We’re in the dog days, when comfort is at a premium. Ray says this arrangement is, “nice and light weight for minimal pockets and light clothing. When I get time I’ll post my heavier gear and the bag that is always near by.” Do you feel his pain? See what he’s carrying at Everyday Carry . . .
Number one requirement, have a gun. The rest is just personal opinion.
Absolutely not, the importance of carrying a handgun worthy of a gunfight does not change based on the weather. Unless one has a physical dissability there is no reason not to carry a mid frame to fullsize gun all year round. There are so many quality holsters and belts and carry systems available to us now that no matter what your body type or attire it is relatively easily acomplished. The only qualifying factor is our will to actually do it.
I agree. I’ve never understood the folks who carry a subcompact us something like .380. It’s better than nothing, but IMHO only marginally so.
Those same people are generally the ones who think their little mouse gun is sufficient to stop an attack like the one at the Baticlan in Paris as if having a gun, any gun is some sort of force field that protects them. Yeah, body armor and an AK vs a .380 pocket pistol in a dark and crowded venue when chaos insues and headshots areally a requirement… No handgun is preferable in this situation, but the longer the barrel and the sight radius the better IMHO.
Some aren’t concerned about “stopping the attack,” but merely “escaping alive.”
“Some aren’t concerned about “stopping the attack,” but merely “escaping alive.””
Some people are pussies and that’s what you just described here. If it’s not to “stop the attack” then what’s the gun for? So you can run for the exit screaming like a little bitch and blindly firing over your shoulder?
My main concern is getting out alive. Since I do not know the location where such an event may occur, the only guaranteed cover available to me and my loved ones is the accurate gunfire I bring with me. The more guaranteed cover the better.
Derek:
Here’s my point. If you’re carrying a gun what’s it for? Shoot BG’s right? If your plan in an attack like the Baticlan is to run away you don’t need the gun. You need decent shoes or boots (no flip flops).
Now, there might be some limited application to “fight your way out” but the real problem with an attack like the Baticlan is you can’t get out because the doors are jammed with other people trying to do the same thing. That means you’re in a situation where you can’t flee and bullets are flying from the terrorists guns. So what do you do? Shooting one of them may successfully take them down or even kill them. Great, now the other BG’s are focused on you. Multiple AK’s and body armor vs your handgun. Odds are; you’re dead. Now, during the time it takes them to figure out where you are and engage you other people are getting out. So, there’s the possibility of getting out after the crowd clears the doorway, but that’s not very likely.
Realistically, if you’re caught in a situation like this you basically have two options: forgo the gun, hope you’re lucky and try to get the hell out or engage and buy time for others to get out knowing that you’ll likely die in doing so. Either way, the gun isn’t going to “save” you. It’s either useless or a tool you use to trade your life for the lives of others.
Now, admittedly the chances of being caught up in a mass shooting are slim. However, they’re random. Sometimes it a gay club in Orlando, sometimes it’s a concert venue in Paris, sometimes it’s a school, sometimes it’s a mall, sometimes it’s a movie theater. Sometimes it’s just some asshole out on the street shooting people. So it could happen to you.
My opinion and analysis is this: regardless of the situation a longer sight radius and longer barrel give you the ability to confidently project force to a longer distance with better accuracy. This increases the chances you put rounds on target which increases the chances you (and others) survive. No matter what I’m doing I’d rather have the gun that’s good at longer ranges and holds more ammo and comes back to a nice sight picture faster.
Due to these considerations I see no upside to “mouse guns” or really small semi-autos other than as a backup gun.
Most of the time I see people buying little guns like this it’s a woman who says something like “It won’t take up too much space in my purse” which is another way of saying “I’ll likely never have to use it and if I do have an occasion to use it in defense of myself or others I won’t be able to get to it in time”.
Strych9,
Makes sense to me, admittedly in a terrorist attack (not a random mass shooting, those people are likely to shoot themselves at first sign of armed resistance) the odds of sucesfully eliminating the threats with a handgun are highly unlikely, I’m still going to bring the handgun that provides the most chance for my family, other innocents and hopefully myself to make it out. If my actions in a situation where I am almost surely going to die can save lives they are worth it. Not only is a full sized handgun the best of the poorly capable (ie not a rifle) for a terrorist attack, but rhe greater capacity is much better for the garden variety car jacking/mugging as well, especially since the criminal element seems to be well aware of the advantages of strength in numbers.
Derek:
“…I’m still going to bring the handgun that provides the most chance for my family, other innocents and hopefully myself to make it out.”
Exactly. And don’t forget that it can be a single carjacker high on meth. You can have inflicted a fatal wound and they’re still capable of returning the favor. Personally, I want the ability to shoot til they drop and do so with bullets that are as effective as I can get without deploying a rifle.
