Why Is This One Different? Question of the Day

Adam Lanza's mother's AR15 (courtesy nydailynews.com)

When the Newtown spree killer mowed down 20 children six and seven year olds and six adults, the call for federal gun control reached a fever pitch. It was thwarted in the final furlong by lovers of firearms freedom, galvanized into action by the legislative threat to firearms freedom. This time, after the Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School slaughter . . .

we have a Republican-controlled House and Senate and a Republican in the White House. And yet we’re seeing momentum for expanding [unconstitutional] background checks, raising the minimum age for a long gun purchase and Presidential support for due-process-denying “gun violence restraining orders.”

At the same, firearms freedom restoration — in the form of The Hearing Protection Act and The Concealed Carry Reciprocity Act — are stuck in development hell.

What’s going on? What’s so different about this mass shooting aftermath as compared to the others that triggered former Second Amendment champions to Rubio to the forces of civilian disarmament?

Is it a cumulative effect: Vegas, Sutherland Springs, Parkland? Is it the mainstream media’s love fest with the ignorant teenagers demanding that the government curtail or eliminate their civil right to keep and bear arms? The fact that Donald Trump is our president?

You’d think the fact that the failure of multiple government agencies (including school authorities) to intercept the killer multiple times would make this spree killing less a focal point for gun control. But it sure doesn’t seem that way.

Are we losing ground here? if so, why now?


  1. avatar John in TX (Was CT) says:

    Easiest place to lay blame would be on Trump, who really has no firm principles other than “I’m the best, so I will fix it”.

    They see Trump reversing his own, already made, decisions because someone lobbied him via Fox & Friends and similar things, and think “If we can saturate the airwaves with anti-2A content, Trump will bend”. Unsurprisingly, a number of less-principled Republicans are bending along with him.

    1. avatar kevin says:

      Because all Democrats hate Trump. And many undeclared voters hate Trump. And a lot of Republicans hate Trump. Anything to get to Trump. I wonder if Trump is going to be a net loss for gun rights, in the end?

    2. avatar Five says:

      The Top four anti-gun groups out spend the NRA by 4 to 1 in lobbying funds.
      The media is rabidly anti-gun, and they have learned from their previous failures. They are now using the same SJW tactics to targeted gun-rights supporters. The anti-gun groups reactionary media campaigns are pre-scripted waiting for an event. They have the legislation waiting to be introduced. Basically they spend a lot of time prepping these national media-legistative pushes and are just waiting for a spree killer to pulled the trigger for them to also pull the trigger.

      Hitting all fronts at once during the height of the emotional impact of the tragedy is the tactic and they are constantly refining it and backing it with more funds.

      It also doesn’t help that Republicans are at their best as obstructionists, once they are in the driver’s seat, they get the “gotta do something” itist. I guess they’re afraid they’ll lose the next election if they don’t do something. But being the stupid party, they’ve failed to realize “doing something” will lose them the next election.

      1. avatar Keith says:

        Send in those donations to the NRA! I just sent my check!

      2. avatar Ing says:

        Most Republican politicians are actually weak-kneed socialists. In their hearts, they’re convinced that the advancing tide of socialism is inexorable. To them, conservatism is merely a way to salvage a few crumbs and gently accustom their constituents to the inevitable loss.

        1. avatar California Richard says:

          Yep, +1 totally. We’ve known this since Bush Jr’s 2nd term: that the Republicans are cowards, scared to weild power, and terrified of whining liberals. Its why they lost the congress after one voting cycle in 2006, lost the presidency in 2008, and why the independent conservative revolution took off shortly there after; they don’t represent us….. Trump was never one of us either, but he sure did piss off them liberals, which I guess is a step in the right direction.

        2. avatar SparkyInWI says:

          ^^^ This is spot on. We have no real friends in Congress or the WH. They all would prefer a disarmed and compliant population.

    3. avatar doesky2 says:

      “Unsurprisingly, a number of less-principled Republicans are bending along with him.”

      Republicans are bending because they are willing to sacrifice the 2ndA to help bring down Trump.

  2. avatar Shire-man says:

    Its a focal point for Trump Derangement Syndrome. That’s all. The vast majority of the noise makers don’t care one bit about the guns or gun control. They just want revenge for 2016 any way they can get it.

    1. avatar Joatmon says:

      I’m inclined to agree with this.
      When Trump won, the left went absolutely ape shit. You had people crying, screaming in the air and talking about impending doom. Then you had antifa. They started small riots, burned stuff and so on. You don’t hear to much of them now.
      So they’re going after the one thing that hits home with ALOT of people. Guns.
      This is revenge that they couldn’t get anywhere else.
      If anything happens with gun bans, confiscation or otherwise, the hard left will feel it too.

    2. avatar AndyinMA says:

      I’m inclined to agree. And my bigger fear is that Trump screws up enough to let the Radical left Dems take over in 2020. And I think they will be great at revenge.

    3. avatar Stereodude says:

      This right here. A TDS focal point.

    4. avatar John in TX (Was CT) says:

      I’ve been convinced for a while that this is true for 75% of Democrats who support gun control. (And, there are presumably cases of this on the Republican side as well).

      “Republicans are against gun control + Republicans are always wrong = Gun control is needed”

      Good article by Kevin Williamson in the National Review today about how this has been the left’s modus operandi for a while, with which the right is (sadly) starting to conform: https://www.nationalreview.com/2018/02/republican-party-enemies-list-model-not-a-philosophy/

      1. avatar doesky2 says:

        Williamson is a stupid cuck who very rarely stubles upon a nut like a blind squirrel. He still thinks the conventional fighting methods of the Republicans works (Hey, just look at all the ways that Republicans have maintained the American culture over the last 40+ years!).

        Jesus, KW is still making excuses for Bill Kristol.
        KW, is beyond gone.

        1. avatar Matt in FL says:

          Am I the only one who almost immediately discounts anything else someone has to say as soon as they use the word “cuck” to describe another, to the point of not even reading the rest of the comment?

          It’s not that I’m offended by it, it’s that the accepted definition has, in almost every circumstance it’s used on this site, nothing whatsoever to do with anything aside from making the commenter feel superior.

          Actually, now that I think about it, this site is the only place I see people use it, basically ever.

          Maybe that’s a sign I need to get out more.

          In any case, for me, cuck == move along, nothing of value to see here.

          Yes, I know you don’t care.

        2. avatar Geoff PR says:

          I got to that point about a year ago, Matt.

          I burned out fast and hard to it…

  3. avatar Keith says:

    The cell phone videos of the gun being fired with the smoke entering the classroom was to many uninitiated to the use of guns stunning. I know because my wife is anti gun while I own guns to include a short barreled 5.56 and an ACR and shoot 3 gun. My wife won’t touch a gun so when she saw and heard that rifle being fired her first response was that it was a machine gun! The noise was something she had never heard so that was overwhelming and then she turned her anger on me asking a rhetorical question to the effect that I own that machine gun whose only purpose is mass murder. Social media also initially showed the bodies in the hallway. That is the difference here!!

    1. avatar doesky2 says:

      What kind of reply were you expecting?

      Would be hard not to be contemptuous of the stupid b****. Well I hope the p**** is good.

      1. avatar IdahoBoy says:

        With an attitude like that, I’d be surprised if you’re getting any.

        Lots of people stay together for lots of reasons. People don’t always have to agree on everything to get along.

    2. avatar Phil says:

      Not the only one in the same boat… I don’t understand the reason that being without gun in the face of evil will be safer then with… Maybe its the continued “empirical fallacy” that home with a gun is more likely to be injured by the gun, Is any more relevant that owning a car makes you more likely to be injured by the car… But how many times a day do you hear the same lie repeated and repeated, because we all know the socialist mantra “Tell a lie often enough and it will become the truth” Just don’t know how facts will ever be more effective then standing on the still warm bodies and screaming about the weapon used over the criminal that inflected the pain & grief. Mom’s against drunk drivers went after the drunk not the bottle. Maybe we need a Mom’s against Spree Killers to go after the monster not the gun.

  4. avatar Leighton Cavendish says:

    And a vagina and penis are only for reproduction…right? LMAO
    Prosecute gun crimes with harsh penalties. Murder is already illegal.

  5. avatar barnbwt says:

    Well, maybe if we hadn’t nominated a candidate who expressed past support for these exact policies…

    I think Trump’s election simply tuckered-out the gun rights crowd; we’re ’emotionally drained’ after our greatest fear (Hillary) never came to pass

    2012: I WILL NOT COMPLY (‘member that guy?)
    2018: Well, bump stocks are just a toy, never mind there’s no distinction between them and every other semi-auto. Kids these days, maybe we should raise the legal age of purchase to 21 while allowing them to vote (antigun) on gun issues in complete ignorance in the mean time. I’m a firm believer in the second amendment, but we have to understand that if we don’t give a little, our REPUBLICAN House, Senate, President, and flippy-floppy SCOTUS will pass bans that make Obama look like a piker…

    Hell, maybe we *are* overdue for an serious existential threat to our liberties, something to get the tired, old, worthless former patriots of five years ago to get off their asses. Maybe gun rights are the most safe with a Democrat president, and Republican congress, after all. Somehow, they are never able to press the advantage while in power, and unwilling to mount a defense against gun control unless it’s the majority oppositions’ idea.

