“New York is probably the biggest violator of [the Firearm Owners Protection Act] as applied to persons declaring firearms for transport in checked baggage at airports. Second, no reason exists to believe that law-abiding gun owners will somehow not be law-abiding just because they are carrying in a state such as New Jersey.” – Stephen P. Holbrook in A Warrior For Our Rights Shrugs Off A Strange Attack [via americas1stfreedom.org]

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38 Responses to IMI Systems Quote of the Day: This is Why We Need National Reciprocity

  1. McFly……McFly! This is exactly why we don’t need national reciprocity. The 1986 Firearms Protection Act was already supposed to protect travellers in such scenarios. Yet, New York and other slave states continue to violate it with impunity.

    And what did firearms owners pay for this phony protection? Essentially, full auto firearms became illegal for private ownership, via an amendment that got slipped into the bill at the last minute. (They aren’t technically illegal, but only full autos in existence and registered at the time are legal. The registry is closed, so supply is frozen at 1986 levels, driving prices up and turning them into collector’s items. Other fees and ted tape make ownership difficult, even at exorbitant prices.)

    Do you seriously believe you’re going to get national reciprocity with no strings attached? What you’ll get is more phony freedom, down the road at best, in exchange for a concrete infringement of freedom in some form right from the start.

    Don’t believe me? Just look at Trump’s backpedaling on the Wall. It was supposed to be built immediately (and Mexico pay for it *snicker*). Now, the deal with the Devil, I mean, the Democrats, is amnesty up front, and maybe kinda sorta some kind of symbolic wall at an indeterminate point in the future.

    THAT’S the sort of “deals” Trump makes. He has no principles, no political agenda, and no core convictions. He just wants to play games and garner attention. He’ll pull the same stunt with any national reciprocity.

    No, he’s not as bad as Hillary. Yes, that was a completely irrelevant point back in the primaries when you nominated this assclown and had other viable options.

    I TOLD YA SO!

    • Whoa, the GCA was crap, totally, but this is a POS tyrannical satan’s blue house of (D) problem. The way you argue it you totally glaze over how F’d NY (NYC especially) and NJ are, and they are only the main points of interest now. We could say the same thing about OH, CA, WA, OR, ID, MA, MD, D.C.; and all the other POS blue bastions of F’d up (D).

      AND “GUNS” AIN’T THE ONLY PROBLEM WITH THEM.

      If you live in a blue state, you may be part of the problem.

      If you have a (D) after your name, are a POS: liberal, progressive, socialist, communist, globalist, or a rino

      THE PROBLEM IS PART-OF-YOU, YOU ARE PERMANENTLY DAMAGED, AND YOUR MOTHER OWES US AN ABORTION.

    • So he sounds just like every other politician.
      SHOCKER!!!! Still better than Killary. But then again so is satan.
      As far as FOPA is concerned, if i read it correctly it should protect firearm owning travelers from states like NY, NJ, and CA. There is however a guaranteed way to make sure you dont have any problems in those liberal shitholes. Dont go there.

        • ALL of them are just your stupid neighbors who needed a job.

          They “get an ass” as soon as you let them forget that.

    • The Firearms Protection Act was supposed to protect travelers going THROUGH a state by allowing them to transport (not necessarily carry on their person) unloaded only firearms. My understanding of National Reciprocity is that it will allow a licensed person to CARRY on their person a LOADED firearm whether they’re travelling through or staying for some amount of time.

      New York indirectly violates the Firearms Protection Act by prosecuting people with 10 round magazines. You’ll note that magazines are not firearms. They also step on transport of firearms via airlines. I don’t know how that’s Trump’s fault for bills passed in the 80s, perhaps you could enlighten me?

      I believe that Trump will sign almost every piece of legislation that crosses his desk (not necessarily the best quality, but he at least gets to give all blame to Congress for inaction). The question of a sort of “blended” bill where some restrictions are imposed for the loosening of other restrictions is 100% on the Republicans that supposedly control both the House and the Senate. If they want to write a bill giving us a clean National Reciprocity without any strings, they will. Otherwise, I supposed you’ll continue to blame Trump like it’s his job to write and pass bills.

      BTW, your “I TOLD YOU SO” will probably go better AFTER National Reciprocity is passed, assuming it comes with strings. BEFORE it’s passed, when we have no idea what it’ll look like…. what have you been proven right on again?

        • Ding ding ding, that was it!

          Really I’ll never understand the gun folks who revel in being a Debbie Downer about the progress we’re making. I think they’d be honestly delighted to be able to say “see? I told you WE wouldn’t get any of OUR rights back”.

          I mean, WTF.

        • submitted from his iphone while maneuvering a rascal through the publix with mom.
          remember, only sugar has more sugar.

    • “back in the primaries when you nominated this assclown and had other viable options.”

