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“We’re not selling Barbie dolls here, we’re selling firearms and we need to make sure we’re putting guns in people’s hands that are going to do good things in the community with them — like keeping peace, not blowing people up.” – Florida Gun Supply owner Andy Hallinan in ‘Muslim Free’ gun shop owner takes aim after judge tosses lawsuit against him [at washingtonpost.com]

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133 Responses to Quote of the Day: Muslim-Free Gun Store Wins Round One

  1. He gets it.

    It is not a question of if Americans will have to fight to keep this country and expel all foreign invaders. it is only a question of when.

    • Define that for me? Would you include Jews in that? Hindu people?

      If you are a legal U.S. Citizen who happens to be Muslim you are no more a foreign invader than a white Anglo-Saxon Protestant…

      • “We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.”

        “ourselves and our Posterity” pretty much means British Protestants, not the “wretched refuse of teeming shores”. All immigration has been bad for the freedoms left to us by the Founders. The borders should have been closed in 1800.

    • My advice is know your enemies. Some of the staunchest supporters of America’s principles are those who came from places that didn’t have such things; They know what it’s like to be behind the iron curtain or in a country that’s a shithole because it’s ran by someone who’s not exactly of a high ethical standing.

        • Sark/ ?
          One side of my family signed the Declaration of Independence. The other walked the trail of tears, after that genocidal criminal Andrew Jackson defied the SCOTUS. I’m glad another relative shot him in the leg in a duel. Am I OK ?

    • yada yada, all muslims are evil yada yada.

      We get it.

      Except that there are how many million Muslims in this country that didn’t blow up the twin towers?

      And lets forget that just a few decades ago the big terror threat was white Christians in the IRA. So maybe because I have red hair he shouldn’t sell me a gun?

      Maybe we can round up some Americans of Japanese ancestry again, just like we did during WWII, for some home grown concentration camps.

      • Good Call JB

        Bullshit like this brings out the dregs of our sub-culture. They wave their flags and sing the songs of freedom even though very few of them can even wrap their heads around the simplest of freedoms.

        I’ve been disappointed in TTAG on occasion, but every time this piece of whale sh*t gets his own article I’m disgusted.

        Shame on all the staff for giving this dirtbag press

        • Agreed.
          The idea that this is any sort of “win” is misguided. The lawsuit was not dropped for lack of merit, but lack of standing. The minute a Muslim who is actually denied sues, the shop owner will likely lose and the resulting award may destroy his business.
          Or there’s the possibility he knows that and has no actual intention of doing as he says.
          Idiot.

      • You can stomp your feet all you want, it doesn’t change the fact that religious and ethnic cleansing has always been the byproduct of the unchecked migration of peoples.

        You are just too foolish to realize that by supporting the free movement of people between nations you are enabling genocide.

        • You’re right, we should round them up and put them into camps until we can distinguish the good guys from the bad guys.

          Talk to a few survivors and visit Manzanar next time you’re in California, coward.

        • Look no further than today’s events for further proof of the ignorance of your position.

          The only person talking about camps is you by the way, which fits since you are the one advocating for genocide.

  2. How does he know who’s Muslim?
    A yamaka doesn’t make me Jewish. A cross doesn’t make me Christian. A Koran and dark skin doesn’t make me Muslim. Even if I were a thing there is nothing preventing me from stating I am another thing to get what I want.

    Maybe I don’t live in the same world as everyone else but nothing is necessarily as it seems from where I’m sitting and lies are the norm.
    Others seem to live in a world where honesty is a given and everything is exactly as it appears to be. Most bureaucracy is dependent upon an assumption of honesty. Probably why bureaucracy always fails at a given task.

    • Bureaucracy depends on lies to flourish. They are some very fundamental lies, such as:

      (1) It is the goal of this bureau to solve problem x

      (2) That this bureau CAN solve problem x

      (3) That centralization of anything/everything is proper, best and most efficient.

      (4) “I’m from the Government, and I’m here to help.”

      etc.

      • Yeah. The bureaucrats lie. But they expect us peons filling out the forms to be honest and pure. 4473 is a good example of that. There’s no way of anyone knowing the truth behind answers to several questions on that form. Like anyone is ever going to say they are a user of drugs on that thing.

