Kryn Miner (courtesy beaumontenterprise.com)

“A Vermont prosecutor says no charges will be filed in the shooting of a troubled Army veteran by one of his teenage children,” foxnews.com reports, “because the man was armed and threatening to kill his family.” Readers familiar with Oedipus Rex (or The Lion King) will appreciate that this incident is the dictionary definition of a tragedy (without the really weird bit). But it’s actually worse . . .

State’s Attorney T.J. Donovan says 44-year-old Kryn Miner was being treated for post-traumatic stress disorder and traumatic brain injury from tours in Iraq and Afghanistan. He says the conditions played a role in the behavior that led to Miner’s death.

Miner was killed at his Essex Junction home April 26. Authorities are not releasing the name or age of the child who fired six shots.

Miner served multiple tours, most recently in Afghanistan in 2010 with the Vermont National Guard.

So why wasn’t Miner hospitalized? Perhaps even institutionalized? That question is notable by its absence. Our condolences to his family. And here’sa horrible thought: it could have been much, much worse. [h/t MP]

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74 Responses to Defensive Gun Use of the Day: Worst Possible Tragedy Edition. Well, Almost

    • With the “War on Terror” Generations of men will come home with PTSD and stories such as this will continue. As long as we have these endless and unnecessary incursions into other sovereign nations (think Ukraine next), men will return home forever changed for the worse only to hurt themselves or others. How many vets kill themselves each day?……22!……DAILY!

      Until the mindset of “America, fuck ya!” is ended and we begin to accept the fact that we are not the police of the world, that it is not our responsibility to install the government of our liking (Iraq, Ukraine,Libya, Syria, etc) this will never end.

      If you believe that we should invade foreign nations to “end terrorism” and “freedom isn’t free” then understand that stories such as:
      Kryn Minor
      Martial Law with people forced out of their own homes at gun point like Watertown Massachusetts
      School lock downs only to find a thermometer with a laser
      Militarized local police beating citizens to death like Kelly Thomas
      Bureaucracies like the BLM terrorizing a rancher and assaulting citizens who exercise their first amendment rights to protest the bureaucracies actions
      Police harassing and beating citizens as they drive highways while never crossing an international border like pastor Steven Anderson. These stories will all continue as a result of the “War on Terror”.

      Get use to it. The military industrial complex (which Dwight Eisenhower warned us about) is in full control and good men such as Kryn Minor will be sent to do its bidding for “American interests” only to return home and kill himself or his family while the rest of us will have our wealth confiscated through unfair and unconstitutional Federal taxation while surviving inside the Police State formally known as the “Land of Liberty”.

      This can change. Convince yourself then others through informed debate. Help others to see what’s going on. Understand that the two party system is a fraud to manipulate the masses. Stop voting the “lessor of two evils” and have the courage to willfully disobey unconstitutional laws. Or just call me crazy and accept that this will get worse…..far worse.

  1. A horrible situation for all concerned. I can’t imagine that grief, shame and guilt that will haunt the young shooter for the rest of the child who pulled the trigger, no matter how justified it was, and how much worse of a situation it prevented.

    Lord, have mercy.

    I wish the man had been institutionalized and treated thoroughly.

    Our nation must bear this shame.

    • Paul, how long is “of the child who pulled the trigger.”

      Why should the government be blamed for what happened? The guy was eligible for retirement five years ago, but turned it down. He was not injured during his last tour, and is reported to have performed well in local news quotes from Afghanistan colleagues.

      He was a volunteer, a career soldier, and he liked it. He also drank, threatened his family with a gun now and then (according to his family), and was obviously dissatisfied with his life. So he gave his kids nightmares for life. Instead of seeking therapy, I would guess. Instead of giving up the booze. Why is that the government’s fault?

      • We have to be careful here. Without much of the facts we don’t know if he personally, a government that discards and mistreats it’s veterans and currently serving military personnel, or a society that wishes to forget the problems combat personnel deal with while in and out of the military carry most of the blame. My guess is that they share it, as is the case with most issues like this.

