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Watching laws being made is never pretty. And the process of passing an open carry bill in the Lone Star State would make any sausage factory appetizing by comparison, but both houses of the legislature just passed HB910. And as you can see from Governor Greg Abbott’s enthusiastic tweet above, the deed is now all but done. Yes, Texans will have to have a concealed carry license in order to tote a heater out in the open. And despite the best efforts of some die-hards, the local constabulary will be able to stop ‘n frisk ask to see the permit of anyone they spy with a pistol visible on their hip. But letting the perfect be the enemy of the good doesn’t get gun owners anywhere. It’s about playing the long game and after too much to-ing and fro-ing, Texas just took a big step in the right direction.

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133 Responses to BREAKING: Texas Legislature Passes Open Carry Bill

  1. With or without the amendment that made it clear that the police are not greater than the 4th amendment?

    • Good point! A story here yesterday stated that the Amendment allowing cops to stop-and-check-papers was stripped. But the legality of that move by the committee was in question. Inquiring minds want to know. This bill should NOT allow cops to ask for papers without due cause…and carrying a legal gun legally shouldn’t be due cause.

      • Personaly, I don’t have the money to be the test subject for a dispute about the 4th amendment and open carry. And I don’t trust a cop to respect my fourth amendment right any more than I expect them to respect my 2nd amendment right today if I strap a pistol to my hip and walk around Dallas.

        • There will be a mass of lawsuits if cops stop legal open carriers. Hopefully that will be open carry TEXAS next mission. Get minorities on camera being harassed by plice while legally open carrying then take them to court personally for federal civil rights violations.

    • My understanding is that it is without the amendment.

      Both the Senate and the House held votes to “go outside the bounds”, which, as I understand it, means that they authorized the committee to strip the amendment. They then both “adopted” the conference committee report. Then they both voted on the bill itself, as reported in the article above they both voted to pass it.

      Licensed open carry goes into effect January 1st (after the governor delivers his promised signature, of course).

    • Oh contrar…they will ask you will comply then cross check for warrants, parking tickets, and failure to pick up after your dog. They will repeat this exercise until you stop open carrying.

      Staying that I am confused. Why require a CCW when OC?

      • The CCW (CHL in Texas) becomes a “weapons license” when the law is in effect, and lets one choose which method of carry they prefer.

        Why require it? Because there were really only two options — with permission/background checks/fees, or without permission/license/fees (aka Constitutional Carry). When the legislative session started, Constitutional Carry bills were introduced and may have potentially gone somewhere, but after the antics of a certain activist (who has since repeatedly called for all legislators who have voted against concealed carry to be put to death), and whose group caused issues in representatives’ offices, all support for Constitutional Carry quickly disappeared.

        Texas seems to be ready to go the next baby step — they authorized concealed carry 20+ years ago, and have seen that the CHL holders are the most responsible group of citizens in the State. So now they are expanding gun rights for those CHL holders. They are not ready to expand them to every resident of the State.

        • Thanks. One would hope that an elected representative could differentiate between good citizens and nonsensical honking of s jackass.

          Congrats….we still gaze at the horizon and wish.

        • Members of the Texas legislature, who are constantly surrounded by the nonsensical honkings of 180 other jackasses, quickly lose the ability to differentiate that sound from rational speech.

        • Yep. That jackass set gun rights in Texas back by about ten years.

          Jackassery is fun for the jackass, but not so much for sane people.

        • Wow… So I take it you will all fall in line to polish your masters’ jackboots with your tongues?

        • To say certain groups tanked constitutional carry is disingenuous.

          All gun control, which permitted open carry is, is all about control. Secondarily about re-election and as a tertiary about revenue.

          Texas politicians are invertebrates, same as every other politician.

    • You can still tell them to get a warrant and am I being detained. It was honestly a preemptive measure to avoid all the lawsuits that are going to happen now.

    • Without.

      But hey, maybe the cops (who are what, 0.5% of the voting age population?) will vote to re-elect the RINOS.

  2. Any info on the final wording of the bill? I know you guys were in a hurry to break this, but some Intel on what actually passed would be much appreciated.

  3. The cop unions demanded they be able to violate settled law. No matter! If they want lawsuits they can get them. And lose.

    Outside of the pure slave states, only Florida and South Carolina remain. Their anti gun Senate republicans will keep guns in the closet forever.

