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Reader Louis S. writes:

Today I was banned by Moms Demand Action’s Facebook page. Why was I banned on this warm July day in Texas? The answer is quite simple: they do not care about political discussion. Now, if I was being an obnoxious individual I would understand. But it was after I proposed a strong counter argument that I found myself banned . . .

An individual brought up the case of the Australian firearm ban in the comments of a post concerning the gun-control mecca of Chicago. My first rebuttal came in the form of an article from the Chicago Tribune that illustrated the correlation between an already dropping murder rate simply continued and that the ban had little effect. After some name calling I then responded — without the name calling — that I disagreed with them.

I then structured an alternate reality in which marijuana was legal and guns were not. Let us imagine that you can now go down to your local convenience store and pick up a big fat doobie, which to some might sound great (note: it doesn’t to me). However, all semiautomatic weapons are now banned. The only place to purchase said weapons would be the black market. With the cartels now looking for a new money source (remember, weed is legal) they pick up the gun trade in full force.

Now the US is flooded even more by criminals with guns and the American gun owner can only defend himself/herself with a double barrel shotgun. I then stated that I would much prefer the world we live in now in which an individual must pass a background check, if purchasing at a retailer, in order to obtain said gun.

Now, I believe going through a background check for a gun makes about as much sense as going through one while purchasing a car. I didn’t believe that this was a battle I wanted to wage with this tyrannical foe.

So in closing, I simply would like to ask Moms Demand Action, why? Why was I banned for simply providing a coherent argument against your ideas? How many people have they banned simply for providing similar, well thought-out alternatives to this gun violence issue some of our cities experience?

As someone who sells guns in a city who is directly across from one of the most violent cities in the world, I know the answer. It is that the city of El Paso has literally thousands of armed individuals who refuse to be the prey of the evil-doers of this world.

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105 Responses to Why Does Moms Demand Action Refuse Reasoned Debate?

  1. The Moms do not want a forum; they want a pulpit. They do not want a discussion; they want an “Amen.”

      • …and their entire argument is not based on facts, but emotion – and lies, and propaganda. So they know that they can’t debate, because most of the facts are against them. Especially after that last LA murderer, who was under every dream restriction they could think of in CA, and still went on a spree murdering people. Not just with a gun, but with a knife. They have to stay with low information soccer-mom emotion game, and can’t have people like you mucking that up by spreading facts and logic amongst their cult.

        • Leftists can only rely on Ignorance and Emotion, they’ve got nothing else. Their preconceived ‘thoughts’ cannot be disrupted or else they fly into a rage. I’ve seen this first hand and it’s sad.

    • And. . .(wait for it) they could use a treadmill (one good ad hominem attack deserves another).

      Kind of makes you reconsider sharia law.

      Naaaaah!

      Who’s paying these people anyway, if it’s people/entities overseas it should be considered espionage or treason.

      • Bloomberg kicked in a handful of millions, the guy’s got issues. Maybe mommy wouldn’t let him have a cap gun as a child or most likely, he shot the pet dog and got punished.

    • Let’s simplify this – has your wife every wanted to debate with you? Or has she simply wanted to tell you what to do?

      Here endeth the lesson.

    • This is clear from their responses to media outlets that actually allow people on our side of the debate to have a microphone, such as Dana Loesch or someone from 1MMAGC. A reasonable response from MDA would be asking the media outlet if they could be on the show as well for the purpose of “balance” or telling them to ask certain questions that they feel should be answered by people on our side. Hell, they could suggest some different people for them to speak to. I wouldn’t mind them getting upset at CNN having Alex Jones on the air, he doesn’t deserve the attention (unfortunately, they love it when idiots like him open their mouths, they get to use him to make the rest of us look bad). Instead, what MDA does is criticize them for allowing Loesch or anyone else on our side to speak on it. They don’t want a debate. For them, it’s “Agree with us or shut up.”

  2. Why were you banned? Because dissent cannot be allowed. They want an echo chamber. Their idea of “conversation” is about the same as their idea of “compromise” – their way is the only way and nobody can disagree.

    • Yeah, I think “Why was I banned for simply providing a coherent argument against your ideas?”, is its own answer.

