This video doesn’t prove that Carnell Snell was holding a gun when he was perforated by the police. It proves that he had a gun. Which is entirely relevant, if not decisive.
But what’s up with Mexican carry? I mean, the same advantages of holstering your firearm apply to good guys and bad: retention, presentation, and safety. And yet I’ve seen plenty of footage of criminals with guns stuffed in their waistband. Holsters aren’t that expensive. So why don’t they use them?
Maybe it helps hold their pants down?
Lots of speculation below about the relative ease of ditching a gat versus the holster, but if we’re putting it to a vote, Swarf, I think you nailed it.
I’ve always heard speculation that they can ditch the firearm easier without the holster. I’d think that an IWB that uses belt clips rather than fixed loops would be just as fast, but maybe a holdover from that idea.
Or you ditch the firearm but it’s harder to ditch the holster in time and having an empty holster is very likley probable cause and reasonable suspicion if you fit the description of the perp.
I imagine DO is on the right track. Even if you manage to ditch your handgun, having an empty holster could potentially be incriminating. Not only does it strongly suggest that you had a handgun, it could even tend to confirm which handgun a witness claims you had. For example, if a witness claims that you had a small semi-auto pistol and your holster is designed to hold a small semi-auto pistol, your day just went from bad to worse. Of course, if a witness claims that you had a huge revolver and your holster is designed for a small semi-auto pistol, your day just went from bad to slightly better.
On that front, why don’t criminals wear the wrong holster on purpose? Carry a compact 9mm auto, wear a taurus judge holster. If you manage to ditch the gun, then you have counter evidence on your body. 😉
That would imply intelligence…
used to work with LE… you got it in one.
having a holster is generally accepted as enough probable cause to start searching so the thugs don’t like having a holster.
You’re giving criminals a lot more credit that they’re due. You’d be amazed how many people traffic drugs out of cars that are rolling probable cause (headlight out, illegal tint, etc plus they then smoke weed in the same car leading to a search)
Not to give criminals any ideas, but Fobus holsters are cheap and very fast to take off.
Looks like a bible, pez dispenser or job application. But seriously, I’m sure he was wearing a belly band holster.
Criminals tend not to be the sharpest knives in the drawer, that’s why.
The guy they bought the gun from didn’t have a good selection in his trunk.
Thinking that when you steal a gun, you don’t waste time looking for the holster.
Yep, the holster would cost them more than what was paid for the firearm. Plus, the other homies would disrespect a holster user. B
I dunno for certain but it sure looks like lack of training and knowledge about firearms, defensive gun use, and concealed carry. You expecting thugs to take NRA classes and become members or something?
Or for that matter even do a few minutes of reading on the interwebs.
Aw c’mon, holsters are often expensive! This is no defense for “Mexican carry” but trying to buy a holster at a retailer is about as maddening as can be. A bunch of small plastic bags/boxes stuffed with black plastic or brown leather – and labled with small print of ubiquitous codes or numbers. A non-gun person or a criminal isn’t going to do it. Too much work! The company/retailer who figures out how to display/merchandise holsters in an easy/friendly way will set sales records.
A couple of other things to remember about bad guys. Getting caught wearing an empty holster after ditching a gun won’t help their cause. Plus of course, most holsters don’t work very well when one is only wearing untied sweat pants.
I’ll just leave it at that.
All the thugs care about is they got their “nine” or “snubbie”. They know squat about the model and if the manufacturer’s name isn’t prominent on the slide they may not know that either. How’s a homie gonna buy a holster if’n he don’t know what gun he’s got? Not to mention he’d have to slide his thug ass into a real gun store to find the damn thing and then actually pay for it in cash. Not the most comfortable shopping experience for those guys, I’d imagine.
Stolen guns in cities that all but outlaw gun ownership. I doubt there is a gun store in town to get fitted with a holster. They are too dumb to look up the model and order off the internet. It’s not like they have a credit card anyway.
How racist. I’m certain a whole lot of them have credit cards in several different names!
They are stupid, and holster cost money. Can’t get to many on the black market like their gun.
In my experience the reason is threefold.
1) Lack of training/experience/knowledge of firearms.
