Man steals gun from man in line at Phoenix McDonalds “On April 7, at Southern and Central Avenues the suspect approached a man ordering from behind before taking the pistol from the man’s back pocket and running from the restaurant, according to Silent Witness spokesman Sgt. Jamie Rothschild. The victim then chased the suspect in an attempt to retrieve his stolen gun but the thief turned around and pointed the pistol at the victim before fleeing, according to Rothschild.” Retention holster, people. Retention holster . . .

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California Ruling Could Pave the Way for Smart-Gun Mandates – “A federal appeals court in California is expected to rule soon on whether states can force firearm manufacturers to incorporate safety devices in their products, a development that could have broad effect on whether and how quickly President Barack Obama’s recent calls for more “smart guns” takes effect.” That federal appeals court is the Ninth Circus. That doesn’t bode well.

“Brandon Maddox owns Dakota Silencer, spanning seven states, and he says business is good. This past legislative session, Iowa just passed a new law making silencers legal. ‘We just opened up a store in Larchwood, so we are in Iowa now as well,’ Maddox said.” Spreading the quietness, one state at a time.

Free Guns Anyone? – Yes please.

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Doom drops all pretense and shows you the guns – “Doom‘s first-person “glory kills” let you tear apart freakish demons with your gloved hands, but you’re still going to need a lot more firepower. Fortunately, your fallen marine counterparts and overreaching scientist employers have left a bounty of guns scattered around Mars and Hell alike.”

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Will you be at the NRA Annual Meeting and Convention in Louisville next week? “Remington Arms Company, LLC, (“Remington”) announces today that Gabby Franco and Travis Tomasie will present handgun seminars at the upcoming NRA show in Louisville, Ky. The 30-minute seminars at the Remington Country Lounge (Booth # 3523) and will cover topics such as dissecting the draw from concealment, how to train, boost your confidence while shooting, get into competitive shooting, grip & stance, self-defense and getting your spouse involved in shooting.”

Murder Suspect Took Fla. Deputy’s Shotgun – In the back seat. While handcuffed. Twice.

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57 Responses to Boxer Tactical Daily Digest: 5.13.16: An Open Carry Gun Grab, Smart Gun Mandates and the Doom Arsenal

  1. OC in a CCW holster is generally a bad idea. OC requires retention of some kind on your holster. Carrying in your back pocket is just dumb.

    Too bad the victim didn’t have a backup gun…

    • The victim was completely clueless. A BUG wouldn’t have helped in time for him to get over his “Hey, what just happened? Is somebody messing with me… Waaaaitaminute!” lag.

      • The guy is an idiot with no situational awareness. No doubt about that.

        I’d have just liked to see the thief get aerated.

        • He gives other gun owners a bad name and gives fodder to the anti gun media. I’m not going to discuss CC or OC, that’s a decision left up to the individual. Resposibility and safety is not negotiable.

        • Can we PLEASE stop with this collectivist “Gives us bad name” lazy-ass thinking. Good grief. We are starting to sound like SJW’s.

          The ONLY person he gives a ‘bad name’ is himself. He does not represent me. Neither do you, nor I you.

          So, get off it.

          Group Politics is for loser Progressives that can’t muster the mental horsepower to realize that individual people are individuals and individual events are their own thing as well.

        • So you’re saying that all Progressives act like the way you describe? Not as individuals? Do you see your catch 22 in your own statement?

          Like it or not, humans pigeon hole. It’s just what we do to help us process things. Accounting for 7 billion individuals is just not the way our brains are wired. So, yes, optics is EXTREMELY important. You’d have to be completely oblivious to not understand that the preservation of rights depends on popular perception. You can wave around the Bill of Rights all day, but history has proven proven by law after law that if the public perceives something in a bad light, they will support legislation against it.

  2. Oh, and the silencer bit is good news.

    I don’t understand how suppressors are not just considered common courtesy to the neighbors.

    Also, they should cost around $75, so yay competition and market saturation.

    • The market is fairly saturated now. Rifle cans still cost $600+; some are double that amount. There’s a reason for that. Raw material for a titanium can is more that $75 by itself.

      • Yeah, my can is steel, and I’m already thinking of buying another, to lose a bunch of weight. Too damn bad that my previous ATF approval doesn’t allow me to buy all the cans I can afford without the tax and weight. Or the HPA hasn’t passed removing them from ATF stupidity.

  3. Yeah that’s not what I call open carry and I don’t appreciate the tittle of this article stating such. If you have a beef with OC then say so. But don’t use stories of stupid carry as evidence against open carry. If you carry a pocket gun, it is totally inside the pocket. If you open carry, you need it on your side, not your back no matter if retention is used or not. I don’t like retention. Somebody grabs my gun then one of us is going to die.