    • Shire does accidently have a point. The Mohammadan is permitted (or required) to lie and deceive the apostate (nonmuslim) in order to spread islam. Only world religion that has such a evil foundation. But Hillary says they are of peace (or pieces)

      • Know your enemies. After reading the koran what I found was that to be a true Muslim, you MUST follow Sharia law. It states that man made laws are irrevalent and Sharia must be followed, and must be the ONLY law followed and you MUST work towards having Sharia installed as the law of the land where ever you are. To say we are not at war with Islam is a very dangerous lie. They are at war with us…we just haven’t had the leaders to admit it yet, to include Bush. It’s right there in black and white. I don’t know why people can’t understand it, and admit it.

  3. If you own the business you reserve the right to deny any person you see fit. I would only expect the same at a Muslim owned store, except id never be caught there

    • While you have a right to your opinion, there are a plethora of civil rights laws prohibiting discrimination on the basis of race, sex, or sexually deviant lifestyles.

      There will be more cases like this, and It will be interesting to see how our courts deal with it.

      • You are correct, but at what point does the government cross a line when forcing two groups to associate where one party doesn’t want to associate. Perhaps the other party wants to force the association just for spite. Do we not have a right of free association? If enough people agree or are ambivalent to a business’ discriminatory practices, the business may survive, someone really has a problem with them they could open another business and cater to all groups including the discriminated group.

        • Government crossed the line when courts began requiring bakers to make cakes for same-sex “weddings.”

      • there are a plethora of civil rights laws prohibiting discrimination

        We should probably back WAY up and question the government’s authority to enact such laws in the first place.

        Remember, just because something is does not mean that’s the way it ought to be.

    • Don’t have worry too much on getting caught in muslim businesses, just look the GDP of countries that are muslim.

  4. But you are way more likely to be killed by a white male mass shooter than a muslim. These people are just ignorant hicks

    • Citation Needed, there dude.

      Got some data to support that, or are you just happy to spout off “information” and expect the rest of us to just take your word for it?

        • Even the most lethal mass shootings in the U.S. only total in the low double digits.

          Muslims have killed over 3000 Americans *domestically* in the last 15 years. There haven’t been anywhere close to 3000 people killed by white male mass shooters in that same timeframe.

          When you consider that they’re less than 1% of the U.S. population, Muslim terrorist attacks have killed disproportionately more people as compared to their populating within the U.S., by a large margin. It’s simple math.

          That said, it doesn’t justify hating all Muslims or acting like this guy.

    • Not in France. In any case, we don’t care about random crazies… An entire ideology dedicated to eradicating the west? Much more so.

    • ”But you are way more likely to be killed by a white male mass shooter than a muslim. These people are just ignorant hicks”

      Working with the frequently touted “30,000 gun deaths per year” data that all the anti’s parade around we’ll do a little quick math for you. 30,000-20,000 suicides is 10,000 cases of somebody being shot either by themselves on accident or by somebody else intentionally. 80% of those are gang shootings (primarily black on black urban gangs) leaving us with 2000 non-gang related shootings each year. Depending on the source and qualifying factors there have been between 160 (well debunked as false) and 50 mass shootings since Newtown three years ago so for simplicity I will just go with 30 per year. Using CNN as a source http://www.cnn.com/2013/09/16/us/20-deadliest-mass-shootings-in-u-s-history-fast-facts/ I come up with 13 deaths per shooting by a white male if we only 23 of the deadliest shootings ever in US history. Again for simplicity sake i will round it down to 10 which is still an absurdly high average. All that considered we come up with an (admittedly) inaccurately high average of 300 people killed by white mass shooters in the USA each year.

      If we look at only one attack by muslim extremists (09/11/2001) we get an average of roughly 215 people killed on American soil alone. If we work those numbers down to a percentage of population and we accept that the 300 number reached above is artificially high . . . you are looking at an almost identical chance of being killed by a muslim extremist with a plane as you are by a white man with a gun. That only holds true if we only use ONE data point against 60 and intentionally ignore all other muslim extremist (or other ethnicities) attacks on American soil and intentionally ignore American civilians killed abroad by muslim extremist attacks in other countries.

      In short Gryb, you bullshit claim is exactly that. Bullshit. It only took a couple quick minutes to find and run the numbers needed to verify that your argument did not warrant further research. Not even getting into the fundamental difference between terrorists and random wacko shootings.

