Florida Carry Preparing Lawsuit Against City of Miami Beach Over Open Carry Detentions

Florida Carry logo (courtesy wikipedia.org)

After his police officers were publicly embarrassed for not knowing state law and mistreating a group of open carry activists over the weekend, Miami Beach Police Chief Daniel J. Oates, through Miami Beach police spokesman Ernesto Rodriguez, claimed to the Miami Herald that he never received prior notification, either by e-mail or regular mail, from Florida Carry of their open carry fishing event.

Given the current climate, if six people show up to a pier in South Beach carrying guns, our citizens expect us to respond promptly and address any potential danger. We did so, and I am confident our officers acted appropriately.

According to MBPD records, no citizen or resident of Miami Beach contacted the police reporting any possible danger at the sight of a group of men displaying holstered firearms while fishing. It was a city park ranger who called the police. At no point was the public aware or concerned by the event.

Florida Carry has stated via their Facebook page;

The illegal attack on our members by the Miami Beach PD is a developing incident. We are pouring every necessary resource in to this incident.

We already know that one Florida Carry member contacted MBPD in advance and was given the runaround by a series of officers.

Additionally, Florida Carry has provided a copy of the letter that was sent more than two weeks prior to the June 24 event.

June 7, 2018

Chief Oates,

My name is Christopher Philpot and I am an avid Florida Fisherman. The reason I am writing your office is because I wanted to notify you that on June 24, 2018 a few friends and I will be open carrying holstered handguns while fishing off of South Pointe Pier in Miami Beach. As you probably already know the open carrying of any firearm is legal in The State of Florida, pursuant a person engaged in fishing, camping, or lawful hunting or going to or returning from a fishing, camping, or lawful hunting expedition.

It is outlined by our State Legislators in Florida Statute: 790.25, The provisions of ss. 790.053 (Open Carrying of Weapons) 790.06 (License to carry concealed weapon or firearm) do not apply in the following instances, and, despite such sections, it is lawful for the following persons to own, possess, and lawfully use firearms and other weapons, ammunition, and supplies for lawful purposes (h) A person engaged in fishing, camping, or lawful hunting or going to or returning from a fishing, camping, or lawful hunting expedition.

The reason I wanted to reach out to your office is because I’m sure there will be citizens that do not know the law.They may contact Law Enforcement when they see someone open carrying a holstered handgun. I just want to be sure that The City of Miami Beach & Law Enforcement are fully aware that what we are doing is completely legal. My friends and I are law abiding citizens. We legally own our firearms and we have never committed any felonies or violent crimes. We are just a few people that love to fish and celebrate our Freedom & Second Amendment rights!

Sincerely,

Christopher Philpot

CC- Eric Friday, Richard Nascak, Scott Whigham, Dennis Fields

Furthermore, Eric Friday, legal council of Florida Carry has stated that not only did Florida Carry send notifications to the City of Miami Beach Police Department, but they also sent notified the City Attorney.

We’re told that end result of this incident will be a suit filed by Florida Carry against the City of Miami Beach. A pre-suit notice is being prepared now. Watch this space. Stay tuned.

comments

  1. avatar B-Rad says:

    First off, the Miami Vice folk need to educate themselves. This was obviously something that should be legal and free from harassment.

    Second, the fact that this guy had a camera strapped to his chest shows he was intentionally trying to provoke this.

    So, if someone is trying to provoke you by doing something completely legal, WTF are you doing? Cops should know the law, and be courteous, even to someone that is in your face.

    1. avatar KTR says:

      They were not filming to provoke. They were filming in order to have evidence in case something like this happened. It’s the same scenario that Open Carry Texas deals with all the time.

      That’s why they film EVERY outing like this with multiple cameras.

      The incident at Olmos Park, TX with the police department there is a great example of why you film. Those guys were shown to be the jack booted thugs they really are.

    2. avatar LarryinTX says:

      I’d like to see the evidence that the camera wasn’t there to record the landing of the largest fish ever caught in FL, or even the largest fish HE ever caught there. There was no reason to expect any confrontation while legally fishing, was there? I hope not, because enforcing laws which do not exist is a hallmark of a police state.