    • Not to mention that criminals are eerily good at removing guns even from retention holsters. It’s not some combination lock, it’s a few quick wiggles and in a struggle it seems to happen almost by accident. Hell, this very writeup includes a story of a handcuffed man grabbing a duty shotgun from the back seat! Those are usually “retained” pretty good, also.

    • Yes, probably you. Lack of retention is dumb. Besides the obvious, running, fighting, etc are all good ways to lose your gun.

    • “Yeah that’s not what I call open carry and I don’t appreciate the tittle of this article stating such. If you have a beef with OC then say so. But don’t use stories of stupid carry as evidence against open carry.”

      Open carry IS stupid carry.

      You’re just unhappy because now there is proof of same.

        • See video, above. I assume you didn’t watch it, or you wouldn’t have asked.

      • “Open carry IS stupid carry.”

        Illogical, trolling, narcissistic self-superiority is pretty stupid AND hypocritical.

        Or, I guess you tell every uniformed cop in the country that OC is stupid?

        Your infantile fear and dislike of a visible handgun is telling of your overall mentality, and what it demonstrates is not flattering. We like to think that it’s the anti’s that have irrational fear of inanimate objects, but we have plenty of it on our side as well – irrationality, that is.

        “You’re just unhappy because now there is proof of same.”

        If you think this story is somehow “proof” that “OC is STUPID” then again, that says more about your mental processes than it does either this story, OC or Michael’s comment.

        Here’s your hint: This story, at BEST, shows THIS INDIVIDUAL’s carry was “stupid,” open or otherwise.

        • Comparing cop OC to non-cop open-carry is also stupid. On the cop’s side, the differences include a metal-shanked holster attached (sometimes with screws) to a 1.5″-2″ rigid belt, along with a 2- or 3-step release mechanism usually strong enough for the officer to be completely lifted off the ground by the handgun’s grip if the release is not activated correctly. There are multiple confirmed accounts of perps not being able to get the handgun out of an officer’s holster after the officer was rendered unconscious or killed. On the non-cop OC side, we have sticking-out-of-the-pocket-carry (see above), sausage-sack floppy soft nylon holster carry, 1/16th-inch-soft-suede-leather-with-cheap-metal-belt-clip holster carry, $10 online-ordered some-kinda-plastic friction-retention-holster carry, trigger-finger-release with optional shoot-during-the-drawstroke holster carry, random thumbbreak-which-may-or-may-not-retain-the-pistol holster carry, and finally, the well-made, thin, secure, and expensive holsters which all Internet OC advocates SAY they use, but are rarely seen in the real world (rarely, as in NEVER) method of carry.

          I have no infantile fear or dislike of a visible handgun; I carried one that way for over a decade, sometimes in public, in uniform, courtesy Uncle Sam. I still carry a handgun that way in my home state, under certain circumstances which require me to do so. But (unlike the vast majority of the outspoken OC advocates, such as yourself) I am very aware of the potential dangers such as the one outlined in the video, and for that and similar reasons, I will never choose to OC if I have the option to conceal. If you give a perp a clear target; give him time to plan, examine your carry system, and pick a location; give him a situation which distracts you (even for a moment) and a crowd which can momentarily confuse you as to who did what; then you are going to lose control of your handgun. Concealed carry prevents many of these steps from taking place, starting with the perp knowing for sure if you even HAVE a handgun, and where/how it is being retained.

          The panicked “OC isn’t stupid, YOU are!” type responses (like yours) are the clearest evidence of how true the above reasoning is. A situation like the video hits close to home for thoughtful OC folks — and it should. However, wasting time and effort trying to justify your flawed carry method and convice others that situations like the video are the exception, and not the rule, given the way that the vast majority of OC folks carry, is, well, a waste of time and effort.

          Carry on, be well, and here’s hoping you’re not the star of the next embarrassing online OC video clip.

    • If somebody grabs your gun you’ve already failed. Somebody will die. Hopefully the grabber. Maybe you, the cashier, or somebody standing in line. They would be the unwitting victims of who?????????

      • Good job victim blaming. Just because a thief doesn’t have to break into your house to steal your plasma tv, doesn’t make him less of a thief. And just because he killed someone with your gun doesn’t make him less of a murderer. I guess you side with the Newtown moms against Bushmaster.

        • “If somebody grabs your gun, you’ve already failed.”

          Do you have a problem with the factuality of that statement?

          “I guess you side with the Newtown moms against Bushmaster.”