    • Most of them do want to live in an echo chamber. I was talking to a liberal friend of mine about something else, and when I challenged her assumptions, all of a sudden I became a tea-party member, ya know all the usual insults, so they just want to live in their echo.

    • You were banned from their FB page? Welcome to the club. We have jackets on order, but due to the large size of the order it will be about 2-3 years.

  3. If they wanted facts, they would not have to lie. They distort, cherry-pick their “facts”, misrepresent, and demonize. Just be their tactics alone it is clear they have no interest in discussion.

    Facts are tough to argue. If violent crime is going down it doesn’t fit their narrative about the horrors of gun violence. None of the facts fit their narrative and bringing those facts to light conflicts with their mission. They will run from reasoned debate because they have nothing that supports their side other than rhetoric.

  4. You know, if enough of us post this article on their page they won’t be able to catch every one. Maybe a few of them would realize that their facebook group is not so righteous after all…

  5. I have never been insulted, bullied or brow beaten so badly in my life as I have for posting a conflicting opinion on either Moms Demand Action or Liberal America. Its infuriating to be insulted by a group of ignorant discriminatory people for making an intelligent argument against whatever emotional BS they’re spreading. For a group preaching tolerance and an end to bullying, they sure can be mean and ignorant. Especially when I do my very best to get my point across in an eloquent and objective manner.

    • The same thing happened to me. Several times on various “liberal” sites. Having said that, the right often does the same thing. Doesn’t make it right and I cringe when someone supposedly like-minded does it to a well spoken person who just has a difference of opinion (or a correct set of facts).

    • Straight out of Alinsky’s Rules for Radicals:

      RULE 5: “Ridicule is man’s most potent weapon.”

      We need to stop wasting our time persuading the hard-core gun-grabbers, and focus on the vast number of people who are persuadable.

      Invite a newcomer to the gun range.

      Educate a friend or relative who is on the fence.

      The anti-2nd Amendment radicals will never be persuaded. We need to leverage our time, attention and resources on those who are willing to listen.

  6. Shannon Watts is a paid PR Professional that is trying to push a message. We seriously need to stop painting lipstick on a pig and stop calling her a Democrat or an Unconstitutionalist.. No, we need to call her what she is: A Paid PR Professional that is doing this for a career. She doesn’t debate because it will expose the truth about her and show that she is nothing more than a paid actor trying to turn public opinion. Go look at the things she did with Monsanto.. It’s the exact same strategy.

    • Truth. Shannon doesn’t do this out of conviction. She does it because it’s her job. Maybe on some level she doesn’t care for firearms. It’s all part of the show and this is how she gets paid.

      She is good looking, presents well on camera, and fits the middle America mom identity (at least she makes it look that way). She was successful, then married a wealthy guy, and now she’s got time, resources, and skills.

    • Just remember that at the NRA Indy MDA protests that thy had to bus and pay people to show up at their meeting which probably lasted an entire 5 minutes. Heck, my daughter and I strolled all around down town Indy and never did find them. NRA convention was great.

  7. If you control the message you shape opinion. Shape opinion and you can change laws. What MDA want is an echo chamber, anyone providing a well reasoned counterpoint is not welcome

  8. I can answer that without even reading this story. They feed on fear! Plain and simple. They get everyone all riled up, much like pro gun groups do, but they do it on fear of having their 3 year old shot by some hillbilly that supposedly doesn’t know a muzzle from the buttstock (although the opposite is likely true).
    Most of them are probably very similar to the honorable Dianne Feinstein, who seem to think that just because a rifle has a vertical hand grip, that it is somehow more devastating than a horizontal one and therefore should be banned, when it has nothing to do with the operation of the gun. :/

  9. Join the club – I got banned early when they formed their little club, and I saw some early pics of Shannon. I just asked if she was down to party a little. . . . . consider it a badge of honor.

  10. The reason the gun laws in CT and NY were passed under “emergency provisions” that stopped public debate was because progressive liberals believe in dictatorship powers. They love control, not debate.