    1. avatar binder says:

      “Well, bump stocks are just a toy, never mind there’s no distinction between them and every other semi-auto.” Keep telling yourself that. Jerry Miculek can’t keep up with one. You can do a 100 round dump into a crowd in 12 seconds. The Vegas shooter did 3 in his opening barrage, scoring over a 40% hit ratio. All told he shot 420 people. The only reason the death toll was not higher is he did not shot continuously (And he had the guns and magazine to get off 4 times the rounds he did) and the range was so far that the rounds with the energy of a hot .380. Those are the facts.

      The other fact is that the bump sock were originally classified as a machine gun, but they took out a spring and substituted the shooter putting forward pressure on the firearm. The bump stock can be easily converted back to that configuration, so it should have never gotten past the AFT to start with. Best part is it works even better than the original configuration that was a machine gun.

      1. avatar ACP_arms says:

        Hold on now, machine guns tend to have higher rates of fire then a semi-auto. But it’s not rate of fire makes a machine gun a machine gun.

        1. avatar binder says:

          I know that, but it is the rate of fire that got them banned. Also does not get around tha original configuration being classified as one, and the facts that it can be converted back nor that the actual effectiveness has actually been actually been improved. (the old version you had to have the spring dialed in for the recoil of the gun)

      2. avatar bastiches says:

        I haven’t seen the FBI report on the incident.

        Where did you find it?

      3. avatar no name 1298 says:

        youtube bump firing without a stock and find out banning bumpstocks wont do a darn thing.

    2. avatar Big Bill says:

      ” I’m a firm believer in the second amendment, but we have to understand that if we don’t give a little, our REPUBLICAN House, Senate, President, and flippy-floppy SCOTUS will pass bans that make Obama look like a piker…”

      If we don’t give a little? Where have you been? We keep losing ground, and you want to give more? How is that being a “firm believer in the second amendment”?
      Sorry, either you’re a troll, or willfully ignorant.

      1. avatar Green Mtn. Boy says:

        @ Big Bill

        Look just where talking/discussion/a conversation/capitulating has taken the second amendment since 1934,I think not.

        1. avatar SparkyInWI says:

          Will add something here. If the liberals applied the same fervor and logic they have for the other Amendments to the 2nd Amendment then they would be arguing not only is there a right to guns but they want to force everyone to buy a gun. That is the great hypocrisy here.

      2. avatar Patrick says:

        I believe Barnbwt was summarizing what other people are saying, not actually saying it himself.

  6. avatar uncommon_sense says:

    I believe it is a cumulative effect — along the lines of “fool me four times shame on me, fool me five times shame on you (firearm owners)”.

    Spree killers have used AR-15 rifles in at least five attacks now since Newtown, Connecticut. This last one might the “straw that broke the camel’s back”.

    1. avatar C.S. says:

      Despite the fact that they were used, if you honestly think that banning the ar15 would actually reduce mass shootings any, then your pen name is well explained.

      1. avatar C.S. says:

        And I deeply apologize.

    2. avatar tjlarson2k says:

      These murderers also used cars, cellphones, computers, water, electricity, the internet, tv, and breathed air.

      Which of those are we banning as well?

      1. avatar Ed Schrade says:

        Ban Uber, he caught a ride to the school with Uber so if there was no Uber then there would have been no school shooting. also ban gasoline which was used to propel the Uber vehicle. Let’s not forget to ban the tires that the Uber vehicle used to get to it’s destination. Then there is the compressed air or nitrogen that was used to inflate the tires. Now , what shoes did the murderer wear when carrying out his killing spree ? Liberal mindset ! Lets ban liberals as insane and dangerous to our society.

    3. avatar uncommon_sense says:

      C.S. and TJLarson2k,

      I oppose all bans.

      Some people are claiming that disarmament forces are somehow more widespread than before and I am simply stating a possible explanation if that is true.

    4. avatar Big Bill says:

      We actually have a history of bans, an “assault weapon” ban included.
      They don’t work. History reveals that to those willing to crack a book.
      Even the “assault weapon” ban was described by the DOJ (and they ought to know) as ineffective in reducing crime.
      Of course, there was Obama who explained those failures by saying we just didn’t do it enough.

  7. avatar Brian says:

    I had been wondering the same thing. My only guess is that we pro gun folks don’t feel the need to mobilize or be heard because there is a feeling we are supported by the house and President. My first thought after hearing about the tragedy was how thankful I was for the current political makeup of the government unlike the structure during the time of Sandy hook when regulation seemed more imminent. I am starting to think I was misguided in my thoughts.

  8. avatar ATFAgentBob says:

    The difference is, with this one there are videos posted of the event actually happening. People can see the still flowing blood running down the tile floors, they can see the gunman actually pulling the trigger, and they can hear the wounded and dying crying out. The previous shootings were Call of Duty this is Ramadan in Fallujah.

    1. avatar Sparty says:

      They hate Trump, fear midterms, this one is very real vs at least 2 that were murky at best, AND the FISA and Dossier revelations were front and center, so amping this one to the max helps put Russiagate in the backseat.

      My money is on Trump. Until he craters the guy has a gift for head fakes like the end result of DACA. Remember everyone went apeshit over his “I’ll sign any bill” wrt amnesty yet here we are and the Dems are the ones in trouble on that one.

  9. avatar Jim Bullock says:

    Battlespace prep for 2018 elections. “Energizing” “the base”, or as a well-known community organizer said, getting people all wee-wee’d up. Never let a crisis go to waste, as someone who worked for him said. (This is good “governance” we have been told.)

    The move is to judo them. It needs to be “Not Hillary II.” Use every thing they do to incite their base to illustrate: this is why we can’t let them win anything.

    Nobody likes the R’s. But somehow, the D’s have managed to make themselves worse.

    In case it’s unclear … as of today Sen Diane Feinstein (yeah, that one) was not “liberal” enough to get the Cali D-party endorsement for her run. Indeed, she came in second. That’s Diane, “If I could, I’d take away everybody’s guns.” Feinstein.

    Unless you want Sheriff Lion there with unlimited authoritah, n federal cover, backed by s ceeching hordes and Springer-lite ringmasters … these people can’t be allowed to be in charge of anything.

  10. Can any please help me:
    Is James Yeager still on YouTube somewhere? Please send me a link. I want to see if he is still suckling off the United Nation’s Director Michael Bloomberg’s NRA teat (((?))) Much appreciated!

    YouTube Banning Gun Channels – I’ve Disabled MAC for a short time.

    1. avatar strych9 says:

      No. Yeager was banned for making specific threats against people. He hit YouTube’s 3-strikes rule (three threats) and was banned for life. He’s done. As he should be. (I don’t really care about the threats, Yeager should have been banned years ago just for being Yeager. He’s a jackass and no friend to the 2A community.)

      1. Mac of the MiitaryArms Channel said he opened a new account starting from scratch in this video. Wanted to check out if he is still supporting the backstabbing NRA?
        They are a Bloomberg/Rockefeller/Rothschild/Warburg/Oppenheimer (((Controlled Opposition))) just like the 10% Approval Rating Congress and no one says anything about… It’s probably more like .10%, you know the fudge everything.

        1. avatar strych9 says:

          Theoretically Yeager isn’t allowed to have any channel under any name for any reason. Nor is he allowed to show his likeness on YouTube. He is supposed to be absolutely banned from YouTube because of the multiple threats he made. From what I understand that ban also covers his company (Tactical Response) and any other companies he may create in the future.

          He might be able to make a new channel for a while but when YouTube figures out it’s his channel they’ll likely shut it down immediately. He is, supposedly, flat-the-fuck-out banned from YouTube. For life.

      2. avatar Andrew Faulkner says:

        Yeager has a new channel. He even uploaded most of his old content. Never have been a fan but he is back on there.

        1. avatar strych9 says:

          He must have reached some sort of agreement with YouTube. I can confirm via search that his old content is back up though.

          The ban he received was supposed to be for life and covered him, his company and any other company or entity he might create. Apparently YouTube took it pretty seriously when he started threatening to kill people.

          I wonder what he did to get back on YouTube. Whatever it was I bet it cost him a pretty penny.

      3. avatar Sian says:

        The deal is one or more strikes was removed, but not before they had “unrecoverably” deleted his account. So he’s not banned but his videos and followers of the old account are gone.

