re asking for financial info or your SSN. Seems like it’s only purpose is to help increase efficiency in responding to emergencies. I think it’s pretty clever.
The company and any agency that uses it would be committing a felony in the state of Florida because it is a Felony to create and maintain a list of lawful gun owners or registries in the state of Florida.
http://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/2011/790.335
It was a felony for Eric holder to walk thousands of guns to Mexico too. That didn’t stop him. He didn’t get any punishment for it either. So why wouldn’t they commit some more of them?
That didn’t stop Florida from providing such info db to Maryland (among others).
You can include whatever information in your profile that you want. You don’t have to say you’re a gun owner if you don’t want to — I created my profile and they don’t even ask that question. Everyone is so paranoid it’s crazy.
Before calling 9-1-1, call 1911(A1)!
I know that St. John the Browning was inspired directly by angels to design his firearms. But I didn’t know they could deal with things like heart attacks, strokes, fires and all the other little problems the 911 system is meant to handle.
You are obviously holding the 1911 wrong. They can be used to restore the bearer’s soul from their cache of all of the others collected by their defensive use. Duh!
Likely everyone here knows that I like Commie guns.
Therefore, everyone with access to pretty much any search engine has access to that information.
If this private firm has your firearms information, they found out from some publicly available source. The information became non-private the moment you tweeted it, blogged about it, mentioned it in some public way.
It is what it is.
Stay off Facebook and Twitter and never use your real name to make comments. Sure, if the ATF wants to find out more about you they’ll probably find all your posts, but no need to make it easy. If you really want to make it hard use a proxy server. Anonymity is bliss.
**Anonymity is dead.
FIFY.
So says the man with the pseudonym.
If we buy up all the Commie guns, they will be defenseless.
It’s for the children. It will help us all. Such Debby Downers.
Haters.
This type of ‘intrusion’ is the future. To simply stand against it is futile. Severe regulation of this takes cooperation.
For instance. I am FOR a national ID!
Every thing get’s misused sooner or later.
I could be for national ID. SSN, plus a fingerprint or two, along with your name. No need for address, phone #, height, weight, etc. As in an ID, not your life story, political leanings, education or criminal history, *ID*, period.
…with all information stored in a SECURE national database….
How do I get a jumbo font LMAO
Everyone on this blog has just committed a Thought Crime in the first degree, a Class A Felony. Report to your local commissar immeadatley for punishment.
What limits are there in how we punish the local commisar?
So it looks like we can sign up and submit our own information. I see a lot of Plasma Rifles in the 40 Watt range turning up in that database in the near future.
I kinda liked the “rail guns”.
“We’re from the goobermint and we’re here to help, Geronimo!” “First we need to register all your bows and arrows………”
I remember something like this up north——but it cost extra to the free 911 service–not counting the monthly fee—I think $5 a month—-you provide the info—-little johnny’s hiding spot—mom’s meds, etc—–have not heard of this company–but as noted by other replies—it the info you upload to other sites that is used-
Ok, so don’t sign up for the Smart911, next!
I am not really worried about this. Very few places use it (Culver City is the only location in LA county, and the only other locations I can find in CA are San Francisco University, CSU Long Beach… namely some university centers)
Even if it gained traction, it is dubious that it would have any chance at becoming mandatory, at least in its current form- privacy in medical records is still pretty important Besides, anything that requires you to actively do something tends to be resisted in practice even by the most nanniest of nanny-state advocates.
As far as the benefit. How does this provide a faster response time, when e911 already provides addresses/location? Heck, even before e911, if you called on a landline they got your location immediately (as I learned as a child when my sister dialed 911 as a joke and the police were at our door in 5 minutes giving us a lecture about falsely calling 911) With e911 they have location from cell phones.
And what if you use someone else’s cell phone? e911 simply says location, and doesn’t pretend to know your blood type.