      • Nonsense. There is no good reason for any American military personnel or hardware to be in Afghanistan or Iraq, besides tactical nuclear weapons. The presence of human beings ‘over there’ simply makes the life of humans worse, without any actual military goals being achieved.

  2. I hate to sound like a dick, but it’s stories like this that make me glad that I didn’t join the military,

    My thoughts are with the family, and I hope that they are able to pull through.

    • You just said what everyone else was thinking. What a waste of time, treasure and lives. For nothing. Whatever “ground” was gained is now lost, and all the sacrifice achieved nothing for anyone, save those who profit from war.

      • Agreed. I am a vet of 2 campaigns from 2 different branches of service. I am currently a reservist with 17 “good” years for retirement. When I hit 20 years, I’m done. Now you know why most “career” military personnel, regardless of being an officer or enlisted end up aligning themselves as non-Democratic.

        Personally, I am an independent with a lower case “i”.

        It is nice to know that I fought to support “artistic endeavors” and free medical care for undocumented non-resident, residents.

        • No, you fought for corporate interests disguised as ‘freedom’, including lining Haliburton’s pockets.

        • I agree, Caius. People sign up for lots of reasons. Draftees have my utter sympathy. Volunteers? I think people sign up to get money for college, to get away from family or their small town, but I really don’t think, post-WWII, people sign up to ‘defend their country.’ If they do, it says they were confused long before military service or deceive themselves about the truth.

          I fought in dangerous circumstances. I volunteered. You owe me nothing. I sure didn’t do it to protect American Womanhood or whatever other bogus reason is sometimes offered. All I can say about the military is that enlisted combat troops are grossly underpaid.

        • Different people sign up for different reasons. Money for school is a big one. Opportunity and sense of community is another. Yet there are still quite a few who did it to serve this country. I know there to a lot of modern liberals and libertarians who think that volunteering to serve in the military does nothing but “line the coffers of corporate interest” or “because of slave-mentality” but that’s poppycock. I contend that ultimately we take our authority from the elected officials and the people of the United States, who in turn vote their representatives in to office. If they don’t like our footprint overseas, or the actions we take they need to look at themselves first. Do I like everything that the administration is doing to the military or with the military? No, but unless it is morally and ethically wrong, I will uphold my oath I took to the United States until I leave the service.

          Oh and one more thing. I personally don’t care if people choose to create “Big Corporations” and pursue profits. If that’s what they feel validates their lives, than why should I get in the way of that.

        • Enlisted combat troops cannot possibly be paid enough, and so are enticed by non-pay incentives like the GI bill, opportunities to achieve in life. Charles Payne on Fox news relates his time in Minot, ND as an Airman, and that after college he has achieved, at one point, a $275 million net worth, from nothing. It is the only real way for those with no future to achieve one. I am not sure that is bad. Unless you die, of course, but that is part of the deal.

        • LarryinTX, I agree it’s not bad. It is what it is. It gave me, frankly, the freedom to not ask for a dime from anyone since the day I turned 18. I considered that a very good thing, and retrospectively still do. I hated groveling for money, which was my family’s game. It all worked out.

          It bothers me that people (the seriously wounded exempt from this, of course) blame their later miseries on their wartime service, though. Yes, it’s natural to have some periods when repetitive nightmares come. There is therapy for that -confronting the events head on, seeing them for what they were, and accepting it is part of war. I went through that. It takes time and honesty and acceptance. “Don’t fix the blame, fix the problem.”

    • It’s stories like this that reinforce the notion that veterans are ‘damaged goods.’

      We’ve got great Sailors, Marines, Airmen, and Soldiers in the DOD. 99.9% of them are upstanding citizens, and a great majority are the finest people I’ve ever had the opportunity to lead and work for/with.

      Between going off the deep end, committing sexual assault (at a rate less than what occurs on college campuses and equal to the general population), or pulling stupid stunts on the youtubes, the bad apples drag the rest of our good names through the mud. The media loves to harp on it because the crazed veteran headlines sell ads, while a story about Seaman Snuffy chipping non skid on the flight deck for 15 hours a day won’t.