  11. avatar strych9 says:

    “And yet we’re seeing momentum for expanding…”

    Are we seeing this or does it just seem that way? Is it different or the same old nonsense again soon to die down like the others? My money is on the latter.

    I remember the panic after Newtown. A lot of people were SURE a new AWB was coming down soon. Obama was going to drop the ban hammer and do it hard. The 2A was done for. It was only a matter of time before we were all going to be lined up to turn in every gun we had or Civil War 2.0 was on.

    People were so, so, so sure. Yet none of it ever happened.

    1. avatar ACP_arms says:

      I”m on the same page as you. It’s not that the things being brought up don’t need to be put down, they do, it’s just aren’t going to go anywhere. A bump stock ban, the definition of a machine gun would have to be changed to classify bump stocks as machine guns. That would mean reopening the NFA to make the changes needed. Which would mean suppressors could be removed, just as SBR’s and SBS’s could. Do the gun bigots/controllers really want to open that pandora’s box?

      1. avatar strych9 says:

        IMHO, they don’t.

        I also don’t see any sort of ATF ruling that changes anything. The basic reason being workload. Then there’s rewriting the NFA (a job for Congress) to avoid the inevitable lawsuit that simply issuing a letter would create.

        The ATF sent a letter to Congress last year asking that silencers be removed from the NFA because they’re not a danger and processing all the Form 4’s is too much work for the ATF. Were they to move on bump-stocks in any meaningful way that would mean that there would be literally thousands of other accessories that they would have to review (ones they currently don’t even bother with). Asking for silencers to be removed because they’re too much work and then adding thousands or tens of thousands of other items to their workload makes no sense and would backlog the ATF for decades.

        Congress sure isn’t going to move on gun control. They might make some noise but it’s the same as the D’s in any other year. It’s a “we tried” CYA. Actually doing anything in either direction is too risky. D’s have at least seven but maybe as many as as 10 Senate seats they could easily lose over actual gun control and R’s would get completely slaughtered if they moved on it.

        I suspect we’ll hear a lot of huffing, puffing and gnashing of teeth as well as wails of sorrow but ultimately nothing will get done because the political will in the actual populace just isn’t there.

        1. avatar ACP_arms says:

          The ATF sent a letter to Congress last year asking that silencers be removed from the NFA

          Man, I missed that one. Wow.

        2. avatar strych9 says:

          Yeah, there was also a “white paper” from the #2 at the ATF with a bunch of other proposals for restructuring a lot of gun laws that the ATF has to deal with like destructive devices… well fuck it, here:


      2. avatar binder says:

        Even Slide-Fire admits that the gun’s recoil is used to reset the trigger, so if a single action of the trigger is pulling it and then releasing it, only half of that action is preformed by the operator. Also the bump stock can be easily converted back to the configuration that was ordinary classified as a machine guns, so the easily converted back rule applies like open bolt guns.

        1. avatar ACP_arms says:

          I’m going to keep saying it, a bump stock does not make a AR a machine gun. The definition of a machine gun doesn’t say jack on how you get the second function as long it takes two functions of the trigger to fire round number two it is a semi-auto.

        2. avatar Binder says:

          And I going to keep saying it is just as effective as one when used properly. Thanks tot the MCR upper it is just as effective as a SAW. It was the effectiveness at mowing down people that got them put on the NFA in the first place. So when someone says that it effectively turns the AR into one you really can’t argue. Also using energy that is not the shooter to operate the trigger is really pushing the definition of not a machine gun.

        3. avatar ACP_arms says:

          “using energy that is not the shooter to operate the trigger is really pushing the definition of not a machine gun.”

          No it does not.

          Bump stocks aren’t using a “loop hole” in the NFA for machine guns, they are using the technicality of what a machine gun is.

          Your argument is the same as the argument that says my AR is a “assault weapon” or “assault rifle”. Just because it looks and sounds like one doesn’t mean it is one.

    2. avatar rosignol says:

      Yeah, and I suspect one of the big reasons it didn’t happen is because Harry Reid blocked it.

      He had a B-rating from the NRA, and thought keeping it would make it easier to get re-elected. He didn’t turn on the NRA until after he decided to retire, and by that point, Feinstein’s AWB2 was legislatively dead.

  12. avatar W says:

    This one is different due to organization. There are already organized leftist movements out there–Women’s March, anti Trump movements, etc. They exist, are energized due to HRC’s loss/ Trump’s victory, and will use this event as a new rallying cry.

    At Sandy Hook, Democrats could have had something. Republicans were willing to compromise. But Schumer walked away from the table. Schumer made that choice. He did so because he said he wanted universal background checks but really wanted federal registration.

  13. avatar TexTed says:

    It’s different because the little person (all of us) now believes that he/she can make a difference. It’s the result of the #METOO phenomenon. With twittering, individuals sank the biggest titan of Hollywood. They now believe that with twittering, they can sink the NRA.

    And it’s working. Look at the rash of companies that have just severed ties with the NRA.

    This time is different. You folks NEED to be writing to your congressmen and demanding implementation of the Trump plans. Otherwise all we’re going to get is going to be bans and lost rights, and the next school shooting will happen, just like clockwork.

  14. avatar Joe R. says:

    This one has chased out into the light all the wet sh_t POS rino MFs that have to be voted out.

    1. avatar Indiana Tom says:

      Yeah, many of the RINOs have been flushed out during Trump’s election and reign, this latest round of shootings will flush them out even more. Before, the RINOs could blame the Dummycraps, now the Republicans are in control so the RINOs are stepping up about pro gun control.

  15. avatar Jay in one town over from Parkland says:

    What if it had been a 10-22??
    Would people with no knowledge of guns be just as jazzed as they are against the AR15??
    Kids are kids. They think they have individual thoughts on every subject and things in general.
    We know the don’t. We all were kids once.
    They follow the crowd. Right now its running on pure emotion and none the facts.
    The Libitards never let a mass killing go to waste.
    They scream we need more gun control. While never providing a single solution that might help stop the next and we all know there will be a next time.
    Anything they scream about will only effect the already law abiding gun owners.
    They aren’t interested in helping anyone but themselves.
    We know what they want is People Control and more power……………..

  16. avatar AlfromMA says:

    Easy, it’s the kids speaking out. You wanna win a political fight these days, you need a sympathic group of people (vulnerable children are best) to be the face of it. 80% of the county wants a solution for the dreamers, even though statistically a lot of those people voted for Trump. It’s hard to say no when you put a human face on the issue.

    What we need to do is the same thing. Show people why we need the 2nd Amendment in human terms. We all know people are alive today because the had a gun. Guns stop robberies, rapes and murders. Show those people.

    1. avatar Toni says:

      maybe also find a way to show in american terms what happened in russia after they were disarmed. that if done right would really scare people away from the onslaught against the 2A especially if it also showed other countries that went through the same. show a photo of a family and then several of them facing pits full of bodies with an officer about to execute them and the body falling in the pit

  17. avatar Jeremy says:

    I can’t be the only one that thinks that *this* time there is a well concerted, prepared, and coordinated effort to roll back 2a advances and to permanently silence some of our most effective voices.

    I’m not talking about a tinfoil hat Infowars conspiracy to pay actors…It just seems like the other side got frustrated, evaluated their past failures, and were ready with more aggressive and effective tactics and better funding than before.

    They’ve already managed to cripple the NRA brand image, even though the NRA is small potatoes in terms of actual dollars spent and is largely funded through citizen membership. And they’ve made this the biggest issue in the media even though the number of children killed in school shootings (and even one would be tragic) absolutely pale in comparison to the number killed by drunk driving, suicide, opiates, and any number of other causes. Causes, by the way, that spend two more decimal points on lobbying each year and don’t have grassroots membership.

    Many people in my community work in healthcare and wonder how long it will take for someone in the media to figure out that medical errors kill 250,000 – 400,000 people each year. There will guillotines in the streets…

    1. avatar ATFAgentBob says:

      Good points but I have to respectfully disagree on one in particular. They didn’t cripple the NRA brand image, the NRA crippled the NRA’s brand image. When they started caving on bump stock bans when they didn’t really turn up the heat and start putting the screws to politicians over the reciprocity and hearing protection bills, they started losing credibility. Eight years we watched them go toe to toe with Obama no matter the odds over every gun law he proposed we started to think well maybe the NRA has a spine after all, maybe just maybe this ain’t the same group that sold us out in the 80s and 90s. We get a friendly Congress and a friendly president and all the sudden every single gun issue freakin stalls… Where’s the NRA? Nowhere that’s where they’re totally silent on the stalled issues instead they’re busy trying to compromise on bump stocks, selling us up the river again just to give the antis a pound of flesh so they can try to pass stuff we really want. When your team is winning you don’t start giving the other team the ball more often.

