Question of the Day: Guns in Schools?

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“Six-year-old Elijah goes to Stratton Meadows Elementary School,” krdo.com reports. “On Monday, he pointed at a classmate in the shape of a gun and said, ‘You’re dead.’ . . . He received a one-day suspension for threats against peers.” Coming hard on the heels of my daughter’s 2A mischaracterizing history test, this incident makes me wonder why The People of the Gun aren’t familiarizing school kids with guns and gun rights. Just as businessmen go into schools to talk about capitalism, and police go in to talk about stranger danger and other threats, we should be talking to kids about firearms freedom. Complete with . . . . wait for it . . . guns! Anyone tried this? And how did you first learn the truth about guns? [h/t Pascal]

comments

  1. avatar BlueBronco says:

    This all goes back to children play “cowboys and indians,” “cops and robbers,” and “army.’ Those are frowned upon in the PC areas of society and has led to the pussification of America imho.

    1. avatar Rokurota says:

      Where have you been? Those games are now “Genocidal Colonialists and Peaceful Aborginials,” “Authoritarian Stormtroopers and Misunderstood Youth,” and “Uneducated Tools of American Adventurism”.

      1. avatar Another Robert says:

        Modern times…

      2. avatar Jus Bill says:

        Unless it’s a movie plot…

      3. avatar Governmentknowsbest says:

        Lmfao

  2. avatar MarkPA says:

    What I’d like to see is a Federal law prohibiting – under color of law – the disparagement of a right secured by the Constitution, as amended where the subject of disparagement is under the age of 18. Protected acts must include speech, press and assembly and the peaceable acting out of satire, humor, illustration, play.
    A modest fine, say $500 plus reasonable attorneys fees should suffice. Any citizen ought to be able to sue to enforce the law.
    We can’t have school teachers disparaging the rights secured in the 1A, 3A, 4A, 5A, . . .

    1. avatar Geoff PR says:

      “What I’d like to see is a Federal law prohibiting – under color of law – the disparagement of a right secured by the Constitution, as amended where the subject of disparagement is under the age of 18.”

      Well, Islam has penalties for those who slander The Prophet (may Peace be upon Him)…

      “A modest fine, say $500 plus reasonable attorneys fees should suffice. Any citizen ought to be able to sue to enforce the law.”

      MarkPA, as a lawyer, ‘reasonable attorneys fees’ for you are vastly different for the non-lawyers, no?

      Islam decrees the Sword as a proper penalty..

      I admit the idea of a firing squad for those who disparage the RKBA does make me smile…

      1. avatar MarkPA says:

        “MarkPA, as a lawyer, ‘reasonable attorneys fees’ for you are vastly different for the non-lawyers, no?” Seems like you think I am a lawyer. That is not the case; however, I have been the client of a fair number of lawyers and dealt with lots of other lawyers over my career. The joke is that “attorneys fees are ALWAYS reasonable by definition”.
        Think about it like this. We don’t want to press for making disparagement of a Constitutionally protected right a capital offense. Rather, we want to make it a tap-on-the-wrist. Neither a teacher nor a school district is going to want to place itself in a position to be egged-on by children bating their teachers into reacting and constantly facing small fines too insignificant in themselves to fight. But, fight they may on principle. In which case, the threat is that they are apt to lose and have to pay a local attorney his “reasonable fees”.
        Ideally, I’d like to see Congress take up such a bill. However, that isn’t so likely. Nothing stops us from pressing such a campaign in a State’s legislature. Surely, among the 57 sovereign States there must be one conservative enough to get such a bill passed. And, then another and another.
        Once we get a majority of States to have adopted such a law, Congress would probably take it more seriously as appropriate for Federal legislation.
        What is the downside? Are there any PotG who have experience shepherding legislation who could comment?

  3. avatar Chip Bennett says:

    “Six-year-old Elijah goes to Stratton Meadows Elementary School,” krdo.com reports. “On Monday, he pointed at a classmate in the shape of a gun and said, ‘You’re dead.’ . . . He received a one-day suspension for threats against peers.”