      • Agree. Yet a large part of the problem is that more than a few soldiers were miserable before they signed up, are miserable after, but blame their service. And yes, the media just love it. ‘Oh, the poor traumatized veteran!’

        I would appreciate it if veterans who volunteered would accept that they only did things a good soldier must do, would be proud they served bravely, and would get on with their lives.

        My first job after military and government service was as a tax consultant for the firm PwC (back then PW). A partner told me he had never before met a Vietnam vet that wasn’t screwed up. I listed for him a few well-known executives who were RVN vets, and explained to him that if the person tells him they are a vet without a good reason to bring it up, chances are they were a fake vet. The 2010 Census proves me right. More than twice the number of actual living RVN vets (by VA count) told the census they were RVN vets. Go figure.

        I’m often surprised by how many ‘troubled’ vets were not even in combat positions. Figure that one out.

        • YES, YES, YES, YES!!!!! Absolutely. And, BTW, returning Vietnam vets did not have excessive problems with illegal drugs. It was all bullpoop. I went to a reunion of the 101st participants in Firebase Ripcord to escort my father, who wished to go because my older brother died in the engagement. The former enlisted troops attending were now corporate executives and entrepreneurs, all the stories we were fed were lies. Read “Stolen Valor”, it does not go far enough.

        • Larry, it’s a small world. I know (visually, from the air, not the ground) the A Shau valley, and areas to the west of it, and saw it many times from the north, beginning about five months after Fire Support Base Ripcord. I moved from IV Corp to I Corp, Dong Ha, in early January, 1971, with the 173rd Assault Helicopter Company, as part of the Lam Son 719 preparations. We flew every morning during LS719 to the north of the valley, refueling at Vandergriff, sometimes at Khe Sanh, before flying into Laos.

          We very often, before and after the operation, traded off with A Company, 4/101 AHB, 101st Airborne, “Comancheros,” for various volunteer days supporting another small unit not part of the 101st. I am glad your father could meet some of the people with whom your brother served. One of my best friends in adult life was the commander of the “radio research platoon” for a time, and involved in that at Camp Eagle during FSB Ripcord. He reached the highest level at a too-big-to-fail bank which I won’t name. He retired two years ago.

          Your brother was brave, and now his memory is honored.

    • Terrible story, but I guarantee this and other stories like this will be used by the left to ban veterans from owning guns. There already in the process of it, I believe its at 50% disability, correct me if I’m wrong, the feds come and confiscate your guns.

      • I have a former coworker at 80% and a current coworker who’s wife is at 100% who are both armed, one of whom I aspire to have a firearms collection that is as large and diverse as his. The wife is at 100% because of mental/emotional issues to boot. I have several associates at varying levels of disability who are also armed. This is all anecdotal of course but I do not believe anyone comes to collect your firearms at 50% or even 100% disability.

    • VSN…I’ll be the one to say it. It’s comments like that that make me glad you didn’t join either. Probably just get someone else killed.

      I joined pre 9/11 and served 6 years in the Air Force in a ground combat role. I did’t join to defend my country or some patriotic reason. I joined to make a difference in others lives. Whether it was my unit or my family at home, they are the reason I sacrificed so much. Plus..it was a blast…shooting amazing guns…blowing stuff up. Who wouldn’t love it?

      I could give a crap about those who focus so much on the others who “profit” from war. I don’t care if rich people got richer off of my sacrifices. I focus on those whom I helped that needed it.

  3. Institutionalized for PTSD? When the VA is letting vets with cancer die of neglect with “secret waiting lists”?

    There are obviously much more important things to do with federal funds than take care of those who served our country. Like caring for those who are in this country illegally. For those who, of their own free will, have never worked a productive day in their lives. For those who [quoting Pelosi] can now spend all their time pursuing their artistic endeavors without worrying about medical care.

    Of course there’s no money left or interest to care for veterans [disgusting, filthy, militaristic brutes that they are].

