Jon Wayne Taylor Buys a Lower Receiver in Texas (vs. Massachusetts)

JWT's gun (courtesy Jon Wayne Taylor for The Truth About Guns)
I am a proud son of Texas. Although the firearms laws here are far from perfect, the difference between the Lone Star State’s gun laws and those of anti-gun rights states was recently highlighted when I read TTAG’s post on Lawson Clarke’s article A Gun Owner Who is Perfectly Comfortable with Gun Control. Mr. Clarke may be comfortable living with the byzantine show of submission he had to go through to legally exercise his natural, civil, and constitutional rights, but I would certainly not be. Fortunately, I don’t have to be. So just to prove a point, I went down to visit Underground Tactical . . .
I asked one of the employees there to read Mr. Clarke’s original article. When he started, I began the purchase process on a lower receiver I need for a new dedicated .458 SOCOM lower receiver.
You guessed it. In the time that it took the UT employee to read the article detailing the knee-bending grovel-fest that allows a law abiding Massachusetts wealthy white male to own a firearm, I’d legally purchased mine. I’m a Texas CHL holder and I paid cash. So that saved me some time. But it felt pretty good to exercise my rights as quickly and efficiently as that.
How’s the firearms purchase process where you live?

comments

  1. avatar pwrserge says:

    Illinois still has the wacky waiting period BS, but it’s only 3 days. For items with that sort of sticker price, I tend to plan things out a bit, so it’s not that much of an issue.

    1. avatar Raul Ybarra says:

      Only for handguns, I believe. Rifles are 24 hours.

      1. avatar Mitch says:

        Three days for lowers, though, because they’re “handguns”.

        1. avatar MadeInUSA says:

          A stripped lower is 3 days, the ATF classifies it as “other” on a 4473. So its not registered as a rifle or pistol, if bought new from an FFL.

      2. avatar pwrserge says:

        It’s three days for “easily concealable” firearms. According to the statute, that also covers 18″ pistol grip shotguns sold without a stock.

        Weird, I know, but since I rarely buy long guns stock, it more or less boils down to a three day wait for me. Fortunately, I live only five minutes from my FFL/Range so it’s a minor, if unconstitutional, inconvenience.

        Honestly, the near total ban on NFA items bothers me far more. The only things you can get are non-expoloside DDs, AOWs, and (if you jump though some extra hoops) SBRs. I can’t wait for the legislature to get off their backsides and pass that Suppressor bill that’s been stuck in committee.

  2. avatar MiketheHopsFarmer says:

    My process? A guy named Tony. The trunk of a Crown Vic. $45. No questions asked. Walk away with a machine gun…. I ke’ed I ke’ed!

    1. avatar Joel says:

      Sounds a lot like a few gun purchases I have made…

      1. avatar Joel says:

        Except I didn’t get a machine gun. And I think I paid $50 for my first handgun. Dang! I got ripped off!

    2. avatar notalima says:

      I just hang out near that lake that everyone keeps losing their guns in… The cost for SCUBA gear up front has paid off in spades 😉

  3. avatar Kevin says:

    Same, but I don’t need a carry permit so I don’t have one. I always thought it was weird someone would rail against registration then rush to sign up for a list that says not only am I a gun owner I actually carry one. We need more constitutional carry states.

  4. avatar Joe Liberty says:

    Same.
    Plus I can open carry with or (gasp) without a permit.
    Louisiana rocks.

  5. avatar Kyle Wheeler says:

    In Idaho, the process is lengthy but painless. Lengthy due to others exercising their rights lol. But in Washington it felt like each letter and number that i filled out on the form was scrutinized for correct form as if they could tell a law-breaker from just how they wrote their address… Sheeple.

    1. avatar William Burke says:

      Really? That sucks. In VA, if you make a mistake on the form they point it out and ask you to correct it!

      1. avatar Bob in mi says:

        Not to be a stickler but…. If they point out a mistake on the federal 4473 they are breaking federal law. The rule is that they can say “due to the answers given i cannot sell you this firearm” and then they should wait for you to find it. If you don’t, no purchase for you.

        1. avatar LarryinTX says:

          YGBSM.

    2. avatar Galtha58 says:

      I actually think that the process in Washington State is pretty quick and painless. But maybe because I now have a CPL. Once you have that the only hassle is the paperwork or filling out the online form at the Dealer. Takes some time and some of the questions seem ridiculous. Other than that it goes pretty fast. But maybe that is because I am now used to the system and have not really tried to purchase in another state. Don’t really need the CPL to purchase a long gun. Don’t remember if you need it for a long gun if you want to take it with you though. Don’t think so. Maybe someone can help on that part.