    When I was in elementary school, we called that “recess.”

  4. avatar Scrubula says:

    As a kid this wasn’t uncommon. Just playing cops and robbers or whatever with friends. Whether intentional or not, administrative action like this is brainwashing kids to be afraid to even think about guns.

    1. avatar Jus Bill says:

      Playing “SWAT and robbers?”

  5. avatar MamaLiberty says:

    The logical solution is to remove the children from the government indoctrination camps. They are being harmed seriously every moment they remain there, and it goes far, far beyond “gun rights.”

    1. avatar Jeremy in AL says:

      +1000

    2. avatar MarkPA says:

      MammaLiberty has it right. There is no prayer of reforming the public school system. It is what it is and so it will remain forever until it is dissolved.
      Back the voucher system. Home-school if you can.

      1. avatar Geoff PR says:

        “Back the voucher system.”

        The voucher system is Kryptonite to Progressive scum It is literally their ‘From my Cold, Dead, Progressive hands…

        “Home-school if you can.”

        For those who can. For some it simply isn’t doable.

        1. avatar MarkPA says:

          And why do you suppose it is Kryptonite? Because they know that all their power rests with indoctrinating the youth. Your enemy will tell you where he is most vulnerable; strike there!
          Moreover, the voters with the greatest stake in the game are the parents of children in the worst schools. It ought to be an easy sell. Just ask these parents: Why do you think you have no right to choose the best available school for their children? For the sum of $X,000 per year your district spends on each student, don’t you think you could get a better education for your children?
          I find it hard to believe that parents – no matter how negligent – are so disassociated with their own children’s self-interest that the message would never soak-in.
          Agreed, very few parents can home-school their children; least of all, those parents of children in the worst schools. These latter parents are the product of the same schools. Nevertheless, there are a few parents who could home-school and indeed do home-school. Each additional child who is home-schooled puts economic pressure on the public school system.
          It seems to me that home-schooling ought to be possible on a co-op sort of basis where a parent who can home-school does so for neighbor children as well. There must be a lot of qualified teachers who got fed-up and dropped-out of public schools. So, one parent is an English teacher; another is a Math teacher, and so forth. Maybe these parent-teachers could extend home-schooling education beyond the elementary grades.

    3. avatar uncommon_sense says:

      You might be surprised MamaLiberty. I think it depends a lot on the specific school district.

      I live at an extremely liberal enclave in the United States. Undaunted (and perhaps somewhat naive) my daughter just brought ballistics gel with bullets still in it to school for her science project. She even included photos of her shooting into the ballistics gel. She got a good grade for her project.

      Even better was the school field trip where all students were required to see the movie Selma. For those that do not know, Selma is a historical drama/documentary about the 1960s civil rights movement in the United States. And the movie pulls no punches … it shows, in graphic detail, police beating and killing people for the color of their skin. It shows local, state, and federal governments screwing over people. I guarantee that movie was an extremely rude awakening for the students.

      I never expected any public school, much less a public school in a liberal area, to allow children to see the almighty, infallible state in such an awful light. And I never expected a public school in a liberal area to give good marks to a student’s science project involving firearms and ballistics. I have to wonder if times are changing for the better … if even hardcore Progressives are starting to see the truth.

      1. avatar Another Robert says:

        Progressives are happy to show the State screwing people over–as long as those being “screwed over” are the Progressives’ client groups, such as “people of color”. And especially when the “screwing over” was done in the past. It gives them an excuse to further empower the present State (and themselves) in order to right those past wrongs. Not to mention reinforcing all the “you should feel guilty about your white-privilege” crap they like to ladle so thickly over the “education” process. I don’t see that it’s necessarily non-Progressive forcing kids to watch “Selma”.

        1. avatar uncommon_sense says:

          Another Robert,

          I hear you and I can definitely see how Progressives think that way and apply that strategy.