    • Sorry GreatUnknown- I gotta call you on this. I honestly agree with what I think you were saying,,, but I work in Vermont, at the VA he went to, and I am a Vet seen there for similar problems myself. On one side I think the senior leadership in Phoenix ought to answer for what happened and it should involve personal pain…BUT any Vet on that list could have walked in when they even got close to feeling that bad.. WE do it everyday. The morons in AZ were trying to cook the books to make themselves look good to VA Hqs… and people died… haven’t seen a word on exactly what they died of… was it an appointment they waited too long for? Was it some long-term illness that was killing them no matter what anyone could do? WE DON’T KNOW. The wife who is now blaming the VA sure as hell could’ve gotten hubby to another clinic, to ANY other VA hospital, to a state hospital if they didn’t have money or insurance… any number of things. Also, so this “retired senior Doctor” only came forward AFTER he retired… I can report things like this anonymously a number of ways myself right now. Why did he wait… gee, he couldn’t take money for such a report while he worked for the VA…WHO KNOWS WHY HE DID IT! Really, if he really did know a-nd didn’t tell someone HE ought to suffer the same fate as that Director… ‘course NOW he’ll be called a “whistle blower” instead.

      Go on folks, throw rocks at me… claim I’m protecting the VA…but in the end, I’m a disabled Veteran, Retired Air Force NCO, VA employee and I know DAMN WELL thousands of us in MOST of the 170+VA hospitals go home every night knowing well we did everything we could to take care of the Veterans we served. And we’ll do it again tomorrow, and the day after, and the day after that…. and y’all will go back to your Superbowl or Game of Thrones or WWF Wrestling and bitch about the next Gov Agency that is run by morons… but when it comes to kicking them out, you’ll just re-elect another Politician who will turn more people into men like any of us… now joined by more and more women warriors as well… and nothing changes….

      • @ Ole’Wolf Thanks for your perspective. It’s good to hear what you had to say in light of the Phoenix thing.

    • Pretty exactly what I was thinking, but not in a sarcastic way. Yours was good, though. Right now it looks like there’s a severe issue with the VA and their “secret waiting lists”. Supposedly, the VA is now “investigating” that situation. If they do as good a job as the Administration’s Stooges did on the Benghazi or IRS Scandals, they’ll probably end-up blaming Kryn Miner’s Family for this tragedy.

      What’s ironically worse is that Kryn Miner probably taught the child he forced to commit Patricide how to shoot and defend the Family when he was absent overseas. This event hurts no mater what angle you view it from. My sympathies to the entire Family.

      • For the record, I posted this before Ole’Wolf made his post, and I might have moderated this post slightly had I read his first.

        • Your points are valid as far as I’m concerned…people already are pointing fingers up here in the northland… and the anti-gunners are starting up the “report the mentally ill so their guns will be taken and this wouldn’t have happened” stuff which is about as disgusting as it gets.

          I can tell you the VA OIG Criminal Division was in my hospital, building, office over the last few days digging through everything and it was more like a proctology exam without anything to dull the pain than anything I’ve experienced getting inspected or doing inspections over the last 48 years… then again, we expected it after hearing about Phoenix. The people who pay me have the right to demand to see that I do my job…just wish they held more feet to the fire when they do find something. Way too much Union and OPM rules come out sometimes.

          For the record, the electronic medical record system in the VA Is called VistA/CPRS… and you CANNOT actually delete anything from the records. Oh it’ll come off the screen for that record, but it always stays in the system with the necessary identifiers. Can’t tell you if this was by design or something somebody “forgot” to add to the computer code… but I sure as heck know it works that way. VA OIG digs in the Phoenix generated records and they’ll find a paper trail…

          BTW, Our supervision told us the top 4 at Phoenix were placed on leave last week… leave as in “Terminal Leave” for those of us in the military…. he rest of you get he idea. Hey, at least it’s a start…

        • Thanks for the further information Ole’Wolf. I have to say the comparison to a proctology exam was very funny. I am not a Vet, I fully believe our Vets deserve all the best we can provide, and I really hope these investigations end-up insuring we are providing the best possible care to all Veterans.
          I get the part about not holding “feet to the fire” when wrong-doing is discovered. The Bureaucracy in this country sorely needs real Accountability at all levels.
          I had heard that the VA’s computer system does not really delete records, which may turn-out to be a good thing.
          Thanks, again,for your comments. It’s good to know that Veterans take care of their brother and sister Veterans. It’s always best when you’re getting help from someone who has walked a mile in your shoes.
          Thanks for your Service to our Country and to your fellow Vets. All Best to you!