    • I hope you are wrong about SC… I’m *this* close to accepting a job offer to move there and would love to have the option of CC vs OC.

      Of course, I’d be moving out of NJ, so ANY carry is light years ahead of where I currently live.

      • Sc carry laws absolutely suck. I lived there for a year and the absolute atrocity of the entire state was too much for me to bear. Easily the worst place I’ve lived in my adult life. I’m not just talking about the gun laws either.

    • Cops all over violate settled law all the time. It’s not skin off their back. In the rare instance someone does bring a lawsuit and the rarer instance they are successful, it’s the taxpayers taking the shaft, not the perpetrators.

      • I’m pretty sure cops can be held personally accountable for civil rights violations.

    • I was with an agency and retired after15 years. I always assumed that anyone with a coat or jacket could have a gun. But I never stopped them on that. It was always something else. If they ask. Be polite and show them your chl. If it goes beyond that with no probable cause then they are using the color of law which can come back against them. I may carry openly or may not. Nice to have an option.

    • Will not happen in my lifetime. 11 million illegals in CA OC’ing. Never gonna happen. It’s what prevents lawful self protection for left coast citizens.

  4. I don’t necessarily agree!

    Just because the specific wording to prohibit “stop and interview” is not included, the Fourth Amendment is not on vacation.

    Seems to me that “reasonable suspicion” that a crime had been committed would still be necessary to establish the grounds for a peace officer to stop a citizen who is carrying a weapon. Merely observing a pistol in a holster carried by a law-abiding citizen would NOT meet that test.

    • As can be witnessed with a glance at YouTube, whether they are allowed to, or not, some will stop people and even arrest them for open carrying and denying to show ID. IT doesn’t necessarily happen often in NM, but there are plenty of times that it has. Don’t trust that even with the correct wording that cops will know or abide by the laws.

    • The 4th Amendment is not on vacation, but it is routinely ignored by police all across this great land. There will be lawsuits filed from OCers who are illegally stopped without reason, probably within a week or two of this going into effect. They will likely win, on 4th Amendment grounds. But that won’t prevent the harassment, especially in cities like Austin, Houston, and Dallas, because the taxpayers, and not individual police or municipal officials, are on the hook for any settlement money.

  5. Start the flaming, but I’m good with the show and tell part. I think a concealed permit course is like drivers ed for cars. Not strictly constitutional, but should cut down on Bozos. Doubt I’d open carry anyway, and don’t see the need, except because it’s my right.

    • Are you OK with getting pulled over just because they want to see if you have a driver’s license, insurance card and sober breath?

      • My thoughts exactly. I love the statist gun owner that’ll sacrifice his anonymity and submit to the police. It’s laughable and sad there are many gun owners like this.

        • The sad thing is that many people get a CCL so that they can feel like part of the state and get that little special tingle from having rights that “civilians” don’t.

    • Deberry v. US has already established federally that the mere act of carrying a firearm, where/when legal, does not constitute reasonable suspicion to conduct a terry stop without further suspicious actions. Furthermore, Brown v. Texas reiterates that an agent of the government can’t demand your identification without probable cause. Texans are looking at hefty taxes for lawsuit payouts.

  6. What is impressive is a Governor making a promise and delivering. When he terms out, head to CA we have 9 million votes for him.

    • 1. I don’t believe Texas has term limits for governor. Rick Perry could have continued to run. He’s just got his eye on POTUS.
      2. Abbott won’t go to California. Washington DC should be his next step. But we’re putting the cart before the horse at this point.

    • The Texas Republican party platform priority was Constitutional Carry, not licensed open carry. This is still a big fail and we got a big list of the people in the house who failed us by voting no on the Huffines amendment.

      • Abbott is in the first year of a 6(?) year term, give him some time. Constitutional carry could be here inside a decade.

    • As much as I would love for Florida to decriminalize open carry, I doubt it will ever happen. Why? Tourism dominates Florida’s economy and too many tourists from foreign countries and the Boston – Washington D.C. megalopolis (somewhat redundant, I know) would be panicking and calling the police at the sight of anyone carrying openly. Oh, and a lot of retirees from the same would do the same.

      • Hmmmm… the way you word it, making tourists from places like states like NY sounds like good sport! I’d consider OC just to **** with them! 😉

      • “As much as I would love for Florida to decriminalize open carry, I doubt it will ever happen. Why? Tourism”

        It depresses me to agree with that theory.