      SO… what other “viable options” would have you suggested?
      Cruz? Santorum? Huckabee? Like they haven’t shown themselves to be just as big a set of thieves and liars as Trump?
      The only candidate I can think of who even TALKS correctly is Rand Paul, but talk is cheap and politicians do a lot of it. Rare indeed do they tell other than a couple percent of truth. They just posture and say whatever their advisors tell them will get them elected.
      If you haven’t noticed by now; There is a reason they call it “political THEATER”. Because its a big fat SHOW, infotainment for those who don’t know any better than to think that TV and movies are real.

      • Everyone was more viable then trump. Even if the rest were equally big thieves and liars as Trump (which they all were not), they at least don’t act incompetent and half retarded. The republican party is doomed, because too many dumbasses are easily manipulated into picking the candidate that the democrats want the republicans to run.

  2. “, no reason exists to believe that law-abiding gun owners will somehow not be law-abiding just because they are carrying in a state such as New Jersey.”

    Well, maybe. Look how just living there F’s up their citizenry, and ESPECIALLY the MF tyrannical POS (D) politicians.

    Bulldoze that sh_t into the Atlantic before Maria comes up the coast.

  3. New York is probably the biggest violator of [the Firearm Owners Protection Act] as applied to persons declaring firearms for transport in checked baggage at airports.”

    The law enforcement officers, prosecutors, and judges involved in such actions are violating federal law and the Second Amendment to the Unites States Constitution. Quite simply: they are violating our rights under color of law WHICH IS A FELONY. Furthermore, because they illegally threaten the “violators” with deadly force, illegally kidnap the “violators”, and illegally rob (fine) or imprison the “violators”, penalties toward the maximum end of the scale of prescribed sanctions are in order — which includes fines well beyond $10,000 and prison sentences of 10+ years.

    We don’t need another law for national reciprocity. We need the government employees who are violating the laws already on the books to cough up $50,000 fines and spend 15 years in prison. THAT will stop violations of the Firearm Owner’s Protection Act in short order.

    Now for the $50,000 question: why does fedzilla NEVER enforce the laws already on the books?

    • “Now for the $50,000 question: why does fedzilla NEVER enforce the laws already on the books?”

      Fedzilla enforces the laws convenient for it at the time.

      FOPA needs *sharp* teeth added to it to force states like NY and Cali to heel…

      • If your stupid neighbors who needed a job don’t continue to generate legislation or regulations then they feel that they will appear to be doing nothing.

        Plus, the churn keeps you from any firm footing of a rebuke and rebuttal, since the can always claim delays in implementation and affect as a means for demanding your patience.

    • A good suggestion, but $50K is chump change. $10 million per instance. Judges lose their bonds. 20 years in prison.

      It needs to have teeth.

    • No words on paper have ever prevented evil men from doing evil, and none ever will.
      “No paper can hold the iron… it must come from men.” -Ten Bears
      Yes, I know this is a fictional character. The words still hold, and the point is still clear.

  4. National reciprocity would be a white elephant. It would rally the anti-gunners together like nothing before. People who hadn’t even been engaged on the gun control issue would be rallied to the cause because they will be annoyed that rural states are foisting their loose gun practices on their suburban or urban areas. The courts won’t protect us from their revenge. Watch how the courts have allowed things like “assault weapons bans” and magazine caps. They have also consistently ruled that applying whatever restrictions you can imagine to concealed carry is constitutional, as long as they nominally still issue permits.

    Right now, 41 out of 50 states are either Shall Issue or No Permit Required. Only 9 states are May Issue. That’s a pretty good situation. Even states like Illinois and Wisconsin which were the last in the country to adopt any sort of concealed carry allowance are not Shall Issue states. You pass National Reciprocity, and watch the left come back with a national law applying much tougher restrictions than most states currently have.

    I think that the Hearing Protection Act is a much more realistic, achievable, and defensible achievement, and political effort should be focused there.

    Besides, I am a pro-gunner that believes that it makes total sense that societal gun norms would be different in a rural areas than in urban areas. In rural areas people hunt to control pests and for food. In urban areas those practices are nonexistent. In rural areas a bad storm with roads blocked by down trees, snow, or other obstacles could keep a person stranded for days or weeks. In urban areas, if streets aren’t cleared by the next day, politicians lose their jobs. In rural areas the police are farther away. In rural areas if you have a negligent discharge while working on your gun at your house, the odds of it injuring anyone outside of your own family are very slim. In urban areas, living in an apartment or condo, you literally have other people in every direction, including up and down. To me it is reasonable that urban societies would have an interest in stricter licensing and verification of gun owners. Let those states do their thing. If you don’t want to go to New York without carrying a gun, then just don’t go to New York.

    • Idiots, losers, and the extinct, are always the ones who urge for retreat and endless fallbacks to the point that there are none.

      No, we need to piss them off. They need to get out in the streets, shouting loudly, shaking their fists in the air, all nice and bunched up together.

      “To me it is reasonable that urban societies would have an interest in stricter licensing and verification of gun owners.”
      BULLFINGSH_T – It’s part of my America (and as soon as it ain’t you let me fing know, because I’ll waste more of my morning rectifying peoples’ opinion on that).