      1. avatar dph says:

        When I bought my Savage .22 rifle I offered my CPL and was told it is not needed for long guns and 20 minutes later walked out with the rifle.

  6. avatar Joe R. says:

    IN THE OK

    CASH AND CARRY – and NICS check – in and out in 15 mics or less.

    I try to set a new record with every new purchase.

  7. avatar COsigfan(now in MA) says:

    While Massachusetts firearms laws are terrible, and the pricing on the ones not on the AG’s list (gen4 GLOCK brand glocks for example) are just as bad…. I don’t know of any laws that would make a lower reciever- .458 SOCOM or not, illegal here.

    1. avatar Rich K. says:

      A lower receiver is considered to be the “firearm” under federal law, whether is is a complete shootable gun or not. Since, according to the Commissars of the Peoples Democratic Socialist Republic of Massachusetts, an AR-15 is an EEEEEEEVIIIIILLLLLLL assault weapon that shoots thousands of rounds into crowds of helpless people all by itself with its nasty bullet clip belt feed mechanism thingamabob, the lower receiver is just as evil all by its lonesome.

      1. avatar Bill says:

        Yes, but AR type rifles are legal in Mass.

        1. avatar Rich K. says:

          GASP!!!! I’m shocked, considering Mass. is a state where even a Daisy Red Ryder is a regulated “firearm”…

        2. avatar Rich K. says:

          Maybe because an AR lower receiver could be built into an unlicensed “pistol”? Liberals’ laws don’t have to make sense. They just have to “feel good” and look like they’re “trying to do something” about a “problem”.

        3. avatar Bill says:

          As far as I know lowers are legal in Mass. If anyone can confirm to the contrary, based on actual knowledge, please correct me.

        4. avatar Sixpack70 says:

          Lowers are legal in Mass. I bought two when I lived there.

      2. avatar William Burke says:

        Hmmm. And I thought the lower WAS the gun to the BATFE.

    2. avatar Bill says:

      I’d like an answer to this as well. AR type rifles are legal in Mass.

    3. avatar That Guy says:

      Totally legal in MA. You just have to abide by the old AWB provisions limiting the number of evil features and no bayonet lug.

      1. avatar Rad Man says:

        Agreed. There are plenty of MA compliant ARs out there so why wouldn’t the lower be legal? I’ve bought a few without incident. Then I got my FFL which makes life a whole lot easier.

  8. avatar woody from NY says:

    NY long gun is a background check and out the door…..of course they greatly limit what types of gun u can buy here now. As for pistols it’s a pain in the bottom. First the pistol permit. Couple hundred bucks class finger prints and waiting for months or over a year After that u buy a gun go to the county clerk they mail u a card that allows u to go pick up said pistol. It’s all recorded on your pistol permit u must have AT All Times that u are in possession of your pistol. I have a concealed carry permit but I long for the day I can move to Vermont…… they don’t have state gun laws there. True constitutional carry.

    1. avatar William Burke says:

      This ain’t Twitter, friend. Drop the “u” and spell the freaking word out, like an adult.

      As for buying a gun in the Old Dominion: having bought an AR and a 9mm banned g… I mean handgun, it’s not bad at all, considering. No worse than it’s ever been since, oh, 1994.

      1. avatar Sc says:

        The most painful part for me is the coupon they give you to give to the FFL to pick up your new pistol after waiting weeks to months for a judge to sign off to the addition to your permit. The actual language on that coupon is “(name) is hereby granted permission to purchase (pistol description, serial number)”.

    2. avatar Jjimmyjomga says:

      Welcome to Vermont. Just don’t forget your property taxes will go up…a lot…to pay for massive local school budgets/teacher pay/teacher pensions…otherwise great place to own guns (especially since we can own supressors now)

  9. avatar vv ind says:

    80%er…

    1. avatar vv ind says:

      Just throwing it out there…..I’ve never actually done one.

      1. avatar Rich K. says:

        Nahhhh… build a 3D printer and make a Warfairy “Charon” lower!

        1. avatar Tim says:

          Not as easy as you might think.
          I’ve tried my hand at a few 3d printed lowers, and they always experience shrinkage. They could all be tooled to work, but I’ve not had one yet that was ready to go straight out of the printer. They take forever too. An 80% could be milled in less than two hours by an unskilled patron. A 3d model takes 24+ hours.
          Yes, they’re cheap(about 10-15$ in ABS), but you get what you pay for. I’d take an aluminum 80% over an ABS any day.

