More Guns, Less Chipotle Ninjas? Texas Set to Become 45th Open Carry State

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“Let me briefly follow up on a word I mentioned a moment ago – liberty,” Texas Governor Abbott [not shown] said in yesterday’s State of the State address. “In a single word, it encapsulates what this country stands for, what Texas symbolizes. I will expand liberty in Texas by signing a law that makes Texas the 45th state to allow Open Carry.” The bill – which has yet to hit his desk – will enable “permitted carry.” Texas residents wishing to open carry legally . . .

will need a concealed carry permit to do so, which requires four hours of firearms training, a shooting test, a fingerprint scan, two photos, a license fee and a criminal background check. Will sartorially challenged [not shown] rifle-toting open carry advocates finally stand down? What will Austin matrons make of my FNS-9C? Watch this space.

comments

  1. avatar JWM says:

    Gotta make that revenue. Sigh, I’d jump thru Texas style hoops if I could carry in CA. Still sucks that apparently our civil rights are zip code dependent.

    1. avatar Jeremy S says:

      Funny that here in WA if you don’t have a CPL the only legal way to carry a firearm is openly. Concealed requires the permit. Anyone legally able to possess a firearm can carry openly. Texas still needs to work on its liberty for all, wild west image 😉

      1. avatar Another Robert says:

        You are exactly right.

      2. avatar What about Bob says:

        Same in WI. Always found that odd.

      3. avatar LarryinTX says:

        While that’s true, given the made-up crap against CC, how it’s the criminal’s way of sneaking up on innocent children or whatever, CC has been demonized for a century, how we ended up with the ability to CC, but not OC (the method of the good guys) beats the beshezus out of me. Really seems backwards.

        1. avatar SteveInCO says:

          Because the laws against CC are (generally) a century old, and people no longer think that way (unfortunately). It became easier to legalize what was once a shady practice (and still is considered such if you don’t have permission) than to just do the legal but “scary” thing. Texas was a bit different in banning both modes of carry way back when, but when the concept of licensing people to do the “shady” concealed thing became popular, it was easier to legalize that than the open carry.

          Disclaimer (for those who don’t know me): My use of negative adjectives at certain points of the preceding paragraph should not be taken as me agreeing with those adjectives; I’m trying to describe what I believe to be the state of mind of (what I hope isn’t) most people.

      4. avatar ThomasR says:

        It’s the same in NM. OC without a license. CC with one. Or carry an unloaded concealed weapon with a mag in your pocket without a license. (I know, weird)

        Texas, a little less a slave state, more of a peasant or peon state.

        As for NM, since we still can’t carry a loaded CC weapon without a license, we still are not a free state, (lightly chained servants?) but the light is at the end of the tunnel.

      5. avatar Cliff H says:

        I no longer live in Washington, but as I recall the official policy of the Seattle PD when investigating “Man with a gun” calls was to take your weapon into protective custody while they checked you out. That little trick alone was enough (and probably intended) to keep me from open carry the entire time I lived in or near Seattle.

        But it brings up the question regarding the new law about no transfer without a background check – can you hand the pistol to a cop? If he takes it from you, can he just hand it back? I wonder.

        1. avatar John in Ohio says:

          I have no doubt that some department somewhere will use that as an excuse to deprive an innocent person of their property. I’ve known departments to do such thievery under similarly petty cover.

          I had a department claim that they were going to keep one of my sidearms post dismissal. I argued with great zeal that if I did not have my property upon journalization of the ruling, there would be a court order and subsequent lawsuit. If they hadn’t capitulated, it would’ve cost me headaches, time, and money to fight it.

    2. avatar Another Robert says:

      “Gotta make that revenue” : You are exactly right too.

    3. avatar CV76 says:

      Wow she is smart and attractive when her tats aren’t on full display. Hopefully the open scarry show will cool it’s jets once it is legal. We don’t need to convert more moms against us.

      1. avatar Victoria Montgomery says:

        I don’t know who you are, but thanks. My husband enjoys my tattoos plenty, which I didn’t get for anyone but myself. 🙂

    4. avatar Roscoe says:

      @JWM
      “…sucks that apparently our civil rights are zip code dependent.”

      I feel your pain and I agree but it’s far better at this time that we have a patchwork of state by state laws governing gun use as we do now. Existing abridgements by anti-gun statutes in restrictive states are more contained. Plus those attacks on our freedom are harder to advance in 2A friendly states; conversely it is easier to enact laws that support gun freedoms in 2A friendly states, and get judicial relief in UN-gun friendly states.