          Fortunately, their strategy is fatally flawed and actually works in our favor. However Progressives wish to spin the facts of the civil rights movement, they cannot change the fact that local, state, and federal governments were wrong and worked against We the People. Couple that with the shenanigans that we see happening today and even teenagers see the real world for what it really is. Okay, well at least most of them see it when you can peel them away from their digital devices and videos.

          Call me an optimist I guess. While the reality of the United States is rather bleak, there is a glimmer of hope in my neck of the woods.

      2. avatar MamaLiberty says:

        I’m glad you are happy with the “school” there. Unfortunately, it doesn’t matter in the end because the whole premise “public school” is built on is authoritarian.

        In the first place, the “state” claims pretty much absolute authority over your children from birth. They assume ownership, and countless examples can be found around the country, and indeed, around the world.

        Second, since government produces no wealth, and has nothing that was not stolen from the productive people, the “schools” are supported with stolen money. This would be a deal breaker for me, even if the first was not so bad… though it is.

        The indoctrination in government schools is designed to discourage critical, individual thinking, and to produce docile “workers” for the state. The fact that they don’t really do very well at this, in spite of the forced drugs, is beside the point

        You might get a much better picture of the situation if you looked at this link. Prussian Education adopted by Horrace Mann http://www.germanamericanpioneers.org/PrussianEducationadoptedbyHorraceMann.htm

        There are a good number of options besides homeschool. Theft and indoctrination into being slaves of the state doesn’t sound like a good option to me.

        1. avatar Indiana Tom says:

          Das Fuhrer Prinzip. Ready to join the Nazi Party?

      3. avatar James Acerra says:

        uncommon_sense You forget that is what they want to show THE MAN (with a badge) getting in the face of J. Q. Public And FEDERAL forces saving the little people. The movie had some good points but overall sucked.
        My son was given a in school suspension when he was in 6th Grade for a finger gun and I told the Principle (I carried a badge then) One more of those I would sue for cause over zero brains policy or home school him. I told my son in their presence that he must make sure his sight line was clear and the backstop would keep collateral damage down just like daddy did! Man some wide eyes on that one. WE MUST keep our rights strong.
        Yours in service
        James Acerra

  6. avatar Another Robert says:

    Considering how much wailing and gnashing of teeth Eddie Eagle provokes among “our betters”, I can only imagine if someone actually tried to talk about “gun rights” in a public school.

  7. avatar Illinois_Minion says:

    “… he pointed at a classmate in the shape of a gun and said, ‘You’re dead.’

    Remind me to teach the kids to say “TAG! you’re it” instead. Or to yell “”SWAT/POLICE! Down on the ground! BANG. – At least I get to go home safe tonight”.

    /sarc

    1. avatar chuck (hates nj) says:

      “Hi I’m from the government and I’m here to help”

  8. avatar MoveableDo says:

    I’m a teacher, a male teacher with a love for guns. I do a lot of recess duty outside with the kids playing…and many boys “shoot” each other with fake hand rifles and such. Same thing many of us did as kids. I don’t want the kids getting in trouble for something totally normal like that so I always take it upon myself to tell the kids to “cease fire” or “holster your weapon, cowboy.” I’d rather them not shoot each other, but only because I don’t want my school to be the next one that shows up here as a stupid suspension for something many boys do while playing.

    1. avatar Rokurota says:

      God bless you, man. The games du jour on my kids’ playground seem to be “Spies” and “Ninjas” — no, I don’t know why poison gas bombs and shuriken are better than guns.