  10. avatar pod says:

    Florida has a waiting period for pistols if you don’t have a CWFL, the length depends on the municipality.

    If you have a CWFL, there’s no wait aside from the background check processing time, which can take minutes or hours.

  11. avatar Grindstone says:

    Here in OK it’s about the same process, minus the CHL exemption (unless you were lucky enough to get yours between May 16, 1996 and November 30, 1998).

  12. avatar PeterC says:

    I live in America, aka Arizona. ’nuff said.

  13. avatar Ralph says:

    .458 SOCOM lower receiver. [ED: A firearm that’s banned in Massachusetts.

    I don’t know who that Ed guy is, but he’s wrong. .458 SOCOM, .50 Beowulf, .50 BMG etc. are all legal here.

    1. avatar Bill says:

      This article seems light on the details regarding this.

    2. avatar Geoff PR says:

      “I don’t know who that Ed guy is, but he’s wrong.”

      ‘ED’ is the brother of Zed, who met his ‘medieval’ end via pliars and a blow-torch at the hand of some “Hard, pipe-hittin’ (gentelmen)” in the basement of the Pawn Shop…

      Or so I heard…

      *cough*

      1. avatar Ralph says:

        Bring out The Gimp!

  14. avatar Sixpack70 says:

    If I had my CCW for this state it would be quick. I just don’t like the idea of handing my medical record over to people who I am not sure would be able to safeguard them. If federal government servers get hacked often, what makes me think some local state or county entity is going to be able to prevent a hack. So, I have a different CCW.

  15. avatar 505markf says:

    Easy peasy in New Mexico.

  16. avatar Earl Keese says:

    15 minutes for background check/paperwork. 1 hour shooting the s#*t with my gun dealer.

    1. avatar Avid Reader says:

      That’s pretty much my experience. My preferred LGS is home based, so if he gets a customer (by appointment only) he likes, or at least doesn’t actively dislike, he’s a talker.

  17. avatar It'sOnlyDave says:

    In MO, you fill out the form (1.8 minutes), pass the plastic and your drivers’ license (1 second), wait for phone clearance (5 minutes), sign the credit card receipt and walk out. This is the drill for long guns and handguns, regardless. The process is even shorter if an FFL isn’t involved.

    1. avatar John says:

      Yep compared to the 12 day wait, test for handgun safety certificate, and all that be I had to deal with one time life is good in Missouri.

    2. avatar vv ind says:

      Then the boat capsizes on the ride home, every time.

      1. avatar Justsomeguy says:

        I know. Aint that a bitch? Every Single Time

  18. avatar Bob says:

    Easy in pa. Long guns 1 form and the shop calling in the nics. Handgun 2 forms and a nics.

    walk out with guns.

    Face to face is ok for long guns with no background chk. Handgun requires a background chk

  19. avatar Mark N. says:

    California: Firearms Safety Certificate (test plus $25, good for 2 years), DROS $25, dealer transfer fee (variable), and a 10 day wait. The only thing a CCW/CHL gets you is out of the FSC requirement. There is a case pending in which the wait was challenged, and lo and behold, the trial court ruled that for anyone who already owns a gun, the requirement is unconstitutional. The purpose of the waiting period is to allow the CA DOJ time to do its own background check (that includes a NICS check but is more thorough). However, the DOJ admitted in litigation that for at least 20% of purchasers, the background check goes through in less than an hour, and almost all the rest in 6-8 days. But, clinging to its hurdles, the DOJ has appealed the trial court’s ruling. We might know something in a couple more years.

    1. avatar Julio says:

      More thorough answer than mine. A FSC wasn’t required based on my job. Wish the 10 day wait was dropped completely. All of the excessive fees and CA DOJ roster crap makes me loathe any future purchases until I move next summer.

    2. avatar Carl says:

      California FSC is good for 5 years like the HSC was. You fill out both the 4473 and the DROS (Dealer Record of Sale). Pay $35 dollars for the DROS background check ($25 to the state and $10 goes to the dealer). Some dealers will not collect the $10 on a new purchase, but they are required to do private party transfers for anyone that walks in and only make $10 for that service plus storing the gun for the 10 day waiting period. That is California’s version of the UBC. All private sales require this. But know a lot of people that have purchased cash and carry on pre-registration handguns and rifles, there is no stopping this. Off the top of my head that there is 20 to 30% of PPT (Private Party Transfers) are still off the books.