  5. From the linked article….

    “We get to know each and every one of our customers,” he said. “If the hair on the back of our neck raises for any person — regardless of their race or religion or anything else — we will not sell to them. ”

    Didn’t I read somewhere recently about the anti-rights crowd wanting gun stores to do this exact thing? Didn’t they bleat about not selling to people who don’t seem like they should have a gun? So why aren’t they supporting this guy for doing exactly what they wanted him to do?

    • “Didn’t I read somewhere recently about the anti-rights crowd wanting gun stores to do this exact thing?”

      Well, but they only meant that to be applied to older, possibly overweight Caucasians that tend to vote for less Progressive ideals on election day. Double plus bad if the buyer is male of any race, age group or body type.

  6. I see this as very troubling when we ourselves segregate ourselves out of fear. The rights of US CITIZENS being denied by the very people who say they defend the “RIGHT to KEEP AND BARE ARMS” for all.? At this point we are giving those that want to deny US our rights reasons to do so. Is the govment going to start asking for religion on the forms ? Race questions should not be on there but religion should? Be careful the reason for denying anyone a RIGHT for that maybe the very reason you are denied YOURS!

    • If you swear to destroy the west five times per day, you’re not a US citizen and have no rights that I am concerned about.

    • The fact you have a right to keep and bear does not compel anyone to provide you with the arms to bear. In today’s America, snow will fall in Hades before a merchant is forced to deliver a gun against his wishes. Cakes and guns ain’t seen the same.

      • Honestly, I doubt it. I think business owners should be allowed to do as they please, but if this guy refuses service to a Muslim customer who can legally purchase a firearm, he’s going to be sued.

  7. I don’t support the theory behind his not wanting to serve the Muslim population. It’s a blanket statement and inherently flawed. I do support private businesses denying services to anyone for any reason. Let the free market decide if they stay in business. This will end up going the same way as the guy who refused bake wedding cakes for gay couples.

    • 1.6 BILLION. Muslims and a couple hundred thousand are extremists.

      The actual religion doesn’t advocate lopping people’s heads off, it’s a small minority that twists it and uses it to spread violence and hate.

      I mean it’s his business and if he wants to do that feel free, but I don’t agree with his logic. I’m sure that will ruffle lots of feathers on here

        • If it were a myth, why haven’t they all taken over the world yet?

          You’ve subjectively reached your bigoted conclusion that all Muslims are hellbent on destroying the west and now are looking for and presenting evidence to support your conclusion. Showing some biased video proves nothing to me.

        • So… Which part of the DATA presented don’t you believe? Or do you think that believing that honor killings can be OK doesn’t make you a radical?

        • This. I’ve never seen nor heard of a Muslim speaking out against the 100k. Hell, when questioned about Hamas, most go quiet, and when they don’t they express support for the terrorist.

        • You may have not, but I’ve met and worked with Muslim, including Palestinians, who had nothing positive to say about Hezbollah, et al – and this was a frequent topic of conversation.

          Similarly, I’ve never heard a Jew condemn the King David Hotel, I’ve heard Christians support the Tiller killing, and I’ve heard Hindus call for the death of Muslims on rumors they are beef. That doesn’t make all Jews or Christians or Hindus bad people.

          My religious organization has a mass killing in its history. When it’s brought up, I stay silent – what can I add to the conversation? I don’t know enough about it or their motivations, but I promise that any response would be treated by those there as an official church statement. If asked directly, I shrug and leave it, “I don’t know.”

      • Lots of Islamic scholars on here. Saying all Muslims should denounce the actions of the fringe violent extremists is like making all gun owners responsible for Aurora and Newtown. Thomas Jefferson read the Koran and he didn’t put a qualifier in there regarding freedom of religion.

        The fact is, alienating a segment of our society through discrimination only ends with angry, isolated people who are easily recruited into these groups.

        FYI: you’re more likely to be struck by lightning than to die from terrorism.

        • No, saying all Muslims should denounce the actions of the fringe violent extremists is like saying all gun owners should denounce the actions at Aurora and Newtown.

          Which we should and, as far as I can tell, we do.

