“There isn’t a single issue in isolation that increases the likelihood of gun death.” – CDC behavioral scientist and lead author of Childhood Firearm Injuries in the United States Katherine A. Fowler in A Dire Weekly Total for the U.S.: 25 Children Killed by Guns [via nytimes.com]

44 Responses to Quote of the Day: Most Media Darlings Forgot This Fact About ‘Childhood’ Shootings

  1. The CDC should really be spending it’s time trying to reduce the number of Americans killed by incompetent, lazy and careless healthcare “Professionals”. Even liberal NPR set that number at 440,000 deaths per year.

    • Katherine Fowler is a poster child for politicized social “science”. While legitimate social science research is supposed to be “value free”, it is worth asking how this can happened when the researcher identifies emotionally and ideologically with a lifestyle oriented social movement like gun-controll (or environmentalism). When scientific inquiry joins with social movement ideology (which is obvious in Fowler’s conclusions) it becomes politicized. And when scientific inquiry is politicized, it ceases to be science and becomes political ideology. We should always be suspicious of any government initiated “facts” which are used to create policy. CDC sacrificed its scientific integrity a long time ago.

      • “We should always be suspicious of any government initiated “facts” which are used to create policy. CDC sacrificed its scientific integrity a long time ago.”-Very well said.

  2. “Children are at a higher risk of violence if they have academic problems, encouragements to be aggressive, and limited adult supervision,” she said. “The likelihood of violence is also higher in communities with high levels of instability, gang activity, drug sales, unemployment or poverty.”

    Captain Obvious to the white courtesy phone please…..

    God I hope they didn’t spend a lot of my tax dollars to come up with that info.

    • Hey, give it a rest. The CDC is confirming what WE have been saying all along. If it is more ammunition against the antis, who are we to complain? It is pretty obvious that what is obvious to us is not obvious to the media–or more likely intentionally ignored. This is harder to ignore.

  3. This is news? Medical science has known for years that excessive lead exposure is harmful to children.

  4. From the article:” Between 2012 and 2014, an average of 1,297 children under age 18 died each year from firearm injuries. Aside from deaths in the course of law enforcement and other circumstances, there were an average of 693 homicides, 493 suicides and 82 unintentional deaths annually.”

    So, just over half are (probably) side effects of gang life and ~85% of the rest are mental health related. Both are societal issues.

    Check.

    Not to make light of either number, but it’s pretty clear guns aren’t the root of the problem. Society is.

    • It’s more specific than just “society.” The study found that homicides were not just the largest category of gun-related deaths of minors, but constituted a majority of them. It goes on to report that homicide rates among black minors are ten times that of whites, and are higher in states with larger black populations.

      Add in this quote, “The likelihood of violence is also higher in communities with high levels of instability, gang activity, drug sales, unemployment or poverty”, and it becomes obvious that the problem isn’t society in general, but rather black sub-culture in particular.

      That’s a really big problem to address, however. It’s much more easy, satisfying, and politically advantageous just to blame the system and call whites racist.

      • And it makes it pretty damn difficult to blame gunz as the root cause of so-called “gun violence.” AS the press has been doing for years. And the Brady bunch et al. And President Obama. And Hellary. Etcetera, etcetera, etcetera.

  5. So this is what our tax dollars are paying for….?

    Had the CDC done a study on the health implications of some men spending their money on wine, women and song, and the rest foolishly, it would have been equally relevant.

    I can see why the pre-Obama CDC was forbidden from spending the public’s money on “gun safety” research – it’s just propaganda for the anti-gun side. Our current president should re-initiate the ban, and Congress should defund any CDC efforts along these lines. The CDC should be spending tax dollars on anti-disease research that actually does some good.

    • The CDC should be spending tax dollars on anti-disease research that actually does some good.

      Let me get this straight: you are saying that the CDC should devote its finite resources on eliminating a disease (such as cancer) that kills millions of people every year rather than spend resources trying to prevent about 8,000 murders, 29,000 suicides, and 500 accidental deaths annually — almost all of which are rooted in dysfunctional families, mental illness, and the downright evil/violent nature of mankind? Sounds rock-solid to me!

    • The leadership at the CDC is a revolving door of corruption with the pharmaceutical industry. Take their statements with that understanding and caution.

  6. Every time someone promotes restrictive firearms public policy in response to murders and suicides, we should remind our audience of the following:
    (a) Violent criminals attacking violent criminals account for about 80 to 90% of all murders. Public policy will NOT significantly impact violent criminals. Period.
    (b) A person who is determined to kill themselves will succeed with or without access to firearms. Period.

    Thus, on a practical level, firearm public policy will have no significant effect on murder and suicide.