      1. avatar RogueVal says:

        Well, they didn’t have fishing gear, so there’s that.

        1. avatar MDC says:

          Didn’t watch the video I take it? I’d imagine fishing poles qualify as gear? No? How them boots taste beta?

        2. avatar Hannibal says:

          “beta”? Has the word “cuck” gone out of style for people trying to be clever on the internets?

        3. avatar B-Rad says:

          Since in either video they never actually did any fishing, it was pretty much a “fishing” expedition to get what they caught, on video, i.e. the cops not knowing the actual rules.

  2. avatar Baldwin says:

    “Miami Beach Police Chief Daniel J. Oates, through Miami Beach police spokesman Ernesto Rodriguez, claimed to the Miami Herald that he never received prior notification…” Because the right of the people shall not be infringed except where prior notification was not given. Because you ain’t shit when it comes to actually exercising your rights. Because tyranny is a thing.

    1. avatar Richard Revoir says:

      Agreed , & Oates is full of shit. There were multiple calls made in advance. Records kept , and he damn well knows it. So he is also a liar ,and a tyrant. Sue the pants off MBPD !!! they should be in striped suits , not wearing pants with a stripe down the sides.

      1. avatar Ed Schrade says:

        why the hell does a person have to send out notifications that they are going to obey the law. When it comes to a citizen not being aware of a law or ordinance it’s always, ” ignorance of the law is no excuse”. How is this different when law enforcement is ignorant of the law. It’s their job to know.

        1. avatar Jay in Florida says:

          Im sure the Chief, Captain whoever it is. Is full of crap. This is So Florida Dade County. Home of the ignorant cop.
          The cops should know the 790 laws by heart.
          Since they deny us any open carry except for fishing and hunting. Don’t dare wear a gun in a camp ground. They will toss you around like a rag doll or try their best to provoke you.
          They damm well know the open carry laws. They just willfully ignore them here.
          One day for giggles. I wore my EDC open. Tucked my T shirt in while in the store. Not one customer said a word or gave me a look. A Palm Beach Deputy I personally know. Came in as he often does. You wouldn’t believe the misinformation he was spouting. As if his lack of knowledge of the 790 laws was gospel.

  3. avatar TrueBornSonofLiberty says:

    The officers involved should be sued into bankruptcy and then face federal prosecution for hate crimes in the denial of civil rights.

    1. avatar uncommon_sense says:

      Yes, those police officers committed felonies under 18 United States Code Section 242 “Deprivation of rights under color of law.” Because those police officers pointed their firearms at the fishermen, that is threat of deadly force and means those cops should be facing up to 10 years in prison as specified in 18 U.S. Code Section 242.

  4. avatar RA-15 says:

    If this was MBPD best behaviour , I would not like to see their worst !! I saw this whole incident unfold when the victims were being handcuffed illegally. One was in agony due to a torn rotator cuff & his handcuffed wrists behind his back caused an ambulance to be ” slowly called to the scene ” MBPD SHOULD BE ASHAMED AND PUNISHED ACCORDINGLY. they point guns at law abiding citizens !! This kind of abuse of power must stop. Lawfully carrying citizens are just that & should be treated accordingly. I hope they sue the shit out of the Dispicable Leo’s that pointed their service weapons at them. MBPD here is a hint LEARN YOUR LAWS YOU TOOK AN OATH TO UPHOLD !! That is to say do not presume guilt , get your facts firstly , act accordingly.

  5. avatar P Hall says:

    Not only is Chief Oates lying when he says that he didn’t receive prior notice of the fishing expedition, I would be willing to bet that he planned the confrontation in advance.

    As soon as he read that letter, he decided that his goons would use a heavy handed approach.

  6. avatar Kendahl says:

    In situations like this, certified mail is your friend.

    1. avatar TrueBornSonofLiberty says:

      Yet an audi/video recording trumps certified mail. And waddya know, they’ve got audio.

    2. avatar Sam I Am says:

      As B-Rad notes, if a citizen acting lawfully provokes a police response, there is something really, really rotten in Denmark. Can’t think of a more compelling example of police declaring war on the populace than jacking someone up for lawful activity. The police are protected from being familiar or even aware of actual law, but refusing to learn the law is a sign of cop power out of control.