      Imagine the hurt we could be in if we ever have a Democrat controlled Senate, House of Representatives and a totalitarian anti rights anti-gun President like we have now. If such a cyclical political shift occurs and national restrictions without limit are enacted and signed, it will be much harder to undo the damage on a national level than it is on a state by state basis, particularly when so many states align with pro-gun freedom pro-gun rights.

  2. avatar Dustin says:

    TX already has permitless Long Gun OC… I hope, upon further examination, this isn’t a trade-off… Permitless is a RIGHT, permitted is a privilege. I think the Bill of Rights deserves better than to mock those who know the difference, and the value of that difference…

    1. avatar Baldwin says:

      This!

    2. avatar John Sager says:

      Who cares? We can all whine and complain about how 2A is a right…etc etc and I agree. But ultimately, as a practical matter I would trade unlicensed long gun carry for permitted open carry any day. I’d rather have permitted open carry of handguns than not have it at all, so any step in the right direction is good for me.

      Any what purpose does open carry of long guns even serve? I don’t think anyone would disagree that it has done much more harm than good for us lately…

      1. avatar RockOnHellChild says:

        “I don’t think anyone would disagree that it has done much more harm than good for us lately…”

        You’d be thinking wrong.

      2. avatar Carl says:

        Actually something similar happened here in California. We had people doing UOC (Unloaded Open Carry), it scared the Democriters so much that they outlawed it. You now cannot cross your threshold without a pistol being in a locked case or rifle in a case. Funny thing is that became one of the pillars of the Perruta decision. Judge said in so many words: You have to have some avenue of bearing arms outside the home, so California was forced, kicking a screaming, to be a mostly shall issue state for CCW, Now after 10 month process I pickup my hard card tomorrow morning.

      3. avatar Hobbez says:

        You are absolutely wrong. I’ll go so far as to say that the ONLY reason that Texas is getting open carry of handguns is because of those that open carried long guns and garnered all that media attention. How many times over the years has an open carry bill been introduced and then just sat in the Texas legislature?

      4. avatar Another Robert says:

        Open carry of long guns serves the purpose of legally having some means of ballistic self-defense available for folks who don’t want to go hat in hand and money out of pocket to the government for permission to exercise what is supposed to be a fundamental right.

      5. avatar JR_in_NC says:

        “Any what purpose does open carry of long guns even serve?”

        Ah, that pesky Bill of Purposes rears its ugly head again …

        ” I don’t think anyone would disagree that it has done much more harm than good for us lately…”

        A LOT of us disagree with you. Nice progressive rhetorical tactic there: making an unsupported claim (no evidence the long gun OC activism has done “more harm than good”) as a fully agreed upon fact.

        1. avatar SteveInCO says:

          “I don’t think anyone would disagree that…”

          That is a textbook example of what Ayn Rand called “The Argument from Intimidation.” The user is hoping you won’t want to stick your neck out by arguing. I’ve noticed it doesn’t work too well on a lot of people here.

        2. avatar LarryinTX says:

          Did y’all notice ” … I agree. But … “?? Sort of says it all.

      6. avatar B says:

        Texas would have never gotten open carry without peaceful OC protests. You think politicians are predisposed to restoring rights on their own? How adorable.

        However, we probably could have swung Constitutional Carry without Cory Watkins acting as a MDA/ Bloomberg shill and poisoning the well for it.

        1. avatar John in Ohio says:

          If more Texans would’ve gone way beyond the few unusual tactics some open carriers employed, y’all would’ve had full constitutional carry in a week. In every state, my own included, timidity is one of two things keeping residents from being able to exercise their individual rights under the law. The other thing is tyrannical government.

          At one time, even the tactics of what some would consider “good” open carry advocates were admonished as “over the top” merely because they actually carried a long gun openly. If you really want to be free in a hurry, OCTC’s methods don’t even come close to going far enough. 😉

      7. avatar Chip Bennett says:

        Any what purpose does open carry of long guns even serve?

        Since when did the lawful exercise of a natural right need to pass a test or meet an arbitrary standard of purposefulness?

        I don’t think anyone would disagree that it has done much more harm than good for us lately…

        Then apparently you think wrongly. And the “has done more harm than good” remains a specious canard.