      1. avatar binder says:

        Bump stocks scarred them. There are belt fed uppers with quick change barrels. And bump stocks work surprising well with a biped. Combined you have a 8 pound gun that can fire continuous aimed fire at over 500 rounds per minute. Vegas itself could have been much worse even with the guns the shooter was using. He had 10 AR-15 set up with bump stocks and 100 round surefire magazines. He could and did 100 round mag dumps in 12 seconds. He could have easily gotten off 4000 rounds instead of the 1000 rounds he did. He still managed to score 420 hits. The range was the biggest mitigating factor on the death toll as most of the energy had bead off the rounds

        1. avatar BigDaveinVT says:

          “…bump stocks work surprising well with a biped.” That one made me laugh.

    2. avatar Garrison Hall says:

      ” . . .They’ve already managed to cripple the NRA brand image . . .”

      Balderdash! “They” haen’t done anything close to crippling the NRA brand image. The progressive left has always hated the NRA and that is where the rancor is coming from. Actually what’s happening is similar to every other gun-control effort. These are always well organized and very predictable in how they play out. What’s happening now is no different from any “gun” crisis in the past 30 or more years.

      What really happens in these instanced is that the NRA’s brand is actually dramatically enhanced by the gun-control movement’s activities. After Sandy Hook, the NRA’s membership expanded exponentially and we saw a profoundly influential growth in gun sales. After Sandy Hook America began to arm itself.

      1. avatar Ardent says:

        ^ Pretty much this. The NRA ‘brand’ is as intact as ever. . . from the outside. To the left, it is still a monolithic power block, as impermeable and effective as ever. They do not scream at powerless things that are on their way out, they scream at things that are right there in their faces preventing them from doing what they’d like.

        From the inside, there are enough quislings and nay sayers just in this thread to make ones heart ache. Do not allow perfection to be the enemy of good. The NRA is still our best hope.

        Much of the rest of this demonstrates such uni-dimensional, short sighted thought that the debate takes on almost surrealist proportions. Trump has yet to sell us out, nor has the NRA hurt us. There are political realities being mapped and played out at levels, judging from the commentary here, beyond the abilities of some (many?) to even contemplate, let alone understand.

        Why is this one different? It isn’t, not in any meaningful way. Take a deep breath. Children and leftists (I’m aware that I repeat myself) are poor at maintaining focus on anything for very long, and those with no skin in the game fall out first and fastest. This wave will crest and ebb without anything of substance having occurred.

        In the meantime, consider that what is said publicly, for mass consumption, and what actually goes on in the halls of power are two different (sometimes unrecognizably so) things. How is it that so many, here especially, can be so cynical when it’s the other side paying lip service and yet so naïve when our side is doing the same?

        The next scandal or tragedy will provide the cover for ‘our team’ to accomplish our goals in the shadows, don’t ask them to fight in the light, it mitigates their effect, and sullies them for future operations.

        The media presents a skewed view of. . . well, everything. Why is it that we understand this sometimes and others reject it wholly?
        The real result of these types of tragedies is that more Americans arm up. Every single mass shooting results in an increasing number of guns and gun owners. While there are plenty, new to the fold, who will continue to give lip service to the antis. . . many will be with us at the polls, no matter their rhetoric, as they quietly vote for their own newly important rights.

        The change really began 30 years ago, it continues apace. No mass shooting, no waving of the bloody shirt, and no amount of gnashing and moaning will change it. Americans want to be armed. Our national reaction, separately and communally is to fight. To fight well requires the right weapons, and we are buying them at record breaking numbers.

        Has it been lost that in the middle of a long, deep recession, Americans kept setting new records for gun purchases? If these are all already gun owners, why buy so many in the face of lowered income and financial security? It’s a farce. The reality is that we are adding numbers (silent, or outspoken for the enemy as they may be). It is this fact, this ever expanding, burgeoning wave of new gun owners, among women, among minorities and especially among the youth that make any set back temporary and major setback unlikely. Weirdly enough, we are winning the culture war. . . don’t attack our allies now simply because you can’t fathom the machinations or understand the game.

  18. avatar rc says:

    The left (along with their MSM propaganda machine), have been learning how to exploit these tragedies for maximum effect to demolish the 2nd amendment with each event. One lesson they’ve finally perfected is to have an all out propaganda push queued up and ready to go, before any facts that counter their narrative enter into the public conscience (as they usually seem to do). Hence the speed and manner, with which the ‘Town Hall’ was thrown together. They get an enormous momentum shift of public opinion that way, before the fact that this was actually a massive failure of the state becomes apparent. They can force knee-jerk actions and take huge chunks of our rights before we can even react. I’ve been observing them get faster and faster out of the gate and ahead of the facts for the past year. They’ve gotten very good at this technique, very fast.

    1. I noticed Fox News and the Republicans not putting up much of even, a scrape in my opinion. Remember the “Lock Her Up!!!’ BS and other things? That was a joke on US. Just like Trump is gonna sign away for more of (((their))) control over US.
      Please stop lying to yourselves…. It looks really bad.

      1. avatar Steve in TX says:

        Your website… well… it looks pretty bad… Do people actually fall for your conspiracies. They aren’t even written intelligently.

        1. Steve in TX says:
          February 25, 2018 at 18:32
          Your website… well… it looks pretty bad… Do people actually fall for your conspiracies. They aren’t even written intelligently.

          Yeah, I went through the U.S. Public School System too, you? I suggest you homeschool or private school your children. I would not let my child anywhere near any of these Public Schools. They are way too dangerous to their learning abilities. I want them to be able to have independent thoughts and ideas; not an “INDOCTRINATION”.
          *Steve, what conspiracy did you see that you don’t believe is true or you don’t believe in conspiracies have ever existed?
          Question: How do “We” allow a 10% Approval Rating Congress and no one says anything about it … It’s probably more like .10% approval, you know the fudge everything. Any answers to that fellow American (((?)))
          Do you have any tips on writing more intelligently, I try not to be too wordy in my blog post. Any other suggestions on improving my site? I am always open to new ideas…, not like most people I meet.

          Lastly my motto and suggestion to everyone:
          “The Quest for truth begins here.”
          “Listen to everyone, read everything, believe nothing unless
          you can prove it in your own research. .and not even me”
          – William Milton Cooper Killed Nov. 6, 2001

          God Bless America!…, because we need it!
          “SUPPORT OUR TROOPS!” Bring them home; they are not our wars.

        2. Steve in TX –
          Steve, I update my last Blog Post, please take a look at it and if you could tell me what you think?

          Veterans and the VA Today 02-25-2018: The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, Fifth Edition (DSM-5) – Not following the Government Narrative; yes that is in there too. “The VA Pharmaceutical Lobotomy Treatment Plan”

          Department of Homeland Security
          (U//FOUO) Rightwing Extremism:
          Current Economic and Political
          Climate Fueling Resurgence in
          Radicalization and Recruitment

  19. avatar GeorgefromAlaska says:

    I and a lot of my friends are getting older. My three sons and my daughter all shoot and own handguns for protection… they are grown and are all working or finishing college. The younger kids today, the mommys boys and girls dressed up as ANTIFA, the children walking out of school protesting “gun violence”, the parents who are being swayed by their children and the weak Comgress are all contributing to a laissez faire attitude by some former strong second amendment firearms rights fighters.
    I know people who didn’t write to ATF regarding their opinion of bump stocks. More and more shooters I know at the range could care less about owning machine guns because of the price, there are some serious long distance shooters that could care less about binary triggers, SBR’s, and whatever the hell the Reformation is.
    I feel those of us who are die hards may not carry the weight we used to and/or our friends in power are not as ferocious and united as we hoped they would all be. No 50 state reciprocaty, no HPA act… nothing real in the first 100 days… hell, they couldn’t even repeal Obamacare..
    I guess I will continue to write letters and send e-mails and make phone calls but I also have acquired the hunting firearms and other guns I have wanted for self protection or sport. I own several Class 3 firearms to include machine guns, suppressors and SBR’s that I have acquired over the years and yes I had to work very hard and take extra jobs to buy what I wanted. I have bought enough ammunition for hunting and range use to last me forever. I just don’t want to see another run on everything firearms and reloading like after Sandy Hook.
    I have no idea where we are headed.

  20. avatar aircooled says:

    Also, we are taking about a swing state with 29 electoral votes. Every Politician with national aspiration is tripping over themselves to pander to whatever they believe will win them Floridia.

  21. avatar HP says:

    It’s different because the left had been saving many of these tactics for the right time. They needed a mass casualty school shooting to really push the issue home. With Las Vegas, the victims were at a country music concert, and while it’s possible, the smart money says the majority of people gunned down there didn’t pull the lever for Hillary. The Texas church shooting targeted Christians – most leftists probably had a hard time concealing their joy over that one. This school shooting was exactly what they wanted. I guarantee you the idea of trotting out children and organizing student rallies in favor of gun control had been cooking for months before this massacre occurred. It was the same with Andrew Cuomo’s SAFE Act – the legislation had been drafted long before Sandy Hook. The progressives just wanted the political headwinds that a massacre of children can give. So now they can sardonically come at us with nonsense like “If you oppose gun control, you are in favor of dead children” and similar incendiary attacks.