    You need to look no further that they highest chief priest, Obama

    The reason he cannot get anything done, is because he refuses to debate. Even with the latest border mess, he will not do a damn thing not even move border agents closer to boarder until he gets his $3.7 billion dollars. He does not want a debate why he needs it, he just wants it. We have an imperial president that is rah rah’d by his base.

    A base the give the illusion of wanting to be part of larger community in words, but does something else with its actions.

    The progressives liberals rules over Detroit for decades and we see what happened when there is only a single voice. In every progressive liberal single party rule state or city we see that a single voice makes no sense but that is what they want — their ideas with no opposition. They rather have mob rule than laws.

    The reason MDA and Bloomberg are fighting so hard at the Federal Level is for one and only one reason, so that can put a boot down on all American’s.

    • Exactly!

      The reason for all the illusory effort is that they have no where near the popular support they claim.

  11. Wow, dirk…. I just spit lemonade all over the place when I saw your comment. Now my iPad is sticky.

  12. I was pre-emptively banned. I joined to engage in reasoned debate, but they have never allowed me to post on their site. Not even once.

    • Well, we know for sure that they monitor this site and watch who posts what and how often. Me, I’m not even going to bother to try to join their little club.

  13. I too posted something factual on their little clubs site and was berated by what could only be described as six year olds with zero logic or have my post stricken with in ten minutes. It is obvious they have an opinion and will stick their fingers in their ear and hum lalalalas to any meaningful discussion. I see their fan base is about 191,000. If these folks really want to live in a country where there is no Constitution or Bill of Rights which includes the 2nd Amendment I think we would all be proud to see them leave America.

  14. Why?
    Because you dare publish more intelligent reasoning than the can. And that it contradicts their utopia….

  15. I really don’t have a problem with MDA banning people expressing ideas that they disagree with. MDA is an advocacy group. It’s their job to stifle adverse opinions. The local Church has no obligation to host a Black Mass. The local Satanists can’t be expected to publish a Papal bull.

    Why should it come as a surprise to anyone when MDA bans pro-gun posts, or even posts that respectfully challenge their antigun orthodoxy?

    What surprises me is when progun people try to post anything progun on MDA’s forum. Don’t you get it? Regardless of our perspective or the way we present our arguments, when we show up there, we’re tr0lls.

    • That is what I was going to say. What is the point of talking to them on their own FB page? There is no prize for winning the internet, and a group of people so entrenched in their position are not going to budge (which of course goes for us as well). Your “troll” point was spot on – which might make us stop and wonder how we react to them?

    • This would be true – if they didn’t keep insisting that they want to engage in a “national conversation” on gun rights. Interesting style of conversation they’ve got – spread lies and refuse to actually engage in conversation with anyone who disagrees.

    • I’m sure it’s true they think we’ll be trolls on their page, but it’s interesting to note that’s not the case here, but I have rarely seen any anti’s posting here at TTAG other than that MikeyNumbers guy who seems to have disappeared.

    • From the Urban Dictionary:
      troll
      One who posts a deliberately provocative message to a newsgroup or message board with the intention of causing maximum disruption and argument

      I don’t think that an attempt to engage in productive discussion, or to correct errors of fact, can properly be labeled trolling.

      Now what Dirk did, that was trolling 😉

  16. There is no reasoning. They have an agenda, which is to take away EVERY gun, period. Everything else is just fuel to their fire. If they really cared about “the children” or “Gun Violence” then that would be a good thing, but they don’t. They want to villainize lawful gun owners and ensure that we cannot use our guns for self-defense, because it offends them.

    There are many good examples of why the gun ban does not work in either UK, or Australia; however, they do not want to be confused by facts. (rape, burglary, and other violent crimes are up in both countries)

    And for the record, I was banned from their site within 5 minutes for attempting to use facts and logic. Does not apply in their world.

    So, we just need to keep up our campaign of Truth About Guns.

  17. They aren’t anything more than a pr campaign. They know this. So they stifle competition where they can.

  18. Same reason Al Gore won’t debate anyone skeptical of the global warming hysteria. Facts are not on their side. And they’re just not very smart.