      The POS stupid neighbors who needed a job and became “gov’t” don’t get to lord that over anyone.

      If they don’t trust their neighbors THEY NEED TO F OFF AND PACK THEIR SH_T AND GO HOME.

    • “Even states like Illinois and Wisconsin which were the last in the country to adopt any sort of concealed carry allowance are not Shall Issue states.”

      Wisconsin is shall issue, and we have a bill being voted on in committee soon for Constitutional carry.

  5. Be careful what you wish for.

    You want FedGov to be your nanny and make all the states do what you want? Of course you do, that’s what Lincoln and all the “Unionistas” wanted all along and that’s what we’re getting. Don’t like what one state says about marriage? Well make the FedGov club those states into submission. Don’t like what they say about abortion? FedGov club! Don’t like what they say about Marijuana? FedGov club!

    It’s two sides of the same coin. Republicans and Democrats only want the same thing, the only thing that differs is who gets clubbed and for what issue.

    You think getting national reciprocity will be a win but in the end it will be a big loss.

    Just remember, any entity that can grant you something can also take it way. The proper response is for the people of New York, New Jersey, etc to change their State government. If the State won’t change or you can’t garner enough votes then you either need to leave or realize that the system if fundamentally broken and perhaps consider that it needs to be discarded in favor of something new.

    • Exactly spot on.
      I don’t see any good coming from national reciprocity unless the States individually do it.
      Not the Feds.

      • How could it be otherwise? NY already IGNORES the FOPA. Considering that, what would ever lead a rational mind into thinking they will not just continue to ignore any new ‘law’ they don’t happen to like?

    • “The proper response is for the people of New York, New Jersey, etc to change their State government.”

      That’s delusional.

      Quite a few states had no intention of changing their ways when civil rights were enacted, and it took onerous penalties to force them to behave.

      And guess what? The 2A *is* a civil right, number 2 on a ‘top ten’ list of rights…

      • “Changing their State government” can be many things.

        If the citizens of that state can vote the lawless ones out of office so be it.

        If not then sometimes the tree of liberty needs watered from time to time.

        Fact of the matter is it is still a state’s rights issue, not a federal issue. I don’t want to have any say what people 100 miles away from me can or can’t do let alone 1000 miles away…

        I

    • We (maybe it’s wrong to assume ‘we’, if so FU) want the Federal Government to uphold the U.S. Constitution. If not, we need to have them (quickly) pack their sh_t and go home and hide for awhile.

      States not liking the ‘upholding’ of the Constitution CAN TAKE AN INTERNAL VOTE TO DERATIFY THE MF, THEN SECCEDE. After which we’ll come and kill all the MFs to get our real estate back.

      If they want to skip a step, let me know.

      • Well you’re in error because you don’t understand history or the constitution.

        The constitution was only supposed to be the binding document that specifically laid out what the federal government could or could not do. It had nothing to do with the states. It was assumed at the time that the States would never infringe on these rights, and if they did it was because it was the will of the people in each particular state.

        But remember, the bill of rights had to be ADDED to the constitution because Madison, Hamilton and the Federalist cronies all wanted the outcome we now have. They wanted a large, leviathan central state. So, the constitution, as a binding document, has completely failed. It has not restricted the federal beast one wit.

        And furthermore Lincoln and Republicans set liberty back over 100 years by illegally invading the South after they seceded. It had nothing to do with Slavery, it was over tariffs, protectionism and states’ rights. And the tyrannical North perpetuated “Union Above All” and expanded the Central Federal Government to unprecedented heights. All of the Southern States were in shambles, and all of the congressional seats were occupied by Northern Republican cronies.

        From there each Administration has just whittled away to where we are today.

        So do I want to go back to the Constitution? No! It’s a failed document. We need a better and fresh experiment in Liberty. I believe the best and most expedient way to do that is to let the States’ have their rights and experiment as they wish.

        It’s already apparent to me that the rural vs. urban culture is almost insurmountable. I further think that it’s probably best if most big cities became “city states” and were left to govern themselves. In short the best “rule” is found the more local you can get.

  6. Too bad the Republicans in power don’t think it is the time to push for this legislation. Guess they assume they are gonna continue to win in 2018 and 202 despite that Trump’s approval rating is in the garbage.

    It’s now or never and right now, it looks like never is their option. I’m sure the Republicans will wave this nice carrot in front of us come 2018 though just like they always do.

  7. The real problem with this and many other legal questions is there are to many laws on the books. The judicial system has 10’s of thousand of laws covering every facet of our lives. Has the time come to not only remove these boundaries on our freedoms? Has the time come to remove the politicians and judges who make them? Yes some laws are necessary and most can be found in the bible even though I’m not at all religious. The ideals set forth in the ten commandments pretty well covers all that is needed for a society to live. WE’VE ALLOWED politicians,judges and lawyers to bastardize our lives with so many confusing rulings and laws that they control the way everything must be done. Is what we have truly Freedom or is it what they want it to be? These are questions everyone should be asking themselves.

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