        However, Texas and Maine are motivating me to engage in some effort to rectify that.

        OC in Florida would be *huge* for normalizing firearms for international tourists.

        How sweet it would be to start a movement for carry rights worldwide.

  7. What about out-of-staters with CCWs that have reciprocity in Texas? Are we allowed to open carry?

    • My understanding is yes.

      The law won’t go into effect until January 1, 2016, so I’m sure some clarification will come between now and then, but as of right now I believe that yes, reciprocity would be honored with open carry.

  8. Damn you, Open Carry Texas! Damn you all to Hell! Were it not for your inane open carry rifle stunts, we would be getting licensed open carry for handguns now!

    Instead, all open carry bills went down in flames and they’ve even made licensed concealed carry illegal. It’s just like all of the OC haters predicted would be the outcome you Chipotle ninjas caused.

    Wait. Hold on. Licensed open carry passed? The Gov is just about to sign it? Oh. Never mind.

    • Who’da thunk it? I guess worms do turn. Good for Texas. Good for the legislature. Good for Abbott. And good for us!

      Now that open carry is legal, what will next be decided is whether seeing someone carrying a handgun will be enough probable cause to stop and frisk. I’m betting the courts will rule that it doesn’t meet the probable cause test.

      • The courts have already ruled that, repeatedly. Dean Weingarten probably has the references at the ready, but I think there were two separate cases, out of the (maybe) 4th and 6th Circuit Courts, where a CHL holder was stopped and detained to check for a license; the CHL holder sued for violation of civil rights under the 4th Amendment, and the courts agreed with them both times.

        It’s already the law. The police just need to be educated on it.

        • It’s already the law. The police just need to be educated on it.

          Close but no cigar. The police will need to learn that we are serious about exercising our right to open carry and lose a few lawsuits. This has happened in almost every state, if not every state, where open carry is legal — even states where open carry is constitutional carry (no license needed).

        • It is the law. Terry vs. Ohio and very recently Northrup v. City of Toledo Police Dept. Terry stops require probable cause, Northrup was illegally detained for open carrying and the court ruled open carrying where legal is no different from carrying a wallet. Cops can’t stop a random car to check if you have a drivers license.

        • Given federal (and who knows, Texas?) Search and seizure law, it strikes me that leaving the “cops may ask” bit in is more one of those little statutes that let the police pile on once they suspect they’ve got an unlicensed OC’er in front of them. From afar it seems the political body in Texas is just terrified of a diverse numerous underclass open carrying with no background checks (as people are seen from the top 30%’s view.) It all seems kind of “Texas Fear and Loathing” to me. I would project that lots of Texans are about to go get their license and occasionally carry,…just to announce to the town that they’re a ‘good guy,’ licensed…not one of that vast violent demi-mond they’ve read about in the newspapers and crime novels. Think I’ll go re-read No Country For Old Men.

  9. CHL papers: check
    Lanyard for CHL papers: check
    Retention holster: check
    Reliable pistol for self defense: check
    GoPro for self defense: check

    I suspect the GoPros will get more use than the pistols.

  10. Maine was a win. This Texas crap is a bastardized compromise … compromise being a dirty word. Excuse me while I vomit …

    You have to have permission to, excuse me, a permit to, open carry and the cops can hassle you without any fear or restriction. This will work so well. I mean the Texas cops are so level-headed and supportive of citizens rights.

    What a train wreck of abuse, er, accidents waiting to happen … over and over again.

    Better keep your heaters under cover boys. Unless you feel like going for the Shoot me, Beat Me Lotto.

    • “and the cops can hassle you without any fear or restriction. This will work so well. I mean the Texas cops are so level-headed and supportive of citizens rights. ”

      The 4th Amendment still applies. The courts have ruled that no, the cops most definitely cannot “hassle you without any fear or restriction”.

      Of course, the cops also can’t shove you unrestrained into the back of the paddy wagon and take you on a “rough ride” that severs your spine either, so … yes, abuses of the law will happen, as they always have and always will. But the law remains that the police cannot stop someone who is engaged in a legal (though licensed) activity, simply to check for a license.

      Apparently the police here do not know that. There are now a good 7 months for the Attorney General to educate the various chief LEOs as to what they can and cannot do under the 4th Amendment to the US Constitution.

    • “This Texas crap is a bastardized compromise . . .”

      It may be, but we should take our victories when they come our way.