    • Actually if you watch the science channel long enough you’ll invariably come across support for the claim of global warming, and yes humans pollution is adding to it however the earth itself goes through warming and cooling naturally, we just add fuel to the fire so to speak. 🙂 just FYI 😀

      • Yep, just like they also notice that other planets were getting warmer too because the sun is getting warmer. So far, we don’t have all explications to explain the global climate change.

        In the other hand, we can’t ignore that humans could do better for a better environment, cleaner air, more efficient energies, etc… There’s plenty of good reasons to pursue R&D and innovations in renewable energies. So, there’s no real reasons to use non-prooved reasons, often based on “emotions”.

        It is the case with Al Gore for the Climate Change, it was the case with George W. Bush for the Patriot Act, and it is now the case with Barrack Obama for the gun control…

        Different people, different party, different matters… but always the same methods. Lies wrapped on an overflow of emotions. Elites are so pathetic once we know their dirty little game!

        PS: I don’t pretend to know everything on any subject. The only thing I know is to recognise a lie when I see it. If someone is so sure about his argument, he won’t avoid any reasoned debate… that’s just what happens here with the MDA group.

  19. I was banned from their page because i corrected their numbers and asked questions they banned me after calling me a ammo sexual.

  20. I was banned from their page for asking “why are you so angry towards gun owners?”

    The unapologetic eye bulging, vein popping, mouth foaming, pure vitriol hatred that these individuals possess is startling.

    I grew up a farm boy. My father was mostly absent from my life, but my mother instilled morals in me and told me to treat others how I wanted to be treated. Even when other people disagree with me and have some fairly major differences I would never think to insult, harass, and demean them simply because they hold another point of view.

    • Anything that is not a sheep scares that flock. Even something as insignificant as a free-flying moth. They do not fear losing. Instead, they fear “not winning.” For then all the money and time would have been spent for naught.

    • Bloomberg’s minions, especially the MDA, *are* wolves who’s primary goal is to *control* the flock by their narrative of propaganda (which is faithfully supported and parroted by big liberal media and institutionalized education).

  21. I think a “Moms Demand Action Against Mom’s Demanding Action” facebook page would be hilarious. If it doesn’t exist already, it should.

    I mean don’t real Mom’s take offense to non mothers, hippies, statists, PR execs, and other overly emotional malcontents speaking for them and making real rational mothers look like raving lunatics?

    • there is a group that is real mom’s against these people. it’s called 1 Millioms Mom’s Against Gun Control. they have a fb page as well as forums outside of FB. i’m a follower/supporter of 1MMAGC. they have local chapters and encourage dad’s to join too. they also do what they can to financially help people that want to carry but can’t afford it go through the process of applying for permits.

  22. Why? Pretty simple really if you speak their language so allow me to translate for you. Shut up slave!

  23. Ive been banned from all of them. I went trolling through one, had quite a bit of time, commented on many wrong facts with correct ones and left sources as well. and still was banned. They dont want to hear logic, they thrive on fear and propaganda.

  24. MDA banned me from their FB page too. I think it may have been because I referred to Shannon Watts as a raging hypocrite and a liar. Specifically because they constantly claim to want to have a discussion but then they block, delete and ban anyone who does not agree with them 100%. Deleted…banned.

  25. Just a thought. Why engage with them? I don’t mean we stop documenting and calling out their distortions and lies. Why do you try and engage in debate with a group that has demonstrated a clear intention not to listen. There are none so blind as those who will not see.

    Rest assured though. If they rile up any pro-gun individual until they say something unflattering that will stay so they document it, and use it to keep driving their point about gun owners.

    • Interesting.

      Curious if the rate has really increased since the announcement (article doesn’t say what it was before), or is this a sampling error in the reporting.

      But, either way, it reinforces my personal conviction that no matter what some corporate suit says, no sign making it illegal for me to carry there, I’ve got no problems carrying there.

      (And even if I chose to stop spending $$ at Target, the article references attacks in the parking lots…making patronizing OTHER retailers an issue and collateral economic damage to Target’s asinine request).

  26. I was banned for commenting on one of their “statistical” images which had some absurd percentage of what Americans were in favor of…to source their material they did have a link posted to an article to confirm the number. It was an article on their own website. I responded by saying the stat is completely off base and that you cannot cite yourself to support your own argument.