  9. avatar Gman says:

    My first recollection of guns was one cold Thanksgiving weekend when I was about 9. My grandmother had two houses on the east end of Long Island in Southampton. The summer house was on Little Peconic Bay and the other in town. The summer house was not suitable for winter habitation so we winterized it each fall and would go out and check on everything when we visited her for Thanksgiving weekend. This one time, when my father and I finished checking on the house and I expected we were returning to grandma’s, he stopped and opened up the trunk. There was a cardboard box with Marlin written on it and a picture of a rifle. He pulled it out and began his fatherly duties instructing me in the safe handling of a firearm. I fondly remember every single time we would take out the Marlin and sit on the sea wall shooting out over the ice at a Clorox bottle he weighted with rocks and tossed out as far as he could. I even clearly remember the sound of a miss skipping along the ice. In high school, I joined the rifle team. Yes, in New York, our high school had a rifle range in the basement. Along with about a dozen others, we brought our rifles on the bus to school and kept them in our locker until after school. NO BIG DEAL! Wow, have things changed in NY.

    1. avatar Gman says:

      On another note, that Marlin was an 80DL. Long heavy barrel .22 with peep sights. I long awaited that gun ending up in my safe, but when my father sold the house a few years ago, he was so afraid of running afoul of the myriad of draconian NY laws he turned it in to a dealer. Tears in my eye just thinking about that. So if anyone happens to have an 80DL they would like to sell, and believe me I’ve looked, I would be eternally grateful. It may not be “my” gun, but it will always remind me of those wonderful times…

      1. avatar Geoff PR says:

        GunBroker has one, auction ends in 2 days.

        Listed at $139.00, no bids so far.

        http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=471489752

        Good luck!

  10. avatar chuck (hates nj) says:

    I just love the shield schools use everytime they’re asked to defend their stupidity “we can’t discuss it since it’s part a students record”. Then they tell the parents there’s slim to no chance it will be on the kids permanent record.

  11. avatar Rokurota says:

    POTG (Parents of the Gun) need to volunteer. Don’t leave PTA duties entirely up to the progressive alpha moms. Principals and teachers have a lot of crap to deal with from absent or unresponsive parents. As a result, they appreciate involved parents all the more. My oh-so-obedient 3rd grader brought a deactivated 50 BMG cartridge to school to show around. The principal and I were able to come to an understanding that I did not consider the fact it was ammunition to be the issue — rather, that I and the school had prohibited it. The SRO (a Sheriff’s deputy) backed me up with a barely concealed snicker — he knew the huge cartridge was not a threat. (But yeah, it does look like a bomb to the uninitiated!)

    Should PTA officers get preferential treatment? No. But being a PTA officer shows your dedication to the school and community. To a progressive, there is no better credential, plus you get to speak up when someone else proposes something stupid.

  12. avatar Pg2 says:

    This is really old news. A lot of people here mention homeschooling, which is no doubt a better education than public schools. I suspect the time will come when homeschooled kids will be on the outside looking in as they grow older and enter the workforce. If the homeschoolers go to college, same indoctrination game.

    1. avatar Another Robert says:

      A lot of the homeschooled kids my homeschooled kids associated with wound up in the military–my own son was until recently a 1st Lt in the Army. But the really odd one is my daughter–she’s teaching at a government school now. Go figure…

      1. avatar pg2 says:

        That’s interesting, a home school kid on our street went military also.

  13. avatar Pantera Vazquez says:

    went to gun show. Saw nice 1911 earrings. Bought them, gave ’em to my 14 yr old daughter. She wore them to school. The world did not collapse. No one even noticed. If and when the powers that be at her school bring it up~ we shall deal with it. Thankfully this is Florida and not Kalifornistan.

  14. avatar Ragnarredbeard says:

    “On Monday, he pointed at a classmate in the shape of a gun and said, ‘You’re dead.’

    Wait a minute, the classmate was shaped like a gun?

    1. avatar RockOnHellChild says:

      No, no, no, the kid who pointed was in the shape of a gun… Try to keep up.

  15. avatar chadwick p. says:

    Ban index fingers. That is the only rational solution to all violence. Maybe require a tax stamp or permit for thumbs.

    1. avatar MoveableDo says:

      So now the index finger and the middle finger are both banned fingers. I give that a thumbs down.