  7. avatar JD says:

    This law allows you to carry without worrying about a CCW. I have a fishing pole in my truck and my range membership card. I can always claim I’m doing one of the four exceptions to the law pretty much anytime I’m out. I’ve always known Florida CCW laws are unconstitutional because the only way you can legally carry is by asking permission and paying a tax. I believe these four exceptions are the reasoning the state uses to get around having the entire CCW permit law tossed out.

  8. avatar Calvin says:

    Excellent! It doesn’t even matter if they win. The process is the punishment. That should work for the good guys every once in a while.

    Unrelated, it took me 3 times to post this comment. WTF?!?!? Why are we still seeing this 40x garbage?

    1. avatar Gralnok says:

      It’s working fine for me. What service are you using?

    2. avatar Hannibal says:

      Except the process is funded by the taxpayers. The Chief isn’t likely to have to pay anything out of pocket. Depending on his constituency and political patrons, he might come out ahead politically.

  9. avatar Gralnok says:

    As I said in a prior article, the police are lucky that cooler heads prevailed. This whole situation could still go badly for the cops, but only for their image. Again, taxpayers will be forced to foot the bill for their legal team and the settlement. However, a bad public image would be better than burying some hot headed cops and a bad image to boot.

    1. avatar B says:

      De ja vu.

  10. avatar TheFoeYouKnow says:

    “Given the current [political] climate, if six people show up to a pier in South Beach carrying guns, our citizens expect us to respond promptly and address any potential danger. We did so, and I am confident our officers acted appropriately.”

    *edited for clarity
    If the Chief of Police is concerned about political ANYTHING, he is a POLITICIAN, not a police officer, and has no business in his chair. A Chief of Police is concerned with law and order, not politics.

  11. avatar ButtHurtz says:

    The people should of used their weapons as the 2nd intends.

    1. avatar Alex Talionis says:

      People over on the FC facebook page got buttburt when I implied that.

    2. avatar Ed says:

      They most certainly SHOULD have, and nothing will change until this starts happening. What are the repercussions for pointing a pistol directly at a LEO? Why should they expect any less when dealing with a law abiding citizen? Cops are WAY too quick to point their guns at people for nothing, always with their finger ON the trigger. Unlawful arrest/detainment IS resistable by any and all equal force necessary, contrary to what THEY would have you believe.
      If you draw a weapon on me, badge or no badge you WILL be treated as a threat…PERIOD.

  12. avatar Dave in PTC says:

    Could the Florida Carry guys draw and fire at the Miami Police when the officers drew on them, in the name of self defence?

    I know there’s probably a definitive answer to this, but a search on the web did not give me something I’d stake my defence on.

    I am not suggesting that anyone should shoot an officer.

    Are there any lawyers reading this and give some insight on this.

    1. avatar FedUp says:

      Pointing a firearm at the innocent and threatening to kill them is a very serious matter.
      That’s why we lock up ‘civilians’ for many years when they do it. They’ve exhibited dangerous behavior that requires them to be put away for the safety of society.

      Unfortunately, we can’t depend on the ‘justice’ system to do the same when a LEO points a firearm at the innocent and threatens to kill them, even though their job makes them more of a threat to society than a common carjacker/mugger. So how DO we go about putting them away for the good of society after they’ve demonstrated that they’re too dangerous to be allowed out and about without a keeper?

      1. avatar Dave in PTC says:

        So why do the police have a presumption of innocence, but not the armed citizen?

        The Florida Carry guys had their guns holstered. Why is it that the police assume that drawing their weapons is necessary.

        I’m kinda done with this societal idea that law enforcement has a greater right to go home at the end of the day than any other citizen.

        1. avatar Sam I Am says:

          Because the Supreme Court said so; nothing else.

        2. avatar RMS1911 says:

          Because they’re 🐔 💩

    2. avatar Dave in PTC says:

      I want to emphasize that I am not anti-cop. I just want to know the law’s effect on someone who genuinely thought their life was in danger.