    I actually had discussed some things on their with their cult followers without issue, but the moment you question one of their unquestionable edicts is the moment the ban hammer drops. When your entire platform is floating on balloons filled with hot air, you cannot allow a person with a reality pin anywhere near it.

  27. Well, I myself have been banned from MDA for quite some time now, as well as just about everyone else who would dare comment on their page while using logic.

    I wasn’t banned for being abusive, or even for arguing a point counter to theirs. No, I was banned because I dared ask for a source to verify one of their claims. That page is nothing more than a big anti-gun circle jerk, if you don’t want to participate in stroking their delusional ego, then you are not welcome.

  28. A while back they started a large “conversation” on their page about a recent shooting, clamoring for the need for more gun control. The gun used in that shooting was a shotgun, so I posted and asked them if they proposed to ban shotguns?

    That’s all it took for them to ban me.

  29. I got banned months ago and I wasn’t even disagreeing wirh anyone, just making a relatively neutral observation that apparently wasn’t sycophantic enough for the page mods.

    There needs to be trurh in advertising, they should change the name to Moms Demand Obedience because that is what they really want.

  30. Y’all can start passive aggressively posting…

    Make the posts seem anti-gun, in nature, but be so absurdly worded that they can be quickly identified as sarcasm to POTG.

    Ex:

    Ban guns, now! No one need an AR16 and .100 caliber clipazines!

    These assault weapons are the scourge of our modern society. We must ban all high-capacity revolvers, ghost ammunition, and other instruments of war!

    And such. Just let your imagination flow.

    I am unable to do this, as I do not have a Bookface account.

  31. Not just on Facebook, but a number of known examples have occurred in-person, where anti-gun politicians tried various methods to get “gun extremists” (i.e. citizens and voters with a right to have their concerns heard) removed from or banned from public meetings, with the oft-cited excuse that the politicians “felt threatened.”

    Or, they moved meeting times and dates with change announcements given only to their preferred interest groups, in hopes that pro-gun citizens would not even show up on the correct day & time. These tricks were tried by both Colorado and Oregon politicians, and many more different kinds of dirty tricks that I’m probably not aware of, in other states and locales.

    Here in Washington state, several anti-gun groups played dirty tricks at PACKED legislative hearings earlier in the year, in an attempt to limit as much of the pro-gun comment period as possible – they did things such as trick pro-gun citizens into wasting time on sign-up sheets that were simply thrown away, causing them to lose their place in line and therefore their seat in the public session. The Washington State Patrol escorted several groups of anti-gun residents (including those from MDA) into the capitol buildings, allowing them to jump in line far ahead of any other groups. Last but not least, the state legislature simply allowed special interests of only one side to take up an inordinate amount of time. Gabby Giffords flew in to Washington THAT DAY, showed up at the meetings as a non-resident, and was allowed to speak for over ten minutes, while actual Washington residents were limited to one or two minutes of commentary a piece.

    In some cases, they don’t allow any public comment at all, and pass bills in the dead of night on “emergency” rules – e.g. NY SAFE act.

    When anti-gun politicians run the show, their dirty tricks are played out in the open. The problem? The media simply refuses to call them on it. Imagine if these shenanigans were carried out by GOP politicians during open public comment sessions for legislation for abortion, gay rights, etc. The media would be livid, and it would be headline news on the national stage.

    So why should we play fair and want to talk to them when they abuse the systems that they conveniently have control of?

  32. In my unicorn world Facebook would modify their software so that directly under the “Likes” counter would be a counter for the number “Banned”. If you clicked that Banned counter it would show the posts from the banned individuals. Now back to reality.

  33. Let’s pair up our open carry advocates againsts moms demand action, now that i’d like to see! That would be a great debate, pit bull vs poodle.

  34. For Bloomberg, the media is a keyboard upon which he plays. Bloomberg believes that if he plays the music long and often enough at the Ministry of Truth, the children will learn to love it as they love Big Brother.

  35. Stop making SENSE. Just stop…BTW I just saw Dawn of the Planet of the Apes. It was great! Yeah I got a slight left vibe but the overwhelming message “he who has guns win!” Also a crazed chimpanzee with 2 machine guns had me rolling in the isles. Yeah NOBODY ever ran out of ammo & the apes needed no instructions but hey it’s Hollywood.