  22. avatar NH Guy says:

    Yes, we are losing ground.

    Our side bickers amongst ourselves while their side acts with singleminded purpose. Their side gets almost unlimited cash from the likes of Soros and Bloomberg. They are well organized and have the entire mass media machine behind them to propagandize for gun control. Our side is vilified and marginalized. Now, major corporations are jumping on the bandwagon to spit in our eye and equate us with mass murderers.

    1. avatar bfitz76239 says:

      This right here. Our side is so fractured it’s no wonder we’re going to lose the culture war.

      1. avatar CarlosT says:

        Everybody believes their side is fractured and the opposition is unified. It’s because you’re there for the fights on your side and not for the fights on the other side.

        I guarantee you some leftist site out there has just posted this exact exchange about the NRA.

  23. avatar Raven says:

    The main change I see is the ‘depth'(?) of the emotion the lefties are using to inspire the non-reactive & fence sitters (including corporations, banks, etc.). Up until now the adults have led with their ‘for the children’ campaigns. This time somebody got the brainfart of having the children themselves do the campaigning. So they prime the MSM, select and coach the kids toward the agenda they want to push. Then they just follow the same methodology – I can’t hear your logical response because I’m too busy ranting about my emotionally charged attempts to control you.

    ‘Depth’ may not be the right word, but in my view they are sinking lower into their controlling, liberty crushing cess pool minds to try manipulating those who have so far been spectators.

  24. avatar Jeff says:

    The current problem is you’ve already got a lot of liberals mobilized. The #Resist people with #Not My President people, the AntiFAs, MoveOn.org, etc. were already mobilized against the current administration. This just gave them fodder to feed on. The liberals were already mobilized and this gave them a “Righteous” cause.

  25. avatar former water walker says:

    Loud obnoxious teenage “victims”. All the apparatus was set-up after Trumps shocking win. Those traumatized Newtown 6 year old’s weren’t articulate. If Trump eff’s up I’ll gladly route for PENCE.

    1. avatar Indiana Tom says:

      Loud obnoxious teenage “victims”. = Hitler Youth.

  26. avatar Joe Brown says:

    The greatest threat to our liberties is a unified government with either party controlling all 3 branches… Politicians are politicians no matter the team they play for, so it’s better to have them fighting each other than accomplishing anything. That is the genius of our Constitutional government, it slows things down…

    1. Your about the only guy here seeing what is actually going on. (((CONTROLLED OPPOSITION))) It’s all a SHOW to make us believe we have a choice.
      Scot Peterson is a “Scapegoat” excuse for more Military Israeli Tactics Training of our U.S. Police Forces.
      – My 3 cents.
      Research SWAT ENTRY TACTICS and Remember (((4))) minutes before Peterson’s “supposed” entry.
      *It takes normal SWAT Units that long to pull up their pants, take out the wrinkles out of their pressed fatigues, put on the shades and look cool for the cameras. Look it up! I ain’t making iot up!
      “To Serve and Protect” It’s hard to find it on their vehicles anymore.
      – Another 3 cents, no charge

  27. avatar sound awake says:

    its the midterms

    lefties always lose their minds the most during the midterms

    only this time theyre alienating the independents like never before

    trump is at 50 percent approval rating and climbing

    theres 100,000,000 of us

    300,000,000 guns

    more ammo than you can shake a stick at




    most of the military and law enforcement are on our side

    hillary lost A RIGGED ELECTION

    the democrat party is done

    they just dont know it yet


    everythings going to be just fine…

  28. avatar Gun Free School Zones are a crime against humanity says:

    Same old shit.

  29. avatar ZF says:

    The conservative and liberty minded folks in this country really need to realize that we are under attack (and not just the 2nd Amendment)…and we are (and have been for a long time) losing…little by little, inch by inch, day after day. The lefties (for lack of a better specific term) run the schools, the media, the tech companies, as well as many others and have vast influence. We also need to stop thinking of “Republicans” and “liberty minded conservatives” as one-in-the-same…some of these “conservative” politicians are simply RINO’s. Just because the R’s have won the recent elections does not mean “freedom & liberty” are on the rise. How is this country going to look 10-20 years from now when these brainwashed, indoctrinated kids are older (and constitute a much larger percentage of the voting population), not to mention the morons that already exist. Liberty minded folks will be the overwhelming minority. Heck…if the Dem party weren’t so corrupt Bernie Sanders would probably have been the nominee in the last election…and just might have won. We argue logic and reason (for the most part)…they argue emotion and agenda (for the most part). It has also been made abundantly clear over the past 15+ years (if not much longer) that many of our elected representatives (and not just Democrats) really don’t give a shit about The Constitution or the rule of law.

    Old Chinese saying: “If you do not change direction you will end up where you are headed”. I’m assuming most (if not all) of you can see where we are headed. We need to stop being reactive and start being proactive. (Just to be clear…I am referring to peaceful, lawful acts ONLY). Make no mistake, at some point a line WILL need to be drawn…the only question is where that line is and will you draw it before it’s too late to properly defend it? The biggest enemy We The People (all of us…red or blue, black or white, straight or gay, man or woman, etc) face is not some far away boogieman…it is right here at home, and we are infested with it no differently than house that has termites or cockroaches. We either deal with it, or it will deal with us.

  30. avatar Craig in IA says:

    We haven’t really lost anything yet, and won’t if some of our ace gun people around here will get off this site, go shave and put on some clean clothes and go out in an up-beat and civilized manner among the general public and stand up for yourselves rather than blame Trump(!!!) or a raft of other ridiculous theories. I accept no blame, I didn’t ignore the 39 cop calls to Cruz’s residence, I didn’t ignore the several specific warnings to the FBI concerning him, nor the other red flags that are still emerging as I write. I also don’t support Gun-Free Zones, I didn’t hunker behind my squad cars waiting for backup while my Coral Springs brothers finally arrived and went inside, I didn’t fail to enter info into NICS and there’s no way I feel any need to apologize to anyone for the deliberate actions of Cruz and non-actions of authorities, local, county, state and federal.

    Get out there and spread the real word to those who need to hear it- quit griping around this place, it does no good other than to let some people vent or puff themselves up. One of the things we certainly should capitalize on here is what we did following Columbine- this act had so many red flags shown to the authorities and Cruz was so obviously nuts that most people outside of NRA’s benefit business alliance can see it should have never happened and that it was government that failed, not some loophole in firearms ownership. And there are a hell of a lot of people out there that’d love to hear that from us if we can present it in an honest, non-threatening manner that doesn’t promote the left’s notion that all gun folk are crazies. Stand up for yourselves!

    1. avatar RidgeRunner says:

      Really good points, Craig, and pretty much aligned with what I’ve been saying. The antis are zeroed in on the NRA, well, the NRA didn’t shoot anybody. I didn’t shoot anybody, you didn’t shoot anybody, these kids were shot by their PEER. Why don’t they look at each other? What’s wrong with THEM? Another thing: all we’ve heard since 9-11 and every tragedy since, “see something, say something,” well, how about when someone “sees something” and then “says something,” the people preaching this mantra DO something? I get that these kids are pissed, they did what they have been told to do, they knew their peer was a nutbag, and when they made note of that, the “authorities” let them down. They lost all credibility. THAT’S where the fingers should be pointing. Incompetency of the highest order. Yet, it’s the NRA’s fault?

  31. avatar ATFAgentBob says:

    add another rhino to the fires of gun control: Condie Rice is comin out saying ban the AR 15.


    1. avatar Green Mtn. Boy says:

      @ ATFAgentBob

      Never had her pegged as a conservative ,being running buddies of the Bushes is similar as being running buddies of the Clintons.

      1. avatar ATFAgentBob says:

        you may just have a point there, and it ain’t on yonder mountain peak….
        She might just be the political equivalent of a bi cheerleader you tried to date back in high school. She occasionally says girls are hot (conservative buzzwords) yet you’ve only ever seen her date and kiss guys (vote for liberal policies).

    2. avatar ZF says:

      What a douche…she makes no sense at all…two of her statements are at complete odds with each other…“We can’t throw away the Second Amendment and keep the First.” and “I don’t understand why civilians need to have access to military weapons. We wouldn’t say you can go out and buy a tank.”