      1. avatar RMS1911 says:

        Look up John bad elk

        1. avatar FedUp says:

          I fully support the reasoning behind the JBE decision (if a cop makes you choose between having your rights violated or using deadly force on the cop to stop him from violating your rights, you may kill his ass with our blessings).

          But I never understood how JBE’s rights were being violated in the first place.
          Is it really a civil rights violation to arrest a fellow cop at a time and place where/when it’s inconvenient to him to be arrested?

          Lastly, there’s no way any court in this country today would say it’s OK to off a badge toting felon just because he’s violating your fundamental rights as guaranteed by the Constitution. You’re supposed to suffer any violation, and even physical injury, and if you survive you can sue them. If you don’t survive your heirs can sue them, but don’t you dare lift a finger to stop them from murdering you.

        2. avatar Vic Nighthorse says:

          FedUp: I think about this a lot and keep coming to the unsatisfactory conclusion that unless I am unrealistically lucky and get an excellent opportunity to superfvck bad cops and get away with it, the only thing I can to about this aspect of cop behavior is hope that there is a special place in hell for them. I wish I believed in hell, other than the many in this life.

  13. avatar Chris T in KY says:

    It will not look good for the police when more and more white people distrust the cops as much as black people do now.
    I hope the police lose their budget in a law suite. I like the police but this department must be destroyed.

  14. avatar New Continental Army says:

    Sending FL Carry another check today!

  15. avatar VerendusAudeo says:

    That’s a lot of phallic imagery for one logo. A silhouette holding a rifle at dick level for no reason. And then there’s the state of Florida. I mean, come on…

    1. avatar NCA says:

      Or, maybe your just gay?

      1. avatar Dave in PTC says:

        Or a gay troll. Come on, Chief Oates, is that you?

  16. avatar Ralph says:

    Congratulations, Chief Oates. Now even fisherman hate cops. Pretty soon, there won’t be anyone in America who can stand the sight of blue uniforms.

  17. avatar Danny L Griffin says:

    Everyone understands that the video of Miami PD audio is irrelevant because they went to Miami Beach, right? Different PD altogether. However, MBPD should be crucified.

  18. avatar B says:

    Go figure. We were just commenting on this stuff the other day with Officer Luis Valdes’ article and his perspective.

  19. avatar m. says:

    we’s be gub-mint, we’s can do anything …

  20. avatar Alan says:

    It would appear that the Chief of Police is flat out lying. With regard to errors made by the police, as has often been stated, ignorance is no excuse for violations of the law. The private citizen, is and has been punished for unwitting violation of law, there should be no exception made for the police, who supposedly are the trained professionals one hears about, these trained professionals being oh so superior to John Q. Public. Should anyone wonder, I’m not Anti Police, though I do state that with power comes responsibility.

  21. avatar R. Ceba says:

    Simple conclusion. Chief Oates is anti- 2nd Amendment, does not follow Florida law, does not believe in Florida law or is completely incompetent.
    Although all reasons may be applicable, I believe the last one should be enough to remove him from office by whatever legal means.

  22. avatar William W Walker Sr says:

    You know, all my life I’ve heard from the police that ignorance of the law is no excuse. We as citizens are required to keep up with all laws. Shouldn’t those who are supposed to enforce said laws also be required to know the law? I don’t believe for one minute the police chief or the city attorney weren’t aware of the law or the fact these men would be there. They did this to try to stop others from exercising the rights. Clearly an attempt at tyranny as a government figure to control the citizens.

    1. avatar Sam I Am says:

      “Shouldn’t those who are supposed to enforce said laws also be required to know the law?”

      Along with no duty to protect, SC declared police are not accountable for knowing the laws regarding any particular situation.

  23. avatar Chip DeBlock says:

    We decided to cover this story on the LEO Round Table law enforcement talk show. Here’s the link in case you want to check it out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uCMSRlN0M1E&t=32s

    1. avatar Danny L Griffin says:

      Looks like Ward is the ass clown. He asked, Why do you need a gun if you’re fishing in [insert anyplace here]? If I knew I would need a gun someplace, I wouldn’t go there! That’s why one carries a gun all the time, you never know when you might need it.

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