    • At least in the original movie franchise, the apes all seen how weapons were used… and could let us fall on the old adage “monkey see – monkey do.” Its a (fatal?) weakness in the new movies.

      For that matter, whether you agree with it or not, at least the reboot of Star Trek on the movie screen included something to attempt to explain the huge changes. (alternate time-line/reality.)

  36. Terrible proposition, what is “reasoned”? 2A supporters will lose all day every day with this kind of verbal subjectivity.

  37. or we could just post all of their home addresses online and indicate that there are against guns and none are present in their homes. For the Children(TM), of course.

    or even better, we can put together postcards with their addresses written on them and encourage our new found visitors on the texas border to come up to suburban Indianapolis for a hot meal and roof over their heads. I know of one MDA member with a few extra beds now that her (step) children are in school. 🙂

    • Maybe if we start reporting the threats of violence that their followers make the FBI would notice.

  38. I was banned from their Facebook page quite some time ago. They posted something about voting for #Gunsense in the elections. I responded that “I AM a #Gunsense voter – I vote for the candidates who will uphold the 2nd Amendment.” – – That was all it took to get banned.

  39. They are typical leftie feminist women who are completely selfish, self-centered, self-absorbed and solipsistic.

    If it isn’t something they already think or already know it doesn’t exist. And if you claim it exists, you are a rotten, ugly, stupid bastard and need to go away.

  40. I’d love to get in a discussion with a gun grabber. See what sense they make, and if they use children, ask them why they support abortion.

    • They’ll give the reasoning of:
      Once the fetus is born, it’s a baby. But before it is born, it isn’t (or its just organic tissues and not a life.)

      You could counter with:
      Ah, but if it isn’t a baby until AFTER it’s born, why is somebody charged with murder if they hit a pregnant woman in the stomach and causes the fetus to die?

      At which point, they’ll probably start using their tongue to attack you and perhaps their fists, feet, purse, etc. as well.

  41. Heck, I was banned simply for “like”ing a post! I didn’t even get to express an opinion in words.
    If you made it to two or three posts, you’re doing far better than most.

  42. I have been banned from 50 out of 53 MDA FB pages, most in a matter of minutes, over maybe 2-3 weeks. Once in about 30 seconds (New Jersey), and two preemptively before I had even posted anything (California and Missouri). Most posts were questions similar to “So what law would have prevented this?” On only one state page (Wisconsin) was anyone willing to even respond. Under threat of banning of course, if I didn’t behave. Which I did. She still lobbed insults. So much for the “conversation.”

  43. Because Potato, No reason, just potato.

    A‪#‎gunsense‬?

    ‪#‎MomsDemand‬

    ‪#‎EverytownForCatBurglars‬

    ‪#‎SomethingBadHappenedToHisFamilySoYouShouldBePunished‬

    ‪#‎BlackTurtlenecks4GunControl‬

    ‪#‎DependsUndergarments4GunConfiscation‬

    ‪#‎CNN4ABrainwashedNation‬

    ‪#‎LiberalsBalkedAtBushAdminTerroristHysteria‬

    ‪#‎CNN4NightlyGunControlHysteria‬#EveryClown #Everytown #guncontrol #GUNSENSE #MomsDemand #DemandAction #MomStrong #TooMuchWine #XanaxIsCool #WeAreBetterThanYou #BloombergsBitches #FullMarmel #SubmitToYourBetters #MomsDemandGuns #DemandGuns #MonsantoMommy #BoughtAndPaidFor #xanaxmunchers #JackedUp #CitizenControl #EndGunShaming #ShannonLie

  44. I think this sums up why you were banned pretty nicely.

    http://youtu.be/AyenRCJ_4Ww

    By the way, I was banned from all of their networked pages over a year ago, for doing the exact same thing: providing a thoroughly logical, tactful, and respectful counter backed up with utterly unimpeachable sources.

    They don’t want debate, discussion, discourse, or compromise.

    They want complete and total capitulation and subjugation, full-stop.