      • Let me share that the sarcasm was verging on tears of rage. My frustration is somewhat ameliorated by the counter-argument of Ole’Wolf, which I was relieved to read. However, the lethal problems with the VA have been documented for years.

        I truly hope Ole’Wolf is speaking from comprehensive situational awareness, and is not being mislead by administrators as to the total picture. It would be appropriate for Vermont to be a breath of fresh air, so to speak.

        • great unknown, I get the “sarcasm verging on tears of rage”. When I heard the story about the Vets in Phoenix who died while waiting for an appointment and the “secret list” cover-up, I was both stunned and outraged, too. My source was Sean Hannity on Fox News, who features a week long report on the Phoenix issue of the “secret lists”. Hannity is now reporting, as Ole’Wolf said, that three people in Phoenix have been put on “Administrative Leave until further notice”, Eric Shenseki (VA Secretary) has been subpoenaed by Congress. One Phoenix Vet is now getting a back surgery he desperately needed and a second is getting some unspecified treatment he needed. Both were on the “secret list”.

          I was aware there had been issues in the VA, both with Benefits and Health Care, but thought it was kind of sporadic. Wrong about that, I guess. Better informed now thanks to Ole’Wolf.

          I think Ole’Wolf has a good handle on what’s going on in the VA Hospital he works at. It’s about time SOMETHING got fixed that comes out of Washington D.C., and if it is Veteran’s Benefits and Health Care that’s first up, that seems eminently fair and good to me.

        • Great Unknown- I gotta admit my point of view is “tactical: at best- but one underlying business practice appears to rage through out the VA and I have traveled to afew and work daily with opposite numbers at about 15…we all get SERIOUS pressure to get the numbers, meet the standard, look good… what we used to call “all show and no go shit.” Lower level supervisors want to grow up to be senior supervisors but get none of the leadership and management training we got in the Military. No “train your replacement here.” So they get promoted from within, often sooner that they really should but HR ends end up the 17th choice and the last one with ANY experience at all… and they are now in charge. In the military we had a very strong, sometimes ingrained and glacial support structure. You go from a base in one place to another 3000 miles away and the signs are the same, the titles are the same, the files are the same set up… and the regulation tells you the standard to meet. At somepoint an ARTEP or ORI (done lots of both) comes in and ses if you do what your supposed to.

          In the VA there is NO ONE making the leadership do things remotely the same as the next VA down the road…sometimes just a few miles down the road. Yesterday I had to mail a paper copy of a Vet’s records to another VA an hour and a half away… and I had to call my opposite number to find out what his “mail code” in the hospital was because we don’t even have that standardized. That may seen trivial but when this lack of organization and standardization is endemic through-out the system. The training, job descriptions, organizational structure. duties and responsibilities, pay, everything differs between the hospitals. How can we be timely, efficient, and customer oriented as a health care SYSTEM when we can’t even do it inside our own hospitals. Roping Down- you and I have likely met if you come down here and as they said in the movie we probably ain’t some of the same dirt… you’re pretty much dead on in what you’re saying…The real pisser is, at the very bottom of it all the Vet and next in line the Vet’s family have to go active and ask for and force getting help… I can only help so much no mattter how hard I or any of us try or even want to.

  4. One of my wife’s longtime friends was murdered by her husband (also a troubled vet), as were her 2 children (one unborn) and their dogs, back in 2010. It is very sad.

    • Such sad events happen, but they also happen in families in which the husband is not a vet.

      Do we say, when there is a family tragedy, “the perpetrator had gone to college” or “this is yet another perpetrator who formerly worked at MacDonalds one summer”? No.