    On an esoteric level, firearm public policy that interferes with our ability to use firearms for recreation or effective self-defense is obscene and has no place in our society. Forcing all men to undergo some sort of periodic search/interrogation to see if they had non-concensual sex (e.g. raped someone) would be a no go — no matter how often men raped women or how effective it might be preventing rape. Similarly, eliminating all people’s right to keep and bear arms is a no go — no matter how effective it might be at preventing murders or suicides.

  7. Seems like a reasonable woman who understands . So why would she involve herself in such a preposterous “study” which accomplishes nothing?

    We’ve known for a hundred years that children in shitty environments tend to come to shitty ends by any number of methods. Instead of wasting resources on the ends time and time again how about looking at the environment for a change?

    • It has to be documented. Maybe she’ll move on to global warming or studying trickle down economics next.

  8. “There isn’t a single issue in isolation that increases the likelihood of gun death,” – Negative comments above seem to miss that this appears to be a very positive statement. It appears to contradict claims the lax gun laws and/or presence of guns in the home can be isolated as factors that increase risk, and thus directly undermines much of the propaganda from the pro-restriction crowd in trying to pass mandatory storage laws or similar idiocy that attempts to impede citizens from having a gun ready at hand for self defense.

    • Agreed 100%.

      In addition, the statistics do provide talking points against further “gun control” measures.

      One thing that seems clear is that at least one subset of deaths — accidental homicides of/by children — could be diminished if people would simply store their firearms properly when not carrying them. I’m not advocating mandatory “safe-storage” laws, but, on the other hand, leaving a loaded firearm where a unsupervised child can get to is just plain irresponsible. One could spare oneself a lot of heartache, funeral expenses, and possible prison time by simply storing one’s weapons properly.

    • EXACTLY! I would love for copies of this report to be given to every Democratic member of the California Assembly and Senate Public Safety committees–and force them to read it! Every single anti-gun bill that goes to that committee is passed on a party line vote, and it is patently obvious that the democratic committee members do not want to hear nor care about what the pro-gun side has to say, so lost are they in their beliefs that it is the gunz. I’d like to see what Dr. Gary Wintemute, who was just given $5 million by the State to fund a gun violence research center has to say about this report. Sadly, I have to assume that it will do nothing to change his opinions.

      • You can force them to read it, but you’ll never be able to compel the level of understanding needed for it to affect their thinking.

  9. So, involvement in crime is not a single issue, that in isolation, in and of itself, increases the likelihood of minors dying?

  10. 25 “children” daily!

    98 percent of which are Chicago or other cities “gang bangers”!

    Quit trying to make this sound like its accendental!

  11. Gun death?

    How about swimming pool death? Or doctor death? A CDC behavioral scientist who conflates murders, suicides and accidents in order to create an anti-civil rights propaganda piece is a lying fraud.

  12. The average Jethro and Jessica Bodine are too ignorant and too lazy to keep deadly weapons locked up when children are in the home. They will say simply that it always happens to “the other family” not ours. Famous last words. And the other argument is that their children have been trained about guns (reality is most of them have not). Even Children that have had some instruction often ignore the training when adults are not around and it gets even worse when they have play mates over as the playmate can find a loaded gun or the resident child wants to show off with a gun in front of his guest and the result is tragedy.

    The only thing Jehtro and Jessica understand is severe fines and imprisonment and that gets their attention very fast, especially the loss of money, never mind their kids, they know they will probably have more anyway.

    Most civilized countries have had such laws for years in addition to mandatory security alarm systems which cut way down on stolen guns that immediately find their way into the hands of criminals. All guns in those countries are also vetted as well including second hand sales. The Right wing paranoids scream it will result in confiscation but as usual their ignorance is unlimited because the Brady Bill has vetted new gun sales for decades and was never designed to confiscate anyone’s guns and never has, so extending it to second hand gun sales would not change anything. This is way over the head of Jethro and his paranoia and irresponsibility.

    Jethro does not realize that registration is not necessary at all if the Government wants to confiscate guns. The majority of guns are not registered anyway so the Government would simply let the public know that this or that category of guns must be turned in or the owner would serve time in jail, be heavily fined, and have his gun rights revoked permanently and have much of his wealth confiscated as well. In other words the average Joe would be under no illusion that hanging on to a banned weapon would be sheer stupidity and yes indeed the bulk of the banned weapons would indeed be turned in, so arguing that the Brady Bill would confiscate guns would be irrelevant even it were true (which it is not and never has been).

    The other Jethro screaming comes from the argument that “I cannot defend myself if my guns are locked up”. Again pure lies and or ignorance. If the perceived threat (and it usually is perceived when dealing with paranoids) is believed, then one could carry a gun on ones person. Also trigger locks and desk safes make it very easy to quickly access them. I did it for years so no amount of bullshit on that category is valid from the paranoid crowd.