      8. avatar LarryinTX says:

        “Any what purpose does open carry of long guns even serve? ”

        It’s kinda handy if you’re a hunter. Sheesh!

    3. avatar Stupid Should Hurt says:

      Why is it a “privilege” to carry concealed?

      Does the Bill of Rights stop at an article of clothing?

      1. avatar The Mountain that Rides says:

        It’s a privilege when you have to ask for permission. A license is written, laminated permission.

      2. avatar Hannibal says:

        The minutemen were not carrying concealed. People armed to defend themselves generally carried openly and ‘concealable’ arms were so short-ranged as to be impractical. In that time period carrying concealed was the mark of a criminal.

    4. avatar LarryinTX says:

      When I moved to TX in ’72, I had to wait 20+ years before CC was legal. One step at a time, so long as the steps are in the correct direction.

      1. avatar John in Ohio says:

        If an individual dies before he is free, he has lost his freedom forever. From his perspective, all of the steps, baby or not, won’t mean anything.

        1. avatar Marcus (Aurelius) Payne says:

          Refusing to take a step because it does not complete the journey denies everyone their freedom forever.

        2. avatar John in Ohio says:

          Your argument is for collective rights over individual rights.

  3. avatar Accur81 says:

    Godspeed, sir. It may be awhile before CA gets open carry. Meanwhile, I’m contemplating my next gun purchase. So far it’s between a Sig 320 9mm, Sig Tac Ops, AR-10, Shield 9mm, or GLOCK 43 9mm. Once Glock gets off its arse.

    1. avatar mike reed says:

      Check out the sig M11-A1. Very nice. Just bought it and a tac-ops! Both 9mm. Shoot the tac-ops in idpa and carry the M11-A1.

    2. avatar uncommon_sense says:

      Are you kidding me? That is no debate at all … AR-10 all the way!

      1. avatar Accur81 says:

        The Smith M&P Magpul .308 with an 18″ barrel seems like great bang for the buck. The Ares Ajax 18″ blackened stainless upper on a built lower would also be very cool.

        Perhaps something I could sling over my shoulder while in TX.

    3. avatar John L. says:

      To coin a phrase, when faced with a choice of caliber, I choose the one I don’t already own…

      1. avatar Chrispy says:

        Glad I’m not the only one!

  4. avatar Model 31 says:

    Beautiful.

  5. avatar Table says:

    So does this also apply to out-of-state permit holders?

    1. avatar LarryinTX says:

      Good question! My guess would be that if TX has reciprocity with your state, so that CC would be legal in TX, OC should be as well. Unless it is specifically addressed.

  6. avatar JamesInHouston says:

    Great! Now only if the licensing fee wasn’t 140 dollars. That’s not including seeing an instructor, fingerprints, and all that other mess. Can easily rack up to around 300 dollars just to exercise your right to bear arms.

    1. avatar Mike says:

      Check the state websight. There are different fees depending on status. Veterans are now $25 for example https://www.txdps.state.tx.us/RSD/CHL/documents/CHLFeeSchedule.pdf

    2. avatar Another Robert says:

      The state fees aren’t as much as the classes and fingerprints and photos cost. And for the vast majority of folks, there is no price break. I’m sorry, I can’t get real excited about “permitted” open carry.

  7. avatar Dano says:

    The OC attention whoring won’t stop when the get OC. Mark these words. It will continue and there will be more antics from OCTC.

    1. avatar Ralph says:

      Good. Without the agitation by so-called “Chipotle Ninjas,” the State of Texas wouldn’t be on its way to being the Republic of Texas again.

      1. avatar Dano says:

        Keep telling yourself that. Meanwhile Chipotle will ask gun owners to leave, as will about a dozen other chains – all thanks to the nitwits of OCTC.

        1. avatar Chip Bennett says:

          So far, the only chain that appears to be doing more than writing weasel-worded PR letters is Whole Foods in Texas. They’re the only ones I’ve heard reported who are following (and even that’s debatable) the statutory requirements for prohibiting firearms on their premises.

          Chipotle? Target? Starbucks? Nope. Just PR “open letters from the president”.

        2. avatar SteveInCO says:

          The whole foods here in Colorado Springs actually posted their store, as well. I understand they got enough complaints they’ve removed their posting BUT I haven’t verified that in person.