    • Me too. And I don’t think it’s too cute that the guy pulled a gun on his family more than a year previously, but the family failed to report it. This guy had anger issues. He also apparently didn’t cope with alcohol very well. Is this the face of PTSD? Drinking and bullying your family? Or is PTSD the face of refusing to accept your life and actions, family responsibilities and responsibility for your own habits and therapy?

      One of my RVN days comrades ended up running a division of the VA during Carmona’s years as SG. What were the major problems of vets? What filled the hospitals and clinics? According to him, eating too much and drinking too much. (Anyone who knows differently, feel free to say so….). Diabetes and other chronic illnesses flowing from obesity and drinking.

      I’m trying to come to terms with the reality of American wars and soldiers (I was one). Senior leaders have repeatedly shown by their actions, or said, that they did not serve because they did not “believe we should be in Vietnam.” Clinton, Bush, Cheney, et al. Fine. So everyone gets to choose now, and it is actually their duty to choose, and everyone knows it. Yes? So if people volunteer for a war they should accept war is explosively, bloodily brutal, and not act surprised. I wasn’t. It was horrible, but my job was to be a good soldier, and my right is to look back and mourn my lost comrades but be proud that I survived it and fought well, and didn’t turn to booze or drugs to put a haze over the memories.

      Why is the new reality not honestly accepted? Why do people sign up and then act like they didn’t know what they were in for? Why do we tolerate, for that matter, inducing young men to sign up for combat duty for such low pay and bad treatment? It is no longer patriotic to volunteer for war. Clinton, Bush, and Cheney established that. All the rest is bull. Let Blankfein’s and Dimon’s kids fight the wars, since the wars are about money. Ah, got it, they don’t need the work.

  5. I’m not military. ? Will the military take care of this guy’s family economically now?

    • No more than anyone else. They should have medical care covered until the kids are of age or Mom remarries, may have some income depending on his previous decisions, but as a matter of course, they are in exactly the same place they would have been if he’d gotten run over by a Mac truck on the way to work.

  6. This story really isn’t so much a gun issue as it is symptom of a CRITICAL issue facing this nation. One that’s not even being talked about in the press. And that’s the fact the this government has used up some of the best of us and simply tossing them out like broken toys. Fighting an endless ‘war’ that’s leaving poor bastards like Kryn Miner little more than a shattered shell of a man.

    I don’t know if anyone caught a news story from a week or three back about how the VA just let a bunch of soldiers DIE while waiting treatment. And that’s just the stuff that hits the proverbial air waves. I can only imagine how many of these languish while trying to get looked after. Hell, I’ve got a relative that’s a retired vet and thanks to the current occupant of the White House’s 5 year plan he’s lost a great deal of his medial coverage. He now has to pay for his coverage or drive three hours round trip to get treatment. To add insult to injury the bastard they sent him to was a complete HACK.

    This has GOT to stop.

  7. This is extremely sad. A man fights for his country and when he can’t or won’t fight any more and his country can’t use him, he’s tossed away like a used tissue.

    • Miner was apparently still active in the VT NG. He hadn’t been deployed out of Vermont in more than 3.5 years. Though he was assigned to a VT NG Infantry Regiment HQ company, he had an Intel MOS, not Infantry. He was eligible to retire from the Guard five years ago, by his own account. If his traumatic head injury was severe he could have gone out with a CW2’s medical disability pension, but chose not to. He obviously liked being in the Guard, and chose to continue. I suspect it was his own civilian life he found traumatic.

      Sounds to me like a combination of mid-life depression, unhappy family life, and alcohol got to him. I’ll follow this until more information comes out. He’d threatened his family with a gun a bit over a year ago. They didn’t report it until a week ago, after the shooting. They didn’t insist that he put his guns away for a few years, or stop drinking, “choose one.” Another “failure to take sh_t seriously” event. They just keep coming. Dysfunction, thy name is Family.