As unlikely as a terror attack or determined mass shooter is I prefer to carry the maximum available effectiveness to deal with whatever I may come across. When the difference between a much more effective handgun and a significantly less effective one is a few ounces I’m seeing a no brainer. Packing a few extra oz for a lot more wallop isn’t really a hard decision and a full frame pistol isn’t hard to conceal reasonably effectively. Since no concealment of any gun on your person is perfect anyway the choice is clear.
Strych9,
Couldn’t agree more, your words are a much needed dose of sanity and a reminder that the internet is not entirely devoid of logical and consistent thought. Cheers
Mouse guns like the LCP have their place and time. I can take the LCP with me to a social event, carried in a pocket holster while wearing a tucked-in dress shirt and flat-front pants, without a jacket, and have no odd printing to be noticed. I can get hugged by a dozen girls at that event, and I don’t have to explain that thing on my side that they felt under my shirt, because it isn’t there.
The same way Homeland Security had those color coded threat levels , I have my own system depending on where I am going, what time of day, and what I am doing. It’s either Threat Level LCP or Threat Level SR9c most of the time.
This x1000
It is 100+ degrees outside in Texas right now, and I have had zero issues carrying a full-size FNS 9 this summer with as little as just a t-shirt,khaki shorts, and flip flops. The weight of the pistol is too much for gym attire, but that’s about it.
It has been said a million times on these pages but the key to carrying a fullsize pistol is having a good belt (re: one that is actually designed for carrying a gun) and adjusting the cant of the holster to place it in just the right spot under my hip so it kind of follows the natural shape of my side (thats an obtuse way of saying that having generous love handles helps a lot).
Something is better than nothing, but you are already at a disadvantage because you are reacting to a threat and are coming out of concealment, why further complicate things by carrying a gun that you will struggle to shoot as well as a fullsize?
Check out the smart carry, g19 and a spare 22 round mag in gym shorts is a hell of a thing. I use it when I run or work out. (Although I do advise using a kydex trigger guard in conjunction with it as it is a soft material)
Alright- a Taurus 22! Still better than that 25 Beretta from last week (maybe)…pretty EZ to hide. The knife is tacti-cool.
more comments from poorly educated children.
Refer to “Ballistics by the Inch”.
Speaking of “comments from poorly educated children”, at least his education included the concept of and use of capitalization at the beginning of a sentence, unlike yours…
I’d rather have a 22 than a 25 bounce off me slick-25 is 19th century garbage…and I’ve quoted BBTI many times. Duh.
Finally! After so many comments and replies from all the tacticool operators operating with their full-sized nines and forty-fives besmirching the benefits of a pocket piece, someone decides to give the lowly PT-22 a little love.
Something you full-bore fans may not have considered: the Taurus tip-up .22 and its Beretta cousins are ideal for someone who may lack the hand strength for a conventional slide on a pistol and want something slimmer than a five-shot snubbie revolver. We dont know the Taurus owners needs or circumstances so I’ll not judge his choices.
Neat, reet and petite.
Wouldn’t be my first choice for a carry piece, with how small the pocket nines have gotten I really don’t see that Taurus .22 being something I would carry. But a gun is better than no gun.
I feel the pain of having to see that picture. I’ll give him a 2 out of 10 for at least having a weapon available. Personally I find a 9mm pocket gun plenty small enough for the hot humid end of summer.
Something about those Taurus Poly Protectors really excites me.
And anyway, all you have to do is read ShootingTheBull410s Blog and it becomes pretty clear that even a Taurus .22 will take care of you in 90+ percent of encounters.
a Taurus .22 will take care of you
It certainly could, but a small round leaves no margin for error and may not take care of the bad guy quickly enough.
Hence why I referenced STB’s analysis on his blog.
According to the data he sifted through, in almost every single case, as soon as you pull your gun you win. In the vanishingly small percentage of cases where that’s not enough, as soon as you fire a round (whether or not it connects) you win.
In the small subset of the small percentage of cases where just firing a round is not enough, just HITTING the target is enough to stop the threat (psychological stop). According to his data, there is only about a 3 percent chance that the caliber even has an effect on the outcome of the encounter.
http://shootingthebull.net/blog/does-caliber-even-matter/
Should you still carry a bigger gun? Yeah definitely, for several reasons. Not the least of which is they’re way cooler. 😛
The way I see it, people who carry firearms are planning for the tiny (1% or so) chance they will need to defend themselves. Why would you not keep planning for those tiny chances? Only a small ammount of people have to fire to stop the threat so why carry loaded? Only a small percentage of people need more than one hit, so why not carry a derringer? Moral of the story is find a good holster, good belt and carry the biggest gun and most spare magazines you can conceal.
How tiny a chance do you need? Why is your limit on ability to conceal? Why not carry a rifle around with you everywhere? How many magazines do you carry? Couldn’t you carry more?