    The other argument from Jethro is ‘I do not want to be inconvenienced to sign for a gun”. Here we get at the real truth in regards to saving lives by vetting all purchases of all weapons. Jethro could not care less how many kids get killed with guns lying around the house or how many guns get sold to psychopaths and criminals. Jethro’s paranoia and irresponsibility are the two real main stumbling blocks to cutting down on child deaths and cutting way down on stolen guns and guns sold to the wrong people.

    Right now all the myriad of State Laws are totally useless in stopping crime as guns flow by the thousands every day from States with lax gun laws into States with tuff gun laws and a criminal knows its quicker often to buy a second hand gun than it is to buy a cheese burger. This fact of course is swept under the rug by the ignorant and the paranoids who scream, I do not want any gun laws period. All this is totally insane of course but when dealing with the Jethro crowd you are not dealing with an educated or a mentally well balanced group of people.

    In the end due to just a few laws (as mentioned above) not being passed, none of which are deigned to take away anyone’s guns, will result in things remaining as they are and the carnage from guns continuing to go up and up and even worse become more and more sensational with all the mass shootings that in the past used to be a rare occurrence. Most of the population in the U.S. does not own a firearm and it is getting less and less with the upcoming younger middle class generation who do the majority of voting. When one goes to gun shows in my area you often cannot find one person under 60 years of age which is simply a “red flag” on what is to come much sooner than later and that is severe draconian anti-gun laws that will be passed in response to child deaths from firearms and mass shootings by psychopaths (mostly by natural born white citizens as statistics have already proven).

    • Translation – Save the money on research, and just trot out your prejudiced assumptions about gun owners without even attempting to back them up with evidence.

    • The first few words of your diatribe render it unreadable, but I did slog through it. My response is that you are a fool and most likely a troll. The rest of my response is very unladylike so I won’t post it here, but know that you have been well and truly insulted.

      • Your attention deficit disorder shows why you remain ignorant on the gun issue. You see everything in black and white rather than admitting that the propaganda you enjoy using to bolster your viewpoints may just indeed have serious flaws.

    • Go away Mr troll and take your hyperventilating un-Constitutional progtard “commonsense” gun control BS with you.

    • cisoc kid? Isn’t that supposed to be Cisco kid? Or how about the_resistance? It always seems when one anti -freedom zealot falls away another one comes storming in with the same distortions, lies and adhominems.

      It’s almost as if there was a well of sewage from which would belch out what at first seems a different gaseous upwelling of filth and wreak which would in the end turn out to be the same familiar cloud of stomach turning corruption.

  13. Page 18, “Urban Delinquency and Substance Abuse” Research Summary, a publication of the Office of Juvenile Justice and Delinquency Prevention, U.S. Department of Justice:

    [Figure 13] shows a very strong relationship between owning illegal guns and delinquency and drug use. Seventy-four percent of the illegal gunners comit [sic] street crimes, 24 percent commit gun crimes, and 41 percent use drugs. Boys who own legal firearms, however, have much lower rates of delinquency and drug use and are even slightly less delinquent thatn [sic] nonowners of guns.

    The socialization into gun ownership is also vastly different for legal and illegal gunowners. Those who own legal guns have fathers who own guns for sport and hunting. On the other hand, those who own illegal guns have friends who own illegal guns and are far more likely to be gang members. For legal gunowners, socialization appears to take place in the family; for illegal gunowners, it appears to take place “on the street.”

    I’m sorry, I forget the year that study was published (and ignored) but Ted Kennedy was on the Senate committee that ordered (and ignored) it. It’s almost impossible to find it now, but if you type that whole “title” into a search engine, you just might get it.

  14. Writes Jacob Sullum at Reason.com yesterday:

    “This sort of misrepresentation is an old trick among gun controllers, as David B. Kopel noted in Reason 24 years ago. “Gun-control advocates are hammering at the issue of children and guns as never before,” Kopel wrote, “in the hope that it will be easier to enact gun controls aimed at adults in an atmosphere of panic about children.” He pointed out that claims about “children” killed by guns conflate accidents involving little kids, which were relatively rare then and are even less common now, with suicides and gun violence involving teenagers.”

    Gun-controllers trotting out the same old shit.

  15. This “study” clearly is a lie and doesn’t exist. Everyone knows the NRA is preventing research into gun violence.

    This is the response to anyone arguing facts in favor of gun control. They gun grabbers constantly claim that the NRA is preventing ALL research into “gun violence” because Congress passed a law that the CDC can’t advocate for gun control. Make them argue for the existence of the study. They will have to explain that what they said isn’t true.

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