      What he did to his teenager, throwing him the .380, asking him “so you want to play, too?” (since he rushed into the room…) and then going for his 9mm, was hideous. It isn’t the military’s fault, and it isn’t something a person has to do because they’ve been in combat. It’s something they do because they hate their life and feel sorry for themselves…and drink when drinking does not cheer them up.

      Booze really is like fire, offering beauty, warmth and light under some circumstances, but depression and death in others. If a person hates their life, it’s a bad idea to reflect on the fact while drinking. I’ll wait and see, but I think the guy functioned well enough during his last tour. I would guess his problems were at home, that he despised his family life and local work life, resented the mundane existence of routine life.

      “Teal said Miner started CrossFit Burlington’s obstacle race training club, and he was certified as both a CrossFit endurance coach and a Spartan Race SGX training coach.”

      Opinionated, ain’t I?!

  8. Having met the man on a few occasions he was a really nice guy and definitely had his head on straight. Not sure what transpired that night, but he is missed by those who knew him. A tragedy for sure.

  9. yep the sad fact is as a piece of goverment property you are disposable. by the time you figure it out its too late and the next batch gets sucked in

    • Whoa! Where the hell did that come from? There is not even a suggestion that he was “discarded” in any way, we’re working with an assumption that his problems were not detected as they should have been. I concealed some problems during my own career, in the attempt to continue doing what I loved, that does not mean he was crazy and should be arrested, nor that there was any lying, cheating, and stealing going on.

  10. War is, indeed, hell. Colatteral damage can, and often does, extend well beyond the battlefield. My heart aches for all involved.

  11. VSN, you do realize that not all veterans or active duty members have PTSD or as severe a case as the father did in this story right?

    • I’m not saying that all vets come out of the service screwed up, but too many of the ones that do aren’t getting the treatment (be it physical or mental) that they need. Anyone remember the whole Walter Reed debacle from a few years ago?

  12. It was a good ending, yes, but infinitely more tragic than triumphant for the younger child that had to kill his own flesh and blood to protect hearth and home.

    He or she is probably going to need some kind of treatment just as much as their father did. But, years, from now they’ll be able to take solace in the fact that they ultimately made the right decision given the circumstances.

    I’m not going to get into the whole thing about the military (mis)treats its people, and the recent wars they fought were for naught. Other people have covered that quite thoroughly.

    • Brings up yet another point. Is some form of the gubt going to be paying for the therapy for this family? Not just the shooter but Mom, brothers, sisters, ALL have been damaged by this, who pays for the treatment?

  13. “So why wasn’t Miner hospitalized? Perhaps even institutionalized?”

    Do you want to ‘institutionalize’ everyone who might get violent? I’ve heard that kind of logic before.

    Sometimes it is difficult or impossible to tell when someone is going to snap like this.

      • Miner apparently functioned well during his last tour, which was more than 3.5 years ago. He pursued working with the Lone Survivor outfit, and was an endurance race trainer and runner. I think his miseries were local, and know drinking was a repeated problem.

        I don’t understand the grounds on which people comment that the military threw him away. That simply isn’t the case. He was still active in the VT NG. I believe it is incidental that he was military. I think what he didn’t like or cope with was being a civilian. That’s not rare. One life is exciting, the other…not so much unless you build an interesting life.

      • And it’s only been in the lat year at most DoD in general really accepted that TBIs are REAL combat injuries…. hard to get Docs to do anything if the system itsellf doesn’t support their treatment plan.

      • I would add that it is only in the last few years that schools and parents have started to recognize that school sports often enough leave kids with traumatic brain injuries. It still is the case that most progressives (and many non-progressives) think a fist fight is better than presenting a gun to end the confrontation, not realizing that a punch or two to the head can lower IQ and mental clarity for life. Only recently have studies shown that more than half of all prison inmates previously suffered traumatic brain injury. When I mention any of that to most people, it’s clear they’d rather be watching Monday Night Football, in which people accrue traumatic brain injury.