2) Ditching a gun is easier when you don’t also have to ditch a holster, which if it’s a nice holster tells the cops what type of gun to look for. You probably didn’t ditch a Cobra .380 when you’r wearing a kydex holster for an M9…
3) Culture. Until appendix carry holsters became a thing it was difficult to lift your shirt in the front and basically “brandish” a gun without drawing it while talking shit.
Not wearing a holster increases the chances that they will accidentally shoot themselves. I’m good with that.
Hard to steal an exact match for you stolen piece, or if they bought it on the street the salesmen are likely woefully understocked on acessories. When selling stolen gats, try and lift any available associated accessories. Point of purchase add on merchandise is a must!
If you carry with just a waistband, you eventually develop a bruise where the gun rubs constantly.If you are in a situation where you have a girl, but can’t carry at the time, the bruise marks you as macho man, a real desperado. makes the girls swoon when you lower your pants.
If you “be a real gangsta”, your pants are already lowered, it is your exposed underwear you lower 😉
Loss of skreet cred points if they use a real holster.
When was the last time anyone ever saw a custom made holster for a Hi-Point?
http://aliengearholsters.com/holsters/hi-point-9mm.html
Ask Cali-Zim. He’s the king of illegally carrying s firearm.
Yep. Just like let’s move-zim is an expert at defacing synagogues. Ask him which spray paint works best for swastikas.
Just so’s you know. I use a holster when carrying without an illegal and unconstitutional permission slip.
But you keep supporting hillary and her racist bunch.
Good. You’re back. I was getting worried about you.
Somebody has to work and pay taxes so your ebt card don’t run dry. You people really do think money is free, don’t you?
They wear loose fitting pants (like the sweatpants in that video) and no belt, they sag and their shirts don’t always cover their ass and no belt, they see it movies/tv/internet and they think it’s a good idea, and… I don’t want to keep going.
If the police catch you wearing a holster, it is hard to claim that you were unarmed if you ditch the gun.
Officer, I was just going downtown (here at 3 AM) to shop for a gun to fit my holster!
They can’t shoot straight, use ball ammo, violate all four rules all the time, are stupid, and are criminals. I would be shocked if they DID use a holster.
The author has it all wrong! Ghetto gangbangers all have “holsters” albeit the cheapest available and we’re all familiar with the brand names ie. Fruit of the Looms and Hanes and they’re called “briefs” (underwear).
If anything we should be encouraging thugs who possess firearms mainly handguns “illegally” to stuff them in their waistband and underwear. “Why?” Because more often than not their oversized paws result in them shooting themselves in their own penis and scrotum. Remember N.Y. Giants Plaxico (LOL) Burress? He not only perforated his thigh with a “negligent discharge” but his nut sack as well so anything that can lead to these animals rendering themselves incapable of procreating MUST be encouraged.
And for those who don’t know, all those Son’s of Obama you see grabbing at their crotches while shuffling down the street is a clear indication their gun has shifted in their briefs which they wear under their exposed boxer shorts.
Wait — what? Do you expect me to believe that thugs would be so utterly irresponsible with their stolen guns that they wouldn’t carry them in fine, hand-tooled leather holsters?
And next, you’ll be trying to convince me that they sometimes mix intoxicants and firearms. Yeah, sure.
I’ll have you know that thugs are experts at the Four Rules, too:
1. All guns are loaded all the time or they ain’t sheet.
2. Keep all guns pointed out the car window.
3. If your finger ain’t on the trigger you can’t shoot it.
4. Know the mofo you shooting at or you’ll never cap his @ss.
Spit my coffee. That is really funny.
On a scale of 1 to Ralph I give that a Ralph+.
“Which is entirely relevant, if not decisive.”
Because carrying a gun warrants a death sentence.
Thanks for the update, TTAG!
Oh, please.
Then please enlighten everyone on how a video showing the person having a gun on his person can be “decisive” on the matter at hand (i.e. the legality of the police killing).
easy so let’s count the ways:
1. it proves he was indeed armed so ignoring the “drop your weapon” thereafter made him dangerously lethal to the LEOs
2. did you watch his behavior? He knew the the police were after him, ducking and dodging behind the car with gun out at the ready; if an LEO came on him then, he certainly would have shot at him.
3. Seeing no LEOs in his proximity, he then stuck it in his waistband tried to drift away as “dindu nuffin”.
That video right there shows intent and shows criminal possession of a firearm, criminal concealment of a firearm, fleeing police.