        3. avatar B says:

          Chipotle didn’t ask them to leave, Jack in the box didn’t go into lockdown with cops called. Most of the stuff attributed to OC protests are MDA lies. Please correct people when they spout them.

    2. avatar Christian says:

      Complain if you want, but we’ve gained nothing by being shrinking violets trying to avoid offending or scaring people. OC’rs are helping normalize guns to mainstream America, proving that owning a gun and carrying a gun doesn’t make you a criminal. Why do you think the MSM, MDA, NYC liberal elites and others despise it so much?

      1. avatar JR_in_NC says:

        This. A thousand times this.

  8. avatar Former Water Walker says:

    Miracles can happen. Like here in Illinois…

  9. avatar Roy says:

    Who is happy about about “permitted” open carry? What’s there to be happy about?

    1. avatar JR_in_NC says:

      That’s it’s not NO open carry?

      There’s a lesson here. It’s easy to give rights away. It’s much harder to get them back.

      1. avatar Chip Bennett says:

        Where were all these “constitutional carry or nothing!” absolutists when our rights were being eroded in the first place?

        1. avatar John in Ohio says:

          (I get what your comment is about, Chip. I’m just using it to sound off in a different way. Hope you don’t mind. 🙂 )

          Probably being shouted down by other firearms owners; being “schooled” about “eating elephants”, “baby steps”, and “ruining it for the rest of us.” I’ve been around since the 1970s, saying the same things that I do today. For some of us, it’s the same shit, different day from sheep in human clothes.

        2. avatar B says:

          Unborn, mostly. Texas got its rights raped like most of the south after the civil war. We actually kicked the carpetbaggers out though with force unlike most states. It just took us 150 years for the generational cycle to make people who wanted to rectify this injustice. Well get there.

    2. avatar LarryinTX says:

      How about “no carry at all, period, go straight to jail” like it was in most every state prior to ’87? Is this site full of children with no knowledge of where they came from?

      1. avatar Red in Texas says:

        Yep, it easy to jack your jaw, when you were born post “freedom”.

      2. avatar Chrispy says:

        Being born in ’87, I can say… “Hey, I resemble that remark!”

  10. avatar Cameron S. says:

    I already decided that I’m moving to Austin once I finish my Medic schooling.

    This is blue steel icing on that cake.

    1. avatar dh34 says:

      Please don’t bring your car. The commute is hell already.

  11. avatar fishydude says:

    Open Carry the FNS9:) Or at least the 9C with the 17 and grip extension 🙂
    I have both. My EDC is the 9C.

  12. avatar Paul53 says:

    Permit open carry may not be the whole enchilada, but at least it assures a certain amount of competency.

    1. avatar LarryinTX says:

      “the right of the competent people to …”??

      I didn’t think so. I get to decide whether I am competent enough to carry, not you. If anyone else gets the power to make that decision, the standards can be increased until the frog is truly boiled, as in, Jerry Miculek is not “competent” enough.

    2. avatar JR_in_NC says:

      “at least it assures a certain amount of competency.”

      How does a permit assure competency?

      Answer is, of course…it does NOT.

      All the permit does is show that someone has completed some requirement to get the permit. Such requirements are usually more ‘time’ related or some other bureaucratic nonsense (filled out x forms and paid y fees).

      A permit says nothing about a person ever having competency (at what standard?) or, more to the point…maintaining said competency for some period after acquiring the permit.

      1. avatar testyTexan says:

        The competency requirement in the process of obtaining a CHL in Texas is ‘weapons qualification’ on a firing range as part of the overall course material. You don’t simply sit in a classroom environment for 4 hours listening to an instructor drone on and on about firearm safety.

        I’ll take every advantage afforded in this new OC legislation to wear my gear and protest for full, Constitutional Carry. Taking what I can get now and going after the rest… we aren’t done yet Texas!

  13. avatar Tom in Oregon says:

    Very cool. How many decades has texas been without?

    1. avatar Stinkeye says:

      About fifteen…

  14. avatar Art Out West says:

    Not very impressed. For all the bragging Texans do about their gun rights, when it comes to carry they are pretty restricted. It is a small step in the right direction. Yet, it is absurd to need a permit for open carry. Other “real” western states don’t require that. There is no blood running in the streets of Oregon, Idaho, Montana, Utah, Washington, Wyoming, etc.

    1. avatar Art Out West says:

      Still, I am glad for the Texans.