          That’s what’s called a “straw man”, and YOU are the only one saying it. In fact, I would side with the Newtown moms against the shooter’s mother, who left the firearms around for a diagnosed paranoid schizophrenic to grab. She failed. And she was the first to die.

  4. Huh? IME, shotguns are loaded magazine only, in an electric gun rack that clamps around the gun in a way that prevents the slide from going forward. (I guess I dated myself there, do they even use pumps anymore?)

    You’d have to push a ‘hidden’ button under the dash while pulling the shotgun out of the rack.
    I guess if cuffed you could hit the button with your hand while removing the shotgun with your leg.

    • My uncle was a sheriff’s deputy up until a couple years ago, and he always had an 870 between the front seats and an AR in the trunk. He only had an AR to begin with because he was on the SWAT team. I’m pretty sure that’s how it with most departments around here.

    • I haven’t really checked, but seems like I heard that the new TX OC requires a holster, sticking your gun in your back pocket is illegal, not OC.

  5. Re: 9th circus and smart guns…. I keep telling you guys…. You can run from California but it will chase after you and get you eventually. You need to stay and fight.

      • If Hillary gets elected with a democrat Congress on her coattails, it will be GAME OVER. Her SCOTUS appointees will turn the court anti-gun leftist for the first time in history. Australian Style Gun Control will become the law of the land.

        • Sorry, I didn’t mean to be a jerk, I just have absolutely no faith in my fellow Americans because when given the choice they have consistently chosen to piss their freedom away every time all for the sake of feel good and politically correct BS.

        • I think Hillary’s concept concerning guns will be the least of our worries if she’s elected.

    • Washington state will be California within ten years, and it will all happen through initiatives. That system is Seattle’s shadow legislature where the laws they can’t get passed in Olympia get shoved through with big money from wealthy donors. We’re going to see a version of GVROs, then probably magazine bans, and at some point, gun bans and carry restrictions.

  6. It’s been nice to be able to have some kind of gun other than some stupid .22 lr iGun without becoming a felon. Thanks mothers of America, where would the good ol’ U.S. of A. be without you? Oh, right, a free-f%$^&#*-country!!! >:(

  7. God dang I hate always having to sound like the racist, but…

    ….Do the perps in these videos ALWAYS have to be black? Do other ethnicities just not get caught on camera or did they give up crime and become Starbucks baristas?

    …what gives?

    • 14% of the population is responsible for about 85% of the violent crime. That would be why most videos of criminals doing violent or potentially deadly stuff are black. Not my statistics, these belong to the FBI.

      As for Hitlary and gun grabbing. I suppose some of that is up to us.

      • I’d think 14% of the population is responsible for ALL the violent crime.

        Did you mean to say that 14% of violent criminals do 85% of the violent crimes, and the other 86% are just part-timers?

  8. The WSJ article is, unsurprisingly perhaps, clueless as to what the lawsuit is about. Or at the least it fails to make the connection between the issues in the suit and smart gun technology, which is kind of important in that smart gun technology is not in issue in the case. The issues in the case, if you read the whole article,arise from three requirements of California’s hand gun roster law pertaining to pistols: 1) loaded chamber indicators, 2) mag disconnects, and 3) microstamping. The point of the suit is that these three requirements have nothing to do with the original purpose of the law, which was to assure that hand guns were reliable and would not discharge if dropped. The fact that the first two have been around for a while is essentially irrelevant, because, as the suit argued, they don’t make the handgun any more reliable. Instead (and these requirements were not added at the same time) were to try to make pistols Fool proof (by preventing the “I didn’t know the gun was loaded” refrain by making it obvious that the gun was loaded (LCI) or unable to fire for the idiots who think that removing the mag means the gun is unloaded. While I understand the sentiment, I don’t really think they have much of a chance on winning on these issues, especially in the Ninth Circus.

    The third issue, microstamping, is a far stronger claim (and there is a separate action that attacks only that provision) for the simple reason that there is not a single pistol in the world manufactured by anyone that can comply with the mandate. Moreover, there is no existing technology that will stamp a “unique identifier” in two places on a casing, as the statute requires. The existing technology (as amply demonstrated in the other pending case) certified by the AG as meeting the requirements of the statute, can only stamp a single identifier on the primer. Thus, there is a very good argument that the AG abused her discretion in making the certification, and the certification (if not the statute that mandates it) should be reversed. (

    • If they ban outright any firearm ‘in common use’, I think you have to overturn Heller or overturn the ban.
      If they ban the sale of any firearm ‘ever made’, I think you have to throw out the ban.