Very few places use it? What are you thinking, they TOLD us it was used by thousands of places! What, are you trying to say they might LIE?!?
actually dispatchers can’t track your exact location when you’re dialing from a cell phone — take that drowning victim from Georgia as an example — she called 911 when her suv went into a lake but ended up drowning moments later because the responders couldn’t locate her on the map: http://www.11alive.com/story/news/local/investigations/2015/01/31/911-location-problems-/22645139/
….that’s why they’re saying this service could be lifesaving
But it’s for our own good. Besides any information they get about my guns if woefully out of date(tragic boating mishap). Seriously if I call 911 they get here in1-2 minutes(I live around the corner).They get here if I don’t want “em to…
Looks like a great way for a hacker to swat someone…
My understanding of this system is that the information is only accessible when a phone number attached to that address or vehicle (by you) is used. Dispatch is apparently unable to access this information at a whim. How secure it actually is I don’t know, but this is how it was explained to me.
Okay, I am actually a little bit keen on this. If I am in my home and the police are responding my 911 call because of an intrusion, I want them to know what I look like. That way, when they come through the door and hopefully see me facing the bad guy with my sr9, they don’t shoot me thinking I am the aggressor. It has been a long standing what-if scenario in my mind. I would want the firearms registration removed, but I would also want the responding officer to know what he/she was coming in to.
Do you get to decide what info/pics you want included?
You Volunteer the info. In the case of fires it’s nice to know things such as invalids in the house and where , wether folks there are on home oxygen , and so forth .
100% private, secure
Speaking as an actual programmer with a modicum of database knowledge:
No such thing as 100% private and secure.
yup, you can generally pick 2 of 3.
Speed
Security
Easy to use
If “free” is involved, maybe only one.
The city where I live has contracted this service. The main marketing point for the service was the increased response time when calls into 911 are made from cell phones. Since the advent of cells and the decrease in land lines, it can be difficult for first responders to pinpoint the location of the caller.
I did choose to put my cell phone information and family details into the service since I don’t want to have to explain myself in an emergency if my attention must be somewhere else. I do not remember a question about firearms stored in the home, I know if it was there I would not have answered it. You can give them as much or as little info as you want. They know my cell number, the address it belongs to and the number of family living in the home.
Did anyone actually fact check the statement about firearms? I did some digging and even signed up, and didn’t see any mention of firearms anywhere in the profile questions, or on the site. And there were no mandatory questions either, I only put in my name and phone number to create the account and then it dropped me onto a dashboard page that let me choose anything else I wanted to enter. And believe me, I went through every section to check. It was all medical notes, house info, pets, vehicles etc. Stuff that seems pretty standard for responders to know about.
I think the source for the firearms info was wrong- the article in CA was from 2 years ago, a lot could have changed since then.
Well, I for one will not be signing up for this bit of Big Brother.
I have a potato cannon. Do I have to list it?
Just realized I still have a marshmallow gun. Does it count?
Funny how they want all the information. Addresses, gun info, bedrooms, etc but I know on my cell bill, I pay a fee for 9-11, which I was told would make it quicker to find me anyway.
Sounds like a ploy database to get more information about gun owners…
This service is a scam. They sell the info gathered.
I’m an NRA member (although that’s getting more and more embarrassing to admit) and a gun owner and all I can say is Oh, Palllleeese!
I’m signed up for this and it NEVER asked anything about guns. Nothing. Where is this article getting it’s info?
And if you don’t want to give them medical info, don’t.
If you don’t want to tell them anything but that you have a cat you want them to save then you’re ahead of the game.
Besides, I give out information all over the place, the bank, my insurance, etc etc is there a risk of hacking? Sure, there always is. But if I’m calling 911 because my house is on fire and I’m going to give them my address what do I care if they already have it? That would be a good thing
If some nutcase has a gun on me (it’s not like I carry my gun around the house, I”m more likely to have my phone at hand) and all I can do is covertly hit 911 so they can hear the goings on. Great! They’ve got my address, (and the information that I have a service dog that I’d prefer they aren’t startled by in the yard so she gets shot.)
I don’t know what all the “it’s a scam” hoo haa is about.
The service is completely voluntary; you don’t have to register if you don’t want to, and if you do register you aren’t required to provide all the information that is available. However, as a 9-1-1 operator, when you can’t respond to someone in a crisis because they can’t speak and you don’t know why, or where they are, there is no worse feeling of helplessness. Smart911 is a service designed to help 9-1-1, first responders, and citizens. It would behoove you to actually check into the service and find out what your 9-1-1 center does before declaring it’s a “scam” or “big brother watching you”. Frankly, when you’re having that massive heart attack, you’ll wish like hell “big brother” knew where you were.