    2. avatar LarryinTX says:

      Hey, Art, 20 years ago we finally got CC, just a year or 2 ago we got massively decreased costs and requirements for license renewal for CC, now we hope to get OC, down the road drop the permits altogether, cut us some slack. There are a bunch of panty wetters moving here from the failing commie states, they have to see that they aren’t murdered every day or something before they stop worrying about crazy neighbors and let us have our rights back.

  15. avatar dh34 says:

    The biggest obstacle is Speaker Straus now. SB 11 and SB 17 are out of committee and have the votes in Senate to pass. It hasn’t gone to committee in the house yet. But Chair Phillips is likely to send it to the floor. It’s not an “emergency” so it won’t hit the floor of either side of the legislature until day 60. I’m optimistic, but cautiouly so.

    1. avatar Garrison Hall says:

      Strauss is a statist through and through. You can count on him doing everything he can to kill both bills. The only thing that saved them the first go-around (remember Patrick had already written open carry off) was grassroots support. If open carry survives it will be because voting, gun-rights supporting Texans, took the issues out of the politician’s hands. If they’re move afraid of the voting public than Joe Strauss, OC will pass easily. This is a sad, sad, commentary on the way Austin politics works. But it’s also true.

  16. avatar stateisevil says:

    Sadly Florida lost its only shot at open carry today in a kangaroo kourt decision by the 4th DCA. Fl Carry will appeal to the FL SC but lose there also as the truth is no defense. Time to move to a real pro gun state. So sick of New Jersey with palm trees.

    1. avatar Geoff PR says:

      Got a link on that?

  17. avatar El Mac says:

    RF, why would you opt for an FHS9/C for open carry?

    1. avatar Robert Farago says:

      Because it’s the gun that I carry.

      1. avatar Tile floor says:

        To celebrate this step in the right direction you should switch to a Ruger Super Blackhawk in .44 Mag, cause nothin screams freedom like a gigantic single action revolver

        1. avatar LarryinTX says:

          There’s something to be said for that. In a tooled leather holster with silver doo-dads and leather fringey things all over it, in a variety of colors and designs! Excellent!

          Let’s all submit suggestions for RF’s new rig!

        2. avatar SteveInCO says:

          And for the new GF:

          http://www.gunslot.com/files/gunslot/images/40534.jpg

          Oh, wait, this is post legal handgun OC. Never mind.

        3. avatar LarryinTX says:

          Steve, you’re killing me!

        4. avatar Another Robert says:

          I’ve got a suggestion for the grips–but I can’t post the pic here. It’s on my not-so-smart phone. Polished ebony with a scorpion made from inlaid brass segments–ya oughta see ’em.

        5. avatar B says:

          I’ve had an 1862 Navy in 38 special (and matching BP version) with tooled leather holster ready to go since 2013, along with a 357 Taurus 65 and Fobus holster for when I’m feeling more practical.

      2. avatar John in Ohio says:

        RF, wear a good ol’ single action revolver in a Tom Threepersons holster and you’ll never go back. 🙂

        BUG of your choice, any action and caliber…

  18. avatar dwb says:

    I want to gripe that Maryland seems to be counted among those 45 states. Maryland is not an open carry state except by some perverted definition. You need a permit to carry, and an act of god to get a permit. The permit covers open OR CC. Open carry of rifles is legal, claims the former party-boy AG. Don’t do that! OC rifles and shotguns is pretty common for hunting, but never ever ever for self defense. Unless you are near a hunting area wearing blaze orange, you will be arrested, prosecuted, and ridiculed (because you were warned).

    1. avatar Salty Bear says:

      Yes, let’s stop counting may-issue states, since we all know they’re really no-issue states.

      1. avatar SteveInCO says:

        They certainly aren’t “no issue” states, there are plenty of issues there. (Yeah you had a hyphen in there and that changes the meaning, but I can’t resist a bit of wordplay.)

        I call them “won’t issue” states.

  19. avatar Timmy! says:

    I just had to ‘splain to my 85yo mother over dinner why open carry is a good thing and not the return of “The Wild West.” I’m not sure she’s convinced, but… we’ll see.

    1. avatar Stupid Should Hurt says:

      It’s a “good thing” in that it self-identifies every shit-for-brains attention whore and mall ninja in the vicinity.

      1. avatar SteveInCO says:

        It also helps flush out shit-for-brains troll attention whore commenters.