  9. I don’t have a damn bit of sympathy for they guy. Carry your firearm like an idiot, lose your gun like an idiot while putting others at risk because you essentially just handed your weapon to some dou– bag.
    With few exceptions, if you get disarmed, you’re a moron and don’t deserve to be carrying a weapon.

  10. Had a folding knife in my back pocket, couple of Brits behind me commenting on it and how “easy” it would be to get it. Anything visible in a back pocket draws the wrong type of attention from the sort of people who act differently to you unless you are looking at them.

    • Typed the name out wrong. It’s too few o’bong from “Little Ben” in the morning.

    • I see people with visible knives, folding and not, every day. WTF would cause someone to begin discussing trying to steal it? If that happened to me, I would have to comment in return that they are not in Britain any more, such an act would likely get them shot to death.

  11. “Brandon Maddox owns Dakota Silencer, spanning seven states, and he says business is good.”

    What does this sentence mean by “spanning seven states?” Dakota Silencer has factories in seven states? Dakota silencers are sold in seven states? Maybe they have offices and warehouses in seven states?

    Sorry, maybe I haven’t got enough coffee in my bloodstream yet, or my high school english teacher is haunting me, perhaps, but I just don’t understand what they mean. [Leaves to find coffee]

  12. Regarding open carry and patrol car gun theft, I blame the criminal. Not to put too fine of a point on it, but some young criminals are just flat out faster and stronger than old, overweight gun owners. I blame the thief for the theft. Of course back pocket “open carry” is not tactically sound. It’s still the fault of the thief. I’d be looking to arrest that guy and not the gun owner. Sometimes bad guys steal patrol cars and sometimes they break down doors and steal guns from homes.

    But for those of you who’ve never struggled over a weapon with an actual bad guy(s), strength, speed and technique are every bit as important as situational awareness. It isn’t all about heart. Preparation matters. That’s why MMA fighters train so hard, and some of those people are wondering the streets.

    Plus there’s Murphy’s Law. I’ve had an ASP baton come out of a perfectly serviceable, approved holster duting a foot pursuit on more than one occasion. Thankfully an officer behind me recovered it. I’ve picked up gear from others who’ve been in fights.

    I’ve broken watches and lost other gear in actual fights with actual people. I’ve ripped pants and shirts and had the knife ripped out of my uniform pocket, and the badge torn off my uniform shirt. But I won my fights, thank God.

    I see a lot of overconfidence here when people think that’s it “impossible” for their weapon(s) to be taken from them, or from their patrol cars. It’s part of my job to study use of force incidents and see if there was anything that could have reasonably been done better. Well, the unfortunate reality is that it is entirely possible to lose a fight with someone who is stronger, faster, and had better technique. That’s part of the reason why we carry guns in the first place.

    • Bull Sh–! A person must protect against the crimes of opportunity. Would you leave a bran new 60″ big screen sitting in the back of a pickup at the mall while you finished shopping? NO? Why not? You mean if it got stolen we’d blame the thief not the owner of the TV? Nobody can protect themselves from everything all the time, but we can all take reasonable steps and precautions to protect ourselves from obvious danger and risks.
      If you hosted a house party, you wouldn’t leave your prescription drugs of Valium and grandpas narcotic painkillers in the medicine cabinet? Why not? Because they will be gone after the party, that’s why! It’s a no-brainer.
      You don’t leave money hanging out of your back pocket and you don’t leave a f—ing gun sticking out of your back pocket at a fast food restaurant or any public place . In crowded places, I take my wallet out of my back pocket and put it in my front pocket. Why? A reasonable precaution against pickpockets. As other said in these comments, it’s about situational awareness. Pay attention to your surroundings and pull your head out of your ass.

  13. I’d probably be that guy if I open carried. So I don’t carry. It’s really simple, if you’re not emotionally stable, trained/familiar with your weapon, and willing to act in a responsible manner just DONT CARRY.

    That being said, I enjoy my firearms and I appreciate all you vets/law enforcement/responsible civilians carrying and making this country safer. I never feel safer than when I walk into a crowded gun store. Thanks.

  14. “The victim then chased the suspect in an attempt to retrieve his stolen gun but the thief …”

    Yeah that’ll work well. Idiot.

  15. Handgun carried in plain sight in a back pocket. That’s not Open Carry or Concealed Carry.
    That’s carrying while being in a major synapse lapse.

  16. Thankfully the open carry obsessed comprise a minute percentage of citizens lawfully carrying a firearm. Most folks actually carrying for defensive purposes have enough common sense and “situational awareness” to know it’s difficult for a predator to grab a gun he can’t see.

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