That’s enough to stop and frisk and disarm right there which gets us current with the shoot.
You do realize the video does not show the actual moment he was confronted and shot by cops, right? There goes your “points” 1 and 2.
Also stop and frisk is not even the procedure for this encounter (that one having been ruled unconstitutional and not practiced anywhere outside the fascist NYC). Get your facts straight, shill.
Decisive as in “He didn’t have no gun.” As in, “He was just an unarmed
child/kid/teenager”. As in, “Summon musta planted that gun”. As in, “Poe-leece made-up all that gun stuff.”
Oh, so you are decisively rebutting the race hucksters who also have no regard for fact either, and in the process, revealed yourself as gun rights hypocrites. Brilliant. 🙂
Hey! Gang. Proof MDS is a computer. Many statements and responses make no more sense than this. Note MDS is replying to MDS.
Heh, bootlickers don’t recognize what is legally relevant and what isn’t, even when it is right in front of their face. 🙂
Maybe if we all ignore it, it’ll go away.
All you all (plural for you all) are wrong. The good citizen holds Mexican cause his spare coin goes to charity and helping children read.
“All you all (plural for you all)”
Beg pardon. Plural of ” ya’ll ” is ” all ya’ll “.
Seriously? We get an entire paragraph of politically correct claptrap hemming and hawing over the term “your woman” yesterday, yet you just come right out and bandy about “Mexican carry” with nary a care? Oh that’s rich!
Shhh! Hush! No, it’s not tantamount to saying “Israeli carry”, because that underlying activity isn’t inherently dangerous nor are Israelis presumed to be criminals. No comparison. It’s not even an accurate comparison to Mexicans, whose only crime was defying a tyrant.
You are asking why someone so stupid and lazy they became a criminal isn’t smart enough to use a holster? I would think that question answers itself.
This
Bad guy having a holster fitting the gun that the bad guy just dropped is more proof you were in possession of it and increases the credibility of those signing complaints or being a witness against you.
Some holsters are also smooth and your fingerprints can be left on them when ditching them. Reference above paragraph for more.
Probably similar reasons to why bad guys so often drive around without a seatbelt on. Think about it… not only do seatbelts help in an accident, but not wearing them is just giving cops a reason to stop you. I can’t imagine how many people would have gotten away with crimes except they didn’t wear a seatbelt, got stopped, and everything unraveled. Even when it’s just someone with a suspended license, you have to wonder… they KNOW that getting stopped means jail, but they still don’t put a seatbelt on. It doesn’t make sense from a rational point of view, but not everything’s rational. Maybe it’s just a level of bravado in their culture or maybe it’s just taught somehow.
But to all the people in the comments talking about how it’s easier to to ditch a gun without a holster… I suspect you’re not thinking like a street criminal. Which is to say you’re thinking several steps ahead and about potential consequences. And so you don’t find yourself in as many situations where you end up on videos after being shot by the police.
Video of instances like this seem kind of creepy to me. I din’t know the story but yes, no holster, but ~ well dressed enough to not scream drug user/dealer/gang banger. Moved like youthful, former sports or ex-mil type. If the opening credits to something at the theater ended with that sequence, you’d be rooting for them as the protaganist, or the mis-understood bad guy. So what the shizzay is going on?
Yes, no holster plays out as bad carry-ops tactics. But the whole thing seems weird.
“… retention, presentation, and safety.”
What makes you think any of those are a concern to someone looking to commit a crime? To them a holster is just more time and money they see as a waste. The holster is the trademark of a responsible gun owner. It shows that you thought it through. As opposed to grabbed a gun to go “pop” someone.
The holster separates the gun owner from the criminal the sams way the wakizashi separated the Samurai from the foot soldier.
Probably a bad time for the other dude to be wearing sweats and a blue shirt and walking in the same direction.
“Holsters aren’t that expensive. So why don’t they use them?”
Criminals use whatever gun is handy. Holsters are specialized. you can’t expect a crim to have a drawer full of holsters for all the random hi-points, lorcins, and other crap they go through, never mind what you do with the now useless holster once you ditch the gun after popping someone with it. They don’t pick one gun and carry it every day like the law-abiding.
Two words: Nyeh Kulturny.
Charlie
I actually know what that means. Good choice.
blankers gunna blank. What did you expect.