      First, CONdoleezza…the only threat to the 1st Amendment that would necessitate relying on the 2nd Amendment would be in literally standing up to and fighting the government…and IF that is the case then we sure as hell will need military weapons. Second, you don’t see why civilians need to have access to military weapons? the answer to that is in your other statement. Also, the AR-15 is NOT a military weapon…they use M4’s. The military also uses semi-auto pistols and scoped bolt-action rifles…does that mean we need to ban those too? And another thing…which clearly shows what your feelings are regarding the relationship between the gov’t and it’s citizens…”We wouldn’t say you can go out and buy a tank”…a) we’re not trying to buy tanks, b) if we wanted to buy tanks we really should be able to anyhow, and c) our rights are not bestowed upon us by government…we have bestowed upon the government the obligation to protect our unalienable rights…not to give us permission to use those rights.

      She also threw in the “I believe in the 2nd Amendment BUT”

    3. avatar Indiana Tom says:

      add another rhino to the fires of gun control: Condie Rice is comin out saying ban the AR 15.

      No surprise here. Bush family is about like the Clintons.

      1. avatar Keith says:

        …and to those of us that already own the gun what then after they ban the ability to buy in the future? Confiscation? Hell No!!

  32. avatar Green Mtn. Boy says:

    My question is who does the president think will vote for him if he should choose to run for reelection,certainly not the ape shit left of either party,he will find himself a man without voters.

  33. avatar Tom Hartman says:

    more americans are realizing that all the liberal stereotypes about republicans are actually fact

    you don’t care about family values, y’all all voted for rapists like trump and roy moore
    you don’t care about small government since you want to inspect everyone entering public bathrooms to make sure they have the right private parts
    you don’t care about the deficit, since you blew it up to give wall street a big fat tax cut
    you don’t care about free speech, only when neo-nazis demand to speak on college campuses
    you don’t even care about blue lives. A police officer who failed to stop a mass shooting is a coward in your view.

    & you very clearly care more about your ability to have an AR-15 than you care about our kids.
    The right is already going after the Parkland survivors and calling them “crisis actors” and all sorts of vile things because the truth is that you hate everyone who isn’t exactly like you, and if we want to make america better we have to defeat you.

    1. avatar Rad Man says:

      What kills me is that you believe in your heart of hearts that battle rifle ownership and loving our kids are mutually exclusive. We’re much, much more prepared to care for and protect our children than you’ll ever be.

    2. avatar uncommon_sense says:

      you don’t care about family values, y’all all voted for rapists like trump and roy moore
      — No court tried much less convicted Trump or Moore for rape. Furthermore, most people that I know only voted for Trump or Moore because they were less of a threat to our families than their respective Democrat opponents.

      you don’t care about small government since you want to inspect everyone entering
      public bathrooms to make sure they have the right private parts
      — Cross dressers who “want” to be the opposite sex are mentally ill. Cross dressers who want to see the opposite sex in locker rooms and bathrooms are perverts. Yeah, I want a small government which actually has resources available to yank such people out of the wrong bathrooms.

      you don’t care about the deficit, since you blew it up to give wall street a big fat tax cut
      — I do care about the deficit which is why I am demanding that government eliminate entitlements.

      you don’t care about free speech, only when neo-nazis demand to speak on college campuses
      — This comment is so silly and inaccurate that it isn’t even worth a response.

      you don’t even care about blue lives. A police officer who failed to stop a mass shooting is a coward in your view.
      — Whether or not I care about blue lives does not change the fact that a deputy was indeed a coward and failed to carry out his sworn duty. You don’t give a pass to firearms owners who had absolutely nothing to do with this horrific, heinous attack. Firearms owners refuse to give a pass to the armed SCHOOL RESOURCE OFFICER WHO HAD EVERYTHING TO DO WITH THIS ATTACK.

      & you very clearly care more about your ability to have an AR-15 than you care about our kids.
      — I love my children enough to assert my right to have the most effective tools available to protect them from two-bit thugs, mafia enforcers, or even a foreign military.

      The right is already going after the Parkland survivors and calling them “crisis actors” and all sorts of vile things because the truth is that you hate everyone who isn’t exactly like you, and if we want to make america better we have to defeat you.

    3. avatar Gun Free School Zones are a crime against humanity says:

      Tom Hartman. Another fool covered in the blood of the innocent.

    4. avatar John in TX (Was CT) says:

      you don’t care about family values, y’all all voted for rapists like trump and roy moore – Didn’t vote for either (Didn’t vote for Hillary, for that matter, and was in Connecticut at the time where my vote didn’t matter, so I went third party)

      you don’t care about small government since you want to inspect everyone entering public bathrooms to make sure they have the right private parts- I’m actually on your side of this one. If a law cannot be constitutionally enforced, it should not be a law.

      you don’t care about the deficit, since you blew it up to give wall street a big fat tax cut- Deficits aren’t fixed by raising taxes, they’re fixed by cutting spending. Tax cuts just benefit the economy.

      you don’t care about free speech, only when neo-nazis demand to speak on college campuses- I care just as much about free speech for conservatives as I do for leftists on either side of the race question.

      you don’t even care about blue lives. A police officer who failed to stop a mass shooting is a coward in your view- The single police officer went against policy not confronting the shooter immediately. Where cowardice comes in is when you have not one, but four, deputies waiting outside the school, who 100% could have stopped the threat while children were still dying.

      & you very clearly care more about your ability to have an AR-15 than you care about our kids – Because, clearly, the “Murder is illegal” statute wasn’t enough to dissuade this jerk from murdering people.

    5. avatar Matt in FL says:

      you don’t even care about blue lives. A police officer who failed to stop a mass shooting is a coward in your view.

      He didn’t fail to stop a mass shooting. He failed to take any action whatsoever.

      Failing to stop it would be going in and exchanging fire and getting killed himself.
      Failing to stop it would be killing one shooter but leaving another alive to continue killing (if there were 2+).
      Failing to stop it would be fumbling the reload of his revolver and dropping all his ammo on the ground, and in the process losing sight of the shooter.
      Failing to stop it would be spending so much time in the parking lot getting kitted up that the shooter offed himself after achieving his objective.
      Failing to stop it would be going in, but not locating the shooter because the campus was large and labyrinthine.

      You see where I’m going. All of these examples of failing to stop it involved taking some action, be it useless or misguided.

      He didn’t fail to stop a mass shooting. He failed to take any action whatsoever.

      THAT is what makes him a coward.

      And for the record, none of this has anything to do with “caring about blue lives.”

  34. avatar DoomGuy says:

    Why is this one different?

    The CDIC was licking their chops and waiting, prepared to blitz the media.

  35. Scot Peterson is a “Scapegoat” excuse for more Military Israeli Tactics Training of our U.S. Police Forces.
    – My 3 cents.
    Research SWAT ENTRY TACTICS and Remember (((4))) minutes before Peterson’s “supposed” entry.
    *It takes normal SWAT Units that long to pull up their pants, take out the wrinkles out of their pressed fatigues, put on the shades and look cool for the cameras. Look it up! I ain’t making iot up!
    “To Serve and Protect” It’s hard to find it on their vehicles anymore.
    – Another 3 cents, no charge

  36. avatar DangerDave says:

    Trump is the reason. He’s not a Republican.

    1. avatar doesky2 says:

      I don’t care if Trump isn’t a republican as long as he does conservative things.

      The Heritage Foundation group lays out the argument that his 1st year is significanly more conservative than Reagan.


      But heck, what does the Heritage Foundation know? I’m sure DangerDave has a better grasp of things.

  37. avatar stateisevil says:

    Not sure, maybe because Trump is fake pro gun and so is the Florida Legislature and Governor combined with the additive effect of 1 or more of these every year. Unfortunately, the Florida GOP is going to pass a “gun control” package in the next week or 2 and that will give a lot of momentum to other states and at the federal level. Unfortunately, the people of the gun don’t care enough to stop it in Fl, mostly because as long as the member is Red, they don’t mind taking it up the butt. All of a sudden, my gun loving neighbors think it’s reasonable to ban bump stocks and deny civil rights to 18-20 year olds. The shootings won’t stop, so next time they’ll come for more. No relief in the courts so 20 years from now we’ll luck like the UK minus a complete handgun ban.

    1. avatar John in Ohio says:

      Yep. That’s a pretty good assessment.

    2. avatar SkippingDog says:

      Australia is the model.

      1. avatar Gun Free School Zones are a crime against humanity says:

        Yes it is. Of failure.

      2. avatar Scoutino says:

        If you crave rise in violent crime like Australia had after their gun confiscation.

        If you think someone dead set on killing bunch of innocents will change his mind and go for a walk in the park instead, because getting semi auto gun legally is “harder”.

        If you don’t mind starting a civil war, since Americans are not Australians.

  38. avatar Francis says:

    The anti-2A plan is to start with 18-20 year olds advocating/voting for the government to remove their own 2A rights. After these youngsters disarm themselves they are going to advocate/vote to disarm anyone 21 years of age or older. If the 21+ don’t comply with this plan the 18-20 year olds will willingly accept a government draft and issue of government arms to go after and kill anyone who still supports the constitution. Make no mistake, this is how these anti constitutionalists think and behave. The anti-2A 18-20 year olds are too soft minded to see that they are playing into the hands of the tyrannical-type government leaders.