      1. avatar Mark N. says:

        As you note, all PPTs must be handled through an FFL in California, if you want to comply with the law, with the usual DROS and background check. In addition, if the sale does not go through, the dealer must do a background check on the seller in order to return the gun, and yews, the same ten day wait applies. PPTs may be $10 for the dealer, but around here, most dealers charge $75 for the paperwork on a gun they did not sell. Hell, I had dealers wanting to charge me $75 for shipping a gun out of state, because they had to list the gun on their books in order to ship it.

    3. avatar sagebrushracer says:

      And don’t forget Kids, limit 1 new firearm per 30 days!

  20. avatar Julio says:

    10 day required wait here in CA. Thought it would be struck down, but seems to stick like a lot of gun “laws” that are heralded to save the masses.

    1. avatar Bob in Calif says:

      I bought a stripped lower at the LGS and had to wait 10 days to pick it up. Then had to transport it in a locked container. As if it just might injure someone with all those parts missing. Bovine excrement!

  21. avatar Justsomeguy says:

    My response to his article:

    The citizens of Massachusetts might well take pride in their revolutionary role, but it would be difficult to see them taking such actions today. They would have to ask Gages’ permission to access the armory and would not be given permission to posses anything that would effectively threaten the crown.

    The author goes on to insinuate that having to beg permission to exercise basic, civil, and Constitutional rights are to be credited with their low levels of gun violence. I would argue that fatherless households and demographics are better predictors of homicidal behavior and Massachusetts would bear that out as one of our least diverse states. Their ethnic diversity matches many European countries very well.

    Of course geography can play a role too. We would be happy to share many of the problems that come from sharing a border with Mexico as well as a number of the illegal inhabitants of our state with MA so they can see what effect that night have on their crime rates. I suspect it wouldn’t be positive.

    I actually bought a Winchester 30-30 recently. I was browsing a gun show, found one I liked, put my money down and walked away with it. It took about 5 minutes and I did not ask my masters permission to do so. That sounds a whole lot more like freedom to me and my rifle represents no more risk to the American people than the authors does. It re[resents a significant threat to those such a General Gage. Astonishingly, my city has had a homicide rate of zero for several years now despite being awash in unregulated guns. Imagine that.

  22. avatar 2AMexican says:

    IN – Walk in, pick your prize, check boxes on 4473, NICS check, pay the man. 10 minutes top. It’s taken me longer to do the paperwork than the wait for the NICS reply.

  23. avatar Indiana Tom says:

    Just walk into Rural King and fill out 4473 and swipe your credit card; the Core 15 is yours for about $ 460.

  24. avatar Tom in Oregon says:

    Found gun through friend. Mailed check off to Florida along with a copy of my go to FFL guy.
    In one hour, I’ll be at my FFL guys place doing some paperwork.
    A phone call to the state police and about a 3-5 minute wait, then it’s mine!

  25. avatar 'liljoe says:

    NV here (not LV), if there is no gun show going on, <5 minutes from fondling gun to owning it, with a gun show, up to 3 hours (but usually less than 20-30) for the background check.

  26. avatar Jeff says:

    Alabama….15 minutes. Tops. Out the door…..

  27. avatar JD says:

    Depends on the time of day. If a customer comes in right at 10 and I run the background online its approved as soon as I hit the screen refresh. Less than 20 seconds. We’ve had guys picking stuff up in and out in under 5 minutes.

  28. avatar Ralph says:

    In a MA gun store, you show your firearms license (no gun or ammo sales without one, but there are no forms for ammo, it’s show and go), pay, fill out two forms (4473 and the State FA-10), provide a pin number for the state database, get your NICS run and ten minutes or less later, you’re done. Despite what Mr. Boston Fudd claimed, there is no waiting period. He lied.

  29. avatar Paul says:

    NC just as long as the NICS takes for long gun. Handguns need either a CCH or Pistol Purchase Permit. CCH is Shall Issue but requires class and a hefty fee. PPP is Shall Issue and costs $5.00 each, you can get as many as you want with one visit to the local police station and a background check that takes about a week, and they are good for 5 years. CCH serves as total ID and as I understand it, negates need for NICS. So pretty quick and largely painless. No waiting period or registration. Private sale in parking lot is quicker; many people ask for a CCH or PPP to confirm ID and legality of buyer even on long gun but I am OK with that. Establishes a positive atmosphere. Still not as quick as ordering a book.