        • It is only the unlearned who claim that if ‘we were only better educated’ we’d see Islam as peaceful, and that they aren’t the greatest threat to Western Civilization we currently face.

          The core tenets of Islam are very much in opposition to all of our values. Please tell of the Muslim-run country that is somewhere you could go and live like a Westerner. Islam does not tolerate other religions, Islam inherently drives towards theocracy and Sharia law among other things.

          ISIS is a crystal-clear demonstration of what happens when one follows the Qu’ran. They are being observant Muslims. The thousands of videos on YT shows what happens when countries allow these invaders in numbers- violence against natives, attempts to enforce Sharia, nothing but trouble. They don’t assimilate, that’s against the Qu’ran. They invade. From their founding in the ME 1400 years ago, to this very minute, Islam has destroyed every civilized culture they have been allowed to infect.

          For those who wish to argue the fantasy that they’re just different, but we should allow them in numbers that allow them to opt out of forced-assimilation, please watch some of the dozens of intellectuals and historians who do speak the truth about Islam. Chris Hitchens is easy to find on YT, and always amusing to watch him bury Muslim apologists.

        • You should actually bother reading what Thomas Jefferson said about the Quran instead of just assuming that since he read it he loved it. I read Mein Kampf, not because I’m a neo-Nazi, but because I wanted to understand an enemy of liberty.

          Jefferson had some pretty, uh, “Islamophobic” things to say about Islam. As did several of our Founding Fathers.

        • Mitch, Not sure where you were going. But yes, Jefferson was well aware of what Islam does, he was a well-read man. Islam destroys civilizations, always has, and, if followed, always will until there are none left but Islam. History tells us no other tale about those who follow Islam.

          It is not just some belief-system that some free people cherry pick a few happy verses from, then form a kinda-lovey community of sorts, like modern-day Christians or (US-based) Jews.

          Islam is not a religion for Sunday, it’s a 5-times-a-day-brainwashing way of life that takes over everything. Lying to infidels (that’s all of us, atheists included) is encouraged to further the spread of Islam. Playing weak in the face of those who can stop you is also in the Qu’ran. There’s a host of other totalitarian evils in the name of some imaginary sky-daddy, and they’re all in there. Frighteningly, there’s a whole lot of complete idiots who not only believe it, they live it. If only 1% of the world’s Muslims were following the book, there’s 16MM of them out there, just waiting to kill us all in the name of Allah. There’s way more than 1%. They don’t care if they die, these cretins actually believe that there’s paradise waiting for them on the other side after they blow up those shoppers in a market.

        • Your hot words cool very quickly. Can you tell me who was given a trial for this crime?
          Was the person or persons convicted?

          Have any jewish people called for there arrest, if they are still walking around?

          Have jews paid reparations to the victims?

        • The founders of modern day Israel are nothing but Abrahamic terrorists, just of a slightly different stripe than the Muslims. They had no problem using the “terrorist” methods they now decry these days, against the people who actually owned the land for hundreds of years.

          http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1311707/plotsummary?ref_=tt_ov_pl

          The entirety of the ME needs to be turned into the world’s largest self-lighted parking lot, or we have no hope of survival as a species.

    • Religion doesn’t inherently promote violence. Does Christianity promote violence? Of course not. Are there violent and radical Christians? Of course. Does Buddhism promote violence? No. Are there violent and radical Buddhists. Yes. History is full of people who take religion too far. A few radical people does not reflect the billions of peaceful followers.

      • You’ve obviously never read any of the Abrahamic sand-cults – Judaism, Christianity, or Islam.

        Each of their texts is replete with verses to kill the non-believers, or those who blaspheme, adulterers, gays, fortune tellers, the list goes on. Christians, and many Jews have gotten away from actually following their text’s instructions, rather they tease the 5% of nice stuff out, and try to be decent humans despite the other 95%. Good for them.

        The Qu’ran is a blood-soaked re-write of the OT, with more nutty rules, more admonitions to kill, the specific “revelation” that there will be no more “revelations” – Islam is the be-all, end-all. And it must take over the earth.

  8. Wait just a damn minute. So the anti’s want to prevent guns from being sold to anybody on an arbitrary government exclusion list, but sue when a gun retailer proactively does it himself? I get it now. It is only OK if the government is in charge of the arbitrary discrimination. Because the omnipotent authority is good and omnipotent the authoritees are bad and must be controlled. This is just another glaring example of the progressive push towards government control of everything.