        1. avatar Xanderbach says:

          Funny that here in AZ, people constantly open carry, and there isn’t people calling them “attention whores” or “chipotle ninjas.” We just call them “people carrying.” Amazingly, there isn’t blood on the streets or news articles every time. Surprisingly low crime here too… Even compared to Texas. I think Texas is just a target because of it’s “wild west” reputation. That, and the antis decided AZ was a lost cause, since their bills keep getting laughed out of the senate…

        2. avatar Stupid Should Hurt says:

          Yes, yourself for a prime example. These assclowns have done nothing but harm to the pro-gun agenda. Every time they lumber into a public place with a Tapco-fucked SKS slung over their greasy backs the media’s eyes light up and thousands of fence-sitters decide that “That nice lady who worries about children’s safety was right. We need to do something about guns.”

    2. avatar Drew says:

      Yeah, the Wild West was terrible, what with the minuscule murder rate and all. A typical western themed movie represented a good portion of all the killing between countrymen in those decades.

  20. avatar Devin says:

    I’ll continue carrying concealed, but it’s nice to know that if my gun shows accidentally, I’m good.

    1. avatar Phil LA says:

      Bingo! I was always worried about that with my CHL in Texas (“disturbing the peace” is a catch-all), but after moving to Louisiana and getting my CHL here in a permit-less open carry state, I’m no longer concerned.

    2. avatar rosignol says:

      Yeah, that’s probably where the real value in legal OC is for most of us. Taking away one of the ways dick cops (not redundant, non-dick cops do exist) can harass carriers is a good thing.

  21. avatar MIKE CROGNALE says:

    I spoke to Alice Tripp, the TSRA point person for the legislature. She does not know if the bills will be brought up in the House. Her comment was essentially, one step at a time. I’m beginning to hope that the members will force RINO Joe Strauss to yield on this.

    1. avatar dh34 says:

      I’m pretty sure the bill will get through committee in the house, in spite of Rep Nevarez. A floor vote will depend on the speaker. Unfortunately the biggest proponents of OC and Campus Carry are not Straus’ biggest fans and vice versa. The OC issue is kind of a distraction in the big scheme of things. Lt Gov Patrick tried to move it quickly to come to resolution quickly one way or another. Abbott may have given everyone an out, whether he meant to or not. By making five emergency priorities, any one of them can be brought to a vote before the 60 day rule. It also signals in a way that these are the items that might cause him to call a special session to resolve. OC was not one of them. Again…I’m cautiously optimistic about OC, but this is the Texas legislature and the show hasn’t even really begun yet.

      1. avatar Garrison Hall says:

        The grassroots needs to speak now and speak loudly. That’s our only real chance.

    2. avatar TX Gungal says:

      You think the RINOs in the Texas legislature don’t know, this “Lucy pulling the football away at the last minute” is not going to effect their chances of re-election? If it’s not passed in regular session, pressure needs to put on Abbott special session.

      1. avatar dh34 says:

        Rep Phillips is chair of the Homeland Security and Public Safety Committee in the house. They’ve had only one meeting to date, and he said he usually gives a bill a week after the hearing to move it. There are no hearings for the committee posted right now. That being said, I would expect him to hold one in the next week to 10 days. Routine business can’t hit the floor until 60 days, so basically the third week in March, after the 13 Mar filing cutoff for non-emergency or local only bills. I believe, in spite of the clown circus Nevarez is likely to cause, that there is sufficient horsepower to get it to the floor. Then the real show begins: some combination of a battle of wills between Gov, Lt Gov and Speaker, and speaker and middle vs. conservative, that gives some power to the Dem minority. Straus seems pretty determined to break the far right.

  22. avatar Frank says:

    WTF is all the carp about someone wanting to OC? The “tactical disadvantage”, the “mall ninja”, the “Chipotle ninja”. I don’t give a rat’s ass how you carry, why do you care how I carry.

    It is my choice what I carry, how I carry, when I carry, and where I carry. If it weren’t for folks stepping out of line and doing things that “hurt the cause”, we would still have folks that could not eat at the counter, ride in the front of the bus, marry each other, etc.

    Live and let live.

    1. avatar Model 31 says:

      Some have made their decision, and not only can they not be wrong, their way must be the best and only way as well.

      1. avatar JR_in_NC says:

        That’s true.