  39. avatar Ralph says:

    All I know for sure is that if the lunatic left succeeds in taking down the NRA, we’re done. Finis.

    And in the war against the NRA, the left is looking at the POTG who have turned on the NRA and laughing at the useful idiots who have no idea that they’re being played by Soros, Bloomberg and the rest of that crowd.

    1. avatar Indiana Tom says:

      And in the war against the NRA, the left is looking at the POTG who have turned on the NRA and laughing at the useful idiots who have no idea that they’re being played by Soros, Bloomberg and the rest of that crowd.
      This is why they are always pushing the AR assault rifle ban. The Fudds will not care as they have their double barrel shotguns and they are happy.

      1. avatar RidgeRunner says:

        Crying about “Fudds” turns people off who might otherwise be helpful. I, like many, became interested in guns through hunting. The “double barrel” and aught six opened up a whole new world, and this site has some of the highest level of dialog and compelling perspective of any site I visit. Convincing arguments are made here, by smart people. Then here comes some guy with the same sort of judgmental asshattery that the left uses against us bitter clingers. We need all the allies we can get, now and for the next incidents, turning off people who could be open their mind is just stupid. someone passing through, wanting to read reviews or whatever, their attention is captured, then sees this comment and thinks, “screw these guys, they’re a bunch of mall-ninja wanna-be operator conspiracy theory whack job” and it’s on to Grandview Outdoors. There are ways to broaden perspectives without calling people Fudds. The general level of intelligence on this site is better than Fudd-calling. Instead, make your case why someone should care beyond their hunting weapons. If they’ve got a gun, they are not a lost cause.

    2. avatar John in Ohio says:

      The NRA shot itself in the foot… repeatedly. Don’t try blaming the NRA’s failures upon those of us that understand the difference between the right to keep and bear arms and a government privilege to keep and bear arms.

      When you support infringement, you are supporting gun control.

      The NRA, you, or anyone else who supports gun control can keep your worthless privileges. We will fight for the actual right to keep and bear arms. The privilege is worthless whereas the right is everything.

  40. avatar Joe says:

    You forgot to mention the coming bump stock ban.

    The reason that all of this is moving forward is because the NRA has given its blessing. After Newtown, the NRA said he’ll no. No they are signaling that they won’t fight any of the above gun control measures.

    The NRA is proving to be the slippery slope that they warned us about.

    1. avatar Tt78 says:

      I think bump stocks are prohibited under existing law – is the operator technically actuating the trigger for each round fire or just keeping their finger stationary?

      1. avatar ACP_arms says:

        It is the former.

        Machine gun definition – “(b) Machine gun. The term ‘machine gun’ means any weapon which shoots, is designed to shoot, or can be readily restored to shoot, automatically more than one shot, without manual reloading, by a single function of the trigger. The term shall also include the frame or receiver of any such weapon, any part designed and intended solely and exclusively, or combination of parts designed and intended, for use in converting a weapon into a machine gun, and any combination of parts from which a machine gun can be assembled if such parts are in the possession or under the control of a person. “

        Page nine in the PDF – https://www.atf.gov/file/58141/download

        If your gun can only fire one round for each trigger pull, which is one function of the trigger, two functions if you want to fire again (releasing the trigger to fire again) the bump stock doesn’t change that. Using a bump stock is no different then bump firing with you belt loop.

        Page nine in the PDF – https://www.atf.gov/file/58141/download

        1. avatar CarlosT says:

          Or bump firing with just your finger. One bullet is fired with each pull of the trigger, period. The stock simply makes a technique easier, that’s it.

        2. avatar ACP_arms says:


      2. avatar TroutsBane says:

        It’s not about a piece of plastic it’s about semi-automatics. If devices that facilitate bump fire are added to the list of NFA items, then owning a semi-auto with something as simple as a rubber band could fall under constructive possession charges.

    2. avatar Sprocket says:

      Right… without the NRA position on bump stocks I’m sure the lefties would be raffling off AR-15s to raise funds for the shooting victims. I have differences with the NRA in numerous areas, but anyone who wants to burn it down over some white trash noise makers needs their head examined.

      1. avatar Scoutino says:

        Practicality of bump stocks has nothing to do with the underlying problem. Instead of holding the line and calmly saying “no more infringements”, the NRA showed willingness to yield. Crack in the dike. Blood in the water.

  41. avatar Tt78 says:

    GOP trying not to give dems any momentum or rallying cry for midterms this year but this will have the opposite effect – it will suppress their base. I think Trump is playing the dems but Gov Walker has no excuse.

  42. avatar Unrepentent Libertarian says:

    why is this time different? Probably because the gun control folks have been brainstorming the reason that they lost the last round. With preplanned arguments, use of children for propaganda purposes and media accompaniment they are snowballing the opposition.

    1. avatar Indiana Tom says:

      They now have the Hitler Youth.

  43. avatar John in Ohio says:


    “My son and I were discussing it this morning and are considering the opposite. You have the left hating Trump and liberty. You have POTG bitterly split on Trump. Hillary and the DNC helped get Trump elected. Liberals are super galvanized and conservatives are fragmented. Those who are vehemently supporting Trump are convinced there is not much to worry about. Trump does not really understand inalienable individual rights or why the distinction is so damned important to a free society. We *think* that it might be the perfect storm against liberty.”

    “BTW: Your framework requires incremental restoration of the exercise of the individual RKBA. We don’t subscribe to that model. Indeed, we believe that true exercise of individual rights rarely get properly restored incrementally. That’s probably why your speculation and our speculation are so different.”

    1. avatar John in Ohio says:

      RKBA absolutism is the only cure. Full restoration of the exercise of unalienable individual right to keep and bear arms will never happen incrementally. Individuals will lose in the long game.

      Once we concede that “shall not be infringed” doesn’t mean what is written, we have lost and it is only a matter of generations.

      1. avatar SkippingDog says:

        RKBA absolutism is what has led to where we are now.

        1. avatar Steve in TX says:

          Opposing incrementalism in legislation leads to nowhere. A+ ratings and speaker posistions to fudds that refuse to bring bills up for vote along with “I support the 2nd but” mentality has also.

        2. avatar John in Ohio says:

          “RKBA absolutism is what has led to where we are now.”

          Since near the beginning, all we’ve seen is incrementalism. That has gotten the exercise of the right nowhere. Just like the failed communist/socialist attempts… How long must we endure these failed attempts until we call the idea failed? This nation wasn’t founded on incrementalism. Incrementalism almost always favors government. RKBA absolutism is what got the Second Amendment written in the first place!

          I guarantee you this: if RKBA absolutism was the resounding response of the people at every attempt at gun control, infringements would be no more.

  44. avatar Chip in Florida says:

    What’s different this time?

    The gun-grabbing crowd has a trifecta…

    Emotional appeal because this could have been YOUR kids!

    Media control because this event is already ten days old and is still ‘above the fold.’

    And emotional manipulation because you can’t argue with their point of view because look at them, their just kids! Why do you hate the kids? Why do you want them to get killed?

    Remember…. They only seem like a majority, being the loudest doesn’t necessarily mean you’re the biggest.

  45. avatar Seizure doc says:

    All of society is moving towards socialism. We are losing. Could any of us imagined the fuss over transgender bathrooms 30 years ago ?
    The Texas sniper in 1963 was slowed greatly by people on campus who got rifles out of their cars and fired back, forcing him to slow his rate of fire. In how many states would those guys be law breakers today ?

    We can must write in a language which sows among the masses hate, revulsion, and scorn for those who disagree with us.
    VI Lennin

    Look at the reaction to this shooting. The NRA is being attacked as if they were with the shooter encouraging him and even reloading for him. Donald Trump is also being blamed as he is for everything. Guns are of course the real culprit. The ones in my safe have not yet shot anyone but it is only a matter of time.

    Watch the midterm elections this year. If Republicans are trashed in spite of the economy, the tax cut, the improved border security, the reduction(not elimination) of Isis and improved overall mood of the country then we will know that Trump is only a speed bump on the way to communism. Whether or not he bans bump stocks or calls for arming of teachers, raising the age you can buy a rifle or anything else we may agree or disagree with is irrelevant.

    1. avatar RidgeRunner says:

      Seizure Doc—I respectfully disagree, to a point. I think pushback on things like the bathroom issue you cite, against identity politics and political correctness in general, had a LOT to do with Trump winning the election. There are a lot of people making noise right now, but there are more people just watching, biding their time, and you won’t hear from them until the left makes a move, and at the ballot box.