    • ” It is only OK if the government is in charge of the arbitrary discrimination. Because the omnipotent authority is good … This is just another glaring example of the progressive push towards government control of everything.”

      +10^23

    • “…Another stump-jumping hick doing his best to make the gun community look bad.”

      There is a way to fix that.

      Don’t shop at his store. Recommend others avoid his store as well.

      If he goes out of business because no one buys from him, problem solved and you don’t have to worry about how the actions of others make you look.

  9. He should just discern which customers he accepts without broadcasting his ideas to the world. If you’re a white small business owner the target on your back is big enough as it is. Besides, there are demographics which disproportionately commit certain crimes that a Floridian is more likely to encounter than a “Muslim.”

    • “He should just discern which customers he accepts without broadcasting his ideas to the world.”

      Agreed 100%.

      Never understood the “Announce it to the World” aspect of decision making in small businesses…whether this guy, the wedding cake/photographers, etc.

      Just do your thing.

      Announcing it and making it “pop culture” gives a lot of credence to the claims that it is ONLY being done for publicity.

      Had he denied sales to people his ‘gut’ told him not to sell to, no one would be the wiser. He’d be doing his part as he sees it.

      Does an FFL even have to offer “out loud” (or on paper) a reason for denying a sale?

      • Two words, JR: “attention whore”. You don’t get tons of media attention and free publicity by just quietly going about your business and not rabble-rousing.

      • Nope. As my ATF examiner told me:

        “We will never come after you for refusing to sell a gun to someone. You might not like the way the guy looks or smells, and we’ll say nothing about your discretion.”

        The plaintiff here can jump up and down all he wants. The government (ie, the ATF, FBI, etc) isn’t going to say “You HAVE to sell a guy to that guy.”

  10. How do you treat businesses that place GUN FREE stickers on their doors ? They do that out of fear and ignorance of what law abiding gun owners are. Their fear of the minority judging US all.

    • Many of us just don’t patronize those places just like we won’t patronize places like this gun store. They both have a right to associate or not as they wish though.

  11. CAIR just has to get their lawsuit to a Court who can make a ruling on the matter, which is exactly where they will go with this.

  12. This public stunt probably keeps pulling in gun sales. So as long as the money keeps coming in these guys are going to say things to keep in the public eye for the free advertising.

  13. I take my fair share of issues as I do with Christianity, and any other religion, but this is dumb. This guy is just trying to get publicity and making himself look incredibly ignorant. I’ve been around tons of Muslims with guns, in Jordan, UAE, Afghanistan, Omar, Djibouti, and several times was unarmed while they were armed and were in charge of our security, and outside of being in an actual war, no Muslim ever wished me harm. Even in a war zone we worked hand in hand with armed Muslims everyday. They could have killed me, and several other Americans in our sleep, poisoned our food, or simply pushed us off a boat more than once.

    Radical Muslims are like white supremacists, they exist, they are evil, and they don’t represent a larger parts of the groups they are apart of (Muslims/ white people). More people have also been murdered by white supremacists that Radical Muslims since 9/11 in the U.S.

    • “I take my fair share of issues with Islam as I do with Christianity” edit button will not allow me to edit.

    • “outside of being in an actual war, no Muslim ever wished me harm.”

      I think you’re incredibly naive about their wishes.

      They treat us like friends when we are helping them get what they want. They remind me of the schoolyard bullies who would cuddle up to me when they needed my help, and terrorized me the rest of the time.

      Trust them at your peril.

      • OP has no idea what Islam commands, or how it tells them to use infidels to do their bidding, or how to lie to them (us), or…

        The enemy of my enemy is not my friend, he’s a field expedient. The scary part is that the powers-that-be turned this kid loose without that basic knowledge.

  14. How is it that some may on you KNOW that Barak, Hillary and the demtard party lie to you about firearms. Yet with they tell you that islam is a “religion of peace” and no threat you the civilized world you believe the SOBs?