    1. avatar Joe-in-NC says:

      It is CHP not CCH. Also with a CHP only a 4473 is required for either long guns or pistols purchase. I can fill out the 4473 in less time than it took to type this reply.

  30. avatar Noishkel says:

    Washington state here. And as every knew i594 never didn’t anything good or even noteworthy. At least from all the news reports I’ve seen. But then again I’ve not actually tried to buy a gun up here yet. Maybe when I can scrounge a few bucks again I’ll start looking around for a good deal on something.

  31. avatar ColdNorth says:

    In Canada, for a non-restricted (like a Vz.58), you show your license, pay the money and get your gun. For a restricted (like an AR-15) you have to do a bunch of other things and make some calls that add a couple hours.
    This is ignoring the time it takes to get the license.

    It’s also ignoring when the Liberals decide that fun times are over and declare your firearm prohibited, but that doesn’t really fall under how long it takes to buy it initially.

  32. avatar Rokurota says:

    No shouts from Virginia, so allow me: shall-issue CHPs, legal open carry of handguns and long guns, no magazine restrictions, no waiting periods, no purchase restrictions (like one-handgun-a-month, which we used to have). Of course, we do have a training requirement for CHPs, a state background check in addition to NICS, and an anti-gun governor whose very presence made us poison for Beretta (they moved to TN instead) and just signed a showboating executive order that TTAG covered. What do you expect from the former DNC chairman?

  33. avatar Mk10108 says:

    I travel a lot, left coast eastbound. What I find remarkable is further east I go the more people embrace the gun. Stroll into AR, MS, AL and GA it’s a different world than CA and its wonderful.

  34. avatar steve says:

    The article is wrong. .458 rifle is fine to own.

    To buy a lower I got to a gun store , full out a 4473 and pay the money.

  35. avatar MontieR says:

    Thankfully I live in a state that still has “some” respect for the constitution, (Arizona). It takes all of about twenty minutes to purchase ANY firearm providing the NICS check isn’t delayed by a pencil pusher.

  36. avatar Skeptic says:

    As fast as you can fill out the paperwork in NE. Handgun purchases require a purchase permit that is background checked by the sheriff’s office in the county I live in. Takes them about a week and it’s good for 3 years. Then you don’t have to do NICS checks for long guns, lowers, handguns, etc. Makes private sales really easy to feel good about as well, anytime I’ve participated in one, you’re usually showing each other your DL and purchase permit or CHL.

  37. avatar Owen says:

    In DE it’s as quick as make your choice, form 4473, NICS call, pay and off you go.

  38. avatar DavidinNC says:

    I buy a lot of stuff online, and here in NC, when I get the call from my FFL that an item has arrived, I’m back home with said item in 30 minutes. And the FFL is a 10- to 12-minute drive, depending on traffic lights.

  39. avatar tsbhoA.P.jr says:

    a lot of readers must not have answered this question last week…

  40. avatar DaveMD says:

    In MD its a 7 day waiting period for handguns and lower receivers; and I have to watch a video…. For rifles and shotguns, its out the door….. Now when it comes to AR’s it starts to get tricky. Certain brands of AR-15’s are banned but you can still buy one and its treated like a handgun (if i remember correctly) but AR-10’s are considered hunting rifles and you can take that out the door in one day.
    I bought most of my stuff before the crazy laws went into effect but I’m pretty sure this how my local gun guy explained it to me.
    In DC for $500 I can go get a cheap unreliable handgun from a truck of car in 20 min, no questions asked.

    1. avatar DavefromMD says:

      The People’s Republic of Maryland. I live in the wrong state to be a gun lover.

  41. avatar Matt says:

    CT requirements vary depending on what you want to buy and if it is pre ban versus post ban 1.0 or post ban 2.0. It boils down to no private sales without a background check (anyone can call the state police who provide the legally required sale authorization number) and no one buys a firearm or ammunition without a permit or certificate of some type.

    1. avatar Matt says:

      I forgot to add

      Time wise anywhere from 15 to 30 minutes for a typical firearms purchase unless of course the state is down in which case you need to wait how ever long that will take to be resolved (I can remember as long as a day). Ammo is show your certificate/permit and go.

  42. avatar LordGopu says:

    Here in Canada, you have to register handguns and ARs so that slows down the process. Though it might only take a couple of days to get the reg certificate, the transfer itself is usually only a few minutes.

    For any other gun it’s just show license, pay and go. Can order online mailed to your door as well. Same for ammo. Not that bad overall.

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