    • “Maine was a win. This Texas crap is a bastardized compromise …”

      A little perspective here. Maine is a State of 1.3 million people. Maine is also “the least densely populated U.S. state east of the Mississippi River.” Its biggest city, Portland, has the population of about 66 thousand: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_in_Maine

      Texas is a state of about 27 million people, with large urban areas: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_in_Texas_by_population – this makes it much harder politically to pass any bill relaxing carrying rules. So, I wouldn’t poo-poo what they have accomplished in TX.

      And by the way, constitutional carry is not yet a done deal in Maine.

      • Don’t forget the odd timing of the Texas legislative calendar, too. Only meeting 140 days every two years makes it difficult to get anything done (which is usually a good thing).

    • Actually, this is still a big win for us in Texas. Right now, if your concealed and permitted handgun becomes visible to the public accidentally or intentionally, the permit holder can be arrested. The open, permitted carry, law will stop the stupidity, at least a little bit. It is a step in the right direction.
      We need to learn from the antis—push for a lot but be happy with every small step.

  11. Police still need to articulate a reasonable suspicion that you are committing a crime. Just ask them if you are being detained, and if so, for what offense. Politely remind them that they need to articulate a suspicion for a Terry Stop. Also remind them that you are recording for your lawyer.

    they will play games in certain urban areas for about 6 months and then give up.. . . . just like every other state pretty much

  12. BTW – where is Shannon? (Smile). I know she is throwing one of her cute little hissie fits

    • No , I bet she’s working her connections to see how she can hassle the metroplex residents into not OCing.

      My guess? A “call” comes in to the police that, “some guy with a gun is acting really creepy. I’m not sure how to explain it, but it’s like he’s skulking and trying not to be obvious [or strutting around displaying his gun in a threatening sort of way].”

      The police roll up and enjoy the opportunity to hassle and detain anybody that they see OCing, just checking that they have a CHL. maybe running your name, having you wait around while they sort this out.

      Eventually, that guy goes back to CC because he doesn’t want to deal with the hassle. In a few years, polls show that few people OC, and she can latch on to show how society doesn’t embrace OC and those that continue to do so are the archaic vestiges of an old mentality and an old society. Something, something, profit.

  13. I expect a lawsuit for illegal detainment on the second week of January when some old city cop loses his mind and goes full Waco on the OCer. Then when the unions get sued by the city for compensation for the detainment lawsuit they’ll have second thoughts about allowing the amendment. Lawyers are counting money in their heads as we speak.

    • Yep, lawyers will be getting richer with this law come 2016. I believe that was in the political plan: professional courtesy, ya’ know.

  14. I’m sure that Cali ex-pat Art Avocado, Austin’s Chief dummkopf, would never tell his minions to stop and hassle legal open carriers. Not in a million years. No way. Nope.

    • Yep, just like the chief in Milwaukee would never order his “troops” to “prone out” anybody OCing in a state where you don’t need government permission to OC.

    • He may very well do exactly that. And his officers may agree to do it. But that doesn’t change the law — it would be illegal for him to do so. Just like it is illegal to stop a brown-skinned person and ask them for their immigration papers. It simply is not permitted under the 4th Amendment.

      That doesn’t mean he won’t abuse the law — he might. And it may be that someone may have to serve as the test case and sue him, his department, his City, and the State for civil rights violations. If they do so, they will win. If that happens enough — you can bet that sooner or later, the city and state will get tired of writing settlement checks to attorneys and defendants and will “get the picture.”

      RF has said he intends to OC, out, loud, and proud, immediately. He lives in Austin. Perhaps he will be our test case — maybe Acevedo’s officers will hassle him and detain him demanding to see his CHL. Hopefully he will wear a body camera and get footage. You can bet he would take it to the courts.

      • Just for fun, I should join Robert , Tyler and Nick for coffee at downtown Austin while open carrying. See if the “wrong” colored guy(that would be me)gets detained first by Chief Avocado’s goons.

        • It would be nice to get 840,000 CHL holders open carry on the Capitol steps to thank the legislature and Gov. Abbot for keeping their word.
          Art “The Perv” Acevado would most likely blow a gasket. He was raised in Communist Cuba, weened on California Communism and then hired in Austin. That’s all you need to know about him.

  15. Not perfect, but law will evolve. Like was said by most anti-gunners after the 1994 Clinton Gun Ban passed: this is a good first step.
    Shoe is on the other foot now!