    OK you don’t like Christianity or _______ religion because it hurts your little feelings by “judging” you and your actions. SO WHAT? If you don’t care about Christianity or _______ religion then that opinion means diddly squat to you. Stop with the pansie brokeass hurt feelings and get a spine Islam is not the same as any other religion. Christianity or _______ religion might pray for you, it might tell you that you’re stupid/wrong/need to see the errors etc but boohoo so what. Get over yourself. Christianity or _______ is NOT going to lop off your head if you don’t agree with them.

    A clue for you – Islam and the mohammands, in order to stay in the club, are REQUIRED to spread Islam. By FORCE. That means YOU when they get to you/your descendants. You will be required to join the club, perhaps can pay the tax for a while but you WILL conform (see THE BORG). You may not be at war with them but the ARE at war with you.

    The Civilized Western world has largely had our thumb on these freaks ONLY since the early 1800s (see USMC and THE HALLS OF TRIPOLI). For most of the previous TWELVE HUNDRED years they ran roughshod over all that stood in their path. Murder and mayhem (look up SUBJUGATE). Gradual expansion, by force of arms, from the sandbox. Fortunately they spend much of their time killing each other over BS. Now the naive enlightened euro panies in gov’t have turned loose the dogs of war.

    You need details it is not that dang hard to find the history of islam. Stop listening to Obama on ANYTHING. If you think anything has changed with this precivilized tribe/club you are nuts.

    • It’s not that hard to look at the oceans of blood generated by Christians in history either, and pretty much any people.

    • Not yet! Still only “allowed” when camping, fishing, hunting or target shooting. But it’s working its way through Tallahassee.

  15. I doubt he has/had a significant Muslim customer base.

    So even Capt. Obvious knows this is not about who he is keeping out, but who he is trying to bring in.

  16. What? 1400 years of history don’t tell enough examples for you doubters.
    The world needs to stop all violent religion….and as obama says….period!
    Its a cancer.

  17. Before I wade into this-are these guys the same ones who run GUNBUYER? If they are how the hell do they know any religion of internet buyers? My wife has close relatives who are half-azzed black moose-lims too(extremely half-azzed)… I am a Christian but this is just redneck stupid to ME. I guess to these southern boys they are the wrong color-and my swarthy palestinian store owner down my street is nominally Christian-but he might be a bit dark for these guys…finally do these guys support the Kurds,moderate Jordanians and other Muslims who live in peace and don’t want to kill me? And fight to death against ISIS? And protect Christians?

    • I don’t think the two companies are related at all. Florida Gun Supply does have an online store, though, so your point is valid. But I’m gonna guess FGS isn’t selling too many guns online, because their prices are stupid high.

      • OMG Stinkeye-325 for a SCCY! Possibly the worst internet store extant…No I don’t think they are the same(similar name to Gunbuyer folks). And different address…

        • I thought asking $700 for a S&W M&P15 Sport was bad (when everybody else is selling them for around $500), but charging MSRP for a SCCY takes the cake…

          I said it in an earlier article about this store, and it still seems true: I suspect his business is circling the drain, and this is a last-ditch effort to drum up publicity and cash out before he has to close the doors. And then he’ll cry that the liberals and Muslims ran him out of business, rather than his own incompetence.

      • You see the Glock 43 with it’s MSRP listed as 480, and it’s price in the 500s? The site is at least honest in letting people know they are getting ripped off.

  18. Thank you fake libertarians for coming out of the closet. You don’t believe in liberty.
    You do however believe in good satisfying Marijuana intoxication.

    This shop keeper has every right to refuse service to people he deems to be dangerous.
    I know many of you agree with socialist that there should be no border enforcement.
    You believe suicide bombers have every right to travel across national borders. A murderer has every right to come to America with a bomb or a gun correct?

    You can’t pass a background check you can’t get a gun.
    You can’t pass background from 4000 miles away and you still get to come to America, correct libertarians?
    And you believe a gun store owner must serve people he thinks will use his services to kill innocent people because that is just fair correct?

    You facists believe in the state forcing a business to serve people they do not want to. Just like the Christian bakers.
    You are communist hypocrites. All you believe in is control by the state.

    • Where have any of us mandated the state step in and make him sell to Muslims? Furthermore, does anyone suggesting that identify as a Libertarian? We have the liberty to think he’s ignorant and bigoted, that doesn’t mean we advocate aggression.