        • Well, yeah, but! As a normal kid, in the ’60s, I punched a few noses, blackened some eyes, and got mine in return. Assuming that caused big sh!t is an open door for control of our lives like we cannot even fathom. Normal life has to be exempt from second guessing by an overreaching government. Outlaw HS sports? OK, fine, just try!

        • Larry, the extent of cognition deficits causes by a single serious concussion were not measured or appreciated until the last decade. Yes, we could be rowdy in blissful ignorance in the sixties. Now, like Adam after eating fruit from the tree of knowledge of good and evil, we need to account for the fact. Soccer headers are now known to know 10 to 15 IQ points off a serious player’s ability. One serious football concussion followed by a second blow to the head too soon does worse.

          There are sports that do not lead to frequent serious injury to the brain. Tennis, volleyball, golf, running, track-and-field generally, weight lifting, lacrosse, take your pick. A sport that frequently dumbs down a student is a bad thing, despite the glorious moments. I haven’t even mentioned the blown knees.

          Are the public school boards supposed to pick up the tab for the ongoing physical and mental problems that flow from HS sports injuries? “Nah, only the military is supposed to pay for traumatic head injuries…” I don’t follow the logic. Opinion is on your side, though, no doubt, especially in Texas.

  14. Terrible.
    From professional experience, childhood trauma always leads to substance abuse and later emotional disturbances. If you’re in this family’s area, please give them support when appropriate. If you’re not, please pray for them.

    And yes, another example of why mental health is THE issue that neither side is stepping up to address.

  15. Unless we know his medications — we can’t be sure if his treatment contributed as much to the situation as his injuries and experiences.

    Mental health TREATMENT is THE issue. Read psychoactive drug/SSRI warnings….

  16. If you have ever experienced “VA mental Heath treatment” you would know that appointments are months apart and that all they do is shove pills down your throat rather than treating the symptoms with counseling. My condolences

    • Derek- it depends WAY too much on the hospital. We get accused of that here- but as a numbers cruncher, we’re a teaching hospital and the younger “new” Docs tend to lean on meds far too much. If it happens to you (or any Vet- go get he Patient Advocate to get you a new older Doc- I did)

    • Not always. They were anxious to enlist me in “Agent Orange” tests and exams, the doc involved would make time for me whenever I could manage it, and explained quite freely that their funding depended on finding poor, defenseless victims, real or imagined. Unfortunately, I could not muster the indignation, since I did not feel any effects. That 20 years ago, now there are new challenges, justification is now easy.

      PS I am convinced that “Agent Orange” funding is outright theft of billions from us suckers.

  17. I see part of the problem being people who join the military for the wrong reasons. Many now join just to get their schooling paid for or to get out of a bad neighborhood. Problem is these people are not really prepared for what they might have to do for the military. The military will ask you to do things that may haunt you the rest of your life. Getting a free education is not worth my mental well being. The military needs to do more to make sure it gets the right people to join. Fix the front problem on the front end, not wait until the damage is done.

    • The military can only represent the people it defends. About 75 percent of young Americans between the ages of 17 to 24 do not qualify for the military because of failure to graduate [from high school], criminal records or physical problems, most of which is due to personal choices. It’s a societal issue, not just military one.

    • How is that the wrong reasons? You describe someone who knows nothing and has no future, seeking one chance. Where else will it ever be found? You have a different path to success? OF COURSE you should take it, in the military you might DIE! But if no one else will even consider sending you to college? Go for it!

  18. Thats the problem plenty of people messes up after ww2 but they could watch video of the camps and the evil and deal with it as a cost of fighting evil.since then not a lot of morally certain actions just fighting for the company.

    • There’s great truth in that regarding PTSD. I think it is necessary to believe that your enemy is evil and a threat to your homeland, or (as in ancient times) believe the fight for loot and land is worth it, as depicted in the Illiad or the Old Testament.

      The guys that seem to get psychologically clobbered are the ones that never come to terms with their fighting and its justification, or who fall into substance abuse rather confronting head on the moments that recur in their nightmares. The guys who start to blame the war for everything from stubbed toes to mouthing off at clients or bosses….those are the guys who sink the quickest. In my anecdotal experience.

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