        And some are astroturfing trolls that show up here for every single OC related post to comment that stuff. Notice how the user names are unfamiliar and it’s generally one or two posts and gone. Also, the tone of the posts is VERY different, so they are VERY easy to identify.

  23. avatar Paul53 says:

    Self defense is a right, driving a privilege. Nobody has the inborn intelligence to do either well. Why not require a basic NRA type firearms education class before buying your first firearm? Shooters ed like drivers ed. People buying and carrying with no training don’t make me feel very comfortable. I can hear the “shall not be infringed” crowd screaming, but I think an educated gun owner is much better off than an uneducated one. IMHO

    1. avatar Jeff the Griz says:

      I kinda get this, but I disagree. You know because all those safe accident free, peaceful, patient people that drive cars and never kill anyone because they took drivers ed!

    2. avatar Chip Bennett says:

      Gun ownership is at an all-time high – which by definition means lots and lots of first-time gun owners. Negligent discharges resulting in injury/death are at an all-time low. Perhaps safe handling of firearms is actually fairly common sense? Perhaps people are just naturally smarter than you give them credit for?

      And even if it weren’t: a training requirement as a prerequisite to exercise a natural, constitutionally protected right is unarguably an infringement upon the exercise of that right. In a free society, the only appropriate course of action is to deal with people who act criminally, after they so act. Anything else represents an unjustified infringement upon the liberties of the law-abiding.

    3. avatar JR_in_NC says:

      “People buying and carrying with no training don’t make me feel very comfortable.”

      No copy of the Constitution I’ve ever seen says “The Right of Paul53 to Feel Very Comfortable Shall Not Be Infringed.”

      To be blunt…I don’t care about your feelings. Your feelings are no basis to trump others’ rights.

      And further, to address the ‘meat’ of your comment…be careful what you wish for. If you open the door to mandatory education, the bar can be set or changed at a whim. It amounts to nothing more than a hook to be used to determine who can ‘pass.’

      As an example…look at the number of states with pre-emption laws. You’d think that would end locally ordained infringements, right? But, it doesn’t. Statists are only dragged toward liberty kicking and screaming.

      Such ‘requirements’ will only be abused, just like every other “well meaning” law or regulation already is.

      1. avatar SteveInCO says:

        No copy of the Constitution I’ve ever seen says “The Right of Paul53 to Feel Very Comfortable Shall Not Be Infringed.”

        That’s because you misspelled “SteveInCO” when you ran the google search. However, don’t despair. I feel very comfortable in a room full of armed people.

        (OK, I suppose I should quit clowning around and go to work.)

    4. avatar Stinkeye says:

      The problem is, when you set requirements like that, they may start out somewhat reasonable, but they are the camel’s nose for statists and disarmers to keep ratcheting up the level of difficulty to exercise your rights. First, it’s a four-hour course in gun safety. Then they decide that four hours isn’t enough, so it’s eight, then sixteen. Then they start making it more difficult for people to be certified to instruct the course, or require that it be taught by special government employees. Eventually, it’s a week-long class that’s only taught five times a year, costs $2000, and the waiting list is ten years long.

      Your idea wouldn’t be a bad one, if you could trust the government not to abuse it. Of course, if you could trust the government to not abuse its power, we wouldn’t need the second amendment.

    5. avatar LarryinTX says:

      The only way I could agree with this is requiring a basic firearms safety course prior to graduation from high school. Any such course required by the state to own a firearm can promptly become the same thing as “may issue”, not attainable by anyone except cronies of those in power.

      Also, we have something like 100 million gunowners now, I’m not seeing evidence of a need for any such thing.

      1. avatar JR_in_NC says:

        “The only way I could agree with this is requiring a basic firearms safety course prior to graduation from high school. “

        Of the various options given when mandatory ed is brought up, this is one of the better ones. It’s still a bad idea, though, for a couple of reasons (some practical, some philosophical).

        We actually did have that when I went to high school. Everyone in 9th grade of public school took “Hunter’s Safety.” It was part of the PE curriculum. I don’t know if it was mandated by the state at the time, but it certainly was at my school.