  46. avatar Ed Rogers says:

    Unfortunately, foolish, short sighted citizens manipulated inexperienced youth. That usually gets airtime.

    We need to get a handle on mental health problems, as well as enforcing existing laws. Gun bans will solve NOTHING.

    1. avatar John in Ohio says:

      “as well as enforcing existing laws.”

      So, gun control is the solution after all?

  47. avatar John in Ohio says:

    Re: Youth mobilization and general frenzy

    The Salem Witch Trials?

    There is nothing new under the Sun.

  48. avatar Dale Gribble says:

    The leftists and RINOs, but then I repeat myself, need to be voted out.

  49. avatar Steve says:

    What has changed is the rise of the internet lynch mob. But attention spans are short. These lynch mobs have a shelf life of about 2 weeks. Think Cecil the lion.
    What has not changed is that our rights are under attack and we need to once again fight back and win. Donate to the NRA. Join the NRA. Upgrade your membership. Write to Trump. Write your legislators. Vote.
    The greatest danger we faced in 2018 was complacency. The media has done us a favor by showing us what the stakes are and awakening the sleeping giant.
    That’s us.

    1. avatar RidgeRunner says:

      The upcoming “march” next month prolongs this whole hue and cry, and they could build a helluva lot of momentum between now and then.

  50. avatar neiowa says:

    Because 17yr old kids are better able to “organize” (agitate) that before??

    OR perhaps, the progs had the ‘warplans” in the file, funding in the bank and the MSM on speed dial just WAITING for a “senseless tragedy” to exploit.

  51. avatar SkippingDog says:

    There’s nothing stronger than an idea whose time has come. That’s what is happening now.

    1. avatar ‘liljoe says:

      Arming teachers?

      I agree

    2. avatar RidgeRunner says:

      True, the end of gun free zones is nigh.

  52. avatar Bikerbob says:

    Other than AR 15 know what else all these school shootings have in common? Most all were done by the students themselves or recent grads of. Looks like a generation problem. Bullies, bullied, loners, broken homes, pushed away by their peers, ignored by all. So much hate.

    1. avatar doesky2 says:

      All these young shooters are a product of an educational system in hammerlock control by the Left.

      The Left destroys everthing that it touches and boy has it been feeling up the educational system for the past 40+ years.

      The Left took 20-30 years to acquire that lock surreptiously while the conservatives weren’t looking. Even if the Right magically recognized the threat just imagine how long it will take to wrest control back from the Left when they know that we’re trying to do that. It would take 3-4 generations in the most optimistic scenario. Face it, we’re screwed.

      n reality the educational system is lost. The only viable solution is create an entire parallel system.

  53. avatar Aaron M. Walker says:

    Thank all the Globalists…One-🌎 world Global Governance is on the move…Next stop, the public burning of the US Constitutional-Bill of Rights and all its old world values…..No more AMERICA! Good luck with the new UN approved Citizens Handbook of Government Issued Privileges….

  54. Sen. Dianne Feinstein Fails to Receive California Democratic Party Endorsement
    Beth Baumann
    Posted: Feb 25, 2018 1:30 PM

  55. avatar IdahoBoy says:

    The Sandy Hook kids were too young to know how to take advantage of social media. The Florida kids know they have a voice. That’s the major difference.

    1. avatar Justsomeguy says:

      It’s not that simple. Somebody is arranging and paying for the busses. someone is coordinating who gets the invite to the interview or the town hall. Someone is providing funding and structure. That isn’t the kids doing. Getting on social media would be them, but this is much bigger and more organized- professionally organized than just some Instagram posts.

      1. avatar RidgeRunner says:

        Agree, no way it’s “the kids.”

  56. avatar Kyle in Upstate NY says:

    If we were suffering repeated attacks from Muslims in the form of bombings and truck attacks, 20 dead here, 60 dead there, etc…does anyone really think anybody would be demanding restrictions on the rights of Muslims or rights in general? Of course not. Similarly, the right to keep and bear arms is just as sacrosanct. Blaming gun rights people for mass shootings would be like blaming people who are against restrictions on things like due process, right to remain silent, right to privacy, freedom of religion, freedom of speech, etc…for repeated non-gun terrorist attacks. As a side note, let’s also remember that three of the recent mass shootings have been done by terrorists (Fort Hood, San Bernardino, Orlando nightclub).

  57. avatar Matthew the Oilman says:

    The two people Trump listens two outside the media echo chamber are Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity , get through to them and make your points coherently. Do not sound like a nut.!!

    1. avatar Kyle in Upstate NY says:

      Just curious, but how do you know he listens to them? I know he likes Hannity a lot, and apparently Tucker Carlson as well.

  58. avatar Mad Max says:

    Actually, the Dems/Progs/Commies may have actually overplayed their hand on this one.

    In the end, this might finally get Elmer Fudd to vote in the midterms.

    In Pennsylvania last year, Elmer skipped the primaries which resulted in 5 Democrats getting elected to the State Supreme Court (by s very small margin with minimal turnout) Now that court had redrawn (possibly unconstitutionally) the congressional districts to benefit the Dems.

    Wake up Elmer, it’s time to vote!

    1. avatar Steve in TX says:

      Elmer Fudd is only going to get up to vote if it involves social security or medicaid. They think 2a protects hunting not liberty.

      1. avatar RidgeRunner says:

        Disagree, Elmer has been pissed off for a while now.

  59. avatar Palehorse says:

    Personally I don’t care who wants to ban what or why. At the end of the day if the .gov doesn’t want me to have it they’ll be forced to come take it. I say let em at it.

  60. avatar Jared says:

    Reminds people of Columbine. Yet the failed vote in the House and the election of GWB killed any movement. Remember 750,000 protested the NRA on May 14, 2000.


  61. avatar Hannibal says:

    It’s Trump. The Vegas shooting didn’t really work for them because it got turned onto a niche issue (bump stocks) and the victims were mainly conservative adults instead of photogenic high schoolers.

  62. avatar Mark Kelly's Diapered Drooling Ventriloquist's Dummy says:

    It’s different this time because the teacher’s union in Broward County is filled with NY/NJ Metro Area Commie transplants and the students belonging to the school’s theater/drama program, school’s TV news station, LGBTQ club, and social justice organization have had four (4) years to hone their message and practice their lines. I started searching Facebook the day of the shooting wanting to see what these virulent anti-gunners were about, most of these BloomBOIG stooges who have appeared on TV have scrubbed their pages, each was filled with hundreds of “social justice”, LGBTQ, pro-illegal alien, and anti-Trump posts, they are “professional” activists and unabashed members of “The Resistance”. We WILL defeat them.

  63. avatar Jim Bullock says:

    They’re screeching because it’s embarassing. They’re screeching because otherwise this mess demonstrates too clearly how much nothing they have. It’s distraction because that’s all they have.

    We screw up every time we let them move the “debate” to their turf, doubly so on this one. Kiflds on site doing what they could, saved lives. Programs n policies crippling what people can do for themselves, got people killed. How about empower people so they can do more good. It’s easy. Just stop, stopping them.

    All their gun laws, surveillance, admini-cops, gun-ban zones, official “resource” officers, draconian “safety” policies, and even Sheriff Lion, there, in a swing state they think they’ve been invading, and still some whack-job shot up a school.

    Their crap may do something, but keeping kids alive ain’t it.

    Meanwhile, unarmed kids — kids their policies kèpt unarmed — stepped up, while the myrmidons of authoritah huddled outside. (Almost like the point of these “resource officers” is ensuring nobody can protect themselves and their friends. Not, you know, protecting anybody.)

    They got shown up. (Again.) So, they can’t let it be about that. So, Guns! Guns! Guns!

    It’s worse than that. Literally every righteous policy and program made this worse. One more kid holding a door… how many more alive? One gun in the hands of any of those kids … how mqny more alive? That teacher who threw himself in the way … any better tool, how many more alive?

    We can’t (or won’t) keep the killers at bay, so let’s disarm victims more.

  64. avatar Jack Moore says:

    Whenever anything becomes the one news story that everyone is required to talk about, it is because the one party media is trying to distract you from some thing else. This time is is probably recent discoveries concerning the shocking level of corruption in the DNC and government in general.

  65. avatar achmed says:

    Honestly it is probably different because the media would rather talk less about the Russia investigation. Personally there should be an investigation, if somebody did collude with Russia in the campaign that’s a problem etc etc.

    But they’re indicting Manafort for lying to the FBI and being a scumbag. The fact that Manafort was a lying scumbag was known for 20 years. They indicted some Russians because (shocking news!) Russia has information operations. If this is the culmination of all that effort and noise then small wonder the media wants to focus on something else.

  66. avatar Ak47 shooter says:

    Anyone that’s arguing for gun control to solve mass shootings doesn’t really want to solve the problem.
    Unless you can be honest about what the problem is, you’ll never solve it.

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