  45. They did the same thing to me when I tried to have a well reasoned debate with them. They banned me months ago for the same thing. They weren’t interested in the facts or the numbers. They aren’t interested in the studies, nor the news reports of legitimate self-defense. They talk about “gun sense”, but they lack any sense of integrity, honesty, or knowledge concerning firearms.

  46. Yall obviously ain’t seen the bile they hurl outta the blue towards any lowly conservative tea bagger. never in my life have I been called un american & an insurrectionist so many times just for the display picture I use or for posting gun pictures.

  47. About El Paso, the drug lords have their families live in the city. They don’t want to crap in their own backyard so all of the bad stuff happens a half mile across the border.

  48. I was banned as well. Anyone who disagrees is banned that is why you see zero arguments on their page. I just use their numbers they post to try to demand change to give my argument. They will make as much headway as a toddler demanding to not sleep eventually they will shut themselves down.

  49. Who are moms? They are mothers and of course wives. As you all know the wife is always right so don’t wonder why you are banned or much less win any argument because their minds are already set.

  50. I am a firearms owner, presently rebuilding his collection now that the Bush economic meltdown is passing. I don’t consider myself an enthusiast as much as someone who appreciates quality tools (as opposed to tools for the NRA, which is another subject). I have a firearms trust and am going through the process to convert a PS90 to a SBR, and have knowledge of and experience with a variety of military weapons (thanks to professional time working at The Bomb Company) so I am probably at a level well beyond the average casual gun owner.

    And I’ve been pitched off of several gun forums. Evidently it’s a requirement that you hate Obama and regularly diss liberal folks in order to fit in with most of those groups.

    That, and an impartial person can see by many of the responses here that most gun enthusiasts don’t really want a reasoned debate. They want to be rude, and they want to try to intimidate the anti-gun groups.

    Gun enthusiasts like to talk about how “stupid” anti-gun folks are when it’s plain to see that those folks certainly aren’t stupid. Most are well-spoken, successful people. Who simply have a different viewpoint.

    And no one wants to hear a person screaming about their “rights” or (my favorite) how someone that doesn’t sleep with an AR-15 is a “traitor.” Traitor and socialist must be the two most overused and misunderstood words among conservatives these days.

    Anyway … I have posted some things at Moms Demand Action calling for compromise and understanding that some gun owners genuinely are responsible. And they still let me post there.

    There have been some comments in this forum about how tactless many gun enthusiasts are and serious people should pay attention. Because everyone is going to ignore the screamers, and rightfully so.

    • Yeah, thank heavens for people like you Johnny G. It is a comfort to know that people like you are voting for Obama and other staunch supporters of the 2A. Bush economic meltdown. You are comedy gold my friend.

  51. I am still reeling from their “Rape only lasts for minutes, death is forever” campaign. As a woman who has been raped, I can tell you that it DOES last forever. The psychological and mental trauma will influence every interpersonal relationship you will have from that point forward. I do not believe that I should just close my eyes and think of a happy place because someone who is wanting to assault me in the most personal way “has a right to live too”. What about my rights? My rights to not have nightmares, to be able to trust a good man when I see one, to not have a disease from an encounter that I didn’t want in the first place? It’s obvious to me that they have never been in fear for their lives. They say this is for the children…should I tell my daughters to just let it happen if God forbid someone was attempting to rape them? I’m sorry, but I think not! I am a responsible gun owner, for both my own personal protection and the protection of my family. I can handle rational discussion on any subject, whether you agree with me or not, but I can’t stand skewed statistics and lies, propaganda and fear. It would be different if they were just misinformed and uneducated on the subject, but this is willful ignorance. I know that I’m only focusing on one aspect of their campaign here but I am appalled by their audacity! I understand that they are afraid for their children, every mother is…but I believe that educating our children in the ways to help them keep themselves safe is way more helpful and constructive than telling them that anyone that doesn’t agree with our point of view is to be immediately feared and hated. I choose to follow the path of education for myself and my daughters as opposed to the path of biased fear and misinformation. That has made me a “terrible mother” who “wants her children dead” to these people. But it’s “all about protecting the children”. Ridiculous.

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