      Your first paragraph makes no sense at all. Marijuana, or anything else one decides to do with their body, is liberty.

      Where has anyone said it’s fine for murderers to come across the border armed? I don’t see this post anywhere, was the username Strawman69?

      Please again point me to where anyone claiming to be a Libertarian advocating for the government to step in and make a baker serve gays cake, or a bigot from not selling guns to whoever he hates. Again is this Strawman69?

      Communist? What? Me thinks you don’t know what a Communist is.

      • That’s just Chris T’s personal dead horse he drags out to beat in almost every post here. Any time anyone mentions a word that even rhymes with “muslim”, he starts ranting about how libertarians and socialists want open borders for rapists and murderers, or some other insane shit like that. I don’t know where he got the idea from, but he’s as regular as clockwork with it.

        • Having watched libertarians on Fox or CNN and CSPAN going back over 20 years there has been a consistent thought that people have a right to travel anywhere they choose to go.
          As far as I can tell that thought has not changed with libertarians.

          I think people have right to overthrow their tyrants and make life better in their home country.

          Now there is a mexican born illness that is appearing in large numbers in the USA. Right after the large influx of ” children” from south of the border. Do I need to go back to the TTAG comments about government forcing people to take shots? Or the other TTAG comments who do support open borders?
          This would never have been an issue if Obama have not allowed them to come here unscreened.
          But according to the writers at Reason Magazine, the libertarian press, these unscreened people have a right to come to America.
          If they had scheduled treatment in advance then I say let them come.

          California is now writing laws forcing parents to have their children take shots.
          Of course if the government enforced the border you would have far fewer infected people here. Perhaps none with this particular illness.

          Same goes for people coming from the middle east. The 911 skyjacker visas expired months before they completed their mission.
          Is it OK to track people who come to this country on a visa? The 911 report has lots of information on the free movement of the people responsible for the Holocaust in New York City.

        • I’m not sure where you’re getting that all libertarians have a consistent viewpoint on this subject. For as long as I’ve been evolving my personal political views, there hasn’t been much consensus among the libertarians I’ve read/heard on immigration. It’s one area where there is plenty of disagreement among people who call themselves by that label. Those who are in favor of wide-open borders tend to be much closer to the anarchist end of the spectrum, in my experience. I don’t think there’s necessarily anything in libertarian philosophy that precludes the possibility of limiting the immigration of people who pose a legitimate threat, health-wise or otherwise.

      • Travis P
        Do I need to go back and check to see how many people called him a bigot for refusing to proved services to people he as the shop keeper believed to be dangerous?
        I can screen shot their comments from the first post on this issue from this past summer if you like.

        • Okay and that makes them communists how? He is a bigot, by definition, you may think his bigotry is fine. Being a Libertarian does mean you tolerate bigotry or stupidity. Believe it or not Libertarians believe in teh right to hold an opinion on a person.

  19. I think they’re both mental. Well, mental like a fox, for squeezing so much publicity, and presumably business, out of this.

    They’re both lucky the judge didn’t toss it out with prejudice and fine them both court costs.

  20. The judge wimped out. Poor excuse. A “white’s only” sign didn’t present an imminent and concrete threat to blacks who wanted to get breakfast. Of course if they feared violence….hmmm…would I barge into a gun store if I felt unwelcome?

    The shop owner is playing to some base that he thinks supports him. Actually his customer base is expanding includes more and more “others” women, minorities even gays.

    What if he said no Christians. Can you imagine the backlash? What if he refused entrance to 18-26 year old white males. Lord knows they’ve consistently caused massive carnage. Or Bloomberg’s choice 18-26 year old black males. Or women because they have PMS. Veterans because they may have PTSD. Or Quakers because they won’t shoot someone….

    His stance is limited and plays to the antis version of gun owners. If he stated: “Our shop in order to support responsible firearm ownership goes beyond the minimum of the NCIS check and state laws. We get to know you as a long term customer. In this way we weed out straw purchasers, those with emotional regulation issues and those who are not legally able to purchase but attempt it.” “If we feel something is up we don’t sell.” “Our right.”