  16. avatar uncommon_sense says:

    We should certainly try to present programs to schools. Obviously, we don’t know if we don’t try. More importantly, public schools may surprise us and be receptive. Of course there are probably several public school districts in locations like Los Angeles, San Francisco, Chicago, Washington D.C., New York City, and Boston that would never even consider such a program. Many other school districts, even in anti-gun regions of the country, may want a program just from a pragmatic standpoint. After all, there are something like 300 million firearms in the United States and many children will encounter them at some point. They have also been a hot button political issue. These two reasons alone are a compelling incentive to learn more.

    I imagine an educational program that teaches safety, responsibility, and legal/political considerations would be valuable to many public schools. Again, we don’t know if we don’t try.

  17. avatar meadowsr says:

    Haven’t tried it yet, but I’m making plans to do so.

    There was a guy around here who was teaching youth shooting safety classes, until much of his learning materials–including numerous guns that he brought in to teach about the various pieces and parts and action types–were destroyed in one of our big fires. I took his class twice, once with just my son (who’d already been shooting with Boy Scouts), and then again with my entire family, as I was beginning to collect my firearms, I wanted everyone in the house to know what to do–and not do–with them.

    I’m planning on upping my training with not only additional firearms instruction, but I also want to get certified as an instructor, hopefully to gain more credence before the law enforcement community–whose support I will be looking to garner for this endeavor–as well as the school board. I want to take Frank’s lessons into the classroom, right in the schools themselves (not necessarily just as an extra-curricular), and maybe even include a field trip to a range. The thrust of my proposal will be similar to what Robert mentioned in the article: we teach students–in class, no less–about bullying, drugs, sex, alcohol…why in the world shouldn’t/wouldn’t firearms safety be included as well.

    Always still on the lookout for materials, so if anyone has suggestions, tips, comments, advice, etc., I’d love to hear ’em.

  18. avatar Sgt Frank says:

    The dumbing down of America and the Wussifing of males is the liberal movement…..just look at Europe. Now look at the animals that are being bred in the middle east…….who is screwing who?

  19. avatar Prof. Skinner says:

    But remember its ok for Sleeper 13 Productions to film with real / Co2 guns in school , as long as it is an anti gun hit piece. They were sanctioned RIGHT ??

  20. avatar Former Water Walker says:

    Home school…It brings lots of joy to see my 3 grandkids thriving while my daughter -in-law home schools them-which is a bit ironic as my son works for the gubmint(we’re here to help)…and yeah we all played war when I was a kid-hardly ever cowboys & indians.

  21. avatar JoeVK says:

    My 13 year old son is smarter than his grades in school suggest. If you can get him talking about a subject he finds interesting or is passionate about, you marvel at his intelligence. He knows how most guns work. I have a few gun books and magazines (the paper kind, not the bullet-holders, lol) laying around and he’s free to read them as long as he puts them back and doesn’t tear them up. He’s read them several times over, without asking many questions. So as far as the mechanical aspect, he knows. It’s the responsibility and safety that my wife and I are teaching him. My wife and I started him off with a cheap (got it at Dollar General) airsoft pistol so we could prepare him for the real thing. He tends to go off in his own little energetic world, kinda like a humming bird without wings, so we figured that would be safer. Also, we live in town, so the airsoft gun is less likely to freak out the neighbors or put holes in anything expensive. Like the time he and his sister found my old BB guns in the back of my bedroom closet and shot out a window of the neighbor’s van from his bedroom window. The BB guns were unloaded too, by the way, so they not only figured out how to shoot them, but how to load them as well.

  22. avatar Geoff PR says:

    “And how did you first learn the truth about guns?”

    Guns? Grew up in a Military family…

    TTAG? I Googled something gun related, TTAG was in the top few results, checked it out, as David Bromberg once said: “The rest, you already know…”

    Send me to the ‘Lectric Chair – David Bromberg:

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