  16. uh, hold on a sec. If cops think they can stop someone merely for having a gun on their hip they are about to meet the 4th amendment.

    • That is correct.

      However, it may take time to sort it out, run it through the courts (I don’t think Texas is in the same Circuit Court that has already ruled on it), etc.

      And it may cost someone some money. Maybe we’ll see increased enrollment in Texas Law Shield (or comparable plans) because of it.

      This could all be headed off by the representatives and senators who are most concerned about it (such as Huffines, Dutton, West, and Ellis) asking the Attorney General to draft an opinion letter and distribute it to the various Chief LEOs. We’ll see if that happens.

      • No doubt there will be lawsuits, paid for with someone else’s (maybe the taxpayer’s) money. Because lawyers love: test cases, and money, and they gotta eat too.

  17. Good for Texas. You’ll see a bunch of 30.06 signs appear for the first twelve months but they will slowly be taken down. Just remember vote with your dollars and send them the polite ‘No guns? No money’ letter available at several websites.

    It happened in my state and it took a year or two but the signs came back down and so did some of the signs that were up before open carry passed.

    Again, congratulations.

    • Actually, I believe the law requires a 30.07 sign with the same display requirements as the 30.06 sign. So if a business wants no guns they have to display both in a clearly visible area near all entrances. That means 1 inch tall letters on contrasting background in both English and Spanish. That’s a lot of window space. My guess is that most place will replace 30.06 with 30.07. If they don’t, you can open carry but not conceal carry on a place that only displays 30.06…until they ask you to leave.

  18. Well done Texas, as a resident of this Great State, CHL holder, and law abiding citizen, who supports all law enforcement officers, I will have no problem with, and proudly show my Iicense to any that ask.

    • I will show very thinly veiled disdain for any jackboot thug that tries to detain me without probable cause. People may call youtubers shouting “am I being detained” at cops names, but there is a reason we’ve had to resort to that. We can talk, but I ain’t stopping if I’m going somewhere.

    • Being a law abiding citizen, why would law enforcement officers stop you? Why wouldn’t you have a problem with that.? Do you believe the law enforcement officers are going to show you respect upon realizing you have a CHL?

      • I will answer this with a true story, me, fall last year, deer season, local 7-11 3AM , on my way to lease, reach up to grab a bottle of water exposing small portion of hip holster covered by jacket, city police officer, buying coffee noticed holster , asked if I was carrying , yes sir I said, can I see your CHL, yes sir I said, he looked at it and my DL, called it in, handed it back , said good luck hunting, told me to make sure I conceal it better next time , yes sir I said, you be safe out there, yes sir he said . leaving deer lease same morning, Game Warden stops me, I automatically present CHL,DL,and HL, he notices the barrel of my pistol under my jacket, sticking out , said nothing checked deer and tag, said nice doe, have a good day sir he said, yes sir you too I said. Respect both ways equalled positive interaction, no problems because, wait for it, I am a law abiding citizen.

        • Just a few years ago, accidental exposure was considered breaking the law and grounds for losing your CHL permit. In a recent prior legislative session, accidental exposure “supposedly” became permitted. Knowing your exposure was accidental, the officer should not have requested your CHL or DL to run them because you broke no law. Your affirmative answer to having a CHL could have resulted in “make sure you conceal it better next time” -end of story. Point being, he did not respect you but rather treated you as a suspect in a criminal investigation. This is the exact point of the amendment that was ripped out by rinos on Thursday.

        • Both the police officer and game warden treated me with to utmost respect and courtesy, both called in my information, and both in no way treated me as if I were part of a criminal investigation, again positive interaction, no worries, no problems because wait for it again, I am a law abiding citizen, both the police officer and game warden are a credit to their profession.

  19. Wonderful! I am shoving a round of Shiners through the usb port for everyone here.

    Now, cue the hysteria from all the lefty media (redundancy alert) who don’t know that TX is one of the last states to allow open handgun carry.

    • “… TX is one of the last states to allow open handgun carry.”

      Yes and no. The number of States where one can carry in practice, as opposed to in theory, is not as large as that. So, it’s a great accomplishment for Texas!

    • I thought many states allowed OC. PA, VT, VA…maybe it’s only in the mid-atlantic and New England? I think five do not allow it, 13 allow it with a permit, and 32 simply allow open carry of a handgun without a license.

      Juliesa, I mistook your meaning….you clearly meant “they’ll whip up hysteria about Texas open carry not realizing that a large majority of states already allow it. Got it..