    6. avatar John in Ohio says:

      You answered your own question in your comment, Paul53. The right to travel morphed into a privilege first through requirements on those traveling while engaged in commerce. Today, even those who are not engaged in commerce are required to obtain a license to travel by certain means. Through the acceptance of a privilege in place of a right under the guise of safety, the exercise of a fundamental right was abridged and the privilege accepted. The same thing will eventually happen to the right to keep and bear arms (all arms, not just firearms) and the deterrent value of the Second Amendment will be completely destroyed. Tyranny is far more dangerous than the unlicensed bearing of arms or unlicensed operation of motor vehicles.

  24. avatar James says:

    $ $ $ rules the roost. In Alabama in my county it costs $65 dollars for a two year carry permit. $2 goes to the state, the balance goes into the sheriffs discresionary (sp) fund. A fund with no strings and NO accountability. I’m waiting to see what color they paint the bradley fighting vehicle they so despratly need for the SRT. More BS.

    1. avatar Model 31 says:

      Well at least the new ride won’t get all dinged up with m855 anymore.

    2. avatar LarryinTX says:

      James, if you could get the rules changed so the sheriff’s department had to do it for free, the urgent need for it would disappear in a matter of seconds.

  25. avatar Ralph says:

    What will Austin matrons make of my FNS-9C?

    They’ll probably say “nice Glock.”

  26. avatar jimfred says:

    when I signed the petition here in Texas for support to open carry it said ” CONSTITUTIONAL OPEN CARRY ” . leave it to a politician when it comes down to signing it into law ,state he actually means to turn it into have to pay fees, submit pictures ,fingerprints and all the other red tape bullshit that basically puts you on what I believe is a sex offender or criminal like tracking list . I wonder to if somewhere hidden in the bill it applies to having to buy a permit to carry long guns to ,would not surprise me at all now. this is the typical political bait and switch crock o shit, that pull the wool over your eyes politicians are known for. they will probably take the revenue from this so they can throw more lavish parties and give themselves a big fat pay raise , and oh yeah add more police and agents to watch us even closer . LAND OF THE FREE MEANS ANOTHER FEE FOR YOU AND ME !!!!!

  27. avatar Brian says:

    oh hey, there’s an article under that photo!

    Still can’t wrap my head around NOT open carrying pistols in Texas, one would think they invented that.

    1. avatar El Mac says:

      @Brian, you have to remember that Texas was once a very Blue state…very. And is in danger of becoming Blue yet again and very likely will if The Dark Lord and his evil minions get their way concerning illegal aliens. The major metropolitan areas of Texas are already Blue as hell…it will take a gargantuan effort to forestall it from happening across the board..

    2. avatar Tile floor says:

      She can open carry in my Chipotle whenver she wants

    3. avatar Drew says:

      Texas may have invented the complete ban of carrying any and all arms. Iirc while still either a stand alone republic or a territory they banned the carrying of all weapons on or near your person. The irony being it was the result of two politicians going after each other.

      1. avatar Stinkeye says:

        The ban on bearing arms in Texas was implemented in 1871.

        Amusingly, a lot of the early debate on the topic centered around Bowie knives. For some reason, legislators back then were really hung up on keeping people from carrying big-ass knives.

        1. avatar ken says:

          Seems like, even in those days, politicians were nuts.

        2. avatar dh34 says:

          And it’s stil on the books. Rep White of Tyler filed HB 92 to remove Bowie knives from the list of prohibited blades.

        3. avatar B says:

          This was post Civil War, disarmament was forced upon us by the carpet bagger reconstruction government. They changed the state Constitution to prohibit the bearing of arms (outside long arms.) It had nothing to do with the will of the people. We had to kick Davis out in 1873 by force because he refused to leave the state house after losing.

  28. avatar John says:

    Not going to help me until they pass campus carry. Working on campus has a number of benefits, being able to carry my gun isn’t one of them.

  29. avatar ken says:

    But…but…. But last month it didn’t even have the votes to get to the floor, let alone pass, remember? Many Texas Political types said so! They wouldn’t LIE as a part of their agenda would they? Just for a few million lobbyist dollars? Ah, hell no! Politicians lying in return for money? It wouldn’t, it couldn’t happen…. It must have been Harry Potter’s magic wand. Yeah… that’s it…
    🙂

    1. avatar dh34 says:

      Last month, until pressure was put on the Lt. Gov and the committee assignments were made, I had doubts it would get to floor. He stacked the State Affairs Committee with pro-gunners. On the house side the committee chair is pro, but the vice is the same guy that tossed OCTC and started the panic button panic. I think it will get through committee, but the speakers really stepping up his game and that is troubling.

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