Hannibal,
The limit is on what can be concealed due to the fact that most of us work in profesions that would frown on the open carrying of firearms, if not fire us for it. Not to be overlooked is the fact that concealing is in some municipalities a legal requirement and is tactically more advantageous. As far as the rifle is concerned see the above as to why concealability is a determining factor. Now a rifle should be kept as close by as is possible to secure it, be that a backpack or a vehicle or a compartment of your desk. I routinely carry 3 spare g17 magazines which for my body size is the limit while preventing myself from incuring a spinal injury in a scuffle (no sob carry) while also accounting for my other gear to still be accessible (fixed blade, folder, handheld light, phone, wallet, keys, multiple tqs, gloves and my light equiped g19 or 17) If I find myself wearing cargo pants then I also pack a full trauma kit or two as well. Now there are times when I only carry one or two spare magazines and not the maximum amount of three that I could carry. This is me allowing sheer laziness to decrease my ability to respond to any threat that may arise. The difference is that I am self aware enough to admit it as such and not try to make excuses as to why I do it or even worse delude myself into believing I have done all that I can.
As I figured. You struck the nerve of “you must carry a SERIOUS battle weapon” crowd.
We’ll I don’t often carry an AR, AK, on even an FNFAL when going about my daily routine. If we’re talking battle weapon, everything else is insufficient.
I normally carry an LCP for a getaway gun. To let me get away from them and let them know I want them to get away from me.
Anyone who thonks it is only marginally better than a stick is either an idiot or a 4 Dan Black Belt in Hapkido (on steroids)
Do mouse guns fail to stop? Yep. So does everything else I might carry in a pocket or on a belt.
So…. Have as big a gun as you will carry and be able to hit with.
Neither do I, but you should keep one as close by as is reasonable. Unexpected gunfights wil lof course occur and we are left with only what we actually have with us. If you have tried a ton of different belts and holsters and you cant avoid printing with anything bigger than your lcp then perhaps ask for some assistance. Or an aknowlegement must be made that you are taking a risk that could be easily mitigated if you had the will to do it. As far as getting hits is concerned thats much easier with a bigger framed gun, the longer barrel and larger energy load tends to help that as well. With handguns it is largly shot placement dependent but you can certainly achieve a physical stop. A whole lot of rounds to the high thoracic is a good way to go. The more the better.
I agree. I often carry a bigger pistol or revolver but I will always have the LCP if I am carrying.
I keep a larger pistol in my vehicle along with additional ammunition.
Maybe a long gun as well. Depends on where I’m planning to be.
Have a gun. Bigger is better…..but not if it’s somewhere else.
Lol best comments section in a long time. Just out of curiousity wonder what the weight difference is between that Taurus and a pocket 9? I wouldnt think that much.
The poly 22 weighs about 10oz. Empty.
9 22s weights a little over an oz.
My LCP weighs 12oz loaded.
Pick your nine.
But of course weight isn’t everything. A light gun shooting 9mm will have a much different felt recoil than a similarly weighted gun shooting a smaller caliber.
Rule #1: Have a gun.
Better than a pointy stick, I reckon.
I knew a 22 lr pistol would get mean comments.
I say good for you for having a gun. If it’s your choice, ok cool I get it…I have an sr22 i trust and size wise it sure is easy to hide/handle.
“If it’s not to “stop the attack” then what’s the gun for?”
It’s for anything that gets in my way to the exit.
In a society where there’s no police service I’d be helping to stop the attack, since I’m a social animal.
But with me paying so frickin much in tax money (read: trading in part of my life) funding those men with guns, I’ve done enough, and I’m outta here. No apologies.
You are wrong when you say only a full size or compact gun is sufficient
I carry either a Sig 938 9mm or Bersa Thunder cc .380
Both weigh 16 oz, both have 7 shots and wear Crimson trace laser grips
I have practiced shooting while running toward and away from targets
I can make hits from 30 feet at a full run with the laser
I can shoot from unconventional positions behind cover/concealment without exposing myself
A small gun in my pocket with a laser and I am superman!
I could certainly have hit the (single) pulse nightclub shooter while hiding behind the bar
As for a multiple terrorist attack, I will have his rifle after I shoot one of the terrorists
Most of us are conservatives who value individuality, so why are we fussing so much about someone’s gun choice, no matter the motive. Let’s not forget not everyone is 6’2″ and can wear baggy Hawaiian shirts all day. “Warm weather carry” makes sense not just for sweat and comfort, but also because we’re wearing fewer clothes. Derek touched on this, but the first C in CCW is for concealed. I’m 5’7″ and sorry, I am not effectively concealing a full-size 1911, no matter how good the holster is.
Nice Trayvax wallet, BTW.
Wow, I just googled my self and found out I generated an interesting discussion. As one of the posters says I use a three level carry system based on the potential threats I might come across. I have a larger 45, a compact 9mm and the 22. If I am doing something where the threat possibility is significantly lower then other situations I am comfortable with the 22. Based on my level of training and experience I am confident on what I can do with the Taurus 22ply with17 rounds. It’s very accurate up to 15 yards but how offen to shootings occur at that distance. Also I live in a rural area that in my opinion has a low probability of a terrorist style situation.