      • Many do allow it in principle, but would one want to open-carry in MA, just to pick an example? In Colorado individual cities can ban open carry, as far as I know; in Utah it took passing a law only a year ago that (hopefully) put a stop to the practice of the Salt Lake City police arresting open carriers for disturbing the peace, and I bet this list can be continued. So, the number of States where one can comfortably open carry must be a bit smaller than the number where it is theoretically legal.

        In TX, with all the publicity this bill has had, one will likely actually be able to open carry fairly comfortably come January 1st.

      • New Hampshire is also an open carry state.
        You only need a permit for concealed carry, or loaded carry in your vehicle.
        New Hampshire is also a shall issue state.
        Weirdly, while NH carry permits are good in 27 other states, they are not good in neighboring Maine.
        (If there’s anyone reading this from Maine, please talk to your state legislators about recognizing NH carry permits. Until then, I’ll be vacationing in states other than “Vacationland”)

        NH Constitution’s Bill of Rights, Part 1 Article 2-a
        All persons have the right to keep and bear arms in defense of themselves, their families, their property, and the state.

        NH Constitution’s Bill of Rights: Article 10
        Whenever the ends of government are perverted, and public liberty manifestly endangered, and all other means of redress are ineffectual, the people may, and of right ought to reform the old, or establish a new government. The doctrine of nonresistance against arbitrary power, and oppression, is absurd, slavish, and destructive of the good and happiness of mankind.

        NH Constitution’s Bill of Rights: Article 7
        The people of this state have the sole and exclusive right of governing themselves as a free, sovereign, and independent state; and do, and forever hereafter shall, exercise and enjoy every power, jurisdiction, and right, pertaining thereto, which is not, or may not hereafter be, by them expressly delegated to the United States of America in congress assembled. June 2, 1784

  20. Way to go, Texicans. No thanks to OCTard TC KKKory, but thanks to those responsible OC Long protesters who locked him up in a padded room somewhere…

  21. Ok, up North now. A positive step for Texans, sort of. But Hey I just finished a 250 mile journey from metro Detroit to my in-law’s home. While OC. Gas near my home, lunch near Flint and Open carried through the grocery store, not sure if anyone even noticed. Open carry only for last 3 months (except anti gun workplace) not one issue only 3 people even asked about my 9mm.

  22. Wow, I thought CO was a screwed up state with our new found mag limits. You have to have a concealed permit to open carry in the supposedly free state of TX!!? Why don’t we stop lying to ourselves; sad to say it, but TX is no more a free state than the rest.

    • In Texas, we have had open carry of rifles and shotguns for a loooooong time! They can be carried openly and loaded, even with a round in the chamber. Only handguns were prevented. This came about as a result of northern aggressors taking control of our state government after the war between the states. We are now getting back to our roots. That is all.

  23. I am supposed to supply my concealed hand gun license when my gun is on my person and I am stopped for any reason…. But when they see a gun strapped to your person, then hell yes they should be able to check when you are carrying open….. carrying a gun on your hip does not mean you a licensed, it could just mean you are an iditot waiting to be robbed of not just money but a firearm!… just sayin!

    • “carrying a gun on your hip does not mean you a licensed, it could just mean you are an iditot waiting to be robbed of not just money but a firearm!… just sayin!”

      Two words:

      Retention holster.

      🙂

    • Not just that, but they should be able to compare serial numbers to make sure you didn’t steal that firearm… just sayin!

      • Cops dont have access to that information. as far as i know even the ATF can only track it to who sold the gun (the ffl) and they have to contact them as to who they sold it to. remember there is no gun registration.

        • So you think cops should be able to detain you and verify you are not a criminal if you are open carrying?

      • The SN# would only be traceable in places like Michigan that require handgun registration. I hate that law. I do not feel that open carry should be a reason to be questioned by police. In reality most bad guys just throw the gun in a pocket or in the waistband. They won’t usually buy a nice hip or shoulder holster. I believe people that get stopped by police for open carrying should be able to verify the officer is a law abbiding person and show papers to the person being stopped too, after all most LEO also have a firearm on the hip.

        • If reported stolen, it should be traceable to a listing of stolen firearms.

          If a cop wants to search a law abiding citizen in order to make sure his possessions are not stolen, that cop needs to become an ex-cop, and soon.