  21. It’s stuff like this (and many of the responses on this page) that make me ashamed of being pro 2A and a card carrying NRA member. I could not be more proud to be an American, and I feel like refusing service to someone on the grounds of their religion is one of the most un-American things you can do. One of the most important principles in the United States is freedom of religion, and if we’re going to discriminate against Muslims because less than 1% of them are extremists, then we’ve only proven the point liberals have been trying to make about us for years. The way I see it, this man’s actions is more likely to turn away good, law-abiding Muslims from guns (and our cause) than prevent weapons from coming into the hands of terrorists.

    Does this man have a right to refuse service to people? Yes, absolutely, I will support him on that. That doesn’t mean I don’t think he’s ignorant and doing the entire gun community a disservice with his actions. The very nature of gun ownership and guns is political – the two are intertwined and cannot be separated, and by taking on such a position, he’s only serving to make us look ignorant as a whole and make it easier for the rest of the country to demonize the NRA and gun manufacturers.

    • I agree,

      He’s swooping down to the level of anti-gun libtards who because of a handful of gunowners it means ALL gun owners are bad.

      And how about muslim military members who served their time on the front lines. How about muslim doctors, nurses, EMT, LEO’s, other public servants? Do they not have the right to own a gun under this guys view? Fuck him, its his business, but hey he lost a few customers with that attitude.

      • He’s swooping down to the level of anti-gun libtards who because of a handful of gunowners it means ALL gun owners are bad.

        That is exactly the argument being made on liberal websites as we speak. California shooting? Colorado shooting? All guns need to be banned because there is only one type of gun owner: criminal. Either they are one, or will one day be.
        It’s a stupid argument no matter who it’s aimed at.

  22. Apparently I didn’t get the memo where owning a gun somehow made you better that everyone else.

    Also, guns can blow people up? They got explosive bullets now or something? Damn, I gotta get me some of them. /sarc

    “I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.”

    This fool is no American. All he wants is to make a quick buck from all the racists plaguing this country.

  23. Muslims who are citizens of the US and who are loyal to our country have the right to keep and bear arms like everyone else. However it is my opinion that Islam is incompatible with western civilization and more importantly the American way of life.

    The gun store owner has the right to refuse service to whomever he wants. The market will decide the repercussions.

  24. “Thania Clevenger, the Civil Rights Director for CAIR Florida, said her organization lost because of legal standing, not because of the merit of its argument.”
    Or rather, if they’d simply stop deluding themselves, they lost because they either didn’t read or didn’t understand the law.

    “Clevenger said CAIR has 15 to 30 days to file its next motion.”
    Which again underlines that they don’t KNOW the law.

    • No, they lost because the people filing the suit hadn’t been personally harmed. No standing. The minute a Muslim is actually denied a sale based on religion, you can bet it’ll return.

  25. Dan and TTAG,

    I expect better than this. This isn’t the sort of press that endears gun right advocates to the general public. This is hate mongering on his part and the “quote” of the day only implicates TTAG in the same sort of believes. If he doesn’t want to sell guns to people who are legally allowed, then he should close his shop.

    • I couldn’t agree more. Stop providing a platform for these crazy anti-Muslim rants. It makes POTG look bad by association with these nut jobs. I’m hoping these nut jobs are about as prevalent in the gun owning community as terrorists are in the Muslim community.

  26. The real problem of this “case,” isn’t that some dude doesn’t want to sell guns to Muslims, or toothpicks to Hindus, or whatever. But rather that the Government down there, would step in and bar some dude from selling whatever guns and toothpicks to whomever he wanted, from out the back of a car parked in front of the store.

    In free societies, dumb shit just gets routed around without much effort at all. But once Government gets involved, everything suddenly becomes a bloody political issue. Ergo, solution, get rid of the government. They do nothing useful nor good, and an absolutely incredible amount of bad. So just treat them like their closest relative, the Ebola Virus, and the world would be a much better place. For Muslims, Hicks and everyone else.

    • The problem is it’s illegal to deny people service just based on their whatever if you are not a private club. Now if you are a private club, like if this were a gun club, then they could legally decide to not accept people of certain stripes. The funny thing is he could have done this stealthily by just using the merchant’s implicit right to refuse business to anyone he wishes and passing it off as personal discretion. By making it a matter of flagrant policy, he’s inviting backlash.

  27. Just wait until he sees the staggering number of pale white born in the USA anglophone Muslims. The pants will inflate.

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