  24. Here’s what’s going to happen. The same mindset that brought you Miranda vs Arizona, Terry, and numerous other court decisions that restrict police, will also cause legislators to remove the stop and detain provision of that law.

    Cops will abuse that authority…why…because they can.

    So be patient. If you don’t like that provision, never fear, law enforcement will fix it.

    • “…. cause legislators to remove the stop and detain provision of that law.”

      Only after that provision affects one of them or theirs.

  25. “Let’s not mince words, not only is it rare [openly carrying firearms], it’s down right weird and certainly not a practical way to go normally about your business while being prepared to defend yourself.” National Rifle Association position of May 30, 2014 on openly carrying firearms in public for the purpose of self-defense.

    Nearly one year to the day later, both houses of the Texas legislature have passed a bill which would make it legal to openly carry a modern, loaded handgun in public, albeit with a Texas handgun carry license. The NRA is now claiming victory for something they have opposed for years, in fact, decades – Openly carrying loaded firearms in public for the purpose of self-defense (Open Carry).

    The NRA almost killed the Texas Open Carry Bill (HB 910) with its opposition to the language in the bill which would make it clear to police that a person who is merely openly carrying a handgun does not constitute probable cause, or reasonable suspicion, that a crime has been committed and therefore they may not stop that person unless they have probable cause to believe that the person is committing a crime.

    That language was removed from the final version of the bill. Now, thanks to the NRA, there are going to be a lot of police officers who think that they get to stop anyone they see openly carrying a handgun and demand to see their license. People, particularly minorities, will now be harassed by police and there will be arrests even of licensed persons for failing to comply or other frivolous charges.

    Anyone who thinks the NRA is going to pay for their attorneys has been living under a rock. And let us not forget that the 1967 California ban on openly carrying loaded firearms the NRA helped write contains a provision authorizing police to stop, search and seize a person and his firearm to inspect it to see if it is unloaded. The police thanked the author of the California bill for including that language because it allows them to search Black people without fear of being accused of harassment.

    On June 16, 2015 NRA lawyer Paul Clement will appear before an en banc panel of the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals where he will argue to uphold California’s 1967 ban on openly carrying loaded firearms. A ban the NRA helped write and a ban that the NRA has been defending these past five years in Federal court. Not to mention the NRA’s defense of the California Gun-Free School Zone Act of 1995 which the NRA said in its Opening Brief in Peruta v. San Diego that the overturning of which would be “drastic.”

    http://CaliforniaRightToCarry.org

  26. Mamma, don’t let your sons grow up to be (Texan) cowboys … they’re now more likely to end up shooting somebody — either by accident or in a moment of rage — or end up dead themselves.

  27. Open carry after submitting to a background check and paying a fee to get a concealed carry license first is not open carry, it’s guilty until proven innocent. The demand of the police unions to have unrestricted stop and frisk of gun owners is and indication of the existence that America is now a criminal police state.

    As we speak the NRA contract lobbyist for IL Todd Vandermyde is placing language in IL’s carry bill to specifically allow cops to seize firearms at contact with CCL licensees:

    “Upon the request of the officer, the licensee or non-resident shall also , and identify the location of the concealed firearm and permit the officer to safely secure the firearm for the duration of the investigative stop.” This provision is being inserted into the Duty to Inform provision that the NRAs rat scum lobbyist Vandermyde put into Rep. Brandon Phelps carry bill in the first place.

    • After following the link, look at the Conference Committee Report pdf. See the last page of the bill, the last section:

      SECTION 53. Except as otherwise provided by this Act, this Act takes effect January 1, 2016.

  28. Ok, forgive me for my mixed gratitude here, but why is it that the po-po get to target me for legally open carrying (with my license- and doing nothing illegal) and we can’t ask someone to show ID at a polling place during an election?! Anyone else tired of this crap?!

  29. “Letting the perfect be the enemy of the good” etc., is a sure indication of sellouts and losers. It’s what ISRA executive director Richard Pearson said after he let NRA contract lobbyist for IL Todd Vandermyde place Duty to Inform w/ criminal penalties in Rep. Brandon Phelps HB183 carry bill, after the U.S. Federal court forced the IL legislature to pass concealed carry.

    There is nothing more dangerous to any organization, people, or nation than treason from within. The fact that Chris Cox & Chuck Cunningham at NRA/ILA actually pay money to a rat like Todd Vandermyde to sell out gun owners proves that they are traitors also.

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